I respect Dinesh D’Souza. However, on this issue I also disagree intensely.
The foundation of D’Souza’s reason for why he does not support a new political party, a MAGA or Patriot or (__fill in blank__) party, appears flawed. By saying a new party would only split the GOP, D’Souza is actually making the argument that creates Battered Conservative Syndrome; the DeceptiCon argument that protects the GOP wing. WATCH:
When the Tea Party rose to power and primaried a host of GOP politicians, it was the Republican party that attacked the conservative base and attempted to destroy the rebellion. McCain called us “hobbits” and McConnell called us “jihadists.” The threat from the Tea Party was felt amid the GOP. The GOP was *not* going to adjust.
Meanwhile Nancy Pelosi and Barack Obama destroyed the center of their political party called the Blue Dog coalition, represented by Bart Stupak. The Blue Dogs were wiped out in 2010 because Democrats forced them into radical left-wing agenda items.
A new party, ie. ‘THE’ new party, would not be a carve out within the Republican club. A new party would be a coalition party of Democrats, Republicans and Independents. Need proof of the scale, look at the 2020 election for Trump. That’s the (fill__blank) party.
A new party would be a SECOND party to the UniParty occupants currently pushing more big government in Washington DC. The fact that we have decades worth of evidence (Patriot Act, Wall Street Lobbyists, K-St. etc.), and specifically the past ten years (omnibus spending bills, limitless debt ceiling, massive wasted stimulus, political bailouts, QE1/QE2, Obamacare, college tuition takeover etc.) shows that both Democrats and Republicans are two wings of the same big government bird.
The fear of “splitting the GOP” is the weaponized talking point of the GOP leadership who use that fear as a weapon to remain in power. Those who listen to that threat are suffering from battered conservative syndrome.
There is nothing conservative about expanding government, spending into oblivion, allowing open borders and simultaneously removing liberty and freedom. What exactly is being “conserved”? CTH has been making this argument for years.
This example from 2015 rings just as true today:
2015 – A few days ago I took the time to read Jonah Goldberg’s expressed concerns about the support for Donald Trump and the state of current conservative opinion.
Toward that end I have also noted additional GOP media present a similar argument, and I took the time to consider.
While we are of far lesser significance and influence, I hope you will consider this retort with the same level of consideration afforded toward your position.
The challenging aspect to your expressed opinion, and perhaps why there is a chasm between us, is you appear to stand in defense of a Washington DC conservatism that no longer exists.
I hope you will indulge these considerations and correct me where I’m wrong.
On December 23rd 2009 Harry Reid passed a version of Obamacare through forced vote at 1:30am. The Senators could not leave, and for the two weeks previous were kept in a prolonged legislative session barred returning to their home-state constituencies. It was, by all measures and reality, a vicious display of forced ideological manipulation of the upper chamber. I share this reminder only to set the stage for what was to follow.
Riddled with anxiety we watched the Machiavellian manipulations unfold, seemingly unable to stop the visible usurpation. Desperate for a tool to stop the construct we found Scott Brown and rallied to deliver $7 million in funding, and a “Kennedy Seat” victory on January 19th 2010.
Unfortunately, the trickery of Majority Leader Harry Reid would not be deterred. Upon legislative return he stripped a House Budgetary bill, and replaced it with the Democrat Senate version of Obamacare through a process of “reconciliation”. Thereby avoiding the 3/5ths vote rule (60) and instead using only a simple majority, 51 votes.
Angered, we rallied to the next election (November 2010) and handed the usurping Democrats the single largest electoral defeat in the prior 100 years. The House returned to Republican control, and one-half of the needed Senate seats reversed. Within the next two election cycles (’12 and ’14) we again removed the Democrats from control of the Senate.
Within each of those three elections we were told Repealing Obamacare would be job #1. It was not an optional part of our representative agreement to do otherwise.
From your own writing:
[…] If you want a really good sense of the damage Donald Trump is doing to conservatism, consider the fact that for the last five years no issue has united the Right more than opposition to Obamacare. Opposition to socialized medicine in general has been a core tenet of American conservatism from Day One. Yet, when Republicans were told that Donald Trump favors single-payer health care, support for single-payer health care jumped from 16 percent to 44 percent. (link)
With control of the House and Senate did Majority Leader Mitch McConnell or House Speaker John Boehner use the same level of severity expressed by Harry Reid to put a repeal bill on the desk of Obama for veto? Simply, NO.
Why not? According to you it’s the “core tenet of American conservatism”.
If for nothing but to accept and follow the will of the people. Despite the probability of an Obama veto, this was not a matter of option. While the method might have been “symbolic”, due to the almost guaranteed veto, it would have stood as a promise fulfilled.
Yet you speak of “core tenets” and question our “trust” of Donald Trump?
We are not blind to the maneuverings of the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and President Tom Donohue. We are fully aware the repeal vote did not take place because the U.S. CoC demanded the retention of Obamacare.
Leader McConnell followed the legislative priority of Tom Donohue as opposed to the will of the people. This was again exemplified with the passage of TPPA, another Republican construct which insured the Trans-Pacific Trade Deal could pass the Senate with 51 votes instead of 3/5ths.
We are not blind to the reality that when McConnell chooses to change the required voting threshold he is apt to do so. Not coincidentally, the TPP trade deal is another legislative priority of the U.S. Chamber of Commerce.
Yet you question the “trustworthiness” of Donald Trump’s conservatism?
Another bill, the Iran “agreement”, reportedly and conveniently not considered a “treaty”, again we are not blind. Nor are we blind to Republican Bob Corker’s amendment (Corker/Cardin Amendment) changing ratification to a 67-vote-threshold for denial, as opposed to a customary 67 vote threshold for passage. A profound difference.
Yet you question the “ideological conservative principle” of Donald Trump?
Perhaps your emphasis is on the wrong syllable. Perhaps you should be questioning the “ideological conservative principle” of Mitch McConnell, or Bob Corker; both of whom apparently working to deny the will of the electorate within the party they are supposed to represent. Of course, this would force you to face some uncomfortable realities. I digress.
Another example – How “conservative” is Lisa Murkowski?
A senator who can lose her Republican primary bid, yet run as a write-in candidate, and return to the Senate with full seniority and committee responsibilities?
Did Reince Preibus (then RNC Chair), or a republican member of leadership meet the returning Murkowski and demand a Pledge of Allegiance to the principles within the Republican party?
Yet you question the “allegiances” of Donald Trump?
Perhaps within your purity testing you need to forget minority leader Mitch McConnell working to re-elect Senator Thad Cochran, fundraising on his behalf in the spring/summer of 2014, even after Cochran lost the first Mississippi primary?
Perhaps you forget the NRSC spending money on racist attack ads? Perhaps you forget the GOP paying Democrats to vote in the second primary to defeat Republican Chris McDaniel. The “R” in NRSC is “Republican”.
Perhaps you forget. We do not.
Yet you question the “principle” of those who have had enough, and are willing to support candidate Donald Trump.
You describe yourself as filled with anxiety because such supporters do not pass some qualified “principle” test? Tell that to the majority of Republicans who supported Chris McDaniel and found their own party actively working against them.
Principle? You claim “character matters” as part of this consideration. Where is the “character” in the fact-based exhibitions outlined above?
Remember Virginia 2012, 2013? When the conservative principle-driven electorate changed the method of candidate selection to a convention and removed the party stranglehold on their “chosen candidates”. Remember that? We do.
What did McConnell, the RNC and the GOP do in response with Ken Cuccinelli, they actively spited him and removed funding from his campaign. To teach us a lesson? Well it worked, we learned that lesson.
Representative David Brat was part of that lesson learned and answer delivered. Donald Trump is part of that lesson learned and answer forthcoming – yet you speak of “character”.
You speak of being concerned about Donald Trump’s hinted tax proposals. Well, who cut the tax rates on lower margins by 50% thereby removing any tax liability from the bottom 20% wage earners? While simultaneously expanding the role of government dependency programs?
That would be the GOP (“Bush Tax Cuts”)
What? How dare you argue against tax cuts, you say. The “Bush Tax Cuts” removed tax liability from the bottom 20 to 40% of income earners completely. Leaving the entirety of tax burden on the upper 60% wage earners. Currently, thanks to those cuts, 49% of tax filers pay ZERO federal income tax.
But long term it’s much worse. The “Bush Tax Cuts” were, in essence, created to stop the post 9/11/01 recession – and they contained a “sunset provision” which ended ten years later specifically because the tax cuts were unsustainable.
The expiration of the lower margin tax cuts then became an argument in the election cycle of 2012. And as usual, the GOP, McConnell and Boehner were insufferably inept during this process.
The GOP (2002) removed tax liability from the lower income levels, and President Obama then (2009) lowered the income threshold for economic subsidy (welfare, food stamps, ebt, medicaid, etc) this was brutally predictable.
This lower revenue higher spending approach means – lower tax revenues and increased pressure on the top tax rates (wage earners) with the increased demand for tax spending created within the welfare programs. Republicans focus on the “spending” without ever admitting they, not the Democrats, lowered rates and set themselves up to be played with the increased need for social program spending, simultaneously.
Is this reality/outcome not ultimately a “tax the rich” program?
As a consequence what’s the difference between the Republicans and Democrats on taxes?
All of a sudden Republicans are arguing to “broaden the tax base”. Meaning, reverse the tax cuts they created on the lower income filers? This is a conservative position now? A need to “tax the poor”? Nice of the Republicans to insure the Democrats have an atomic sledgehammer to use against them.
This is a winning strategy? This is the “conservatism” you are defending because you are worried about Donald Trump’s principles, character or trustworthiness.
Here’s a list of those modern conservative “small(er) government” principles:
• Did the GOP secure the border with control of the White House and Congress? NO.
• Did the GOP balance the budget with control of the White House and Congress? NO.
• Who gave us the TSA? The GOP
• Who gave us the Patriot Act? The GOP
• Who expanded Medicare to include prescription drug coverage? The GOP
• Who created the precursor of “Common Core” in “Race To the Top”? The GOP
• Who played the race card in Mississippi to re-elect Thad Cochran? The GOP
• Who paid Democrats to vote in the Mississippi primary? The GOP
• Who refused to support Ken Cuccinnelli in Virginia? The GOP
• Who supported Charlie Crist? The GOP
• Who supported Arlen Spector? The GOP
• Who supported Bob Bennett? The GOP
• Who worked against Marco Rubio? The GOP
• Who worked against Rand Paul? The GOP
• Who worked against Ted Cruz? The GOP
• Who worked against Mike Lee? The GOP
• Who worked against Jim DeMint? The GOP
• Who worked against Ronald Reagan? The GOP
• Who said “I think we are going to crush [the Tea Party] everywhere.”? The GOP (McConnell)
• Who worked against Donald Trump? The GOP
And, you wonder why we’re frustrated, desperate for a person who can actually articulate some kind of push-back? Mitch McConnell and John Boehner are what the GOP give us?
SERIOUSLY?
Which leads to the next of your GOP talking points. Where you opine on Fox:
“Politics is a game where you don’t get everything you want”
Fair enough. But considering we of questionable judgment have simply been demanding common sense, ie. fiscal discipline, a BUDGET would be nice.
The last federal budget was passed in September of 2007, and EVERY FLIPPING INSUFFERABLE YEAR we have to go through the predictable fiasco of a Government Shutdown Standoff and/or a Debt Ceiling increase specifically because there is NO BUDGET!
That’s a strategy?
That’s the GOP strategy? Essentially: Lets plan for an annual battle against articulate Democrats and Presidential charm, using a creepy guy who cries and another old mumbling fool who dodders, knowing full well the MSM is on the side of the other guy to begin with?
THAT’S YOUR GOP STRATEGY? Don’t tell me it’s not, because if it wasn’t there’d be something else being done – there isn’t.
And don’t think we don’t know the 2009 “stimulus” became embedded in the baseline of the federal spending, and absent of an actual budget it just gets spent and added to the deficit each year, every year. Yet this is somehow smaller fiscal government?
….And you’re worried about what Donald Trump might do?
Seriously?
The geometry of 3 does not work. The larger number of 4 makes it worse. If Government regulation kept donations and spending small and we had 6 or 7 parties, this would be better because the Party power is the greatest cause of political Evil we have.
Parties should be organized around a candidate for primaries and general elections, then end the day of Election or the day contested Elections end. Every Party would gather enthusiasm from the Ideas of a Candidate and not the sheeple instinct of Party dedications. So, a Person who had something to offer the People would gather a Party around to support that Person and then fade away forever or regroup if the Person ran again.
Trump and Biden would have their own Party for the Primaries and be on the same limiting financial footing as Tulsi or Yang or Cruz. The Primary would have many candidates and the General would have only 2. That would make it possible for Tulsi and Trump to have had a face off. No one could be ever trapped into supporting someone with a criminal background and brain fever again.
If you create a new conservative party with a new platform and sell it to the American people, you end up with 50 to 70 million patriots.
The remnants of the dnc, gop, rinos, anti-Trumpers will have to merge just to stay alive politically.
Some who might come crawling will be rejected. New blood will be preferred.
We will not need Mitch or Susan or Romney or their ilk. I am ready for 2022 primaries.
Yep – we need fresh blood – untainted by Swamp water.
One of the things that amazes me about Republican politicians is that they can’t think past the end of their nose. How hard is it to conclude that if 70-80 million Republicans voted for Trump, Then the election was stolen, and THEN the Republican Party failed to support him, that 70-80 million Trump voters might just follow him if Trump started the MAGA Party?
Well, you idiots, we ARE going to follow Trump because he’s the only one who kept his promises to us. You’re toast. Adios.
I like your idea; I was thinking of something similar. The DJT party would pop up, exist for 4-8 years, then be gone. The Cruz party might follow, or whatever. You’d have to figure out how to align down-ticket candidates given the periodic changes. It would be unlikely to have DJTINOS (in name only) because of the brevity of the party. But I like your idea too. Only individuals facing off in a primary, no party affiliation. Forces the people to pay attention and think. The top two would go to the general. Again, you would have to figure out down-ballot alignments, would there be a staggered primary?
Create a new conservative populist party and it will, in time, be co-opted by the same interests governing the GOP or relegated to the sidelines. Bet on it.
Sorry folks, but more of the same is not the solution.
Wrong. Led by Trump, it would not be co-opted. Or at the very least, it would not be co-opted as much as the GOP because Trump created a new model that was wildly successful.
I’m 100% with you Sundance. I love Dinesh and just bought another of his books, but I think he is wrong on this one. How can they not realize we only have one party right now?
Worried about Susan Collins. She can vote with our new party if she wants to and vote against if she doesn’t want to. The same thing she is doing right now to the GOP along with Murkowski, Romney, and others. And Dinesh needs to identify the elephant in the room (no pun intended) and take a hard look at the RNC and their actions and inactions. There are largely unknown big power brokers in the GOP (communications, etc) that have not served us well at all. It seems we had some very good up and coming youngsters in the ranks that didn’t get the RNC support that they should have leading up to the election.
I’m not saying that a new party would be an automatic success. Much care and thought should be taken to see that the National Committee remains devoted to the people and avoids being corrupted. Maybe there is some possibility of reform within the GOP but I just don’t see us getting rid of McConnell and the like from within.
I married a Democrat. He voted for Trump. Because he believes power and money corrupt and that the working man has been a tennis ball in a match between parties for 100 years.
A new party is a MUST! A clean new tent for the tennis ball – American citizen worker who just wants to raise a family and have dignity for earning an honest wage.
Thanks Sundance.
Like many here, I cannot stand the Uniparty. Time for patriotic citizens to band together to form a new party.
I find myself wondering what would happen if every Republican joined the Democrat party. Seems that would screw over everybody.
The dems don’t want them.
The Republicans in power probably mostly voted for Biden. They are too obvious in their avoidance of supporting the President in this fight to expose and defeat the fraud.
If Trump’s win doesn’t hold, I am cancelling my registration as a Republican.
I will be re-registering as independent, and if Trump makes a new party, I join it.
Simple.
It is LONG PAST TIME for the Republicans to become the new Fox News.
I’m with you. I’d vote gop in Ga if I were able but that is as far as I’d go if PDJT is cheated. Burn it down and start over.
I am 100% aligned with your thinking @Pascal20!!
Thank you. Have a great weekend.
I already planned on doing just that, and MANY people I know have said the same!
And I will be “reminding ” them on Jan 21st to do it if President Trump is not inaugurated.
I will be Independent voter.
Not a threat…but a promise!
you register to get raped again.
the vote was fake and will never be real again.
if POTUS doesnt win you have Cival war with POTUS and the last members of every agency and military fighting with him to save America.
There is no walking away from this… China is ready to strike.
The RNC still believes they can survive this, and old smilin’ cocaine mitch will be holding his hand out for more money in 2 years…you watch….we need a primary list for the next election…NOW….that includes senators and congressman….I recently unaffiliated myself with the republican party in all respects…the ‘local county’ republican party called me about the note I sent to them describing why I resigned from the party…I told them the same thing that is being discussed here,,,,they categorically represent their party now, not us, not the people. Told them I’ll never go back and they better figure out some better candidates….I will not vote for an R again unless they in alignment with the ‘people’ just like president Trump. But told them expect a movement to a new party…it is time. 80 million americans are going to demand it and choke off financial support for anybody with an R or D at the end of their last name,.
Speaking of new news, while we are developing this new party, why not reach out to the folks who could actually start a brand-new news network to replace the garbage we have been putting up with up to now.
Don’t get me wrong – Newsmax, OANN, and RealAmericasVoice have been doing a good job, but I believe a TRUMP PATRIOT NETWORK – home of the truth – would do a much better job and would be an instant success. I’m ready for “just the truth”!!!
I’m done with the GOP for showing no fight against the steal! Instead, they aided and abetted the steal!
I’m an independent, waiting for the American Party to form. MAGA!!
I like the constitutional party myself..or something similar…that document with the bill of rights is our mantra….
I gave up on the Republican party over twenty years ago, after watching the Oregon Republican Party put up softball candidate after softball candidate that the Eastern side of the state would never vote for.
I’ve spoken to various party officials on this side of the state (East of the Cascade Mountains), they feel like they’re being screwed by the main group over in the valley, they always putt Mitt Romney-style candidates up for governor, the Eastern Republicans always stay home from the polls, and then the candidates always lose.
I moved from Republican to Independent/Unaffiliated in 2017. I was fed up with the GOP. They didn’t support the Tea Party and let the Dems run circles around them. Every time I wrote Burr on issues, I got a letter back defending the status quo. Yes, I still wind up voting Republican but that’s another reason we need a MAGA/Patriot party. I’m with Sundance. When I think of all those conservatives attending Prresident Trump’s rallies, the car & boat parades, the DC marches, and the 73+million who voted for a man who fought for us, I know now is the time for a new party.
Both parties are working together to create an illusion of different political parties, in order to keep the dupes in one camp or the other
If the republicans keep the Senate, it’ll probably be because the democrats (and republicans) decided it’s best to keep up the illusion in order to keep the dupes in their camps, all the while knowing it makes no difference in the long run
Upsetting the balance of the “two camps keeps us in power” apple cart is not in their interest
There’s absolutely no gain in keeping the status quo. The end result will always be the same. The elites win and we lose, no matter how the pie is sliced
What we have now, republicans vs democrats, is nothing but a shell game, and until we add another shell to the mix, one that we the people control, we’ll continue losing
If we continue to play this game, nothing will change. The two party illusion will always have the winning hand
No GOP votes till the party becomes conservative in fact, not hype.
Boycotting elections in a massive public display, like the draft card burnings of the sixties will send a message.
The elections are fixed anyway according to uniparty strategies. And what good are token small ‘wins’ in the senate if society is systematically bring transformed into a globalist nightmare?
Revolutionary systemic change is needed, and it doesn’t come with minor tweaks to the status quo.
A massive purge of the GOP or a new party.
Apparently, history has taught you nothing.
Here’s my lengthy dissertation on the topic.
It is the party of We the People. RINOs shall leave the party. Bye, Bye!
We are changing to have a country class versus the elite class dynamic, like Angelo Codevilla has written about. Right now you have so many different people in the Republican party, because President Trump is talking about the forgotten man. The ideology and party loyalty is not emphasized. Those we elect to represent us, don’t, and *we the people* are going to correct that.
There is a strong conservative direction in what President Trump calls “our movement.” I think Americans have had their dance with the devil and figured out that the nuclear family is a remarkably good idea, and life is meaningless without God.
I think President Trump is the one to make the call as to whether there should be a new party, or just rejuvenate the Republican party. I like the meaning of the word, the reason the party formed, and the fact that we say “republic” whenever we say the pledge of allegiance.
Forming a new party and secession are both presented as ways to obtain justice. We aren’t getting justice right now, and something has got to give.
There are two things going on right now that prove how inadequate the current Republican party is. The first is of course the election steal. The second is the stimulus talks, and the obstruction put up by RINOs like McConnell and now Sen Johnson. President Trump wants $2000 checks, and understands that money will go right back into the economy to help our businesses. The RINOs seem committed to stopping stimulus, to the point where it looks like they are purposely trying to make the Republicans lose the Senate. Georgia voter fraud aside, it’s political suicide to hold up that aid while Georgia’s seats are at play, which I guess is the whole point of them doing this.
Yet both parties quickly agreed to back pay and future salaries for contractors not working for the Military Industrial Complex
No more compromising… Do or die.. there is no try..
I will say, give it a try, what do we have to lose?
Exact same thing Trump said to the minorities in the country prior to his election in 2016, what do you have to lose…..I’m in, both feet.
https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/republican-party-founded
we did it before, we can do it again.
I’m tired of holding my nose and voting for a democrat lite republican because the Demorat/communist would be infinitely worse. Although I think it would be easier to simply take over the GOP, I look forward to the Party of Trump/MAGA or whatever name is given to a party that truly supports and defends the Constitution as written.
I go where Trump goes, at this point.
Amen to that.
Sundance, you said all of that and SOLD me! Not mentioning once corruption or communism. Way to much corruption and so many Communist. Add that in and what do we have?
According to Albert Einstein, the definition of insanity is “doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”.
Reagan tried to take over/reform the Republican Party and failed. Oh, he got the large majority of the rank-and-file, but not the Republican political class, not for long.
Trump – same thing. See Georgia and note both Republican Senate candidates are old school / establishment, not Trumpers. See also the almost complete lack of support Trump is getting from the Republican political class on even something as righteous as opposing a massively dirty election.
A new party would absolutely split the Republican party. The question is where the split would occur. It would certainly get the top layer which may be 1000 party leaders nationwide. There may be another 10,000 that are the direct support for them in their offices and aides. Add in their families and you are up to maybe 100,000 Republicans. Below that are vast legions of conservatives that would have tried to move to higher office but were blocked by the old guard. These would be our new leaders and they would be young, energetic and hungry. The Republican machine in the states and counties would be all-in because they want to win.
When they threaten a split of the party, they are not talking about people. They are talking about money. The money would likely split at a very different place leaving a higher percentage of the money with the old guard. That money would no longer be spent at the top of the party and may very well chase Democrats. That is what they fear losing, the money that is spent to keep them at the top of the party.
So, of the roughly 80 million that voted for Trump, that leaves 79,900,000. I think we could make that work.
Isn’t the money already split? Miss LIndsey probably (I haven’t look up his campaign financial statements) got a lot of funding from the GOPe. Meanwhile MAGA Republican candidates did not . Most people I know contributed directly to a candidate’s fund, not to the GOP. Ask Ms Ronna why?
And if the money is split, the party is split. We need a full-on divorce.
Unfortunately, we don’t have the time. Even if elections were totally on the up and up, the old Rep party will run a candidate and there will be three choices. We would need to get as many old DEMs as we lost GOPe, and get 50+5 of independents. This might be possible over a decade if elections were not rigged.
Not punishing this election fraud (sanctioning those states with loss of electors), and criminal cases against various individuals and companies, all elections going forward will be rigged. The Dems will have absolute control.
Separate thought, maybe some GOP members had help too. Rigged for McConnell?
My suggestion is to take out the rino’s, uniparty leaders. Example the newly reelected Senators.
Recall them ASAP, have new elections ASAP. replace them with WHITE HATS. NO MONEY TO PARTY,ONLY TO PERSON RUNNING.
Great idea.
We don’t have time to waste! Recall is a way to change faces quicker!
I believe in working harder to primary these people out. Kind of like our own term limits. Get rid of people that are not working for us. Remember, these representatives get snagged up in the land of lobbying. That is the first problem we get with any of these elected fools. Then it is their own peer pressure. We need to clean up the flotsum.
The long term incumbents like Mitch McCorporatist have not gotten the majority of campaign money from ordinary voters for decades. They care not about us; they only feign concern during election year.
The evidence of this is really simple. Ignore what they say. Only watch what they actually do.
Sundance, if President Trump is sworn in again next month I am with you 100%.
If Biden is sworn in, a new party makes no difference, as votes can and will be changed to ensure a victory for the Uniparty candidate.
I’d offer up my life in a revolution before committing to anything electoral if it’s the latter scenario.
True. If a massively dirty election prevails, there will never be anything else.
All this talk is really a little premature.
If PT does not prevail… what happens next will quite likely not matter.
The only reason a new party would even be seriously considered is if President Trump is not sworn in on January 20th. That should not be an option in our minds. There is some level of “giving up” associated with this new party idea. And that is unacceptable to me. So what then? Our new party would have a new name and get frauded out of the presidency in 2024 again? What is the point of that? If Biden is sworn in, our country is toast. No discussion of some new party is going to change a damn thing at that point.
the president can leave the GOP in his next 4 years as president.
Whether we fight within the GOP or outside of it, any key to success will depend on a funding mechanism to support the candidates running under a MAGA label. The reason 3rd parties and primary challangers usually lose is because they get outspent 20 to 1.
My preference is for PDJT along with people we can trust to endorse MAGA candidates in the primaries and also enable them to draw from a well funded campaign structure. PDJT can create that apart from the sad sack WinRed money machine.
Just taking a look at the freshmen House and Senate members who won this November, there is a big contingent of MAGA people in that group. As long as we keep adding people like Tuberville to our team, I don’t really care so much how we do it, only that we don’t undercut that effort by becoming splintered.
Don’t really know about the freshmen yet do we?
Most of the new House members already signed a letter demanding that the House investigate what happened in this election. You should check out some of them. Very impressive bunch.
PDJT has only been at this for 4 years and has seen many good people take office during that time. Starting from scratch may not be the best option right now.
Agree. We simply don’t have time or resources to start another party.
That is a losing proposition. There is no need to do so.
President Trump already owns the GOP along with the Deplorables.
Let the scumbag RINOs start their own damn party from scratch.
President Trump does not own the GOP. That is the problem. Here in PA, the state TOO has been actively working against him.
State GOP, not “TOO”
That’s kind of a true/false statement. Yes, there are some in this state who are your quintessential RINO’s and are of no use, but there are also alot of state house and senate members who have been fighting the good fight since election day.
I just noticed that I can like posts now (didn’t use word press on the older site)! ?
It is critical to find and develop candidates who are ‘honest’, to build an organization.
But what ‘honest’ people would want to be politicians, now that the swamp is totally corrupt. Obama’s predecessor senator from Illinois was so sickened by the corruption, that he refused to run again, opening up the slot eventually won by the ethically-challenged and anti-american obama.
It is going ‘uphill’ to try to replace crooked GOPe candidates.
Starting a new party could generate excitement and participation by people who are at least somewhat more honest and less-bribeable than the current GOPe. The current GOPe understudies are likely just as crooked.
A leader such as PDJT can generate a sense of purpose, and attract new talent. He needs to get better at character selection, which can be done to help him.
There are better ‘lie detectors’ now that can almost read words and thoughts. (“Do you take bribes”?…show them a picture of hillary and measure the electrical response…) The new party should test and certify candidates, and train them. AOC, remember, was selected as theatrical talent and trained by the leftist-antiamerican movement.
did POTUS resign?
none of people’s talking is making sense. –
if you are in a cold area – get a means to heat yourself, feed yourself…
There is no more parties as Sundance has said – We have China purchasing both parties turning them into the lips of their ASS.
its 1921 mf’s.. 03/17/17 We know.
by the way i found the thing Twitter defends from the republicans…
THIS!
https://4thamendmentrestored.com/
This site is still up, Share it
TheLastRefuge kept every old article link the same – so it all still redirects to theconservativetreehouse.
SPEND TIME EDUCATING DURING THESE FEW DAYS before POTUS steps out in front.
this is the time –
thelastrefuge has the means to make a knowledgetree now since they own the design of their site. Look at the 4th’s take it.
I agree with all your points about the sorry state of our corrupt two-party system, but have to ask: what good does a third party, even one backed by a majority of voters, do if the voting is not transparent?
Right. Nothing matters as long as our elections are rigged. If we can’t fix our elections, then it’s over.
If a new party is formed I vote to use Sundance’s lion as the new icon for the party, I love the lion that has been placed in many articles.
We need to control the GOP, not split it. The math of our voting system ensures that splitting our votes is a tactical mistake, we need to focus on primaries.
And we need to encourage the Democratic party to split. Point out their long history of racism and split off a Minority Party.
I’ve studied game theory. Splitting our votes leads nowhere. Alternative voting schemes don’t have this fault, but first past the post voting was analyzed long ago.
Further, I believe that a better strategy would be for PT, once he prevails, to go after and force accountability in terms of indictments and convictions.
As I’ve posted previously, the corruption will not stop without people going to jail. Period.
Most of all, I believe this will then attract more and better MAGA candidates… once they see that we are serious.
Then we primary out those insufferable RINO’s and affect leadership change.
Otherwise, I fear we will just manage to split the vote.
An, I respectfully disagree. I believe a new party is EXACTLY the answer – but to make it effective, we have to sell it. Get the truth out there about what the new party is and what its platform is! Educate the masses who are just like us: sick and tired of having to hold their nose and vote for the least of 2 evils and looking for candidates who are real patriots. I believe we already have 70 million plus who will join this new party, including indies and fed-up dems.
I also believe we need a uniform format for vetting our candidates – perhaps a list of questions for each candidate to answer IN WRITING, requiring a signature. Patriot groups in Colorado did this in 2010 – it was very effective. And now, we know a lot more about what to look for, what to ask, whose feet must be held to the fire and how to do it.
As soon as President Trump is inaugurated into his second term, he will have nothing to lose and I feel like after what he’s been through, he’d be all in on this. We can do this, people.
Spot on.
To this, I would add the. EPIC defeat of Eric Cantor during the Summer of Amnesty. Remember the GOP telling us it wasn’t about illegal immigration? That was the summer that Obama/Boehner unleashed hoards of illegals – mostly children – in a shameless attempt to blackmail the American people into Amnesty.
The GA runoff is pointless because THERE IS NO OPPOSITION PARTY ON THE BALLOT.
The Republican Party is dead. They just dont know it yet. Oh it’s still breathing and has a pulse….but it’s on life support. We’re not gonna be the stupid people anymore. Were done being like the little high school girl takin to the prom,screwed under the bleachers then left to walk home. 80 million of us dont need these frauds anymore. We are the Deplorables and thire asses are gonna get run over by the MAGA train.
“Ya see, Dinesh, there are some wranglers ya can draw down on, and some ya should just let pass by.
Now ya laying there on the gound with more holes in ya than a Dalton alibi.”
Well said. The GOP dug its own grave and it’s not coming back.
Name the last time you were inspired by anything a republican other than Reagan or Trump said.
I agree with D’Souza 1000%.
You cannot get ahead without moving forward. The Republican Party has dismantled itself and is mired in the past and how things worked with the establishment in the old days. Every man for himself and the voters be damned. Talk a great game, tell the people we have your back while behind the curtain be no different than our friends across the aisle. Whatever you do never support this man in the WH that the people elected because the voters are too stupid to know better and he is upsetting our apple cart. Let’s see what nefarious schemes we and our friends can come up with to get this situation righted and the man causing the chaos out of office. Who cares about the voters.
The repubs are doing nothing to save this country from the awfulness coming under a Dem controlled, illegally won election. They are punting in every direction while trying to keep their cushy spot at the public DC trough. This has gone on long enough.
Time for major changes and a new American, Patriot run political party is needed. imo. Get rid of all of the pretenders and traitors of the people on the Republican side and crush the Dems while doing it. We cannot trust our votes to do it under current party lines as we’ve been shown by this 2020 fraud of an election. We must rise up and create a new party that will be so strong in numbers, leaders and legal votes that it will change the govt. and get our country back. The time is right for a complete change in political practices and party rule. Imo.
The only problem I see with a new party is . . .
How to prevent it from being OWNED by the SAME big money globalists?
We will need a coalition of nationalist billionaires and millions of devoted small contributors.
It is possible . . .
Well written! There is only one party in DC, the Corrupt Party. They’re freaking out because they hear the rumblings of 80 million people talking about starting a new party. And it’s exactly what we need. Force all those RINOs/GOPe to join their brethren in the Democrat Party. It’s exactly what McConnell fears regarding the objections he doesn’t want to hear.
#ThePatriotParty
#AmericaFirst
“The history of the present [Republican party] is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.”
While I stated in a post previously that we need a new party due to the two party illusion which keeps the elites in power, the thing is, we need it now. We need an organized effort to bring the power of the 70–80 million votes to the table pronto
Yes, that many voters would be a stunning political juggernaut, with the power to truly change the political dynamic, but it’s needed before the traitors install their tyrannical power over the Constitution and the law as intended
Look what they’ve been able to accomplish already. The judicial system, including SCOTUS, along with law enforcement, has simply disregarded the Constitution and the law to create their own law unto themselves
Election fraud, the Constitution and the law are simply dismissed with no recourse
If, God forbid, the Biden / Deep State / Globalist cabal takes over, we have four short years to put it all together, and we’d better have it together, otherwise, the scum will have a system in place where freedom and liberty will never be able to rise again
Political parties are irrelevant now. The energy should be focused on summarizing, proving, and rejecting the election fraud, preventing a Biden administration. There is no cost too high for this. Too many institutions need to go.
There is no budget because there cannot be a budget. A budget assumes the ability to prioritize and make decisions. That ability simply doesn’t exist.
We are in a blow off phase where those who have power allocate money as they wish and the money is created out of nothing by the fed and pushed into the system.
They don’t even need to tax anymore, since they are simply making the money up out of nothing. The tax system remains only to regulate behavior and keep the power structure.
This will end in hyper-inflation, when all the made up money, which is no better than Monopoly money or Disneyland tokens, filters into the mainstream economy. Currently it is bouncing around the banking system,stock market, and tech oligarchs, who have seen the cost of private jets vault 40% in the last year.
Worrying about political parties and “budgets” is rearranging the deck furniture on the Titanic .. when its already 2/3 underwater. Totally irrelevant.
rharknonen: I agree with you. Without a country and an economy based on creation of real wealth, not just stock portfolios, parties won’t matter.
I miss the “Like” button under the individual posts. So here goes:
LIKE!
there is s ‘thumbs up’ button. press it.
With 212Million registered voters and 66.2% voting,140.344 M voted. Now if Trump got 74 M, that leaves only 66.344 M for Biden. These numbers don’t add up to what we are being told. Lies and more Lies! – Bill Binney
I left the repub party years ago and started voting for constitutional candidates, or if a real conservative repub ran, I would vote for them…and i still do on the state level. The repub party is in a self induced death spiral, and for what reasons are anyones guess (any ideas?). It appears that they will lose the senate while the buffet queen abrams is running circles around them unless there was some deal made to give the senate to the turtle in exchange for biden.
But Im game for any new party as long as it means the end to the corrupt repubs, or at least an ineffective repub party. The BIG question is: how you attract the uninformed conservatives who still cling to the (R), but also voted for President Trump? The folks who cling to FOX snews, and dont have a clue about evidence of election fraud? The ones that would get angry if, well at least in my case, you were to say bad things about liz cheney? I dont think it will happen overnight, but it needs to happen.
Anyone that missed this press conference 3 days ago missed these firebrand and their threats to the GOP and is akin to what is being discussed on this thread.
Enjoy this press conference it’s awesome!!! “There are billionaire ready back MAGA candidates & to primary,,,we will get rid of you…
I had to search for this video youtube took it down but I found it on bitchute…YEAH. because I wanted to watch it again,
Sorry, Video did not link
here is the website info: http://www.bitchute.com/Trump-electors-stop-the-steal-coalition-hold-press-conference-on-capitol-hill
https://www.bitchute.com/video/jBG1iHYUJ75B/
Page not found.
just click on the bottom link
Wow…..what an eye-opening post when you see all the “deception” lined up in a row.
An excellent job.
Yes, the old conservative GOP is long gone. We should BURY the last of them and speak the name no more.
MAGA, TRUMP, PATRIOTS, LIBERTY, AMERICA FIRST – call it what you want.
“Lets Roll!”
I’ve always thought (well, since beginnings of Tea Party @ 2007) that the UniParty should just join up together officially.
They can call themselves Dem or Repub., I don’t care.
The 2nd Party would then be MAGA/Tea Party based. And I’d be more than happy to have the handful of real MAGA/Tea Party Repubs join with us in our new Party.
Actually, even the bernie-bros have more in common with an anti-crooked-establishment MAGA party than the dems.
Offer bernie a house on the beach somewhere, and a position to participate in prosecution of google/facebook/amazon/microsoft for being monopoly billionaire 0.0001%
Third party will go nowhere for two reasons:
Any vehicle that attracts voters attracts the professional political class. They will find a way in. Think Fox News 15 years ago and today.
Second, the third party will need money. Lots of it. When they solicit donations from us, we will make a show of patting our pockets like we do to panhandlers before we tell them we’re all out.
If we can’t create competing media, social media, educational institutions or entertainment industries then a political party is extremely unlikely.
No choice. We will make it work or die trying.
Eric please keep posting and reminding these people.
they are in a pedophile relationship! they think they can change the person, make it work.
you are SELECTED TO BE SNUFFED from the timeline of humanity – You either fight now , legally, for yourself and your country – or you are just a FOOL marked for death Crispin.
Dinesh thinks the Democrats/Deep State with control of government will allow the GOP to exist. If President Trump is not sworn in for a second term this coming January 20th, he will be drawn and quartered like William Wallace at the end of Braveheart. Then they come for us.
Their Chinese Communist puppet masters have already “COME FOR US”.
THE CHINESE WUHAN KUNG-FLU. Us…our allies…and the rest of the world for that matter.
DEPLORABLE JEDI.
Trump needs to seize power militarily. That’s all that matters.
I liken the GOP to my ex-wife not a battered one…….a painful memory, costly to get rid of, takes everything when she goes and leaves a bad taste in one’s mouth.
AMERICA FIRST
I may not be as smart as some of you here, and I have been lurking for years, soaking up everything. What makes any of you think there will EVER be a free and fair election again? I and my family and friends and many just like me will NEVER, and I mean NEVER EVER vote republican again. Not one more penny will be spent supporting republicans. They don’t share my concerns, value and direction. They have worked against us for far too long. I will only vote for constitutionalists that want to make America great. I held my nose and voted for Jim Inhoff and he turned right around and worked against removing section 230 protections. I’m sick and tired of being censored. Covid seems like nothing more than a way to steal the election and oppress the people. I work in the medical field. The numbers are completely inaccurate. And now W.H.O. has combined pneumonia, influenza and COVID into one diagnosis. The numbers are so skewed things will never give us the really true statistics. It has all been by design to oppress and control and steal from the people. And the fact that we have been infiltrated by Chi-na at every turn only makes things worse. I just do not see millions of people like me kneeling to the party of those that have beat us down to the point of severe resistance. We are no longer loyal to that and as someone has already said, WE HAVE NOTHING TO LOSE! We will not be beat down any longer. RINOs and establishment Republicans are like Fox News. We’re done with that. I liberated myself from Direct TV on November 4th. It was Independence Day for me.
My wife and I are done with the GOP. Done.
We joined our GOP county committee. We volunteered to work on election days to hand out sample ballots and be poll watchers. We have donated a lot of money. We have knocked on doors.
We’re done.
America First or bust.
I also bought a new carbine today and my son is look at AR-15s.
Sundance:
I disagree. I’ve been down that road. It is a dead end.
It is simple math. If we attempt to reform the Republican Party, we only need to take 51% of the seats or approximately 25% of the US electorate. If you form a third Party, you have to win 51% of the entire US electorate. This is twice as hard to do.
The hard truth is the middle class does not donate enough money. How many Treepers, if we knew their true names, would be listed on Open Secrets. Campaigns take money, and politicians go to the Chamber of Commerce to get it. They have few other options.
President Trump was our big chance, but he had major flaws. His appointments were dismal. He did not use all the power we voted him. Don’t get me wrong, he is the best president I’ve ever seen, but when you take on the mainstream media, the New World Order, and the deep state, you have to throw some major leather. He did not land enough punches. He needed to land haymakers.
He needed political knife fighters like Bannon, Miller, Lewandowski, Sidney Powell, General Flynn, et. al. He listened to Ivanka, Jared, and Pence. Personnel is policy.
While we were busy working at the top, the Georgia, Pennsylvania, Arizona, and Wisconsin RINOs were beavering away changing their state’s election laws. They undercut us.
The best place we can put our efforts is at the state legislature level. State by state we must fix the election laws to remove mail-in ballots, eliminate government (Democrat) workers counting the ballots, institute a system where only the top two vote getters advance to the General with no write-ins. President Trump lost this election because the Libertarian cost him Arizona, Wisconsin, and Georgia. Working at the state level is much less expensive. Let’s pick a state, and take out as many RINOs state legislators as possible. I would suggest Georgia or Pennsylvania.
Another place to get a lot of bang for the buck is to clean up the voter rolls. This is accomplished by True the Vote, and pushing County Clerks to mail out postcards to inactive voters.
I’m sure Mitch and the RNC will go along with all of that.
They just need it explained to them.
At this point if the Communist gain control we won’t ever have another election, Its that bad. I still believe President Trump will prevail one way or another.
I could get behind a new party. However, what GEOTUS did was what is called, in the business world, a hostile takeover of the party. It’s his (and ours) now. I say kick the RINOSs out. Make them create a new party if they aren’t going to support the wishes of the plebes.Stick a spear in the sand at their feet and look them in the eye.
BAH! Do that and they’ll just revert to the Dhim party, that’s where they belong anyway.
Democrat Lite = most Republicans
AGREE!
Regarding a new party – totally needed. It won’t split the GOP — the GOP has been split all along – either you’re with Trump as President or you were not. So – a new Trump party will take all those who voted for him – he carried the “down ballot” to success and that’s a confirmation of his following. I for one, who have voted Republican since Nixon vs. JFK would immediately join Trump’s party. Regarding Trump prevailing at this time — I put my trust in God — Luke 18:27… “The things which are impossible with men are possible with God.” One way or another, if God is willing – Trump will prevail.
Can’t split dead wood.
Now since you wrote:” I still believe President Trump will prevail one way or another.”
I think this might be appropriate:
Here is the article referenced in the video; keep it in a safe place for easy reference:
https://libertyunyielding.com/2020/12/04/in-trumps-campaign-to-save-the-republic-we-havent-seen-the-key-supporting-effort-yet/
Thank God for a familiar name and voice, abigailstraight. Since the platform change the names are unfamiliar and the level of awareness has bottomed out. This link you give to the video and especially to the article may bring us back. Thank you.
I miss Carlos Osweda…A LOT.
No Trump no GOP for me.
Trump is the only one that can make me stay and vote for RINOs. Because he will need the Senate and House. No choice but to vote for them if we get 4 more years.
But if they don’t fight and help us keep the WH they can go to hell. I will devote my life to destroy the GOP.
80 million americans will not allow that without a fight I’m afraid….