The tone, attitude and rhetoric from the group demanding support for Israel-First above all interests, is the same tone, attitude and rhetoric from the group demanding unlimited support for Ukraine…
….. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with you for noticing the similarity.
You are stable, pragmatic and wise. You are also not alone.
The alignment of cheers from the Coliseum crowd for the attack on Iran from both Israel-first and Ukraine-Always groups is slightly unnerving in the way it makes you grimace -quietly- inside.
It is an understandable sense because you do not pretend, nor do you disqualify your intuition.
Perhaps like many, you are comfortably invisible, as you prefer to be, and you observe thoughtfully.
When you attend the July 4th celebration and parade, perhaps you do not join the crowd in gleeful clapping as you watch the latest military type police MRAP vehicles pass by. Instead you think of what they signify, a bigger picture.
You are prudent; yet you do not wish to disrupt the smiles of those who do not carry the same thoughts. It’s ok, you are not alone.
We hope for the best in all things, yet we do not carry the singularities of self-interest that demand conformity to our views or priorities. Those shouting in our ears demanding we clap and smile are not us.
For the recent Iran action, we hope for a ‘one-and-done‘, but we accept the unfortunate reality that hope is not a strategy.
And so we pray….
Love to all,
Steadfast!
~ Sundance
Prayer and preparation are the only options they have left us.
***that’s Not “just a last resort”***
What they thought was a BAT SIGNAL turned out to be a B-2 BOMBER see https://515loupe.wordpress.com/
My thoughts entirely. If this becomes a longterm conflict, that will perhaps be the thing that destroys MAGA. I hope I’m wrong.
24 yrs. ago .. political /economical/monetary reset(NESARA/GESARA) been destroyed by 9/11…….just before to be sign up by Clinton…will this bombing/closingStrait of Hormuz and other fall out do same….. I hope not we did wait for this way too looooong…….
nah i am pissed. no more doing israel’s bidding
I found it especially choice that amidst this, the one-fingered piano player with the wife preening on the Vogue cover but with no business suit of his own had the chutzpah and gall to tweet at the world that the Ukraine needs its $40B, INCLUDING FROM THE U.S.
So now we’re going to be sending trillions overseas to Marshall Plan not only the Ukraine borderlands but also freshly missiled Iran and Israel. It’s as sure a thing as U.S. Congressvermin positioning themselves to siphon hundreds of millions off the “rebuilding”. Meanwhile, good luck to East Palestine, Ohio.
well at least maybe the Republican Senate can now pass the BBB because they got their Iran blackmail strikes.
O my…you are so outdated on the $40 billion, it is now:
This year alone, $43 billion has been allocated to support Ukraine’s defense industry. Next year, we call on each ally to allocate 0.25% of their GDP for this. Because supporting Ukraine’s defense means supporting Europe’s security.
Stinkin’ inflation.
A midget with a superiority complex and of the Bibi Tribe. Regime change in Russia, Iran and China is all MIGA asks for. Just one fell swoop is all they ask for.
I wonder if his hair is falling out yet ; I suspect he already knows of Putin’s plans for him . He’ll get louder as time grows near .
Guess you don’t remember under Obama when one of our ships was detained- Iranians boarded, made our men kneel, hands behind their heads/ the endless Deth to America-what do you do when the threats never end?? You do what Trump did.
Why couldn’t Israel do it?
Did you listen to Trump speak after the bombing?? For 50 years Iran has terrorized the world- they’ve killed and maimed US citizens, they aim to annihilate us. Trump just put down the rabid dog. Thank you, Trump.
I notice that those who criticize PDJT for bombing Iran tend to omit all the times since 1979 that Iran and it’s proxies have murdered Americans. I suppose that way they can frame it as Israel first rather than America first and frame PDJT as a stooge of Israel.
Perhaps because we have the discernment to NOT give Israel ALL of our biggest best toys?
Because they couldn’t. Didn’t have the capability. Do you not read the news?
Iran is a paper tiger. They could have harmed us if they wantedto over the past 40 years.
They hate us and Israel. They don’t “need” some provocation to do it. Hatred is their motivation.
I had hoped we wouldn’t need to bomb them and that Israel could have done this with commandos on the ground, but for reasons you and I don’t have access to, Trump decided to act. It’s done. Not great, but probably better than the alternative. Would you have sent them another few pallets of money like Obama did? Don’t like it? That’s your right. If God is on any side of this argument then it surely isn’t with Iran and Islam.
The penetrator bombs could be dropped from B-52s, but we have never sold one to another country. Israel has been asking for years. On the Doolittle raid on Japan, one B-29 bomber landed in Russia even though they were ordered not to. Russia’s Tupolev Tu-4 was reverse-engineered from this B-29.
No. “What is the US bomb capable of destroying Fordow?The GBU-57A/B Massive Ordnance Penetrator (“MOP”) is a 30,000-lb bunker-buster designed to penetrate deep into reinforced structures before detonation. It can breach over 60 meters of concrete or rock.
Only the B-2 Spirit stealth bomber can carry the MOP, flying undetected over enemy airspace to deliver it precisely. –Jerusalem Post
the Doolittle Raid wasn’t B-29’s. The forced landing in Russia of a B-29 (actually atotal of 3) was later in the war but you’re right, they were reverse engineered by Russia.
The raiders flew B-25 Mitchell medium bombers. There was no way that a Superfortress could take off from an aircraft carrier. The raid took place in April 1942, the -29 did not enter service until May 1944.
Trump is his own person. Nearly impossible to push around.
I’m guessing that he had his own cards to settle with the Iranian regime, separate from those of Israel.
It just so happens to be that their interests aligned at the same time.
A much saner explanation than many I’ve seen.
Maybe this was for the USA and the rest of the world not just Israel.
Trump just removed the boogeyman from the room. A non-nuclear ran is no longer a threat to Israel, a non-nuclear Tehran is no longer a threat to the United States or to any nation in the world.. there’s no longer a reason to poor billions of dollars into Israel. I guess that’s something to be pissed off about if you want endless war..
Most of Irans attacks that murdered Americans came from their terror proxies.
I believe the President was most concerned about the leaders who paid for all the terrorist triggermen that killed our people over the years.
Then look at the weapons development programs for the bomb, the delivery vehicles, and a passive USA for decades. Bad mix… I wish it had not come to this but in my heart of hearts and the bit of logic I possess, those mullahs would have employed a nuke on us and Israel. 45 years of history confirms they would find a way to export violence, terror, and utter destruction on a scale not seen since WW II.
Israel’s bidding = CIA/MI6’s bidding.
There is NO daylight between, they are one and the same.
To be upset about “doing Israel’s bidding” is to be upset about doing the CIA/MI6’s bidding.
And that means refocusng your anger at the US/UK’s leaders.
Being “pissed” at Israel is being pissed at the tail of the dog.
Because being pissed at the head of the dog comes with much more risk in doing something about it than being pissed at the tail of the dog.
I have a small dog. That hates big dogs. Tries to attack dogs big enough to bite off and swallow my dog’s head in one bite. My dog knows not to attack head-on. My dog crawls on its belly, guerilla style, towards the big dogs. Gets in closer. And closer. And closer – to the big dog’s rear. And when close enough lunges for the rear. And that’s when the big dog turns and decides to either send a warning bite message. Or bite to kill. I never know what a big dog will do. So I just try to avoid all confrontations between my small dog and big dogs. I don’t know the outcome, and I don’t want a dead/broken small dog.
Those who get big mad at Israel are like my small dog. And want no part of the business end of the big dog. There’s a term for that. I’ll let you decide what it is.
What is the end game for the CIA in all this if what you are speculating is true? What do you think Pres. Trump knew or didn’t know about the CIA running the world, apparently since its inception almost. The CIA is blamed for every issue world wide that cause chaos, death and regime changes. How do they do this? Where is the proof? Why are they not just disbanded? I’m so sick of blaming an entity with no proof they did anything at all. It’s sounds like a giant cop out but with overtones of truth in it. So why don’t we get rid of them?
like JFK tried to? You do get the picture that the President really doesn’t control the Intelligence Community, don’t you? or are you just a bot?
There is lots of them here…….saaaaad
I have been asking that question since Trump came into office. Nobody seems to have an answer – yet.
Amazingly everyone wants to think this is about doing Israel’s bidding ; it is most definitely not . This is about slowing the encroachment of Islam . Anybody says otherwise is not looking at facts already in evidence . Islam and freedom cannot coexist .
It’s certainly not beyond the realm of possibility that IC actors are skewing the intelligence in order to produce results that draw the US further into conflict. Israel is a closer ally than Ukraine but I still don’t like foreign military entanglements. I trust Trump, but if his intel is bad his decision-making process is then impacted.
I’m not saying we should or shouldn’t have bombed Iran. Obvious to me that them getting a nuke would be bad. As Sundance said…hopeful that this is the extent of our involvement.
Perhaps a little peace will enter your mind if you rethink “bombed Iran”, and switch it to – We bombed 3 buildings that may, or may not have housed nukes. We didn’t slaughter innocents. We stole the power of Israel, and the Globalists to ever scream Iranian nukes again.
Great point, hopefully deeper research into the damage will bear this out.
Another comment I saw somewhere is that the action is a message especially to China, should the CCP move on Taiwan. Maybe.
China is a paper tiger.
Their whole strength is based on what they can steal from us. The minute we stop doing business with them, their entire house of cards comes crashing down. And I think they know it. Makes them very vulnerable. The only leverage they may have is the rare earth minerals we need from them for our military equipment etc…
Good point.
Hope for the best but prepare for the worst…..I truly believe Trump feels the same way and I will trust in Trump’s judgment because I know he’s not Lindsey Graham.
Ditto👍
Optimal solutions. God has the consequences to meter out.
Have faith and pray that peace will reign.
Trump sure did win the praises of Lindsey Graham last night. Trumps judgement is delusional, he has now started a war in the middle east. And I say that as a major Trump voter and MAGA supporter.
Yada, yada, yada… seminar concern troll.
I can never support the Israelis. WHY you might say? Because of what they did to the USS Liberty back in 1967. Two books written by two of the survivors will tell that story. Someone said that never happened. Go an tell that to the remaining survivors at their reunion they have every year. I dare you.
they literally have an illegal nuclear program and not beholden to any treaties. they need to give it up as well. Israel “only we can have illegal nuclear weapons”.
Israel hasn’t spent the last 47 years threatening to use A Nuclear Weapon against anyone and everyone who attacks them either.
I guess you never heard of the Samson option.
I wonder how many practice the Delilah option?
Except that Israel never openly threatened to annihilate the Big Satan aka America.
Illegal ? According to who ?
Okay, time to insert some math here.
If Israel officially joined the nation states who have nuclear weapons, the same thing that happens at the UN would happen with this small group: on the ones side are Russia, China, North Korea, India, Pakistan and Iran (for the purposes of this math lesson, keep Iran in the states with a nuclear weapon crowd. One of these would propose a dictum, restriction, amendment, etc., that would target Israel’s program for severe restriction and “confidence building measures” ad nauseum (a.k.a endless inspections by the “neutral” IAEA), but not theirs.
Those opposing: the United States (if not run by the Obama / Biden ilk), Great Britain, France and Israel. 5-4 is the best Israel could hope for, and thus, any dictum/restriction/amendment would pass, resulting in Israel being prohibited further from acting as a sovereign nation to defend its people and land, as well as DETER its enemies from annihilating them.
That is why Israel has an “illegal” nuclear weapons program. It’s simple–but deadly–math.
And considering what Khomeini did to us in 1979, I’d say that we’ve been at war for a long time, but ignored it. Just like in The Godfather, it’s time to settle some accounts, some of which have no statute of limitations or that are related to Israel.
Yes I agree.… we pretended there was no war.
Yeah, remember what we did to them in ’53.
Nationalizing oil was a reason for toppling a ruler in 1953. Sad reason in hindsight.
Religion had nothing to do with 1953…..and back then (and until 1978/79), Iran was bordering on secular.
British Petroleum and CIA did it in ’53, Jimmy Peanuts, UK, France, and CIA did it in 1979.
See my response to Southernborne above.
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/israel-middle-east/articles/cia-coup-in-iran-that-never-was-mossadegh
100%. And Trump is the only America First president who had the stones to do it.
Oh, yeah! Been waiting on this A LONG TIME!
Perhaps in the future we won’t be in foreign lands forcing our will upon foreign people, and perhaps Mexican illegal immigrants, and others coming to our land won’t do it to us.
Even if no American ever enters a foreign land or sails the seas, they will still arrive here and bring war.
They will, if we allow it.
Don’t forget all their proxy attacks on US in many nations since 1979. We can pretend it didn’t exist.
What did Khomeini do to “us” in 1979? Seems to me, he was leading a plan to take Iran back from a puppet government that had been installed by the CIA and MI6 back in 1953. Meanwhile, evidence suggests that Israel was involved in the JFK assasination and 9/11, along with the attack on the USS Liberty in 1967.
Somebody mentioned the Lavon Affair last night.
For those unfamiliar with the USS Liberty “incident”, watch:
No one ever said that it never happened… what they DID say was that it was an incredibly horrific accident, a case of mistaken identity in the fog of war, a friendly fire incident that both governments have acknowledged. It is understandable that some will never forget, nor will they forgive. But mischaracterizing anything about this tragedy does a disservice to the memories of the victims.
It was NOT mistaken identity. The sailors that survived and are still alive meet annually, and they will attest to that.
Good point. So don’t support the Israelis. At least always be “suspicious cat” with them.
But, now I’m thinking, maybe let’s have a meeting with the Liberty survivors and the relatives of the victims of the Beirut bombing of 1983. Not to mention relatives of US soldiers who were victims of certain IEDs delivered to Iraq in the ’00s.
In other words, as has been said by others, maybe in this case US interests coincide with Israeli interests, much as we might be a bit dismayed at that reality.
Let us pray for wisdom on all sides. There is a Win-Win in this somewhere.
i’m assuming that PT and PP have gamed out the plan already,
so a win-win might be very possible.
if it works, we could be rid of the dangerous leadership of Iran
AND off-load a money sucking parasite (Zelensky’s Ukraine) to Russia in exchange.
🙂
Don’t know if true but I read medvedev said other nations will provide Iran with nuclear warheads, I wonder who.
Thank you, Sundance.
Yes!!!
Thank you, Sundance.
🙏🇺🇸
Thanks Sundance…certainly a time for some deep thinking. Too bad we have so many in CONgress incapable of doing just that. It’s amazing to watch the support for foreign countries, especially when the war hawks are circling.
I saw this somewhere in all that I read that our Capitol (with CONgress in session) is the only foreign military base on US soil.
Things that make you go hhmm.
As my deceased father used to say, “Don’t start something you can’t finish”. This is by no means over. Iran is already threatening to close the straits of Hormuz, Russia’s Medvedev has made a statement, see link, Xi is quiet so far. This reminds me of the “Mission Accomplished” banner on the carrier when bush II landed on it celebrating the “successful” Iraq war. We know how lousy that turned out.
Russia’s Medvedev Blasts Trump After Iranian Military Strikes – Says “A Number of Foreign Countries Ready to Directly Supply Iran with Nuclear Warheads” | The Gateway Pundit | by Jim Hoft
We’ve been there done that before. Do you think that Trump and his team have not prepared for this? We have a strategic oil reserve built back up and we have strengthener relationships with members of OPEC and even in Canada.. those ties will provide us with plenty of excess oil. You can bet our Navy is going to protect ships coming through that body of water..
Thank you Sundance.
We, The People will be watching events in the Middle East closely. How U.S. troops (our sons and daughters) are affected. To hell with DC anal oligarchs.
Some 45,000 of them by this 2023 estimate. What purpose are they serving but being sitting ducks?
Do you have a clear answer to your question? Minus DC oligarchs spins?
I believe Trump will bring them home. Those countries are not our responsibility, until they target our soil.
Djibouti, Camp Lemonnier… just opposite the southern tip of Yemen down there… 5,000+…
Agree. And as soon as we build OUR Iron Dome equivalent (Golden Dome he calls it, right?) then we should withdraw most of our troops spread out across the globe.
hopefully it will be better than Sieve Dome…currently on display as not working well….. see commenter Martin pictures…here on CTH…saaaad
This isn’t Biden’s Afghanistan.
No one believes (not even you – I’m sure) that American military lives “aren’t” top consideration in President Trump’s planning..
According to whom?
I’m suspicious: we have a US base in Israel??? (That’s what the map appears to be showing).
However many there are, I hope we can bring many of them home. If Iran’s ability to export terrorism and hurt enemies through proxy wars is indeed crippled, the case can be made to bring our soldiers home and let the region take care of its own security. But first the neighborhood bully has to be brought to heel.
Fox News IS BESIDES THEMSELVES with the PHARMA Ads and Chest Thumpin’ …
COME ON FOLKs – ACTS of WAR are FAILURES Of NEGOTIATIONS / OR JUST – PLANNED ACTS of AGGRESSION
PAST TIME to CANCEL ALL LEGACY CLEARANCES for These RETIRED ” TALKING HEADS ” from IC and the MIL
that ARE Knocking Down SIX DIGIT Salaries with the ” Think Tanks ” inside the BELTWAY
You are right on points.
I posted this under SD’s post on Pete Hegseth and General Dan Caine hold a Pentagon Press Briefing :
“Any nation or people threatening America or her allies the message has always been clear. PDJT won’t blink – he acts. And that’s what terrifies the establishment.
The last three administrations refused to act with precision, clarity, and backbone. The strike on Iran’s nuclear infrastructure wasn’t a declaration of war. The same D.C. class that appeased Iran for decades is now pretending to care about constitutional limits. Thomas Massie announces that he has introduced a bipartisan War Powers Resolution to prohibit “United States Armed Forces from unauthorized hostilities in the Islamic Republic of Iran.”Congress ceded the authority to make war to the executive branch after the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks and hasn’t taken it back since.
It isn’t about PDJT taking action. They’re not defending the law. It’s their legacy of weakness they are trying to defend. The media didn’t flinch when Obama armed radicals in Libya. Now they’re clutching pearls over a justified, targeted strike.
This wasn’t a march to war – it was the return of something Washington forgot: American strength, unleashed without apology. The message was not just for Iran. It was for every regime watching to see whether the West still has a spine. It is long overdue.
PDJT is clear – we will defend our people should Iran and her allies attack American troops and citizens. This was a measured, targeted response; a strike aligned with the Trump Doctrine: peace through strength, deterrence through clarity, and war only as the last resort. President Trump doesn’t seek conflict. He ends it, without sending American sons and daughters into endless foreign entanglements. The ball is in Iran’s court. We will not hesitate should our sons and daughters in the Middle East are attacked.
That, would be America responding to war against her people she will be be responding to. Not Israel, not the EU talking heads nor those DC war hawks and all who are crying foul. America’s enemies within! They have never been honest calling injustice where it belongs.
They are still using the version of the old model; whereby the oligarchs – (who were not in charge because they were bright, but because they were ) the best killers. They took all the best counsel from all the talented minds and proceeding as jury on their own behalf; chose the course of action that suited there anal dreams.
What is needed is to retain the best advisers and replace the oligarchs with juries of the people.
Juries today know little of the law, but are the makers of justice.
The mandate of We, the People is that PDJT protect US, country and its people when attacked; as he should”
It’s time to take a step back from all the conspiracy theory nonsense and just appreciate what President Trump did, not just for Israel, but for the whole world community. A nuclear armed Iran has been avoided and the world, especially the Middle East, is in a much safer place now. Those ME countries won’t say it, but they are thanking President Trump for having the guts to do this.
Back channel talks I am sure support what you have said.
One can always tell when we are right in our thinking. A cloud of naysayers saying, “Nah, I HATE JEWS no matter what.”
Well, I HATE TERRORISTS no matter what!
It’s funny how wondering why the American government is not nearly as zealous about defending America as it is about defending Israel is depicted as “hating Jews”.
Sometimes the easiest explanation is the truest. Do you trust Trump? Or theocratic psychopaths who’ve facilitated the death of Americans and chanted death to America for 40 years?
Conspiracy theories? What Trump did was the biggest “conspiracy theory” out there. The “conspiracy theorist“ have always believed that Israel created this bogeyman so that we have endless war in the Middle East and use this to control monetary policies, armament, production, petro-politics, and virtually every political decision in the world first the past 50 plus years. What you just posted is exactly what the “ conspiracy theorist” have been saying all along. If this were a football game, the conspiracy theorist would be winning 69–0 it’s not even halftime.
Sad that there are so many people who think like this.
Nothing sad about the truth.
Well, now that threat has been obliterated so they can’t say that anymore, right?
The truth that lurks beneath all else is that many elected politicians are corrupt; the margin for error is slim indeed!
Our parents and grandparents wept and prayed after each Allied success in WWII. Even on VE and VJ days, they flocked to the churches.
Many here and elsewhere are high-fiving and cheering this bombing on, like a TV sports event. And many are cheering on for even more bombing and destruction. As if there was no risk to them whatsoever.
Because Fox News will break it all to them, in convenient 13 minute segments. With enough time during the ED and guttergard ads to get another beer or a sandwich.
Morality and a deeper understanding of the perils of war, both those justified and those for adventure, have been entire lost to so many.
Good times make weak men.
We’ve had it relatively good for a very long time.
I hate hippies.
I dislike reckless warmongers who inevitably expect other people’s children and grandchildren to go and fight and die in conflicts of their creation, to sate their warped geopolitical fantasies … and their defense stock portfolios.
The last two decades after the last headlong plunge into war there under the Bushes, made under false WMD claims, should have at least taught some prudence and caution before risking American blood.
Israel had the situation well in hand already, by their very own accounts. Why weren’t IDF commandos deployed instead of B-2 crews to finish the job at those sites? Israel has the military capabilities to have handled this all by themselves. In fact, they initiated this preemptive operation.
It will take a strong peacemaker President like PDJT to control the inevitable escalation that usually results from these types of operations.
Pray he is successful, and the direct conflict, now involving the US, ends with those bombs last night.
The gleeful warmongers are an eyeopener.
“In great empires the people who live in the capital, and in the provinces remote from the scene of action, feel, many of them scarce any inconveniency from the war; but enjoy, at their ease, the amusement of reading in the newspapers the exploits of their own fleets and armies. To them this amusement compensates the small difference between the taxes which they pay on account of the war, and those which they had been accustomed to pay in time of peace. They are commonly dissatisfied with the return of peace, which puts an end to their amusement, and to a thousand visionary hopes of conquest and national glory, from a longer continuance of the war.”
— Adam Smith
Adam Smith wrote that before Hahn and Strassmann.
It’s now a much smaller world than he ever imagined.
Perfect post. Thank you, Sundance.
Dr. Steve Turley called this out as the Eternal Enemy Complex.
He defined it as (1) the need to constantly manufacture and fabricate existential threats to (2) justify permanent warfare in the expansion of American power abroad while (3) enriching factional interests connected to the military-industrial complex.
He further described it as the compulsion to destroy any potential rival to an American-dominated unipolar world — a world that no longer exists.
In other words, the Neocon mindset.
You don’t think that Iran, which has repeatedly called for “Death to America!” is our enemy? I’m curious as to what it would take for someone to be your enemy.
There are a great many people within our own borders who openly want ‘death to America’. Some of them occupy important positions within our government. They are a much more clear and present danger to us that Iran. Yet nothing can be done about them.
VSG PDJT ..gave ultimatum to Iranians and act….I think many his supporters would love to hear his shout ..to give ultimatum to DS on MSM and unleash his do nothing/little .Kash/BONDI/radkliff……
Well said
As I read this morning this is not the beginning of the end but the end of the beginning.
Truthfully, in my own non pretending way, I’ve known these times would come because we did not call out the enemies earlier.
Much treason over the decades.
May Peace reign and trust in God.
Well said.
It was probably necessary, and I trust that President Trump felt it was necessary.
Having said that, I pray that this is ONE and DONE.
Just to be clear: Support for Israel does NOT equate to support for Ukraine.
Night and Day. Apples and Oranges.
One is logical and Biblical. The other is illogical and probably Satanic. Anyone making equivalencies needs their head examined.
Equivalencies not in conflict, but in argument from the advocates.
Including in tone and tenor…
Yes, sir. I agree and respect your wise counsel. I support Israel. I do not support the Ukraine debacle.
Sounded like some of us were being lumped-in with the globalists. That’s the last thing I am. Maybe I need to re-read it a third time.
Hands down the best tweetable understanding of the IC dilemma in ages. Maybe ever.
First it clearly identifies the Why, then moves to the How before isolating the Problem. Even more important is it opens with the central fallacy of our nature.
Simple, basic psychology in a refined form.
Thank you Sundance for the Refuge.
Why -> Conflict
How -> Argument
Problem -> Advocates
Fallacy -> Equivalencies
This pattern of social behavior has been going on since we first started throwing sticks & stones at each other.
When are we ever going to learn?
It is our original sin that drives this cycle.
It not hard to fathom, that fear drives our emotions. Just as Joy does.
The mixed state of this duality is our daily struggle.
What’s seemly been lost.
What’s seemly in grasp.
These all are interchangeable states of our eternal exercise of choice.
Easily swapped in one form or another in the search of Joy and the lengths to void fear.
What’s seemly found can easily be lost.
What’s has not been lost is easily found
These are all central to the what is called our original sin.
There is a single word to make sense of this.
That word is covet.
Lee Smith explains:
Trump’s Opponents Want to Humble the USA
What do Iran’s nuclear ambitions have to do with America First? A lot.
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/trump-opponents-humble-america
War is very serious as it entails the loss of life.
When people treat it like a frivolous game and cheer for their side, then they expose themselves as people who do not value every life that Gd created.
War is tragic even when your side wins.
And yes the alternative of no war may be worse but the loss of life is a tragedy regardless.
Thank you Straight Arrow.
Couldn’t agree with you more.
Personally I value America and Israeli life more, though, than bloodthirsty Muslims who have proven over and over that they hate us and hate our God and are a cult of death, not lovers of life. They sacrifice their own children as suicide bombers! If that makes me a bigot I’ll just have to live with it. I do NOT want us going to war over there.
I finally punched back at a bully in elementary school after weeks of torment. He never bothered me again and we became amicable. I’m praying that we just gave the bully a much needed black eye.
Sometimes war is necessary, especially when your enemies choose to be bloodthirsty and cruel instead of using their Gd given potential to do good and be kind.
Perhaps it’s not cheerleading but the feeling of relief that someone stopped pretending and actually did something.
there is that, at minimum
Yes I hear that.
I just hope there’s a way to still retain our humanity and humility through the fear. Life is something to celebrate. Death is not.
It’s easy to conflate the two when your life was saved through the death of your enemy.
Usually, the last people who want to go to war are the ones who came back….just sayin’.
Probably because they’ve seen the ugliness of war firsthand and up close. Unlike the arm chair ‘generals’ cheering from the safety of their couches at home.
America First. I don’t support anything after that. Especially Israel or Ukraine.
So do you view this as an America First strike, as I believe President Trump does, or as supporting Israel? I don’t think they’re mutually exclusive.
I’m 100% America first. I think THIS instance was in our interest. I’m NOT a cheerleader for war, death, or intervention. Never have been. Never will be. But sometimes you have to do unpleasant things in life. I think this
was one of those instances. In and out and none of our soldiers on the ground. I’m anxious for us to build a dome defense system and get the hell out of other countries.
john….”you have to do unpleasant things in life”…. like wars/color revolutions ???? …it looks like is a past time of many US presidents since 1945…..saaaad
From satellite view, linked below, there are 2 groups of 3 holes, totaling 6 holes on the surface of the ground at Fordo, that were not there 1 day ago.
Not sure what the holes may mean, below the surface.
( and the ‘meaning’ can have many local, national, international interpretations, or spin, going forward.
Does that sound familiar? )
p.s.
Some may correctly think that a nuclear bomb threat may have been reduced in the world – for the time being.
Some others may think about making more even trade agreements, and reduce the perpetual stonewalling / obfuscations / manipulation$ / games people play.
Others may follow through on deportations of illegal immigrants…
Others may wonder about repercussions.
(well, there has been repercussions for the status quo, and other events etc. for prior decades too )
Others may enjoy the outdoors, or peace, just a little bit more…
(except the wildlife, etc. near Fordo may be going through an adjustment period)
Link to satellite images of Fordo:
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/fresh-satellite-images-show-damage-at-fordo-nuclear-site-after-us-strikes/
Has someone taken credit, or blame, for the Sept 26, 2022 Nordstream sabotage?
Has someone taken credit, or blame, for July 17 1996 Flight 800 crash after takeoff from New York? [ a 20 year investigation became an obfuscation ]
hmmm…
Someone is taking credit, or blame, for the bombing in Iran.
Is there a difference?
The latter has some hurts, but also some fortitude, love, truth etc.
imho
A rabid dog was just put down. We’ll no longer get bitten-unless it’s from a terror cell Crooked Joe let traipse across the border and live off the taxpayer
The Jew-haters here who have popped their heads up recently will disagree. Common sense doesn’t seem to apply to them. It’s the same psychosis as TDS.
Thank you for providing a perfect illustration of the point SD is making in his post.
Thank you for the predictable reply and for closing your eyes to the number of comments here that are clearly anti-Israel, not just anti-war. I am anti-war… if it can be avoided. We tried diplomacy. It didn’t work. Should we have given them a few more years to think it over? I’m practical but not a pacifist or a warmonger.
And you can fault me for it, but I believe in the God of the Bible. His words say “those who bless Israel will be blessed, those who curse Israel will be cursed.” I’m going to side with God and His word on this issue, ok? I don’t have a knee jerk reaction every time we help out an ally and especially in cases like this where we are actually protecting ourselves and the REST OF THE WORLD. Instead of assuming you know how I think, why don’t you ask me? I agree with Sundance, but didn’t like the implication that supporting Israel was equal to supporting Ukraine and the globalist agenda.
You know just because people are not in favor of giving money to Israel and always taking Israel side does not mean they are jew haters does not mean they are antisemitic
Agree. But there’s a level of vitriol in many of those posts.
Apparently anyone who is not fanatically pro-Israel is automatically a “Jew-hater” in certain peoples eyes. We’re not allowed to be indifferent, let alone mildly critical.
Thank you, Sundance. You’ve expressed my thoughts perfectly.
Couldn’t agree more-Sundance has expressed exactly how I feel. My husband too agrees.
I prayed at church today especially for the ordinary people of Iran and of Israel and for all of us.
I trust President Trump. He has excellent judgment and instincts and he sees the big picture. He knows more than we do about Iran and the present world situation.
I am not on the same side as mark Levin. He has revealed himself to be a horrible human being and likely a Mossad asset or a paid lobbyist. He has deeply insulted MAGA and Americans who have served in the military. He should be taken off any cable shows he is on. Like the rest of his ilk he has never served in the military even though he is the age to have been drafted to Vietnam. Reportedly, no one in his family has ever served. How did you get out of that Mark? Maybe there’s a story there. He is a chicken hawk. My sense is it’s all about money with him.
Similarly, I have been reading divisive online comments that say “you aren’t America first if you are on the same side as the Jews or non-white people”. Who are these people??
Certainly, not MAGA and not America First. America is composed of all these groups and more, you idiots!
I guess what I am saying here is that there are more than two sides here and I am with PJDT and Sundance.
Ultimately there are just two sides – but there are a myriad of viewpoints and combinations of knowledge and experience, as well as some driven by motives such as levin’s.
Let not the cacophony of propagandists or tsunamis of others’ emotion deter you from the attempt for truth.
Ol’ Yeller’s father was a WW2 veteran.
I support Israel because they seem to be able to fund pensions and paychecks during and between wars. So, there is that.
Ukraine is where all the young men ran away to avoid being drafted.
In Israel, the young women carry weapons to defend their country, even when not on duty.
I don’t see many Nazi’s being coddled in Israel.
Genesis 12:3 and Galatians 3:8 (look them up – it will do you good.)
Israel has illegal nuclear weapons. They are bound by no treaties. They struck Iran for the same thing. That does not square.
Illegal?
Hahahaha!
You troll farm clowns are too funny. You are all over this thread, talking s***.
No one cares what you think. Understand that, Jew hater….
You ignore Death to Israel and Death to America chants, each and everyday, for 46 years. Take that and square it, circus clown.
So you place Israel and Iran on equal footing.
in the multiporal world all nations should be treated equally…..you parrothead….
Illegal according to who?
I mean who gets to decide who is permitted nukes and who is not?
As I stated elsewhere: if the nuclear nations got together and made a proposal to regulate Israel’s nuclear program by XYZ dictum the vote would be as follows:
Affirmative: Russia, China, North Korea, India, Pakistan, and Iran (keeping them in the nuclear nations for now).
Negative: US, Great Britain, France, Israel (if Israel were official part of the group).
6-4. Israel loses. Every. Single. Time. (apologies for my earlier post where I had the math wrong at 5-4)
This is why Israel has an “illegal” nuclear program. A simple question of math.
Israel is not a party to the NPT, that does not make their possession of nuclear weapons “illegal”. As far as I know, the treaty does not have an enforcement mechanism. Pakistan and North Korea were signatories to the NPT then withdrew from the treaty, do they now “illegally” possess nuclear weapons?
Also Matthew 27:25
America First.
You would be more persuasive without the condescending tone.
Dispensationalism is a Christian heresy, and modern Jews are as much the descendants of Abraham as George W Bush is.
“I support Israel because they seem to be able to fund pensions and paychecks during and between wars. So, there is that.”
Unusual reason, but is there really that?
US taxpayer dollars given to Israel and Israeli costs:
and why they are coddled in glorious Ukraine ????? 2 presidents with Jewish faith since 2014…??? Joan ?????
I’m uneasy the war hogs are congratulating Trump. I’ve been politely clapping at 4th of July celebrations since illegal lockdown. Appreciate the post Sundance.
Thank you!
Having traitor mike pence support this gives me the willies.
Can a MAGA guy like me appreciate the surgical precision of Operation MIDNIGHT HAMMER, and not be Israel First, and All-in on Ukraine? President Trump just did what half the world wished he would do. Many won’t acknowledge it publicly, but see it for what it is: A Pathway to Stability.
Apparently some folks believe that if you supported PDJT strike on Iran you must be an Israel first and not an America first
Well said. Nice moniker. (2 ags, 1 horn. No one is perfect.)
Again what was the alternative? That’s the question. Allow the psychopaths in Iran to have a nuke? All the noise aside those same people would cheer if we bombed the Galapagos.
The right question is what was the alternative when the Iranians went dark and stopped pursuing negotiations all together?
The United States was the first to recognize the new State of Israel in Trans-Jordan, in recognition of the need for a Jewish homeland after the horror of the Nazi Holocaust. We are in reality the only Great Power guarantor of Israel, and thereby have a moral obligation to preserve its security.
We have no such moral obligation to Ukraine, and only via the leftover alliances of the Cold War have any obligation to the nations of Europe. Any political figure who attempts to equate Israel and Ukraine is on no firmer ground than a six-year-old playing soldier in the back yard.
President Trump knows and appreciates the difference. He knows that Ukraine is really part of Russia’s family, and he knows as well that Israel is part of ours, and will remain so.
Axis powers who wronged them had an oligation to right that wrong. Those responsible for the wrong have now passed away, as have those who experienced the wrong. Mandating support is like going on about slave reparations in the US.
What’s happening now is a misdirection in which the secular, liberal state of Israel — where 70% are atheist or agnostic, only 30% claim to follow the Jewish faith, and only 10% actually do — draw on Christian confusion about their use of Judaism and Israel terms as being biblical in nature, though they actually mean the ethnic group when they say them.
They use the words Israel and Judaism to elicit support from those who think they are participating in biblical history and and will of God, even though only 10% of those in country are concerned enough about the God of Abraham to be bothered to follow the Law given them.
The STATE of Israel is actually about ethnic identity and a shared sense of history. Its like supporting a liberal state devoted to the hispanic ethnic identity, where 70-90% reject the Judao-Christian God, generally vote hard-left world-wide, but use the words to manipulate Christian support thus the U.S. into support for their ethnic state.
They attacked Iran knowing they couldn’t achieve their de-nuking objective without the US, manipulating the US (who wouldn’t otherwise have attacked Iran) into doing it for them. Might have respected them if they had actually accomplished their objective, but manipulating the US into doing it for them does not bring respect, it raises hackles They need some serious time in the woodshed.
Whether the secular, irreligious liberal state of Israel exists, the people of Israel around the world remain, voting hard-left as always, with only the tiny fraction actually respecting and following the God of Abraham and the Judaeo-Christian reality they manipulate to gain support even as they work to accomplish the opposite, like other leftist, secular, materialistic groups.
Israel and its significant historical sites are practically paved over by the materialistic ambitions of the irreligious secular state (“See Jacobs Well — next to the toll booth in the parking lot at the end of the block!”). The area is too important to be left to secular materialists. Pity its not handled by someone more sensitive and committed to the area’s actual significance beyond their personal ethnicity obsession.
Amen my brother Sundance, my first instinct last night was to NOT WATCH the POTUS announcement so I went to bed thinking just more of the same old NEOCON bullshit. We’ll just have to see where it goes from here. Hopefully IRAN will capitulate to a peaceful settlement. Only time will tell………….
Iran refers to the USA as “The Big Satan” and Israel “The Little Satan”.
The fact is, is that this has nothing to do with land, it has nothing to do with Israel, it has nothing to do with bombs and it has nothing to do with “Palestine”.
This is a centuries old Holy War being waged against Western Civilization by savage third world Mohammedans who are incapable of negotiating in good faith and believe they are on a supreme mission from allah to spread their ideological cult throughout the world by any means necessary.
The ONLY thing that will deter them is overpowering force.
Trump & Netanyahu both know it, but politically they can’t say it.
Morover, Islam abhors free speech, free markets, individual liberty, the Judeo-Christian values that made America great and is fully allied with the post 0bama “Progressive” Left in that regard.
What else does one need to know?
Thank you Clivus for seeing the really big picture. The cry for no new wars, no more forever wars, is nearly delusional. No one seems to notice, but civilization been in a forever war with radical Islam, for centuries. We joined in when Jefferson sent the marines to Tripoli in the early 1800’s. The radical Muslims in Dearborn Michigan are chanting death to America. Who let them in?? The Islamist pretty much own Dearborn and Hamtramck, This is Detroit. The current head of the snake of radical Islam resides in Iran. Should it not be cut off? Ya the body of the snake will slither around, but it won’t be a nation state. Parts of the snake are in America NOW. At least remove the head. If you support keeping the head on the snake, well, keep up the support the forever war and those that make the money.
Regarding Russia and Ukraine (lets stay out of that) the CCP and other commies in general. The Commies are not suicidal. The radical Islamists are, just wait till the get a nuke.
💯
Agreed, Clivus.
Another thing to remember is that the Hamas men doing the killing on Oct 7, 2023, were not shouting
‘From the River to the Sea”, were they? They were shouting ‘Allahu Akbar.”
👍
Trump didn’t just ‘step in it.’ He walked straight into a pile the size of a Winnebago and declared it genius.
Very deeply sorry, but he is done
No American troops on the ground. No American lives lost. No Iranian lives lost, and the boogeyman was eliminated. Sure he’s done.
Trump just changed the course of history.
Sorry, I don’t see that at all.
Frankly, I think the opposite. People admire strength.
People do admire strength
My buddy who works with cruise industry just texted me and said the Strait is closed.
Filled up all cars and all gas cans. Gas went up .10 in just 1 day…watch it now. May even purchase extra storage containers…
Choice: pay more for gas temporarily, or “duck and cover”.
Did you read the article at TGP about several Nations ready, willing and able to give Iran Nuclear Warheads or did you miss that one?
Good luck with that. Two can play that game….I’m sure S. Korea and Japan would love some nukes.
Oh, and some nukes for Taiwan!
We don’t get much oil from Iran and are ramping up our own production. Why do you think there will be a problem here with price and demand?
For interim security purposes?
Kind of like flying commercial into some conflict areas gets closed, for an interim period?
Yeah, right.
I don’t know what to think right now. War with Iran 6 months into the Trump administration was not on my radar. I thought we’d be curtailing aid and military assistance to Ukraine to try and force them to negotiate an end to the war with Russia and that we’d be avoiding any involvement in yet another ME war. While Rubio is saying we want peace with Iran does anybody believe that is possible anytime soon now and that the US is not going to be drawn into further engagements with Iran? IMO the longer this goes on the more likely we’ll see the detente we and Israel have with Arab countries deteriorate. The Neocons seem to be getting everything they want and yet I feel they are still likely to backstab Trump. I don’t know.
yeah..where would you put your money?
I just don’t quite get it.
I do get the incessant cave-man reversions, chants to a devil-god, intentionally dulled intellect, and all ensuing debris from the general population of the region not exclusive to Iran. I also get the cultural erosion occurring since the deposed Shah and the resulting struggle for theocratic dominance, islamic oppression and aggression, and the site of hate for the West in general.
I get that.
What I don’t get is why there is such similarity between build-ups of conflict in the ME and a blank stare when asked for proof of WMD, nuclear weaponry, nuclear enrichment, and why now all of a sudden? What other powers are a work to pull strings and manipulate public opinion as well as influence national leadership.
That I don’t get.
Saying so does not place Iran or any other ME state in a favored light, and it does not indicate innocence of terror against humanity in general. No. Iran is NOT now a friend to anyone.
But, why now and where is the proof of need?
60 % enrichment is all the proof you need , see SOS Rubio’s interview with Margaret Brennan ( ? ) .
And what proof is there, where did the assessment originate, and why now (all of a sudden, so to speak)?
It just smells like other distractions, not that the Iranian leadership is anything but a shit stain.
The globalists want to use the Iran conflict as a way to split Russia’s forces across two fronts, making them easier to conquer. From the globalist viewpoint, even if Iran’s Islamic government is toppled, a puppet government can be installed to help them put more pressure on Russia.
Trump and the nationalists want to align with Russia and either muzzle the Iranians or replace them with a nationalist government. I believe Trump and Putin are working towards this end now. I do not expect the death cultists to exercise any degree of reason. They will need to be eradicated like cockroaches. Then, maybe the old Crown Prince will be returned, I don’t know. But it will be a secular, nationalist Persian government capable of truly aligning with Russia and the US.
Lastly, I don’t want to fight Israel’s wars, but the Israel question has only two outcomes: help them retain their homeland, or let them be scattered to the wind as the Jews were for centuries, after which they will come and live with YOU. I would expect that even the most devoted Jew-hater can appreciate the logic here.
Crown Prince is not nationalist…but bankster lover…
One fact seems obvious to me. Satan can whisper in President Trump’s ear but its God that has his attention. Sometimes we can’t understand but we can have faith.
It was no accident that President Trump explicitly said “we love you God” in his address last night.
Like George Washington, he has experienced divine providence first hand and he knows who is in charge.
What are the opinions of ignoring international law and signed treaties?
Those were promulgated by the West. Destroying them won’t help the U.S. Also, the U.S. just torpedoed any trust in American negotiations. We’ve shown that negotiating is just a head fake to sucker punch the other side.
Ill take no one cares about your opinion, for a 1000, Alex….
Israel will keep asking for more just like Zelensky. A can or worms has been opened.
And if they don’t will you publish a retraction? If they do, you can say you told me so.
This was the ONE thing they asked for because they didn’t have the ability themselves.
I don’t recall us going to war for them or with them during their entire existence as a nation.
Seems like they pretty much can handle most things on their own. We intercepted incoming during
their battle with Hamas and all the other Iranian proxies, but we haven’t done anything like this before and it doesn’t mean it’ll become normal.
False Straw Man argument by Sundance. There are many, myself included, that never supported Ukenazis, but DO support the current action on Iran by Trump.
When the Mullahs are frothing ‘Death to America’ chants on the streets of Tehran with the local populace chanting back, then I tend to believe them. At some point, the Nutter Islamists will get a Nuke probs from Russia. Never trust Russia is my motto. Same goes with our still current Big Gov in USA. Founding Fathers set that last tone. Def don’t trust Islamic Nutters.
I’ll await the Russian Sympathizers here with their pro-Russia talking points I’ve been laughing about here for the last 3-4 years during my Lurk Phase of not commenting.
We provided nukes to our proxy states, so we seem to be on weak ground in objecting to Russia (or China, or Pakistan) potentially doing likewise.
And the Mullahs are frothing ‘Death to America’ chants on the streets of Dearborn Michigan.
Update on Developments in Iran (4)
The Director General said the IAEA has been informed by the Iranian regulatory authorities that there has been no increase in off-site radiation levels after the recent attacks on three Iranian nuclear facilities, including the Fordow uranium enrichment site.
“As of this time, we don’t expect that there will be any health consequences for people or the environment outside the targeted sites,” he said. “We will continue to monitor and assess the situation in Iran and provide further updates as additional information becomes available.”
Vienna, AustriaSOURCE :
https://www.iaea.org/newscenter/pressreleases/update-on-developments-in-iran-4
Praying is helpful I think.
I also appreciate the free speech aspect of the site. It’s more boring than offensive. The offense is to America when it comes down to it.
Iran is run by Mullahs. More than 600 years ago their Prophet commanded all devout Muslims to exterminate the infidel.
If Iran intended only peaceful electricity from nukes, why do you suppose they built their power stations thousands of feet under solid rock?
That’s been my question since all this started awhile ago. Underground and no full inspections from regulators. Cause one to go hmmm, what are they actually doing under ground there?
All I have to say to the majority of the comments on this thread and to Sundance is: BS!! I won’t call any of you anti-Zionist or antisemitic, but you are not stable, pragmatic or wise. You are ignorant and naive. To compare Ukraine to Israel. Are you kidding?? Iran invaded our country in 1979 when they took over our embassy and kidnapped the hostages. Reagan should have taken out the Mullahs then when they released our hostages, but he didn’t. No President did anything but appease the Mullahs. Trump did something and now Israel is Ukraine. BS!!
Sundance’s point has flown way over your head. You missed it entirely.
He is saying — and you and a couple of others are proving — that both camps’ style of discourse is quite similar.
BS!! There’s nothing similar.
The British burned Washington DC to the ground in the war of 1812. Are we going to let them get away with that?
You display a Middle-East mindset, where the past is never past and where people hold grudges for slights suffered by their forefathers generations ago.
The US Embassy in Iran was US territory. The British are not yelling “death to America”. What is wrong with you??
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2025/06/russias-medvedev-blasts-trump-after-iranian-military-strikes/
I guess the Deep State won after all. This is exactly what they wanted.
Well done Israel, you did your duty to your DS buddies and crippled America and the American people.
You may be G-d’s chosen but I have no time for your machinations. You ruined the work of a truly GOOD man.
I keep asking myself if Israel is gods chosen people then what hope is there for the rest of us in the afterlife? To say that they are gods chosen people is completely counter to the teachings of Christianity. I am not a Jew hater and I’m not antisemitic.
That line has been pursued and for profit for centuries.
Jesus’ teachings do not support it, imo.
sharing from another commentary:
IAEA: NO INCREASED RADIATION DETECTED
…IRAN GIVEN ADVANCE NOTICE…PATH TO PEACE?
[…https://s.w.org/images/core/emoji/15.1.0/svg/1f680.svg Late last night, American warplanes and submarines attacked three major nuclear sites in Iran. President Trump claimed the sites were “completely and totally obliterated.” The Iranians say it was nothing but a flesh wound. The attacks —widely predicted for days by independent analysts— have already produced incoming waves of rhetorical missiles based on wild speculation about warmongering, dark suggestions of constitutional violations, and doom-crying about what might happen next.
The International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) said it had not detected any increases in radiation outside the sites. (It also slammed the US bombings as “a brutal act that contradicts international laws, especially the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons.”) The welcome news of non-radiation-leaks also suggested the Iranians had cleared the sites ahead of time, a noteworthy fact to which we’ll return momentarily…
…Amwaj Media (Iraq/Iran) ran a story last night headlined, “Iran given advance notice as US insisted attack on nuclear sites is ‘one-off.’”
The satellite picture above shows a line of trucks picking stuff up from Iran’s Fordow nuclear site— the largest of yesterday’s three targets. The photo was taken two days ago— just after the most recent meeting between US and Iranian negotiators.
“A high-ranking Iranian political source,” Anwaj reported, “confirmed that the Trump administration on June 21 conveyed that it did not seek an all-out confrontation, and only intended to strike the Fordow, Isfahan and Natanz nuclear sites.” It added, “Importantly, the senior source also confirmed that the targeted sites were evacuated, with most of Iran’s stockpile of enriched uranium kept in secure locations.”
If true — and no one disputes it — this raises the intriguing possibility that the strikes were more politically performative and less warlike than corporate media and the hot takes fear. In other words, this could very well be a paved path, an off-ramp, for making a broader peace deal politically possible…]
See more:
https://www.coffeeandcovid.com/p/bomb-iran-sunday-june-22-2025-c-and
*** *** ***
This may be closest to the truth. An expensive but necessary act against warmongers?
If that’s true, the USA just spent a ton of money just for show. The crazy info coming out of these places is just head spinning and no one knows the truth of any of it or what lies are being told to throw off the straight path to any truth. It’s maddening to say the least to try and make one bit of sense out of any of it.
Shock and Awe bs?
Looks it to me.
I don’t believe that the neocon warmongers wanted this attack on Iran’s nuclear program.
They’ve been making trouble all over the Middle East for the past several decades, but have kept their hands off of Iran.
The Ayatollahs are the regime change that the Deep State wanted decades ago. Because the spectre of never ending hostilities between Israel and it’s Muslim neighbors (which was then expanded to “Islam vs the West”) is a dream come true for those who want to create global chaos and division.
I think Sundance is off base on this one. The Bushies would have never done this. Trump went rogue, and the usual suspects who’ve been cheering for Zelensky and Ukraine are privately not happy about this. Pay attention to their silence.
I think they were counting on it.
War is a racket to them. Any war.
Interesting how Iran is now winding up, just as Ukraine is winding down.
.
Your second to last sentence IS the point Sundance was making, IMHO.
That you recognize the point, yet want to disparage the host saying the same thing, says something about you, IMHO . . .
I have had the fortunate experience of teaching ethics at the Naval Academy a few years ago. One of the things covered was just war theory. Here are the tenets according to our curriculum:
1. War must have just cause. Such as the preservation of innocent life or securing basic human rights..
2. War must be declared by competent authority. It must not be done by private groups or individuals.
3. The action taken must have comparative justice. The rights and values involved must justify the violence, destruction, suffering, and death that are part of warfare..
4. The action must have right intention. The intent must be in accord with the cause, and not for such side issues as territorial enhancement.
5. The action taken must be a last resort. All peaceful alternatives must have been attempted. No other means of settling the dispute is feasible.
6. Probability of success. The resort of force must have some rational basis. Enormous destruction, and suffering in the face of certain defeat is rarely justified.
7 proportionality of ends. All the cost of the war taken together must not be greater than the benefits to be derived from it prosecution.
As far as I can tell President Trump fulfilled all of these, although I’m not happy about it
Hard to argue with any of your points.
Now, blend it with Sun Zu’s Art of War
…..mainly the need to pick the field of battle
Iran getting a Nuc….wouldve let them choose the when & where
Couldnt be allowed
I’m trying hard to understand why so many here don’t see the bigger picture here
What Trump just did is the beginning of the end for Deep State interests
Go back and listen to Jen Griffin’s reporting about the stealth with which this entire op was conducted
She was gobsmacked over the secrecy despite the complexity and coordination
Seal Team Six could have used a little secrecy, too, since it’s hard to have forever wars if the axe handle ain’t sticking out
.
What boggled my mind was the use of the word ‘deception’ by at least one Fox ‘guest’ who was gushing that Trump’s team used same to pull this off.
Distraction, sure.
But, not having plans leaked is not a deception.
It is national security.
I deception is an accurate term and perhaps they were referencing the misdirections both America and Israel engaged in prior to the nuke site bombings.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/how-an-israeli-american-deception-campaign-lulled-iran-into-a-false-sense-of-security/
“listen to Jen Griffin’s reporting”
If there’s one takeaway from my readings of Sundance’s posts over the years, it’s: “don’t trust anything whatsoever that comes out of Jen Griffin’s mouth”. There are probably other things as well… but that’s a big one…
Burning your hands in the oven? Jen Griffen? Rhymes…