I wrote about this in 2014/2015, followed the dynamic and refreshed it again in 2017. However, with increased sunlight on the agenda of Fox News, perhaps a review of this history is needed again. Back when the 2014 “Comprehensive Immigration Reform” agenda was swirling in the senate; you might remember the “gang of eight” immigration bill; specific media entities inside and outside FOX media were involved in private discussions to promote the agenda. {GO DEEP}
Two of those outside FOX voices were Laura Ingraham and Tucker Carlson; so it was not a surprise to see FOX News Rupert Murdoch hire them later as prime-time hosts. This is all about following the money and the FOX agenda; ie. inside baseball stuff:
During the 2015 Fox Business News GOP Primary debate several political junkies noted a rather curious and brutally obvious omission: Senator Marco Rubio was never questioned about the 2013 Senate Gang-of-Eight bill and his stance on Comprehensive Immigration Reform. In fact, if you were to review the 2015 debate substance you’d note candidate Rubio wasn’t directly questioned about his immigration positions at all.
It is not disconnected that during the 2013/2014 Gang-of-Eight immigration constructs we later discovered Fox News was an active participant in the promotion of the immigration reform proposals.
In order to facilitate the congressional immigration intent Fox launched a previously unknown pro-amnesty propaganda blitz to support senate immigration bill.
What follows below is an evidenced expose’ of their agenda.
Candidate Jeb Bush attends Chamber of Commerce dinner with Fox’s Rupert Murdoch and Valerie Jarrett (December 2014)
♦ It was in 2014 when writer Mickey Kaus was chastised by Tucker Carlson, then a Fox contributor and now prime-time show host, for writing an article in the Daily Caller outlining the relationship between Rupert Murdoch, his company Fox News, the talking heads under his control and authority, and Murdoch’s request for pro-amnesty propaganda to be broadcast on the network.
Tucker Carlson took down the article from the Daily Caller, and subsequently Mickey Kaus quit in disgust over the agenda-driven editorial decision. Apparently some things are just too sensitive for sunlight and exposure.
However, what Mickey Kaus outlined was a pattern within Fox to push immigration reform and included a first person excerpt between David Axelrod and Rupert Murdoch:
On page 424 of his recent memoir, Obama’s former top strategist David Axelrod describes running into Fox chieftain (and immigration amnesty supporter) Rupert Murdoch at a dinner in the fall of 2010:
During the dinner, Murdoch, who was seated beside me, insisted that the president had to move on immigration reform. ….
“But the solution has to be comprehensive,” I said. “We can’t just attack a piece of the immigration problem. And you know, there’s one big thing that you can do to help, and that is to keep your cable network from stoking the nativism that keeps us from solving this.” [Emphasis added] (link)
Kaus goes on to outline how Fox News followed the plan and conspicuously avoided any mention of the crafting: “in the spring of 2013 when the “Gang of 8” amnesty bill snuck through the Senate“. Mickey uses a historical timeline, day-by-day story leads, showing how Fox was intentionally NOT COVERING the story (see here).
♦ However, even before Kaus discovered -and outlined- proof of what his research into Fox revealed there was a prior article written by Ryan Lizza in The New Yorker Magazine [June 2013] which was even more revealing:
New Yorker 2013 – […] Fox News has notably changed its tone since the election. A Democratic policy staffer who worked on the issue in 2007 and has helped write the current bill said, “NumbersUSA and FAIR”—two groups that want to dramatically limit immigration—“managed to convince Fox News back then to be their twenty-four-hour news channel of the anti-immigrant point of view. Fox has now totally bought in to the idea that we just need to figure something out.”
Rush Limbaugh, who fiercely opposes the bill, has come to sound resigned. “I don’t know if there’s any stopping this,” he said on January 28th, the day the Gang held the press conference announcing its framework for the legislation. “It’s up to me and Fox News, and I don’t think Fox News is that invested in this.”
McCain told me, “Rupert Murdoch is a strong supporter of immigration reform, and Roger Ailes is, too.” Murdoch is the chairman and C.E.O. of News Corp., which owns Fox, and Ailes is Fox News’s president.
McCain said that he, Graham, Rubio, and others also have talked privately to top hosts at Fox, including Bill O’Reilly, Sean Hannity, and Neil Cavuto, who are now relatively sympathetic to the Gang’s proposed bill. Hannity voiced support for a pathway to citizenship for undocumented immigrants, which he previously dismissed as “amnesty,” on the day after the 2012 election. “God bless Fox,” Graham said. “Last time, it was ‘amnesty’ every fifteen seconds.”
He said that the change was important for his reelection, because “eighty per cent of people in my primary get their news from Fox.” He added that the network has “allowed critics to come forward, but it’s been so much better.” (link)
So there’s a trio of GOPe Republicans in the so-called Gang of Eight huddled with leading figures at Fox News Channel. A few days later Bill O’Reilly interviews Marco Rubio and urges the Senator to come to him if anyone opposes the proposal.
♦ As you watch this segment in retrospect, with the information you now possess, consider that both Bill O’Reilly and Marco Rubio have pre-discussed the entire topic and worked out exactly what the framework of questions and answers would be:
.
Rupert Murdoch, Wall Street, The U.S. Chamber of Commerce and the entire GOPe apparatus -including House Speaker Paul Ryan- are 100% behind comprehensive immigration reform to include amnesty.
Back to Fox News and their debate agenda – The executive in charge of Fox News debate programming, debate questioning and debate structure is Vice President Bill Sammon. (circled below)
The Washington Post has an outline describing how Bill Sammon runs the entire show at Fox regarding debates; and how he is the person who Chris Stirewalt, Megyn Kelly, Chris Wallace and Brett Baier directly reported to for all debate issues, construction, and question organization.
In essence, Bill Sammon runs the show.
Bill Sammon’s daughter is Brooke Sammon who was the national press secretary for Marco Rubio’s presidential campaign.
Now, lets contrast this information against the backdrop of Rupert Murdoch’s response to the republican debate.
There is a particular clarity that resonates, no?
Mr. Rupert Murdoch, who is also leading the executive decision-making on Fox programming, also contracts pollster Frank Luntz to appear on Fox News broadcasting during the 2015 and 2016 election cycle.
[…] since June, Murdoch has been attending Ailes’s daily executive meeting held on the second floor of Fox headquarters. The secretive afternoon gathering in Ailes’s conference room is attended by about a half-dozen of the network’s most senior lieutenants. It’s where some of the most sensitive decisions about running the channel are discussed. (link)
Frank Luntz had sub-contracts with Marco Rubio and a long-term relationship with Rubio going back to the Freshman Senator’s time in the Florida Legislature. Rubio alone has paid Luntz $350,000+ It’s not accidental that Frank Luntz focus groups regularly found Marco Rubio as the winner of debate and opinion programming.
In an extensive 2016 article within New York Magazine, mostly outlining the rather sordid details of Roger Ailes, readers may also noted confirmation from August of (2015). Fox News owner Rupert Murdoch instructed Fox News executives to take down candidate Donald Trump.
Excerpt:
(NY MAG) […] Murdoch was not a fan of Trump’s and especially did not like his stance on immigration. (The antipathy was mutual: “Murdoch’s been very bad to me,” Trump told me in March.) A few days before the first GOP debate on Fox in August 2015, Murdoch called Ailes at home. “This has gone on long enough,” Murdoch said, according to a person briefed on the conversation.
Murdoch told Ailes he wanted Fox’s debate moderators — Kelly, Bret Baier, and Chris Wallace — to hammer Trump on a variety of issues. Ailes, understanding the GOP electorate better than most at that point, likely thought it was a bad idea. “Donald Trump is going to be the Republican nominee,” Ailes told a colleague around this time. But he didn’t fight Murdoch on the debate directive.
On the night of August 6, in front of 24 million people, the Fox moderators peppered Trump with harder-hitting questions. But it was Kelly’s question regarding Trump’s history of crude comments about women that created a media sensation. He seemed personally wounded by her suggestion that this spoke to a temperament that might not be suited for the presidency. “I’ve been very nice to you, though I could probably maybe not be based on the way you have treated me,” he said pointedly. (read more)
A July 2017 article written by Roger Ailes confidant Michael Wolff affirms one of the more transparently obvious hidden secrets in the 2015/2016 presidential race and election.
Fox News owner/mogul Rupert Murdoch was intensely against the candidacy of Donald Trump. So much so that Murdoch instructed former President of Fox News, Roger Ailes, to shape favorable coverage toward anyone other than Donald Trump, including a request to tilt toward support for Hillary Clinton.
New York – […] It was Ailes’ tacit support of Trump that, in part, made his removal from Fox all the more urgent for the Murdochs. And it was not just the liberal sons who were agitated by Ailes’ regard for Trump, but also the father, whose tabloid, the New York Post, helped create Trump, but who found him now, with great snobbery, not of “our” conservative class. (“When is Donald Trump going to stop embarrassing his friends, let alone the whole country?” Murdoch senior tweeted the day after Trump officially declared himself a candidate.)
Murdoch instructed Ailes to tilt to anyone but Trump, Ailes confided to me before he was fired, even Hillary. (Ailes, for his part, characterized Murdoch’s periodic efforts at interference as similar to Nixon’s instructions to bomb this or that country — best ignored.)
After the election, a confounded Murdoch had to call on his ex-wife Wendi’s friends, Ivanka Trump and Jared Kushner, to broker a rapprochement with the disreputable Donald. Now, to Trump’s great satisfaction, a humbled Murdoch is a constant caller. (read more)
All intellectually honest media and political observers already knew this was the basic premise for Fox News in the 2015/2016 presidential race. Murdoch supported Jeb Bush and Marco Rubio as the frontrunners because each of them advanced policies that were beneficial to the interests of Rupert Murdoch.
The August 2015 ambush by Murdoch’s princess Megyn Kelly was merely a highly visible example of Murdoch’s aversion to the ‘America-First’ agenda of Donald Trump. Ms. Kelly was later paid $10 million by Harper Collins, another Murdoch company, as compensation for services rendered, ie. advance payment on her book deal.
However, what most people don’t recognize is the motives behind these activities. There were/are billions of dollars at stake from the policies and outcomes of the election.
Maintaining control of multinational corporate trade policy and influence; along with retention of multinational “Wall Street” banking policy; in conjunction with open border mass immigration policy is still the primary objective of the Big Club.
Research on Dreamers Contradicts Public Image @JessicaV_CIS @wwwCISorg #EndDACA https://t.co/WIsEY9Nk6b
— NumbersUSA (@NumbersUSA) September 1, 2017
As I just recently wrote, Tucker Carlson is a man who gets rich (very rich) by looking good and reading other people’s teleprompter texts. He has no skin in the game and there is no reason to worship people who risk nothing.
To cap it all off, he invited a dumb communist state-employed Dutch professor on his show, got a certain part of his body kicked by this cretin and then refused to air it. His show always works the same way: Either someone is invited to be mocked, or to agree 100% with him.
Carlson’s target tonight was Attorney Sidney Powell. Atty Powell refused to provide evidence Carlson had demanded, and then told Carlson to stop calling.
Good – Sydney doesn’t have time for FakeFauxFurballs anyway
Yes, I heard that too. I was not happy. I went to her Twitter feed and found this. https://twitter.com/JZmirak/status/1329528803123744771?s=20
Also, Bo Snerdley also brought it up on his Twitter feed. Keep tanking, Fox News. I loved you for years and years, but no more. Special Report and Tucker were my last holdouts.
Tucker can try to get a seat in court and listen to the evidence there………the media is not the arbiter of all things…..actually they aren’t the arbiter of anything. Tucker spoke at our church last year………seems like a decent guy……….but they might have a cow prod on him and he’s already experienced doxxing……..so who knows why he thought he could prod her into giving out evidence that belongs in the courtroom……
Tucker sounded so peevish and pettish I’d like to think he starts
blinkiing out “T-O-R-T-U-R-E” like the Vietnam POWs, at some point.
Makes perfect sense. Every mega corporation with control by a small cabal is signing into the Reset. Murdoch kids no doubt want to be part of the elite nutcases that feel they are entitled to be our overlords.
If one listens closely to Tucker, he walks a very fine line most of the time
I’ve noticed that as well. He always seems to offer some equivocation of the points he makes, seemingly to sound fair and balanced. But it always bothered me and provoked my spider sense.
Tucker is a collectivist. It’s the collectivists that American individualists must fight, always and forever.
Yeah, Tucker is scripted, it isn’t Tucker talking. Tucker is CNN through and through.
To be honest, I think you will see Hannity walk in the New Year along with Hegseth and Earhardt
“there is no reason to worship people” at all. I worship God and God alone.
There is entirely too much celebrity worship in this country, including religious celebrities. We put people on pedestals. Appreciation is one thing, but fawning is another.
Yes. In the world, really.
And nowadays everyone is his/her own celebrity with the self adoration and self promotion on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter…
People drift away from God. Worshiping the creation rather than the Creator.
Delete Facebook. Delete Twitter. Unplug cable.
Never joined the first two. Very close to canceling cable.
Do it, your life will improve dramatically.
https://ustvgo.tv/
Free TV. I log in on my laptop but I’m getting a device from Google for about $20 so I can project my laptop to my TV. I’ll save all that money every month that I was paying to the likes of FOX.
Thank you. There are other options, and I’ve been contemplating too long and talking too much. Time for action.
I gotta get over the ‘old dog, new tricks’ mindset.
Once you make the leap, you will be SO GLAD that you did!
I was addicted to FOX, but it was WAY easier than I thought it would be to quit them cold turkey. I will NEVER watch their network again.
I quit fox completely on election night and never looked back. I had been down to Tucker and Lou, but no more.
No fox. O exceptions!
It’s some other (non news) channels and shows that I might miss.
No exceptions, not O
This is an excellent choice. I have all our computers bookmarked here and have for months.
Yeah I use that site from the UK…
It’s owned by Google. No thank you.
$20 one time to google or 1k/yr to MSM – your choice.
What’s the device? I have thought of doing that for YEARS, and I think now is the time as I hardly watch any television anymore. The size of our cable bill is grotesque.
Ours is grotesque, too.
https://www.tomsguide.com/us/what-is-google-chromecast,news-17637.html
Mine should be here tomorrow. My daughter uses this at her house and hasn’t had cable for a year. Will save me about 1k/year. That’s 1k that CNNFOXMSNBC etc won’t get. I’ll overlook that it’s from Google – it’s worth it.
Thanks..I appreciate that! Brilliant, and cheers!
“A device from Google”?? GOOGLE??
It’s easy if you’ve got good internet that doesn’t break the budget.
OAN is $4.99 month through Roku
also through Roku FREE: OAN Encore episodes several days old…
The First which has Buck Sexton’s Hold the Line and Bill O ‘Reilly’s show Mon-Thurs.
There’s another, can’t remember the right title..something like America’sVoice or Real America voice…
Newsmax also but can’t figure out if the CEO is truly a conservative. Donated to the Clintons.
Saw that Gateway Pundit had a Sydney Powell video linked up on both Bongino’s Rumble and Google’s YT. Finally, conservative alternatives!! Don’t want to feed the beastly enemy!
Waiting to see if CTH is going to Bongino’s Parler platform.
I’ve been watching Newsmax, OAN, and others live via the free Pluto tv app. It’s on the IPhone and pad, not the tv monitor. I’m not only getting used to watching on smaller screens, but I’m actually starting to really like it for the portability.
Waiting to see if CTH is going to Bongino’s Parler platform.
Uh, doubt that, serious mismatch for moving the whole site – Parler is like Twitter, short word-limited “parleys” are like “tweets” as far as I know. Treepers need room for more words!
Unless you meant, will sundance as The Last Refuge parley there, the way he currently tweets on Twitter?
I sort of wish his words would appear everywhere so that more people could see them, but it may not be in the cards…
“Waiting to see if CTH is going to Bongino’s Parler platform.”
If you can find Sundance’s recent Twitter disagreement (last week) with Bongino about using Parler as a host you will find your answer.
And the cash can go to something else, cable is expensive.
I don’t know why people need to be told this over and over.
I preach till I’m blue in the face to friends and family.
Slowly getting through to them.
I was a faithful watcher of Tucker, Hanaty and Lora… no more. they are dead to me. NewsMax now
I wholly agree and have tried to encourage other “patriots” to do likewise but it seems far too many are addicted to many of the enticements of our (now painfully apparently, mortal) enemies whether on (anti)social media, sports (yes, pro AND college) and various sources of “TV news” and other “TV entertainment.” It is quite telling to me how many “patriots” apparently are unwilling to “suffer” any inconvenience in their otherwise comfortable lifestyles to strike a blow against our enemies by merely “turning them off.”
People feel like they are totally in the dark and are grasping at any news. Or they are inserting negativity on purpose.
There is certainly an effort by our enemies (now including an increasing number of repub and/or “conservative”officials and pundits) to divide and demoralize.
At the same time, however, we need to try to avoid creating an echo chamber like our enemies have done for years such that honestly held and rational (evidence-based) views can be disseminated and sifted. Sometimes even those on “our side” make mistakes or perhaps fail to see a pitfall ahead etc.
We do ourselves no favors if we merely try to “whistle past the graveyard” rather than having a robust exchange of ideas and views, as long as they are well-intended and within the context of ultimate loyalty and allegiance to the Constitution (borrowing from the oath I took many times as a Marine).
Gain some color PaleRider.
Yep!
I learned to use the library again. I lived at the library as a kid. My little library has tons of DVD’s so I don’t have to deal w/a spinning wheel while streaming, and they have pretty much any book I want.
You (and I) are in a shrinking minority.
jumpinjarhead, I believe they are called pino. Not the type of people you want in your foxhole. We’ll get along without them just fine.
Cannot unplug cable until after Trump’s second inauguration.
I use Facebook and Twitter for sharing information. It works for me and my friends, supporters of our President.
We have gone to Newsmax mostly and yea that thing with Tucker tonight didn’t sit well. She doesn’t owe Fox a thing. Parler is also on my phone and USA.LIFE is an alternate for FB.
Pulled the cable out in 2004. MUCH better now.
I think I’ve been without it for about 2 years now, haven’t missed it for a moment. I pay extra for the internet access itself, but it’s still far less than I paid for all those cable boxes, and what a joy not to give any $$ to CNN!
mike–2004 (August, during the revolting Dem Convention in Boston for Swiftboat Kerry–and that turd, Neil Cavuto’s broadcast of it) was the year is turned things off, as well. I don’t like and don’t let anyone use my mind–and it was clear to me that Fox News was part of the same PsyOps as every other television media outlet was (is still?). I am MUCH more informed, sane and calm doing so; reading the news from a dozen or so reliable news-reporting outlets and blogs like this was a superb decision. MUCH better now.
Trying to convince most other people is like trying to tell a pothead to put down the doobie…most can’t or won’t do it. The few that listen are much happier. Cheers!
Unfortunately, mike, some of us still have to use the “cable” TV providers (Infinity in my case) in order to have internet access which comes with a $90 monthly price tag. Use to be $103/mo. but my son negotiated them down (told them we’d go to one of their competitors). I believe it also gives me access to some TV shows (not sure, I don’t watch TV, but my son does).
Seems like a million years ago McCain’s lackluster ’08 presidential campaign was reinvigorated by a fighting governor from Alaska. Alas, it was a BIG club, and SHE wasn’t in it.
God bless you Sundance.
McCain was IN THE LEAD after Palin’s rousing speech. He then went on to fold like a sheet in the next debate…deliberately looking like Elmer Fudd.
2008 came down the way it did because the GOP folded too. Now Trump has pumped New Blood into the Party….and these ‘new guys’ are not painty-waisted. The poor old RINOs are about to get a lesson in HOW TO FIGHT….something they lost 20 years ago. Romney is that poster-child for the old, tired-blood RINOs.
McCain led until the night that Lehman Brothers disintegrated and touched off the financial meltdown, which caused Songbird to suspend (i.e.: THROW) his campaign.
Indeed.Also the GOP never attacked BO, like they Did Kerry in ’04. No swiftboaters for Barry. The fix was in
Doll, how can you ‘Swiftboat’ someone who had his entire “life” professionally scrubbed? There’s no evidence he ever did anything but rabble-rouse and drugs!
O’s 20 year association with Dr. ” I hate America! ” Wight and his “church ” in Chicago was not scrubbed. There were tapes of Wight’s hate spewing ” surmons ” , shown for a day or two….then dropped . And O’s long association with some of the worst Chicago’s slum lords was not scrubbed , either record used by the GOP as they would be if they were interesting in winning.They and the press wanted O to win. Imo
Like
Stopped with all but Tucker after election night. Tonight CANCELLED Tucker.
Same here…the transition is complete. With Fox off the list, I have my life back lol
Yup.
Something else I noticed about Tucker. Every show insists that if we aren’t already terrorized to near suicide about everything else, he has one more thing that, ” if you’re not concerned about this, you should be”. Good grief. ENOUGH already. ?
YEP.. me too. And have noticed his deliberately ‘vanilla’ topics since his ‘faux’ swing a Cavuto.. (staged) just after the election? I could barely watch it yesterday. It was like watching a really poor grade rerun of ‘Womens Weekly” gossip. How sad to see whats behind everything. They created the ‘rebellious Tucker’, so well, the ‘controlled opposition’ indeed! Stunning.
Um, I’ve been a Tucker fan for the last two years.
I was a bit troubled by the flip-flop when it was all “Covid! Covid! Covid! – trust the science! – you aren’t doing enough!”
The whole focus changed markedly to suddenly challenging the “science”, where Fox stands to this day.
Last night’s episode – I have now lost faith, where Carlson attacks Sidney Powell for not providing EVIDENCE. To HIM. BECAUSE he is Tucker Carlson!
I’m sure that a modicum of faith in Ms Powell is warranted – file the claims, and those Statements of Claim must necessarily identify the evidence upon which they are based.
Even at that point, there is NO NEED to disclose all of the evidence to the Court. This is normally done through the pleadings, interrogatories, disclosure and so on.
I’m losing my religion…
No matter anything else, reading about the Gang of Eight Cabal always reminds me: THANK GOD FOR SENATOR JEFF SESSIONS!!!!!
I’m glad Tucker blew it so bad tonite. Watching the Fox News ratings this past couple weeks, he seemed to be about the only thing keeping them afloat- at all!
Went to YT to see if there was a clip of what he said and yeah, it was bad. Basically: ” We give credence to UFO’s, but this election interference that Sidney’s claiming is a bridge too far”….
hahahaha!!! Bye Fox!!!
https://twitter.com/M2Madness/status/1329609041367150594?s=20
It is just like Sidney saying we got the servers, we just don’t know if it was the good guys or the bad guys. `She sure as hell knows who has the servers. And she knows it is the good guys who have it. She was told to say that, hoping the people who did this will get cocky and then slip up. I am convinced that Trump has all the info.
I hope you are right. Whenever I have a spell where I lose confidence, I remind myself about all the times over the past four years that Trump has outsmarted the Dims.
All of the posters who thought Fox was their friend need this, Sundance. Thanks for sharing again. So many people have not focused on the intentions and factual backgrounds of their information sources.
Sundance, Rudy and Sydney have had a very productive day as Patriots. I cannot think of a more rewarding and productive feeling!! Well done!! Get some rest – recharge and reload. Dawn will be here before you know it!!
And further, the Faux faceplant into the election night iceberg gave them a big gash below the waterline. The fact that Dana and Tucker are working so hard pumping more water into the good ship lollifaux means that they have no idea what is happening in the belly of the beast.
Everyone at Fox seems to have misjudged Patriots’ willingness to be mocked and taken advantage of. They’ve hired a Crisis Management consultant, but they’re not going to get us back. That’s the thing about betrayal: people never forget and they never forgive.
Turning the other cheek and taking the high road isn’t always what it is cracked up to be.
I guess they thought they could lead us on like cattle or that libs would replace us? ?
And along the same lines, it’s advisable to do some research on Newsmax before joining the chorus of those who are proclaiming it the place to go when leaving Fox.
I have never been sold on Newsmax, and they’ve been around for a pretty long time. The way they market their network in advertisements is insulting, and clearly aimed at the lowest common denominator conservative demographic. I prefer OANN.
You mean like the Trump Teddy Bear?
I can’t stand OAN and don’t even tune in to them anymore. Almost all their daytime young anchors from San Francisco are admitted liberals. Alex Salvi is an admitted liberal. I figured he was.
Forgot to say, I can barely stomach Newsmax. I like Greg Kelly best. Salted o seems pretty good, too. I like Stinchfield.
Yes my worry too. Newsmax coud be the final finish to the media’s psyops campaign. Hoping it’s jusl a bad dream
Thanks for reposting!
Moloch Murdoch’s felonious FOX echo chamber full of attack parrots like Bully O’Really, Hannutty, MeAgain Kelly and clueless Ingram > FOX is an avoidable mental affliction
Pretty fast if he tied them to ratings. If he didn’t then it was at a YUGE discount to begin with.
How fast can Mike Lindell get out of his Fox ad contracts?
I agree with your sentiment, but the man wants to sell a lot of his products.
If you’re going to suggest he drop Fox, then research and suggest where else he can get the same or a better deal (cost per minute) to reach equal or greater numbers of viewers and that doesn’t involve MSM. I don’t think OANN or Newsmax can yet offer the same viewership numbers as FNC (although that may be changing).
He is selling on youtube’s “Steve Bannon’s War Room”. Lots of his commercials there…
Great! I can’t recall seeing him on OANN yet.
I actually like the ads and him! But then I like watching infomercials?
I see My Pillow commercials on Newmax.
?
On RSBN too.
fauxnews may be selling MikePillows in half-hour infomercials to increase their ratings.
Time to get some zzzzzzz’s.
Fox is probably having to reduce their ad rates due to the ratings collapse. I am sure the contracts are based on viewership. Mike Lindell is probably getting a yuge refund.
My goodness lol…
2014 – This is when I first came upon TCTH (Jessica Chambers rest in peace) but didn’t quite have the interest in what TCTH had to say “politically”.
The Donald Trump campaign and election is when I had my baptismal, but didn’t really know any of the players.
5/6 years later, Fully aware today – thank you Sundance.
Same story here.
Ditto for me, elena. I lurked for two years here before I commented. I came to CTH in November, 2014 as the result of a comment (and possible link) posted by an individual over at The Daily Caller (DC).
I had reached the point that people then commenting at DC were not the individuals I had encountered at the onset of my time there when it had more of a conservative leaning. In January, 2016, I created my WP acct. so I could “Like” comments and post responses and didn’t return to the DC. No regrets whatsoever.
I don’t know what is going on, but most of the time I can only read here: it doesn’t takes my likes, unless I post comment. I cannot “like” this blog at all.
Jessica Chambers. I read many of those articles, then stopped coming to TCTH. Just busy with other things.
When POTUS was elected and I first started hearing about Russian Collusion again, I tried to find the site where I had read so much information before that was never reported anywhere else.
I found TCTH again, and have been here daily since.
No wonder Roger Ailes had to be taken out; Gretchen Carlson given the assignment and now laughing all the way to the bank.
And of course Hollywood made no less than two movies pointing out how awful Ailes was, all the time while ignoring the rape allegations against Mat Lauer and co.
If the left didn’t have double standards, they would have no standards at all.
I remember Rush telling the story of Rubio and Schumer summoning him to NYC for dinner. They tried to get him to push amnesty. Rush said he would do it, ONLY IF they put in the provision that the illegals after becoming citizen had to wait 25 years before they could vote.
Rush used to speak highly of Rubio, but Rubio’s name has not been on Rush’s tongue in quite sometime. If I could get through to the show, I would ask Rush about his current opinion of Rubio.
Rubio is re-surfacing, and quite frankly he creeps me out. He is a fool if he thinks he can win in 2024. My State Senator just did a Zoom meeting w/him that cost some big bucks to sit in on the call. Ya know, pay to play. It made me want to puke, and my friends were going WTF?
Republicans think they have Trump’s votes without Trump – they are in for a ride awakening going forward.
Amen to that.
Clearly the Miami pool boy wants to be on Sundance’s “Hollywood R Squares” for 2024, again.
I think Rush once said Rubio was a deep-throated conservative.
Yes.
Rubio will never recover from the thumping Chris Christie gave him in the debate. Best we can hope is that he holds an R seat, but no hope of leadership ever coming from him that benefits us. Empty suit would be a kind way to define him. Traitor in waiting would be more apt.
Traitor in waiting? There is a reason why he is chair of the Senate Committee on Intel.
Yes!!!
I heard that show and heard Rush repeat the anecdote several times thereafter. Rush said frequently that no one would take him up on the suggestion, but he wasn’t all that surprised. I thought it was a brilliant offer and it revealed the true aim of the immigration “reform”.
Weeks prior to that day he told the story, Rush had kinda stumbled and let the beans out of the bag, but never clarified. I remember him saying “if you only knew”. Then he told the story, and I was like ‘aaah’ that is what he was talking about. I remember him clearly saying when the powers that be summon you, you go. It confirmed the ties and manipulation of the media and politicians, which up until that time I never considered Rush to be one of those types. It was a brilliant response to their pressure. Then Rush mentioned numerous times the number of media that had been to his home for dinner, including Meghan Kelly, which in their world I am sure is quite normal. It still made me want to barf and at the same time want to be a fly on the wall.
And, shit like this is why I’ll never again patronize FOX News or their past or present media whores.
They are prostitutes that get paid handsomely. I wish some of “Q researchers” would start doing some “digs” into the media. The people that watch FOX are the whores.
I’m not really mad at Tucker, but I was wondering whole time was why would Sidney Powell present evidence to Tucker on Fox news of all places ?
And Tucker darn well knows why so it only amplifies the disingenuousness of his statements tonight.
He is starting to realize he won’t be able to book the people he once could, as they don’t trust FOX, and his viewership will suffer the same fate as a result.
Tucker (as his show was) cannot survive if the rest of Fox collapses.
https://mobile.twitter.com/shahin120089/status/1329549766699720704
whoops –
Having a bit of a problem. Trying again –
I’m not really mad at Tucker, but I was wondering whole time was why would Sidney Powell present evidence to Tucker on Fox news of all places ?
Yep. Rudy is sweating just like he did on September 11, 2001… Confronting US Government as he did that day, running to the epicenter, Sweating. For us. Putting the sweat in Blood, Sweat and Tears… Coup d’etat from within… beginning with the Usurper 2007…
He knows just as President Trump knows.
Brennan and his jester Clapper knows, too…
Roger Ailes made Fox successful by giving people what they wanted. Murdoch inc. wants to tell people what they should want….nah?
How about Maria Bartiromo?
I quit Fox a while back, but still follower her on Parler. She seems solid, but who really knows these days.
Same with Lou Dobbs; but Trump has forced the cracks, so if they are charlatans, we’ll soon know.
I have never seen Lou Dobbs as anything but 100% MAGA solid.
I can rarely find it on streaming, either – last night’s was not up – any time there is a clip of him it’s like a drink of fresh water!
I always wonder why Fox Biz gets away with so much more freedom than Faux itself.
Well, Dobbs owns his own show, so that’s why HE can get away with so much more freedom.
But don’t forget, the slimy, hysterical Cavuto also spends half his day on Fox Business.
You can livestream Fox Bus and a bunch of others here:
https://watchnewslive.tv/watch-fox-business-network-fbn-free-24-7/
..so I can still see Dobbs occasionally 😉
Same here, I’d hate to learn differently.
No news media allowed in my house.
Trust Sundance, I can take it to the bank when Sundance says something.
Raised on Reagan: They are all TV personalities. They are there to generate ratings and ad revenue. They are actors and their product is entertainment.
Whenever I discuss this topic I issue all kinds of disclaimers and review my 15 years of church outreach to my Hispanic immigrant community. In short, I used to be a certain type of sympathetic. I think of the Good Samaritan and still struggle a little with of ultimately God wants us to live as separate nations.
Having said that, our God is the God of unity. Amnesty as is being promoted is antithetical to unity. It relies on tribalism and multiculturalism where every culture needs to be respected except the culture of The United States of America.
I work at a community college in SoCal. They rely on immigrants not assimilating for maximum funding benefit. I see this first hand and this is but one small aspect. It’s big business. Every bureaucracy wants their piece of the funding from health services to. Calfresh. IHSS, WORKFORCE development.
Immigrants are not encouraged to embrace e pluribus unum. Quite the opposite. I experience daily the danger of hyphens. They are divisive…and extremely lucrative.
I am an immigrant. And it was my dream when I arrived in 1978 to assimilate and become an American. I even didn’t thought my kids my native language…
Welcome.
Even the Kingdom of Heaven has borders. Israel, the home of God’s chosen people, has borders. The scriptures talk about borders. There is a reason.
I thoroughly believe that God’s children, as God’s proxies, are meant to take dominion here on earth (Genesis 1); for as it states in Psalms, “the earth is the Lord’s and the fullness thereof.” Lordship implies that we bow our knee to Him; and in so doing, we yield lordship of our piece of earth to Him and He becomes its ruler. Those who yield to God’s enemy violate that dominion and THEY certainly are trying to take dominion continually. The fraudulent takeover of this election is a perfect example of how they work and connive to do it.
Without borders, there is no kingdom.
Really old saying concerning hunting technique:
“You can’t argue with a dead fox.”
Big Pharma, Big Media, Big Tech, Big Banking, Big Government: Five fingers on the left hand of the Beast of Daniel and Revelation.
The faux News outlets has always been a progressive (lazy communist) propaganda mockingbird tool that just removed the curtain, the bow tie wearing smug pompous A-hole better remember they came for him once and they will do it again.
I just mentioned on another site (CitizenFreePress) that I stopped watching Faux News in Aug – 2015 when Kelley/Baer tried to blindside Trump at the first GOP Primary Debate… It was clear back then what they stood for…and now they’ve even gotten worse!!! – – I don’t miss Faux. – – Thanks to Sundance, we have CTH!!!
That’s the same night I pulled the plug, I should thank Megan Kelly for asking her Rosie question, all it took for me.
Same with me after that ambush. But then I came back in December 2016 when they gave Tucker a show. I never liked O’Reilley and Hannity always wore thin with me. I liked Fox Business with Stuart Varney, Charles Payne, Liz MacDonald, and Lou Dobbs. Always hated Cavuto and Charlie Gasbagarino. But finally turned all of them off more than two weeks ago. Reading this column by Sundance has now validated my decision. They are now forever dead to me. I won’t ever go back no matter what. I am also now going to find other options to get away from Dish so none of my premiums fund any of these fake news networks, including Fox, even when I don’t watch them. It’s amazing in how just under five years, Trump (and Sundance) have pulled the veil off of so many people, magazines, and networks we used to foolishly trust. It’s sad, but enlightening.
not of this matters because………………………………….
Squirrel! – NY Slime:
Ali Velshi
@AliVelshi
·
2m
BREAKING: NBC confirms a new single-day record of 185,527 new COVID-19 cases in the U.S. The previous record was on Friday 11/13 with 176,309 cases.
1,912 deaths were reported across the U.S. today.
There have been 11,771,117 cases and 253,305 deaths.
Amazing how the numbers spiked right after the election. I guess they want us to worry about something else than their stealing of the Presidency.
And, unlike in the spring, when the virus’ spikes made its way from region to region over a span of a few months (i.e., NY and NJ spiked in April, but Florida and Texas didn’t spike til June/July), this “second wave” happened all over the nation in sync right around Nov. 3.
It is convenient that they are proposing and imposing lockdowns when the most fraudulent presidential election in American history is unfolding, yes?
It’s almost like they don’t want any of us to have the right to leave our homes.
Reminds me of a scene from a decent movie, I, Robot, when humans begin to rise up against the machines:
Please remain indoors. This is for your own safety.
…
Please return to your home, a curfew is in effect.
…
You have been deemed hazardous. Termination authorized.
The “machines” aren’t robots now, just the mega industries of Big Tech, the media and our governmental agencies and most of its administrators.
So a 97% survival rate with the total, and a 99,99% survival rate with todays numbers. If you take away the covid ‘related’ deaths, that survival rate number is much higher.
Yep, panic squirrel.
But no one has died from old age since March, so our overall death rate is lower than the last two years.
It would be miraculous news if not for Covid. No one in the USA has died from any other cause other than Covid. Now, if we can only tame Covid, we’ll all live forever!
How hard would it be to start a new political party with 70 million members?
I don’t know, but starting a real conservative television news network with 70 million instant subscribers sounds quite plausible to me.
70 (more like 80) million Patriots are going to constitute a very powerful bloc – politically and economically – and TPTB have not even begun to twig to this fact. It will be fun when we realize our power and start deploying it. Fox is our first victim, but won’t be our last. Time to stop buying the idea that we are powerless: there are many more of us than there are of them.
Fox is dead to me. When they were talking about the MAGA March in DC and Laura Ingraham called the marchers Trump Fans that burned my butt!! I do not care about any of those back stabbers! Fox will never be seen in my house again and yes, this means you too Tucker the MF!!
My wife and I are exactly of the same sentiment with you. I hope their re-enactment of Glenn Beck’s crashing and burning due to the Trump curse brings them great enjoyment.
It is interesting how God can show you things that you didn’t think about before. It dawned on me just before the election how ALL of these pundits, from supposed right to left, make their living off the swamp of D.C. It doesn’t matter to them who won in November because they are ALL are in on it and aren’t affected by any decision the vile government officials make. We appeal to God because He loves us and is the TRUTH embodied by His Son, Jesus Christ. DO NOT put your trust in princes, in mortal man that cannot save.
For those that say they are quitting Fox news except for so and so.
That’s like saying “I’m quitting smoking, I just don’t smoke between cigarettes”
Oh, how I love that analogy.
I remember hearing Tucker on a panel at CPAC in 2012, I believe, say it would be wonderful if Romney was elected. Been skeptical ever since.
Compared to Ozero, I think Tucker was correct at the time.
Romney is a NeoCon/Country Club RepubliCON, but I doubt he would have weaponized the NSA database, DOJ, the FBI, or changed the military brass to a bunch of social justice-worshipping a-holes.
I didn’t mind Romney back then, considering the alternative. Then I woke up bigly.
I used to like Romney. But in 2012, my dear son-in-law cautioned me that he was a snake. Unfortunately, I realized he was exactly correct. But I also set him straight on Lebron James and now he also agrees with that. But Romney is even lower than a snake.
The only time I warmed up to Romney was in 2008 and he was running against McCain. Of course unless you was were from Massachusetts he was an unknown product.
Romney ran as a “conservative” to the right of McCain in 2008. But the real tragedy of the 2008 GOP primaries was Rudy’s ill-advised state strategy. If Rudy had gotten better campaigning advice, he’d have been a much more formidable challenger to Zero than Songbird was.
TuCa was out of line in his comments re. Powell. The findings of those investigating this totally fraudulent election are extensive and represent a huge threat to many, globally. Not to mention that there are legal issues involved.
Tucker is not a court of law, and his recent shows have been weak at best.
Decision time, Tucker. Money or patriotism?
He already made his choice…….
He’s still there yapping!
If he had any moral compass he would have resigned on election night.
It’s all about the money with Tucker.
He likes fly-fishing too much. Apparently doesn’t mind if the creek is in China.
Trucker is a trader ….a wolf in sheep clothing…he fooled me until just now.
Same talking points…
Some people say…
Norman, coordinate!
Is this a movie reference?
I remember the republican primaries like it was yesterday.
Such a glorious moment watching at the time Mr. Trump squish everyone of these jerks and there disdain for is little people out here.
I learned many years ago from watching MacGyver to never trust a Murdoc.
Varnie on Fox Business and Lou Dobbs on Fox Business are syndicated. They speak the truth and are not going to be fired. I have given up on everyone else. Laura Ingrums, what a disappointment. Tucker, what a wuss. and even Hannidy is squishy.
Let’s not worry about Fox, let’s fight for our liberty in these recounts and Court challenges. FREEDOM. Do what you can.
I’d like to know who specifically in fox upper management thought it a great idea to hire Donna Brazile.
Paul Ryan
Eric nails it.
Short and succinct.
I’ve stopped watch FNC ever since Brett and company started calling China Joe ‘President-Elect’.
I’m still impressed on Fox Business with Maria, Lou, and Elizabeth: all solid conservatives, with good guests.
I remember all this well. I cancelled Fox after I watched the MEgan exhibition. I have held Tucker at arms length ever since he opted for Faux money and power over loyalty to Kaus. Have retold the Kaus story many times here on CTH though many treepers adore him. Disloyalty isn’t a little cut on the hand; disloyalty cuts right to the heart for me. This whole scenario seems so long ago, thanks for the reminder, Sundance.
Mickey Kaus is the real deal. Son of a great California Supreme Court Justice (yes, there were really some back in the day) Otto and great mom Peggy.
I do love me some history, let’s check in on Joshua 😛
King James Bible Joshua 24
Joshua Reviews Israel’s History
1 And Joshua gathered all the tribes of Israel to Shechem, and called for the elders of Israel, and for their heads, and for their judges, and for their officers; and they presented themselves before God. 2 And Joshua said unto all the people, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Your fathers dwelt on the other side of the flood in old time, even Terah, the father of Abraham, and the father of Nachor: and they served other gods. 3 And I took your father Abraham from the other side of the flood, and led him throughout all the land of Canaan, and multiplied his seed, and gave him Isaac. 4 And I gave unto Isaac Jacob and Esau: and I gave unto Esau mount Seir, to possess it; but Jacob and his children went down into Egypt. 5 I sent Moses also and Aaron, and I plagued Egypt, according to that which I did among them: and afterward I brought you out. 6 And I brought your fathers out of Egypt: and ye came unto the sea; and the Egyptians pursued after your fathers with chariots and horsemen unto the Red sea. 7 And when they cried unto the LORD, he put darkness between you and the Egyptians, and brought the sea upon them, and covered them; and your eyes have seen what I have done in Egypt: and ye dwelt in the wilderness a long season. 8 And I brought you into the land of the Amorites, which dwelt on the other side Jordan; and they fought with you: and I gave them into your hand, that ye might possess their land; and I destroyed them from before you. 9 Then Balak the son of Zippor, king of Moab, arose and warred against Israel, and sent and called Balaam the son of Beor to curse you: 10 But I would not hearken unto Balaam; therefore he blessed you still: so I delivered you out of his hand. 11 And ye went over Jordan, and came unto Jericho: and the men of Jericho fought against you, the Amorites, and the Perizzites, and the Canaanites, and the Hittites, and the Girgashites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites; and I delivered them into your hand. 12 And I sent the hornet before you, which drave them out from before you, even the two kings of the Amorites; but not with thy sword, nor with thy bow. 13 And I have given you a land for which ye did not labour, and cities which ye built not, and ye dwell in them; of the vineyards and oliveyards which ye planted not do ye eat.
Choose Whom You will Serve
(Deuteronomy 10:12-22)
14 Now therefore fear the LORD, and serve him in sincerity and in truth: and put away the gods which your fathers served on the other side of the flood, and in Egypt; and serve ye the LORD. 15 And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.
16 And the people answered and said, God forbid that we should forsake the LORD, to serve other gods; 17 For the LORD our God, he it is that brought us up and our fathers out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage, and which did those great signs in our sight, and preserved us in all the way wherein we went, and among all the people through whom we passed: 18 And the LORD drave out from before us all the people, even the Amorites which dwelt in the land: therefore will we also serve the LORD; for he is our God.
19 And Joshua said unto the people, Ye cannot serve the LORD: for he is an holy God; he is a jealous God; he will not forgive your transgressions nor your sins. 20 If ye forsake the LORD, and serve strange gods, then he will turn and do you hurt, and consume you, after that he hath done you good. 21 And the people said unto Joshua, Nay; but we will serve the LORD. 22 And Joshua said unto the people, Ye are witnesses against yourselves that ye have chosen you the LORD, to serve him. And they said, We are witnesses. 23 Now therefore put away, said he, the strange gods which are among you, and incline your heart unto the LORD God of Israel. 24 And the people said unto Joshua, The LORD our God will we serve, and his voice will we obey. 25 So Joshua made a covenant with the people that day, and set them a statute and an ordinance in Shechem. 26 And Joshua wrote these words in the book of the law of God, and took a great stone, and set it up there under an oak, that was by the sanctuary of the LORD. 27 And Joshua said unto all the people, Behold, this stone shall be a witness unto us; for it hath heard all the words of the LORD which he spake unto us: it shall be therefore a witness unto you, lest ye deny your God. 28 So Joshua let the people depart, every man unto his inheritance.
Excellent timing.
A good friend of mine tells me Tucker claimed he invited Sydney Powell onto his show to present her evidence, and that she told him to $&@! off.
I sent her this column, along with a reminder how Carlson swore he’d go down with the ship for his writer who got fired last summer for being insufficiently woke. Only, the writer remained fired, and Tucker gave a Paul Ryan “that’s not who we are” speech trashing his writer instead.
If I were Sydney I’d tell him to kiss off too. He can read the affidavits and look at the data spikes himself. He doesn’t need her to present her case. It’s clearly a trap to either set her up in some way, or to try and figure out what she knows.
(I think her good guys /bad guys thing is a smoke screen…to keep the enemy guessing about who actually confiscated the servers.)
He could watch the magnificent press conference like everybody else.
Exactly. Ive seen enough and read enough of the evidence on just the treehouse alone. Tuckee has the personnel and resources to dig to china, or venezuela, and find the evidence on his own. Lazy tuckee, or compromised tuckee?
Tucker worked for MSNBC. Grew up in San Francisco, Georgetown, and an expensive boarding school. His father was a government Mickey muck and his stepmother is was their to a frozen food company.
He until recently spent years living in the 99 percent progressives neighborhood of Chris Matthews and many others like that and was happy as a pig in you know what.
Donald Trump and his deplorable voters repulse Tucker.
Carlson worked at MSNBC before it went full bore moonbat. He was one of those purged when they went over to the dark side and turned the network over to the likes of Olbermann, Maddow, and Tingles Matthews. Scratch Scarborough was the only conservative who survived the purge there because he went full bore moonbat himself.
Tucker was also friends with Hunter Biden….
Good guys/bad guys smokescreen.
Agreed hokkoda!
Fox & Tucker are dead to us. OAN and CTH rule.
For years Rush was a huge supporter of Fox. His friendship with Ailes is well known. Even today almost every show he mentions that ” I saw (reference to any current subject) on Fox news.”
Not that surprising because his career is almost exactly parallel to the rise of Fox news. And he mentions that they were the only two conservative outlets in those early days.
However he is more cynical and suspicious. And he has mentioned with sadness that Fox is not as trustworthy, though not addressing individuals. In fact he has mentioned how well he was treated by Chris Wallace and others.
It would be nice if he frequently explicitly referenced more alternative sites, resources and individuals. He does leave some links but generally still is focused on mainstream legacy media. As well, there is a competitive/monetary element where he may not want to give publicity to other conservative media figures.
With such a big audience it would be helpful to boost trustworthy people and places that his audience may not be familiar with.
It’s one thing to dissect the mainstream media every day, but that really is playing defense. Going on offense would be more publicity for alternative figures and research and less angst over the usual mainstream figures.
I have been trying for 5 years to convince my Mensa member sister that FOX was the enemy. FOX hosts would be saying one thing, while the banner scrolling at the bottom of my TV screen was repeating CNN/MSNBC talking points.
Roger Ailes is the person who mentored Rush in becoming syndicated allowing him to become the media behemoth he became. Rush is loyal to a fault and will never turn on the person who made him who he is, especially now that Ailes is no longer among us.
If a skunk and a Fox News host are lying dead in the middle of the road how do you tell the difference? Skidmarks in front of the skunk.
And the skunk smells better…
I appreciate the review that Sundance has posted here. I was not a Treeper until late 2017 so had not read that background.
Thank you SD for confirming my suspicions with facts.
So Tucker Carlson thinks his “I want, I want” is more important than Sidney’s need to make a proper case in court and complete gathering the evidence. Lou Dobbs instead respected that and simply asked when she thought they be ready.
I watch Tucker and will continue to, to see what he picks up and what he doesn’t. Tonight he sounded in a bit of a snit because Sydney wouldn’t give him everything she has. He should have known she would not. They are presenting a case and will roll it out on the timeline they believe will be most effective. Everyone else on Fox crapped all over the pressser, and the other outlets didn’t even cover it. At least Tucker led with it. I give him credit for that because he is going to get a firestorm of grief for doing it.
Someone got the German servers. Who got them? Are they in a warehouse with the Hunter Biden hard drive? And what was in the envelopes at the GHW Bush funeral? Anyone seen Ghislaine lately? And where oh where has the Weiner laptop gone? Oh, and don’t even get me started on the Vegas helicopter or the third San Bernardino shooter. Nothing to see here.
She said that she doesn’t know who has the server, and that the “bad guys” could have it. That’s strange. If the “good guys” had it, wouldn’t they tell her? But if she does already have the evidence, then we don’t need the server anyway.
I think she has a fantastic poker face. Never tell the enemy what you know until it’s too late for them to stop you..
Exactly. She knows who has it. Tonight TGP claims the good guys have it and that it will provide the empirical evidence needed to support all of the statistical evidence that could be dismissed as only circumstantial. We’ll see, but if true, this is HUGE. And don’t forget Sidney’s admonition that she never claims anything she can’t back up. I bet there are a great many people finding it difficult to sleep tonight.
What they’re going to be able to do is take the eyewitness affidavits, which are independent of the electronic data, and map them to specific counting locations at specific times and possibly even specific Dominion user logins in the server data.
Data + Independent eyewitness = confirmation