Update #26 Part 2 – Trayvon Martin Shooting – A year of drug use culminates in predictable violence…

This update, like several before it, does not stand alone.  To truly understand the depth of the research and background it is important to have first read Update #26 Part 1.  This Part 2 builds on the previous presentation of Trayvon Martin’s lifestyle choices and drug use connections.

This update is a creation of Treeper “Dedicated Dad“, who deserves full credit for investing numerous hours researching, learning, understanding and fitting the disconnected puzzle pieces together.   What we outline here was right in front of our face the whole time.  Yet we looked past it because we were in a position of ignorance about what we were looking at.  We just didn’t know.     Now however, it all comes together:

Several weeks ago, as further information and discovery came to the surface the whole framing of the original media narrative began to crumble, I stumbled over a reference to “DXM” in Trayvon’s Facebook history.

It’s nagged at me since, at various times popping to the front of my mind when Trayvon’s drug use was mentioned, was quickly lost to other distractions.   A couple of evenings ago it again came to the forefront of consideration.   This time I decided to dig in, do a little research, and see if there might actually be something to it.

What I found was frankly, quite stunning.   So much so that it literally made the hair stand up on the back of my neck.

After further reflection this drug use aspect may actually lead to the greatest understanding, and key, to the whole case.   Understanding exactly where the mindset was of both Trayvon Martin and George Zimmerman, and what influences are now readily available and out in the public forum, a number of questions are now finding answers about that evening’s events, most importantly what precipitated and led to Trayvon Martin’s approach toward being questioned by George Zimmerman.

So I suppose I should start by answering the obvious: “what in the heck is Dedicated Dad talking about”, and how would research answer questions about “intent”?

The substance of research was prodded by with this graphic of unknown attribution, dealing with the possibility that Trayvon Martin was not only an illegal drug-user, but possibly a drug-dealer.   (Large file version here).  While the “graphic” itself is unattributed, the content within the graphic was easy, at the time, to confirm with a quick review of Trayvon’s Facebook page and extensive work already done by the TreeHouse and multiple websites including Wagist.

Go ahead and review the whole thing, because while it most certainly is “controversial” it is also a good substantive fact-based background in Trayvon’s own words.   But, again it is only background,  and more information is needed for the rest of this discussion.  We will highlight some sections of it, from Trayvon Martin’s own words, throughout this explanation because it speaks to a “directional sense” in the lifestyle of an evolving teenager.

As I use these Facebook discussions from Trayvon I’m going to correct the ebonics unless it seems necessary to reference directly to the source.  Otherwise  I’ll do my best to interpret it into something people unfamiliar with nuance within a “cultural language” can understand.

Let’s begin about mid-way down the page on the left-hand side, where Martin says:

unow a connect for codine” or

“do you know of a connection for codeine”?

Trayvon is seeking a source for the prescription drug Codeine. Eventually we learn that he’s not seeking the pill form, but rather a “liquid” form, which he says he’s “had…before.”

His friend responds that he doesn’t NEED codeine – that he can just mix Robitussin and soda to make…

“…some fire @$$ lean.”

Our first question then becomes “What exactly is “lean””?

WHAT IS “LEAN” ?

According to Urban Dictionary, “Lean” is described as follows:

“…  6. Lean is a mixed drink originating in the Southern Rap culture. It is a mixture of Promethazine and Codeine cough syrup and a soft drink such as Sprite (usually). While other soft drinks may be used, Sprite was the original.

[And now also Arizona Watermelon for Watermelon Drank/Lean]

There are some variations of Lean. For example, Promethazine and Codeine syrup is usually Purple in color. But there are other colors of syrup that work the same way. There is a golden-colored syrup (hydrocodone based) and other colors as well.

Lean slows you down. It makes you feel good. It’s meant to be sipped on, and it taste damn good. One of the best feelings you will ever experience. Euphoria with a hint of sedation. …”

Lean is also the drug mixture that killed Pimp C.  nigga pimp c died on an overdose of lean  (urban dictionary descriptive)

OK, so now we know Trayvon is seeking a source for a powerful cough syrup, commonly used in the “drug culture or circle” to make an intoxicating drink called “Lean” – also known as the infamous “purple drank/Purple Lean/Lean/Sizzurp.”

Purple Lean, or Lean, is an intoxicating beverage also known by the names lean, sizzurp, and liquid codeine. It is commonly abused by southern rappers and wannabe suburban teenagers. It is a mixture of Promethazine/Codeine cough syrup and sprite, or other beverage [such as Arizona Watermelon]  with a few jolly ranchers and/or skittles thrown in.

There are your “DXM”  “Watermelon Lean” Ingredients

Arizona Watermelon Juice purchased from 7-11 included in the Crime Scene Photographs and incorrectly listed/discussed as “Tea” by Benjamin Crump, the media, and even police reporting authorities.

Promethazine with codeine, consumed in such large amounts as is popular with such southern rappers as lil wayne, slim thug, and Big Moe, produces an opiate-like high that is potentiated by the Promethazine.

Promethazine by itself will not produce a high. The beverage must be sipped slowly, and not guzzled, in order to avoid unconsciousness and/or life threatening overdose.

But what does this have to do with Robitussin or “DXM”? Trayvon clarifies in his next message:

“codine is a higher dose of dxm”

As the conversation continues, Trayvon indicates that he plans to quit smoking marijuana because he doesn’t want to risk being busted or “roped”, because it is discoverable in drug testing, and possession of Marijuana is illegal…..  (Obviously he never did actually quit)

….. and further believes he can obtain the same high by drinking “Lean” .  But that’s not nearly as important as the fact that he’s clearly under the impression that prescription Codine is a stronger form of the drug DXM found in various versions of cough suppressant or cough medications.

So, what then exactly is “DXM“?

DXM” is an abbreviation for the cough suppressant Dextromethorphan Hydrobromide — which is the active ingredient in the cough-syrup brand Robitussin.

According to numerous websites found with a search, DXM is increasingly being abused as a recreational drug.  One of the more scholarly and scientific sites found with in-depth analysis of DXM and its various uses is “Erowid.org“. According to its “FAQ”, Erowid is:

“…a small non-commercial organization that operates in the controversial and politically challenging niche of trying to provide accurate, specific, and responsible information about how psychoactives are used in the United States and around the world.    We are committed to protecting the privacy of contributors and reporting on the topic non-judgmentally. Although our primary focus is on the Erowid.org web site, we also provide research and data for other harm reduction, health, and educational organizations.”

In short, it’s a site filled with information on various forms of drug abuse, mostly to enable the abusers to do so with as little risk as possible.   It is not within the scope of this discussion to make any value judgements about this fact so we’ll continue our discussion – considering Erowid a valuable resource for our research and typical of the sort of information someone can easily locate on today’s Internet.

According to Erowid’s “DXM Home Page“:

DXM is a widely available over-the-counter cough suppressant. When taken far above its standard medical dosage, it is a strong dissociative used primarily by teens.

Their “DXM Basics” page further makes clear that it is:

a semisynthetic opiate derivative which is legally available over-the-counter in the United States. It is most commonly found in cough suppressants, especially those with “DM” or “Tuss” in their names. It is almost always used orally, although pure DXM powder is occasionally snorted

At this point you’re probably thinking – as I did at first – “how bad can this stuff be if it’s available over the counter!”   However, as we’ll see, it’s actually startlingly dangerous stuff!

Erowid begins to hint at DXM’s seriousness in their “DXM Basics” discussion:

“…High doses … are sometimes compared to the effects of other dissociatives such as PCP or ketamine…”

This stuff is compared to PCP ?   This is no exaggeration! DXM in higher doses is actually a very volatile and dangerous drug, and they are quite right when they compare DXM to PCP and Ketamine!

In fact, the drug has come to be known in some circles as “Poor-Man’s PCP!

Perhaps more importantly, unlike marijuana and many other drugs of abuse, DXM does not cause sedation, and in fact can produce profound agitation  hence the comparison to PCP.     In the  “DXM Basics – Problems” section, Erowid notes:

“…DXM causes physical and psychological effects that may be frightening or unpleasant… Psychological effects can include profound disorientation, depression, a feeling of personal disintegration, or a feeling of “unreality” and disconnection that may persist for days. Chronic use may cause depression, psychological dependency, and possibly brain damage. Large doses may be associated with psychotic breaks…”

It was at this point that I first noted the feeling of the hair standing up on the back of my neck – but this sensation would become much more common and pronounced as I continued reading and gaining understanding.

One of the best sources I’ve found for DXM info is Erowid.org’s “DXM Vault.” One article in particular was especially helpful – “The DXM FAQ by William E. White – Version 4“,  published at the previously linked site Erowid.org.

This document is, to be blunt, written for “recreational users” of DXM – those who will use it “to get high.” I will refer to “recreational use” by its proper term: Abuse.

In the document’s “Introduction”, the author notes that as the number of people abusing DXM has grown since he published the first version of his FAQ, so to the number of adverse effects and problems has also grown:

“… A few people, on the other hand, seem to be greatly susceptible to DXM addiction and some of these have suffered long-term health consequences. A very few may have suffered permanent brain damage from extremely heavy use of DXM (e.g., an 8oz bottle of Maximum Strength syrup every day). On the other hand, some people consume the same amount for years seemingly without consequence. And while some people can consume DXM regularly without psychological consequences, others suffer from severe depression and psychotic breaks, even leading to a few cases of suicide attempts…”

He goes on to note the growing indications that there is a possibility of a phenomenon called “NMDA Antagonist Neurotoxicity (NAN)” – microscopic holes in the brain called “Olney’s Lesions.”

Perhaps with the understanding that Trayvon used “Lean” to get high the Medical Examiners notes in the autopsy of Trayvon’s brain cultures now have a new light shed upon them.

For these reasons, the author points out, “as of the time of his writing  (coincidentally in 1995, the year Trayvon was born!) there just wasn’t any significant quantity of medical research into the long-term effects of DXM abuse, which he hopes (unsuccessfully, as it turns out) will be resolved in the following years, and notes “…Until then, my official recommendation is not to use DXM at all!

Of course he knows people will not stop using, so he goes on to express his “own personal belief that DXM is probably pretty safe when used occasionally (e.g., once or twice a month) at the lower plateaus, and rarely (e.g., once or twice a year) at the higher plateaus.”

Mr. White then gives hints at the otherwise unclear “data” he’s gathered by saying “I have yet to hear from anyone who used DXM with this or less frequency who has suffered any impairment, temporary or permanent.   Actually, to be technically correct, nobody using it once a week for less than six months has ever seemed to have problems, but it’s always best to keep a wide safety margin…”

Unfortunately, teenage boys, especially those from within Trayvon’s cultural demographic, are not known for their temperance, much less “keep[ing] a wide safety margin.

To the contrary, it’s likely that a young man like Trayvon would consider Robitussin an easily obtained standby for times when marijuana was unavailable.  In his own words he has already expressed his opinion that it gives him “the same vibe” – and he is in fact likely to PREFER the DXM as it’s less likely to get him “roped” (busted).

Subsequently a rational framing would be the odds of him limiting his use to “once a week for less than six months” is highly unlikely.   We know from his own words to his friends that Trayvon has used DXM as far back as June 2011.

Even more troubling, the author goes on to note:

“Another thing to keep in mind is that DXM in the upper plateaus is a considerably different experience than the lower plateaus, and may be better suited to spiritual or ritual use. Even at the lower plateaus, DXM is not really well suited as a frequent recreational drug

… In summary, I’m not nearly as convinced that DXM is a benevolent psychedelic as I used to be. It is in many ways considerably more powerful (and certainly more dangerous) than LSD or mushrooms. Like all psychedelics it can profoundly change you; unlike others, these changes are not necessarily under your control, especially if you are not very familiar with yourself.

I don’t think there are too many people less “familiar with themselves” than teenagers whose sense of “self” is still highly formative.  The concern from this discovery was growing quickly, but this next section really took the feeling of concern to entirely new heights:

DXM can be a great tool for spiritual rebirth, but it can also turn you into a paranoid, antisocial asshole… It is a unique and uniquely powerful mind-altering drug, and one which I think most people would do best to avoid. “

In short, the “drug-user world’s” foremost “expert” on DXM abuse is clearly advising against regular, chronic use for some very good reasons.   But if a teenager like Trayvon were even aware of such a recommendation what degree of confidence would there be that the would actually heed it?  Remember, this is a young man who thinks “codeine is a higher dose of DXM” and is actively seeking to find it.

Therefore, the odds of him accidentally and naively stumbling into enough of a habit to render himself “A paranoid, antisocial asshole“, in the words of Mr. White, are probably quite high.

But… Let’s read on!

Physiology of DXM / Lean Use

We know from Trayvon’s own words that he’s experienced “lean” – and since he knows what DXM is – but thinks the promethazine/codeine cocktail is “a higher dose” then he’s also experienced DXM, at least at a “lower plateau.”

In answer to the question “What’s the DXM Trip Like” the author says:

“Well, that depends on how much you take. There are four different kinds of experiences, based on the dosage; these are called plateaus.

The first plateau is a mild stimulant effect with a little bit of a buzz, and has been compared to MDA [a more psychedelic cousin of MDMA -aka-“Ecstasy”].

The second plateau is more intoxicating and has been compared to being drunk and stoned at the same time.

The third plateau is dissociative, like a lower dose of ketamine.

The fourth plateau is fully dissociative like a higher dose of ketamine.

You should not [emphasis original!] attempt higher plateau doses unless you have someone with you who can take care of you in case you get sick or freak out. It happens on DXM.

Many things can happen unexpectedly on upper plateaus, such as spontaneous memory recall, complex delusions, hallucinations, out-of-body experiences, near-death experiences, and perceived contact with spiritual or alien entities. You need to be pretty stable and grounded before you can handle these things“.

“Stable and grounded” would not describe the behavioral or social pattern of Trayvon Martin who was moved from house to house, parent to parent, and surrounded by a litany of on-again, off-again, relationships from his parent’s partners.    Could a “complex delusion” or “hallucination” perhaps elicit a paranoia “tracked” by George Zimmerman?

One thing is sure – young Trayvon was CLEARLY ANYTHING BUT  “STABLE AND GROUNDED” in both his physical and emotional address.

In another section – Is DXM Dangerous” – the Author again makes note of the possibility of “bad trips…psychotic breaks…psychological addiction and depression and irreversible brain damage“.

To repeat the obvious, THIS IS VERY VOLATILE, DANGEROUS STUFF  especially in the hands of an impulsive, cognitively immature, and adolescent  minded individual like 17-year-old Trayvon Martin.

One of the problems with DXM is that with long-term or regular use  “most of the pleasurable effects of DXM tend to go away … Tolerance can build rapidly, leaving one only with a general sensation of being high and stupid.

In young and impulsive individuals, this can lead the person to take higher doses, looking for the same “vibe“, and thus accidentally lead the individual to find themselves on a much higher “plateau” than they intended.

Lacking both the knowledge and experience to understand what is happening to them, and the skills or assistance needed to deal with the “surprise” effects,  an ungrounded teen can suddenly find themselves in a dangerous – even potentially fatal – situation!

The “FAQ” lists the following “Risks” (among others):

  • “Major Risks of Occasional Use:
    • Panic Attacks
    • Psychotic Breaks
    • Impaired Judgement in Critical Situations (!!)
  • “Risks of Regular Use and Binges:
    • Mania
    • Violent Ideations, Antisocial Behavior and Paranoia
    • Habituation and Psychological Addiction
    • Tolerance and Physical Addiction
    • Psychosis
    • Liver, Kidney and Pancreas Damage

At this point it is highly important to remember, or refer to, the coroners report about Trayvon’s Liver?  (a screen grab is below)

In addition to the risks of DXM itself, many DXM-containing products contain other active ingredients that can be dangerous. Common additives include acetaminophen (Tylenol), which can cause fatal liver-damage in large doses.   Products containing Chlorpheniramine Maleate such as Coricidin Cough and Cold should especially be avoided.   See DXM Health for more information.

When you take acetaminophen, [such as would be used in making Purple/Watermelon Lean]  your liver breaks it down into a substance called N-acetyl-p-benzoquinone imine, or NAPQI, which is toxic to your liver  […]  Your liver contains an antioxidant called glutathione that can keep NAPQI from causing damage, but too much acetaminophen reduces glutathione and leaves your liver open to harm […]  acetaminophen only causes liver damage if you take more than your body can handle.

These post-mortem symptoms of DXM use would also mask themselves as a variety of causes for ‘mild fatty metamorphosis of the liver’ if you were not specifically knowledgable of the subject’s history.   Obviously in this example neither Tracy Martin, nor Sybrina Fulton would be informing the Medical Examiner of prior drug use.

We can confirm from his Facebook and Twitter Accounts that Trayvon had essentially been “sippin sippin” (using Lean or DXM) for at least a year, perhaps longer.  It would appear from the Medical Examiners report Trayvon’s liver was showing the early indicators of excessive use consistent with such a timeframe.

Psychology of DXM Use

“…Be very careful in trying to restrain the tripper, since she or he may perceive this as a threat, and will probably be mostly immune to pain...the tripper, like a cornered animal, could beat the living shit out of you without thinking twice. (!!) …”

So, where does all of this lead?  At this point, after reviewing all the information, it appears quite probable that a pattern of drug cocktail use specifically led to the mindset, or psychological environment, between George Zimmerman and Trayvon Martin on the night of February 26th.

The tone or hostility of the encounter, and Trayvon’s response to being confronted, would more easily be understood against the backdrop of the discovery for his prior drug use; and more specifically the types of drugs being used.

It is quite possible that Trayvon Martin – experiencing the tolerance effects caused by chronic use of DXM – potentially took a larger dose of DXM than he’d had before,  or at the very least was recently indulging himself in an admitted actitity.   Maybe even suffered a “psychotic break”, but at least the behavioral paranoia and psychological stress consistent with the use of long-term DXM use might have to a physical and psychological reaction to questions by George Zimmerman, and ultimately to his aggressive response.

Trayvon would not necessarily have needed to be under the “immediate influence” of the “trip” at the time (Robotrippin’), he could just as easily have been preparing for his next “trip” while still holding the long-lasting effects from prior use.   The timing of prior use may contribute to his emotional state, or the cumulative effect could have been a contributing factor.  Both are just as potentially dangerous.

If however, Martin was in the midst of a stress induced “psychotic break”, or under duress exacerbated by George Zimmerman’s “eyeballing him“, well, then, there’s really nothing George Zimmerman could have done once the confrontation began.   Any confrontation at all could have led to the same outcome.

The FAQ advises a “Tripper’s” “Safety Person” to:

“…Instead of restraint, try talking him or her down. Be calm, soothing, and repeatedly remind the tripper that they have taken a drug which has critically impaired their perceptions. Remind them of who they are and how they got here, and that the experience will end…”

That sounds great, on paper, – except for the fact that George Zimmerman had no idea Trayvon Martin was potentially “Robo-tripping“, and it’s rather difficult to “be calm, soothing” and so on when the “tripper” has already snapped and is busy “beat[ing] the snot out of you without thinking twice!!

Common Sense

We know from Trayvon himself that last summer, between the school years, in or around June 2011, Trayvon was engaged in DXM/Lean and Marijuana use.   We also know there are multiple behavioral side effects from DSM/Lean use.   Those side effects and impacts on cognitive judgement increase with prolonged exposure.   The more you use, the worse the psychological affects are.

Now consider this in the developing physiology of a teen in the full hormone raging puberty phase of 15/16/17 years of age and you can magnify those psychological and physiological effects exponentially.

Hormones = Sex = Teenage boy normal.

Hormones + psychotic psychological addiction from DXM/Lean drug effects = Super Aggressive Sexual Thoughts, actions, expressions. Teenage boy NOT normal.

It would be intellectually dishonest to frame as coincidental or disconnected that he apparently started seriously engaging in the DXM/Lean/Pot culture in the summer break of 2011 ;  and then was suspended from school three times for behavioral issues in the very next school year.   A rapid downward progression would be an inevitable outcome from frequent use of DXM and Marijuana. 

Trayvon also subscribed to the U-Tube feeds  of drug use, drug culture, street violence and activities in this same Summer between school years.   Not accidentally in the same timeframe he gained significant interest in MMA style street fighting.   This is not at all just random coincidence.  As we have meticulously outlined aggressive anti-social behavior is a specific, frequent, and documented side effect from DXM/Lean use.

Trayvon was admittedly, according to his Facebook conversations, a user of DXM and Purple Drank/Lean since at least June 2011.   He was also an admitted smoker of Marijuana which was found in both his urine and blood tests.   His liver indicates the beginning stages of an unusual degrading known as “mild fatty metamorphasis”, and his brain tissue appeared compromised, both conditions symptomatic of DXM use.

In addition he was suspended from school three times in the past seven months  prior to the shooting for behavioral issues.  He was detached from adult supervision at the time in question, in a relatively unfamiliar place, and according to his father Tracy Martin, grounded.   His girlfriend describes their phone call as Trayvon being “paranoid”.

Trayvon makes a trip to the store and buys two of the specific three ingredients needed to blend a drug cocktail he was well versed in making (Lean).  And appeared slightly exagerrated, tenuous, and wobbly (swaying) when you objectively review his physical movements on the video of the store during the purchase.

He was a little more than a half a mile from home (Brandy’s house), yet he left the store at 6:24 and was first noted at the clubhouse at 7:09pm.   If he intended to go straight home from the store, and under normal cognitive capacity, he should have made the 1/2 mile trip in well under 30 minutes, well under.

The facts, and new understanding, as it now presents itself, would certainly lend weight to the strong possibility that Trayvon Martin was motor impaired, or at least influenced, by some altering condition.   At the very least this bears considerable merit for further inquiry, and a serious toxicological analysis for an understanding of exactly what metabolic influences may have been in place at the time of the encounter between George and Trayvon.

The toxicology review should specifically look for trace evidence and levels of DXM agents in his system.  Both to understand if he was robotrippin’ at the immediate time of encounter, as well as if longer term use created a cumulative effect, and was a contributing factor in his physiology or state of mind.   One such well known, and well documented side-effect is “anger”, or, “violent temperment”.

  • 7-11 Store Check out time 6:24pm  –  Shooting 7:17pm
  • 53 minutes from the time Trayvon left the store to when he was shot.
  • 53 minutes to travel .60/mile

Zimmerman: Hey we’ve had some break-ins in my neighborhood, and there’s a real suspicious guy, uh, [near] Retreat View Circle, um, the best address I can give you is 111 Retreat View Circle. This guy looks like he’s up to no good, or he’s on drugs or something. It’s raining and he’s just walking around, looking about.

By Dedicated Dad  – Now knowing all of this information, take a closer look at the new discovery for what REALLY happened at the 7-11 on the night in Question.    This too, opens eyes to a FAR GREATER UNDERSTANDING.

CLICK HERE to continue…

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791 Responses to Update #26 Part 2 – Trayvon Martin Shooting – A year of drug use culminates in predictable violence…

  1. Pingback: !!! Must Read!!! Unbelievable info on Trayvon Martin. | Fellowship of the Minds

  2. Lars says:

    I thank you for this painstaking research into this. The stories of the Martin Family keep changing. I remember first report I heard is that Trayvon has just gone to the store during basketball game halftime to get his little brother a treat of tea and skittles when the white devil stalked and murdered him for no reason but the color of his skin.

    I thought it odd that Little Brother didn’t tell Daddy and Daddy Fiancee when they got back from BB Game that Trayvon went to store for treats and never returned. So – initial story about Little Brother wanting Skittles was a lie?

    Especially in the light of the video, which to my eyes makes him appear impaired – slowed down – something also that Zimmerman reported on the call to police initially reporting his presence – you have to wonder. If I was found with a pound of flour, a pound of butter, a pound of sugar – chances are I was planning to make a pound cake with the milk I had at home. Mixing up “drank” makes a lot of the incongruous details fit together.

    Like

  3. Pingback: Trayvon Revisited

  4. Great Investigative research ! World Class good job. If the Orlando Slantinel (eventually steals and publishes any of your work — sue them. And (personal knowledge with verified proof) prosecutorial misconduct (Ms. Corey — I am a Minister of Justice (vomit ! ) ) is the NORM in Florida, not the Exception. Did you know PM got SO BAD that Attorney Sandy D’Alemberte (former President of the American Bar Assoc. & also of FSU) demanded 2years ago that Fla form an Innocence Commission. This was due to a Tsunami of “innocents” who went to prison, being exonerated by Barry Schiffs legal team. The Fla. Prosecutors Assoc. FOUGHT the creation of an Innocence Commission

    Liked by 1 person

  5. ben says:

    Apparently this article is so dangerous, Facebook has suspended my ability to post anything after I linked to this page…

    Liked by 1 person

  6. JE_Reading says:

    I’m not sure about the correlations between Martin’;s potential Lean usage and the autopsy findings. Fatty liver points to many things. Leptomeningeal congestion seems to be aligned more with disease or blunt force trauma to the skull than anything else. Basing this on several google search results. I could find no direct correlation between moderately (or less) congested Leptomeninges and drug usage or toxin exposure.

    From a behavioral perspective, this DMX usage implication potential puts one heck of a spin on things. Do you believe this will be explored from a legal perspective?

    Like

  7. Shayla says:

    I must say that this is a great report. However, TM is not here to tell his version of the story and no matter how hard people work on destroying his character on that night he wasn’t doing anything wrong. I have been in the line with crack head buying food. Did I know they were high yes, but that did not give me a right to kill them. Now to be fair I would like you to do a detailed report on Adderall and Tempezapam. To bad you can’t compare it to GZ drug screen test because one was not done. Make sure to mention GZ past arrest record. I am sure someone will bring up TM school record and for those who try I will ask you, which one will be more detrimental to you if TM or GZ was trying to enlist in the Army? Listen that night someone died, how could this situation had been avoided? Since GZ was the adult in the situation his decisions should be held to a higher standard.

    Like

    • John Galt says:

      “no matter how hard people work on destroying his character”

      TM destroyed his own character with parental assistance and/or neglect. Posts on this site merely point out that which was announced by TM himself via social media on the net.

      “GZ was the adult in the situation his decisions should be held to a higher standard.”

      GZ held himself to a very high standard. He endured a protracted beating and called extensively for help prior to finally shooting TM in defense of his own life.

      Like

    • ctdar says:

      sorry, no, GZ was clearly attacked by TM; follow the evidence.
      Age doesn’t matter when comes to self defense.
      Oh and ps;
      GZ had every right to get out of his truck just as TM had every right to walk to the store.

      Like

    • Aussie says:

      TM destroyed his own character on his Facebook page, as well as by his own actions. He committed felony assault upon the person of George Zimmerman.

      Like

    • Aussie says:

      I have to add here that Adderal is not as you describe. It is a legally prescribed medication.

      Also, I once again stress that GZ would not have taken Temazepam prior to driving to the shops because it is a drug that is for sleeping disorder, and the strict instructions for this medication is to take only at night prior to going to bed.

      Like

  8. Pingback: Was Trayvon Martin High On “Purple Drank”? | The Rio Norte Line

  9. MaddMedic says:

    Reblogged this on Freedom Is Just Another Word… and commented:
    Skittles, Iced Tea and Robitussin…ewwww…

    Like

  10. bvc says:

    DXM is best ingested from the Robitussin CoughGels gelcaps. 15mg pure DXM/cap. no tylenol or sedative mixed in. 20 caps per bottle for about $4 @ Walmart – way cheaper and purer than sugary syrup which is also usually 10% alcohol too. 2-3 caps a day is a great appetite suppressant for dieting. 6 will get you high like LSD/XTC.

    Like

  11. JE_Reading says:

    Were Trayvon Martin Witnesses Coached to Change Their Stories? Bennett L. GershmanProfessor of Law, Pace

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bennett-l-gershman/trayvon-martin-witnesses_b_1549128.html

    Like

    • howie says:

      Looks like the only possible chance Corey has is to use Zimmerman against Zimmerman. We have not seen his statements. Nothing else meets the needed threshold for charging him. It will be interesting to see if Omara tries to have them suppressed.

      Like

    • John Gault says:

      Professor Gershman should review Dee Dee’s interview with respect to improper witness coaching.

      Like

      • Bill says:

        Yeah thanks for posting that. That was mighty interesting. I wonder if they could run a stress test on that to see if she was telling the truth. I thought those questions at the end about trayvon bike and such would be used to compare her prior testimony.

        Like

        • John Gault says:

          “I wonder if they could run a stress test on that to see if she was telling the truth.”

          LMAO, she admits lying in the interview. “You want that, too?” (translation: I have lied before and I am ready to lie again, if you want.) “I guess you could say that.” Dee Dee will say anything that you want her to say, and she makes that obvious to the attorney, who nonetheless blatantly leads her throughout the interview. “get off, get off” is also total BS which contradicts her prior “the phone cut off” testimony.

          Listen for the CYA “I want the truth” announcements from the attorney. Those are the points that Dee Dee is so completely stupid that she blatantly admits to lying and the attorney is attempting to preserve his license to practice law. Another interesting point is at the end where the attorney could not get her to state that she told Crump the truth, so he settles for having her admit that she talked to Crump.

          Like

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  13. kolembo says:

    Very interesting stuff…you’re obviously VERY interested in the case.
    You may be right, however, Zimmerman needn’t have pushed the confrontation.

    He had reported the mated, he should have stepped away.

    The kid is dead for no reason whatsoever except that he was suspicious to ‘someone’.
    That’s the only reason there is for his death.

    It’s not good enough.

    Like

    • Sandusky says:

      Can you show me any actual EVIDENCE that GZ “pushed the confrontation”? As Jello333 says below: George did what he thought the dispatcher was asking him to do. THAT is what he did. “Let me know if this guy does anything else.” And, “Which way is he running?” George thought the dispatcher wanted him to keep Trayvon in sight, so he tried to do just that…. by getting out of the truck and following. Then, when the dispatcher advised him to stop… he STOPPED.

      That’s hardly pushing a confrontation.

      And “the only reason there is for his death” is NOT that “he was suspicious to someone” (although if you’ve read all the evidence on this site, you should be able to concede that TM’s behavior that night gave reasonable grounds for suspicion). The reason TM is dead is because he CHOSE to ATTACK someone (the autopsy report on TM, the medical reports on GZ, and the witnesses all make it clear who was delivering the beating and who was receiving it) who was legally carrying a concealed weapon and that person, having repeatedly called in vain for help, reached the point at which any reasonable person would have feared for their life and shot TM to save his own life.

      If you really want to blame TM’s death on someone other than himself, though, you might consider blaming the thieves whose behavior over the previous months had driven the residents to set up a neighborhood watch system in the first place.

      Like

      • kolembo says:

        So you think the kid just decided, on his way home, to beat up Zimmerman? Eh? Just saw Zimmerman and decided to beat him up? Eh?

        Be serious.

        Like

        • ctdar says:

          Yeah, sounds like that’s exactly what happened to the bus driver that TM beat up as well.
          Can’t pick & choose kolembo, especially not here.

          Like

          • kolembo says:

            If that’s what you’re bringing, it’s going to be a very short case.

            Like

            • ctdar says:

              You got something right, it will be a short case coz Judge Lester will dismiss for lack of evidence toward 2nd degree before a jury is paneled.

              Like

              • kolembo says:

                The judge will ask three questions.

                What made you suspicious of the young man?
                Did you know you were carrying a gun?
                What reasonable outcome were you expecting?

                Like

                • John Galt says:

                  “The judge will ask three questions.”

                  Fail. The judge examine witnesses. The prosecutor or the defense attorney asks the questions.

                  Like

                • kolembo says:

                  In determining the sentence….

                  Like

                • Jello333 says:

                  You really don’t understand the legal question here. There are gonna be a ton of issues, big and small. But in the end, it’s gonna come down to one thing: Was this self-defense? And how that will be determined is this:

                  Was Trayvon beating on George at the time of, or an instant before the shooting? The evidence says yes. Was George being injured? The evidence says yes. Did he believe he was in danger of death or grave bodily injury? The evidence (the screaming) says yes. Was it “reasonable” under the circumstances that he believed that? You tell me… I, and I think most people, would say ABSOLUTELY. Could he “escape”? The evidence says he was on the bottom trying to get up…. so the answer is no.

                  And that’s pretty much it. It doesn’t even matter if George “started it”, except he would then be required to TRY to escape. This is an easy call. Self-defense all the way. Nothing else really matters much.

                  Like

                • kolembo says:

                  Self defense relies on the circumstance of the event. To establish self-defense you have to start somewhere.

                  Self -defense is a smoke screen toward which everyone is being herded.

                  It will be too late to counter when the prosecution rests it’s case.

                  Like

        • ejarra says:

          For approxiamately 3 minutes TM was out of sight of GZ. A minute and a half was after he got off the phone with dispatch. During that time, TM should have been back at Brandy’s.

          Why did TM attack GZ? Maybe paranoia, maybe he thought GZ saw him doing something illegal, maybe it had to do something with the drugs he MAY have had, maybe he just felt like beating up a smaller, fat, white/hispanic, older dude. Maybe he didn’t like GZ (it’s posible he knew him or of him via Chad).

          Does it really matter? GZ had every right get out of his car, to follow him, and even walk right up to his face (I’m not saying he did that). Every citizen that lives in that community has that exact right. There’s no difference between that gated communinty and a castle. TM had NO RIGHT to attack and try to kill GZ!! GZ had the right to defend himself, including using deadly force.

          Like

          • kolembo says:

            You see, what TM should and should not have been doing is not in question here.

            He could does not need to have been going home (although he clearly was), he could have chosen to turn back and head to the store again.

            You’re right about suspicion, and this actually is what I’m trying to point out because the case will hinge on that.

            Who’s definition of suspicion are we talking about?
            Is it reasonable suspicion?
            If yes, what reasonable response did Zimmerman expect.
            If no, why did he follow.

            On all accounts it is ‘suspicion’ that is being worked out here.

            Then beyond that, for murder, that is, the intent to kill.

            I think Zimmerman will be caught on ‘reasonable’ suspicion.

            If his defence are clever, they will steer his case away from this because he is being baited.

            The reason I think he fails is because in his mind, he thinks he has ‘reasonable; suspicion.

            The law will not.

            Like

        • John Galt says:

          “So you think the kid just decided, on his way home, to beat up Zimmerman?”

          Yes, TM profiled GZ as a law abiding cracker, noted that he was on the phone, approached, circled (stalked), and realized that GZ was reporting him to the cops. Having just obtained a blunt from the 3 stooges at 7-11, TM was likely holding weed. Based on his prior bust and school suspension for weed, TM became scared of being busted once again, and ran, ditching his contraband. Having ditched the contraband, and noting that GZ had left his vehicle, TM attacked, consistent with his violent nature previously indicated by swinging on the bus driver and fight club events and perhaps caused by brain damage from long term consumption of Purple Drank/ DXM.

          Note that Dee Dee states in the BDLR interview that TM had reached home (Brandy’s house), yet the confrontation occurred “a couple of minutes later” (according to Dee Dee) approximately 70 yards to the North, at the T in the sidewalk. So either GZ captured TM at Brandy’s house and carried him 70 yards to the North to the scene of the fight, or else TM voluntarily went North from Brandy’s house and attacked GZ, consistent with GZ’s statement. If TM had not made the unfortunate decision to travel North from home, confront and attack GZ, then he might still be sippin’ on sizzurp, burnin’ blunts, and stealing jewelry to this very day.

          Like

        • Aussie says:

          TM was not a kid. He was an adult. 17 is an age when we call young people YOUTH.

          Like

      • kolembo says:

        Eh? Don’t be silly. Blame some ‘other’ people?

        Consider this. Whatever ‘state’ Trayvon was in, he was going home having bought a soda and sweets.

        That’s all.

        How the rest of it occurs is solely up to Zimmerman.

        You take Zimmerman out of the equation, there is no public nuisance, there is no espionage, there are no problems.

        Just a kid out for soda and sweets.

        Like

        • howie says:

          Are you enjoying your Purple Drank today? A little early isn’t it?

          Like

        • ejarra says:

          Since he DID NOT go back to Brandy’s. At least not IN her place, can you PROVE that he was NOT trying to break in someone’s home? I bet you can’t PROVE it. You have NO IDEA what TM was doing that night nor why it took over a half an hour for a 15 minute walk.

          Can you PROVE that he was NOT checking out houses looking for unlocked doors? He had do be doing SOMETHING during for those extra unaccounted for minutes.

          Can you PROVE that GZ do NOT prevent another burlary?

          I’m not saying that TM did or was doing anything wrong, but neither did GZ.

          Like

          • kolembo says:

            I’m just trying to give you something to think about in terms of the case is before the court.

            Firstly, the burden of proof is not Trayvons. What he was doing is not in question. Proving that he was NOT suspicious won’t even be attempted.

            Then, arguing that GZ could have prevented a burglary (and he may well have) has no baring on the case.

            And lastly, GZ is being accused of doing wrong from the very beginning, and that the totality of his wrong actions led directly to Trayvons death.

            What was his intention when he called the cops?

            Infact, what was his intention when he left his house that evening?

            Just something to think about.

            Like

            • barnslayer says:

              If TM didn’t attack GZ he would survived that day. However he wouldn’t be TM. TM was a thug acting out. He got what he had coming. If not then by GZ then eventually. Good riddance.

              Like

            • ejarra says:

              You said, “Infact, what was his intention when he left his house that evening?”

              He goes shopping on Sunday nights.

              Like

            • John Galt says:

              “And lastly, GZ is being accused of doing wrong from the very beginning, and that the totality of his wrong actions led directly to Trayvons death.”

              First, GZ did nothing illegal. Second, even if GZ was the initial aggressor (in spite of the fact that Gilbreath testified under oath that they had no evidence of that) then GZ’s right to shoot TM in self defense was restored when TM was on top of GZ beating his head against the sidewalk. Crump’s profiled, pursued, confronted, killed nonsense won’t get past the judge.

              Like

        • Aussie says:

          If TM was going home, then he should have been there well before he was spotted by GZ. In fact TM reached the condo of Brandi Green but he back tracked.

          There was no reason for him not to have gone inside that condo.

          Like

    • Aussie says:

      the confrontation was initiated by TM. There was no pushing.

      Actually I am of the opinion that TM could have set up the confrontation when he ran… but there are other possibilities for the running… such as hiding his stash prior to setting about beating another person.

      On top of that TM had plenty of time to reach the apartment of Brandy Green, but he doubled back to the T-intersection. So do not tell me that it was GZ who initiated any confrontation.

      BTW TM is the one with the deep voice.

      Like

  14. Pingback: The Trayvon Martin Case, Update 9: Of Tea and Skittles and Blunts « Stately McDaniel Manor

  15. Margie says:

    So GZ lied about funds and a passport? I am interested in TM’s drug use thanks for such a thorough job on it. Still if GZ had listened to the cops he called, where would we be now? Maybe hailed as a hero for stopping a crime, maybe just one more report in his file, maybe meeting a kid telling him him I thought you were up to no good in front of the cops. Maybe free to enjoy his life with the knowledge that he did not kill a human being. But no. He did not stand down. I cannot wait for the trial.

    Like

    • John Galt says:

      “So GZ lied about funds and a passport?”
      No, neither. RIF – Reading is fundamental.
      “He did not stand down.”
      Again, RIF. The non-cop police dispatcher advised GZ that “We do not need you to do that.” “Need” means — require –. Compare to “stand down” or “I order you not to follow.”

      Like

    • Jello333 says:

      Oh my god! Seriously? So instead of reading this site, and other sites that have been trying to get the truth out there, you’re still listening to Crump, Corey, and their scummy buddies? That is the only way anyone could still be talking like this: “Still if GZ had listened to the cops he called, where would we be now?”

      George did what he thought the dispatcher was asking him to do. THAT is what he did. “Let me know if this guy does anything else.” And, “Which way is he running?” George thought the dispatcher wanted him to keep Trayvon in sight, so he tried to do just that…. by getting out of the truck and following. Then, when the dispatcher advised him to stop… he STOPPED.

      So your statement that George ignored orders/suggestions from the cops/dispatcher is about as honest as what comes out of Crump’s mouth.

      Like

    • CTDAR says:

      & maybe if TM had just gone straight back to Brandi’s rather than lurking about at night in the rain in private condo association that clearly had neighborhood watch signs posted things would have turned out different.

      Like

    • Aussie says:

      He did not lie about the passport. BDLR is lying

      Like

  16. Pingback: White Civil Rights » Disgraceful “Justice” System in Florida Throws Zimmerman in Jail

  17. Joseph says:

    Very interesting. I wonder if anyone has ever spoken to the 7-11 clerk.

    Like

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  19. Bob Johnson says:

    This tells half the story.
    -The other half is that Travon was likely the burgler the neighborhood was looking for and, discovered, under the influence of the ‘poor mans PCP’ that he had been observed and discovered, reacted under the influence of this long term exposure.
    Facts:
    Travon was under school suspension.
    The cause was for 3 infractions. One having an empty baggie with marijuana residue.
    The other two causes are most telling:
    -One was for having what the school described was a ‘burglary instrument’ some kind of screwdriver or similar piece of equipment that was perfect for facilitating burglary.
    -For, with this device having womans jewelery of different kinds of, and rings.
    -But the main reason, FOR BEING CAUGHT IN AN UNAUTHORIZED AREA.
    You do not get suspended for 10 days as the main reason for being in an unauthorized area if you wander into the school kitchen!

    When combined with one other fact, this adds up to one thing, the other fact is this:
    -This complex had experienced burglaries every other month for the last year and a half.
    So:
    -Travon had bought and sold marijuna which requires a nest egg to start the business.
    -Travon was under suspension for 10 days for circumstantial evidence of burglary and of being in an “unauthorized area”. Suspicion enough, with the marijuana remaindered baggie, of suspending him for 10 days, quite a long suspension.

    -Zimmerman had tutored young black kids. He knew the difference between normal and not normal, suspicious and not. He rated Travon as acting ‘suspicously’ and stated he saw him looking into the window of some homes in the complex when Travon said to his girlfriend he was going towards the complex of homes to get out of the rain, protection from rain the eves of the complex did not protect against.

    Summary:
    -I think there is a high probability that Travon was the burgler that both he and the other neighborhood watch program were looking for.
    -Travon who was using a drug long term known to cause paranoia bolted when he discovered he was being observed.
    -What this research shows is that this drug can cause exactly the reaction that occurred, that when cornered, the user can attack you on what is termed the “poor mans PCP”.

    Conclusion:
    -Travon was the burgler they were looking for.
    -Likely as a result of being observed high and long term use of the poor mans pcp he reacted and as the author states was in the midst of ‘beating the s—‘ out of Zimmerman.
    -The furiosity of pcp users is well documented and is the reason Zimmerman reacted, after having exhausted the presence of mind left in asking the homeowner who observed the fight to ask for help he responded with what may have saved his life.
    -If Zimmerman had access to something other than a gun, be it a stun gun shoot out gun, or mace, while patrolling a townhome complex, this may have ended the fight, and not so tragically.
    -The law should be changed possibly to do this, to restrict the stand your ground law so that neighborhood watch groups in a condominium project at least, are not allowed to carry firearms.
    -The revocation of bail, and and out of prison Zimmerman has to go through now, is one of the few law enforcement sanctions he should, and likely will, ever have to go through for committing justifiable, but naturally repulsive, homicide of this young man in a troubled decending period of his life.
    -The sides to this puts is all in a very difficult position, not the least of which is Zimmerman.
    -Cudos to the presenter on this website who has done all of this research.

    Like

    • CTDAR says:

      Questions on some of your conclusions:
      -any evidence that TM was at the complex the nights of other robberies? His father’s home was several hours away.
      -GZ was not out on NWatch duty that night, he was in his car on the way to Target when he noticed TM suspicious behavior. what would have happened to GZ that night if he hadn’t had his gun which he was legally liscenced to have? With the injuries he had i have no doubt he would have been severely injured or murdered at the hands of TM.

      Like

    • Somuchtolearn says:

      I see a couple of flaws. The break ins had been happening for over a year. I agree with most of your other assertions. Its too bad they couldn’t have met during better circumstances. Maybe GZ could have stepped in and mentored him. I don’t think trayvon was beyond the point of no return. He just needed someone to show him that there other routes he could take in life.

      Like

    • Aussie says:

      agree with others that there are some flaws since one of the burglars who had been caught was by the name of Burgess…. but he was pinged for receipt of stolen goods.

      Like

  20. kolembo says:

    Whether the boy was on drugs or not is irrelevant.
    What suspicious behaviour did Zimmerman note?

    Is being black suspicious?

    None of this happens outside of Zimmermans suspicions.

    It’s not a good enough reason to have a kid dead at the end of it.

    Like

    • howie says:

      Stumbling around “like he is on drugs or something” sounds suspicious to me. The Tox report will likely add more exculpatory…(that means showing Zimmerman to be innocent)…evidence to the mountain that already exists. Especially if it shows Tradevon was on more drugs than Weed. Tradevon would not be dead if he had gone home like a good little boy instead of stalking and attacking Zimmerman.

      Like

      • kolembo says:

        Rubbish. You making stuff up from the good work done here? It’s interesting but it’s not evidence. In fact it’s never mentioned.

        Trying to make this about why Zimmerman was right to intercede won’t work.

        Just pointing that out.

        It has nothing to do with the case against him. Its what he is using as exculpatory consideration on his part.

        i.e. it’s his excuse

        Like

      • John Galt says:

        “Tradevon would not be dead if he had gone home like a good little boy instead of stalking and attacking Zimmerman.”

        Indeed. TM profiled, stalked, confronted, and assaulted GZ.

        Like

    • John Galt says:

      “It’s not a good enough reason to have a kid dead at the end of it.”

      The cause of TM’s death was his violent assault on GZ.

      Like

    • ctdar says:

      How bout being in the backyards of neighbors homes in the dark & rain especially in an complex that had a neighborhood watch system in place after it had 8 robberies/home invasions (mother & child was at home in one) over the last 15 months. oh and all robberies were suspected or committed by young black men.
      I would call that suspicious behavior on TM part….had he just gone back to fathers girlfriends home instead of circling back to jump GZ he’d probably still be alive today.

      Like

    • Patriot Dreamer says:

      Whether Trayvon was on drugs or not is completely relevant. Some drugs make people paranoid, delusional, or more prone to overreact. One of the known side effects of Purple Drank is hallucinations, which might be an explanation for suspicious behavior.

      Like

      • kolembo says:

        Again.

        If this is the argument presented to the Judge, the case will be a very short one.

        On what premise is Zimmerman defining ‘suspicious’?

        On who’s definition will it stand? How far are you legally permitted to act on your suspicions?

        If he argues this way, he’s baked.

        Like

        • Patriot Dreamer says:

          It is not unreasonable to follow someone a little ways and report suspicious behavior to the police. It is unreasonable for Trayvon to react by hitting him in the face, knocking him to the ground, and continue beating on him putting him in fear for his life. It is not unreasonable to defend oneself if you are down on the ground and you have no way to retreat.

          Like

          • kolembo says:

            No, no. It’s unreasonable to follow anyone actually.

            I think this is what the case is going to hinge on.

            Like

            • Patriot Dreamer says:

              You think it is unreasonable to follow someone at all under any circumstances? I guess we will have to agree to disagree on that. GZ was somewhere where he had a legal right to be. And up until the first punch was thrown, there was no criminal act.

              Actually, I think that this case will hinge on the lack of evidence. I have seen no evidence that shows beyond a reasonable doubt that all of the elements for 2nd degree murder under Florida have been met – especially that of “depraved mind”. Manslaughter, perhaps, but not 2nd degree murder.

              Like

              • kolembo says:

                No, no, I’m just trying to give you the probable play at court.

                You see, it’s not what anyone thinks reasonable or unreasonable suspicion boils down to, it’s what the law defines it as, and who can act on it that will be the focus.

                They are not going to try it on ‘evidence’, the dead body is there, the gun is there.

                I’m just trying to point out that you need to shift the focus to something other than ‘reasonable suspicion’ in order to win Zimmermans position.

                Like

            • barnslayer says:

              But it’s entirely reasonable to break someone’s nose, get on top of them and repeatedly slam their head against the cement. That’s a perfectly normal reaction to someone following you, right? Wrong!!!…. what reasonable is killing someone who attacks you, sits on top of you preventing your escape, and continues to injure you. Feel free to do differently if you are the one on the bottom.

              Like

              • kolembo says:

                Your still at the point the trigger was pulled.

                Suspicion began way before that…in Zimmermans head.

                Like

                • barnslayer says:

                  Absurd. TM circled GZ’s vehicle like a shark, sizing him up. At the time of TM’s choosing he chose to engage. He broke GZ’s nose. That is assault. He continued his assault. Slamming GZ’s head onto the pavement goes beyond any possible delusion of self defense. TM had no excuse.

                  Like

        • barnslayer says:

          What legal premise was TM working under?

          Like

    • Aussie says:

      You are on the wrong track. If you listen to the police tape what was stated there is that the youth (not a boy) was acting like he was on drugs or something.

      The dispatcher then asked for more specific details and GZ responded to those questions.

      Since George himself is a black man – of Afro-Peruvian descent – then NO he was not profiling based upon a person being a black man. This is especially true when one considers that many of the residents in the community were themselves blacks.

      Like

    • Aussie says:

      BTW TM was not a kid. He was 17 years old, looked older from a distance, and at 17 he is close to being an adult. So let’s just cut out the “he’s a kid” bull. It is getting boring especially when this was an adult who died.

      Like

    • Aussie says:

      the drugs are very relevant. It seems that you have a comprehension problem regarding the interaction of certain drugs on the brain.

      Now that we know the truth, that it was Watermelon juice at the scene and that the Skittles purchased were purple, we have more than enough evidence regarding the issue of drugs ingested by TM.

      What really convicts TM is his own FB page because it was there that the evidence of both his dealing and his use of Purple Drank was revealed.

      The consumption of both weed and purple drank is extremely dangerous. In fact it is a combination that can set off a psychotic episode or paranoia.

      I no longer have any doubt that on that night TM was acting out because of his paranoia about being discovered for either having used weed again, or for being in possession of weed. There is further evidence that within the previous 24 hours he very likely imbibed in some weed when visiting his cousin.

      If, as suspected TM thought that GZ was the fuzz and that he had been sprung (the circling of the car points to TM attempting to check out whether or not this was the police), the fact that he ran points more to him attempting to hide what he had in his possession than anything else.

      Drug induced paranoia has long term effects, it can be triggered from something like a police siren, causing the person think that the police were coming after him/her even though it might not be the case.

      Once TM discovered that GZ was not the fuzz, simply by listening to the conversation that GZ was having with the dispatcher, he decided to start the confrontation.

      Yes, drug consumption is extremely relevant where the actions of TM were concerned that night. It is the reason why we should know more about that toxicology report as to what drugs or substances were in his system.

      Like

    • Alicia says:

      kolembo; How can you say TM being on drugs was IRRELEVANT? Didnt you read what the drug he was taking causes people to do if confronted by others? Also didnt you read GZ saw TM looking into windows of homes of the complex? You are correct though none of these actions were enough reason that TM is dead but when he attacked GZ the way he did which everyone can clearly see by the photos of GZ if he didnt do something to stop the beating GZ might of been turned into a vegtable or killed.

      Like

  21. kolembo says:

    Right, it’s been fun people. I must go.
    I think what you all must think about, when thinking about the best possible defense for Zimmerman is to steer clear of any position that places Zimmermans judgement about suspicion at the heart of the matter.
    There you will be nailed by race. Period.
    Just pointing it out.
    You’re all being herded precisely where prosecution is driving you.
    Nevermind his trustworthiness of word – that being discussed now – but his ability to make reasonable judgment that underlies even that.

    Be wary.
    Find another angle.

    Like

    • John Galt says:

      “his ability to make reasonable judgment that underlies even that.”

      GZ shot a thug that was on top of him and beating his head against the sidewalk. Sounds reasonable to me.

      Like

      • kolembo says:

        But you’re at the wrong point in the incident. There, you’re already dead.

        What was he doing there in the first place?

        How did we get here?

        That judgment will then be carried forward to the point at which the trigger was pulled.

        The case will be determined long before that point.

        Like

        • John Galt says:

          In spite of Crump’s fantasies to the contrary, the pertinent statutes will apply.
          776.013(3)
          A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place [other than dwelling, residence or vehicle] where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

          776.041 Use of force by aggressor.—The justification described in the preceding sections of this chapter is not available to a person who:
          (1) Is attempting to commit, committing, or escaping after the commission of, a forcible felony; or
          (2) Initially provokes the use of force against himself or herself, unless:
          (a) Such force is so great that the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant; or
          (b) In good faith, the person withdraws from physical contact with the assailant and indicates clearly to the assailant that he or she desires to withdraw and terminate the use of force, but the assailant continues or resumes the use of force.

          Like

          • kolembo says:

            So to say?

            This piece of scripture will be tabled by both sides and dismissed tout suite.

            What I’m trying to tell you is that you are being deliberately lead, where the distinction to be made is not.

            The side that wins this case is the one that correctly identifies the point around which the case rotates.

            The act of pulling the trigger and it’s intent will be traced back and away from ‘stand your ground.’

            Be prepared or prepare to be flanked.

            Like

            • Jello333 says:

              If you really are trying to warn people away from a possible trap, then that’s appreciated. But I think you’re missing a major point here. You seem to be talking about the “but for” doctrine. “But for Action A by the defendant, Action B would never have later occurred.” And in some kinds of cases, that comes into play. But as Alan Dershowitz has pointed out, “but for” does NOT apply to self-defense claims. In other words, even if it can be proven beyond all doubt that George “started it” (by being suspicious of Trayvon, by calling the cops, by getting out of his car, etc)… that just does. not. matter. That all falls away when it comes to self-defense. The ONLY thing that changes, if George is deemed to have “started it”, is that he might then be required to escape/retreat if possible. “If possible” is the key.

              Like

              • kolembo says:

                No, the but for pertains to intent.
                Did Zimmerman have his gun drawn when he entered the situation for instance.
                Will we ever know? I doubt it, but it will be enough to introduce the possibility to argue that ‘but for’ self defence was not an issue.
                And I really am trying to get people to see what is being engineered.

                You see, everyone is going to be defending ‘stand your ground’ as a statute and prosecutrion will completely by pass it by arguing ‘suspicion’ and intent from the very beginning.

                Like

                • Jello333 says:

                  I personally am not relying all that much on SYG. I’m more looking at this as simple, centuries-old self-defense theory. And yes I KNOW, I think we all know, that the prosecution is trying to make this a racial case, about “profiling” etc. I won’t get into all the reasons I think that is ridiculous. And if you’ve only just now come to this site, you probably don’t know this about me… but I’m one of the token liberals here. 😉 I’ve only been here about a month, and I get along fine with people here, despite our big political differences on many issues. And I might as well tell you this too: Despite being a life-long Dem., I will NOT be voting for Obama this time. The reason being he has moved way to the RIGHT of where I consider myself. Yeah I know, the rest of you guys on here can now make fun of me and call me names. 😉

                  Like

                • kolembo says:

                  haha, that’s funny!

                  But you must admit, THIS particular site is at least more interesting than the rest.

                  At least they’re trying to cobble together something.

                  I respect that.

                  In my mind Zimmerman got into something he didn’t expect, Trayvon got too big-headed and the two of them found themselves in a terminal situation because a gun was present.

                  It’s sad.

                  I don’t think Zimmerman ever had an intention to use that gun, and really, the whole thing has just turned into a nightmare.

                  I think 2nd degree has been charged because the case has been politicised so, justice will have to be served but will have to served to both sides.

                  My guess is that he will be found guilty, but the sentence will not be severe, and that ‘Stand your ground’ as a piece of legislation will be the first statute looked at when politics resumes.

                  Meanwhile, despite those to the extreme right of the issue, Zimmerman will be (and is, full of remorse), the family questioning God how all this could have happened to a normal (well…almost…!), well-intentioned family.

                  What I’d like to see is a verdict that recognises and respects both mothers, and two mothers who can publically come to terms with the verdict.

                  As for you my friend, onward!

                  The real battle awaits!

                  I cut you with my ObamaSabreLightStickThingyMaJig, and ask you to parry!

                  Like

                • Jello333 says:

                  Hey, I only said I wasn’t voting for Obama…. I didn’t say I was voting for Romney. I’ll probably end up writing in Bernie Sanders.

                  (DUCKING from incoming… from both you and all my Treeper friends!)

                  Like

                • kolembo says:

                  Hahaha! This was certainly a surprising and excellent meeting.

                  I shall sleep with a smile on my face – and some of it will be on me!

                  Like

                • barnslayer says:

                  Oblamer has been much more of a socialist than he campaigned as. If he was to be more to the left he would have to run on the communist party ticket. If oblamer is too far right for you…
                  1-I’d like to know in what specific ways he was too right.
                  2- Who would you prefer?

                  Like

                • ejarra says:

                  You asked if GZ had his gun drawn. He did not and I can prove it beyond any reasonable doubt. He was holding his keys and a flashlight. The keys were dropped when TM attacked him near the top of the T, the flashlighlight a few feet down the walk. Unless he had grown a third arm, there is NO WAY he could have also been brandishing a pistol.

                  He had taken class put on by the SPD on how to spot suspicious behavior which was mentioned in that Reuters article a few weeks back. What say you if that class and what was taught about “reasonable suspicion” and how it applies comes up, IF there is ever a trial?

                  Like

                • DizzyMissL says:

                  Nice Ejarra. I wish we had a LIKE button here.

                  Like

      • barnslayer says:

        Reasonable to me too. Why is it so hard for anyone to understand that? Only criminals are against self defense. You can’t expect someone to run away if you are sitting on them. TM forced GZ to save his own life.

        Like

    • Patriot Dreamer says:

      It’s not our job to provide GZ’s defense. We are not even trying to do that. We are trying to discover the truth about what happened and see through the lame stream media’s manipulations.

      Like

      • kolembo says:

        Then that is conjecture, and the young man here has done a good job of providing hidden into, and suggesting avenues at what might have happened.

        Truth is, we’ll never know.

        Like

        • Patriot Dreamer says:

          “Truth is, we’ll never know.”

          Maybe, maybe not. As more actual evidence comes out, then we’ll see. The manipulated media narrative and tainted “evidence” has not helped with the truth seeking.

          Like

          • kolembo says:

            No, I think the highly racialised context of American society has not helped with truth seeking.

            I think most American have a sneaky suspicion what went down – a very unfortunate meeting between two people, themselves lost in the racialised context of the meeting, and themselves surprised at, and caught in, an occurance over which they had no control.

            Like

            • Patriot Dreamer says:

              “Racialized context”? Are you saying that Hispanic/black Zimmerman is racist against black people? I don’t think that will go very far given the other things that we know about GZ’s background.

              Like

    • howie says:

      Uh, you forget one minor detail. The Police told Zimmerman to keep an eye on the perp. Zimmerman complied with the request. That my friend, is acting under public authority. When told to cease “Keeping an eye on him” Zimmerman did so. Zimmerman did not bring up race. The Police did. You are pathetic in your argument.

      Like

      • kolembo says:

        You needn’t call me pathetic. It’s not necessary. I’m trying to add a different point of view here.

        Oh wait, sorry, there’s obviously something wrong with the equipment.

        You’re clearly Made In China

        Like

        • barnslayer says:

          That seems like a racist comment. Maybe he’s made in Kenya, like oblamer.

          Like

        • howie says:

          To have a point of view it is imperative to know the facts, and apply the facts logically. To do otherwise makes for a pathetic argument. I called your argument pathetic not you. I want to know how you back your claim that the prosecution is “Herding” me/us right where they want me/us to go. In addition please explain how I/we will be “nailed” by race. Just the facts please.

          Like

    • ctdar says:

      you mean like, Stand Your Ground?
      How is the prosecution gonna get around that FL Law pray tell?

      Who you trying to be deep throat? thats a new troll term to me.

      Like

      • kolembo says:

        sorry, lost you there…

        …arguing ‘stand your ground’ is a constitutional affair.

        For the murder charge they will move back from there to the point at which reasonable suspicion was exercised, then the determination of ‘reasonable suspicion’ will be argued forward into Zimmermans intention as he pulled the trigger.

        They will argue that Zimmerman is not reasonable man, that his judgment is not reasonable, and that his intention, in following Trayvon was to prevent criminal activity from occurring.

        And this is what I’m trying to point out.

        If you argue that Zimmerman had reasonable suspicion going into the event, you’re cornered.

        ‘Stand your ground’ is not on trial…it’s media framing the issue for the public…it’s sound bite.

        Like

        • John Galt says:

          “arguing ‘stand your ground’ is a constitutional affair.”
          Fail, syg is derived from a Florida statute.

          “For the murder charge they will move back from there to the point at which reasonable suspicion was exercised, then the determination of ‘reasonable suspicion’ will be argued forward into Zimmermans intention as he pulled the trigger.”

          Fail, the pertinent issue is whether or not Zimmerman had a reasonable belief that he was in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm at the time he shot TM.

          “And this is what I’m trying to point out.”

          You can’t point anything out because you obviously don’t know the law.

          Like

          • kolembo says:

            Fine. Let it play out. You obviously know the law, and I have an F in your class.
            Just remember this discussion when everyone yells – What? It’s not about stand your ground?!

            Like

        • howie says:

          There is no doubt that Zims intention when he pulled the trigger….if it was not due to a struggle over the gun. The intention is to kill Tradevon. I understand your argument that they will claim it was to prevent criminal activity from occurring because he profiled Tradevon as a criminal. That was the basis for the Detective wanting a 3rd degree manslaughter charge. Wolfinger put the Kibosh on that and wanted to take all the evidence to a Grand Jury. Please explain how the leap to 2nd degree murder comes.

          Like

          • kolembo says:

            I’m not sure how they are going to mitigate the intent to kill to 2nd degree.

            But yeah, I was just trying to add something that maybe will have you guys aware that you have to look at it in a different way if you’re to have any chance.

            I’m black, and Democrat and so (although you can argue that there is no specific link…!) for Trayvon.

            But I actually found the info here interesting and wanted to have you all see it in a way that prepares you to argue something effective.

            Anyway, you know, just interneting and in this case I’m entirely aware what kind of board I’m on so it doesn’t phase me if I get the expected replies.

            I think you get where I’m coming from. It’s not only interesting but prudent to try and see it from somewhere else, if only to know which angle to attack it from.

            Stand your ground is being waved around quite intentionally because the criminal intent has nothing to do with it.

            It’s just a play on ‘common sense’ and the publics polarisation on that statute.

            It will only come into play if they can demonstrate that Zimmerman is capable of ‘reasonable suspicion’ and whether he has the jurisdiction to act on it.

            That’s what the prosecution is going for.

            From there it is easy to argue that at the worst, Zimmerman, packing a weapon, and with reasonable suspicion, intended to prevent a crime, and was aware that he may have to use his gun, and that at least, at the point he fired the weapon, he was already no longer reasonably, ‘standing his ground.’

            At reasonable suspicion, had he drawn his weapon? Will we ever know?

            Look away from self-defence for a moment and see what else you can find.

            My comments have nothing to do with the defense being mounted by Zmmerman but with the prosecution and how they are likely to direct the walk through evidence.

            Like

            • howie says:

              I get it. I understand your point. I am glad you post. I could shoot that argument so full of holes it would resemble Swiss Cheese. But yes, that is what they will attempt. And they will fail. If the theory was true it still does not meet the threshold of 2nd degree murder. Now, let me ask. We had no knowledge of the Purple Drank connection. Did you? Or was it a surprise. Are you aware of the Police asking Zimmerman to keep an eye on Trayvon? If so what do you think about that point. Mr. Zimmerman was still in his vehicle I think. How will the state overcome that issue? Race was brought up by the Police not Mr. Zimmerman. Once Trayvon reached the Green Condo he had to have made a decision to go back. How can the state overcome that? That is just a few minor details. I hope you hang around and bring your points to the board.

              Like

              • kolembo says:

                I think Zimmerman has no idea how this happened.
                I think the cops are complicit in allowing Zimmerman to live a life as an ‘important’ contribution to community policing.
                I think the police themselves are hooking up some kind of deal that allows them to be free of the dirt that flies.
                Because the prosecution is going to argue that the racism is institutionalised.
                That nevermind Zimmerman, the cops were instrumental in collapsing the notion of ‘reasonable suspicion’ with ‘the colour of the criminal’ at least for Zimmerman.
                I think the prosecution will argue that race formed an aspect for that ‘reasonable suspicion’, that Zimmerman went after Trayvon with the explicit understanding that he was armed, that despite the ‘fuzziness’ of what actually occurred during the confrontation, Zimmerman pulled that trigger with the intent to kill Trayvon, and not to defend his life.

                This is how I read it, and if the defense goes straight to Zimmermans actions at the point of the shooting they will concede the argument of intent, and concede to the accident of the actual shooting – i.e. they will have conceded to 2nd degree murder.

                That is how I see it.

                It will be interesting to see how prosecution approaches the bail issue.

                I think they will not focus of whether it makes Zimmermans testimony less truthful, but on his capability to make ‘reasonable judgement’ to begin with.

                The public will fall to his portrayl as a slightly gullible, soft-headed man, pushed into an action he could not understand beyond the racism behind his decision to pursue.

                I most certainly will be on from time to time, because the OPs look into ‘purple drake’ or whatever, was certainly interesting, and if the Defense pushed it on the PR side of the road show (and it is a road show!) they could mitigate the eventual sentence.

                Because there WILL be a sentence.

                Like

                • Patriot Dreamer says:

                  If the prosecution cannot prove ALL of the essential elements of 2nd degree murder beyond a reasonable doubt, then the case is over because the state will not have proved its case. That includes the element of “depraved mind”. What evidence have you seen that proves beyond a reasonable doubt that GZ demonstrated “depraved mind”? 2nd murder is more than showing that someone was killed.

                  Like

                • Patriot Dreamer says:

                  “Because there WILL be a sentence.”

                  That’s what people thought about the Duke lacrosse case, too. How about we wait for the trial? I hope he can get a fair trial at this point, especially considering the tampered with so-called “evidence” that has played out in the media. To what degree has this tainted the potential pool of jurors?

                  Like

                • howie says:

                  I can not argue that the Police are not cooking up a deal. They are the Police. In fact your point that the cops allowed Zimmerman to live a life as an important contribution to community policing dovetails with none other than Mark Furmans comments to date. Mark Furman agrees with you. Does that maybe give you a pause. But it seems to me you are talking strict liability here. That is not applied in felony crimes. As far as a sentence. He is already serving the sentence. Along with his whole family. Without a trial.

                  Like

          • ctdar says:

            Imho i think the intention of GZ when the gun went off (if it did not go off during the beating) was simply to stop (not kill) TMs attack.

            Like

        • ctdar says:

          Puhleeeze, you have to argue the facts & evidence of the case presented at trial not “what ifs” or the biased/edited soundbites by the media.
          Anyways there is not enough evidence for prosecution to try on 2nd degree as they didn’t even provide all the facts (esculpatory)known at the time to ask for that charge. I predict you are right tho the case will not last long because the judge will throw it out based on the lack of evidence warranting a 2nd Degree charge.

          Like

        • barnslayer says:

          Again…absurd. There is no argument what GZ’s intention was when the gun went off (assuming it didn’t go off as a result of TM trying to grab it). GZ was being beaten and the intention was to stop the beating. He owed his attacker nothing.

          Like

    • Aussie says:

      Race is not an issue in this case. This is a black man vs black man situation. Get over it.

      Like

    • Sweetback the Murse says:

      @kolembo: I can’t fathom how you could be so obtuse. You are basically stating that no one has the right to observe and report to police possible criminal activity in their community. The fact that Zimmerman was part of an organized community watch group makes your arguement all the more inane.

      Like

  22. kolembo says:

    Ok, thanks for the discussion, I found this extremely interesting!
    If I don’t reply it’s because I really have to go!

    Good luck, let’s see how it un-folds.

    Like

  23. Pizzed! says:

    @ kolembo says:
    June 3, 2012 at 4:34 pm
    “No, I think the highly racialised context of American society has not helped with truth seeking.”

    And who racialised the context of the GZ/TM tragedy? TM’s parents, the black panthers, Crump, and not the least of all, Obama. George saw an unknown youth cross through the fenced border of Retreat Circle in the evening. Trayvon did not enter through the gates. This is like walking into your neighbors backyard just because there’s an opening when you well know you shouldn’t be because it is private property. The owner inside stops you. You have the right to circle him and then later act out on him? The gated condo complex is private property conjointly owned by the condo owners. Maybe Trayvon was a guest (and not a good one) but when he exits Brandi’s town house he is entering the private properties of many residences. George and Shelley were part owners of the property. George was also the designated watch captain. Do you know what the term “Watch” means? It means he watches out for signs of potential disturbance to prevent it. That includes calling 911 for assistance and the right to follow intruders who enter the premises through illegal way. As the owner of your house, should you be charged with stalking if an intruder broke in and ran out of sight into another room to get away from you? It’s laughable that outsiders who are visiting private property think they have the right to sue the pocket books of the residents when they neglect to keep tabs on their own truant offspring. You racialised beings, like Obama, are really ridiculous.

    Like

  24. digmo1 says:

    I also believed Zimmerman was not guilty. The media always showed TM as a innocent teen. The truth is coming out about TM now. He was a drug dealer (TM)

    Like

  25. creamytracks says:

    DXM is completely different than codeine. Codeine is an opiate that cannot be bought over the counter anywhere. You have to have a prescription to lortab, oxycodone, tylenol 3, etc. DXM produces a completely different high than codeine. The article states that it produces effects similar to pcp and ketamine and that is why it is dangerous. Nowhere does it actually warrant why that is dangerous. When it is used occasionally it is completely safe. The only way you will see negative effects is with daily use pretty much, which can lead to serotonin syndrome because when active the drug blocks serotonin uptake inhibitors. Codeine on the other hand, is almost no different than heroine, just not as strong. You see people mess up their lives daily from codeine while almost no one gets addicted to dxm as it has not actual addictive properties.

    Like

    • Major-General says:

      Indeed, Dextromethorphan was developed because they were looking for a non-addictive replacement cough suppressant to replace codeine. Also DXM causes vomiting in higher than therapeutic doses.

      Like

  26. Pingback: White Civil Rights » Florida “Justice” System Throws George Zimmerman’s Wife in Jail

  27. It all makes Sense now. Thank you, dude, for this page and all your time and effort in research.

    Like

  28. Bob says:

    You know, something about the “finding woman’s jewelry in his backpack”, has me wondering. Could he have used them as payment for weed that he sold others? OR was he going to use them as payment for weed he was buying.

    Like

  29. Pingback: Zimmerman New Video + Evidence - Page 45

  30. Pingback: Trayvon Martin - Page 13 - NFL,NBA,MLB Forum & Message Board

  31. Pingback: Zimmerman passes lie detector test. - Page 5 - Shooting Sports Forum

  32. Inez says:

    I am currently in law school and have recently been learning about character evidence. I didn’t know this kid, but it sure looks like the information on this page “suggests” that he deserved to die. Maybe it took him an hour because he was talking to his girlfriend on the phone and did not want to have the conversation around his family. Have you ever stayed in your car longer or outside a restaurant a little longer than necessary so that you could talk on your cell phone? I have and more than once. What you have said and what I just said is all speculation. The webpage could be a fraud, I mean really, who talks about making drugs on their Facebook page. I like to believe that people aren’t that dumb. Was he a model kid? Maybe not but I have seen kids who did things that are not the best (drugs, gangs, etc) turn around and be stand up citizens. I am not for Zimmerman, but I am not against him. I don;t know all the facts. I just know what the media is allowed to say and what they actually do say. It could all be twisted. All this character stuff about both people takes the focus away from the real issue. Did he break the law. At the time of the incident, did he (George) provoke the situation or did he merely protect himself. That’s what it boils down to and if there are good lawyers on both sides, they will leave the character stuff out of the courtroom and stick with the facts as they have them and the law. That’s what we should do too. And remember Judge, lest you be judged….. Be blessed

    Like

    • teajr says:

      You sound like a nice enough fella and I’m sure that if you got away from someone that you felt threatend by you wouldn’t double back and try to kill him “ground and pound style”. Oh, I’m sure that you don’t drink “lean” in an attempt to emulate gang-bangers who routinely espouse the morals of murderous thugs who deal drugs and count killing someone in cold blood to be a supreme in-group/adaptive virtue. There’s plenty more to to say but you should take the time to read all of the evidence before you troll.

      Like

  33. Pingback: Diversity, Race, & Culture « Manosphere Links

  34. Pingback: Professional Racists convince public that Race the issue in Zimmerman/Martin case, and that officials shorted investigation.

  35. Pingback: It never was tea « Bob Owens

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  37. Pingback: Update #26 Part 2 – Trayvon Martin Shooting – A year of drug use culminates in predictable violence… | The Last Refuge | Kent's space

  38. J Orion Wood says:

    I have never heard of this concoction called “lean” since in my day, the kids would just drink it straight from the bottle and call it a “robo trip.” It wasn’t limited to robotusin and nyquil. They would also swallow a couple of dozen coricidene at a time, which is a cold medication for those who have HBP. I knew a guy who would do this each and every single day. He would get in all sorts of trouble and experience all sorts of paranoia and delusions which would cause him to end up in jail and often times beaten. I probably do not need to get into it because you have done enough research to where you can picture what an individual high on this garbage all of the time would do. He actually ended up dying in 2008 via a truck plowing him as he was walking in the middle of the street. If someone can be so out of their mind that they are capable of walking into the road and not notice a truck coming at them, it is not out of the ordinary that someone on such a substance could act weird enough to get them into the situation that Trayvon Martin got in, including being the aggressor. Of course it is sad and no one wants this to happen, but this is the reality of entering that world.

    Like

  39. Pingback: Top News Stories Fla Police Sergeant Fired For Having Trayvon Martin Shooting Targets Myfox8 Com | Top News Stories

  40. pj43033 says:

    So I am guessing this is the long way of saying the incident was the fault of Trayvon under the guise of a twisted sense of compassion?

    Forgive the sarcasm, but I cannot help noting the assumptions, presumptions and conjecture. While highly informative, this piece clearly misses the point. Take for example the noted THC levels found in his blood. They are pointed out, only because they are present, but the “trace” levels are never once mentioned. Trayvon stated he was looking to quit smoking because he did not want to get caught. Albeit for the wrong reasons, in all actuality, he did quit! His levels were so low he would have passed any THC screening because they fall below well the acquirable levels that are screened for. The initial screening cutoff level is 50 ng/ml while the GC/MS cutoff level is 15 ng/ml. In terms of measurable nanograms per millimeter, had he been smoking in previous seven to 10 days, he would have registered no less than 50 ng/ml. The truth here is that his levels are more evident of an individual who was exposed to passive, second hand exposure, or that of an prolonged direct user who could demonstrate such trace levels for more than three months after last using. The point I am making is: why point such inconsequential data out as it has no true baring on the incident. The same holds true for his likely use of DXM. I think what is being expressed here is that Trayvon was not the innocent victim he was originally made out to be!

    This is where quite a bit of truth lies. The media got this wrong form the onset. Perhaps (as it is suggested) innocently at first, but never corrected once such realities came to light! That is actual problem. The media backed off because it became known that the new poster child for gun control was lost to his own darker side. Trayvon’s character has less to do with this than we would like to admit. If GZ was told to stand down by the police; why then was he out of his vehicle?

    This is not to defend Trayvon, but if I were being challenged and stopped for doing nothing wrong I would defend my rights… physically if need be because I understand the how the Constitution protects my right to move freely and no watch officer has the constitutional authority to infringe upon that right.

    Trayvon was not “innocent” in the tense, or sense the media and his family have made him out to be, but that does not make him wrong for not allowing an individual with no authority to confront him or restrict his freedom of movement.

    He very well could have been on his way to make himself some lean… again… so what. What bearing does that have on the incident itself? There is a better way for our youth to live their lives, last I checked, that, at his age, that is the responsibility of the parents and serves no relevance beyond that.

    We are pissed at the media that for not fairly covering these facts because they were too busy trying to publicly convict Zimmerman for his role in this. We need to address this for what it is, not for what it isn’t! Let’s face it, we are not mad at Trayvon for getting shot, but we sure are taking aim on his character as if it changes the events of that day. It doesn’t. We must ask ourselves as individuals who covet the US Constitution how we would respond if stopped, confronted, or otherwise hindered in freedom by an individual who clearly lacks the authority to do so. If we opt to defend our right to freedom and are gunned down for, would we would our lives placed on blast with such contempt in this manner? I think not.

    What is failing here is Americanism itself and how leftist progressives have hijacked it to advance an agenda to undermine the Constitution itself! If we would effort correcting that in the manner in which e have seem to have efforted the social persecution of this kid, this land would be a better place.

    Like

    • sundance says:

      Well written, and well said. You might find multiple agreements, myself included.

      However, there are two factual and fundamental flaws in the construct of your expression:

      1. Trayvon DID in actuality get high (smoke pot) the night before in Sybrina’s garage, with his cousin Stephen “Boobie” Martin. Stephen has stated this, and the defense team has recently confirmed, through discovery evidence, Trayvon brought Marijuana with him from Miami Gardens and used.

      2. You say: “GZ was told to stand down by the police; why then was he out of his vehicle”? While this narrative has become somewhat of an urban legend at this point it is factually incorrect.

      The fact is, and the records confirm, while on the phone with NEN Operator, the Operator said: “let us know if he does anything else ok”? Zimmerman got out of his truck walking in the general direction of where he saw Trayvon run. After more than several seconds the operator asked if Zimmerman was following him – GZ confirmed, the operator then said “ok, we don’t need you to do that”. At which time, according to recorded call, Zimmerman’s statements, and corroborating timeline analysis, George Zimmerman had lost sight of Trayvon, Zimmerman stopped and began walking back toward his vehicle. He did exactly what the NEN operator said he should do.

      Like

    • eastern2western says:

      I find a huge fallacy of your argument. Yes, it is true that trayvon had the right to defend him self from a stranger but self defensive does not mean putting some one in a near death situation. Zimmerman was definitely putted in a situation where he felt he was in immediate danger and he felt like he had exhausted every possible method to escape before he had to pull the trigger. at this point we do not know who started the fight, but trayvon used excessive for on Zimmerman that had already passed the legal definition of self defense and trigger Zimmerman’s last emergency protocol to defend him self, which is using his gun.

      Like

      • pj43033 says:

        I think my point is being taken a bit too literally… no surprise. I do see what you are saying, but having been in situations where I have been forced to defend myself, things get incredibly subjective. At what point do you stop? At what point do you determine the (and this is a to way street) aggressor will stop and has had enough? In the moment, and I can tell you first hand, some one must do that for you. You cannot always turn yourself off once you have flipped that switch. This is also to say that once things escalate to this point, the person on the receiving end has like questions to answer and must determine the extent of action to take in defense. I do get your point, but when defending yourself things take on a new perspective. Either way, all of this should be moot and the energy expended here should be directed at the larger problems we actually face in determining what our rights actually are and the intent of those in office currently trying to restrict them. TM and GZ are mere symptoms are far bigger issue that too few are willing to address.

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        • jello333 says:

          You realize there’s no evidence that George was the “aggressor”, or that he initiated the final confrontation, or that he made ANY attempt to catch up with, let alone “catch or detain” Trayvon, don’t you? And quite a bit of evidence that just the opposite is the case? Evidence that Trayvon was the one intent on a confrontation?

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        • Sharon says:

          You’re posting on a thread here that is a year old. It is one of over 800 posts regarding the Trayvon Martin situation. You say,

          TM and GZ are mere symptoms are far bigger issue that too few are willing to address

          As you read the posts and comments, research and cross-posting over the past fifteen months regarding these events, you will encounter — again and again — phrases reflecting a basic understanding, often in these exact words, “This is not about George Zimmerman.”

          Yes, indeed, “too few are willing to address” those larger issues. In addition to the hundreds and hundreds of posts about the events surrounding the death of Trayvon Martin, there are hundreds of other posts that pursue those issues. The drop down menu (choose a topic) in the right hand margin includes (among hundreds of listings) listings of 8 posts dedicated to cultural marxism, 76 dealing with Fabian Socialism and over 450 dealing with the background issues that set up the disasters in Egypt and Libya — far bigger issues that too few are willing to address.

          It seems you have made some assumptions about the site’s involvement and interest in the George Zimmerman case. We care very much about George Zimmerman, but this site is not defined by that situation, and does not exist to serve that situation. You may want to review the thousands of posts on the site that are broad efforts to address those bigger issues.

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    • HughStone says:

      George saw Trayvon in front of a house that was previously broken into. He KNEW Trayvon didn’t belong there. He had every right to call the cops and observe the person walking. Gosh, get your facts straight before you rant.

      Like

      • pj43033 says:

        Did anyone ever say he did not have the right to notify law enforcement? I must have missed writing that part… oh I didn’t, my bad.

        Like

        • HughStone says:

          George saw Trayvon in front of a house that was previously broken into. He KNEW Trayvon didn’t belong there.

          Sorry. There you go.

          Like

  41. Pingback: Zimmerman is Going to Jail - Shooting Sports Forum

  42. Pingback: The Trayvon Martin The Media Does NOT Want You To Know About | George Zimmerman Should Be Found Not Guilty For Self-Defense! | The Tallahassee O

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  44. Say What says:

    If the comments were taken before his account was scrubbed why are there not more recent comments about the use?

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  45. anarchyst says:

    One must understand the defective pathology that exists in the minds of almost all urban underclass blacks. You see, “young master trayvon felt “disrespected” for being asked what business he had in that community. (Any ordinary civilized person would have stated that he had relatives there and would have been on his way). His only possible response (due to his defective black pathology) was to pummel and murder Mr. Zimmerman. In this way, he would regain his “respect”. If “young master trayvon” had been successful in murdering Mr. Zimmerman, it would not even make the evening news. It would definitely not be reported as a “(racial) hate crime”.
    Mr. Zimmerman is being railroaded at the behest of the race apologists, poverty pimps, and race hustlers. The prosecutor should be brought up on charges of malfeasance of office for charging Mr. Zimmerman. . .without convening a grand jury. . .

    Why is the so-called “news media” so intent on persecuting George Zimmerman?? It is evident that Zimmerman was “jumped” while heading back to his car and that the “thug” trayvon got what he deserved . . . the urban black “underclass” has a disdain for education, finds “disrespect” under every rock, does not know what REAL “respect” is, and is generally a “menace to society”. trayvon was “casing houses” NOT going to the store to buy “skittles”. Trayvon was walking between houses, not on the sidewalk . . . he was “up to no good”.
    Any civilized person would have answered the neighborhood watch guy that he had been visiting relatives, but not trayvon. . . trayvon’s feral underclass upbringing led to his demise . . .

    Here is a message for all you racial “apologists” for minority “bad behavior” . . .
    It is apparent that you have never lived around or experienced the typical urban feral black. I hope you never have to as they would “eat you alive”.
    The black “underclass” is REAL.
    If you want to “expand your horizons” and experience “authentic black culture”, travel the mean streets of Detroit, South Chicago, Gary Indiana, Atlanta or other “refuges” of “authentic black culture”, preferably at night. I would prefer that you go unarmed, as this will add to the excitement of your “adventure” . . .
    Your outlook on what you now consider “racist” will change in a hurry. You will find that minorities (especially blacks) are “racist to the core”.

    “saint” trayvon was a thug, casing houses, looking for trouble. Looks like his feral black upbringing did him in. Look at that whole trayvon “family” . . . human garbage at its finest. . .they already hit the “racial lottery” with a million-dollar “settlement” from the “homeowner’s association”. How many people are unaware that they did not report their “son” missing for three days?? I am sure that his “family” was aware of “young master trayvon’s” criminal activity, probably benefiting from it themselves.

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  46. Pingback: Treyvon Martin, Homemade Drug concoction, and Zimmerman Innocent | U.S. Constitutional Free Press

  47. george milton says:

    I’m just a little confused about all the people that like the Bernie prosecutor are all outraged and claim they disagree with the jury and saying how “the jury got it wrong”

    Clearly Martin was the local burglar evidenced by (A) his social media pictures of huge jewelry horde spread out on his bed (B) He was also busted with a pile of jewelry in his school locker (C) He had burglars tools lock picks and bump keys and lock bumpers etc.

    Clearly he was a drug user, drug abuser and dealer. Significant evidence in multiple forms from social media to toxicology reports, school busts, friends and of course Zimmerman could tell he was stoned or something.

    Clearly he was violent! Having boasted about beating up the school bus driver – and behavioral aggressive direction was also evident by his social media two middle fingers up and rape dialogs and of course Zimmerman’s account of a vicious beating he suffered.

    So with ALL of this growing mountain of evidence of Criminal burglaring behavior, Drug use and abuse and dealing to other peoples kids behavior and the escalating to now violent psychotic or sociopathic behavior why in the world did we have a trial at all and why are all of these misinformed people still going on about it as if someone just killed puppies and kittens? It’s nuts!

    Like

  48. george milton says:

    And Obama’s response to this? Let’s use this to our advantage to try to ratchet up the gun control efforts. This guy very much needs a fast impeachment!!

    Like

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