President Trump and Turkish President Recep Erdogan – This Should Be Interesting…

The announcement of The United States drawing down troop deployment from Northern Syria – with the United Arab Emirates, and Saudi Arabia sending in replacements to bolster the region, highlights a much larger backstory.

President Obama’s February ’09 Cairo speech began a sequence of events that led to what was called the “Arab Spring“; factually an extremist uprising.  Bolstered by the resulting chaos the Muslim Brotherhood rose to power in Egypt behind Mohammed Morsi.

However, a majority of the Egyptian people rejected President Morsi’s sharia governance, and asked a well respected General Fattah al-Sisi to step in.  Accepting the request of a desperate people Sisi removed Morsi, disbanded the Muslim Brotherhood and went on to win a landslide election in 2014.   The leadership of the Brotherhood fled to Qatar.

President Obama and his policy team was not happy with this outcome.  Obama supported Morsi, not al-Sisi.  Another person who was not happy, was Turkish President Recep Erdogan, who also supported Morsi and the Muslim Brotherhood.

Undeterred, and understanding the need for urgency, Egyptian President al-Sisi then began a long process of confronting extremism.  Sisi destroyed the Hamas terror tunnels on the border between Egypt and Israel; and, despite the anxiety expressed by U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry, Sisi brokered an interim peace agreement between the Palestinian Authority and Israelis.

Destroying the Hamas tunnels removed the physical terror influence of Iran.  President al-Sisi then returned his focus back to Qatar and their support for the exiled leadership of the Brotherhood.

President al-Sisi formed a coalition against Qatar. This coalition included the UAE and Saudi Arabia who withdrew their ambassadors and isolated Qatar in the region.  This was the beginning of what we now call more broadly the Arab coalition.  The coalition initiated sanctions against Qatar until they stopped financing and harboring terror.  Remember this is late in 2014 and a lot is happening really fast.

Against growing pressure from Arab states, including the Gulf Cooperation Council, Qatar agreed to expel seven leaders of the Muslim Brotherhood.  Again reflecting his alignment with the Brotherhood, and with much more grand ambitions of a new Ottoman empire as his unspoken motive, Recep Erdogan provided the terror leaders a home in Turkey.

It is important to note timing (’13, ’14, ’15,) and the political alignments:

  • President Obama, Turkey (Erdogan), Qatar, the Palestinian Authority, and Iran, were aligned with favorable outlook toward the Muslim Brotherhood.
  • Egypt, Israel, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, UAE and the Gulf Arab states were not favorable toward the Muslim Brotherhood.

In the background of this ideological conflict, Syria is in a state of civil war as a result of U.S. Obama policy carried out by Secretary Clinton/Leon Panetta and Secretary Kerry/John Brennan. Obama is aligned with Turkey, again Erodgan, who wants greater influence and has a vision of his new Ottoman empire.  As gatekeeper between Europe and the Middle East, Erdogan knows the value of his geography and the influence it provides him.

Erdogan also wants to absorb Northern Syria and is willing to enlist his Muslim Brotherhood allies toward his goals.  However, Egypt, Israel, Saudi Arabia and the UAE (team anti-Brotherhood) are against the expansion of Turkish influence.

Despite President Obama’s ongoing opposition, Egyptian President al-Sisi faced down Turkey over a U.N. Security Council seat and quietly defeated them.  [In a secret ballot, Erdogan lost.]  At the same time this was happening, expansive energy reserves via natural gas, were discovered to be much larger than initially thought off the coast of Israel.

♦Fast forward to the 2016 presidential election and outcome of a Donald Trump victory.  With President Trump the power dynamic shifts.  Hillary Clinton, recognizing the value of the financial benefit from Qatar, would have supported the Muslim Brotherhood; Donald Trump does not.

The Anti-Brotherhood, anti-extremism team now have an ally.  The key voices are Egyptian President Fattah al-Sisi, Saudi Arabia King Salman, and Crown Prince Mohammed Bin Salman.

President Trump supports the disposition and view of the Arab coalition (Egypt, Jordan, UAE, Saudi Arabia, GCC and ultimately Israel); President Trump is not supportive of the Pro-Brotherhood more extremist team (Turkey, Qatar, Palestinian Authority) and that becomes brutally obvious during the historic U.S.-Gulf summit when President Trump tells the audience to “drive out” the extremist voices.

Back to Syria.  The Brotherhood is the political branch of multiple extremist groups. The bottom line is the Brotherhood supports radical Sunni extremism regardless of faction or fighting force.  President Recep Erdogan of Turkey also favors the Brotherhood; and unfortunately he leverages his position inside NATO with that favorability in mind.

Recep Erdogan wants Northern Syria; and wants to eliminate any resistance toward his gaining Northern Syria; specifically the Kurdish resistance.  Concerns over this key point are what’s driving a wedge between government policy advisers. Differences of opinion over this key point are what’s driving opposition to Trump’s withdrawal position.

The Arab coalition, and Israel, oppose Erdogan.  President Trump has been undergoing a transition period for quite some time.  Trump’s plan is essentially to draw-down U.S. troops in Syria and replace them with regional Arab coalition allies to bolster the Kurds.  Many U.S. voices are concerned that Turkey (Erdogan) will attack this coalition and the Kurds, without the presence of U.S. troops.

Ultimately this is where President Trump becomes important.  President Trump is aware of the duplicitous and untrustworthy nature of President Erdogan; simultaneously Erdogan is in the NATO alliance.  President Trump will obviously not allow fear of a NATO ally to drive U.S. policy; and he’s right.

If you think about it, either: (A) Turkey needs to comply with group regional security and stability measures; or (B) Turkey needs to be kicked out of NATO, confronted and crushed.

Which option do you think President Trump is working on?

Yesterday, December 23rd:

Today, December 24th:

Knowing the economic approach that President Trump brings to solving these challenges, I have a hunch the president is positioning for option “A”, but in the background hoping for the opportunity to use option “B”, which will really get to the root of the problem.

This geopolitical dynamic also provides a more clear understanding of what motives Erdogan held when he was so aggressively antagonizing over the Kashoggi matter and trying to create a fracture in the relationship between President Trump and Crown Prince Mohammed Bin Salman (MbS).

[…]  We now know that Jamal Khashoggi was never a journalist—at least, not in the usual sense of the word; he was a highly-partisan operative who worked with a handler to publish propaganda at the behest of the Emirate of Qatar. He was, in other words, an agent of influence. (read more)

Yes, that’s correct.  Even the New York Times now admits, Jamal Khashoggi was actually receiving his articles from the Qatar government explicitly to push an agenda favorable to their pro-Muslim Brotherhood views.

Now think about this.  In the U.S. we know The Washington Post is essentially the print propaganda for the U.S. intelligence apparatus, and more specifically the CIA.  Khashoggi was working at the Washington Post, to write stories, approved by Qatar, favorable to the Muslim Brotherhood.   The CIA Director was John Brennan; the former head of U.S. CIA Saudi office.

Notice how the pro-Brotherhood ideological gang is all connected around Khashoggi?  Turkey, Qatar, CIA (Obama, Brennan) etc.

Oh, and one last thing…..  Remember that 2014/2015 massive natural gas reserve discovery off the coast of Israel?

Remember that?

Well, there was a recent development:

JERUSALEM (AP) — Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on Thursday said that Israel, Greece and Cyprus will sign an agreement early next year to build a pipeline to carry natural gas from the eastern Mediterranean to Europe, while the United States pledged its support for the ambitious project.

The $7 billion project, expected to take six or seven years to complete, promises to reshape the region as an energy provider and dent Russia’s dominance over the European energy market. It also could curtail Iranian ambitions to use Syria as a gateway to the eastern Mediterranean.

Speaking at a summit with the Greek and Cypriot leaders in southern Israel, Netanyahu said the three nations reaffirmed their commitment to the pipeline and discussed “important aspects” of the project. Italy is also a partner in the pipeline’s planning. Cyprus President Nicos Anastasiades said the project is waiting for a green light from the European Union to move forward.

“We’re going to sign formally, officially, this agreement in a few months,” he said.

In another boost for the project, U.S. Ambassador David Friedman hailed the pipeline as integral to the “stability and prosperity of the Middle East and Europe,” and urged all countries in the region to ensure its success.

Washington is eyeing the east Mediterranean with renewed interest. In a meeting with the Greek foreign minister earlier this month, U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo called the region “an important strategic frontier” for Washington, which is working to strengthen its relations with “democratic allies there like Greece and Cyprus and Israel.”  (read more)

Do you know who was the original energy policy consultant; the person who constructed the obscure -at the time- policy paper plan to avoid an EU pipeline through Turkey; and who put all of these regional heads together; that ultimately ended with this announced deal?

That would be the little known, generally invisible young energy adviser, who would eventually become the central figure in the “spygate” targeting, George Papadopoulos.

Yes, for those following the granules as they expose, that energy extraction strategy alone would have put Papadopoulos in opposition to the interests of President Obama, candidate Clinton, Turkey, Qatar and ultimately Iran and Russia.

Huh… Funny that.

It’s almost as if…..

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298 Responses to President Trump and Turkish President Recep Erdogan – This Should Be Interesting…

  1. MVW says:

    And I didn’t even hop the pond to our British buds’ MI-5&6.

    I didn’t mention Trump’s banker bud’s helping him with tax & deals.

    If I didn’t know any better, it smells like Nationalists & Globalists are just two factions of the same group, following rules of competition, whichever wins, the group still wins. No idea who the ‘group’ is.

    It just stinks with a dead odor.

    Like

  2. kltk1 says:

    Great read. Thank you for putting that together.

    Liked by 7 people

    • fleporeblog says:

      What our Lion 🦁 has done in less than two years in this region of the world is absolutely a gift from God! I truly believe that leaders like President el-Sisi of Egypt 🇪🇬, King Abdullah of Jordan 🇯🇴, King Salaman and Prince MBS of Saudi Arabia 🇸🇦 as well as PM Bibi Netanyahu of Israel 🇮🇱 saw the election of our President as a gift as well. They have seen the face of evil in the previous administration.

      They realize that everyday is precious in order to bring peace and stability to Northern Africa and the Middle East. The forces that will take over when we leave will fight like their lives are on the line. Turkey 🇹🇷, Muslim Brotherhood, Qatar 🇶🇦, Iran 🇮🇷 etc. are in for a rude awakening. The GCC countries don’t follow the same rules of engagement as our troops. They will kill first and ask questions later.

      We are on the cusp of the Iranian Mullahs being killed or run out of their country. I truly believe they won’t be around once the calendar hits 2020. Once that occurs, peace becomes a reality. Hamas, Hezbollah, Palestinians, ISIS, al-qaeda, Taliban etc. will all fall apart quickly without the financial backing of Iran 🇮🇷.

      The Neoconservatives, Warmongers, BHO, Brennan, Kerry, HRC, Erdogan, Uniparty etc. all realize that their grand scheme is literally evaporating right in front of their eyes.

      Liked by 20 people

    • Mo says:

      Yes excellent Sundance and Merry Christmas to all Treepers!

      Liked by 3 people

  3. sysconfig says:

    One of the best..no the best connect the dots I have read..well done.

    Liked by 13 people

  4. joeknuckles says:

    It took me a while to get through the whole thing, due to a house full of kids and various other relatives, but I saw the Papadoofus connection coming. Although I have to admit that I had previously thought Papa was delusional to think he was targeted for any other reason than his connection to Trump. Papa was on the right track all along and was right to promote the pipeline. He’s pretty damn smart for a young guy.

    If only the rest of the country could read Sundance’s outline, there might be hope.

    Liked by 13 people

    • The Demon Slick says:

      Half of Cyprus is occupied by the saracens. It’s a real military occupation. I’m not disagreeing with anything I just think it’s important to factor in. The media never mentions occupied northern Cyprus because then they might have to explain why they’re so mad at what they call the occupation of Israel. No heartwrenching stories about poor displaced Cypriot children will be written. No heartstrings will be tugged on for the poor Cypriot refugees. A real military occupation and nobody gets freaked. A false one by the Jews and they go all Farrakhan.

      Liked by 5 people

      • yucki says:

        And the Turk is making threatening noises to the rest of Cyprus all the time!
        It’s just gotten worse, now that he knows he’s not getting a piece of that East Med gas pipeline.

        Turkey, Greece, Cyprus conflict deepens as new flashpoint in the Med intensifies
        https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-10-31/turkey-greece-cyrpus-conflict-deepens-new-flashpoint-med-intensifies

        Liked by 1 person

      • mike says:

        At this point, Cyprus doesn’t have displaced children – the Turkish takeover was 40+ years ago. Greek Cyprus is prosperous in comparison to Turkish Cyprus albeit the Turks still have the massive, stolen real estate from 1974.

        The real problem is that both sides have had blood on their hands from ethnic grabs and massacres over the generations. The worst opportunists of either side selectively used these historical priors as excuses for worse ethnic atrocities. The mainland Turks were the more recent aggressor with a bigger vulgarity “to protect the Turkish Cypriots”. No one mentions the murderous activities of some Greek Cypriots before 1974, or how Cypriots treat their guest workers…

        Street level realities are kind of messy and ugly.

        Liked by 2 people

    • Dutchman says:

      J.K.; Right there with ya; thought papad was blowing smoke, but saw him coming, in closing paragraphs of article.
      And great anayses, flep, as always!

      Liked by 3 people

    • The Devilbat says:

      If only the rest of the country could read Sundance’s outline, there might be hope.”
      If only half the country could even read. They all watch the indoctrination box (TV).

      Liked by 4 people

  5. Donna in Oregon says:

    The President is right. We were there to defeat ISIS. Time to leave. For the rest of it, according to my Bible there hasn’t been peace in the Middle East for centuries.

    Let them fight it out for Syria. As far as the Kurds, they are much like the Jews, they will have to get a strong hold and hold on to it rather than mingle with the others. It’s just the way those people are, it will never stop.

    Liked by 4 people

  6. Justin Green says:

    Liberals always side with radical Islam. They’re both the same, really. Tyrannical, immoral terrorists.

    Liked by 8 people

  7. Trump Train says:

    Fantastic info. Refreshing to read real journalism which is both fact based and informational.

    Liked by 8 people

  8. GB Bari says:

    I was always suspicious of Papadopoulos. Something didn’t add up about his being targeted by the Obozo embeds in the IC but yet he formerly worked for them. And then suddenly was on the Trump Campaign. Up until now there was nothing that reconciled the disparate facts.

    Now it makes perfect sense. Thanks to the master sleuth who hosts this blog.

    Merry Christmas to Sundance and all Treepers.

    Liked by 8 people

  9. Rich Van Slooten says:

    Good analysis Sundance. enjoyed reading the thread. I have lived in the Middle East for over 20yrs. I understand the politics of power. The Sunni – Shia conflict is the undercurrent of all struggles as well as the common denominator of the Israeli problem. I do fear for the Kruds. They are oppressed on all sides – Syrian, Iraqi, Iranian, Turki, etc. I hate to see the U.S. abandon the Kruds – so I hope that there is ongoing covert support in a meaningful way. Turkey’s ongoing influence has to be diminished – but that will drive the Turks towards Russian influence which they know is much more brutal. So overall its an interesting chess match and just gets more complex as time goes on.

    Liked by 4 people

    • jeans2nd says:

      Saudi Arabia and the UAE are moving in to protect the Kurds.
      And who knows how many Israeli “Arabs” will also be embedded with the Saudis, what with the new-found SA/Israel alliance? Heck, one may even see a few Egyptian “Arabs,” who knows?

      Liked by 3 people

      • yucki says:

        who knows how many Israeli “Arabs”…
        …are ALREADY embedded with the Kurds.
        Plenty.
        Many of those Thomas Wictor identifies as “GCC” are – in fact – Israelis.

        Nearly half the Jewish population of Israel comes from the Arab world. NOT European origen, something few in the West understand.
        Actually, they’re ethnic Arabs, just as there are ethnic Arab Christians.

        Liked by 1 person

  10. Rich Van Slooten says:

    Kurds instead of Kruds… Sorry there

    Liked by 3 people

  11. Attorney at Law says:

    Shouldn’t Barry Soetoro be reading this site on a daily basis? Oh and Hillary as well, what about Soros?

    Just link this site to their instagram and surely someone would let them know…

    They too could have a Merry Christmas.

    Liked by 3 people

  12. sauwinglam says:

    Brilliant analysis. The best I have ever read on this subject. A copy should be sent to every member of Congress so they know what is going on.

    Liked by 11 people

    • James Carpenter says:

      “Brilliant analysis. The best I have ever read on this subject. A copy should be sent to every member of Congress so they know what is going on.” –

      Hear, hear! Would open some eyes.

      Liked by 3 people

    • WSB says:

      Publically. All on Twitter.

      Liked by 2 people

      • Sharpshorts says:

        This story is being told on twitter, bit by bit.
        Are you aware of the large number of writers that twitter has banned or shadow banned
        that are telling a lot of what sundance has outlined?
        But the “social network twitter” is a part of the Obama/Clinton/CIA cabal (et al.)…fighting to continue keep the general public in dark.

        Evil does not give up easily…remember that there are TRILLION$ at stake.
        History shows that absolute domination of the world has always been the larger goal…
        That continues to be the goal of the enemy today.

        Liked by 3 people

  13. sterling1776 says:

    Wow. I can’t wait until all the movies about these times are made. Anyhow, I pray that PDJT can carry out all of his plans despite the forces aligned against him. He’s already made the world a better place. Too bad about one third of our country is watching a different movie and, consumed by hate, just don’t get it.

    Liked by 6 people

  14. Sayit2016 says:

    I said a few months that the BS when some here were slamming Pappa D was a hapless, wanna be, nitwit .I said that was not true given his expertise in natural renewable energy…….see this is yet another layer in the Criminal Clinton labyrinthine…

    Liked by 3 people

    • WSB says:

      I never knew what to make of him. Nothing ever set right around Papadopoulos’ story.

      I guess we now know why. Some should tweet this to George.

      Would be a nice Christmas present.

      Liked by 1 person

      • yucki says:

        Negotiations for the East Med pipeline have been going on for years. For far too long Israel was trying to hammer something out with the Turk. Jews still live in Turkey, trade between the countries has been substantial.

        But as the Turk grew increasingly Islamist, and then openly hostile, those outside the business community in Israel began to oppose any such longterm arrangement. Parallel negotiations with Greece and Cyprus started in earnest.

        Greece was none too friendly with Israel historically. Then she got deeper into the debt-pit, and swamped with Merkel’s Moslem pets. Israel was seen in a different light, relations have been improving steadily. Joint military training missions, technology transfer, various positive exchanges.

        This deal is the culmination of a process. It looks great!

        Liked by 1 person

  15. Austin Holdout says:

    Is this our Christmas gift? Wow! Where else could we read this kind of analysis? Absolutely fascinating.

    Liked by 5 people

  16. LULU says:

    I am absolutely in awe of what Sundance has pulled together for us here. Anyone who doesn’t “get” Syria and Erdogan and the dynamic our President Trump is working on after reading this article will never get it. I saw some of them on Fox Business earlier today.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Mongoose says:

      And what amazes me is that Pres. Trump is not afraid to go toe-to-toe with a rat like Erdowan. Like The Prince says, “Keep your friends close and your enemies closer” is a hard thing to do, but Trump is doing it. Everyone else before him bowed down and kissed and groveled at his caliphate longings. And everyone else treated the Moose Limb Bros. as a victim class of helpless, toothless homeless, whatever’s, and not the terrorists they really are.

      Liked by 5 people

  17. Convert says:

    Papadopoulos has been tweeting about this from the outset, and a lot of people blew him off. He was targeted for a reason much bigger than just OrangeManBad…. Thanks for the excellent explanation.

    Liked by 4 people

  18. warrprin1 says:

    All the contributors here tonight have provided exposure, breadth, depth, and clarity for those of us who strain to comprehend the policy decisions enacted by our government. Sundance, your extraordinarily well explained piece has elicited contributions from a squadron of additional knowledgeable sources. Solid, detailed, up to date information, on all policies pursued by our own government, and the context surrounding the development of those policies, are precisely what we, John Q. Public, need, in order to make informed choices in regard to whom we support for elected leadership.

    Thank you, to all of you, for weighing-in with such valuable lessons in history, politics, energy economics, and international muscle flexing. There is someone at home in the White House tonight who has made enormous personal sacrifices to serve the American people, and to right the Ship of State. You have turned the unmaskers of the previous Administration into the unmasked.

    God bless you. God bless President Trump. And God bless the United States of America. Merry Christmas to all.

    Liked by 10 people

  19. Right to reply says:

    Like the movie Jack Reacher. Kill six to hide the fact you only wanted to kill the one. Trump, is brilliant! I wonder if Carter Page feels a little angry that the FISA was always meant for Pops, but they couldn’t get it!

    Liked by 1 person

  20. You can definitely see Valerie Jarrett all over this. She’s the most dangerous of the group. Mainly because most people think this is a Sunni/Shia conflict. That may play a small part in it, but it is mainly a Persian/Arab conflict, which Jarrett understands perfectly all too well. As for the other players, they have minor roles. Obama is too lazy/stupid. Clinton is in it for the money, even though she is heavily influenced by another Persian, Huma Abedin. Brennan is too driven by his emotions. But Jarrett on the other hand is ideologically driven. Her downfall though will be the Persian belief that the Arabs and Jews are inferior. That may be true to a large extent with the Arabs, but will prove fatal when going up against God’s Chosen People.

    Liked by 5 people

  21. Mongoose says:

    This is innovation at it’s best. People working in their own self interests and keeping the wolves at bay. But then they “wait for approval from the EU?” What the hell is that about? Tell the weenies in Brussels to go take a hike.

    Liked by 3 people

  22. czarowniczy says:

    I do believe I mentioned a few years back when Turkey actively got into the fray that Turkey was slinking towards reestablishing the Ottoman empire and those eastern Syrian provinces were a target now that Assad had lost sway there.
    The Turks played nice for a while, even letting Kurd fighters transit Turkey for the Syrian front, the Turks probably saw their fighters getting wasted in a war of attrition with Turkey getting, reducing the numbers of ISIS and Kurds – a win/win.
    NATO can’t afford to lose Turkey, it’s far too valuable, but the Kurds are zip to NATO and the US strategic planners. Reports released today indicate Trump and Erdogan are all smoochy again, Erdogan saying the Turks will clean up ISIS, the US (and by extension the Kurds) aren’t needed any more. The Kurds have suffered before due to their relative unimportance relative to Turkey and I believe they will again. It’s how we do business.

    Liked by 2 people

    • rashomon says:

      It is my impression that MsB is sending his U.S.-trained military into the area to protect the Kurds, an arrangement PDJT apparently discussed with MsB prior to announcing the pull out of American troops and prior to our president’s discussion with Erdogen.

      Such an adroit PDJT move! A true reshuffling of the players. Especially since the PTB finallt admitted that Khoshoggi was always a Muslim Brotherhood operative and arms dealer, not the esteemed WaPo journalist as he was originally “sold” to be Erdogen has got to be going nutso!

      Merry Christmas, czar! This should be a very interesting 2019.

      Liked by 3 people

      • czarowniczy says:

        As much as I hate Kissinger I have come to accept his realpolitik outlook.
        The Kurds are vermin to the Turks, they will never agree to let them breathe the same air as long as they fight for an independent Kurdistan.
        I see the US taking an agreement that the Kurds won’t be attacked, have the Turks finish ISIS and then – after a pause where US attention is drawn elsewhere – Turkey will go back to playing Whack-a-Kurd.
        We did this with so many others in the recent past and we’ve done it with the Kurds in the past.
        it’s the dirty side of international politics.
        Y’all have a great Christmas too – I get to do this one with a brand new miracle grandson.

        Liked by 2 people

        • rashomon says:

          Congratulations on your new grandson. I hope we can leave him a better world …or, at least, America, than the mess PDJT is trying to unravel.

          Snuggle the lil tyke for me. All my kidlets tower over me now and I miss that newborn smell (which quickly turns to odors of snakes and snails and puppy dog tails)!

          Liked by 1 person

          • czarowniczy says:

            We’re doing this remotely, he’s about 1300 miles away. My son’s sending me pix and videos as he opens his presents.
            I was musing on Xmas when I was a kid and we had to dial ‘)’ on the chunky bakelite desk phone to talk with relatives.

            Like

    • WSB says:

      When President Trump gets ‘smoochy’ with any other entity, watch out.

      Liked by 2 people

  23. Bastiat says:

    I read this article the other day that is really interesting and helps put into perspective the different factions in the area. It may seem a bit off topic at first, but as you read you will see what I mean. The maps with the different factions are really, really interesting. Could be of some use to Sundance.

    https://waitbutwhy.com/2014/09/muhammad-isis-iraqs-full-story.html

    The thing that stands out to me is that Bush II unwittingly(?) created the first step in the Shia Power Axis with the 2nd Iraq War, and Syria seems to be phase 2. This would seem to be against Turkey’s interest, but it is hard telling with a power-hungry fool like Erdogan.

    The other thing that stands out is the size of Kurdish areas, and how they are often overlooked. They should be their own nation.

    Liked by 3 people

    • JohninMK says:

      There should indeed be a Kurdistan but we the British in cahoots with the French made sure that that would never happen.

      Using the tried and tested colonial technique of divide and rule, the borders of the countries of the region went mainly in straight lines and usually through the middle of tribal areas.

      Now, a hundred years later, we see just how successful that plan was in ensuring that no powerful new country arose in the region to challenge the existing powers. Much like Africa really.

      It might be unfair but those of us in the West have benefited mightily from the policy, although our 1% have done much better than the rest of us.

      Liked by 2 people

  24. Ghost says:

    Observations from a smaller limb.

    Brilliant Sundance just utterly Brilliant.

    I have been dancing around this for weeks but hadn’t gotten there yet, Thank you!

    My uninformed opinion is now the focal point shifts to Cypress. The Greeks would like nothing better than to remove Turkey from Cypress and NATO. The Greeks have been one of the few NATO countries meeting its contribution targets on military spending.

    A mid continent alliance seems to be forming on its own. Poland, Hungary and Greece as the base.

    Poland receiving point for LNG from the U.S. and Greeks as a receiving point of natural gas from Israel provides for interesting moves against the globalist controlling Europe. Trade negotiations with the E.U. Were put near the end of the line for a reason.

    Russia had two years to get with the coming program; but Putin and his cronies sat back and chose the wrong side. Instead of pivoting and working with PDJT moving towards the coming trade alliance with Japan, India as the base they like the Australians will be left at the alter.

    czarowniczy says:
    “NATO can’t afford to lose Turkey, it’s far too valuable, ”

    I respectfully disagree.

    If Turkey were still a democratically based country respecting the rights of its Christian Minority you may have a point, but those days are gone and so is the need for Turkey’s southern position in NATO. The ball is now in Erdogan’s court, but the counter if he misbehaves is easy to see.

    Liked by 6 people

    • yucki says:

      We’ve done LOST Turkey!

      Neo-Ottoman Turkey is lusting after Europe.
      Salivating over all those EURO-Turks, even second and third generation in Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands.

      He’s endowing mosques in the Balkans, beach-heads for the takeover. Makes my hair stand on end!

      Liked by 2 people

  25. Broseph McGee says:

    If Turks invade and murder Kurdistan I will look for another Nationalist president to vote for.

    Like

  26. Pyrthroes says:

    When regional economic interests –an Eastern Mediterranean gas-pipeline to Europe, obviating Putin’s dangerously political link through Merkel’s Germany– take precedence over Qatari-Turkish extremists fostered by SHD’s actively seditious Intelligence Community (IC), Trump’s geopolitical leverage via Egypt, Israel, and MBS’s Sunni Arab KSA will beat scimitar-waving cultists every time.

    Most interesting that Papadopoulos plays a substantive role here, explaining the “five eyes” IC frame-up conducted to exculpate Gangrenous through MzBill. Decades hence, historians of this unraveling era (once academia’s PCBS bites dust) will have their work cut out.

    Liked by 3 people

  27. Moultrie Flag says:

    And then we reflect on the MB influence present at the highest level of the last administration

    Liked by 2 people

  28. Sherri Young says:

    A withdrawal of our boots on the ground in Syria does not necessarily mean total abandonment of the Kurds. Let’s go back to what PapaD tweeted recently.

    IMO, it is past time to find an alternative to our base at Incirlik. We should not abandon Incirlik unless we have a base ready to go. Building new would involve too much of a delay. If we are in negotiations with the British for us to take their base on Cyprus, that could explain why Trump has not yet declassified the unredacted documents.

    Watching to see if the British turn over that base in the very, very near future.

    Pure speculation on my part.

    Liked by 4 people

  29. Sherri Young says:

    The Kurds live in an oil-producing region. KSA’s premier oil field is pretty much watered out. MbS is willing to take over protection of the Kurds. Also allows him to get his foot in the door to forward deploy to the west of Iran.

    Makes sense to me.

    Like

    • JohninMK says:

      The Syrian oil fields east of the Euphrates are very small compared to Saudi’s. The main fields in the region are in Northern Iraq which is neither giving land for a Kurdistan nor letting the Saudis anywhere near it.

      The KSA seems to be moving diplomatically, via the Sudanese President, towards Damascus. It clearly wants to neutralize the Iranian influence in Syria by peaceful means now that force has failed.

      Only the MIC and neo-cons are unhappy with this. The man in the street here and there just want to be able to get on with their lives peacefully.

      Liked by 2 people

  30. JohninMK says:

    Very large units of the Turkish Army are continuing to move into positions on their side of the border. Everyday brings news and film of more.

    This is very interesting, either they will strike south soon (running the risk of hitting the US before the US moves out?) or they will stay where they are. Whichever it is they are scaring the proverbial out of the SDF Kurds.

    Maybe the latter is the plan. Unlike the US the Russians seem to have told the Turks to stay out but they still need to force the Kurds into agreement with the Syrian Government. This happened this morning, Video at link

    Mare
    ???? #RiseUp4Afrin
    ‏ @nighttides

    Handover of several W #Manbij villages by MMC to Syrian border guard protection in the presence of Russian forces also included dancing

    If this is the plan and it works the Turks will get what they really want, no PKK Kurdish access to their southern border policed with Russian help, whilst the US is able to pull its troops in a safe manner. So far so good.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Sherri Young says:

      That tweet is from March 9, 2017. Is something similar happening today?

      Like

      • JohninMK says:

        Yes and thanks well spotted, sorry about that. Over the past couple of days the Syrians have indeed increased the numbers of their military up in the areas that they already held in the area. It seems to be some attempt at a blocking move.

        Liked by 1 person

  31. Linda K. says:

    Why did the Saudi’s take the chance of killing Kashoggi in Turkey which is pro muslim brotherhood? They must’ve wanted him gone pretty badly. Maybe Kashoggi was a crucial link to the Iranian, Quatar. Obama propaganda? Was he so important ? You’d think anyone at the Washington Post could write up what they are spoon fed.

    Liked by 1 person

  32. KDog says:

    Interesting analysis….

    Like

  33. Ghost says:

    Sherri Young says:
    “Watching to see if the British turn over that base in the very, very near future.

    Pure speculation on my part.”

    It maybe speculation but it is based on intelligent and clear thinking.

    The longer the British and Australians hold off from standing up and coming clean the higher economic costs will be to them. They are running out of time,, March is approaching.

    Merry Christmas to everyone !!

    Like

    • Sherri Young says:

      TY

      Like

    • JohninMK says:

      As far as I am aware the US uses RAF Akrotiri, which is incidentally UK Sovereign territory, as much as it needs already. There is also a major listening station at the top of Cyprus’s highest mountain, Mount Olympus. RAF strike aircraft and drones operate out of Akrotiri, targetting ISIS in Syria, most days. There is very close US/UK co-operation at both sites.

      There are already major US bases in Greece and Sicily plus Turkey along with Iraq, Bahrain and Qatar (the biggest) on the other side of the region. I fail to see any possibility that we would hand Akrotiri over to the US, the Cypriots would hate the idea, the last thing they want is a red hot US target on their island, its bad enough with us Brits being there.

      Not sure what you mean by “higher economic costs” or “running out of time,, March is approaching”. We have always pulled our weight supporting the US.

      Merry Christmas as well.

      Liked by 1 person

  34. Elwood says:

    Erdogan is smart enough to understand that if he throws in completely with the Brotherhood he will place his secular Turkey on a collision course with radical Islam. He is simply playing one side against the other since this was forced on him by the Obama admin. If he can make a buck out of it too then he isn’t beyond that either.

    Both al-Sisi and Netanyahu paid very public visits to candidate Trump before he was elected.

    Liked by 1 person

    • yucki says:

      Turkey is no longer secular. It’s becoming known as “Pakistan on the Med”.
      If not Iran.
      Turkey’s Revolution Looks like Iran’s – but in Slow Motion

      • The SAVAK’s infamous Evin prison, which once held as many as 5,000 of the Shah’s political enemies, soon held over 15,000 of Khomeini’s.

      • Erdogan once said that “Democracy is like a tram. You ride it until you arrive at your destination, then you step off.” It appears he has reached his destination.

      • As Prime Minister and then President of Turkey, Erdogan’s policies have become steadily more hostile to U.S. interests. He championed the Gaza flotilla, helped Iran transport weapons into Syria, and fought America’s Kurdish allies.

      • Imagine what the world would be like if the U.S. had stationed nuclear weapons in Iran prior to Khomeini’s takeover. Imagine what the world will be like if Erdogan seizes America’s nuclear weapons.

      https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/13107/turkey-iran-revolution

      Also, the Islamic takeover of the education system:

      The Islamization of Turkey
      https://besacenter.org/perspectives-papers/islamization-turkey/

      Like

  35. cali says:

    @Sundance: There are two flies in this ointment to be a successful strategy bringing peace to the middle east.
    The first one is Fetullah Gulen = the radical Islamic cleric residing in PA after fleeing Turkey trying to overthrow Erdogan. He too is a CIA tool. He has grandiose plans for Turkey to turn it into a theocracy like Iran with himself being the Iranian Ayatollah Khomeni.
    If that weren’t enough he runs a number of madrasa-type schools under the radar and without any oversight by government. Since American teachers are not of his liking he commits visa fraud on a massive scale by importing Turkish teachers teaching sharia law. It made him a billionaire. Who knows what else he does to be so wealthy.
    The Hussein/HRC/Brennan gang protected him while in office rather than face justice in Turkey.

    The 2nd one is the EU or rather the UK’s MI6, MI5 and SIS who together with Fetullah Gulen attempted the last coup against Erdogan. Naturally the US was implicated and accused of conspiring against Erdogan since he resides here and protected by the deep state. The UK of course stays mum and enable Erdogan to blame the US.

    Enter Michael Flynn: Flynn knows Fetullah Gulen and his agenda ergo he wants him to be deported to Turkey and stand trial. Flynn knows Gulen is bad news.
    I would not be surprised if there are activities taking place behind the scene and out of public view – namely president Trump being in agreement with Flynn to accomplish a much broader peace agenda there. He was not acting as agent for a foreign government or committed treason as judge Sullivan at first accused Flynn of such destructive charges.

    It looks to me that the EU/UK rather not have Turkey as NATO member ergo the coup against Erdogen in collusion with Fetullah Gulen.

    Lastly I’m pleased that president Trump decided to bring our troops home from Turkey. Remember Hussein and company issued orders to train the ISIS savages in Jordan which must have been humiliating to our soldiers. I know that a number of them resented Hussein’s orders to do so despite disguising these ISIS savages as Al Nusra aka moderate rebels. There was nothing moderate about them. Some of our soldiers expressed that they reluctantly taught them less than the basics.

    I’m sure that the deep state there before being bombed into smithereens by president Trump used our soldiers to wage a proxy war against Russia in Syria. “They thought she would never lose” was planned to frame Russia in Syria attacking this republic.

    This is the hang-up of the Mike Flynn classified struggle behind the scene because this patriot is innocent of all charges originating with the Old Guard (Mueller) and gang.

    Liked by 2 people

  36. Scott Zundel says:

    Very interesting and thoughtful comments.

    I knew the Muslim Brotherhood had something to do with this.
    For 45 years we worked to replace Russian influence in Egypt with our influence. Obama’s policy of destroying that work NEVER made sense to me unless he actually puts Iranian interests above US interests which I just can’t believe to be true.

    People need to go back and study the history of the Muslim Brotherhood to get a better picture of who they are.

    But be careful because the media/progressive fascists swarm to protect the Muslim Brotherhood.

    Liked by 2 people

  37. inspectorudy says:

    I don’t have any problem with bringing our troops home but to deal with Erdogan is tantamount to dealing with Hitler. I see that many of you are enthusiastic about this and believe there is a deeper plan by Trump than we see and I hope you are right but I think it is exactly what we see and nothing more. Saudi Arabia and Turkey are supposed to work together? They despise each other. I believe that Trump just wants to bring the troops home because of his promise and that’s all there is. God bless him for that! This could also be his pressure on the Saudis to help the US out after their debacle of the murder of Kashoggi.

    Like

  38. Confirmation of just how far Obama/Soetoro’s commitment to the Muslim Brotherhood extends. And how far his “transformation” of America was meant by him to extend. We — I — knew of that much, with Obama’s intimate dependence upon Valerie Jarrett and complicity with the CIA Brennan, and the constant kowtowing to Muslims (reordering NASA’s mission, for example, not to mention the political poisoning of the military and every agency, to the extreme treason of the ongoing attempted coup against President Trump).

    That commitment, I think, must go back, not just to his early years in Indonesia, as Barry Soetoro, but to probable financial help from Saudis and maybe others, c. 1980-83; I think that financial association is behind the closing up of the many records of his life so that we cannot see them, or the benefactors they reveal.

    Valerie Jarrett’s father-in-law wrote this newspaper article back in 1979:

    http://www.dailyinterlake.com/opinion/columns/frank/article_7924e4f0-0468-11e2-8da2-0019bb2963f4.html?mode=image&photo=0

    “Will Arabs Back Ties to Blacks With Cash?”

    All of that needs to be investigated and revealed, especially “Khalid Abdullah Kariq Al-Mansour, formerly known as Donald Warden, of the Holmes and Warden law firm”, and “a black San Francisco lawyer who has close ties to officials of the Organization of Petroleum-Exporting Countries (OPEC)”. He is quoted in the article as saying, (with respect to “rumored billions of dollars” expected from “oil-rich Arab nations” to “American black leaders and minority institutions”), “It is not just a rumor…” I recommend everyone read the whole, short article.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Jederman says:

      “I think that financial association is behind the closing up of the many records of his life so that we cannot see them, or the benefactors they reveal.”

      Indeed. His future CIA director helped bury his travel records during that period through a company Brennan owned that provided security for passport/travel information.

      BTW, your last para (and this isn’t the first time this has come up) is something I still haven’t figured out. The much ballyhooed Sunni-Shia death match seems to sometimes be on hold as the Jarrett/Shia forces and the Obama/Sunni forces were apparently simpatico in the WH. I wonder how that works.

      Like

      • yucki says:

        Yeah, that Sunni/Shia divide is balanced by “enemy of my enemy” tribal pragmatism.

        Iran sheltered al-Queda because they shared a passionate hatred of the USA. Sunni Hamas and Shia Hezbollah are united in hate against the Jews.

        Tangled web spun by the Devil.

        Like

  39. teeheeman says:

    My head is spinning after reading this story (twice). So complex, so many players/actors, and so important. If George P ends up being something of a White Hat in this drama that would be beyond amazing.

    Liked by 1 person

  40. JX says:

    “It’s almost as if…..”

    100%. His installation in the Presidency was a disaster for the world.

    Liked by 1 person

  41. ed furman says:

    Wow!! How awesome is that? It can now be said the deep state’s first mark of the campaign has contributed more to world peace and stability than all of his tormentors combined. Here’s to you George….a patriot and a great American.

    Like

  42. Femoncrats says:

    The “Arab Spring” was obammy’s and Hittlliary‘s plan to create an arab terrorist caliphate in Egypt, Libya, and Syria for the muslim brotherhood. The same terrorist obammy installed in his administration and the pentagon. Hittlliary’s goon Huma and her family are members of the muslim brotherhood. obammy’s and hittlliary’s goal was the irradiation of Israel.

    Like

  43. Demoncrats says:

    The “Arab Spring” was obammy’s and Hittlliary‘s plan to create an arab terrorist caliphate in Egypt, Libya, and Syria for the muslim brotherhood. The same terrorist obammy installed in his administration and the pentagon. Hittlliary’s goon Huma and her family are members of the muslim brotherhood. obammy’s and hittlliary’s goal was the irradiation of Israel.

    Like

  44. jmuniz1 says:

    President Trump is trying to prevent a resurgence of the Ottoman Empire Read this from the History Channel:
    Armenian Genocide
    https://www.history.com/topics/world-war-i/armenian-genocide

    Like

  45. Scott says:

    Just catching up after the holidays, I have a question for anyone still following this thread. Where does American Pastor Andrew Brunson fit into all of this (taken hostage just before the 2016 US election)?

    Like

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