All things considered, this is a positive first step and the first significant indication that Western propaganda around World War Reddit is failing.
According to sources who are speaking to NBC News, U.S. and EU officials are gently beginning to talk to Ukraine government officials about what steps might need to be taken to bring an end to the Ukraine-Russia war. Obviously, for those who do not pretend, we all know the decision to end this conflict comes down to the USA telling Ukraine President Zelenskyy to open peace talks with Russia.
The EU NATO alliance has recently started to show less interest in the maintenance of a U.S. proxy war against Russia, and more open public statements that the current status of a stalemate is unsustainable given the amount of money, hardware and political energy required to maintain it.
Additionally, Zelenskyy is running out of men to throw into the meat grinder; the troops and military leaders are actually defying his orders now.
Therefore, if the Biden administration (State Dept and CIA) concede to the reality, Zelenskyy will have no alternative except to talk to Russia about ending the conflict.
This is the baseline of non-pretending honesty that President Trump has been saying in his remarks about his ability to end the “killing and death” within 24 hours. The reality of the situation is not complex.
Ukraine pledges not to join NATO, the USA pledges not to use Ukraine as a proxy nation to conflict with Russia, the untrusting Russian government keeps part of Eastern Ukraine as a safety mechanism, and the war/bloodshed ends.
However, given the use of Ukraine as a financial mechanism for U.S. politicians to get rich, and given the financial stakes for multinationals like Blackrock, there are other financial considerations which will play out in the background of any potential peace talks. In the end, just like in the beginning, it’s all going to come down to money.
(Via NBC) – WASHINGTON — U.S. and European officials have begun quietly talking to the Ukrainian government about what possible peace negotiations with Russia might entail to end the war, according to one current senior U.S. official and one former senior U.S. official familiar with the discussions.
The conversations have included very broad outlines of what Ukraine might need to give up to reach a deal, the officials said. Some of the talks, which officials described as delicate, took place last month during a meeting of representatives from more than 50 nations supporting Ukraine, including NATO members, known as the Ukraine Defense Contact Group, the officials said.
The discussions are an acknowledgment of the dynamics militarily on the ground in Ukraine and politically in the U.S. and Europe, officials said.
They began amid concerns among U.S. and European officials that the war has reached a stalemate and about the ability to continue providing aid to Ukraine, officials said. Biden administration officials also are worried that Ukraine is running out of forces, while Russia has a seemingly endless supply, officials said. Ukraine is also struggling with recruiting and has recently seen public protests about some of President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s open-ended conscription requirements.
And there is unease in the U.S. government with how much less public attention the war in Ukraine has garnered since the Israel-Hamas war began nearly a month ago, the officials said. Officials fear that shift could make securing additional aid for Kyiv more difficult.
Some U.S. military officials have privately begun using the term “stalemate” to describe the current battle in Ukraine, with some saying it may come down to which side can maintain a military force the longest. Neither side is making large strides on the battlefield, which some U.S. officials now describe as a war of inches. Officials also have privately said Ukraine likely only has until the end of the year or shortly thereafter before more urgent discussions about peace negotiations should begin. U.S. officials have shared their views on such a timeline with European allies, officials said.
“Any decisions about negotiations are up to Ukraine,” Adrienne Watson, spokesperson for the National Security Council, said in a statement. “We are focused on continuing to stand strongly in support of Ukraine as they defend their freedom and independence against Russian aggression.”
An administration official also noted that the U.S. has participated with Ukraine in discussions of its peace summit framework but said the White House “is not aware of any other conversations with Ukraine about negotiations at the moment.” (read more)
Ultimately the decision to end the Ukraine-Russia war is not up to Joe Biden. At a certain point the CIA and State Dept will tell him the cost -v- benefit analysis is no longer worth it, politicians are getting too many angry calls from Americans, and it’s time to end the conflict.
Biden will do what he’s told and read what is prepared for him, while the people around him try to position the end of the Ukraine conflict to gain Joe Biden the Nobel Prize for peace.
The political propaganda at the conclusion of a proxy war that NATO and Biden started is very clear to see.
A week after Hamas bombed Israel, I stopped seeing any effort to publicize the Ukraine war. It continues and the MSM hardly mentions the Ukraine war anymore. That’s a choice someone made. I scan a number out news outlets and there isn’t much being said. I see this as a concerted effort, NOT individual decisions being made by the MSM. I believe you’re spot on with your assessment Sundance.
Hamas ended the war in Ukraine just like Putin ended the covid pandemic
sad but true
Never let a NEW crisis go to waste.
Yah, at the climax of the Trucker protests THE DAY after Twinkle-deau and his henchwoman Freeland failed to pass the Emergency Act. Interesting timing, n’est ce pas?
Makes a person wonder if the decreasing fortunes of the Ukraine military added to decreasing positive interest by U.S. citizens prompted the Military Industrial Complex-colluding black hats in the Middle East to incentivize Hamas to go primeval on the Israelis. The Deep State black hats have consistently proven to be opportunistic on top of being completely amoral.
Occam’s razor: Blackrock.
Considering Blackrock’s immense portfolio of investments in munitions industries, one can assume they’re always ready to profit from conflicts of all types, regardless of the depth of immorality of any of the players involved.
Morality as such, is no longer present in their gene code, let alone in their human functions or brain. Basically, this can be seen in the dead eyes no longer reflecting a human soul.
Case study: Antony Blinken.
Cabal Biden is still trying one last round of Ukraine dollars to steal. New Speaker must be frustrating the machine a little. Still the swamp, but Gaetz made some noise.
go to …moonofalabama.org for daily update on SMO … and ISRAELIS/HAMAS…war…
Stalemate? It is always satisfying to see a bully get his arse handed to him after picking a fight.
I guess we can add “stalemate” to the ever growing list of words with new progressive definitions. So if by “stalemate” they mean Russia won, then sure, it’s a “stalemate”
Definition of a stalemate: When one side in a war has “seemingly endless” troops and munitions available slowly and systematically grinds down the other side who are running out of troops, who have soldiers and officers defying orders, and couldn’t buy a BB gun if it wasn’t paid for by someone else. Sure, that sounds like a stalemate situation to me – not.
Won what?
Most of the formerly Ukraine territory east of Dneiper River, a land bridge from Russia proper to Crimea, and a buffer between the “motherland” and NATO. You know, what they intended to win all along.
I suppose the Kyiv run was just a visit. They are now the pariah of western civilization, and have destroyed a generation of Russian men. The territory they have occupied has become a minefield strewn with ruins. The black sea fleet is a shambles, the Russian Army reinvented WWI and the Airforce has yet to put in a meaningful appearance. The land bridge is all within striking range of western munitions. The NATO “buffer” Now ensures Finland and Sweden will shut down Murmansk when necessary. Crimea is within range of all sorts of munitions as well. Quite the victory Tovarich and you are all behaving as if this were over. What you have is a 1915 stalemate.
I assume you mean the US considering they probably started the war and kept it going.
Nonsense. Russia had Ukraine as a proxy for 80 years and invaded to keep it that way. “The US started this” is a Russian talking point.
The more you know…..
Nonsense
Have another glass.
Many experts have exposed the motivations of the West (US) to provoke Russia into this conflict. Russia was not provoking Ukraine or the West to start the war – get your facts straight. Remember Merkel’s comments about MInsk if you haver any remaining doubts.
And let’s put responsibility where it truly lies, and that would be Zelensky who wholeheartedly requested adhesion to NATO while knowing Russia would never tolerate it.
If one offered me a bunch of goodies in exchange for using my home for questionable purposes, I – and only, me – am responsible for the outcome based on my decision of acceptance.
Pay any attention to 2014?
You really should change your name to Plonk Noir.
What are you 12?
Yeah. I knew like minded independent thinkers would get it.
Echo chamber much?
Actually, I believe it to be NATO that was the source of this. It was the request and consideration of adding Ukraine
as a NATO member that triggered this war. Ukraine wanted NATO backing while Russia warned against it.
Having Ukraine as a NATO member right against the Russian border evidentally was too close for Putin to put up with.
Never ever forget that, for the Biden Socialist cabal, it’s always about geopolitics re energy sources, green new deal initiatives, renewables, control over fossil fuels (the better to KILL it!) etc. UKRAINE WAS MASSIVELY IMPORTANT IN THE GEOGRAPHICAL EQUATION.
If Ukraine functioned within the orbit of Russia, it would vastly affect EU energy choices. However, if EU could annex Ukraine by hook or crook, it would fall within the new green energy regimes on the EU continent.
THAT’S WHY PIG BIDEN NEVER WANTED A PEACE DEAL!
But now he has his new honey, i.e., The War in the MidEast WILLFULLY PRECIPITATED BY HIM! He hopes to make conservatives the enemies of both the Jewish population and the Islamic population by baiting both groups THUS turning them against the Nation’s biggest domestic threat, i.e., Trump voters!
Speaking ill (within the political realm) of either group will be classified as hate. All such remarks will be censored, and Uncle Joe will pound away at conservatives for being both anti-Semitic and anti-Islamic.
THAT’S THE BIG PLAN FOR NOV. 2o24.
At least that’s what their AI systems recommend!
And yet there was no response to Finland joining.
Russia is stalemating forward around Avdiivka.
The Russians are getting their ass handed to them around Avdiivka.
Your comment is laughable, but unfortunately Ukrainians are dying by the thousands every week.
Do some research. Haven’t seen you on this site before.
Especially since they were on the outskirts of Kyiv 600 days ago.
Plonk. Have you ever heard of a feint? The Russian attack on Kiev was done in order to establish the defensive lines in eastern Ukraine. Which Russia was able to do in some areas without firing a shot. It was a masterful plan. That won the war for Russia in the first few months.
If not for NATO support. Ukraine would have surrendered in the summer of 2022. When their Navy was sunk. Their Air Force grounded. and all Their Army’s Armor destroyed.
Thirty years in uniform . What you are proposing is garbage.
I cannot help but think how timely (US CIA/ State Dept) a new war starts up in the middle east just in time when the Ukraine war fervor dies down.
Weird isn’t it?
Notice Russian talking points always have presenter and then immediately two or three “supporters” chime in? Doggy Daddy and his team. Then right on time we have Joshua2415. Weird isn’t it. There is a pattern here.
Pinot, you’ve gone off.
DoggyDaddy and his team! LOL almost spit covfefe through my nostrils.
Should we have our own t-shirts made up?
interspersed with a couple mass shooting events as punctuation?
I respectfully suggest that Russia doesnt have to agree to anything. Theyre winning. And the US has already betrayed them in a treaty they signed together, so no trust exists. Once Adivansk falls the road is open to Tor. Whats it called now Slovansk or something. Russia may choose to negotiate a settlement, but the US will be beggars at the table.
Putin is presently telling all of his oligarchs; you bring any money and assets you can move outside Mother Russia, home or everything I can get my hands on is being seized.
Two things, he is making sure as little wealth as possible get confiscated by Europe and US, if this escalates. He wants everything and everyone home if this thing escalates.
Right now there is some interesting real estate being heaved on the market. High dollar parking spots in NYC, London, other usual parking spots.
Putin’s boys are probably making some difficult decisions.
Putin is also finding out if he has any Fredos to be concerned about.
Screw sanctions by the west. Your a flushed Russian, you and your Fing yacht better get
home.
These people do love to negotiate with themselves don’t they.
There will be very nearly no negotiations. The terms will be a new government in Kiev according to Russia’s outline, Russia will hold all of the Eastern territories at least to the Dnieper, all of the coastal areas to Odessa, Crimea to be recognized as Russian and Transnistria integrated as a result of Russia taking the adjacent land. No NATO at all in the rump state that is left to Ukraine. This is the best case scenario for Ukraine.
Or they will grind on until you have a Russian Border at Poland.
…AND, the U.S. taxpayers will pick up the tab for the reconstruction of the infrastructure of the Ukraine, paying the pensions of their thieving government, while siphoning off much of it by the thieves in the U.S. government.
ALL THE WHILE the U.S. is being invaded by migrants from many countries who dislike the citizens of this country. Incomprehensible.
The false implication of Russia in the Trump/Russia collusion hoax has consequences. USA is absolutely an Empire of Lies. Negotiations with liars is a fool’s errand. Putin is no fool. Take what you want, then leave the rest.
They have been attacking “Adviansk” since 2014.
The US has violated every treaty and agreement with Russia. I would hold no trust in what comes from US. Russia should keep grinding until all Nazis are dead or defeated then dead. Ukraine and US can have all the meetings they want.
So all Vlad has to do is say, “Not yet.” or “Nyet” if responding in writing.
Whatever the Russian people support is what he will probably do within reason and after meeting all strategic objectives. The same thing we would do.
Of course, it’s gonna cost more money, now that we destroy the place we have to go back and rebuild it. i’m sure Jim Biden and his construction crew will be there shortly surveying the damage.
Sounds like a project for the Clinton Foundation 🙂
Instead of sending more money to Ukraine we should send our extra IRS agents.
They could actually perform some good by tracing what money and weapons were purloined and claw it back for the rebuilding effort. Of course penalty fees and prison sentences would apply.
The IRS agents should be given hammers and shovels and instructions not to come back until Ukraine is rebuilt.
Except for the Big Guy, of course!
Any IRS agent sent to Ukraine would eventually return stinking rich with nary a FATCA disclosure.
Think the new speaker dealt with the IRS agent army.”
I think the world would be better served if” they” were sent to the front lines.
What if the people of Ukraine say “no thank you” to the Clinton Foundation as well – and any of the other people hawking NGO services?
west1890: As soon as the paint is dry in Haiti.
The multinational corporations are already making plans and greasing palms. The Ukrainian government has already been negotiating with western corporations, such as BlackRock and the German weapons maker, Rheinmetall.
I am hoping that those plans turn out to be futile.
Black rock and Larry (Rat)Fink already got the contract
True dat.
I posted links to that effect a while ago but don’t remember which thread.
Blackrock is therefore, Q.E.D., the ey decision maker saying “it’s time to negotiate.”
Can’t make all that faux-rebuilding look good if bombs are still falling, right?
But what if all that does not pan out and they are kicked out of Ukraine?
they will be all of one..
What if Ukraine says, “no thank you”.
Blackrock has already negotiated a deal with the UniParty.
Blackrock is the Uniparty.
When Zelenskyy runs with his Millions or Billions and American Politicians get their cut. That will signal the end of the war in Ukraine. All those lives sacrificed for Mammon. What have we become?
We’ve become the nation of Bidenia.
Apparently the Russians have won this war.
The “USSA” Lost; Which is more important, imo. Now, If We/Me/You can only Regain control of “Our” Country from the Feral Coup DC GrubMint before the Open Border Invasion ignites the Chaos of Civil Dissolution. I spit, links from Patriot Vets at ……
genearly.substack.com
Yes indeed!!
The fog of war is the perfect money laundering scheme. Billions of our hard earned money, now stained with blood, line pockets of the elites. Another country is left decimated and likely more to come. The world is destabilized. And the Democrats call this winning.
It seems to me that everything our Gov does is some form of Money Laundering. Like the Climate Crisis scam, the covid scam, the EV car scam and it goes on and on.
they almost done same to S Y R I A ……before RUSSIA came there in the September 2015…….
Was Kevin McCarthy not one of the biggest fools? We never, ever wanted McCarthy.
You certainly can’t blame the Russians if they now push to secure their gains. They won.
Some changes for the EU, notably Germany – no more pipeline, and higher energy costs forever. Hope they got what they wanted.
Welcome to the peace talks.
Here are the terms of surrender:
1.- The four most eastern oblasts, and the four oblasts immediately to the west of those four, are inducted into the Russian Federation.
2.- An election is held in what remains of Ukraine for the governing of Ukraine. Candidiates for office must publicly swear that they will never allow foreign troops or weapons on Ukraine soil, on pain of death.
3.- Reparations are paid by the United States and the EU to Donetsk and Lugansk for the destruction caused to them by Ukraine, which is the proxy of the United States/NATO and EU. Reparations are paid to the Russian Federation for the sabotage of the Nordstream pipeline.
4.- All funds and property of the Russian Federation are returned to the Russian Federation, with suitable interest for the loss.
5.- The United Nations hears the evidence of the bioweapons labs. The United Nations, in open session, votes on what the consequences should be for the perpetrators of the bioweapons labs.
6 – War crimes trials are held, in Donetsk, for the all the perpetrators of the bioweapons labs in Ukraine. These perpetrators include western officals.
7 – War crimes trial are held, in Lugansk, for the Nazi leaders of Ukraine, including but not limited to Zelenskyy, Zhalushny, Budanov, the perpetrators of the Odessa Trade Council massacre, and leaders of the Azov Battalion, Right Sector and other neo-nazi groups. War crimes trials are held for any western leaders who materially aided Ukraine.
8.- The statue to Stepan Bandera in the center of Lviv is torn down in a public ceremony attended by Zelenskyy and other neo-nazi Ukrainian officials.
9.- Zelenskyy signs the surrender agreement in Kiev. He reads it aloud, and states the unconditional surrender of Ukraine. The text of the surrender agreement must appear in the leading newspapers in Brussels, Berlin, Paris, London, New York and Washington, D.C.
Sign here:
With those demands the war goes on until the last Ukrainian dies.
That sounds a bit “Severe”, unless Compared to the “Armistice” JoBama will have to (willingly) sign if WW 3 breaks out over “Israel”and is ended promptly when USSA Aircraftcarriers are sunk in rapid succession.
NWO Mother WEFers seem to be “calling the shots” despite all the “Awakening”…… are We/Me/You hitting the “Snooze” button and “normalizing” Events???
33 Trillion in USSABankster Debt is now “Normal”, Coup govs from Rigged sElections are “Acceptable” for the past 3 years, Citizens, even grandmothers & veterans are put in Feral Prisons for Tresspassing is “Justice” from a corrupt DoJ, and the Feral FIB-Polezi Statists kick in doors to serve benign warrants for “Insurrection”.
Sheesh, I suppose it can Get Worse, as Tryranny is the New Normal, Comrades.
Sounds reasonable.
Relating to #3, the Greeks paid reparations with silver plated coinage, USA government will do the same with fiat money. The US government should fix the pipeline as terms of surrender.
Sure. Now go take your meds.
NEOCONS/WARMONGERS and most of clapping seals in the CONgress will need strong meds very soon ……maybe you too Pinot Noir ……
Don’t identify as any of those things. Nice try though s.
And perhaps a padded cell?
yup – something like that – see my post below
These all correlate with Russia’s stated goals at the beginning. The WEF has little means of resisting any of it, short of nukes, and even that is doubtful.
Sounds like an actual authentic draft.
Thank you. These terms will come closer to any other suggested terms, certainly closer to the terms floated in the west.
closer ^than^ the terms, not ‘closer to the’.
You forget very important items …Ukraine never will be in the NATO/EU……..and NATO will stay in the 1997 borders…is blinken/nuland/jb ready for that ???????I do not think so…….. Russia will fight to last ukr./mercenary soldier…..
#2
Is it a matter of fact that many individuals who were a part of DJT’s administration (Vindman, et al) had strong connections to the Krainians. Their government is financially tied to the US Treasury, as well.
Pray that our next budget cuts out all these connections, and may the same come to pass for our financing of all foreign entanglements.
The witness list for the impeachment hearings was a roster of actors who were responsible for the funding, creation, or dissemination of the dossier
Wouldn’t surprise me if Sundance is right! So Biden’s weakness and fecklessness started the war in Ukraine by not stopping the Ukraine Nazis from killing ethnic Russians will get him a “Nobel Peace Prize” for ending a war he started???!!! What a paradox!! About as well earned as obama’s 2009 Nobel Peace Prize which he won for merely getting elected President! Just more of evidence of the Noble Peace Prize being meaningless and only for leftist totalitarians!
I agree he’s almost certainly right.
PDJT will probably predict it too, I’m guessing…
Timing is everything! Now is the time for peace talks, but only if we fund the hundred billion or so of US dollars to Ukraine. Good way to put pressure on the House. Hope they do not fold.
STOP SENDING OUR MONEY TO OTHER COUNTRIES AND STAY OUT OF THEIR BUSINESS.
USE THAT MONEY FOR CLOSING OUR BORDER! DEPORT ALL THOSE WHO HAVE ILLEGALLY CROSSED.
SAVE AMERICA.
🎯🎯🎯
I get the feeling that you are going to be a hard case for the re-education camp.
No doubt! Texas midget
😎
If the US forces Ukraine to the negotiating table will Russia turn up? Why would it?
Putin, as a Kremlin dove may well be in favour, but he has a very real problem, his people appear to want quite reasonably a just reward for the sacrifices they have been forced to make. Russian deaths over the last 18 or so months are what its all about at that political level but are just a part of it diplomatically. Putin is on course to be lauded by his people as the most significant Russian leader for centuries. Will he put his place in history at risk by doing a deal that the people view as ‘soft’.
As written/implied by other posters, the aggressive posture and actions of the US/NATO since 1991, including the move of NATO many times more than “not an inch” eastwards, followed by the blatant admissions that the Minsk Agreements were only a cover for Ukrainian military enhancement, have made certain that the Russians know from bitter experience that the US is not “agreement capable”.
We are now moving at a pace dictated by the Russians into the position where their military will unambiguously defeat the Ukrainian Army (there not being much left of its Airforce and Navy). Can the US allow this NATO invincibility destroying event to occur or does it have to settle it diplomatically? Again, why would the Russians let them?
You all may not be aware but the Russians have just increased by around 70% their defence budget for next year. This is not like the US profit bloated spend as most is in State owned organisations. They are cranking out everything from tanks to fighters to bullets as if there is no tomorrow. Basically trying to ensure that for them, plus their friends, there will be a tomorrow. Does that sound to you as if they are looking to do a deal anytime soon?
Regardless of the rights and wrongs the Russians are looking on agast at the US supported slaughter of civilians in Gaza.
They may in DC think they can get a deal but they have misread the Russians at every move for years. Seemingly trying to judge them by their own standards. Will someone rise out of the Swamp with the skills to sort this?
With a US President’s word or signature now proven worthless, would the US Congress, for that is who the Russian would insist sign up to any deal, get on board?
Perhaps a suggestion should be made to Putin that he insist President Trump be the negotiator.
Between them they could undoubtedly come up with a plan that sticks it to all the actual perpetrators (The Powers That (Should Not) Be) and helps only the citizens of each our countries.
Oh, and that stops the damage to the citizens of Ukraine as well. That means telling Blackrock and the rest of the BBB crew to take a hike.
You were doing pretty well until you thought that the Russians care about the “US supported slaughter of civilians in Gaza”. There are several wrong statements in that one sentence but I’ll let the treepers figure that out for you. Then there is the finishing statement. In a surrender by the Ukraine, why would you think a US Congressional signature would be involved?
I don’t need to figure it out, it is you who should open your mind to the history of events beyond the shores of the US.
The Russians care about what is happening in Gaza can be summed up with two words, Stalingrad and Leningrad. There are still, just, Russians who were there. Putin’s elder brother died there. Those events are deep in their souls. As a nation they feel for others going through the same.
Maybe the Germans should care too based on what UK/US aircraft did to Hamburg and Dresden. Sad to say but what we are seeing in Gaza has been standard US/NATO etc operating procedure for the last 80 years.
Have you not been watching what is happening in Ukraine? Without US military and especially financial support Ukraine would have caved in sometime last year. It cannot operate without Congress’s OK. Any surrender would be under the instructions of the US.
The Russians are not going to negotiate with Ukraine, it will be with US/NATO/EU in the hot seats and the US, as the boss, will have the final say. As I wrote, the word of a US President is now, based on historical precedent, not worth the paper its written on. The only chance of the word of the US being in any way believed is if Congress ratifies it.
Based on all the reneged upon treaties in the past, Russia has stated that the west “is no longer agreement capable”.
“You all may not be aware but the Russians have just increased by around 70% their defense budget for next year.”
Russia spends a little more than 1/10 of the money on Defense than the US does. Russia Defense budget is Forecast to be around 120 billion US dollars.
US defense budget is Forecast to be around to 1 Trillion dollars this year.
Maybe someone here can tell me. Who is getting the most bang for the buck?
No contest. The US shareholders and executives and consultants/lobbyists by a mile.
In terms of equipment, there is no evidence yet that US?NATO gear is better than Russia’s in a peer to peer conflict. This applies to any current gear that has been supplied, SAM or cruise missiles for example, let alone the old stuff (generally current stuff but old versions). In most cases the reverse applies.
The conflict has shown that the Russians are very fact to learn the lessons presented by new NATO equipment and apply countermeasures.
It seems like little by little, only the white house embarrassment and the rest of the administration lemmings, still support the money laundering operation.
Along with Z and some remaining 1% dregs in the EU – yes.
Oh and the Obammunist of course!
Surely the politicians have been able to satisfy their financial needs by now out of that $100-150 billion pot?
There is never too much graft to these people. They’re worse than heroin addicts.
just like a car salesman trying to squeeze every last penny out of his hapless victim
So the evidence of the Israel Hamas war being used to supplant the Russia Ukraine War is trickling in.
It was so strange watching all the ‘peacenik’ Europeans March in solidarity to push the Ukraine War. Almost as if they were all dominated by some hidden entity.
So what was the goal of such an entity? And how does an Israel Hamas war further that goal?
A place to ‘build back better’. Accomplished in spades. And Gaza is the next place.
Destroy Putin and break up Russia? Big Fail. Now we can try it with Bibi.
Graft off of funding a war? All things must end. Not if we start another war. Now, who will start murdering at a drop of a hat?
Of course, it is not necessary for there to be an overarching conspiracy. Just multiple regional conspiracies and great timing for the second one to rise as the first one fails.
Iran conspired with Hamas. It is what they do. We funded both knowing they will do it. But were we in on those plans or know of them, or ask them to meet a timetable?
And with peacenik France and peacenik Germany bragging about how they tricked Russia into the Minsk accords so that they could buy time to arm Ukraine, we don’t have to leave NATO to find conspirators openly plotting to destroy Russia.
And isn’t our Congress Military Industrial Complex always grafting? That is an 80 or so year running conspiracy that has always been eager to graft off of every war it can find or gin up.
And our media are adept at hiding democrat failures so that there are never any consequences.
The appearance of an overarching conspiracy could just be the overlapping of multiple interlocking conspiracies. And just look like somebody is behind it all pulling all the strings.
But we have to be careful. The George Floyd stuff looked so set up that some were thinking the poor cops were in on the conspiracy. Instead, Obama had slowly built up a conspiracy to portray such a death as a murder so that they could gin up riots. And it took them lots of practice figuring how to thwart the truth from coming out. Deaths of unarmed blacks interacting with police happen almost once a month. And most are due to poor choices they make. And they make instant riots. You just have to hide the truth to keep those riots going.
So we have to be careful and get it right.
Nice comment.
I believe they are positioning Democrat Sanctuary Mayors to replace the fading Zelensky as vessels for the continued Looting of the Treasury.
“These Cultural-Enrichers sure are expensive, Boss!”
Calling a stalemate in this proxy war at this time is like calling Germany’s situation in January 1945 a stalemate. People inside Germany at the time were also putting out feelers about negotiating.None of the wonder weapons were ”game changers” Hurry up with those Abram tanks.I guess we have arrived at ”as long as it takes”.Zelensky has many homes around the world to flee to as do other well-connected Ukrainians.They should worry about the survivors coming after them after it sinks in that they were used without any regard for their wellbeing.
History lessons.
Mussolini. Get out while you can.
Ceaucescu. Read the room.
BlackRock. Sell.
Billions of dollars stolen from the American people and thousands of dead Ukrainians.
The Ukraine war has went sour. New war to begin at the cost of death in Israel/Palestine. More money rolling in. Government officials will/are pleased.
A half million of the previous occupants of New Khazaria are now gone. Soon comes the international invitation to adventuresome Bolsheviks all over the world to come settle the New Frontier of New Khazaria, where you can learn first hand what the historians got wrong about WW2.
And yet as Sundance often says, few will get truthful enough with themselves to look beyond the lies to see the pattern beneath.
This is a global fight between Jewish led factions–on one side you have Jewish Nazis, decked out in Hitler tattoos and everything. Those are National Socialists.
On the other side you have Jewish globalists–communists.
Get it yet? You have two distinct Jewish led groups battling with each other for which specific Jewish method of applying Marxism will control the world.
I don’t want to be controlled, but that is now called an antisemitic belief. So be it.
Seems they decided Netanyahu has to go. Zelenskyy was useful for a fleeting moment. Nuland, Kagan, Krystol, Podhoretz, Freeland, Vindman and Blinken stay.
All of the Epstein subverted pedo politicians stay as well. The beat goes on.
Recently schumer and mcconnell, were making the continued funding of the ukraine bottomless pit, the most important wasteful spending of money ever. Now both just look like a couple of dumb asses.
Not dumb asses, just shameless thieves. They needed one more big theft. Notice they have much Congressional support.
Oy…I’ll bet talks of winding things down isn’t going over well for the little general, or is it corporal?…Yet, I’m sure he’s stashed away billions of American taxpayer dollars over the last year in anticipation of a CIA late-night flight out of the corrupt wasteland that became known world over for being a refuge for U.S. corruption…The secrets he could tell makes me wonder if he’ll ever get to spend his ill gotten booty, when his secrets could deprive our, at home political grifters, of spending theirs.
You guys are awesome.
Seriously, reading the responses here I am reminded how refreshing an invigorating it is to spend time with an online community who are honest, smart, knowledgeable and with genuinely well thought out perspectives.
Each Treeper has their own unique skill, but the reasonable and pragmatic worldview on these pages is the best in the entire online community.
I cherish you.
Just thought I would say that.
Awww shucks…
Ditto, as Rush used to say.
All of it possible because of you. You have provided the space for us all to come together and create this community, nay even this family if I may be so bold.
We love you, Sundance.
Right on!
#MeToo
All but the kickback recipients are tired of it:
https://www.rt.com/news/586566-adviser-italian-pm-resigns-prank/
The war in Ukraine is what happens when you put a little man with a Napoleon Complex in charge of a country. A fight to the last Ukrainian, he proclaims.
We would do well to understand that Ron DeSantis also appears to have a Napoleon Complex.
Not as long as he can buy cowboy boots with elevated heels.
do you mean Ellensky or Malarky?
IMO the only reason they may want to negotiate for peace now is possibly because the truth of all the money laundering is getting harder and harder to hide.
Kiev’s top general chastised for causing ‘panic’ in West
Valery Zaluzhny had said that Ukraine is unlikely to achieve a breakthrough during the ongoing counteroffensive
Here’s a Russian take on Zelensky. “The Ukrainian leader’s erratic behavior and growing messiah complex means he’s now an asset to Moscow.”
“There are two options left (for the West): either to persuade Zelensky to leave amicably by pointing to Washington’s chosen successor, or simply to kill him: a dead hero is better than a living psycho.”
https://www.rt.com/russia/586534-russia-should-protect-zelensky/
What it’s going to be is “unconditional military surrender, on Russia’s terms.” A complete acceptance of all the objectives of the special military operation as Putin spelled them out at the start.
The present boundary lines of Ukraine are neither historic nor cultural. They were set in a couple of USSR planning meetings. They will now be re-drawn along ancient cultural boundaries. Then, Poland will move in to re-draw them again. So it goes. Such has always been the history of this part of the world, for many thousands of years. They have never known peace, and likely never will.
Russia will impose to get what it wants, and ignore what it doesn’t. End of story. “We won.” Zelensky’s regime will be left in place, now irrelevant, until his own people dump him. 💀
yup – see my post below
Will Molestor Biden get to keep his Virus/Vaxx Weapons Factories? How about his Child Trafficking Networks? Plutonium Sales?
1 million Ukraininans dead, wounded or prisoners of war–they were protecting Switzerland’s borders.
The ones around Biden’s secret bank accounts. Zelensky’s, too.
Is there a Nobel for Best Puppet Dictator in a Bankster/Deep State Production?
The terms at the end of the Ukraine war could have been reached without the war. The only difference is the spectacular theft of US dollar would not have happened. It is absolutely disgusting what our “leadership” did in Ukraine. Stolen elections have consequences, really bad consequences. Every vote cheater has the death of Ukrainians on their hands (as do stupid Biden voters). Personally I prefer mean (true) tweets to war.
I guess the money laundry in Ukraine is drying out now. So, it will now be okay to switch to another laundry mat. Perhaps Iran and their terrorist allies? Maybe not, but a great opportunity will soon fill the vacuum for our greedy politicians and “investing” firms.
Why would Putin agree to talk peace at this time with all that NATO has cost Russia. A full unconditional surrender, with the removal of all Nazi’s is the only thing he should accept.
Zelensky may not want to give up. This has been quite a power rush for him. He was lauded everywhere he went, the reincarnation of Winston Churchill according to the idiot son George Bush.
He will wake up from his glory days and see what he has done to his country and all the young men dead. Hard to live with, in my opinion. Once the devil is done with you, the truth comes out. Suicide or assassination in his future.
I still remember -was it Stella? – who used to talk about the call of the pistol on the bedside table…
It wasn’t as if U.S. leaders weren’t warned. Appalling the role the played.
Stop the Ukraine war and divert everything to destroying islam and hamas. They are the mass murderers of the world for 1400 years.
I haven’t run the numbers but I would guess that the Christians are way ahead in that race.
Lessons old and new and “in development”
Mussolini. Get out while you can.
Ceaucescus. Read the room.
BlackRock. Sell.
I ripped all the Blackrock out of investments as soon as I first saw sundance’s take on them.
I was skeptical about the coup against McCarty, but it does seem to be making a difference so far. The new Speaker situation ended the prospects for unlimited funding for Ukraine, thus the sudden interest in negotiations. Add to that the Dems desperate desire to deprive Trump of a winning campaign issue, and the potential triumph of fullfilling his boast of ending the war immediately after taking office. They’ll give even peace a chance to stop that.
Sundance,
You nailed it with this picture of the kids in the back seat.
What a sad period of US history. Our government is largely responsible for a half million dead and maimed Ukrainians. We know this conflict should have been resolved before it started. We could have saved millions of lives and resources.
Stolen elections have consequences. They guy they said would start WW3 would have nipped this conflict in the bud. Guaranteed.
Any leftist with functioning reasoning abilities “pretend not to know” this, but they know Trump would have ended this long ago.
All the fun is gone. We’re just not that into Ukraine any more.
Lots of destruction. Billions and billions of FedBux® shoveled into a pit. No one really knows why, nor, what has actually happened, or not happened, or what was the point.
A two-year waste, for nothing.
We’re witnessing Putin’s propaganda offensive: his forces cannot win this war against Ukraine……so, they must give the impression that it is Ukraine that has everything to lose by holding out against a negotiated settlement. This is just another Putin head fake that the liberal press has lost it’s jock over!
I do not believe the current situation in Ukraine is a stalemate. Nor do I think the war (SMO) will be stopped by the flipping of some negotiation switch. The war could go on for quite some time (2025 or 2026) until Russia has achieved it’s goals. As outlined by Putin in his February 2022 speeches and subsequent announcements. And the final map of what is left of Ukraine may look quite different than it does now.
At the extreme, I think Russia is now ready to re-establish control over what they consider to be Russia on an historical basis. So if you want to see what Russia/Ukraine will look like when this is all over, best see a map of Russia from 1932. Where the Russian – Polish border met somewhere slightly East of Lvov, and quite a bit West of Kiev.
Let me explain.
I read or watch the following, amongst others, in order to gather information:
Weeb Union
Military Summary
Defense Policy Asia <==Also does work on the Sinoloan Cartels if you are interested,
Simplicius (on substack),
Moon of Alabama (MOA),
(Some of them reference Rybar, on Telegram which I do not have).
Putin’s speeches from February 21st and 24th, 2022,
Putin’s follow on speeches telling Ukraine they may lose their country if they continue,
And the commentary on all these publications. Which can be quite extensive, as it is here at CTH.
These sites attempt to follow and discuss the war in Ukraine at a very granular and geographic level. Including a lot of projections about tactics, strategy, production, training, bench depth, assets, land value, rebuilding, sanctions, etc. ad infinitum. Not that they are right about everything. Or anything. But there is a lot of effort to discuss, educate and persuade.
And all these, in sum, add up to a view of a much more dire situation for Ukraine than stalemate.
Ukraine is losing, and losing badly.
Not territoriality, but in the only metric which really counts. Manpower. But also equipment. Giving them more equipment at this point is wasteful, because there is no one their to use it, or even know how to use it. Because the Ukrainians are being slaughtered by the tens, even hundreds of thousands, protecting real estate that has no strategic value. Mariupol, Sieverdonetsk, Lysychansk, Bakmut, and now Avdiivka.
Or attacking (the Great Spring Offensive) where there is no chance of success. Like in Rabotina, now a cauldron, which has cost Ukraine something like 70,000 casualties since June 2023 alone.
Ukrainian equipment losses are monumental on all fronts. And now they are running out of both. And financing of more has suddenly become in short supply.
Meanwhile, Russia is outproducing the West (US, Europe and whomever) in war material of any and all kinds. And has bought even more from North Korea, China, and Iran. And has raised and trained large armies which sit on the border of or operate in Ukraine. They now have hundreds of thousands of troops who are combat veterans – which is the ultimate training.
While Ukraine press gangs teenagers and old men and sends them straight to the front to die.
==================
Even today the offer (The Ukraine Peace Talk Trial Balloon) is being discussed on MOA. There is no consensus other than Russia will ask for a lot more than Ukraine is ready to give. So the war will continue.
There is the idea that Russia will take all of the Oblasts it currently occupies (and has annexed); Luhansk, Donetsk, Zaporizhzhia, Kerson, Crimea. And ask for Mykolaiv and Odessa. Maybe Karkhiv. Plus the demilitarization of the remainder of Ukraine – whatever they think that is. No treaty with NATO by rump Ukraine. Removal of the Aegis Systems from Poland.
The list starts to get long. So the war will most likely continue.
If the analysts/blogs above are correct, the situation for Ukraine is much more precarious than portrayed in Western media. The Ukrainian military may be on the verge of collapse. And a coup or large scale mutiny may be in the offing along with a general retreat, if not a rout to the Dnieper.
We will see.
OGDuck
Some other podcasters that have good insight on Ukraine are:
Duran – Featuring Alex Christoforou and Alexander Mercouris – They also host other experts.
https://rumble.com/c/theduran
Larry Johnson, ex CIA Analyst at https://sonar21.com/
Col. Douglas Macgregor – former US military officer https://www.youtube.com/@douglasmacgregorcolonel
yup – read them too – there are a lot more. tried to keep the list short.
Most all of these podcasters have the same assessment as yours: “Ukraine is losing, and losing badly.”
Duran and Larry J. and Col.Macgregor…….are good source of info with moonofalabama.org…try it…….
Excellent post. I’ve been watching this situation since early 2014.
Now that the move to a multipolar World is underway, now that the World is watching on their TVs and Interweb the callous US supported Israeli strategy and the Russians finally have their economy humming on a wartime footing, I can’t see that the Russians have any reason not to keep going.
Quite the opposite, everything points to them keeping going if only to really show that the US/NATO, under current conditions, is a paper tiger. It has to, to help their vision of the future forward.
Good summary!
👏👏
I would add…..
Until Zelensky is removed
from office and the laws
are changed in Ukraine
which makes it illegal
to negotiate with Russia….
the fighting will continue.
US and Russia may be
conducting talks-but
Ukraine is not participating.
When Zelensky is removed,
and the laws changed…
I will then consider that
any negotiations are serious
and not just a smoke screen
and propaganda campaign.
🤷♀️💁🤷♀️
Russia want ELENSKY sign up— C A P I T U L A T I O N—–……so he elensky will fight to last UKR. soldier before he depart(if he will be lucky) to TEL AVIV (his parent’s0 new home…saaaaad
@OGDuck…Agreed. I first posted my terms about seven months ago. I agree with you about the time it will take to get there, but I think I am ‘way closer than the neocons.
The most important element in the surrender terms is having the Ukrainians – and NATO and the west – concede that they have lost completely. MacArthur and other generals have given that lecture. An open hearing at the U.N. on the bioweapons labs should be included in the terms, and the SMO should not be concluded until those hearings are completed
I would add Telegram to your information stream: Pepe Escobar, Intel Slava Z, Anti-NATO Coalition, Foreign Combatants, Rybar Itnernational to name a few (there are more). JohnHelmer.org publishes a good site.
UKR..lost about 90,000 soldiers since theirs “paper” offensive (early June 2023)…Zaluzhny’s interview in the british -ECONOMIST – openly said UKR. lost war….Zelensky & Company is mad as h*ll…..
How about charging Zelensky with criminal charges and find out where OUR $$$ went. I think lots of USAID & State Dept lifers will retire nicely along with warmongering politicians in the USA along with the Clintons & Bidens for sure. NO STRONGLY WORDED LETTERS but REAL charges. That would be a miracle.
Blinken was also just told to pound sand by al-Sisi (Egypt)
FJB/Blinken’s not having a very good day, huh?
Big Bummer
Ukraine has not been de-Nazified or demilitarized yet so Russia will continue to press forward. Fall mud season will slow things down. Frozen winter may bring more advances. Spring mud season will slow things down again.
The WEF is up against an inexorable force. Will the penis piano player still be around by spring?
to your last sentence….probably in the TEL AVIV or in the $30 million mansion in the sunny Florida……
In any manner of an end to this war, it will be touted by Russia as a victory over the USA. Putin will us the media to push that narrative.
Meanwhile as pointed out in this article, the US will continue to pour billions into Ukraine for the stated reasons.
As I recall, Biden has already appointed someone as the over seer in the Ukraine rebuilding collition.
As she will become more prominant in the media about this position, more talk of how money will be necessary for this rebuilding.
Hide and watch.
It is too early to draw the new borders of Russia. If Odessa is not taken the British Navy will install a base in the Black Sea and in 30 years it will be War again. They have been trying since the Crimean War.
Ideally the end of the Ukranian War will bring the dissolution of NATO and of our vassal European Union.
Generals Milley, Austin and Brown guided US into another Vietnam and Afghanistan victory.