An interesting story promoted by Rebel News, highlights the plight of an Amish farmer who operates a private market club for his products. Because his crops, dairy and beef are not sold to the ‘general public,’ and only to those who are members of the private food club, Amos Miller contends he should not be subject to USDA regulations.
Miller’s organic farm operates on century old farming practices. His farm uses no electricity, no tractors, no diesel, no gasoline, and he produces exceptional all natural yields which people are willing to pay top dollar to purchase.
Additionally, because Mr. Miller doesn’t use chemical fertilizer or fuel, his farm has not been impacted by the increased costs that have hit industrial farms. He and his customers are completely unaffected by outside influence.
However, a federal judge ruled that despite his closed members-only market, he must have USDA inspectors for his beef and cattle slaughter processes. Miller does not want to use the regulated and required pharmaceutical antibiotics, and other regulatory processes required by the USDA. He now faces jail time and a $300,000 fine. [Rebel News Article]
While CTH is completely on the side of the Miller farm, it’s not fair to share this story without providing the alternative perspective from the side of the regulatory agencies.
(Via Lancaster Online) – […] “The United States submits that Mr. Miller’s continuing recalcitrance and flouting of the court’s orders requires a robust, more-coercive civil contempt sanction than previously imposed,” government attorneys wrote in its request filed in late July. “Specifically … the court should order him to be incarcerated until he has paid these sums that are long overdue.”
U.S. District Judge Edward G. Smith scheduled a hearing for Sept. 26 at the federal courthouse in Easton for Miller to show why he should not be jailed.
And the government wants Miller’s wife, Rebecca Miller, added as a defendant in the case because she is a co-owner of Miller’s Organic Farm. That will also be addressed at the hearing.
Miller — who has an attorney, but has been filing paperwork on his own — filed a response on Aug. 5 suggesting Smith and the government are “working in concert” in supposedly violating his rights. The filing seeks a stay of the proceedings and indicates Miller plans to appeal issues in which he contends the judge is wrong.
[…] Miller first came to the attention of federal authorities in 2016, when the Food and Drug Administration said it identified Listeria in samples of Miller’s raw milk; the agency found the Listeria to be genetically similar to the bacteria found in two people who developed listeriosis — one of whom died — after consuming raw milk.. (read more)
It’s an interesting issue, specifically interesting because the members of the private food club are in a hold-harmless relationship with the Miller farm.
What do you think?
As someone that has lived over 50 years around Amish, this is clearly an attack on their small business enterprise to shut them down and steal their customers. You can bet your life that there is a slaughter house, a milk company in that area that is unhappy that this “peasant” is providing those products at a much more reasonable price, and by far more nutritious and tasty. It is common in the area that I live to go to the Amish for those products. That is the American Way of “Freedom For All.” Every American should be outraged at this government attack on those people that just want to provide a service to their fellow Americans and be left alone. Disgusting INDEED….
My body, my choice.
Our government recently absolved pharmaceutical companies from liabilities for FORCING Covid injections upon a majority of Americans by threat of losing their income. Thousands died or had immune systems permanently compromised from these shots.
Where is our government’s moral high ground fining a farmer for people getting ill after they VOLUNTARILY joined a club consuming 18th century food processing techniques?
The humans in government are the disease and we are the cure. I hope someone is keeping a database of the ‘reasons’ and ‘symptoms’ of the disease. It’s two full time jobs now trying to keep track of even a sampling of them.
Be that white blood cell that makes a difference.
This interesting article from CNN of all places lays out some interesting facts, who got prosecuted in these cases, and what good did all the regime’s corrupt “regulation” and fees do?
https://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/28/health/e-coli-outbreaks-fast-facts/index.html
What do the Amish do?
They live their lives, build communities, and leave others ALONE.
Why the hell can’t the infiltrators who have taken over what was once OUR government—
LEAVE these poor people ALONE?!
Well now, they’re not exactly “poor” and they are capable of defending themselves in court. Not saying that the govt is right, just that the Amish are not quite so poor nor as pitiful and helpless as you seem to think.
Yes, leave those people alone!
only the uniclub can club.
I believe that if the farmer and the PRIVATE group agree to take the risks of not following the USDA regulations, which are for the general populace, then they have a right to do it as they wish. As long as the group understand why the regulations are there and choose to not use them in order to get the pure product.
The fact that someone got sick once is unfortunate, but don’t we all know about product recalls, lettuce as an example, that made people sick even WITH the regularions? Accidents happen; it’s a matter of percentages. If MANY people were getting sick in this group, then the govt. could step in; but commonsense tells me the people would have already stopped buying the bad product by then.
Agreed 100%. A private group, by its nature, accepts certain limitations and risks by choice. “My body, my choice” applies here.
Why did Lincoln establish the USDA?
“The U.S. Department of Agriculture was established by President Abraham Lincoln on May 15, 1862. Even in the midst of the Civil War, the darkest days of any American presidency, Lincoln viewed agriculture as a critically important component of his domestic policy.”
The USDA is responsible for overseeing farming, ranching, and forestry industries, as well as regulating aspects of food quality and safety and nutrition labeling. The USDA is further tasked with administering several social welfare programs including free school lunches and food stamps.
USDA is made up of 29 agencies and offices with nearly 100,000 employees who serve the American people at more than 4,500 locations across the country and abroad. [Too Big]
The ‘farmer’ will be assimilated by the collective Borg, ‘resistance is futile’.
USDA is another bloated behemoth useless fed agency (2nd largest after DOD i believe?). There is absolutely no need for a federal ag agency of this size and scope. The states can and should handle all usda functions, many of which are of dubious value.
A key usda function is to reallocate taxpayer $$ to wealthy corporate agribusiness cronies and interests. (Sarc but it’s sadly true)
How about we just get rid of it for a few years and see how that works out. Send all the employees home — we will save millions and can handle any workarounds I’m sure.
Are you 12?
The USDA suffers from all of the issues with any large regulatory agency. The central mission is to ensure ample supply of safe nutritious food. Hard to oppose that. Absent some control, the population can become subject to unsafe or inefficient food production. Those are the benefits.
Problem one: the USDA was and is infected with elements of FDR New Deal imbecility of planned economy. At its best this had given us a relatively stable economy and suppressed the issues of failed crops, or inefficient production, i.e too much of something not enough of another. Also probably has a positive effect stabilizing prices to keep farmers production rather than episodically bankrupted. This unfortunately also supports corruption, often by big Ag and “stakeholders,” such as China investors or the odious cretin Bill Gates. These investors are hostile to our national food production. Another imbecilic and corrupt byproduct of globalism.
Problem two: Capture. Big Ag, under the cloak of safety, uses governmental clubs to bludgeon competitors, set prices, establish unhealthful standards, etc. Monoculture, GMOs, mistreatment of animals, too much antibiotics and chemicals, etc.
It would be essential that we have moral honest people to manage this. But how can one have a functioning government run by amoral psychopaths and foreign enemies like Brandon’s handlers? Too long we have failed to acknowledge that immorality has costs. Rules of conduct are not just arbitrary restrictions on individual identity. Stupid, and evil, are unworkable.
I’ll never buy an assertion that if not for the USDA, we would not have an ample supply of safe nutritious food.
Ugh.
Thank you. USDA possibly became an Opportunist expanding itself into areas unforeseen 150 yrs ago.
Self preservation is inventive.
Well, I’m not too sure “My Body, My Choice” fits the control principles of Fascism. Even in a communist community, people must obey the Almighty Party. These good people live in a closed community obeying their own laws and practices, as they should be allowed under the Constitution, but all of that is overshadowed by the reach of the Democrat Party, the voice and fist of Socialistic Fascism of the United Stated.
But it doesn’t apply. Because “our side” believes the world functions by rule of law backed by principle. Their side holds no such beliefs. They believe in centralized power as a bludgeon. Their sodomite troll philosopher, Yuval Noah Harari, even says as much openly:
https://www.bitchute.com/video/quQAvAUm59wy/
Whose approach is winning?
Run for office. Get appointed. Take the bludgeon out of their hand and use it as they would. Then dismantle that office as you exit.
One of the sick actually died. Does the dead person’s family have recourse?
I wouldn’t think so, they signed the agreement to hold the farm harmless. If they had wanted to be safe, they could have heated the raw milk to 160F to kill any bacteria.
not if they signed a valid Hold Harmless Agreement with Miller.
No. Because that person assumed responsibility by joining and consuming raw milk. And there’s no evidence of negligence on the part of the farm.
My reading does not state that Mr. Miller’s milk caused the harm. The writing seems deliberately misleading on that point. Liability would be a matter of demonstrating negligence and causation.
The lettuce, spinach, etc contaminations weren’t usually “accidents,” but inevitable results of being downstream of massive factory hog or cattle CAFO operations.
And then you have migrant worker sanitation issues, but that might be considered “racist,” so we won’t bring that up.
USDA does not just protect consumers, but also proteccts other farmers and ranchers from one crackpot’s diseased herd or flock infecting surrounding farms or ranches. I get the staunch American individualism on display in this thread. But with that individualism comes a duty to exercise it responsibly. In this instance, compliance with USDA regulations is non-negotiable. This stubborn farmer is wrong.
I am reminded of a stupid father who impresed his middle school age son’s friends by saying “I get half the road, and I’ll take my half right down the middle if I so choose.” Most of us outgrow that nonsense.
This is not the first time govt officials have targeted the Amish. About 15 years ago or so, the PA govt sent in a SWAT team in the middle of the night to an Amish farm because it was selling unpasteurized milk. Customers purchased it believing pasteurization destroys essential nutrients in the milk and had been drinking it for decades without incident. But PA govt regulators and state scientists declared the milk a health threat anyway.
And yet they allow puppy mills- do nothing
Not really. One beagle puppy mill was just raided, and now the Humane Society (sorry) is scrambling to care for 4,000 puppies and dogs. These dogs were intended to be sold for the usual scientific torture.
The “extreme right” have had a meme for some time saying the Amish will rise in the ashes of the Western world destroyed by the Talmuds. That cannot be allowed. It would mean the Talmudic Holy War left a combatant on the field.
The Luciferian Feds are now turning their PATCON tactics they used to slaughter the Branch Davidians, the Weaver family, and to some extent the Fundamentalist Latter Day Saints, against the Amish. Watch as the propaganda ramps up accusing the Amish of dealing drugs, dealing weapons, and molesting/trafficking children. As it has always been, they will project their own crimes onto the group they want to destroy.
I worked for the USDA/AMS back in the 80’s and 90’s and worked closely with inspection. Things have changed considerably in those years but if anyone is truly interested in what is going on and the regulations involved it would be worth their time to read the link I’ve posted. I’d pay special attention to the difference between state and federal inspection. https://www.fsis.usda.gov/sites/default/files/import/Compliance-Guideline-LIvestock-Exemptions.pdf
It’s an interesting issue, specifically interesting because the members of the private food club are in a hold-harmless relationship with the Miller farm.
How’s the hold-harmless going to hold up in court when someone’s child dies from drinking tainted raw milk? I suspect it won’t and he’d get sued into bankruptcy.
Miller he is doing what he had always done, but times change. The Amish are the biggest tightwads you will ever meet and they use manure and honey wagons because it’s free. Pasteurizing milk costs money too.
Follow the law and pasteurize the milk! I would never buy or drink raw milk. The label organic on foodstuffs is nothing more than a marketing tool to me. Organic plant foods are expensive because they have to wash multiple times.
Many Pennsylvanians eat a lot of venison, including the Amish who aren’t shy about shooting any deer they see near their crops. The Amish moved into area where a friend had a hunting camp and the deer population crashed soon after.
That being said, where do wild game get the antibiotics? I am opposed to antibiotics and steroids/growth hormones in meat production. I believe both affect the consumer and may cause obesity.
Meat, whether natural or grown with antibiotics, can go rancid if not properly handled. Solution for everyone is don’t eat raw meat.
In the end the government will win its case. Being Amish doesn’t trump the law.
The Amish will jump into any niche market if they can make money. It’s off topic, but I could go on with the horrible puppy mills they operate.
“I would never buy or drink raw milk.”
So because YOU wouldn’t do it, you want to force your beliefs on everyone else? How tolerant of you, comrade.
I’m not forcing anyone. The law is the law. If you want to drink something that can make you really sick, or possibly kill you, have at it.
However, if you give illegal and tainted milk to your children and they get sick and die, then you should be arrested and charged with manslaughter.
Thousands of children were dying every year in France, and elsewhere, until Louis Pasteur made his discoveries.
Please explain to me what is the benefit of unpasteurized milk?
“ Illegal milk”
Hahahaha
And you wonder why the Rhino keep getting voted in to extend the scope of government.
We were asked by SD to share out opinions. I have.
So what does that have to do with my politics?
What are you currently doing to help defeat DemonRats in November?
A contract is a contract.
Does that include conducting business in violation of a law?
Hold Harmless agreements are not a legal contract. They are not accepted in courtrooms.
Some Judges will not hear the case. Insurance companies may reject an application if you use one.
They are intended to shift responsibilities, our laws protect Buyers, not Sellers.
You can’t hold a third party “Harmless” by “accepting” the risks then reject responsibility for accepting those risks. Worthless. Ask your ins. company or a Lawyer before you depend on one.
Neither party to the contract is contesting the contract.
Certainly the seller would have a problem if the buyer brought a claim for the care in producing the good or product.
And yet in most of Europe the cheese and other dairy products are made using unpasteurized milk. That’s why they taste better. I have no dog in this fight and have drunk both pasteurized (routinely) and unpasteurized milk (a friend’s mother had one milk cow). Yes, the unpasteurized milk and cream tasted significantly better, although perhaps people acclimated to low fat, pasreurized stuff wouldn’t think so.
The EU has strict standards on every thing, including food. I am sure they monitor it.
That doesn’t always stop rogue actors.
When I was in Europe in the early 1980s Austria’s wine industry was practically destroyed by distributors adding ethylene glycol (think anti-freeze) as a sweetener. I haven’t has a bottle of Austria wine since.
All one has to do is go to France. The cheese is offered as a dessert choice. And the taste is unmistakable different than cheese with the Pasteur method. Plus American milk needs refrigeration, shelf life is weeks at best. Brie in the US is expensive and says comes from France. It might come from there, but it had Pasteurs method and its as bland as an unsalted cracker.
Pasteur method he invented because of wine and beer for long term storage.
Well, no, unless you favor the government deciding what is best for your children, and if necessary taking the children away to populate yet another Federal Agency. See the slippery slope there? WHO in GOD’S NAME should make decisions for their children, anyway?
OK, so let’s just drop all food standards and kill thousands of people a year.
Trust me, there are a lot of parents who shouldn’t be parents.
Your application of collective responsibility betrays you.
Your argument is EXACTLY the same argument gun controllers use when they say “our inaction kills tens of thousands of people every year”.
People are responsible for their own decisions and action, uninvolved society surrounding them is not.
Period.
“We” has no place in this argument, except in the minds of collectivists.
OH MY ! I betrayed myself! I guess I better turn in all my guns and start voting for DemonRats.
LOL!
Apparently, many people here at the CTH rightfully condemn selective enforcement of laws, unless it happens to be a law they disagree with.
Miller is breaking the law if he selling his milk.
The people purchasing these pure products have more than likely researched them, know the risks. Unpasteurized tastes richer and the cream at the top is scrumptious.
That’s great but that doesn’t make it legal to sell it.
As of Apr. 2016, the sale of raw milk in stores is legal in 13 states. 17 states only permit raw milk sales on farms; 8 of the states that prohibit sales allow acquisition of raw milk only through “cow-share” agreements; and in 20 other states all sales of raw milk are prohibited.
Drinking or otherwise consuming raw milk is legal in all 50 states. With the exception of Michigan, no state expressly prohibits the sale of raw milk as animal feed.
Here is the law in Pennsylvania regarding the sale of raw milk.
Retail sale of raw milk in stores is allowed. On-farm sale of raw milk is also allowed. “Raw milk must come from cows certified by department as in good physical health and disease free; cows must be tested for brucellosis and tuberculosis at least once a year; bacterial limits < 20K/mL, coliform < 10/mL.”
THE law is the LAW, what a ridiculous statement. You’re not even speaking from a scientific pov. You’re comparing France and deaths with pasteurization and guess what lots of milk and cheeses are not pasteurized in France and many other countries. They do not use the Processing from Pasteur. THey use another method, and it does not require refrigeration and makes the cheese especially brie like a Dessert, and they serve it as dessert.
The law is the law, and the LAW is a self serving behemoth when managed by people who profit using the law.
Bow down to your masters, and may your chains lay lightly on wrists, as you learn ignorance is no excuse.
Listen to yourself.
So let’s just drop all food standards, or not enforce them, or have selective enforcement?
Where have we seen that?
You are uninformed about raw milk. It is so good for you. The ultra pasteurized and homogenized milk you buy in the store goes bad quickly and all the nutrients are destroyed in the process. There’s almost no point in drinking it. Most people who have raw milk are fastidious about cleanliness and testing their animals and the milk. No hormones. No antibiotics. No sprayed grass hay. Just the way God intended it.
I provide delicious and nutritious raw milk, I should say my dairy cows do, for my family. In the state of Tennessee, they can’t tell you what to do within your own family. If you don’t meet the state’s requirements for selling to others, you can sell your milk labeled as “pet milk”. Many people do that. I don’t. I keep it within the family.
But, the bottom line is: If you don’t like it, don’t drink it. The government needs to get their nose out of our business in general. There may come a time when you will wish you could buy FOOD from the Amish. It’s all in our best interest to support the Amish and their way of life.
I wish I were your neighbor or better yet, a long lost cousin.
Thank you. I have Jersey and Guernsey milk cows (high butterfat, A2/A2 proteins, which are digestible for people with lactose intolerance). Best milk on the planet and it’s feeding my grandchildren. I have a compromised immune system and I drink raw milk every day. I am grateful to the Lord for the opportunity to provide whole and nutritious foods to my family. My cows are clean because they are on fresh grass all the time and not herded into a dairy parlor. I hope I die carrying in fresh milk from the field.
Well said…This may set wheels in motion for attacks on all who operate small farms to feed us!
“Just the way God intended it.” I believe God intended that milk for a calf. Not humans. Lol.
If you read Scripture, it is clear that the Lord created all things for the benefit of people.
On this farm, we “calf share” because dairy cows can produce 6 or more gallons of milk a day. The calf does not need 6 gallons of high butterfat milk a day and learns to graze on the good grass and drink water as it grows. Some dairy cows produce 10-12 gallons of milk per day. Here, the calf is not weaned until 6 months and is weaned so that it doesn’t get too fat, which will interfere with it’s hormonal development as a dairy cow if it is a heifer (female). Steers are another matter. Fat cows have difficulty in their pregnancies and overall health, so it’s important to maintain balance. When we milk, we get what the calf does not need each day. The calf gets the lion’s share of the good milk. When the calf is weaned, we have a lot of milk to process every day and the other animals enjoy it too. My big dogs get their saucer of milk every morning too.
Real milk is a magical thing that everyone can benefit from. It is not a scarcity model, but a model of abundance.
To each his own, but life without food standards for the general public would be a disaster. The good o’days of my grandparents, all born in the 1890s, was one of illness, disease, and yes, food poisoning.
Also fake drugs, but I guess some things never change.
I agree with you that food standards can be a good thing. My grandpa grew up on a Georgia farm and was disgusted by every aspect of it and couldn’t wait to get away from the farm and the cows. I am thankful for this age where I can keep things clean.
I disagree that the government’s role is one of enforcer and destroyer rather than helper.
My father grew up on a farm in the 1920’s and 1930’s in northern Minnesota. They had cows, pigs, etc.
He never missed it.
While people can certainly decline to include milk in their diets, humans consuming animal milk certainly seems to constitute a reasonable use for it:
Genesis 18:8 — “So he took butter and milk and the calf which he had prepared, and set it before them; and he stood by them under the tree as they ate.”
One might find the proceeding versus enlightening as to who “they“ were.
Also from 1 Corinthians 9:7 — “Who at any time serves as a soldier at his own expense? Who plants a vineyard and does not eat the fruit of it? Or who shepherds a flock and does not drink from the milk of the flock?”
Don’t forget the scores of verses referring to the favorability of being in a land with “milk and honey”.
I’m glad you found it!!! I have an incurable cancer and the raw milk along with whole, organic, foods, has kept me out of treatment, off drugs, and out of the hospital. I will defend it with all of my being.
Do your own thing. I’m OK with it.
But selling a products to consumers is different.
Ever seen an Amish puppy mill located in the same barn as their milk cows?
No, but I’ve seen a wonderful Amish breeding barn, enclosed and climate controlled, with an outdoor run for quality dogs. Not all Amish eschew electricity. I’ve also seen a pretty filthy Amish barn for dairy cows. I wouldn’t buy from them.
Have you ever seen a commercial dairy that provides milk to the grocery stores? In many, the cows aren’t out on beautiful, scenic, fields, grazing. They are chained up in the barn. They poop and pee and give birth in that same spot. They are given antibiotics and hormones, etc. They aren’t always fed properly. Their calves are immediately separated and bottle fed with a milk replacer formula. The bond between mother and calf are immediately broken for ease of management. There’s a lot not to like in commercial dairies. The reason the milk is highly pasteurized and homogenized is to kill the bacteria that is inherent in that kind of set up. This has nothing to do with the Amish, and yet it is common practice in this country.
My point is this – if the consumer doesn’t do their due diligence and agree to the risks, then that’s on them.
Relying on government agencies to protect one from harm is no guarantee. There are lots of recalls on all types of foods continuously. In the case of this article, the customers know the farmer and agree to their practices before they purchase.
Can we shut down big Ag and big Pharma for all their lapses? No. But, we can refuse their practices and services because of freedom of choice. Let’s never give that up that freedom. We are being regulated, literally, to death. That is my primary point and has nothing to do with Amish. We need to support freedom.
Most people who have raw milk are fastidious about cleanliness and testing their animals and the milk.
And what about the people that aren’t? Should they be selling milk?
It’s a choice to sell. It’s a choice to buy.
I trust my Amish neighbors more than I trust the United States Government.
Nice chatting with you today. I have a farm to manage. Take care.
But, the bottom line is: If you don’t like it, don’t drink it.
I agree. But that doesn’t make it right for people to sell it and break the law.
The law is an ass.
I could care less. I rarely drink milk.
Miller is breaking the law.
It is MORE than obvious that you do indeed care! But what you care about is not milk, organic farming or the Amish people. You are just self-righteous about authoritarian rules!
I’ve been drinking raw milk for years. It is more healthy than the burnt-shit milk that big-ag provides. Why do you think so many people have lactose intolerance? FDA approved pasteurization. And another point – manure is so much more environmental and healthy than what big ag uses. Did you ever get a whiff after a farmer spreads pig manure. It’s fully liquified and it smells like a pig ate it’s own crap, vomited it out, ate it again, and then crapped it out again. It makes you wretch. And they spray it in pure liquid form, with no-till and it runs into the rivers and streams as soon as it rains. It is a disgusting and filthy practice.
#metoo
The most interesting thing is that grass fed cows’ poop doesn’t stink at all, and it feeds the soil. My pastures are beautiful. No chemicals, just happy cows. The milk is sweet and delicious! I don’t think I can ever drink store bought milk again.
So don’t buy the milk and enable more fed interFEARance.
There’s some written contradiction
– with all doe respect.
Yes, times are changing.
-WHY?
Your blanket statement of Amish being tight wads indicates acutely insufficient information of their inter community’s compassion and generosity.
Maybe you can get a law passed for the government to tax them at a much higher rate to finance Social justice reforms among the Amish?
Not at all! I really don’t care what they do, with the exception of puppy mills, as long as it doesn’t affect me.
The hold harmless agreement is more of a clause within a contract rather than a contract itself. YES! it is fully enforceable in a court of law. As a matter of fact, most of these clauses do hold up in court. Unless there is extreme negligence on the party that is being sued (like a dangerous substance being dumped into the milk supply) the contract should hold up in court. Anyways, take my opinion with a grain of salt as you seem to know what’s best for everyone (i.e. raw milk, deer population, venison, raw meat, growth hormones, steroids and the Amish religion along with their spending habits).
Luciferian Fed puppet, at best.
Every population has bad elements. The cohort needs to be evaluated net-aggregate. Did you work the Waco Seige? Were you on the helicopters, driving a tank pumping the gas into the building, or just rooting it on from the comfort of your couch?
I’m surprised you didn’t parrot the molestation blood libel.
LOL!
No, I am retired and I am currently involved on the ground trying to defeat DemonRat candidates in the 2022 election. What do you do other than make baseless assumptions?
And yet in the state of Washington which is one of the most liberal places in the United States it is legal to buy Raw Milk. I used to live there and I used to buy it and I’ve never been sick from it. It is great to make kefir from Raw Milk because it provides your body with more powerful probiotics then you could buy in pills or get from yogurt.
The law in Florida is that you can buy raw milk as long as it is labeled for animal consumption.
The problem is the law in every state is different.
I grew up in a town that had many dairy farmers land kids were just drink raw milk right from the cow. I never heard of any of them getting ill from it. They were probably healthier than most people in the city.
Miller should move to Washington. Problem solved.
It’s unfortunate you have found us, however, the folks that keep the treehouse on course will ultimately decide. There is Amish, Mennonite and Brethern in my family tree/ history. They are businessmen, capitalist and
Religious people. You do yourself and the Amish a disservice by painting (writing) with your broad brush.
In case States didn’t realize it, they’re up to bat right now….all of them are up to bat. Protect your citizens and quit sitting in the dugout.
PA is a good state for people that like tyranny. They won’t be protected in PA. Big-Ag will put the Amish out of business and PA gov’t is rife with the kind of statists that enjoy carrying it out.
The state of PA will never be able to curb stomp the Amish. Ever.
The federal government is like that guy in the public restroom who has fifty urinals to pick from and decides to use the one right next to the one you are using. Give me some space dude.
Truth….lol.
Amish live a life typically shielded from average American life styles and situations by religious choice .
They are by descriptive terms a religious cult that run afoul with the outside modern society when they either choose to cross that barrier they Institute or inadvertently cross that line .
Marketing products to sell must be inspected as any would be by any producer of said products .
Remember some of the Amish practices are not exactly acceptable to us English .
The practice of pulling young girls teeth (all of them) to avoid paying for dental work needed is down right medieval among other issues clashing with modern society and religious dogma
Omg- so uninformed
What a load of manure you are spreading here. Get some knowledge (not opinion) before you spread shyte.
The Amish are not a cult. They do not recruit others to be part of their lifestyle. Really, they just want to be left alone!
They are trying to live a lifestyle they believe the Holy Bible tells them to live – “Be ye not of this world”.
Are there some bad apples in the group as in any other group of people . . . maybe.
All the critics obviously miss the point . Many young girls have escaped the Amish group (since many find cult objectionable) due to the poor treatment or abuse .
I agree to live and let live and those wishing to partake in risks like naturally produced food products that are not tested for safety , go for it !
True government testing fails often but no testing at all is a roll of the dice like eating raw oysters and tuna it’s a risk as long as you are made aware of such risks .
As for spreading shyte perhaps a bit more research will alter your criticism
The Amish and other Anabaptist communities, such as the Mennonites, arose in the 16th century — contemporary with Martin Luther, Zwingli, Calvin — and voluntarily separated themselves from “The State.” As a consequence, they refuse to be inducted into “State Religions,” “State Military Drafts,” “State Public Schools,” and so forth. Ultimately the US courts determined that that Amish embody a religious way of life protected by the religious exercise clause of the US Constitution.
We have recently heared Democrats proclaim the sanctity of “Stare Decisus.” Will these join Farmer Miller in an appeal to US District and Supreme Courts, which settled the matter during WWI ?
Utter crap. I am in beautiful Lancaster county in pa – and trust me, I am very very familiar with every aspect of amish life! If pulling young girls teeth as you describe was commonly done in this area I would know about it.
The lifestyle practiced has everything to do with wanting separation from the cancerous society existing nowadays – and raising one’s family as untainted as possible.
Robert has not been apprised of Grandmas rules, or being informed before posting. Yikes.
Stop attacking farmers. PERIOD. He should sell bullets to his members. Remember Bundy, Waco, Ruby Ridge? Is this useless FEDERAL org armed? Yes, then FJB.
Was at dinner last night with a group, many who are private small businesses. Everyone talked about the IRS harassment coming because of Biden and the Democrats – it’s going to be like a huge wet blanket dropped on small business.
Of course it is. The Democrats’ best friends are giant corporations and American oligarchs. It is to their advantage to quash small to medium businesses whenever, wherever and however it is possible. (What do you think was the real purpose of “lockdowns”?)
“Just pay your taxes, you’ll have nothing to worry about.”
When the government announces some huge recall on romaine lettuce of a certain date, it’s because an Immigrant Doing the Jobs Americans Won’t Do has pooped or peepeed in the actual field of said harvest. But that’s different I suppose.
As an aside, these recalls always come weeks after the first report. So it is unlikely that any of the possibly tainted product remains, as it has been consumed or spoiled by then.
Exactly!! Big Ag and Big Food systems are rife with problems. Recently it was tainted peanut butter that most people had already eaten by the time the notice went out.
This brings to mind Big Pharma being held harmless for Covid vaccine adverse events. Records of adverse events in the near and far term will go down the proverbial “memory hole.”
Fook Pennsylvania. They oughta join The Great State of BEST VIRGINIA, at least the western half.
I think it is more likely that that person that died from listeria was killed by the corrupt health care complex. You can’t trust corporate media to investigate that aspect.
Also, usda has same relationship with bag ag as the fda has with big pharma. They are monopolistic structures and fascist cartel arrangements that should be destroyed with extreme prejudice.
Also – I think that every judge accepting remuneration from a government position has a conflict of interest in any cases brought by or involving government. They are biased from the start and conflicted by their dependence on the government system.
We definitely have a double standard – one for the big guys, one for the little guys. Our government can let Pfizer et al skate on harm caused by mRNA Covid injections, but will try and incarcerate and ruin an Amish farmer who’s customers have agreed to hold him harmless in exchange for buying natural foods. If this farmer goes the way of the Dodo bird, Bill Gates or the CCP will be waiting in the wings to buy his land. We need to remove the scales from our eyes and see how these “Great Reset” and “Build Back Better” movements have been kicked into high gear. By the time we wake up, I’m afraid it will be too late.
Totally agree. It’s all about control.
This being an Amish family has nothing to do with it. This is overreach from the government. I watched a documentary on Indiana beef growers fighting with STATE agencies to have their own slaughter facilities to break from the food monopolies. And that’s what we have now in the USA. There are like 3 beef monopolies and the same goes for chicken and pork. I believe the Chinese own one (think it’s Smithfield). These Indiana small beef farmers fought for over 10 years and finally won. All these state legislators and governor (can you say Pence?) just ignored their efforts until finally the farmers got a couple legislators on their side, then a few more etc. The monopolies lobby and pay off the politicians.
This is the same government overreach. If you sign an agreement to pay and belong to a private food club (and I know there’s a name for it because we have them in my area) then you agree to the risks and benefits.
This is the USDA and FDA trying for a power grab for their masters the monopolies of agriculture. They want to eliminate small farming and control all food supplies through the approved monopolies.
Feds…aren’t these the same folks the gave America the sugar cereals back in the fifties and got us hooked on carbs?
USDA food pyramid.
Useless federal workers looking for something to do to justify their existence annual budgets benefits and pensions.
We can do without the usda. Perhaps there was a time it had some value. That time was probably 100 years ago.
I would go to standing i.e. challenge the USDA’s right to prosecute starting with the proposition that the Federal Govt’s authority over commerce is limited to interstate transactions. They do not have jurisdiction over commercial activity if all his members are in the same state as he.
There is also a religious exemption angle if all his members are Amish.
Other than that, we know that US Prosecutor’s love to take on the little guy because a) they’re easy pickings and b) promotions come from successful prosecutions. This is a form of corruption.
A whole variety of government “processes” will emotionally, financially and religiously defeat the Millers. There’s a slight possibility they may not end up in jail, but if not, it will serve as an EXCELLENT message to the rest of anybody else who wants to become aggressive in securing their “rights and liberties”.
The Obama Transformation is just starting to bite into us, with a lot longer to go. All the buildings and people in Washington DC are not the government you thought it was.
Because the FDA has done so well with Covid oversight…
I believe Farmer Miller and his wife are completely within their Constitutional rights and the federal government should be kicked out. The feds ruin everything they touch.
The FDA is as corrupt as the CDC, the NIH, the EPA and all the other agencies that “regulate” our lives. I’m personally fed up with them regulating our water, air, food, and every living thing they come in contact with. They are grossly inhibiting our right to the Pursuit of Happiness.
The federal government is bought and paid for by entities that care not for American citizens and it should be dismantled.
Moral of the overall story? Humans should NOT be consuming cow’s milk. Humans should consume human milk until they don’t, only as a baby.
Weird how we have been doing it for thousands of years and Europeans have a genetic mutation to enable them to tolerate it as adults.
However, did we all survive.
Yeah. and I know several who got jabbed and are injured or dead, yet our Federal Government protects the Big Pharma from responsibility for their jab. When a child is injured or dies from Bill Gates’s crickets will the Federal Government go after him?
F*$ the gov agencies.
They couldn’t find a grizzly if it was in front of them.
What’s the difference between the people who get their food from this farmer and the people who eat somebody else’s potato salad at a potluck? Same risk of food-born illness. Why does the government need to get involved in either one?
Good point
A third of the population doesn’t wash their hands after using the toilet.
“Look Ma – No Hands”
Sorry – the devil made me say it……………………..
And they use their hand to wipe their rear….
Every FDA (government) approved drug has known risks; side effects, of which some are listed (in tiny print) on the containers, or written on paperwork from the pharmacy.
Often, people do not know they will have negative; sometimes life threatening reactions, to medicines, food or other consumed products that are sold.
Many people are knowingly allergic to nuts, eggs, tomatoes, lactose …. and various other consumed products only after a bad reaction.
How interesting it is (perhaps even telling) that Vitamins are not FDA approved.
There are no ( or have little) provisions in the law for the FDA to approve dietary supplements for safety before they reach the consumer.
https://ritual.com/articles/the-fdas-role-in-the-supplement-industry
I found this interesting:
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2016/06/supplements-make-tobacco-look-easy/488798/
——————————
People have been purchasing the farmer’s edibles BY CHOICE.
The alleged 2 listeria cases should have ONLY warranted:
-an FDA-inspection to determine and trace listeria
– help farmer to mitigate it
PERIOD!
The Atlantic is a left-leaning publication/website. I always keep that thought in mind when reading from there.
When the fbi, Atf, irs, and other government orgs cease misbehaving, then I’ll start worrying about the amish selling goods to people who belong to a club.
Maybe.
A contract is a contract and there is no need for the government to inject itself.
It took home schoolers a long time to get the government and unions off their back.
Gov agencies couldn’t find a grizzly if it was standing in front of them. Don’t they have some big ag to go after for the poison put into their food?
My strongest thoughts are that the FDA spend their time and effort on how the drug companies are destroying peoples’ health and lives with the vaccines. Tobacco, pot, alcohol are all voluntary choices made by private individuals as this seems to be and another overreach by the ‘departments’ of the government.
Can you spell fascism? It is the cornerstone of the Democrat Party.
The big picture here, is that the government wants to destroy common law which our Constitution is based on.
The Farmer is operating in the Private.
The government can not have anyone legally telling them to trick off.
Just like certain Gymns during the Covid farce, the changed to Operating in the Private. This is a lawful stop to the government based in our laws and Constitution.
Josh Barnett from Arizona has been teaching people how to stop the government from taking over every aspect of our lives, by using the State Constitutions.
Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the Amish and some other Anabaptist groups do not participate in the Social Security system (legally). They do not pay in and in turn they get no Social Security benefits. They take care of each other – great way to live.
Could this play into the govt wanting to punish them? They are making too much $$$$ that the gubmint can not get out of the farmers back pocket.
Meat, produce & dairy products which are subject to gubmint regulations are recalled for various contaminations including e-coli every day.
Who has their eye on the Miller’s land?
The community of people who purchase from him…and rightly so, they are the one’s most concerned! He does not sell to the general public!
Yes, I understood. Somebody wants his land. By force apparently.
Honestly, given the contribution to prostate and breast cancer, obesity and heart disease that animal milk in general and cow’s milk in particular create, why would any well informed person drink the secretions of a cow well after the need for milk ends at about 2 years old for humans. After all, nature or whomever engineered cow’s milk to grow a 100 pound calf into a 600 pound steer quickly. Why would a human want to replicate that? For the first 62 years of my life I loved drinking cow’s milk and products made from cow’s milk. And then I came down with prostate cancer, pre-diabetic status, the early stages of heart disease, and weighed 265 pounds (15 pounds shy of being clinically obese). On my doctor’s recommendation, among other products, I cut out all dairy products. That was 11 years ago. Now: cancer free, Pre-diabetic status gone, heart disease gone, and I dropped 80 pounds and have kept it off—all through dietary changes combined with exercise. I feel better at 73 than I did at 25 and enjoy optimal blood work results on all parameters measured.
Only they don’t. You get diabetes from being overweight mainly due to carbs.
There sure seems to be a lot of liars.
What’s in Nanzi’s ice cream?
The notion that governments exist to protect citizens from themselves is an extremely dangerous one.
Putting someone in prison until he pays a fine seems counter-productive and reminiscent of “debtors’ prison.” And if they decide to jail his wife, then I suppose what they really want to do is seize his farm. The government is like that.
Easy to pick on the Amish because of their commitment to faith and peace.
Patriots, OTOH, well….
Bill Gates has probably already put in an offer!
Everyone accepts risk on a daily basis. USDA is not in the founding so I prefer the axiom less is more. Less fascism, more Liberty.
I love raw milk. It tastes clean and without a sour aftertaste. That sour aftertaste is from the dead bacteria in the pasteurized milk. It’s like drinking a soup filled with dead, rotted bacteria bodies. I also need the gut bacteria from raw milk because I am on heavy doses of antibiotics for an infection in my leg that will never go away. Stop telling me how to live my life. I have a far greater chance of getting killed in a car accident than from drinking raw milk, but facts never stopped a good communist from controlling another person’s life. Besides, who will take responsibility for the deaths of people who consume USDA and FDA controlled products and still get infections and die? Should we blame the USDA and FDA for letting a tainted product slip through their fingers? The USDA should be embarrassed for itself!!!
This is not about milk. That is total bullshit.
This is about the government trying to remove your constitutional guarantees period.
The legal term is operating in the Private.
The government is attempting to bust that lawful practice up. This is pure overreach of federal agencies that have been told to get the hell out of people’s lives..
I read this a lot. Usually with lots of likes. What remains is ‘how do we end government overreach and intrusion into our freedoms and liberties’?
More specifically, how do we end the humans who, freely and with full cognizance, make that choice. That’s really what it comes down to. They’re being who they really are. Accept it. Do what needs to be done.
This makes me think of the raw milk movement where a lot of us do not want pastuerized milk as the process adulterates the product. You can get unpastuerized directly from farmers if your state allows it. But the federal government was fighting it for a while as though it was heroin. I am not sure of its current efforts. Hunters can process their own animals. This would not be any different.
My father grew up on a farm a century ago. He worked for an oil company most of his adult life. On retiring, he threw away the suits and loafers for jeans and boots. We thought he had gone crazy. He built up a ranch where he bred cattle. I did not appreciate him back then and did not get into the details but he always boasted that he raised his cows the ‘old’ way, not the modern way and rarely ever lost a calf in the process, unlike as happens with the modern methods.
Did the Pilgrims not create a great country without the need for intrusive government agencies? What was Reagan’s famous quote? “The nine most terrifying words in the English language are ‘I’m from the government and I’m here to help.'”
I contend religious freedoms are in play here and those facts of the Amish beliefs would support his farming agenda!
Two people died from tainted milk but nowhere does it say it was from farmer Millers milk.
Did they die from his milk?
When reading such posts, a memory is accessed. A pretty recent one. Covid. The propaganda, the lies, the obfuscation, the distraction.
It’s pretty easy to turn that cannon on any target, here apparently an Amish farmer. Or maybe you, or maybe me.
The scary part is the sweat we produce each day to labor to buy that USDA-approved version of milk not only funds their propaganda war but also the direct attacks on humans and their businesses.
We can make different choices.