Update #6: Trayvon Martin – The Latest Installments

Arresting someone because they are “not black” is just as racist as not arresting someone because they are black.

Another installment in our soup to nuts deconstruction of the lies and obfuscations by the media in the Trayvon Martin case. Along with what verified fact based information we can gather.

Every Day The media looks more and more insufferably inept. You don’t charge someone with a crime unless you think you can convict them, that’s basic prosecutorial ethics. If the evidence isn’t good enough to use at the trial, it’s not good enough to use to arrest.

Throughout the past few weeks more new facts surrounding Trayvon Martin have been discovered thanks to the New Media doing the work the Institutional Lame Stream Legacy Media intentionally refuses to do. Simultaneously we discover how many lies and falsehoods are continuing. Today’s updates include:

      • CNN Backs Away and now confirms the intelligible audio from the 911 recording was not a racist slur.  George Zimmerman said “fucking cold”.
      • Robert Zimmerman shares that police and officials have phone records from George Zimmerman showing he was going shopping on the night in question.
      • Trayvon family attorney Ben Crump exposes the real agenda, money.

In short. This is perhaps the biggest national racial event since Rodney King. It is also shaping up to be the biggest media driven false public story since Richard Jewell. It’s in the process of becoming a watershed event; And, as more facts surface, it continues to look almost entirely fake. It’s a tempest in a teacup.

The whole thing is an institutionally media-generated racialist/socialist psycho-political agitator’s dream come true.

Today we will update and continue to outline and contrast the false narrative sold by the Legacy media types, TV, Print and Radio including: ABC, NBC, CBS, MSNBC, FOX, CNN, PBS, Associated Press, Reuters Media, USA Today, New York Times, Orlando Sentinel and other like-minded affiliates.

For the sake of these continuing posts we are going to focus entirely on Trayvon Martin and not the infinite various nuances and side stories spinning out of the false narrative. I apologize for the length, but accuracy matters and context is needed.

SUMMARY of Content: In summary we now know Trayvon Martin was not the innocent 17-year-old (junior year) High School kid portrayed by the media as: a football player, a volunteer mentor, a math loving student, and loving respectful child, who was serving a five day ten day suspension for tardiness. This was, and is, a complete fabrication. The truth is divergent in the extreme.

But that picture of an innocent child was exactly what the media wanted to sell, because it fit their chosen narrative.

The media even doctored photographs to make Trayvon look more child like.

It is also what the professional race-baiting Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, New Black Panther party wanted to portray; and it should be mentioned at the time of this writing they are still bitterly clinging to it. But losing grip rapidly.

Real photo                                             Doctored By Media Photo

When the truth is being presented, one does not have to work so hard to control, portray, obfuscate and spin. The media have been working very hard because the media has not been presenting ‘the truth’.

But now, against the shere weight of the truth-telling, research, and presentation of facts by the New Media, the Legacy media is beginning to backtrack. Their false construction is crumbling around them.

However, we are not going to let them just skulk back into the shadows. They, the media, created this mess – and make no mistake, this is a huge mistake – and now they are going to be forced to own it. All of it.

We will not allow the media to turn George Zimmerman into Richard Jewell. Not this time. This time we push back. Truth is on our side.

False - The media initially reported that Trayvon was suspended from school for five days because he was tardy. That narrative soon changed to the more truthful ten days. However, they missed the reasoning and a little research revealed much more.

Truth - We now know that Trayvon Martin was suspended from school THREE times in this school year. We do not know the details of the first suspension, rumored Tardiness. But Trayvon Martin was suspended the second time from school in October 2011 for an incident in which he was found in possession of stolen women’s jewelry and a screwdriver that a school security staffer described as a “burglary tool,” The Miami Herald has learned.

According to the report, on Oct. 21 staffers monitoring a security camera at Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School spotted Trayvon and two other students writing “W.T.F.,” an acronym for “What the f—,” on a hallway locker, according to schools police. The security employee, who knew Trayvon, confronted the teen and looked through his bag for the graffiti marker.

Trayvon’s backpack contained 12 pieces of jewelry, in addition to a watch and a large flathead screwdriver, according to the report, which described the screwdriver as a burglary tool.

“Martin was suspended, warned and dismissed for the graffiti,” according to the report prepared by Miami-Dade Schools Police.

Then in February 2012 that second suspension was followed four months later by another one, in which Trayvon was caught with an empty plastic bag with traces of marijuana in it AND a pipe. A schools police report obtained by The Miami Herald specifies two items: a bag with marijuana residue and a “marijuana pipe.” Trayvon was again suspended. This time for ten days.

You can read much more about Trayvon’s drug involvement at Wagist. Click HERE

The Martin family and attorneys et al are furious about the release of background school information to ABC news. Because one of their lawyers, Ben Crump, had filed an injunction to “seal” Trayvon’s school and criminal records earlier this month as soon as he was retained.

The parents argue the background information on Trayvon is irrelevant, yet simultaneously proclaim the background information on George Zimmerman is vital. A tenuous position at best because one of the points of contention is the behavior of both during their encounter.

False – Trayvon was a respectful peer and role model mentor.

Truth - Trayvon left a trail of communication from his twitter account that is retrievable via Google cache. His screen name was “NO_LIMIT_NIGGA” and his words speak for themselves. You can read 152 pages of his twitter communication at DAILY CALLER.

However – Warning, explicit language.

The Daily Caller has identified a second Twitter handle that was used by the late Trayvon Martin during the last weeks of 2011. Tweeting in December under the name “T33ZY TAUGHT M3,” Martin sent a message that read, “Plzz shoot da #mf dat lied 2 u!”

There are also concerning discussions within the twitter communication from Trayvon’s friends about his violent encounter with a School Bus Driver. In the conversation Trayvon is discussing having punched the bus driver in the face.

A reasonable person would think the media would be interested in this aspect. Alas, once again the media shows they only report on that which affirms their pre-scripted narrative. Someone tell Anderson Cooper that it shouldn’t be hard to find that bus driver….. wait, nevermind.

Tattoo on back of Trayvon Martin's neck from Twitter Account. His mom's name is Sybrina

Another picture of Trayvon’s right arm tattoo and physique *Note this tattoo because it is evident in the “fight club” video:

Fight Club – U-Tube Channel

Below is a U-Tube video of Trayvon Martin refereeing a street style fight. Fight club? The video comes directly from Trayvon Martin’s U-tube channel.

Trayvon is the one with the white ballcap turned backwards, silver/black striped shirt, black jeans, and black “Cons” (sneakers). He is called by name by the camera operator, and while the video is grainy at the :47 mark you can identify his right bicep tattoo.

Apparently he was quite familiar, and comfy with “fighting” and physical confrontation. Another Legacy Media narrative destroyed.

Next?

Tea and Skittles

So let’s pause a minute here and put some common sense into the dialogue. Everyone has heard this story about Trayvon going to the store for “Tea and Skittles” right? But has anyone stopped to ask where this story, now urban legend originated? AND how anyone could possibly know? I mean, sadly the guy was dead. So how would anyone know he went to the store for Tea and Skittles.?

From the Washington Times … “And it all stems from Trayvon Martin, he of the walking home from the 7/11 store with Skittles and a can of tea. While wearing a hoodie“…

Where exactly did this “Tea and Skittles” narrative originate? His parents, his attorney(s)? Maybe they read something on his phone about his intention…

But did anyone stop to ask what he was talking about? Tea and Skittles is street lingo for “Marijuana and DXM, somtimes known as ecstasy“.

So is it more likely innocent childlike 17-year-old angelic Trayvon was coming back from a Snapple and Candy run. Or….

Is it more likely that a troubled teenager without supervision and a history of drug use, while serving a 10 day suspension for taking a baggie of pot and marijuana pipe to school, might have been talking about something else.

It is too much to expect the media to find out about this stuff? Never mind.

Oddly, Mr. George Zimmerman specifically mentioned to the police operator on the phone the suspicious subject he was witnessing appeared to be on drugs. But, I digress…..

We discover during a Fox interview with Craig Rivera where the “skittle story” came from. Well, maybe. According to the 14-year-old son of Ms. Brandy Green, “Chad” asked Trayvon to get him the candy when Trayvon said he was going to the store.

We discover that Brandy Green and Tracy Martin (Girlfriend and Dad) were in downtown Orlando at a restaurant and both the boys were home alone, Trayvon Martin aged 17, and Chad Green age 14.

So I guess we are to believe the story about Skittles and Tea stemmed from the 14-year-old son of Brandy Green, passed along via Tracy Martin and Sybrina Fuller. But, again, as with all the stuff from these peeps something just doesn’t pass the sniff test.

I’m not saying the 14-year-old kid was lying, but he sure looked rehearsed and, well, Tommy Flanaganish.

Just sayin’. I mean who wouldn’t believe that a 17-year-old kid, serving his third school suspension (this year), this time for drug use and a marijuana pipe in his backpack; and home alone – unsupervised albeit supposedly “grounded”; would hoof-it, at night, in the rain, right before the NBA All-Star game, for a single can of “Tea” for himself, and a bag of “Skittles” for his 14-year-old half-brother. Altruistic no?

But then again…. Don’t all altruistic 16-year-old tattooed kids, who enjoy getting “head, and loose ass pussy”, carry around screwdrivers (described by teachers and school administrators as a “burglary tool”)in their backpacks filled with women’s jewelry, while writing “What The Fuck” on school lockers.

I mean, doesn’t that describe an all-American boy looking for every opportunity to hike in the dark, and rain, to 7-11 for “Tea and Skittles” when they turn 17? I mean really. Sheesh, to think there could be any doubt.

Trayvon Martin was allegedly out at night, on foot and in a rainstorm getting iced tea and skittles. Ok, here’s the address where the altercation took place from the police report: 2381 Retreat View Cir Sanford, FL 32771 The 7-11, you know, the place to buy skittles and an iced tea, where’s the closest one and how far is it on foot?

The closest “convienience store” appears close to a mile away. In a rainstorm, for a bag of skittles and can of iced tea, both ways? Possible? Sure. Plausible? That story ought to be able to be checked, and rather easily — all convenience stores these days have video recorders.

So has anyone checked to see if indeed the deceased hiked to the store?

These are pretty basic questions — if the story of going out for skittles and iced tea holds up.

The Trayvon family can “leak” phone records to ABC to help sell their narrative. ABC can steal video from the police station to help sell the narrative (and then backtrack when it backfires). But interestingly when it comes to a simple 7-11 video we get ((crickets)) ?

See what happens when you inject common sense? The house of cards crumbles down.

Trayvon Martin's parents. Tracy Martin (Dad) left and Sabrina Fulton (Mom) center. Attorney Benjamin Crump (background)

Financial Opportunism

Trayvons mother also applied for Trademarks on his name last week.

Sabrina Fulton (Trayvon’s Mom) is seeking Trademarks for the phrases “I Am Trayvon” and “Justice for Trayvon,” according to filings made last week with the United States Patent and Trademark Office.

In both instances, Fulton is seeking the trademarks for use on “Digital materials, namely, CDs and DVDs featuring Trayvon Martin,” and other products.

The March 21 USPTO applications, each of which cost $325, were filed by an Orlando, Florida law firm representing Fulton.

Odd no? How many “grieving parents do you know that would be concerned with “Trademarking” their dead child’s name? And why?

But then again, the Trayvon “Brand” would be more marketable and valuable if the constructed image of the innocent child victim could continue.

Alas, now it becomes clear, why all of those people who stand to profit from the death of Trayvon, consider any fact based, or truthful, information too risky to the Trayvon brand.

This also explains why Sabrina Fulton (Mom) and Tracy Martin (Dad) hired an attorney named Benjamin Crump. The very first action that Crump took upon retention was to file an injunction to “seal” Trayvon’s school and criminal records. Thereby trying to hide the troubling background.

Benjamin Crump - Attorney for Trayvon's parents

Discovery of Trayvon’s background presented a risk. Not just a risk of character assassination toward their son per se, but a risk to the “brand image” being created. A financial risk. In addition, various Black organizations have invested themselves in the outcome of this case. Controlling the “image narrative” is a key component to their continuing ability capitalize.

Benjamin Crump Esq has been quite revealing in the motivation surrounding the cries for the “arrest” of George Zimmerman.   There is much more beneath the surface and is outlined in the following post.   CLICK HERE  The support and documention to show a financial purpose and motivation is becoming more clear daily.  Much more to follow on this.

All Lawyered Up..

One of the key aspects of this fiasco to keep in mind is the “inability” of George Zimmerman to publicly defend himself or tell his story. Yet the family of Trayvon Martin, and their supporters, can talk 24/7 to every media outlet and personality.

It seems every day a new legal representative face appears in the media, or even on Capitol Hill as an attorney for Tracy Martin (Dad) or Sabrina Fulton (Mom). A partial list of their known lawyers are:

      1. Benjamin Crump Esq. (Family/Natl Media) – Personal injury lawyer
      2. Daryl D Parks Esq. (Family/Natl Media/Gov’t Relations) – Personal injury lawyer
      3. Ms. Jasmine Rand Esq. (Natl Media/Public Relations) – Personal injury lawyer
      4. Ms. Areva Martin Esq. (Family/Natl Media)
      5. Ms. Kimra Major-Morris Esq. (Financial/Family/Media)

This composes only a partial list of the National legal team hired by Trayvon’s family. Compared to Crump, Parks, Rand, Martin and Major-Morris, George Zimmerman is at a significant narrative disadvantage.   And this doesn’t include the Florida States Attorney General’s office “Angela Corey”, from the Jacksonville Division, who is conducting the investigation with her 65+ person support team of prosecutors and investigators. Indeed, A flea looking into a furnace.

Also he cannot share his side of the story for two more reasons:

First, because he is literally under threat of bodily harm and injury. The New Black Panther party has placed a MILLION DOLLAR bounty on his head, “Wanted Dead or Alive”, and tens of thousands of people are rallying daily with the Black Panthers and professional race-baiters.

Even Spike Lee tweeted the address of Zimmerman’s home to his 248,000 followers. Fortunately for Zimmerman Spike Lee sent out the wrong address. However, profoundly unfortunate for the 70-year-old couple living there now housebound with around the clock security. :(

Secondly, if Zimmerman was to speak now every word, nuance, phrase and intonation would be scrutinized by not only the media, but by law enforcement who are under extreme pressure to arrest Zimmerman, with or without legal merit. He has been advised to keep quiet. He cannot talk without a ridiculous amount of risk.

The FBI Arrives In Sanford

SANFORD, Fla. — FBI agents on Monday were questioning potential witnesses in the Trayvon Martin shooting, confirming to NBC News that the agency had begun a “parallel investigation” that focuses on whether the teen’s civil rights were violated.

Agents are seeking information on George Zimmerman’s background and whether he was racially motivated when he pursued Martin after calling a 911 police dispatcher about his presence in the community, an FBI official told NBC.

The agents were at the Retreat at Twin Lakes, where Martin was shot dead by Zimmerman, the gated community’s neighborhood watch captain. (more)

THE 2005 ZIMMERMAN “ASSAULT” CASE

Another fabrication the media allows to continue without correction surrounds a prior 2005 arrest (non-conviction) of George Zimmerman. The media and talking heads have repeated this mantra long enough to embed it in the psyche of almost every reader/listener. They frame the arrest as a battery charge against a police officer.

But whoa… wait a minute. Arrest with NON-Conviction. Huh? Well the details are more nuanced and they prefer you not to know the full story because the headline fits their narrative, the content doesn’t.

In 2005 Zimmerman was in a bar having a drink with a friend. Unbeknownst to them an undercover sting operation was going on inside the bar with police officers posing as patrons to catch bar operators selling alcohol to minors.

An altercation between one of the undercover (regular clothes) officers and a friend of Zimmerman took place. Zimmerman thought his buddy was about to be in a bar fight so he interjected and shoved the guy away from his friend. The guy was part of the sting. Out of spite for the shove, and potentially frustration for no minor alcohol sales, they arrested Zimmerman and his pal.

One media outlet did report truthfully. ONLY ONE.

In 2005, Zimmerman was charged with resisting arrest with violence. State alcohol agents said Zimmerman pushed them while they were arresting a friend of his during an underage drinking operation at a bar. Zimmerman avoided a conviction by going into a pretrial program that is offered to people with no prior arrests.

FACTS

Now some facts to deconstruct the left-wing media bias.

On Feb. 26, when Zimmerman first spotted Trayvon, he called police and reported a suspicious person. He called the non-emergency phone number not 911. He was taught to call this number by police as part of the Neighborhood Watch program. He was asked by the police operator a question about describing the person. The operator specifically asked “is he black, white, or Hispanic” Zimmerman described Trayvon as a black male, wearing a grey or dark hoodie, acting strangely and perhaps on drugs.

Initial reports reflected that Zimmerman was fulfilling his shift on the neighborhood watch patrol. However, according to his brother Robert, George was not “patrolling”, George was driving to Target to go shopping when he noticed Trayvon acting suspiciously.

This was further supported today with an interview with George’s father on the Sean Hannity show (4/4 ) where he shared that investigators are in posession of George Zimmerman’s phone records showing a text to his sister that he was headed out to go grocery shopping at Target.  

Zimmerman was Captain of the Neighborhood watch program because the Home Owners Association voted him as such. In this gated community there were eight burglaries, nine thefts, and a shooting just in the past year.

In fact, the local homeowners’ association reports that George Zimmerman actually caught one thief and aided in the apprehension of other criminals. The Miami Herald wrote about this on March 17th. None of the thousands of articles and cable news segments that came after, thought this was important.

In fact the Miami Herald goes on to interview neighbor, Ibrahim Rashada, who is black. Rashada confirms that there has been a lot of crime in the neighborhood and indicates to the reporter that the perpetrators are usually black.

One of the commonly repeated media narratives is of George Zimmerman being a vigilante type personality. Nothing could be further from the truth as outlined in this report from an investigative piece done by The Philadelphia Enquirer, and intentionally ignored by all other National Media Outlets:

[...] people are wondering if the 28-year-old Zimmerman is an earnest if somewhat zealous young man who was just looking out for his neighborhood, or a wannabe cop who tried to take justice into his own hands.

Attorneys for Martin’s parents say Zimmerman is a “loose cannon.”

“He’s a wannabe police officer,” lawyer Benjamin Crump said. “Why did he have a gun?”

But some neighbors welcomed his vigilance, at least before the shooting.

Samantha Leigh Hamilton, an auto-dealership employee who has lived on Zimmerman’s street for about a year, said that she once left her garage door up and Zimmerman noticed it while out walking his dog. He notified another neighbor, who let Hamilton know.

“The only impression I have of George Zimmerman is a good one,” Hamilton said Wednesday.

Hamilton said another neighbor, a black woman, would regularly inform Zimmerman when she was out-of-town so that he could keep an eye on her place. Hamilton said that when she moved into the middle-class, racially mixed community of about 250 identical townhouses, the black neighbor told her, “Hey, if you need anything, you picked a really good area, since George is part of our neighborhood watch.”

Zimmerman, who was captain of the neighborhood watch and licensed to carry a gun, made 46 calls to police since 2004, according to department records.

Hamilton said there had been several break-ins in the past year, including one three doors away in which burglars took a TV and laptops.

“When I hear about him calling the police constantly, it kind of makes sense to me because we had so many break-ins recently,” she said.

The homeowners association’s February newsletter said that Sanford police had beefed up patrols in the neighborhood and that officers on bicycles were making random checks of front yards and backyards. It was not clear how big the neighborhood watch was, but Zimmerman was the dominant force.

If you’ve been the victim of a crime within the community, after calling the police, please contact our captain, George Zimmerman … so we can be aware and help address the issue with other residents,” the newsletter said. It added that the neighborhood watch group was looking for more participants at its monthly meetings.

Zimmerman moved with his parents from Manassas, Va., to Florida about a decade ago. He lived with his parents in nearby Lake Mary for several years before moving to the Retreat at Twin Lakes, records show. He lives in the gated community with his wife, Shellie, a licensed cosmetologist, but is now in hiding because of death threats. (read more)

The selling George Zimmerman as a racist narrative ran smack into a significant push back from Zimmerman’s family today (4/2). In a letter to the NAACP his family refuted the allegation(s), and provided specific example of how George had put himself on the line for his black community.

The letter also described how Zimmerman was one of “very few” in Sanford, Fla., who spoke out publicly to condemn the “beating of the black homeless man Sherman Ware on December 4, 2010 by the son of a Sanford police officer.”:

“Do you know the individual that stepped up when no one else in the black community would?” the family member wrote. “Do you know who spent tireless hours putting flyers on the cars of persons parked in the churches of the black community? Do you know who waited for the church‐goers to get out of church so that he could hand them fliers in an attempt to organize the black community against this horrible miscarriage of justice? Do you know who helped organize the City Hall meeting on January 8th, 2011 at Sanford City Hall??”

“That person was GEORGE ZIMMERMAN. Ironic isn’t it?”

“The main point for this letter is to explain to you that the black community has labeled George a racist without any investigation at all,” the letter continued. “Regardless of the fact that George personally spoke to many of your constituents, not one has stepped forward and said, ‘Hey I know that face. That is the Hispanic guy that was standing up for Sherman Ware. That was the only non‐black face in the meetings for justice in this case.’”

“You know as well as I do that there are many NAACP followers that recognize George from the Ware case as well as many other good things that he’s done for the black community.”

READ FULL LETTER

In addition the framing of the “supposed” racial slur during the 911 audio tape has now been debunked and shown that he said “fucking cold” as he was watching Trayvon Martin.   Video Here

George Zimmerman would not know Trayvon Martin because Trayvon was visiting, staying with his Dad’s girlfriend in the Orlando sub-division. Both the Dad and the girlfriend were not supervising Trayvon at the time. Neither adult were home. We now know they were in Downtown Orlando having dinner.

Much controversy has been “created” by the media about the fact Zimmerman was “following” Trayvon, as if that represented some form of unusual behavior.

Zimmerman was driving to Target when he noticed Trayvon outside the community clubhouse. Being as he is captain of the Neighborhood watch patrol, of course he’s gonna follow the suspicious person. That’s what concerned citizens do. See something suspicious – Say something to police – and Keep watch. DUH?

This point is not in contention by either Zimmerman, his attorney, or the other side. It is a manufactured talking point of the race-baiters. AND it is being promoted by an agenda driven biased media.

While on the phone with police George Zimmerman stopped the car and got out of his SUV to follow Trayvon on foot.

When a dispatch employee asked Zimmerman if he was following the 17-year-old, Zimmerman said yes. The dispatcher told Zimmerman he “did not need to do that”. Zimmerman replied “OK”, and immediately turned back toward his SUV.

There is an exceptional breakdown of the timeline including maps of the complex available at WagistEvidence that Trayvon Martin Doubled Back“. I highly recommend readers visit the analysis including a timeline, maps, and phone records which substantiate Zimmerman’s account of losing sight of Trayvon, and being confronted while en-route back to his vehicle.

  • 0:15 – The best address I can give you is the clubhouse. [A]
  • 0:45 – He’s just staring at the houses. Now he’s staring at me.
  • 1:00 – He’s coming towards me.
  • 1:20 – He’s coming to check me out.
  • 2:08 – Shit, he’s running.
  • 2:14 – Sound of truck door being closed. [C]
  • 2:20 – He’s heading towards the back entrance. [referring to E]
  • 2:25 – Are you following him? Yep.
  • 2:45 – He ran… Zimmerman stops and completes the 911 call. [E]
  • 3:05 – Call ends.

Entire Transcript:

Dispatcher: Sanford Police Department. …

Zimmerman: Hey we’ve had some break-ins in my neighborhood, and there’s a real suspicious guy, uh, [near] Retreat View Circle, um, the best address I can give you is 111 Retreat View Circle. This guy looks like he’s up to no good, or he’s on drugs or something. It’s raining and he’s just walking around, looking about.

Dispatcher: OK, and this guy is he white, black, or Hispanic? Zimmerman: He looks black. Dispatcher: Did you see what he was wearing?

Zimmerman: Yeah. A dark hoodie, like a grey hoodie, and either jeans or sweatpants and white tennis shoes. He’s [unintelligible], he was just staring…

Dispatcher: OK, he’s just walking around the area…

Zimmerman: …looking at all the houses.

Dispatcher: OK… Zimmerman: Now he’s just staring at me.

Dispatcher: OK–you said it’s 1111 Retreat View? Or 111?

Zimmerman: That’s the clubhouse…

Dispatcher: That’s the clubhouse, do you know what the–he’s near the clubhouse right now?

Zimmerman: Yeah, now he’s coming towards me.

Dispatcher: OK.

Zimmerman: He’s got his hand in his waistband. And he’s a black male.

Dispatcher: How old would you say he looks?

Zimmerman: He’s got button on his shirt, late teens. Dispatcher: Late teens ok.

Zimmerman: Somethings wrong with him. Yup, he’s coming to check me out, he’s got something in his hands, I don’t know what his deal is.

Dispatcher: Just let me know if he does anything ok

Zimmerman: How long until you get an officer over here?

Dispatcher: Yeah we’ve got someone on the way, just let me know if this guy does anything else.

Zimmerman: Okay. These assholes they always get away. When you come to the clubhouse you come straight in and make a left. Actually you would go past the clubhouse.

Dispatcher: So it’s on the lefthand side from the clubhouse?

Zimmerman: No you go in straight through the entrance and then you make a left…uh you go straight in, don’t turn, and make a left. Shit he’s running.

Dispatcher: He’s running? Which way is he running?

Zimmerman: Down towards the other entrance to the neighborhood.

Dispatcher: Which entrance is that that he’s heading towards?

Zimmerman: The back entrance…fucking [unintelligible]

Dispatcher: Are you following him?

Zimmerman: Yeah

Dispatcher: Ok, we don’t need you to do that.

Zimmerman: Ok

Dispatcher: Alright sir what is your name?

Zimmerman: George…He ran.

Dispatcher: Alright George what’s your last name?

Zimmerman: Zimmerman

Dispatcher: And George what’s the phone number you’re calling from?

Zimmerman: [redacted by Mother Jones] Dispatcher: Alright George we do have them on the way, do you want to meet with the officer when they get out there? Zimmerman: Alright, where you going to meet with them at?

Zimmerman: If they come in through the gate, tell them to go straight past the club house, and uh, straight past the club house and make a left, and then they go past the mailboxes, that’s my truck…[unintelligible]

Dispatcher: What address are you parked in front of?

Zimmerman: I don’t know, it’s a cut through so I don’t know the address.

Dispatcher: Okay do you live in the area? Zimmerman: Yeah, I…[unintelligible] Dispatcher: What’s your apartment number?

Zimmerman: It’s a home it’s 1950, oh crap I don’t want to give it all out, I don’t know where this kid is.

Dispatcher: Okay do you want to just meet with them right near the mailboxes then?

Zimmerman: Yeah that’s fine.

Dispatcher: Alright George, I’ll let them know to meet you around there okay?

Zimmerman: Actually could you have them call me and I’ll tell them where I’m at?

Dispatcher: Okay, yeah that’s no problem.

Zimmerman: Should I give you my number or you got it?

Dispatcher: Yeah I got it [redacted by Mother Jones]

Zimmerman: Yeah you got it.

Dispatcher: Okay no problem, I’ll let them know to call you when you’re in the area.

Zimmerman: Thanks.

Dispatcher: You’re welcome

Visit the entire construction at Wagist

Nope, as indicated in the 911 transcript, the first place Zimmerman saw Trayvon was near the “clubhouse” [A]. Which he identified to the Police operator as the “best address I can give you” (See map below).

The sidewalk [F] was where Trayvon eventually ran but not until after walking past Zimmerman’s truck [C].

Zimmerman was talking on his phone to police when Trayvon walked past looking at him. Zimmerman drove a little way, parked, then walked toward the gate [E]. Zimmerman told dispatch he thought the person was headed to the exit the gate.

Zimmerman lost sight of Trayvon because Trayvon turned right down the path [F] toward home [D]. Zimmerman told the dispatcher he had lost sight of the person while continuing toward the gate [E]. That was when the operator asked him “are you following them, because we don’t need you to do that”, to which Zimmerman replied “OK” before turning around and heading back toward his vehicle.

Zimmerman explains in his statement that Trayvon then approached him as he was returning to his SUV. According to Zimmerman Trayvon approached from his “left rear”, which makes sense if you look at where Trayvon ran [F], and where Zimmerman was returning from [E].

A view of the sidewalk "F" from Ms. Brandy Green residence "D" (on right) toward point of confrontation in the distance.

There’s only one thing wrong with the Zimmerman description. It totally makes sense. Not only has it been consistently told, recorded, and his statement never wavered one bit. It was also repeated in various contexts during five hours of interrogation and then during a crime scene walk-through step by step re-enactment with police the next day.

What does that consistent and sensible description mean? It means Trayvon initiated the confrontation and subsequent attack.

Zimmermans explanation, along with his recorded voice describing his position, proves Trayvon was heading “BACK” toward Zimmerman and intercepted Zimmerman near the intersection of the two sidewalks.

That was exactly where the scuffle took place, and was witnessed first hand by “James” who lives at the unit labeled [G]. This was the location where Trayvon was shot.

If I can piece this together from 911 recordings, witness statements and police reports, then what was the intention of Craig Rivera specifically and intentionally misleading viewers?

(*Note HatTip to Wagist who is has also reconstructed the entire event, and who also concludes that Trayvon “doubled back“. Trayvon had to double back, because in the police recording Zimmerman lost sight of Trayvon. [F] is the only place he could have run while Zimmerman ran toward [E]. Why Trayvon didn’t just continue to [D] HOME essentially explains the motivation of Trayvon and backs up Zimmerman’s account).

Much false controversy has been made about the police dispatcher instructing Zimmerman not to follow the person (Trayvon), but it really is a moot point. It is standard protocol for all operators to say “do not engage” or in this case “we don’t need you to do that”, because they are trained to avoid liability by police departments fearful of being sued. As soon as the police dispatcher told him not to follow, he stopped, turned around and attempted to walk back to his vehicle.

There is about a one-minute gap during which police say they’re not sure what happened next.

According to the police report George Zimmerman told them he lost sight of Trayvon and was walking back to his SUV when Trayvon approached him from the left rear, and they exchanged words.

Trayvon asked Zimmerman if he had a problem. Zimmerman said no and reached for his cell phone, he told police. Trayvon then said, “Well, you do now” or something similar and punched Zimmerman in the nose, according to the account he gave police. His nose was broken and bleeding when police arrived.

Zimmerman fell to the ground and Trayvon got on top of him and began slamming his head into the sidewalk, he told police.

Video of Zimmerman account HERE 

An independent witness from the next house [G-above] gave the same descriptive to police of Trayvon on top of Zimmerman punching him and pulling his head up and down slamming it into the sidewalk.

Zimmerman began yelling for help.

Several witnesses heard those cries, and there has been a dispute about whether they came from Zimmerman or Trayvon. Lawyers for Trayvon’s family say it was Trayvon, but police say their evidence indicates it was actually Zimmerman requesting help.

One witness, named John, who has since talked to local television news reporters, told police he saw Zimmerman on the ground with Trayvon on top, “pounding him” — and was unequivocal that it was Zimmerman who was crying for help. He described with specificity what both people were wearing and their exact body positioning.

The Ridiculous Voice Analysis

The eye witnesses have not stopped the Trayvon family from continuing to sell the “Trayvon was the one screaming” story to the media.

The Orlando Sentinel stepped into this narrative over the weekend with an “expert” in voice analysis who has determined the screams did not belong to Zimmerman. The Lame legacy media has jumped on this narrative. They’ll regret that.

This “expert” is now totally discredited. And once again it shows how Lame the Lame Legacy Media truly is. It only took a day and a half for someone within New Media to trace his ‘motive’, poor credentials, and insufferable stupidity. Not only will his basement expert analysis never reach a court room, but within a week, maybe two, the Legacy Media will have to back track just like the prior talking points that are so easily dispatched. Just One Minute provides the deconstruction. – Consider:

The Self-Refuting Expert Witness The Orlando Sentinel Is Touting

Back on the Trayvon Martin killing audio expert Tom Owen is getting good press with his claim (broken by the Orlando Sentinel) that it is not George Zimmerman heard screaming for help on a 911 call. Here are CBS, CNN, MSNBC, Mediaite and the Boston Herald.

I squawked that other experts would question that conclusion – a good forensic audio match requires examples of speech similar to the sounds being compared. So using George Zimmerman’s spoken voice on his 911 call and comparing that to the screams heard in the background of a second 911 call would be a no-no for the other experts.

And Tom Owen agrees! In describing his techniques at his website, we see this: (my emphasis):

The examiner can only work with speech samples which are the same as the text of the unknown recording. Under the best of circumstances the suspects will repeat, several times, the text of the recording of the unknown speaker and these words will be recorded in a similar manner to the recording of the unknown speaker. For example, if the recording of the unknown speaker was a bomb threat made to a recorded telephone line then each of the suspects would repeat the threat, word for word, to a recorded telephone line. This will provide the examiner with not only the same speech sounds for comparison but also with valuable information about the way each speech sound completes the transition to the next sound.

There are those times when a voice sample must be obtained without the knowledge of the suspect. It is possible to make an identification from a surreptitious recording but the amount of speech necessary to do the comparison is usually much greater. If the suspect is being engaged in conversation for the purpose of obtaining a voice sample, the conversation must be manipulated in such a way so as to have the suspect repeat as many of the words and phrases found in the text of the unknown recording as possible.

The worst exemplar recordings with which an examiner must work are those of random speech. It is necessary to obtain a large sample of speech to improve the chances of obtaining a sufficient amount of comparable speech.

And this is the man who now claims that a few seconds of background screaming can be matched to calmly spoken words.

Well, if the prosecutor loses his mind and waves Mr. Owen up as an expert witness in the trial of George Zimmerman, the defense will ask him to re-read this material from his own website, then ask the judge to dismiss him. Good luck to the prosecutor.

I have no doubt that the investigators have already received this advice, so let’s not hold our collective breath waiting for the audio deus ex machina. This testimony won’t be credible and may not even be admissible.

As to why Mr. Owen is sticking his neck out, well, he may be civic minded. But he rolled out his new voice recognition software on March 1, so he also may welcome the publicity.

I figure the media mavens that are starting to play catch-up will catch up to this by May. Is is asking too much to expect them to review his website and ask a few basic questions, such as, why does your website say this Zimmerman match can’t be done? Oh, why ask why.

HMM: In an Addendum Jacob Sullum wonders whether the dubious audio evidence, presumably in a larger context, would be allowed to help establish probable cause for arrest even if it had little chance of being admissible at trial. Over to the lawyers!

For a lighter look, from ‘someguy’ in the comments, I am stealing a quick Frequently Unasked Questions about Tom Owen. Imagine this as a trial cross-examination, because the prosecutor may be having nightmares about just this:

Tom Owen. Is he really a “forensics expert?” Well, no. He has a B.A. in History, not forensics.

Well, surely since he’s an expert, he went to Harvard or Yale or Oxford, right? Well, no he went to Bellarmine College in Kentucky. You’ve heard of Bellarmine College, right? [Normally I deplore this credentialism but if Tom Owen was an expert for the right his college degree is all we would hear about.]

Well, but surely he’s worked for the FBI or CIA as a forensics examiner? No, but he did work for the New York Public Library in charge of their Rogers and Hammerstein archive.

But surely he’s written some books about forensics that the FBI and CIA use, right? No, but he has written extensively about the banjo and did a coloring book:

      • Tom Owen, Scaling the Fretboard (Chappell Music 1973)
      • Tom Owen, The Chord Coloring Book (Chappell Music 1974)
      • Tom Owen, Tenor Banjo (Chappell Music 1975)
      • Tom Owen, Lead Guitar (Chappell Music 1976)
      • Tom Owen, The Classic Blues Singers (Chappell Music 1977)

What about his wife Jennifer Owen … surely she’s a hotshot FBI forensics examiner, right? No, she makes Powerpoint presentations and is a secretary with a political science degree, not a forensics degree.

But surely they have an advanced forensic acoustics laboratory where they conduct their forensic analysis right? No, they just have a computer in the basement of their house in New Jersey right next to the railroad tracks.

But surely he’s a member of the American Board of Recorded Evidence? Yes, but he and his wife run the Board. He’s the chairman, and she’s a board member. The Board is run out of a weight-loss clinic in Springfield, Missouri along with a bunch of other dubious “boards,” “colleges” and “Institutes.”

      • American Board for Certification in Homeland Security‎ – Address: 2750 East Sunshine St. Springfield, MO
      • American Association for Integrative Medicine Inc – Address: 2750 East Sunshine St. Springfield, MO
      • American College of Forensic‎ Examiners International – Address: 2750 East Sunshine St. Springfield, MOC
      • College of Wellness – Address: 2750 East Sunshine St. Springfield,
      • MO American Psychotherapy Association – Address: 2750 East Sunshine St. Springfield, MO

There are no colleges or real boards here. There’s a fat farm weight loss clinic at that location. They appear to have certified themselves experts by running this board themselves.

Now, let’s examine the software they used to perform their analysis. How good is it?

Well, given two KNOWN samples of speech by President Richard M. Nixon, the software only matched two recordings to a 86% match.

Remember, Mr. Owen said he’d expect a 90% match before he concluded that the voices were identical. Although when he’s testifying in murder cases, he claims a 68% match is enough to send someone to prison for the rest of their life (CT v Sheila Davalloo). Even in the software makers own demonstration of the product, using two KNOWN samples of speech from the same famous person, there was only an 86% match.

What about the algorithm they’re using to make the comparison? How good is it? UNKNOWN. That’s proprietary. They won’t tell you what they’re actually measuring.

I am leaving that up there for folks to check over (and it was left on April 1), but if it is even mostly right, this guy won’t be taking the stand in The People versus Zimmerman.

I did note yesterday that Mr. Owen is rolling out their new product as of March 1, 2012, so he welcomes the publicity. (Just One Minute)

The Media Lies About Weight

At this point it becomes imperative to point out one of the most blatant media lies. George Zimmerman’s weight.

The media continues to report that George Zimmerman outweighed Trayvon Martin by 100 lbs. You see that report and justification for the impossibility of physical assault everywhere. It is factually wrong.

How did the false reporting start? A reporter researched a prior 2005 arrest report for George Zimmerman which placed his weight at 248 lbs. So that was what they reported as his 2012 weight. 248 lbs.

In actuality he weighs 170 lbs. Yeah, he lost weight in those 7 years.

No-one, not one reporter or TV talking head bothered to check. The 100/lb weight disparity fit the narrative, so they ran with it. Even now with the facts clearly available the media continues to sell the same lie.

So let’s get this straight once and for all, at least here in the world of factual reality:

George Zimmerman 2005 5′ 8″ @248 lbs

George Zimmerman 2012 5′ 8″ @170 lbs

  • George Zimmerman is 5 foot 8 inches 170 lbs
  • Trayvon Martin was between 6 foot even and 6 foot 3 inches (per mom) 160 lbs (according to police report)

IF THEY CAN’T EVEN GET THE DESCRIPTIONS CORRECT WHY WOULD PEOPLE BELIEVE ANYTHING THE MEDIA IS SAYING.?

The New York Times Finally got this corrected and confirmed Zimmerman’s weight at 170 lbs, and Trayvon Martin at 160 lbs.

The Gun

According to Robert Zimmerman, and the statements that Zimmerman gave during his 5 hour police interrogation. During the scuffle on the ground Trayvon noticed the gun at Zimmerman’s waist. Both Zimmerman and Trayvon began trying to get his handgun out of his belt. Trayvon attempted to get the gun away from Zimmerman. Zimmerman then shot Trayvon once in the chest at very close range, according to authorities.

The impact of the shot thrust Trayvon upward, backward, and partially spun him around to land on his stomach.

The handgun was a Kel-Tec PF9 semiautomatic 9mm pistol. The police took immediate custody of the weapon when they arrived on scene. The gun was recovered with a full magazine and only the chambered round had been fired.

This is a condition associated with something preventing the gun from cycling a fresh round from the magazine into the chamber after the shot was discharged. One thing that can cause this condition is another man’s hand wrapped around the pistol, retarding its slide mechanism.

This would indicate, as the coroner’s office affirmed, that specific gunshot residue patterns and cuts were present in certain places on Trayvon Martin’s hand(s), and that a struggle for a gun was taking place when the fatal shot was fired.

The Injuries and The Paramedics

When police arrived less than two minutes later, Zimmerman was bleeding from the broken nose, had a swollen lip, had bloody lacerations on the back of his head and grass located on his back.

Zimmerman was processed as a potential criminal suspect and placed handcuffed in the rear of the second arriving patrol car. Paramedics from the Fire Dept. gave him first aid in the vehicle upon arrival but he said he did not need to go to the hospital. He got medical care the next day.

He was held in the vehicle while preliminary investigation took place and the crime scene was initially processed. The police retained custody of the handgun.

George Zimmerman was transported to the police department where he was questioned, recorded, and processed. The police questioned Zimmerman for five hours at police headquarters without an attorney present, apparently Zimmerman felt he had nothing to hide. The police report noted Zimmerman was “bleeding from the nose and the back of the head.”

Visit Breitbarts Site for definative evidence of Zimmerman’s injuries.

It is almost embarassing at this point to have to deconstruct another Trayvon family narrative the media is selling as some grand discovery. The 2nd ambulance was cancelled while en route.

Yes it was. So?

The Trayvon family is using this discovery to outline a timeline narrative first attempted on CNN by Don Lemon. On CNN anchor Don Lemon’s commentary Sunday – he hosted several segments about Trayvon Martin and “expert analysis” of the story.

In one segment his expert said that Trayvon was treated by paramedics on the scene for 8 minutes and declared dead. Subsequently she concludes by looking at the arrival time of George Zimmerman to the police station, minus the travel time there, Zimmerman could only have been medically treated by EMS for a total of 7 minutes.

This flawed, cognitively dissonant and pretzel logic analysis, went on for over 15 minutes.

REALLY? Ever hear of treating two victims at the same time? Ever hear of two different EMS units being dispatched simultaneously? Perhaps the Fire Dept paramedics (EMT) and also an Ambulance Service (EMS)? DUH!!

Hello? Read the police report. The “Fire department Paramedics” treated George Zimmerman in the rear of the police car. Why claim as fact there was only one EMS/EMT unit on scene? Is she psychic? INSUFFERABLE. And they call this professional analysis? Pffftt… There, I just shot the entire segment to smithereens.

As luck would have it the next day, Monday, the Trayvon family trotted out an emergency audio where a “SECOND” ambulance was cancelled while en-route. A SECOND AMBULANCE. That means there was already one ambulance (EMS) on scene treating Trayvon, while the fire dept paramedics (EMT) were treating Zimmerman. Just like the police report, police officials, and just like Zimmerman himself has stated.

It was NOT an either-or situation. Two different emergency vehicles and services were on scene, they asked George Zimmerman if he wanted to go to the hospital for his injuries, he said no, the paramedics treated him on the scene. If he had said yes, the 2nd ambulance would not have been cancelled. The family is getting desperate, and grasping at straws.

There are conflicting reports on what toxological evidence was retrieved from Zimmerman. CBS reports none were done. However, that CBS article appears flawed in that regard. A Police Dept. spokesperson told local Orlando media a full toxicology analysis was completed including, blood tests, breathalyzer and the police took residue and swab samples of his hands, arms and body.

In addition the police took custody of Zimmerman’s clothing for further evidence processing.

George Zimmerman was fully cooperative with investigators both on the scene and at the police department. He was noticeably shaken and distressed, but fully cooperated with all questions and gave both written and recorded statements for over five hours.

Zimmerman’s statements were compared against witness statements, and against the recorded phone calls including a timeline analysis. In addition, his statements were compared against the physical evidence at the scene. The following day, detectives reenacted the shooting with Zimmerman at the scene.

After intensive questioning, George Zimmerman was released from custody pending further investigation. The police retained custody of the handgun and clothing of Mr. Zimmerman.

Zimmerman sought medical treatment the following day for his nose, head, face and anxiety.

Trayvon’s body was evaluated, autopsied, and crime scene processed by the coroner’s office.

The following day the police re-created the events with George Zimmerman on the scene.

Who was Trayvon Martin? For the police this became a question difficult to answer. Unfortunately Trayvon was unknown to anyone at the scene, surrounding residences, investigators, police, or any person available for contact within the community.

Completely understandable when you consider Trayvon lived in North Miami, and no-one within the gated Orlando community was familiar with him or where he was from.

It is important to remember that neither Trayvon’s father Tracy Martin, nor his father’s girlfriend were home within the community at the time of the shooting.

Hence the delay in police figuring out who this John Doe actually was.

ODD STUFF

There is one odd Point of contention from the Mitchell family about a “supposed” phone call Trayvon made during the time Zimmerman was following him.

The call was reportedly to Trayvon’s girlfriend in Miami, who has, according to the Mitchell’s completed an affidavit stating that Trayvon told her on the phone he was being followed.

Both Trayvon’s parents, and their attorney Benjamin Crump think this phone call is an important aspect because it shows George Zimmerman was “following” Trayvon Martin.

The family thinks it is so important they had the girlfriend swear an affidavit to that affect. However, something doesn’t smell right about this because again today we discover something new. There is a lie embedded in this entire “phone call” narrative, but what aspect is false is yet unknown.

Why so sure?

Tonight, Tuesday (3-27) on CNN Piers Morgan Show Florida Attorney General Pam Bondi was questioned about the case and some general aspects surrounding the ongoing investigation. During the conversation about wanting to get to the bottom of everything. Pam Bondi specifically stated that Trayvon’s girlfriend had previously been unwilling to cooperate with police.

Bondi stated she was hopeful that Trayvon’s girlfriend would now become more cooperative, because since the time of the initial early investigation, up to and including all subsequent inquiries, she has been unwilling to talk to police or provide records of the phone call. She has refused numerous times to be interviewed and would not provide a statement to police, nor allow herself to be interviewed even with legal representation.

As of Friday night March 30th according to Martin family attorney Benjamin Crump, Trayvon’s girlfriend still had not talked to police. She was refusing to give sworn testimony, or a sworn statement.

As of Monday night April 2nd, again according to Benjamin Crump, “DeeDee” still refused to cooperate with police.

As of Wednesday night April 4th, she is still refusing to be cooperative.

Doomed To Repeat History?

Could it be because they cannot accept any sworn statement for use against Zimmerman, from a person not willing to testify? Or, perhaps, DeeDee is “unable” to give a sworn official statement, or testify, for fear of perjurous implications..? Zimmerman’s defense team must have an opportunity to question any witness “if” Zimmerman is indicted by a Grand Jury. But why won’t the media challenge all of the Trayvon lawyers about this?

Could it be the family is trying to establish a case in any other manner than to put DeeDee into the mix? Perhaps DeeDee is in a similar position to Tawana Brawley? You might remember in the Brawley case, again with Al Sharpton, Brawley was not permitted to give a sworn statement, or sworn testimony to the grand jury. And dismissed every attempt at supeona even to the extent she left the state of New York and moved to Virginia.

Why? Well, I’ve got a strong hunch, but it is supposition so I’ll not go there because for the sake of intellectual honesty every cintilla of verbage on this subject up to this point is factual, fact based, and verifiable.

However, I’m not sure why this phone call is even a point of contention.

Again, neither the police, nor Zimmerman dispute the fact Trayvon was being followed by Zimmerman. If anything it leads further credibility to Zimmerman’s explanation of events.

However, again I note while the parents of Trayvon are stating they are in possession of a sworn affidavit from the girlfriend, she has never allowed herself to swear the same to police or law enforcement. She has refused any and all attempts at being interviewed.

Perhaps even more alarmingly, if she’s being truthful, this aspect does bring up a general common sense question:

“If” this phone call was actually taking place during part of the time Zimmerman was following Trayvon, and if Trayvon told his girlfriend that someone was following him, then why wasn’t anyone worried or looking for Trayvon when he didn’t show up or come home.?

If anything this bit of information makes it even more odd that Mom, Dad, or Trayvon’s girlfriend were not worried even more about where he was.

Was there a phone call? Was there even a trip to a 7-11? Was it snapple and candy, or Pot and Ecstasy/dxm? Hmmmm

There are two obvious really tragic aspects to his death. One is the shooting, and a life cut so short.

But with a full measure of brutal honestly, another is the culpability of his non-engaged parents in creating a morally undisciplined teenager.

Their visible outrage now showcased in the media is understandable given their grief. But perhaps a dose of guilt is intertwined.

Apparently it should be.

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198 Responses to Update #6: Trayvon Martin – The Latest Installments

  1. Wagist has a new article at length with some new information also. Definitely worth checking it out.

    The Missing 2:30 & DeeDee’s Testimony
    http://www.wagist.com/2012/dan-linehan/the-missing-230-and-deedees-testimony

  2. Gino says:

    While we know something of the short history of Trayvon, we are now sure that his parents have had more than their share of anxiety with him in the past and presently..Obviously, the parents are conspiring to suppress any and all information pertinent to Trayvons life history, which begs the question what are they hiding? The interval from the time of death to the time the parents were notified by police is of a particular concern only in the context that the parents were not looking for him for several days.Having said that we can now go to a new hypothesis, what if the parents already knew of Trayvons death well before the police notified them.?
    Perhaps the fourteen year old son of the girlfriend conveyed this information to them with an alarming caveat that Trayvon and him were out looking to break in to a home within the neighborhood and/or had previously broken into homes within the neighborhood?Mr. Martin, in knowing this could have contrived the skittle story to protect the fourteen year old.Thus he would eliminate all future conjecture that the boys had performed any robberies within the neighborhood.Thus, eliminating the wrath of their neighbors, community and the HOA..Mr. Martin perhaps was looking at the bigger picture which would be the Homeowners Association would proceed with evicting them from their residence regardless of whether or not they owned or rented the property. (Yes! subject to a moral clause incorporated in many associations contracts).
    Trayvons parents would not be searching for him because they knew he was deceased, knew that he was not supposed to be in the neighborhood and knew the fourteen year old girlfriends son was conspiring with Trayvon..The parents needed time to create a plausible explanation and story which would have included Trayvons girlfriends fabricated testimony. Perhaps she unwittingly was willing to oblige them and was being influenced with the promises of future monetary award until she realized and/or was notified of the punishable consequences of her actions.This would explain why she refuses to provide any testimony,.
    The contrived story in the month after Trayvons death evolved presenting the potential and opportunity for an economic windfall to the parents.Thus, they continued to allow the false narrative.presented by the media, Sharpton, Jackson, the NAACP and The New Black Panthers.In conclusion the hypothesis herein presented is not substantiated in any affirmative facts but instead supposition also being know as what if.

    • tnwahm says:

      Your hypothesis actually fits with my doubts that the 14 yr old didn’t hear the commotion in the neighborhood. I find it hard to believe that a 14 yr old didn’t hear sirens.

      • Aoife says:

        The neighborhood is next to 417 and Rinehart Road. Sirens would be common and we tend to ignore things like that after a while. I just think we may never know all the ins and outs but I do think that GZ will be exonerated by what evidence exists, or have some minimum bs charge brought against him. From what I now understand, if they even bring a manslaughter charge Uhrig is going to eat them alive in court. Too many holes that give reasonable doubt. I think that’s why the authorities have put some info out that they are getting ready to release information AND ‘they’ are ready for whatever. Are they expecting riots because they don’t have anything or know that what they do have won’t placate some?

  3. Sick to Death of RACISM says:

    It is obvious that you idiots do not care that a young man was killed. say what you will, but EVERYONE knows that had the tables been turned, there would have been arrest first and questions later. It doesn’t matter what is said on either side, the fact UNDISPUTED is that after Zimmerman was told not to follow he did. And how many of you go to Target with a gun on your person. What happened to this kids right to STAND HIS GROUND. The truth is Zimmerman hunted this teen down. Say what you will , but if some unknown man was following you, watching you, and on his phone your SIMPLE MINDED ASS would have ran. As an adult I know I would have. I think you are a part of the reason RACIAL profiling conntinues to exist. The reason any MINORITY teen is Suspicious. If that were your son your ASS would be doing the EXACT same thing that his parents are doing. And let’s not get started on how IGNORANT you sound. You are a RACIST yourself. This fact is obvious bacause instead of just pointing out what discrepencies you believe there are, you decide that it is IMPORTANT to speak poorly of every BLACK person your simple mind can think of . So do something more constructive with your time. You’ve attacked everyone who does not believe Zimmerman. Your INVESTIGATIVE reporting leaves alot to be desired. I listened to those 911 tapes myself and Zimmerman did not go back to his truck. His ASS was out of breath on those tapes. He never said “OK”, when the SECOND officer told him not to follow. P.S. If you have any children, you would know that SMOKING pot, Graffatti, and cursing are part of being a teen today. And by the way, how many WHITE teens have been involved in DRUG and ALCOHOL related fatal accidents. How many non BLACK teens have shot up schools and killed innocents. So before you make any further RACIST remarks, maybe you should investigate that and put your findings on the WEB. I DARE YOU.

    Photobucket

    Ladies and Gentlemen the institutional left is now wildly shooting up flack in any direction. We are clearly over the target…. /SD

    • stellap says:

      What is it with these people and CAPITAL LETTERS????

    • stellap says:

      “If you have any children, you would know that SMOKING pot, Graffatti, and cursing are part of being a teen today.”

      Really? That’s the way your children behave, and you just accept it because “it’s part of being a teen today”?

      • Menagerie says:

        My children are no longer teens, but they are not so old that I do not remember and know what it is like to guide strong willed young men with more testosterone than restraint. They push the limits on what you allow, but you set firm, non negotiable rules, and you enforce them. Yes they cussed (unfortunately, they learned some of it from me), and I know at least one experimented with pot. Graffiti, I doubt, because they were taught to respect property, and because they would have failed to see any point in it. We were not a perfect family, but we tried to watch, to guard against thuggish behavior. Above all else, they knew that there were serious repercussions when rules were broken. The most important thing was, they had responsibility from a young age, and they had jobs. This taught them to respect and appreciate other people and their accomplishments, and to value what someone’s hard work had bought them.

        • bill says:

          there are to many flaws with your argument…but one key one is there are black kids that live in that neighborhod none of which have come forward to claim they are being watced because they are black…maybe that is a line the martin attorneys can play….buy them a kid to come forward..second, it was the martin legal team and there supporters that started digging up dirt on zimmerman and trying to hide the dirt on martin…so yes it is important that everyone know martin was not this little innocent 12 year old the martin legal team tried to paint him up to be.. if you want to call me a RACIST i dont care. waite a min that word is supposed to scare me and bring me under controll RIGHT…doesnt work

    • Aussie says:

      stupid person, how many times do you have to be told that Zimmerman was not following the THUG Trayvon Martin at the time that George Zimmerman was punched in the face, and had his head smashed into the concrete.

      On top of that unintelligent and extremely stupid person, how is it that you do not understand that Trayvon Martin was attempting to take the gun so that he could shoot Zimmerman at the time that the gun was fired?

      Try dealing with those facts you extremely stupid person… and then get over yourself.

      P.S. George Zimmerman is a registered Democrat. He is not white. He is Hispanic.

    • Patricia says:

      Obviously, you didn’t bother to even read the article. I told my husband that most black people won’t read it because they would rather listen to the media. A child would rather have his parents read the book than read it himself.

  4. bill says:

    i see one problem with your walk thru zimmerman stated he was running toward the back gate….that would be at the end of twintree lane…so he had already made the turn toward the entrance…he had to have been on the side walk because zimmerman left his vehicle…..and the chase was over because zimmeman stated… ok he ran….

  5. bill says:

    i have looked for a timeline based on the calls do you know if anyone has done that..what im looking for is the timelapse between zimmeerman hanging up and the first 911 call…

      • bill says:

        thanks sundance, so based on the timeline of the calls…i now know that the fight occured right after he hung up with the dispatcher…knowing that is was roughly 2 min. after the disconnect from the dipatcher…and the first 911 call came in..at which time the fight had already started…so he could have been close enough to hear martins conversation with the dispatcher…altho the girlfrinds staements dont really add up it is hard to belive what she says so i exclude those…it appears the fight started about were, according to my calculations, zimmermas hung up with the dispatche.r that would verify the fact he had turned around to head back to his truck when martin approched him.

        • bill says:

          so he could have been close enough to hear martins conversation with the dispatcher….sry was supposed to be martin could have been close enough to hear zimmermans conversation with the dispatcher..

          • Nicole says:

            If he was close enough to hear the convo and he was there to break into houses, then why would he confront zimmerman? he would know the police were on their way.

  6. Sick to Death of RACISM says:

    Stelap: If you were intelligent enough to read my entire comment , you wouldn’t be asking such a STUPID question. I said that that is the norm and it is. No my children are honors students, but I am not with them every second of the day. I said that the information about Trayvon is not important and if you do have children and you think they do nothing WRONG, you are sadly dissolutioned. Your comment is exactly why kids shoot up schools while their parents think “my child is an Angel” who would NEVER do anything like that. Your children are the one’s you should be concerned about and not mine. Stick to the script. What difference does it make about the CAPITAL letters. LIKE I SAID BEFORE, DO YOU GO SHOPPING WITH A GUN ON YOUR PERSON? IF SOMEONE YOU DIDN’T KNOW WAS FOLLOWING YOU, WHAT WOULD YOU DO?WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE WHAT TRAYVON BOUGHT AT THE STORE? AND THE PERSON WHO WROTE THE ORIGIONAL ARTICLE SURE KNOWS ALOT ABOUT DRUG DEALING . Comment all you want, but answer my qestions in the process. Like the man said think for yourself. I’m heartbroken for anyone, any race who has been killed UNJUSTLY. Are you?

    • stellap says:

      You are clearly a very unhappy person who is carrying around a lot of rage. You know nothing about me, and I did not, and would not accept the kind of behavior you described as ordinary in my house. I know that such behavior exists, of course, but you spoke of it in such an off-hand manner. I did not say that my child was an angel, as that child definitely was not, as I was not.

      I’ll stick to whatever script I like, so mind your own business. Nothing wrong with carrying a gun when I go shopping, is there? I didn’t know you wouldn’t approve of it. Sorry!

      I don’t feel any need to answer any other questions of yours. I can tell you one thing – mind your mouth or you will never post here again. Take that as a first warning. I don’t have to put up with any crap from you.

    • stellap says:

      Since you told me your children are honor students, I should tell you that mine graduated summa cum laude from a Big Ten school.

    • Wow, way to miss the point. Like, completely.

      Oh, and you talk to Stella like that again I’ll kick you out myownself.

    • DO YOU GO SHOPPING WITH A GUN ON YOUR PERSON?
      Yes.

      IF SOMEONE YOU DIDN’T KNOW WAS FOLLOWING YOU, WHAT WOULD YOU DO?
      Ask them why they were following me.

      WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE WHAT TRAYVON BOUGHT AT THE STORE?
      If he bought beer, cigarettes and a fifth of Wild Turkey it might merit inquiry. No? Besides, how do you know he even went to a store?

      AND THE PERSON WHO WROTE THE ORIGIONAL ARTICLE SURE KNOWS ALOT ABOUT DRUG DEALING.
      Nah, I know a lot about kids/teens, and yeah I’ve been high more than once.

    • barnslayer says:

      Sick to Death,
      You are all over the place with your essay. You can’t expect anyone to:
      1-read ALL THIS (you ain’t no Shakespeare).
      2- Answer all you questions at once.

    • texan59 says:

      If you had taken a few minutes to peruse this site, you might have your eyes opened just a bit. No one on this site who is here on a regular basis has not disagreed with you pertaining to the sad fact is that a young man is dead. That young man happens to be black. Those are the facts that we all know. That is all you know unless you were there. Were you?

      I’m sure that if you would like to participate in a grown-up discussion that people might be more receptive to your point of view. It’s no different here than it is in person. Is someone is an asshole, they are an asshole. You are acting like one.

      The other issues that are being discussed here pertain to information that is being put out either by the police or media outlets. It has been proven that many of the media outlets have slanted their coverage to pertray GZ as a bully, a stalker and a white man. According to police reports thus far, all of those do not appear to be correct. The media has tried to portray TM as an angelic little frail young man. The only truth there is that he was a young man.

      I would assume that anyone who goes by the twitter name of “NO LIMIT NIGGA” is not quite as angelic as you try to portray him. We have also seen many of his tweets. This kid sure tried to act like a thug and a hustler. Maybe he was. Maybe he wasn’t. Did you know him personally? Can you personally vouch for his character?

      There are very few children who are complete angels. I wasn’t. My daughter wasn’t. That does not mean that we endorse smokin’ blunts, taggin and having underage sex with as many partners as we can. As it appears this young man was doing. You have to admit, it’s hard to get suspended from school three times in one year. Nobody can just be that unlucky.

      Now, hopefully you’ll play nice and these folks will let you hang around. If you can’t act like a grown up, they probably won’t. Have a happy and blessed Easter.

    • Aussie says:

      hey imbecile,

      Any self-respecting parents would not accept that such behaviour is the norm. In fact such behaviour is unacceptable and it should be reinforced as being unacceptable.

      No one gives a tinkers that you claim your children to be honours students because in some schools honours remains an extremely low standard.

      Plus if your spelling is a guide, I can only assume that the low standard is the norm in your area.

    • Aussie says:

      BTW imbecile it has not been proved that the thug Trayvon Martin actually purchased anything at the store. There is the possibility that he stole something, but I have not seen any reports stating that a bag of Wrigley’s skittles and a can of iced tea were found at the scene. For all we know the police might have found ecstasy (another name is skittles) and marijuana.

      Zimmerman in his call to the police stated that the thug was acting like he was on drugs.

    • Aussie says:

      and one more thing dummy,

      my white female cousin was kidnapped, raped and murdered by a white man…..

    • Gino says:

      Sick to death of racism, Wow you are ranting to the point you are making no logical sense you need to calm down.You address young Mr. Martin’s death as if you have all the evidence you need to convict and with all due respect many of the arguments that you raise presently are unsubstantiated.However, to be fair to you I would suggest that you provide us with the specific Florida statute under which Mr. Zimmerman should be arrested.Please remember we are a nation of laws so it is important that you specify the statute and secondly provide your explanation as to why said statute is viable for the arrest and more specifically the conviction of Mr. Zimmerman.Furthermore, please address all legal ramifications and absolute evidence pertinent to this case.I will tell you this if you present your opinion in unbiased format that is non prejudicial we certainly will evaluate same and if in fact you are correct many of us here would support your initiative.

  7. Sick to Death of RACISM says:

    The next time I go shopping, I’ll be sure to load my gun and put it in my purse. You never know when a Suspicious teen wearing a Hoodie, might cross my path. If it’s raining I will be sure not to cover my head! And if I happen to be BLACK, why even leave the house!

    • stellap says:

      That chip on your shoulder will ruin your posture.

    • What state do you live in?

    • Aussie says:

      stupid person, if you have done nothing wrong, and if you are not casing the neighbourhood then you have nothing to fear….

      Maybe with that gun in your purse, and you get into a fight, you might want to be careful because your assailant might try to take it from you after you have been knocked to the ground with a punch to the face, and then had your head slammed into the footpath….

    • All I can say is, thank you for not pre-judging us. Have a nice day.

    • Gino says:

      Sick to Death of Racism, I find your comments are blatantly disrespectful and biased. I also find it interesting that you are demonstrating a contempt for white people and that you articulate your arguments predicated upon black only interest as if they are exclusionary and vested.Perhaps, you do not realize that many families in this nation have been effected and impacted by racism and blacks are not exclusionary. Religion, nationality and color of ones skin have impacted our peoples all the way back to the days of the planes Indians.
      As I was reading your commentary today I was thinking about Malcolm X.and his quiet unassuming demeanor.I remember after his days work there was always men in a black no pun intended to escort him to his residence.Malcolm was an interesting person and until such time as the militant left persuaded him to follow their leadership he was a pacifist.In the end Malcolm realized and acknowledged that his biggest mistake was his rhetoric of hate.
      I bring this to your attention to demonstrate that anyone can be persuaded to act in a particular manner and as long as the black slave masters want to keep the race imprisoned for their own personal gain they will continue to make promises and present propaganda to be dissimulated.Do not follow their lead demonstrate you are a free thinker.

      • Aussie says:

        It was the NOI and the leaders of the Black Panthers who ordered the death of Malcolm X. It was Louis Farrakhan, friend of creepy in the White House who ordered the assassination of Malcolm X.

        I can barely remember hearing about Malcolm X and he used to give stirring speeches, but I doubt that he was anything like the race-baiters Sharpton and Jackson.

        Then there was Martin Luther King. Who ordered his execution? Did Jesse Jackson have a hand in his death?…. just asking because I have a lot of doubts about Jesse Jackson… he is no reverend anything.

    • bill says:

      wonder how many of the teens in that complex wear a hoodie and have never had a problem…it was the news media and blacks that started the deal with the hoodie why dont you ask them if they have a problem with ppl wearing hoodies..they have made more out of the fact that he was wearing a hoodie than anyone else humm.

  8. bill says:

    why is it so hard for some ppl to accept that a pearson walking around my neighborhood in the rain that i dont recognize would get my attention…

  9. bill says:

    on the voice recordings…anyone remember the casey anthony case….a new software was used to analyse her computer…the prosecution ran with it… only to be proven there was a flaw in the software…if i remember correctly…

  10. Tim says:

    So I guess the cries for help was fabricated. Yeah right. Never heard tea referred to weed here in FLA yeah I heard skittles for X, but that’s it. As far as I can see all of u are racist and for the record his dad is white and zimmerman is a male which inherited most of his father’s traits. THAT MAKES HIM WHITE NOT HISPANIC LIKE HIS MOTHER. STUPID IDIOTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • How do you like the room service at Holiday Inn Express?

    • Aussie says:

      yeah right, timmy boy…. never heard the expression about tea being pot….. well it was new to a lot of us…. but apparently in the 1930s that was known terminology.

      I would say it is more than likely that certain adults know that what was meant was that the thief and thug was indeed looking for some pot.

    • Aussie says:

      and stupid troll……

      My cousins have a similar ethnic mix. Their mother is white.

      Children inherit characteristics from both parents, not just one. My cousins are Hispanic. George Zimmerman sees himself as Hispanic!! So get over it… Zimmerman is not white, and he has the swarthy appearance of an Hispanic.

    • Jay says:

      Generally speaking, you don’t get “the” gene for a particular trait from either your mother or your father; you get (almost) all of your genes from both of them. When you combine that with the fact that most physical traits are governed by more than one gene, the interactions can get complicated.

      Here’s the basics of how it works. This is a simplification, but explains a whole lot of how inherited traits like hair and eye color work. Your genes are made up of pairs of bits of DNA. For each gene, there are a range of possible DNA sequences that exist in our species. All of these possible values are called alleles; in general terms, each allele is connected to some specific variation of a physical trait. Supposing that a single gene determined eye color, there would be an allele for blue eyes, an allele for hazel eyes, and so on (eye color is actually determined by more than one gene, but it’s a good example to get an idea for what an allele is).

      For any gene, you have two alleles. They may be the same, or they may be different. Depending on the gene, and on the alleles, different things will happen if the alleles are the same or different. So-called dominant traits will show up if you have either allele for that trait; recessive traits will show up only if you have both alleles for that trait.

      Now, how do your parents figure into this? For every gene, you get one allele from your mother, and one from your father. Because you have the same number of genes as your parents, you have half of your mother’s alleles, and half of your father’s. It’s basically random which ones you get, which is why your genetics is different from your siblings’ — they also have half of your mother’s genes, just (probably) not the same half.

      n to the (simplified) specifics of hair color. There are two genes that control hair color. The first is the brown/blond gene, which has the dominant brown allele and the recessive blond allele. The second hair color gene is the redness gene, where having reddish hair is a recessive trait.

      So, because you have blond hair that’s not reddish, we can see that you yourself have at most one redness allele in your red hair gene. You might have none, or one of your parents might have been carrying the red hair gene around for generations. You might have redheaded children, or you might not.

      Because you have blond hair, and because blondness is a recessive trait, we know you have the blond alelle for both of your blond/brown hair color alleles. Because both of them are the same, that means that both of your parents gave one to you — you (and every other blond) gets your blond hair from both of your parents! They both have brown hair, which means they both have one brown and one blond allele; brown is dominant, so the blond allele doesn’t get expressed in their hair color, but it does get passed on to you. Your mom’s mom was blond, so she had both blond alleles, so she must have passed the blond allele on to your mother.

      You can see that the way this works is that brown hair will tend to win out over blond, but the blond alleles will stick around in families, and sometimes two of them will come together and make blond hair where everyone else is brown.

      (There’s another set of genes that controls how dark your hair is; the more of these genes that carry the dominant ‘dark hair’ allele, the darker the hair will be)

      High scool biology>You. Nite nite now.

  11. jr31911@yahoo.com says:

    I don’t think what is stated above is true because.one why was he even caring a gun.two why would travon run then later on confront him? Three the point not that he shot him its just that he wasn’t arrested on the spot..he had days to study his statement and friend to calms they say saw travon first.if he did two on one is better then one on one..no kids is as innocent as their parents portray but he still didn’t deserve to die.

    • Many people who go around banging people’s heads against the pavement don’t deserve to die. If that part of the witness testimony turns out to be true, what do you think he deserves? A cake?

    • My favorite part:

      …the point not that he shot him its just that he wasn’t arrested on the spot….

      If the police placed Zimmerman in handcuffs, put Zimmerman in the back of a squad car, drove Zimmerman to the police station, detained Zimmerman and questioned him for over 5 hours, would it make you feel better? No, wait… huh?

    • Jay says:

      But um he was at police station right after it happen did you not see the video. He had a gun because of a pitbull animal control told him to buy a gun Zimm wanted to use pepper spray.

  12. Eddie says:

    Okay, this is ridiculous. Okay, Travon was a bad seed. I get that, I even get that in self-defense when a gun is involved. Somebody is bound to get shot. The facts that you have obviously over looked is the fact that George Zimmerman is a neighborhood watch security personal. Neighborhood WATCH, not neighborhood POLICE.

    He (Zimmerman) should have waited for the police, period! It was not his job to pursue a suspect that he felt was dangerous. Just like if he saw some people breaking into a house, it would not be his job to go into that house to arrest the burglars. He would call the police, watch and wait. Now why couldn’t do the same for Travon Martin? Travon (even with his background that Zimmerman knew nothing about) was still a kid, so why pursue and take things beyond his professional jurisdiction?

    If Zimmerman would have kept himself in the car or at a fair distance from Travon (so he could at least he could see were he was going) and waited for the police to do THEIR job. We wouldn’t be talking about it now. So yes, because this could have been prevented by a more competent neighborhood watch or security personal. I think Zimmerman is responsible for his incompetence and should be prosecuted.

    • barnslayer says:

      Yep! It’s Zimmerman’s fault. He should have stayed clear of Martin. He should have forgotten all his neighbors who entrusted him with watching the very neighborhood he was in. Let the little kid break into someone’s house or maybe just rob someone else. After all he’s just a little 6’3″ kid with a violent/drug mentality. If Zimmerman sh0t in self defense or if Martin grabbed the gun and caused it to go off it doesn’t matter. All that matters is… one less puke to bother good people.

      • Eddie says:

        It was raining and Trayvon had a hoodie on. What in God’s good reasoning did Zimmerman have to be suspicious of a 5’5″ or 7’1″, white, black, or mexican man walking through the neighborhood? Either way, he was captain watch guy. If he felt that Trayvon was that dangerous, that he would have broken into a neighbors house or hurt somebody. Then why follow him, when you don’t EVEN have the proper training to do so? The last statement is based on ignorance and I won’t even comment on that part.

        • Jay says:

          Um have you looked at the amount of precip for that night seems not. From 4 to 8 0.09 of precip. At 6:53 no precip. If the hoodie was for the rain why didn’t he take it off at 7-11

    • I think you should inform your neighbors of your perspective.

    • Aussie says:

      the march of the trolls who do not understand how to comprehend anything.

      Sure Zimmerman was the captain of the neighbourhood watch. On that night he was driving to Target when he saw someone near the clubhouse acting suspiciously so he did what he was told. He called the police.

      He followed to get a location. It was the thug who initiated the confrontation.
      ————
      Edit by Admin

      • Eddie says:

        Look here dude, I didn’t disrespect anyone on here to get my point across, so why are you? And look at the picture of the apartments, you can see clear down the walk way. He (Zimmerman) could have stood his ass at the end of the walk way and watched which house Trayvon was going into from a distance. Unless Zimmerman needed glasses, which in that case he shouldn’t have been neighborhood watching shit.

        He could have kept a better distance from Trayvon and you can’t say that Trayvon confronted Zimmerman. You can’t say who confronted who first, the only thing that is true. If Zimmerman was following him, Zimmerman got close enough to either confront Trayvon or be confronted by Trayvon and bottom line he should have stayed his ass in the car. That is not his job as a neighborhood watch “personnel” to pursue or “follow” a suspicious suspect.

        And what made Trayvon so suspicious anyway for Zimmerman to call the cops and get out his car to follow Trayvon? Was it just the hoodie, because from my understanding it was raining anyway, so why would Trayvon not have a hoodie or something to cover his head. Comprehend that, which I am sure you have a response. Because you are probably one sided about all of this, so go on ahead shoot. You will probably get away with it like Zimmerman did.

        Eddie, the answer to what made Trayvon “suspicious” is located in the reason for Zimmermans 911 call. Did you read what he said?

        Also, go back and look at the ‘map’ of the complex. From where Zimmerman was parked labeled “C” it was impossible to see Trayvon head down sidewalk “F”. Even if he got out of the car and headed that way, he still would have lost sight of Trayvon when Trayvon turned Right…… /SD

        • Eddie says:

          But if he got out and Trayvon turned right, he still could have watch were Trayvon would be going from the end of the side walk. And yes I looked at the map, bottom line we weren’t there. I just know this, Zimmerman was not a cop and if he called the cops and they got there to search for someone braking in or hurting someone. A police presence would have been there to handle it or at least stop suspicious people from walking around the neighbor hood. Black people don’t even like walking around when police are patrolling a neighborhood, so it would have ended as soon as they showed up.

          • welovethetreehouse says:

            It was dark outside. I know I wouldn’t have been able to see too far down that sidewalk (standing at the T, facing Tracy’s girlfriend’s house).

          • Jay says:

            Or maybe TM thought Zimm was on the phone with the cops and that’s why he ran.

        • Jay says:

          Actually you can. Dee Dee said Trayvon asked why you following me. Um that’s a confrontation.

    • Aussie says:

      oh and stupid dimwitted troll, the word is personnel…. learn to spell.
      ————
      This is a place of conversation. This is not a college classroom or a high school English test. Further comments of this nature will place you in moderation. –Admin

      • Eddie says:

        Wow! Well, I was on my phone when I typed out that message and it must have autocorrected into that word. But, I should have double checked my message and fixed it. So thanks for the catch. I mean you bypassed the whole point and found a flaw in my writing, but you still understood what I meant even when I spelled a word wrong. So was it really that important to point out that you understood what the stupid dimwitted troll meant?

        Also stupid and dimwitted, aren’t you using the same word twice? Check the Thesaurus before you start calling people names “Dumb Ass”. Two different meaning words, did I spell that right?
        ————–
        You’re ok, Eddie. I apologize on behalf of the Tree. There is clearly disagreement with some of the points you have made, and that’s part of the conversation. Calling people names as Aussie has done is not considered “part of the conversation.” –Admin

    • Jay says:

      He wasn’t on patrol he was going to the store. Bye bye now.

  13. diane28 says:

    No child reguardless of there race deserves to be shot and killed. To me it dose not matter weather he was white, black, Hispanic, blue, or green! If he was acting or looking strange then Zimmerman should have called 911 and told them what he saw and waited on them, but because he had a gun on him and followed this child is wrong. And now you have the audacity to bring up how he was in school, well I’m sure u was a child once and u wasn’t perfect! If this was you child I wonder how you would deal with the situation.

    • *sigh*

      This is getting tiresome.

      No one is saying Trayvon deserved to be shot and killed because of his race.

      The reason we are bringing up his behaviour at school, his Twitter feed, etc. is because the media has been pushing the narrative that he was just a happy-go-lucky kid who was hunted down and killed by a racially motivated “white Hispanic”.

      Get it now?

      • I don’t think some people are constitutionally capable of drawing a distinction between what the media tells them, and what the reality is.

        People just seem incapable of understanding a counter position from the false media created narrative. They appear to say “if you point out the truth, and identify the media falsehoods, then you are attacking the subject of the media lies”.

        Really silly.

    • barnslayer says:

      Okay, it’s coming along. Drop more terminal “g”s and “d”s, add a few errant plurals and misspell a few more words. Keep practicing, you’ll get it.

    • Aussie says:

      hey dopey,
      Zimmerman called the police and reported that he had seen someone acting suspiciously.

      That “child” was not shot from a distance. That 17 year old more than 6 foot thug, punched Zimmerman in the face. He reached for the gun that was in the holster and he no doubt had plans to use said gun on Zimmerman. In the struggle the thug was shot.

      I have no sympathy for that kind of thug… regardless of ethnicity.

      ———–
      Edit by Admin

    • Jay says:

      So if a 17 year old kid broke into your home and raped you he wouldn’t deserve to die.

  14. tnwahm says:

    I think I have a new talk show to listen to. I heard Michael Berry from Houston last night. He did a best of show this morning and the podcast for the 10 a.m. hour featured a call from Betsy in FL that was excellent. She started out by saying that she though Mr. Zimmerman should have been arrested on the spot. The way he let’s her dig her own hole is worth a listen.

    http://www.ktrh.com/player/?station=KTRH-AM&program_name=podcast&program_id=michaelberry.xml&mid=21975254

    • Sharon says:

      Michael Berry is an absolutely pleasant HOOT to listen to! I often choose to listen to him instead of Hannity if I’m going to listen to anyone in the afternoon. He is so worth the time and effort, and a very different kind of “listen.” Glad you found him!

  15. dudesavatar says:

    I guess the YouTube scrubbing of Trayvon’s account finally occurred today. It is gone.

  16. Pro treyvon says:

    This whole posting sounds pro Zimmerman to me. So why should anything on this site be called the truth!! Sad to say a child has died but you people prove racism by calling Trayvon a thug because of pictures and comments he makes!! I have tattoos I use profanity on my social sites and I have taken pictures of my self with my middle finger up also I have tried weed, and yes I AM BLACK! Yet I was an honor student in high school I graduated at the top of my class and I made the deans list three times in college. So I guess I’m a THUG too?? Ignorance is all around and it is sad and I don’t expect any of you ignorant people to change..there is always three sides to a story Trayvon’s, Zimmerman’s and the truth which we will never know!

    • …….you people prove racism by calling Trayvon a thug because of pictures and comments he makes……

      Do you want to provide your definition of “Thug”?

      • Pro treyvon says:

        As I’ve clearly stated I have done some of the same things and I have no criminal record and I’m no thug! So please enlighten me on your definition!!

        • stellap says:

          I’m curious – why do you think using profanity is necessary on social sites? Same with having your picture taken with your middle finger up. You are at least of college age. Such behaviour seems juvenile to me.

          • Pro treyvon says:

            I was referring to my high school years when that took place and I do have photos with my middle finger up still I’m no thug now I have two kids and I no longer do those things!! You have yet to tell me your definition of a thug?? Let’s face it people everyone walking this earth has a little bit of racism in them you can lie to everyone else but you can’t lie to yourself!

            • stellap says:

              The reason for bringing up Trayvon’s behavior is obvious to me, but not to you, it seems. Most of the press has been making a point of showing only pics of Trayvon as a child, or young boy, and even photoshopped images of him to make him look angelic. What’s up with that? Why do they do that? Comments here about the boy Trayvon, innocent stricken down by an evil Zimmerman point to the “why”. You say we are “pro Zimmerman”. Why? Because we allow the thought that maybe Zimmerman was attacked by Trayvon before he shot him? There is evidence to suggest that, so I don’t know why you think we are “pro-Zimmerman”. Zimmerman may very well be a murderer who shot a kid in cold blood because he is a racist. He also might be a man who was attacked and defended himself. I can see both possibilities. Why can’t you? Who is the racist here?

              • Pro treyvon says:

                I cannot speak for the media. I say this site is pro Zimmerman because it is bashingTreyvons character and build up Zimmerman’s, instead of staying unbiased it claims to report the “truth”. Zimmerman maybe innocent BUT he may also be guilty!! Bashinga dead child is not getting us closer to that truth!!

                • dudesavatar says:

                  Zimmerman maybe innocent, but that is only reported by people like us. From the very beginning, the media pointed to Zimmerman as being guilty. We always held judgement until the facts came out. Now that more of the facts are coming out, our common sense approach is being validated. The knee jerk reactionists are being seen for who they are, and the level headed, slow and steadies are finally being seen for who they are.

              • Pro treyvon says:

                Please explain how I am racist because I questioned the term thug??

                • stellap says:

                  You are racist because you cannot understand why we are trying to balance the stories being told. You say we are pro-Zimmerman because we are not afraid to say that he may not be guilty of murder. You think we are racist because we are “bashing a dead child”. Telling the truth about someone – dead or alive – is not bashing.

            • Aussie says:

              and you are living proof that you are the racist….. look at your own statements… they are full of racism towards an Hispanic man.

            • Jay says:

              Where did you grow up? was it in the hood or PJ’s TM at this point in his life had been caught for weed had stolen property on him(I don’t care what anyone says that excuse it belongs to a friend but won’t tell who that friend is means it’s stolen) busted for graffiti lived in Miami Gardens which is thick with gangs drugs murder. He was well on his way to a life of crime. I know a thug when I see one. The old saying game recognize game I see what he was. Could you still make the deans list with that on your record doubt it. Don’t get me started on his friends which openly display gang signs and gang writing. I know what I see been around gangs my entire life just had a member of SMM in my driveway an hour ago.

          • Eddie says:

            Eminem, Tupac, Tommy Lee, John Malkovich, Kevin Spacey and I could go on and on. All took pictures with their middle finger in it, all multi-millionaires and all educated people.

            • stellap says:

              Just because someone does something – rich or not – does not make it acceptable. Didn’t your mother tell you that? You know – “If your friend jumped off a bridge, would you do it too?”

              I don’t exactly think of any of these people as role models, and I would suggest that you think about that.

              • Eddie says:

                My bad. Never said it was acceptable, just saying self made millionaires and educated people do it as well. All I was trying to say, that it is a form of self expression from all levels. Whether we like it or not. Your right they are not role models and my mother did mention something about a my friends and a bridge if I remember correctly.

            • Jay says:

              Serious Eminem grew up in the slums of Detroit he’s as ghetto as they come. Tu-pac was educated but his parents were black panthers Pac screamed thug life everyday till he died. Tu-pac was a thug no doubt about it. I met him once in NY before he died he would snatch the life out of you quick as look at you. Ever heard of the out laws or Hussein Fatal guess what gang member. Good friends with Pac

      • Pro treyvon says:

        Oh excuse me for not posting my definition, a thug is a person who commits Violent criminal acts!

        • texan59 says:

          It’s not the best plan to act like you’re a thug. No one is happy that a young man is dead. However, actions have consequences. This young man wanted to act like he was a tough guy. It doesn’t always end well, no matter what color you are. Now please explain why y’all want to take this out on white people again.

          • Pro treyvon says:

            First of you group with Y’all meaning black people…I am not y’all I am my own person, i have my own views i cannot speak for others and not once did I state that any race was to blame nor did I say black people are victims I clearly made a comment on the terms we are using to describe this child also I stated that ignorance is all around.

            • Aussie says:

              black people are victims of their own making….. talk about indulge in the victim mentality. Every word you write screams of the victim mentality.

              If you do not want to be the victim then you have to stop this form of behaviour…. and yes… the angry stuff is nothing more than thug behaviour.

            • texan59 says:

              You certainly have pretty thin skin for being so open minded. Brother Jesse and reziss we much tell us that we speak in code all the time. They say that everything we say is code for racisssss white folk. I’m not going to tolerate it any more. That being said, I have many friends in Houston who are black, brown, white and yellow. The consensus among my friends is this – if you look like a thug and act like a thug – even if you aren’t, you run the risk of appearing to be one. That’s life. Or death. Too many people walk around and are scared. Black folk and white folk. Gangs are all colors. Actions have consequences. There are too many people who make a living off of keeping the divide alive. Sorry to say this, but JJ and Brother Al do not care if another black youth or black man is killed. They are in this for the money. So is Barack. He grew up in an environment where he was told that he was being repressed and held down by whitey. That is bullshit. He knows it is and so do you. They live and breath victimhood. There are many who are tired of this. I speak for no one else on this site. I’m not going to let you or Trayvon play the victim or racist card. That ship has sailed. You need to deal in facts and your facts cannot back up the reality of this situation.

        • Several witnesses say that they saw Trayvon assault Zimmerman and slam his head into the pavement, causing his head to be bloodied. Also, police report break-in evidence in his possession. Maybe you don’t believe any of that, but at least admit that THESE are the reasons we call him a thug, NOT because of how he looks. Ok?

        • barnslayer says:

          My question, why would anyone dress and act like a thug?

          • Pro treyvon says:

            Everyone please tell me your definition of a thug then look it up in the dictionary..tell me what it says on how a thug dresses. Because if a hoodie makes you look like a thug every college student and persons who wears them are thugs! Plain and simple.

            • barnslayer says:

              I said “dress and act like a thug”. Now we can dance around this for a whole month or cut to the core and agree we both know what I mean. It’s a combination of clothing, jewelry, language and behavior. I travel the NYC subways daily. There are those (black, Hispanic,Asian and white) that adopt just pieces of the puzzle… Not thugs. They are just doing it for style. Those that put the whole thing together and act the part… Thugs. Their reason is… You tell me. Is it just an act or is it more than that?

              • Pro treyvon says:

                Some of what your saying sounds flawed to me it sounds like a stereotype which everyone has for every race and that’s the problem here. Committing criminalacts is a thug killing people makes you a thug not your personal style! If you do not agree with me then agree to disagree and keep it moving.

                • Aussie says:

                  Wrong…. you are the one who has been stereotyping people.

                  I have a friend whose husband happens to have a lot of tattoos. He is not a thug, neither is he dealing in drugs. He happens to be a rather nice person. However, people see him and think that he must be a bikie or something like that…. not so.

                  People are not judged on looks alone, but they are judged by their standard of behaviour…. Trayvon Martin was a thug by definition, not by looks but by definition. He displayed violent behaviour. He punched Zimmerman in the face after cornering him. He then bashed his head into the ground, and he attempted to get hold of the gun in order to kill Zimmerman…. there were powder burns on his hands.

            • Thug: A youth of any distinction who at the age of 15 begins to tattoo himself and engage in a street lifestyle; A 16 year old youth without adult supervision who participates in street fights for enjoyment; A sixteen year old youth who uses drugs, sells drugs, and steals from others via burgalry to gain money for drugs, and participate in illegal activity; A high school youth who writes graffitti on walls, disrupts class, skips school, and is suspended 3 times within one school year for behavioral issues, including engaging in influencing other youths with drug use; An aggressive, and loudmouth youth who writes extensively about “getting head” as the ultimate enjoyment, talks pornographically about women/girls (see post above), and embodies the “gangsta lifestyle”, as a choice to determine his goals in life. A 17 year old youth who proudly proclaims himself to the world of public opinion with his own descriptive term “Nigga”.

              To me, those behaviors, and actions, constitute a thug. Perhaps we disagree, but those are a few points of definition to support the adjective or verb. Those points are factual behaviors of Trayvon “tray” Martin. These factual behaviors are not a matter of opinion they are facts and all the evidence to support such a conclusion are included above.

              Your turn.

            • Aussie says:

              the hoodie had nothing to do with the description of thug…..

              A lot of people wear hoodies, it means one does not have to carry around an umbrella, especially in windy weather. It is also easy to use when rain is threatening….

              No… it is the behaviour, like smashing someone in the face, knocking the person to the ground and then bashing his head in the ground…. that is what causes a person to be called a thug.

              And Trayvon Martin was NOT a child. At 17 he was a grown man.

        • 2319! We’ve got a 2319!
          Another “poke and run”
          I would say that this young adult’s action speak for itself and we are testifying to that fact and basic way of life. Can you understand that?
          fyi there is an alternative to this kind of “choice” he makes and we are just accounting for the choices made. You can’t just say “oh they are just young and are gonna grow out of it”. That is an excuse an basic ially illogical.

          • And furthermore. If you look like a thug, dress like a thug, listen to thug misic, smell like a thug, act like a thug, what does that make you? A good, innocent, trustworthy, decent young man? If you play in the dirt, eat the dirt, roll around in the dirt you are gonna get dirty, FACT!

            • Pro treyvon says:

              What kind of music is considered thug music? What does a thug dress like? And lastly what does a thug smell like? Educate me please!

              • barnslayer says:

                Regarding dress please scroll up to my last post. Still don’t get it? come ride the A train with me one day.
                Now regarding music… check the lyrics you can answer that yourself. Big difference between singing about bitches, ho’s, killing, leaving them dead, compared to the stuff that made Motown a big deal.

              • Just an example of many different answers
                Any music that is degrading to women, men, God, and authority.
                wearing a hoodie with the intentional purpose of wearing it to look like a thug. Size 50 And buttauthority hanging Pants

              • Pro treyvon says:

                Everyone needs to get a clue a lot of teens dress the way you describe listen to”rap” (let’s be honest since everyone here is scared to say the word, you rather describe it then just say rap music!) yet they are not thugs. But according to you the’re intentions is to look like a thug glad everyone is a mind reader and know what peoplesintentions are!

                • stellap says:

                  If Zimmerman is not indicted by the Grand Jury, what do you think will happen? What do you think will should happen?

                • barnslayer says:

                  Baloney. Read the lyrics. If they embrace the gangsta mentality they edge closer to embracing it’s behavior. The clothing comes, in part, from prison. The idea is to not be part of society. To act like a badass and angry. To threaten and intimidate. To what end? If you act the part convincingly enough you will be treated as the real thing even if you are only playing dress-up. Regarding rap music… name another genre can brag about having a body count at its concerts.

                • GFCinthatorder says:

                  I reaally believe you are either not of goo will here or need to be educated better. Just because society has such low standards for it’s teenagers does not make it right or good in the slightest. That is an excuse period. “Well he’s and she and she is doing it” does no harm t make it it healthy, right or good. And furthermore mister, if my daughter does not want to be mistaken for the cheap whore or just plain cheap, then she had beter not dress and try and immitate one. Thankfully all three of my daughters can understand that very clearly. My youngest is only 11 and totally”gets it” . What is wrong with your thought process? Can you possibly be wrong? Or are you to pround to come out of your blindness which will cause you to continue to dwell in darkness?

              • Pro treyvon says:

                If he is not indictedthen that’s the end of this but with all the backlash he is getting he will most likely have to do what Casey Anthony did and stay in hiding because people are still going to hate him.

                • tnwahm says:

                  And who is to blame for that? Let’s see; the NBP have a bounty on his head. Where is law enforcement on that? And the media has manipulated recordings, pictures and words to fit their agenda. And that’s all before we get to the professional race hustlers of Sharpton and Jackson. Actually, the only people who will hate him are individuals like you who refuse to use logic and common sense to look at the facts and have been ginned up for other people’s agendas.

              • Pro treyvon says:

                First off do not group me with the NBP I have my own views and opinions! You need to open your eyes and reread what was said not once did I say Zimmerman is guilty and he should fry!! Don’t assumeit makes you look bad! You sound one sided instead of like a person who is using common sense to the possiblities that Zimmerman may or may not be guilty. You talk of the media in my opinion what I read from this site is no better than the media that’s pro Treyvon…this site depicts Zimmerman as innocent even in past crimes ” he just so happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time”!

                • barnslayer says:

                  It was chance that Zimmerman met Martin. It was Martin’s choice to engage him in a fight.

                • stellap says:

                  As for Zimmerman’s ‘past crimes’, he has no criminal record. As a first offender, he met the requirements of the court, and his record was expunged. The ‘crime’ was pushing an undercover cop in a bar (no uniform) who was harrassing a friend of his (as he saw it). Not smart, but that was seven years ago, and he was much younger at the time.

                • Menagerie says:

                  The choice of the name you use to post here does not imply that you are yourself unbiased.

                • tnwahm says:

                  The media of whom you speak has admitted to doctoring audios, videos and photos. That doesn’t sound unbiased to me. Does it to you? As has been noted, your “name” doesn’t sound terribly unbiased to me. Actually, I am using common sense in coming to the conclusion that Mr. Zimmerman acted in self-defense. Each fact that comes out continues to support Mr. Zimmerman and his original statement to the police and the statements of witnesses. I would be very surprised to read the autopsy report and toxicology report and find that they contradict anything that Mr. Zimmerman described. How about you? Do you have any facts that contradicts Mr. Zimmerman and the witnesses?

        • Aussie says:

          Yep, that was Trayvon Martin… he committed burglary…. got caught with the stuff in his school bag.

          He bashed Zimmerman and kept on bashing him when he was on top of him… the evidence of that bashing is clear…. in other words Trayvon Martin indulged in thug behaviour…..

          • Eddie says:

            Did they release video footage of Trayvon on top of Zimmerman and bashing Zimmerman’s head in the ground? Cause I didn’t see that footage and neither did you. You weren’t there. Nobody was there but them two, so we don’t know if there was a fight or not. Point is “Zimmerman shouldn’t have had a gun on him” (that was quoted by his neighborhood watch colleague) and he should have waited for the cops. So screw both of their past, that night wasn’t good for anybody.

            Technically Zimmerman could be considered to have Thug behavior also. Because Thugs carry around guns when it’s unnecessary and they shoot people they can’t fight man to man.

            Eddie, you are forgetting the eyewitness “John” who saw them fighting. John told Trayvon and Zimmerman he was calling the cops. The eyewitness who was there told police, and gave a written statement, that the guy with the red jacket was on the bottom, and the guy wearing the hoodie was on top “pummeling” (his word) him.…../SD

            • tnwahm says:

              Why do you keep insisting that Mr. Zimmerman shouldn’t have been carrying a gun? He is licensed for a conceal and carry permit. If he wouldn’t have been, I suggest that he would already be charged for a gun crime. Why do you think people have conceal and carry permits? For protection. It appears that Mr. Zimmerman needed protection because he was assaulted by Mr. Martin. Have you never heard of people being beaten to death?

            • Eddie says:

              So eyewitness “John” saw the fighting part, but didn’t see the shooting part, because of why?
              Because he went inside.

              Did he even see how Trayvon got the best of Zimmerman, who had a gun on him the whole time?
              Zimmerman did not have a “gun on him” (as in aimed at him), Zimmerman had the gun in a pouch holster at his beltline.

              And “John” said that he was calling the cops and Trayvon still was fighting. That’s bullshit, now I don’t know that boy, but I know kids and black people and if say “I am calling the cops”, then I am sure Trayvon would have tried to leave. Shit, if you say “I am calling the cops” even over a loud speaker of nationally televised football game. 30 black people, 20 mexicans and maybe 5-7 white people are going to get up and leave the game. Because some people (mostly ethnic and poor people) are programmed to get away from the cops at all cost.
              Apparently Zimmerman and Trayvon would not have been the ones to leave. “John” has no skin in the game, he has no reason to lie. He gave his statement within moments of the police arrival.

              Zimmerman shouldn’t have followed Trayvon in the first place, but since he did and he had a gun. Why did Zimmerman put the gun in plain sight to show that he was armed or some type of security guy?
              He didn’t put the gun in plain sight. Nor should he. Why escalate a potentially dangerous situation. That’s why they call it a “concealed” carry permit.

              The 911 call clearly shows that Trayvon was being judged from the get go for no reason other than Zimmerman’s own stupidity.
              No, he was being “judged” because he was acting suspicious and looking around in the backs of peoples houses – Read the 911 transcript.

              Zimmerman: “He is staring at me right now….” of course he is staring at you and looks suspect, because you are staring at him and talking about him on the phone. Sorry, went on a rant.

              But the point is, the eyewitness saw part of the fight and none of the shooting, which is sad. Because that could have helped out the situation a lot. And why did the eyewitness go out and try to break up the fight?
              The eyewitness did not try to break up the fight, why would he? Why should the witness put himself in danger?

    • Aussie says:

      trayvon was a thug. He punched Zimmerman in the face. He continued the bashing. He reached for Zimmerman’s gun and intended to use it….. in the struggle a shot was fired… and that little thug cannot bash up any more people.

      • Eddie says:

        Dude, what is your problem? Do you not like black people or do you not like teenagers, what is it? Let me ask you something. If someone was staring you down as you walked pass their truck, then they got on the phone while watching you, and then they got out their car to follow you while still on the phone? What would you have done? And how do you know if Trayvon wasn’t trying to stop Zimmerman from using the gun on him? Cause it seems to me that it was conveniently pointed at Trayvon and not Zimmerman. I don’t know the kid, but out of respect of the dead. I would reframe from calling Trayvon Martin names. You must not have kids bro.

        • barnslayer says:

          Since Martin started the attack it doesn’t matter if he was trying to stop Zimmerman from using the gun. If he didn’t attack him, get him on the ground and continue to beat him it would not be an issue. Whether Zimmerman had total control over the gun or Martin made a try for it doesn’t matter. Martin attacked a man. That man’s gun killed him. No attack, no dead 17 yr old.

          • Eddie says:

            No follow, No Attack, No Dead. I mean Trayvon “RAN” and Zimmerman caught up with him. You didn’t even answer the questions I asked Aussie.

            If someone was staring you down as you walked pass their truck, then they got on the phone while watching you, and then they got out their car to follow you while still on the phone? What would you have done? Would you not have defended yourself?

            And why is Trayvon a “Thug” for fighting someone that was following him? And it clearly states that Trayvon asked Zimmerman “Why are you following me?”, he didn’t just punch Zimmerman onsite.

            If I was running away from you and you followed me, while you was on your phone and caught up with me. I would probably whoop your ass out of fear of my life, especially if I saw a gun in your side. I don’t know what you planned on doing with me.

            • stellap says:

              Your account of what happened doesn’t match what is described in the 911 call. He did not follow Martin; in fact, he lost sight of him.

              • Eddie says:

                Even if you lose sight of someone, when you catch up with them. That usually means you were following them and you can here him running in the 911 call and the wind in the background. Even the dispatcher could tell that Zimmerman was following Trayvon. That’s why the dispatcher ask “are you following him?” “We don’t need you to do that, sir.”

                • stellap says:

                  And what was the next thing that was said? Zimmerman answered, “Okay”. Then he carried on a conversation with the 911 operator about where he would meet the police when they got there, and what his telephone number was. Then he says, “I don’t know where this kid is.” If he was following Martin, he would most certainly know where “this kid is”.

                  P.S.: Why did you post that ridiculous photo? The seven-year old pic of Zimmerman that doesn’t look like him, and the photo-shopped pic of Martin, that doesn’t look like him either.

                • tnwahm says:

                  We are not disputing that Mr. Zimmerman was following him and got out of his truck and continued to follow on foot to give the police a more accurate description of where Mr. Martin was. The point that you don’t seem to understand is that Mr. Zimmerman lost sight of Mr. Martin and was headed back to his truck when he was assaulted by Mr. Martin. Mr. Martin didn’t have to double back and assault Mr. Zimmerman. He could have just headed back to his dad’s girlfriend’s house and finished watching the basketball game with the 14 yr old that he went to the store for.. He would still be alive if he had.

                  • Eddie says:

                    On the map (above), it clearly shows that the incident happen around the corner away from Zimmerman’s truck. Behind the the homes, where the eyewitness say it was in their backyard.

                  • tnwahm says:

                    And Mr. Zimmerman couldn’t drive his truck onto the sidewalk where he saw Mr. Martin head. He had to go on foot. The point is that Mr. Zimmerman was going back to his truck to wait for the police, when Mr. Martin doubled back and assaulted him.

                  • Eddie says:

                    And you (tnwahm) may not be disputing that Zimmerman was following him, but others are. He could now have been heading back to his truck if it happen in almost the middle of the backyard of these town homes.

            • stellap says:

              Aren’t you reading the explanations to your other previous comments? Have you read the posts, and did you read the text of the 911 call? If you don’t have anything new to add, why do you keep saying the same things over and over again that are incorrect?

            • barnslayer says:

              Not that it happened but…. are you serious? Do you think for a minute that Zimmerman could outrun Martin? And worse, Zimmerman’s short legs allowed him to run so much faster than Martin’s 6’3″ (17 yr old) legs that Zimmerman could run and talk on the phone at the same time and still catch him? Damm he must be the real Flash!

              Why is he a thug for attacking someone who was watching him? Is it okay with you if you are eyeballing someone that they attack you and start beating the crap out of you? After all you WERE watching them, you asked for it. Come on!

              • Eddie says:

                If I am staring down someone and not giving them a reason as to why i am doing it. i would expect them to confront me and based on there up bringing. Will determine if it would be a fight or a conversation (Hey, what are you looking at buddy?). Depends on how bold you are to confront it.

                It happens all the time between people, shit guys do it just when you are staring at their girl sometimes and do “I” think that I am an exception to any of those rules if I was staring down someone. No i don’t

                • stellap says:

                  Why did Martin run away, then double back and attack Zimmerman? Why didn’t he just go home?

                • barnslayer says:

                  So what about the running idea, no comments? How much of your money would you bet on Zimmerman to beat Martin in a foot race? How much if Martin had a head start?

                  Staring someone down is not the same as following them. I have not read anywhere that it described how the pistol was worn. Was it in his pocket, waistband, side waist holster, back waist? Without that you cannot assume Martin knew about the gun before the fight.

                  • Eddie says:

                    And you also can’t assume that Trayvon knew where it was to reach for it either in a struggle. But in some peoples arguments Zimmerman was struggling to get the gun back from Zimmerman. I don’t know what happen and you don’t know what happen. All I know is Zimmerman should have never got out his var and waited for the police and Trayvon should have taken himself home and got in the home right away. If he felt threaten.

                  • barnslayer says:

                    It would be easier for Martin to feel or see the gun once he was on top of Zimmerman.

                • tnwahm says:

                  Yes and apparently Mr. Martin thought that he could assault Mr. Zimmerman and beat him. He didn’t know that he was assaulting someone that could/would defend himself. If Mr. Martin would have just gone to his father’s girlfriend’s house instead of thinking he could beat Mr. Zimmerman up, he would still be alive.

              • Eddie says:

                And you still didn’t answer my questions, i just answered yours. What’s the problem?

                • stellap says:

                  But you said that Zimmerman caught up with Martin, and that clearly didn’t happen, as Zimmerman told the police dispatcher that he didn’t know where Martin was. He said he didn’t want to give him his exact address because, “I don’t know where this kid is”

            • tnwahm says:

              Why didn’t Mr. Martin just go home? If someone was following me, I would hightail it to the house. I wouldn’t have confronted the person. If I really felt threatened, I would be calling 911, not talking to someone else on my cellphone. Why didn’t the girlfriend call 911 if she felt her boyfriend was being threatened. Must be a great relationship if Dee Dee heard a commotion while on the phone with her boyfriend but didn’t worry about him when he didn’t call her back.

              • Eddie says:

                Very good point and honestly. He shouldn’t have even had his ass out the house in the first place being that he was suspended from school. He should have been on punishment and stayed at home. Too bad that wasn’t the case.

                • He was also “grounded”. :(

                • Aussie says:

                  thanks for the honest comment Eddie… it shows that you have been looking at the information…. keep going….

                  • Eddie says:

                    It’s not the information above, it just basic common sense.

                    Look people,

                    I am just as upset with Trayvons actions in this as I am with Zimmerman’s actions in this and it is sad that it turned out this way. But the problem I see in this forum is that Trayvon was a “Thug” and Zimmerman should not be responsible for his actions. And most of you act like Trayvon deserved what he got and like most of you don’t have any kids of your own.

                    I get Trayvon wasn’t the best kid, but I Do NOT think that Trayvon was trying to beat Zimmerman for “Street Cred” (as tnwahm has so nicely put), and I Do Not think that Zimmerman is solely to blame for the incident getting started. But I Do think Zimmerman should NOT have gotten his ass out of his car to follow anyone he felt suspicious in the neighborhood. He was NOT a cop and did NOT have the proper training to follow anyone suspicious, he should have waited for the cops. Even if he lost sight of Trayvon, it was not like Trayvon had a TV in his hand or something was reported stolen or someone was reported beatin’ in the area to make sure he kept an eye on Trayvon for the cops.

                    Trayvon should have also taken himself home when he ran and/or felt that his life was in danger. And I did read all the evidence above (3 times and skimmed through it every time I made a comment), this is not a race issue. This is a lack of common sense issue and I don’t think most of us are using it.

                    We all know what should have happen and it didn’t, but still respect that a child was killed (no matter how fucking tall he was) and it could have been prevented.

                  • tnwahm says:

                    Eddie;
                    First, where has anyone here said that Mr. Zimmerman should not be responsible for his actions? I haven’t read anyone here saying that he shouldn’t be responsible for his actions. My opinion is that it’s up to the police to sort thru the evidence to see if they believe it was self-defense or murder and whether they can prove it.

                    Second, why do you think Mr. Martin assaulted Mr. Zimmerman? Why didn’t he just go home? I just presented a hypothesis as to why he did. From Mr. Martin’s twitter account and history at school, we know that if he hadn’t become a “thug” he sure appeared to want to give that impression.

                    Third, you may not think that it is a race issue, but if so, you are being extremely naïve. Why did the media doctor the audios if they weren’t trying to paint this as a racial issue? Why did they call Mr. Zimmerman a “White Hispanic” if they weren’t trying to stir-up racial tensions? Why have the professional race baiters and liars of Sharpton and Jesse Jackson get called in? BO/BS and the DemonRats are in a panic about the election and they are trying to get the ignorant ~I would have said stupid, but I don’t want to get moderated; insert wink~ who believe whatever the media and Jackson and Sharpton tell them.

                    And yes, I do have children and they are not perfect, but there would be serious consequences if they tried to pull some of what Mr. Martin did.

                • tnwahm says:

                  Thank you. This is a tragic case of should have/would have. The dominoes started to fall when Mr. Martin left the house for whatever reason with the culmination being in Mr. Martin’s decision to assault Mr. Zimmerman. It appears from available evidence that this was a case of self-defense. Would we be having this same conversation if Mr. Martin had beaten Mr. Zimmerman to death?

                  • Eddie says:

                    See, all you are saying is Mr. Martin Mr. Martin. But nothing about about Zimmer’s actions. Now I agree that Trayvon should have stayed in the house on Punishment, but that self defense bullshit is ridiculous. Just because Zimmerman says that Trayvon assaulted him first, doesn’t make it true. Zimmerman also says “okay” as if he is going to stop following Trayvon, but you can still here him running on the 911 audio for about 22 more seconds.

                    And No; we wouldn’t be having this conversation if Trayvon would have shot Zimmerman and claimed self defense. Because Trayvon would have been behind bars and awaiting trial and you know it.

        • tnwahm says:

          What I would have done in Mr. Martin’s shoes is hightail it home. I wouldn’t have started an altercation with anyone. You keep blaming Mr. Zimmerman for the altercation, but if Mr. Martin would have just gone to his dad’s girlfriend’s home, he would still be alive today.

    • Pro treyvon says:

      Some of you who left me a comment I respect your comments also I may agree or disagree others it’s a sad world you live in the more you write the more stereotypes shoot out your mouth..I have said my peace” hate it or love it”oops that came from a rap song guess that makes me a thug! FYI this site is not 100% accurate but people read and take what they want from it and run with it educate yourselves!!

      • Aussie says:

        Wrong buster…. it is a sad world you live in with all of your racist behaviour.

        The only racists in this matter happen to be blacks…. that is extremely sad when so many fought for equality for blacks…. and this is how you repay those who fought for those rights.

        • Pro treyvon says:

          Please tell me how you concluded I’m racist? Because if anyone sounds racist its you Buster! Tip reread before you post don’t want to contradict yourself!! Lol

          • Aussie says:

            Your whole attitude is racist…. you see racism when there is none….

            BTW you are also sexist.

            • Pro treyvon says:

              Wow really my attitude please point out in my comments where I blame white people or any race for that matter!! Oh yeah that’s right you can’t!! But I can for your comments!! And you keep making me laugh do tell why I am sexist?? I could use another good laugh!

              • Aussie says:

                Can you think for yourself? Buster is masculine…..

                That is a sexist remark….. and I am not a feminist either.

              • Pro treyvon says:

                I am all about the truth the good bad and the ugly but thats my point how do you know its the gods honest truth? Answer is you dont…I have said in comments Zimmerman maybe guilty and he maybe innocent but to me no matter how much evidence is collected no one will know the full truth except Trayvonand Zimmerman. Its a tradgy for sure!

            • Pro treyvon says:

              And I quote from Aussie sent to me at 3:01am “….Wrong buster…. it is a sad world you live in with all of your racist behaviour.” according to you and I quote again Aussie at 6:44am”…Can you think for yourself? Buster is masculine….. That is a sexist remark….. and I am not a feminist either.” that’s funny because I am a woman and I believe in your statement earlier that’s what you called me!! So who is really the sexist here?? Can’t find me on racism so you try sexist and yet you still failed!

              • stellap says:

                Personally, as an administrator, I wish both of you would stop the name-calling. Yes, Aussie too. I want to hear your thoughts on the facts of the case, not what you think of each other.

              • barnslayer says:

                You have yet to answer anything I asked you. Don’t have an answer? Come ride the A Train with me. While you think it over enjoy the lyrics to this wonderful song…

                http://www.lyricsfreak.com/b/brotha+lynch+hung/catch+you_20024842.html

              • Menagerie says:

                Question for you. Are you looking for the truth of what happened, with a fair outcome, whatever that may be when the facts and eyewitness testimony are presented, along with forensic evidence? I assure you, this is a sincere question, and not sarcasm.

                • Eddie says:

                  There are facts and evidence that says Zimmerman should have left himself in the car. This started because of someone doing more than what there job entailed and it finished sad and foolishly.

                  Someone was followed, they got into a fight and somebody got shot. Those are the facts. The details and the forensics are shaky at best (on both sides) and because of the media we really don’t know what to believe. I personally (just my opinion) think it would not help. Because at this point people think everything is doctored to sway to one side or the other. There was forensic evidence in the O’Jay case that proved his innocents, and everybody felt the evidence was tampered with back then. We didn’t have 1/4 of the technology we do today and people alter things all the time in youtube. Also, white people were still mad at the outcome of that case. I think black people will feel the same way (no matter what the evidence, because of the message it sends to the world. hope I answered you question.

                  • Menagerie says:

                    Are you the same person as Pro treyvon?

                  • stellap says:

                    I’m sure they aren’t, but they sound similar, don’t they? The arguments of all of these “visitors” are starting to run together.

                  • tnwahm says:

                    Please provide proof with links that back up your assertion that Mr. Zimmerman should have stayed in the car. This started because there was a young man who was acting suspiciously. Are we to stop all neighborhood watch programs? If Mr. Martin felt uncomfortable with Mr. Zimmerman watching him, he should have run home. He could have easily gotten to his dad’s girlfriend’s house and that would have been the end of it. That’s what I would have done.

                    You are right. It is a needless tragedy that Mr. Martin was shot, but Mr. Martin didn’t have to assault Mr. Zimmerman. I think Mr. Martin thought that he had an easy victim and he could earn more street cred by beating up a man. Imagine his tweets after beating up Mr. Zimmerman. Too bad for him, that he picked on someone that could defend himself.

      • Aussie says:

        by the way… the word is “piece” not “peace”…. yet more evidence that people could not care less about such things as spelling and then expect people to take them seriously.

        • Eddie says:

          There you go again, trying to correct someone in spelling and you were using double negatives earlier in your comments. Since you are smart enough to catch people’s spelling corrections. Why don’t you be smart enough to just understand the message at hand.

          • Aussie says:

            well Eddie, spelling is important…. the message being conveyed by the followers of the race baiters is something that is totally irksome.

            Zimmerman is not white. He is Hispanic by heritage.

            If this was a case where someone had been shot in the back, or tasered or something that really showed that there was racism my attitude would be different. However, that is not the case.

            The thug Trayvon punched Zimmerman in the face. The thug Trayvon Martin then proceeded to smash Zimmerman’s head into the ground. The thug Trayvon Martin noticed that Zimmerman had a gun and he reached for it. Zimmerman tried to stop him and reached for his gun at the same time. There was a struggle, and the gun went off. In those circumstances there is no pre-meditation to murder, there is not even a good chance for claiming manslaughter.

            How about you look at some of the other cases where there has been black on white racism…. there was that example of the young couple who were murdered…. she was raped if I remember correctly. Also, how about the case of the boy who was on his own verandah when he was attacked by black thugs…. then there is the elderly couple, where the woman was raped and murdered by black thugs…. as well as the bashing of a 78 year old man by black racist thugs.

            It is not like there are not white thugs, because they exist as well. The difference is that white have not been rioting over a matter where a person was killed during a scuffle, after one person had his face punched and his head bashed repeatedly against the ground.

  17. GFCinthatorder says:

    Is the poke and run gone yet? Well soon enought. I think we really have to back up and start with the basics. Like, do you believe in good and evil? Because if they don’t we are wasting our time. And if they do then we have at least soms kind of starting point to return to. I really don’t believe that any of them can see the difference between white and black, in good and evil. Does everyone think it is “okay” to be listening to the trash they call music that basically says it is the thing to rape, do drugs, kill cops, be racist, have gang wars, sex any and everyway you can get it, steal…..yeah it’s just music man no harm. And it is okay to dress like a whore, look and act like a whore, talk cheap like a whore, but how insulting if you even dare inSINuate that I am a whore. These are all the same, blind.

    • Aussie says:

      that is a very good point about the music… especially teenage music of today. I agree, it is trash…. when it goes kerthump, kerthump… and they scream obscenities.

      What happened to some of the wonderful groups from the 1950s and 1960s such as the Platters? The lead singer of the Platters really did know how to sing.

      Then there was Lena Horne, who is one of my favourites and nobody sings “Stormy Weather” like Lena Horne. There was Louis Armstrong, even Sammy Davis Jr (one who was known to hang out with the Mafia), Cab Calloway (of Minnie the Moocher fame), and a whole string of others. These are the folk who wrote the Blues music for which the blacks of America used to be identified, and certainly not the obscenity that is supposed to be the music of Einem.

      Some of the best Spirituals were things like “Swing Low, Sweet Chariot” and then there is “When the Saints come Marching home”…. ah there is just so much available.

      I do not believe in excusing teenagers for their bad behaviour, regardless of whether it is drugs or whatever. It is not ok for white, black, Hispanic or Asian girls to go around dressing like a whore, or indulging in promiscuous behaviour. It is up to the parents to ensure that their children are safe… and that includes those teenaged boys and girls who think that they are adults.

      • Average Joe says:

        It seems to me all that matters is if the testimony is accurate then the one man assaulted the other man and the first man, fearing for his life, used deadly force on the other man in an attempt not to become dead himself.

        • Aussie says:

          Average Joe, who is the first man?

          The person who threw the punch in the face is the one who has ended up dead. The one who was pummelling the head of the other man ended up dead. However, you have not identified your first man!!

  18. stellap says:

    And while we discuss the shooting of one young man in Florida a month ago (sad though it is), five more shootings in Chicago last night – one death.

    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/chi-friday-night-saturday-morning-april-6-april-7-shootings-20120407,0,2654676.story

    • barnslayer says:

      No details on the parties involved. I will assume they didn’t meet Sharpton’s (or oblamer’s) criteria.

  19. Harold says:

    It is time to put the lies to rest. This is the parents fault and they failed to fix the problem. It is time for the trouble makers Al-Jessie and the black to take their thug act somewhere else. Martin was a thug and he was wrong.

    • Aaron says:

      And what exactly did he do wrong?

      • stellap says:

        Have you read the post yet?

      • stellap says:

        Of course, we must wait for the grand jury opinion. I still suggest you read the post.

      • Aussie says:

        Really, the transcript points to the comment that Martin was acting as if he was casing the neighbourhood houses. It was also stated that he looked like he was on drugs…. and that he was acting suspiciously….. It had nothing at all to do with him wearing a hoodie in the rain!!

        • Eddie says:

          There are flaws in the transcript (above) right in the beginning an throughout.

          These parts were not said in the recording, but I guess not you are going to tell me that these are the true transcripts and the audio was doctored for media use, right?

          Not True:
          Zimmerman: When you come to the clubhouse you come straight in and make a left. Actually you would go past the clubhouse.

          Dispatcher: So it’s on the lefthand side from the clubhouse?

          Zimmerman: No you go in straight through the entrance and then you make a left…uh you go straight in, don’t turn, and make a left.

          This is were he started running towards Trayvon:
          Zimmerman: The back entrance… (He didn’t even say this) fucking [unintelligible] – And this part was just wind in the phone.

          Which is why the Dispatcher asked this question:
          Dispatcher: Are you following him?

          Zimmerman: Yeah

          Dispatcher: Ok, we don’t need you to do that.

          Zimmerman: Ok

          Zimmerman kept on running, you can here the wind in the background and the wind stops right after Zimmerman gives the dispatcher his last name. He ran for another 0:22 seconds and Zimmerman said “he ran” and was out of breathe. Now if he wasn’t fat and he Zimmerman was 170 lbs. (and not 200 or 240 lbs., which he was fat in the fucking police video) why would he be out of breathe? Probably because he smokes right?

          And heading towards the back entrance from were Zimmerman was parked, anyone running in that direction would seem like they are running towards the back entrance.

          Zimmerman: Alright, where you going to meet with them at? (this doesn’t even make sense) Why would Zimmerman say this?

          He also asked the dispatcher to have the police call him when they get there. Why, if he was going to meet them at the mailbox. Probably, because he was going to go look for Trayvon.

          Zimmerman: Actually could you have them call me and I’ll tell them where I’m at?

          Dispatcher: Okay, yeah that’s no problem.

          Look, play the 911 call on one tab and look at the transcripts on another, the story above is not completely accurate. Here is the link.

          And honestly this is getting ridiculous going back and forth. No one sees Trayvon’s point of view, I understand that they have gone overboard with attacking Zimmerman. But, this was not a self-defense situation and the truth will come out eventually. But this blog is not holding the golden ticket.

  20. Pingback: Trayvon Martin: Innocent or NOT Innocent? « A'Kai.edu

  21. Nicole says:

    I’m over the whole “liberal” media/”conservative” media stuff. This is not the first time the media has told us less than the whole truth. Reading all of this makes me wonder why the media uses emotion to get us all riled up against each other. I remain unconvinced that there is any media conspiracy. It looks like that they benefit by encouraging divisions among people. I mean, it’s not like they go out of their way to actually educate people on anything. They look like they go out of their way to evoke an emotional response from us. I suppose they just want our eye balls for their ratings which would mean more advertising revenue. Or maybe they are pushed by us because we are looking for minute-to-minute updates on whatever the focus of the moment is and they publish whatever they can get their hands on. Maybe it’s cut backs in the industry that have left us with the same “associated press” article on a million sites, and very few investigative journalists. Everyone wants to fit the little piece of what they think happened into a narrative. What do we really know? Who knows? I just hope we (Americans) can separate the emotion of the moment and push for a higher level of analysis and discussion in our cultural dialogue. This is a sad story all around and I sure do hope that none of our own lives are dissected and judge by the public through the media. Life just is not black and white.

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