No, Waiting for ObamaCare to Implode is Not an Option Either…

As more people begin seeing through the fog of political “talking points”, the next response from those suffering from battered conservative syndrome is to say: well, do nothing, and allow ObamaCare to simply self-destruct.

Unfortunately, this is not an option.  At least it’s not a reasonable option.  To understand how battered conservatives are being lead around, used and abused, it is very important to understand the abusers.  There are many.

Last week Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin informed congress it will soon be necessary to raise the debt ceiling.   Immediately, crony-constitutional conservative types, like many who assemble in the House Freedom Caucus, shouted “no way”; apparently, according to their pearl-clutching political position – it unnerves their fiscally conservative sensibilities.


On October 21st, 2015, the Freedom Caucus itself backed Paul Ryan for Speaker of the House of Representatives. (LINK)  A week later, October 28th, 2015, members of the same Freedom Caucus voted to approve a $2+ trillion dollar Omnibus spending bill, a massive continuing resolution, and removed the debt ceiling restrictions (link).  Two days later, October 30th, 2015, at 3:00am in the morning, the Omnibus CR bill passed the Senate (link).

This was yet another year without a federal budget, and a specific decision to fund all of Obama’s spending priorities for 2015 and 2016. 

It has now been 9 years since a federal budget was signed into law; the last one was September 2007 (FY ’08) by George W. Bush.

The 2015 Omnibus spending bill, used in place of an actual budget, extended spending of all programs, all of Obama’s programs (, through April 1st of 2017.

President Trump’s budget proposal will not kick in until the beginning of fiscal year 2018 which begins on October 1st 2017.

That means there is a period from April 1st, 2017 until October 1st, 2017 without a financing mechanism.  Hence, Secretary Mnuchin tells congress they need to raise the debt ceiling April 1st, to cover their own previously authorized and approved federal spending…. which they voted to do on October 28th and 30th 2015.

This is not a RINO issue; this is not a RYAN issue; this is a republican congressional issue of their own creation.   President Trump didn’t have anything to do with their decision in 2015 to authorize two years of spending, essentially without limits.

They own that vote and that decision.  However, now those same voices claim it would be against their principles to vote for an increase in the debt ceiling that is fundamentally required because of their own previous decision.

See now, why their credibility is less than?

This is the mindset behind what I call the “Crony Constitutional” crowd.  Those who claim political fiscal purity and litmus tests, yet give a standing ovation to Speaker Paul Ryan at CPAC in February 2016, only three months after passing a two-year continuing resolution, $2+ trillion Omnibus spending bill and removing the debt ceiling.   clap-clap-clap.

clap-clap-clap “Muh Ted Cruz”, “#NeverTrump” clap-clap-clap

These are your abusers.

If you don’t recognize this behavior you are suffering from Battered Conservative Syndrome.

Now, lets move on to the Healthcare proposal known as RyanCare.  Yes, it sucks.  Quite a bit of it sucks.  However, the Muh Freedom Caucus voted for Speaker Ryan to lead the House of Representatives (Again – Link).  So, don’t allow them to play mental gymnastics with you.

Additionally, many in the House Freedom Caucus are now complaining that RyanCare’s tax credits are a new entitlement.  However, two years ago, 13 of the Freedom Caucus’s members, including chairman Mark Meadows,  co-sponsored an ObamaCare repeal-and-replace bill offered by then Representative Tom Price.  That Freedom Caucus legislation included… wait for it….. yup, refundable tax credits.   Go figure.

These are your abusers.

Two years later, Representative Tom Price is now HHS Secretary Tom Price, and has created the road-map with the three step plan to get the best possible financial solution through both the House and Senate.

It contains an almost identical framework to the prior proposals which were in the repeal-and-replace bills.  Heck, it should – Price built the plan.  Just ask President Ted Cruz, or President Rand Paul, or President Marco Rubio; no, wha, huh… wait. What?

As the fog is removed from the “talking points”.  People begin to shake off the battered conservative syndrome and realize that all plans are moot if nothing is passed through both the House and Senate.  There are only about 30 to 40 Senators willing to vote for a repeal bill.  Teeth gnashing, shouting into the radio microphone, railing against the system etc. doesn’t change that.

However, unable to fully shake years of structural dependency on their talking point abusers, many people shifted toward the nihilist position that if ObamaCare cannot just simply be repealed outright, it should be allowed to simply collapse in the death spiral which has already begun.

Fair enough.  That is an actual plan that can work.  However,….

Setting aside the probable chaos being attributed to, well, you know – blamed on, the people who are in charge while the chaos rains down upon the electorate….

Setting that aside, how is President Trump going to present a priority budget when the massive ongoing costs of ObamaCare are now unresolved.  The budget, while unfamiliar to 2/3rds of congress who have never been a representative when a budget actually existed, is necessarily dependent on solving the financial issues inherent within ObamaCare.

The Budget is intertwined with ObamaCare.  Letting ObamaCare spiral until it self-detonates on the country (and the budget) isn’t, or at least shouldn’t be, an option.

Budgetary priorities like rebuilding the military, or building a Southern Border Wall, are dependent on actually having a budget.  But there’s also something more, something 99.99% of the voting population have no idea about

Remember, two really important points:

♦ #1 Over two-thirds of current Republican representatives in the house and senate have never been in office a single year with a federal budget.

♦ #2 And, most importantly, thanks to the absence of a federal budget, ObamaCare has used extra-budgetary fraudulent financing to exist –SEE HERE– It’s too complex to explain in a single outline, but follow THIS LINK and you’ll understand.

Now President Trump has to present the first federal budget in a decade and simultaneously overcome the issues from how President Obama and the HHS secretly funded it.  Yeah, it’s a mess.

Then you move on to tax reform.

President Trump’s tax reform agenda is directly related to continuing the America-First pro-growth, pro-middle-class, economic expansion.   The repatriation of trillions of off-shore revenues, the infrastructure growth and rebuilding, and the economic nationalism needed to reignite our national economic engine needs the tax reform as a key element in jump-starting the policy and initiatives.

The Tax reform, just like the federal budget, is intertwined with ObamaCare reform.  Letting ObamaCare spiral for two to three years until it finally self-detonates on the country isn’t, or at least shouldn’t be, an option.

President Trump is President Trump because he is uniquely skilled at this moment in time to confront all of the large, dynamic and structural issues that have undermined the United States for more than three decades.

If we want to see all of the benefits from a practical non-politician tearing into the swamp, we damned sure should be providing President Trump with the tools he says he needs to do the job we have hired him to do.

Specifically because the Healthcare plan needs to pass through the Senate’s reconciliation process, it cannot do everything.   President Trump’s HHS Secretary Tom Price, said that ObamaCare gives him power to write 1,440 rules and he will use that specific power to provide regulatory relief and bend health care in a consumer-centered, market-driven direction.  Why can we not just support that intention and then hold them accountable for it.

President Trump, the man we just elected to drain the swamp, supports the three step approach….  Secretary Price, the author of the prior repeal bills, supports the three step approach.  Speaker Ryan, the leader the House Freedom Caucus chose as their House Leader, supports the three step approach….

Shouldn’t we?

This entry was posted in Big Government, Big Stupid Government, Budget, Economy, Legislation, media bias, Mike pence, Mitch McConnell, Notorious Liars, Obamacare, Paul Ryan, President Trump, Professional Idiots, propaganda, Uncategorized. Bookmark the permalink.

253 Responses to No, Waiting for ObamaCare to Implode is Not an Option Either…

  1. MVW says:

    4) After 2018 landslide election finish the rough edges on the health bill.


  2. Keln says:

    Well, here is my appeal to those who seem stuck on opposing WeaselCare because they can’t see a few steps ahead. I could be wrong, but this all makes sense to me.

    Liked by 3 people

  3. Timmy-the-Ute says:

    Ryan has consistently shown he is not up to the job as speaker. He will be out of the job soon.


  4. CleanhouseinDC says:

    “Why can we not just support that intention and then hold them accountable for it.”

    We have supported the Repubs “intention”, with no results for so long, that we have no reason to believe the future plans. Just because Trump indicates something, as we’ve seen, few in the incumbent hacks (GOPe, deep state, bureaucrats, press etc.) support him directly. The incumbent GOPe leadership has worked against us for ages. If i don’t believe that GOPe leadership is working with Trump in good faith, then why would I ever believe this phased approach can work. I learned in business a long time ago that you get what you need up front… it’s the only way to ensure you get what you need.

    How exactly do we hold them accountable? Don’t vote for them? We see how well that worked with Ryan last election. They have no accountability, and they won’t take any. Trump and his inner circle are only a few fighting against many, and our govern,ent isn’t afraid of us. If we dont get it now, I don’t believe we’ll get it at all.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Marc says:

      Never seen your Username here until now. Hmm…

      Liked by 1 person

    • diddle40 says:

      Nah….there is always hope! Trump is pushing a steam roller uphill. Just wish he wouldn’t sound like a politician telling people if they didnt vote for it, they get primaried.


    • The Demon Slick says:

      Ding ding ding ding ding! I’m with you. My spider sense is tingling. The CoC wants this thing badly. Their interests and mine are rarely the same. And if Ryan told me water was wet I’d go to the sink and check.


  5. WallyWorld says:

    Still accepting the false premise of the debate.
    Repeat after me:
    – No Republicans voted for Obamacare.
    – Republicans were shut-out of the process.
    – Waivers and extensions were granted to left-wing groups.

    If Obama can issue all those waivers willy nilly to all his pals, what is to stop Trump doing this, “I hereby grant waivers to all LEGAL AMERICANS exempting them from ObamaCare

    Liked by 3 people

  6. bulwarker says:

    “Setting aside the probable chaos being attributed to, well, you know – blamed on, the people who are in charge while the chaos rains down upon the electorate….”

    Thats a matter of messaging. For the sake of argument if Trump wants a full repeal and replacement but can’t get it because Democrats filibuster than it stays the way it is. Obamacare collapses but its not for lack of Trump trying to fix it, as he’d say ‘Obamacare is working as intended and screwing over the people.’ If the people want a change they need to vote out their democrat congressmen.

    “Setting that aside, how is President Trump going to present a priority budget when the massive ongoing costs of ObamaCare are now unresolved.”

    The president’s budget is ‘basically advisory, indicating where the president thinks Congress should focus its spending. Not that it really matters. Lawmakers can — and do — ignore the president’s budget.’
    The house and senate make their own budgets (resolutions). Obamacare was their mess, let them figure out how to rig the numbers to account for ACA spending.
    In fact, this conversation about other options is really just an exercise in futility because the republicans already put through their resolution which is why they are stuck trying to fix Obamacare in 2017 instead of working on tax reform first:
    ‘As soon as Republicans passed a budget resolution in January that included reconciliation instructions related to Obamacare, they were locked into this window.
    As it stands, Hill leaders are doing Obamcare repeal-plus under the fiscal year 2017 budget window. So long as they want to pass this proposal only needing 51 votes in the Senate, they must do Obamacare repeal now.’

    “Budgetary priorities like rebuilding the military, or building a Southern Border Wall, are dependent on actually having a budget.”

    Or a continuing resolution, the wall can come from other revenue adding measures, my point is there were options available that the government has used before. There is a reason the government didnt shut down because Obama/Congress didnt pass a budget…

    “The Tax reform, just like the federal budget, is intertwined with ObamaCare reform. Letting ObamaCare spiral for two to three years until it finally self-detonates on the country isn’t, or at least shouldn’t be, an option.”

    I dont buy that. If they decided to let Obamacare fail and instead pursued tax reform, pressuring the democrats in vulnerable states to get 60+ votes, there was a chance to pass clean reform that could’ve ameliorated some healthcare costs in the interim – offset by tax returns and a friendlier environment for American business.
    But because Congress already set its resolution, to deal with Obamacare and Tax reform through reconciliation in that order, they are now intertwined.

    I get it, its hard making decisions when you know people will suffer regardless of whether you do something or not. I dont envy the president and trust him if this is his way forward. But there were other options prior to congress locking in their resolution. I don’t think any of the options are “good” but there was a choice. The GOP made up their minds and are doing option 2, now it comes down to who can marshal the right numbers to get 51 votes and what will be given up to get it. That is why I think we’ve seen/heard the charm offensive with Pence, Ryan, Paul, Brat, etc all hitting the pavement/air waves trying to garner support for their side while putting out half-truths and spin.
    Sad, I wish they’d figured this out ahead of time, but then again, that’s not how they’ve operated for over a decade.


  7. The Devilbat says:

    The president should go on TV during prime time and tell the American people that the democrats are refusing to vote to kill off the train wreck known as Obamacare. He should publicly name them all and ask their constituents to seriously voice their anger.

    Being politicians the majority of these party line democrat snakes will all bend to the will of the people so as to get their skanky asses reelected. They will vote Obamacare down.

    I believe that the situation could be changed simply by letting the people know exactly what is going on. Trump got himself elected by showing the American people what was going on in Washington so why not keep them informed and allow them to help him drain the swamp?
    Why not let the American people join in the fight? Make them part of taking their country back.

    Liked by 4 people

  8. Paul Killinger says:

    I’m sorry, but I don’t understand the problem here…

    Our President is simply asking us to support a piece of legislation that he believes will help us achieve our goal of Making America Great Again.

    Now let’s take a look at its detractors within the GOP Congress- Which ones in the House supported his candidacy? And how many of those in the Senate actually RAN AGAINST HIM?

    This bill is being sold as a “three step process.” But actually it’s a good deal more than that. It’s only one of the opening moves in our President’s much larger chess game to Make America Great Again.

    So you can take his word that he needs this chess piece moved or not. Just keep in mind overall our goal is “WINNING!”

    Liked by 2 people

  9. dstarke says:

    “On October 21st, 2015, the Freedom Caucus backed Paul Ryan for Speaker of the House of Representatives. A week later, October 28th, 2015, the same Freedom Caucus voted to approve a $2+ trillion dollar Omnibus spending bill, a massive continuing resolution, and removed the debt ceiling restrictions (link). Two days later, October 30th, 2015, at 3:00am in the morning, the Omnibus CR bill passed the Senate (link).”

    So you are saying that since even the Freedom Caucus members were, in the past, spineless jellyfish, we should want them to remain consistent and roll over again? Untangling O’care from the budget of the US is a “good thing”TM and should be done (now that the GOPe has taken straight repeal off the table) so that the illegality of its funding CAN BE STOPPED (removed from the budget), without any legislation at all. Otherwise, the budget is a sham and no better than a continuing resolution.

    Congressional Republicans, it’s past time for you to stand up, get to work
    and pass a budget with no “illegal funding” of any part of government. Pass a budget that reflects the priorities of your President and the millions of people who elected him. Live within your means and if you have overspent our tax dollars, CUT THE PROGRAMS, don’t raise the ceiling.


    • Paul Killinger says:

      It is not “illegal” for our Congress to engage in deficit spending. If it were, we’d have to go back and indict Presidents Lincoln and Reagan.

      And to those who oppose our Govt temporarily increasing its deficit, you can forget about this President having any chance of MAGA!

      Liked by 2 people

    • nhgardengram says:

      destarke, AND we will be watching who passes Trump’s budget and who doesn’t. Those who DON’T and are up for re-election in 2018, 2020, will be on a list that CTH bloggers will distribute and try to get them out of office. We are big and growing; let’s use our combined ‘we the people’ power to help Trump. Are we on board?

      Liked by 2 people

  10. Paul Killinger says:

    When the Senate Democrats passed Obamacare, it only happened because a number of their members were willing to “Walk the plank.”

    Tbe only place the GOP Senators now opposed to reforming it are willing to walk to is THE BANK!


  11. Mike says:

    Let it die.
    Don’t permanently attach this Presidents name to another hokey boondoggle. President Trump is too smart for this.


  12. ” President Trump’s HHS Secretary Tom Price, said that ObamaCare gives him power to write 1,440 rules and he will use that specific power to provide regulatory relief and bend health care in a consumer-centered, market-driven direction.”
    Secretary Price is probably a very busy person right now, preparing to release these new rules. Bet the democrats never thought that part of O-Care could be leveraged against their wishes.

    Liked by 1 person

  13. The Demon Slick says:

    I think that one thing many people overlook is that Obamacare has spawned all kinds of regulations, and the only way to ensure that 100% of those regulations are gone is a complete repeal. Otherwise they need to be specifically targeted and dug out.


  14. Mickey Wasp says:

    Investors Unite is a diverse group of individuals from around the country. We seek to educate and mobilize in an effort to regain our investments in the GSEs that are currently being illegally confiscated by the Federal Treasury.
    Follow Sundance’s link above … if one wants to fully understand “the mess” …

    Did the Obama Administration Use Fannie and Freddie Funds to Bail Out Obamacare?
    “jaw-dropping prospect that the Obama Admin illegally siphoned Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac’s profits to pay for provisions of the ACA that Congress chose not to fund.
    “Dr. Jerome Corsi, published stories this week that draw on documents posted on as well as previously undisclosed documents that put the Obama Admin’s plan to “wind down” Fannie and Freddie in an even more unfavorable light. Corsi chronicles Oval Office meetings and internal communications that reinforce what has long been apparent to anyone who has followed Fannie and Freddie’s captivity in the government-induced conservatorship.”

    Jerome Corsi ~ MARCH 7, 2017
    WASHINGTON, D.C. – “leaked documents from the Obama Treasury dept now prove the Obama Admin started planning in 2010 to eliminate home ownership as a pillar of the American Dream.
    The paltry 53 documents (of the 11,000 still under Obama administration seal) that Judge Margaret M. Sweeney of the US Court of Federal Claims in Wash DC made public last October were more than enough to prove the Obama administration forced the government’s two giant mortgage Government Sponsored Entities (GSE) to fail.”

    As citizens of the United States, we expect our government to be transparent in its actions, especially as they relate to the handling of private property and individuals’ rights. It is in the Bill of Rights. The Federal Gov’t has gone to great lengths to withhold information on its rationale for enacting the “Sweep” of the profits of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Shareholders of these privately-owned entities who are directly affected by this decision deserve to know why and how it happened. Every American has a stake in challenging the United States Government’s lack transparency and vigorous attempts to hide how it conducted the people’s business.

    ** As Sheriff Clarke rebuked ‘the swamp’ – get your torches lit and pitchforks sharpened. **
    Thieves – they are ALL thieves.

    Liked by 1 person

  15. tax2much says:

    Obamacare was and is nothing more than the Democrats plan to expand health coverage to their plantation residents of illegals, welfare queens and millennials living in Mom’s basement.

    They could only pay for this by stripping the working folks of their health coverage and making them pay more in taxes because we all had too much white privilege anyway.

    No republicans voted for this because they didn’t have to. It was the uniparty’s method to ensure that there was an opposition in name only.

    Now, the proposals are to expand the Medicaid portion to an even greater number of folks to gain the Democrats’ support. This is just the flip side of the uniparty coin.

    Ultimately, you will be sitting in the ER waiting room for the 7th hour and watching ambulance crews, police units, doctors, nurses and hospital personnel rushing around to save a gang banger who got shot in a botched drug deal while his baby mama socks a big wad of cash in her purse and pulls out his Medicaid card for his free treatment while you hope and pray that those chest pains you are experiencing are nothing more than the spicy burrito you had for lunch and the stress of knowing that you will soon be dealing with a debt recovery company for the $2,000 that your high deductible policy did not cover for your ER visit.


  16. Mac says:

    For some reason people are totally invested in enacting legislation which will in NO WAY solve the healthcare cost problem. First it was the bogus 3 phase argument. Unfortunately, the current AHCA bill would actually acerbate the situation by again increasing government funding of healthcare. It would maintain a “subsidy” system and maintain high levels of federal funding for expanded Medicaid all while doing nothing to address the chief cause of healthcare cost increases, government insurance programs. Now are told that we have to pass this legislation so that Trump can provide a budget. PLEASE. As I noted before, this bill does not decrease government spending on healthcare at all, it actually expands it. All it does is reduce the amount of government income. And, if nothing is done, then there is no affect on the budget.

    Since the late 1960s, medical costs have been rising at several times the rate of inflation. This was caused by guaranteed, government third party payer programs. First it was Medicare. Then it was Medicaid. Medical costs rose to the point where the average person needed insurance to afford healthcare. Then, as medical costs continued to increase, the insurance premiums got to be so expensive that the consumer needed a government subsidy to afford the insurance. That is the point that we are at now. There are only two ways to fix this problem. One is to nationalize healthcare and institute government price controls. The other is for the government to get out of the health insurance business altogether. Both are going to be painful for citizens.

    This bill would only give the appearance that something was being done to alleviate the problem, but all it would do is buy time without fixing anything. What could be done, today, is to cap the spending for Medicare at the existing level. Roll back Medicaid enrollment standards to pre-2010 levels, thereby restricting it to those with real need. As the demand for medical services declines, the charges for medical services will also decline, to make them affordable to the population. This will cause the insurance premiums to fall as well. It will be painful, but no matter what is done, conditions are going to become painful for some people. There is simply no way around it.

    So, nationalize healthcare and enact price controls. Or reduce government involvement in healthcare, including health insurance, and allow the market to adjust on its own. Your choice.


    • jeans2nd says:

      One does not need to enact price controls. One only need negotiate costs down with the pharm companies.

      As more people obtain work through the economy improving, more people will be able to afford paying for their own healthcare/insurance, either through their employer, health savings accounts, purchasing healthcare/insurance across state lines, or joining a group that collectively bargains for healthcare/insurance.

      You are assuming the old rules still apply. The old rules no longer apply.

      Liked by 1 person

  17. Laura says:

    Would someone PLEASE explain the rationale for doing healthcare in three stages?


    • Charles says:

      Because by stage 2 the people have figured out that stage 1 was a fraud, hence stage 3 begins another multi-stage kabuki theater legislative fix.

      lather, rinse, repeat.


    • jeans2nd says:

      A complete repeal bill cannot be passed in the Senate because a complete repeal bill would require 60 votes in the Senate.

      Step 1, a budget reconcilation bill in the Senate, would only require 51 votes in the Senate, which could be attained by negotiating with some Dem Senators.

      Meanwhile, HHS Sec Price starts Step 2, which is de-constructioning the massive regulations currently in existance with Obamacare, and continues after Step 1 is complete.

      Step 3 is cleanup, passing legislation which HHS Sec Price had enacted by the new regulations HHS Sec Price had completed in Step 2.

      The Trump Economic Plan (TEP), the Trump Budget, the Trump Tax Reforms, etc., will all continue at the same time.

      It’s going to be Beautiful. It’s going to be Great. It’s going to be America First, for once in our lives.

      Liked by 1 person

    • JT says:

      sundance has several posts on this very topic written in the past 48 hours. all on the first page.


  18. Summer says:

    Folks, you cannot argue with Cruzlims, just as you cannot argue with progs. Both groups are ideologically inoculated against common sense.
    Both groups — Muh Constitution group and Muh Socialism group are united against President Trump’s attempts to MAGA. We can debate that their reasons for opposing the repeal AND replace policy might be different but the result is the same: both groups scream YOU SHALL NOT PASS! This is a classic example of the Horseshoe Theory.

    The only effective way to the Congresscritter’s heart is through their pocket because Muh Principles have always been for sale in DC if the price is right or the risk of losing “campaign contributions” is too great. However, as Sundance always points out, trillions are at stake so the contributions flow like there is no tomorrow. That means Muh Principles are well-funded at the moment and President Trump will have a hard time to persuade the Muh Constitution group that they are against the same tax credits they were for just a short time ago.


  19. Timmy-the-Ute says:

    Why is there only a House plan? When the Democrats passed ObamaCare they passed a Senate plan first.


  20. saintoil says:

    I am with Trump and Sundance. We just don’t have the votes in the senate. We have plenty of other fish to fry too. Patriots, the purist aren’t so pure. Easy to blow it all up and say you stood for principle. We won’t get rid of Ocare and lots of people will suffer as the obamanation implodes. The responsible thing is to fix it through the process Sundance has laid out which is Trumps way, Ryans way. I was upset at first and had to think hard on this one but it is the best way. I respectfully ask that you consider this course of action. Thank you.

    Liked by 1 person

    • CleanhouseinDC says:

      The problem is that Ryancare isn’t benign, it is a republican version of Obamacare. It doesn’t do anything that will bend the cost curve downwards, it simply changes the equilibrium of control to a different set of bureaucrats (not a knock on Sec. Price). It isn’t getting government out of healthcare, it is simply shift who’s in charge.

      And when you complicate that with a comprehensive distrust of Ryan and the majority of the GOPe, it’s a losing strategy. We want Obamacare neutered, and this doesn’t do that.


  21. anthohmy says:

    If drug companies refuse to cooperate can .gov contract with another organization to manufacture off-patent drugs?


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