02-20 George Zimmerman Case – Open Discussion Thread

Use this thread as an open thread just for Zimmerman Case stuff. A place to just dump, collect, or discuss general information about the Trayvon Martin VS George Zimmerman Case.

“The sensationalized, fact-deficient coverage of this case has achieved the
desired results. The networks got their ratings. The politicians got their
talking points. And if it means innocent people get caught in the middle of the
racial enmity they’ve fomented, obviously it’s considered acceptable collateral
Congratulations, geniuses. Job well done. Jim Treacher, The DC Trawler

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393 Responses to 02-20 George Zimmerman Case – Open Discussion Thread

  1. diwataman says:

    I’ve reworked the deposition list for anyone interested:

    Also a little update:

    Update: Jonathan Ables’ killer, Crystal Scott, indicted for murder

    • LetJusticePrevail says:

      Holy Cow! I had NO IDEA how many witnesses still need to be deposed! No WONDER Mark O’Mara said he cannot be ready by 6/10, let alone 4/22.

      I hate to say it, but he waited WAY to long to depose some of these people.

      • jello333 says:

        There’s times when it matters greatly the order in which you depose people. Plus, after deposing a certain person, you may learn something you didn’t already know, which leads you in another direction for awhile before you can continue. 99% of the delay is due to unforeseen events, especially regarding what the State and the Crumploids have done.

  2. arkansasmimi says:


  3. arkansasmimi says:

    Well Geo and Shellie, if FL gets too HOT to handle, come on over…. We are predicted to get a snow/ice event tomm and/or Thurs. I hope and pray NOT!!! Dang we had 80 to 90 mph winds yday, so enough lol. I sure dont want to be without power AGAIN! Hopefully Friday will HEAT it up with a CHump Depo :) Stand tall Geo and Shellie, Keep the Faith!!!! OH Shellie, you looked nice and was glad to see you standing tall!!!!

  4. rumpole2 says:

    Daily Daft Post From Justarse Quest

    The Traybots have woken up to the fact that George PASSED a Voice Stress Test
    (He was not Lying)

    In every case these people bray for the accused (and witnesses) to take a “Lie Detector Test”… of course often people refuse and the cretins take just that refusal in itself as an admission of guilt.

    Yet here in this case they conveniently, but hypocritically overlook the fact that George agreed WILLINGLY to take the test…. THAT fact in itself is significant. It indicates that George had nothing to fear because he was telling the truth.

    Furthermore he PASSED the test

    I have archived a summary of the test.. Video and results:

    The cretins are twisting and turning in all sorts of directions… despite what they have said in previous cases.. NOW Lie Detector Tests are not reliable…. Voice Stress is “not as good a polygraph” (false), etc. Besides George is so evil that he can fool the test. He is a “sociopath” (that old chestnut…. Lol), and so believes his lies and fools the test. He is on meds that make the test invalid etc… anything and everything… all imagined and based on no evidence at all. The “expert” opinion of dopes whose qualifications and expertise is a delusion from the outset.

    The Voice Stress Test was done by a professional. I am sure he was well aware of its limitations and what factors MIGHT effect results. That is the POINT of a session lasting over an hour. I watched the entire VST video. ALL the factors that might effect results are checked, eliminated, or allowed for in evaluation of results. It was done properly. The results are valid.

    It is laughable that the old ducks at JQ with no qualifications, or even much sense, think they know better than professionals actually carrying out the test.

    The tried and tested Truth:

    “Did you confront the guy you shot?”….No

    “Were you in fear for your life when you shot the guy?”….Yes

    Random Topics

    …………………………………… photo cockatoo_zpsd358cb24.gif…………………………………..
    If only Trayvon had kept his hands in his pockets, none of this would have happened.

    • rumpole2 says:

      Moody Blues – The Voice

    • rumpole2 says:

      Thanks Admin  photo kissy20face204_zpsd9d4b6e9.gif  photo 050000429547A_zps3981dc96.jpg

       photo happydance1_zps511a32c1.gif….Admin

    • libby says:

      Yeah, we will see who has the brass balls of tugboat when it comes time for them to be interviewed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
      Tugboat didnt need no stinkin lawyer when he was being interviewed by the cops, he was just plain old fashioned tellin the truth.
      I am certain neither the martins nor the fultons have the kind of faith in telling the trrth that good ole GZ has ….

    • myopiafree says:

      Hi Rumpole – George passed the “Stress test”. Why not have DeeDee take the same test. But wait – would that be DeeDee 1 or 2 or 3? Perhaps Crump should tell us which one we should test – starting with, “DeeDee – could you tell use what your phone number was when you were talking to TM (since his phone was not working)?

      • ejarra says:

        I would like to see Tracy, Sybrina, and Stephen take the same test and then ask, “Is that Trayvon screamng for help? Does that sound like Trayvon?”

        That would go along way to ending this farce.

        • maggiemoowho says:

          I really think they should, if they have nothing to hide, then whats the problem.

        • jello333 says:

          Sounds like a job for Jerry Springer. Have George and everyone from the Scheme Team go on the show, LIVE, and let each of them be tested right then and there. Hmm… why do I suspect the Schemers might balk at that idea?

        • Are you Following Him...."Yes" says:

          Yep…..at no time does gz say “I’m begging you”. Of course we can always take it from the murder’s mouth “that doesn’t even sound like me’

          • jello333 says:

            I like you. Will you be my friend?

          • JB from SoCal says:

            In 1967 I was living and working in Alaska. One of the draftsmen in the office needed to survey his property on Lake Talkeetna, so I spent the weekend there staking out his new house location. It was breathtakeingly beautiful and I recommend a trip to Lake Talkeetna if you ever visit Anchorage and environs.
            But beware of the bugs and such. The mosquitos are so big, Alaskans call them “moosequitos.”

          • JB from SoCal says:

            Oh and admin, I sure like my new avatar. Ironically, it looks just like me !

          • libby says:

            Why dont we just believe every lie the criminally negligent parents made?

          • Chip Bennett says:

            Free donuts in the break room! I’m low-carb, so you can have mine.

      • rumpole2 says:

        Hi myopiafree.
        Y’all don’t NEED no Highfalutin city-bought test to tell when Crump, Tracy, Sabrina, the Dee Dee girls and others are lying.
        Just a video.. if their lips are moving, then there are lying. :D
        The hypocrisy at JQ knows no bounds.

  5. LetJusticePrevail says:

    OK! We THINK we got some GOOD news yesterday when the defense team announced that they would meet the first month’s fundraising goal for George’s defense fund, RIGHT?

    WRONG! And I will tell you WHY I say this!

    Meeting a short term goal like this SEEMS like a VICTORY, but the reality is that it presents a GREATER CHALLENGE THAN EVER!

    Too often, people relax when they THINK they are winning the race! It’s not that they stop caring, but what happens is, they become OVER CONFIDENT!

    Right now we need to come out even stronger, posting George’s message wherever we can, in every blog,and in every newspaper comment section!

    And I’m not just talking about articles related only to this case. I am talking about news items on topics like Gun Control, SYG Legislation, Crime Stories, Police Corruption, Civil Rights, Proposed Legislation, YOU NAME IT!


    i have set a personal goal: At the end of the NEXT 30 days, I want to see the defense team post a statement that will SAY THEY DOUBLED THEIR FUNDRAISING GOAL FOR THAT MONTH!

    Does that sound crazy? NO! I KNOW THIS CAN BE DONE! BUT….

    YOU HAVE TO START TODAY! Remember this:

    There was an important job to be done, and Everybody was asked to do it.

    Everybody was sure Somebody would do it. Anybody could have done it, but Nobody did it. Somebody got angry about that because it was Everybody’s job. Everybody thought Anybody could do it, but Nobody realized that Everybody wouldn’t do it. It ended up that Everybody blamed Somebody when Nobody did what Anybody could have done.


    • diwataman says:

      I’ll do that if O’Mara starts posting discovery and an itemized list of where the recent and future money is going.

      • LetJusticePrevail says:

        Has anyone made a request to the defense team for an ongoing, detailed accounting of how the defense fund is spent? I have seen a couple of general accounting posts on their site regarding this, which seemed vague, but reasonable. Perhaps they would be more detailed if they realized there were concerns about this.

      • waltherppk says:

        A Richardson hearing regarding the delayed and yet still incomplete ? forensics report on the phones would seem to be a no brainer. This would press the issue with Nelson that the State has been hindering defense preparation and delaying and obstructing due process which supplies valid grounds for allowing more time to complete discovery before setting a fixed date for any immunity hearing or trial. The State is attempting to pursue a “trial by ambush” by delaying discovery completion to the eleventh hour before trial in order to hinder defense preparation for the immunity hearing and/or to hinder defense preparation for trial. A Richardson hearing could address that issue which is prejudicial in its adverse effect on the Defense.

        • JC says:

          Amen and in addition to the general delays I think Tray’s cell phone details of the shooting day are extremely damaging to the prosecution. I think the calls never occurred at those times and Crumpster and his cohorts completely fabricated the story not knowing how many details exist in cell records. (And thats why he doesn’t want to testify)

          • John Galt says:

            Crumpster probably also prefers not to testify about contacts with witnesses. For example, how did former Crump employee and protege Alicia Adamson come to represent Cheryl Brown in connection with her telephonic change of Austin’s statements to police? Who paid for that representation? Do Crump’s phone records show communications with Alicia Adamson in the relevant time period? What were the dealings of Crump and associates with Mary Cutcher?

    • Angel says:

      Letjusticeprevail: I have donated to GZ defense fund in the past because I believed GZ should receive a fair trial and be able have monies to support himself until this thing went to trial/immunity hearing. I was going to make another donation that was going to be continuous until the end of this thing. But with things working the way they are with the immunity being possibly combined into a trial and not sure of what MOM and Co’s goals are, I don’t want to pay money if attorneys are not working to the utmost to defend their client. It would just be a waste.

      • ytz4mee says:

        I gave in the beginning as well, and fully intended to make ongoing donations.
        I’m not interested in contributing as long as MOM is in charge of this “case” and continues to make decisions that are IMV detrimental to his client. I refuse to subsidize stupidity.

  6. Macready says:

    Crystal Scott was indicted? I thought witnesses corroborated her account that this Ables character was banging on her car window.

    Apparently there is more to this case then I originally thought.

    • libby says:

      maybe there were more than one witness (we know the news media only gives credence to the testimony of black racists).

      • Macready says:


        We’ll have to wait and see. Until then, I’ll give Scott the benefit of the doubt. Seems odd that a single mother working at a bank just went off and murdered some guy in a public area who was “only” approaching her vehicle, but who knows.

        I agree about the double standards though with regard to many blacks taking sides strictly based on skin color.

        • thehoff71 says:

          The issue I had with this case was the fact that when her NAACP handler showed up on the crime scene with an attorney for her she was released from the crime scene and it took 6 months to convene a Grand Jury. I also understand that she (Scott) was known for multiple Road Rage incidents in the past. It’s the hypocrisy..what if George was black and Trayvon was white?? He would have been released from the scene.

          • Chip Bennett says:

            It’s the hypocrisy..what if George was black and Trayvon was white?? He would have been released from the scene.

            Actually, I think it’s the presence of counsel. If Zimmerman had done the right thing and gotten a lawyer there immediately, the lawyer would have asserted Zimmerman’s rights, including the right not to be detained unless under arrest.

            Zimmerman’s biggest mistake that night was not seeking counsel before cooperating with the police.

          • Macready says:

            “I also understand that she (Scott) was known for multiple Road Rage incidents in the past.”

            Is there proof of this?

            • thehoff71 says:

              I do not, my understanding comes from what I have been told from those I cannot reveal. So you can take that comment as my opinion.

    • Kihn says:

      There is a rumor on another board that she exited the car after the first shot (through the driver’s side window) and shot him again while he was down on the pavement. On the local news video at the location for the incident, the bullet hole in the window appears to be on the forward and side of driver’s door glass (glass edge closest to the windshield).

      Originally IIRC, it was said by the shooter that the deceased was trying to open the door when the shot was fired through the glass. If the bullet hole location is as decribed above and that is the one to strike him initially, I would guess there’s a question as to whether the deceased could have been trying to open the door to attack her.

      The poster offered nothing to substantiate this claim IIRC.

  7. Angel says:

    I am not able to get a screen shot off twitter so I have to improvise. When I read the following twitter, I thought, what is the point of mobilizing now except to intimidate to get a ruling that is against GZ or otherwise there will be riots and stuff? This is going to trial now which is what people said they wanted. So why not let this run its course in court of law now. Mobilization for what?!

    No justice no peace mobilizations does not bode well for GZ.

    Michael Skolnik Michael SkolnikVerified account ‏@MichaelSkolnik

    We will certainly need to mobilize people to come to Sanford during Zimmerman’s “Stand Your Ground” hearing #OurWorkIsNotDone #HoodiesUp RT!


    13 Favorites
    NeonLovesNevermore23 Tony Anderson Brittany Harris Li Black Dorothy Wright C CEDRIC DAWKINS Natalie Jackson Stefhy *

  8. John Lyle says:

    I wonder whether somebody should take a look at how Trayvon Martin arrived in Sanford before the shooting. According to an interview with Sybrina Fulton and Tracy Martin conducted by O’Steen and de la Rionda on March 26, what happened was that on Wednesday, February 22, Tracy took Trayvon to a point halfway between Miami and Sanford where he left him with Brandi Green who then took Trayvon to her townhouse in Sanford where he stayed until Sunday.

    The question arises why not just put Trayvon on the bus? Was it because he could not be trusted to leave Miami by himself? Or is possible that he had taken the bus earlier but there had been an incident with a bus driver? Or had that third suspension from school actually been an expulsion resulting from something that had left a victim looking for revenge?

    Or did Trayvon actually take the bus later or go with his father to Sanford on Friday, the whole halfway handover business being an alibi for something that that happened in Miami on the Wednesday?

  9. rz says:

    Although I read each comment daily, I attempt not to comment. However, in a recent post, 18 February, a contributor stated – “If I were GZ’s parents, I’d refinance my house or cash in my retirement to pay for an expert for my adult son, especially if I believed in their innocence.”

    Unfortunately, we have no retirement that can be ‘cashed in’. Additionally, we can do nothing with our house because it is collateral for George’s bond. We must pay a mortgage, taxes, insurance, utilities, HOA fees, and other expenses for a house we’re unable to live in. We must also pay for where we are currently staying.

    Other family members, who we are also attempting to help, have been forced to leave their employment and relocate. As we have always done, we will continue to assist our children in any way possible.

    As for my ‘believing in George’s innocence’. I believe I have a very thorough understanding of George’s actions on 26 February. I have presided over approximately 20,000 probable cause hearings, determining if individuals should be charge with a criminal offense. There is absolutely no doubt whatsoever that George should have never been charged with ANY offense – none.


    • Chip Bennett says:

      My God continue to keep and to protect your family, Mr. Zimmerman.

    • raiikun says:

      What Chip said. Your family continues to be in our prayers, and I know God will see you through this.

    • You and your family are in my prayers, too. And, I agree with you, he should not have been charged.

    • Omar says:

      God bless you and your family. People always have the simple answer of what they would do if they were in someone else’s shoes, but there is no way a person can understand the complexity of the situation with which your family is faced unless they have, themselves, been in the same situation. Please know that you are in our prayers, and most of us certainly do understand that your family has done, and will continue to do, anything and everything possible to help George and Shellie. I’m sure that there isn’t a “kindly” suggestion of what should have or could have been done that you haven’t already explored. I believe with ALL of my heart that George is a kind and generous and honest person who has been falsely accused of a crime. Defending your life is NOT a crime. God bless you all.

    • JOC56 says:

      I can only imagine how hard this must be for you & your family. Stay strong. Better days lie ahead.

    • recoverydotgod says:

      “Yet the righteous will hold to his way, and he who has clean hands will be stronger and stronger.” Job 17:9

    • waltherppk says:

      Robert, Please get George to insist O’Mara motion for a Richardson hearing on the tardily and incompletely disclosed forensic evidence on the phones, particularly the “heart phone” found at the scene and confirm accurate call times to the second by the ping logs, and make certain the MAC address for the phone and SIM cards match that heart phone, which should have GPS data of priority interest. Of course the GPS data for George’s phone could be helpful also. And the prior to 2-26-2012 data for the “DeeDee phone” should be examined for consistency by any “pattern of use” with the story that was in fact a phone being already used by DeeDee prior to 2-26-2012, since it was a prepaid “anonymous user” type of phone. Contact Dr. Michael Antal at St. Johns Data Consulting about recommending someone to analyze the forensic data for the phones. Dr. Antal is an FDLE agent but he is also a private forensic professional consultant and could possibly ? also bring scrutiny of any law enforcement “unprofessional investigative activities” / errors that may have been involved here in this case.

    • partyof0 says:

      Hi Mister RZ,
      It is outrageous, shocking, disgraceful, offensive, contemptible, despicable and many other adjectives to describe what has happened to George and the family. Many TM supporters rant “I am Trayvon” with much passion. I feel like saying that about this except to state “I am George”, for inwardly I would have been just as naive and as trustful as George has been in this scenario. I also would “trust” in the system to help me, not bully me as the legal system is doing to George. I wanted to contribute to his Defense, but after the second bond hearing I realized that the powers that be were hell bent on bleeding any and all funds or aid coming George’s way. Right now, and I know it is illegal, but I would be more inclined to contribute to a “Run Fund”, that of which he was accused of the “possibility” of attempting early on with contributions of “other people’s money”, so he can wait patiently in a place of sanity. But, what I see happening to George is not “legal“ either, AND its coming from the “legal system”. All I can say is for George to hang in there, because I believe in all this, and it may be the naivety in me, the truth has a way of gnawing its way to the top and someone, anyone with a conscience (hopefully) will not be able to stand it anymore and pave the way to its end

    • ejarra says:

      I see that you read our comments. That, along with our prayers, hopefully are ways that help you see a better future during these stressful times.

      God bless you and yours.

    • maggiemoowho says:

      God Bless you and your family, My prayers go out to all of you. I agree with you also, George should have never been charged.

      • waltherppk says:

        Grand Jury review and investigation was very conspicuously circumvented by the CORRUPT and politically motivated “justice” system of Florida …..BECAUSE it was KNOWN that it was unlikely that an IMPARTIAL and THOROUGH investigation of the FACTS and EVIDENCE would result in a NO TRUE BILL being issued by a GRAND JURY. This is EXACTLY the kind of “judicial indiscretion” and TRAVESTY of justice which needs to be eliminated from the conduct of prosecutions in Florida, along with restoring use of 12 person petit jury (NOT a cheap “substitute” 6 person petit jury) particularly for felony prosecutions. Since DISHONEST agents of the state cannot be trusted to exercise good judgement about such prosecutions, then the change to doing things the “old fashioned way” should apply to ALL felony cases PERIOD. Bureaucrats can be thanked once again for screwing the taxpayers by their own STUPID and DISHONEST and unprofessional acts made a matter of public record and a national scandal as has occurred in the absolutely bullshit prosecution of George AND Shellie Zimmerman. It seems the State of Florida has lost its way so maybe the taxpayers should put the state back on the road of righteousness and purge the bureaucratic ranks of those who want to play politics under the guise of “law” with the lives of citizens who should be let alone. Instead of ticketing people for seatbelt violations maybe time could be better spent by law enforcement rounding up illegals since 90% of the population growth of the State is due to illegal immigration, same as for the states of California and New York. It isn’t the rank and file citizens of the state who need to become clear on what is wanted from Tallahassee, it is Tallahassee that needs a reality check and a hearing check so that it can understand what the taxpayers are telling their
        hired help, to knock it off with the “progressive” pinko agenda and the tax bill that comes with it.

    • rumpole2 says:

      Hello Robert. Thank you for taking the time to give us a little inside info.
      You and your family come across to me as good people. Your two sons in particular are a credit to you and your wife.
      The financial aspects and woes of this case must be a huge extra worry.. beyond the criminal charges battle. I do hope that financially there is a big reckoning at the end of all this.

      Just as a lay person looking at the facts and using common sense… I totally agree with you…..

      There is absolutely no doubt whatsoever that George should have never been charged with ANY offense – none.

    • boricuafudd says:

      Thank You for taking the time to write to us, out prayers go out to you and your family. I really would like to ask you about the legal proceedings, but understand that this is not the correct forum for that. I just hope that you read some of our comments, understand our support and hopefully address our concerns not with us, but with your legal team. If we are wrong in our assumptions and or opinions just remember we have what is best for George and Shellie at heart.

      God Bless you and yours.

    • justfactsplz says:

      Your whole family is in our prayers. I remember that post and replied that you had to put up your house for collateral for George’s bond. George IS innocent and has a lot of support. Stay strong.

    • LittleLaughter says:

      John 16:33
      “I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace. In this world you will have trouble. But take heart! I have overcome the world.”

    • myopiafree says:

      Hi RZ – As you can see – a great number of posters here are devoting a large number of hours to get freedom and justice for George Zimmerman. This is our way of praying for him and your personal welfare.

    • Angel says:

      Prayers for strength and patience to you Mr. Zimmerman and your family. “Tough times don’t last always , but tough people do.” :-)

    • mrsgeosqt says:

      May God be with all of you and guide you. Stay strong and keep the faith.

    • arkansasmimi says:

      Your family are all in my heartfelt prayers. May God give you comfort, peace and lots of strength in all that you have to endure. Please stay strong~ Tight hugs, Mimi

  10. Sha says:

    For George and Shellie……

  11. AghastInFL says:

    Just a general observation, it seems to me that as we move closer to the anniversary of this shooting those supporting TM have taken a decided turn back to portraying this as a racially motivated hate killing. I’m not sure if there is a force driving that narrative but on news sites and others where I prefer to post the dialog has become consumed with characterizing George as the racist murderer and Shellie as the wife of same. The hate espoused increasingly in comments is both cruel and vicious.

    I will never understand how people can be so easily driven by a few carefully crafted phrases, but they are. LJP above mentioned taking the time to comment on these types of sites and I agree there must be an effort to counter their narrative before it overwhelms the facts of the case. Self defense, not stand your ground. Assault, not a wrestling fight. Race was in answer to a direct question. etc simple easily understood facts; almost like starting over from the beginning.
    If we falter they will succeed. JMHO

    • John Galt says:

      I think it is safe to assume that those that drove the original false narrative, and their minions, will once again swing into high gear in order to influence potential jurors as the trial date approaches.

  12. Springstreet says:

    I think my fellow Treepers are being a might too optimistic about evidence. Do you remember David Boies? He was Al Gore’s so-called “best lawyer in the world” … and his one and only expert witness was forced to recant ALL his testimony? Yeah … so then what happened … in Florida? The Appeal Court (Liberals) over-ruled the resulting verdict! So … what do you think is going to happen this time?
    My best guess scenario is there will be a trial (with Nelson disallowing any dead phone, lie detector, Crump, DD(s), Trademark history, etc, etc.) SO, the jurors will only be allowed to listen to the story of a semi-automatic “assault” pistol totting ex-bouncer (with a drug, violence, and a cop wannabe problem) chasing yet again “some (black) asshole who always gets away.” Then, a couple of jurors (who want to get home in one piece) will refuse to acquit … and there will be a hung jury … and, of course, no successful appeal … and George will have been hung out to dry (with the help of a Latino community who lifted only one particular finger).
    Welcome to Obama’s Amerika. But … if it’s any consolation … this time the Scheme Teamers have lied so much that they probably won’t end up getting any White Guilt money.

    • John Galt says:

      “Then, a couple of jurors (who want to get home in one piece) will refuse to acquit … and there will be a hung jury … and, of course, no successful appeal”

      Nelson’s (assumed) denial of immunity pursuant to 776.032 just prior to submitting the case to the jury will be appealable (and not moot, as in the case of acquittal) in the event of a hung jury, because Z would be subject to further prosecution.

      • art tart says:

        JJohn G – the thing about a hung jury as you point out, is that the case can be retried meaning MORE monies needed for another defense as well as the Defenses entire case has been shown, statistics show that 2nd trials in hung jury cases have a higher propensity for conviction, Phil Spector is serving his time as many on the 2nd trials can attest. In some cases like John Edwards that had a hung jury, Prosecutors didn’t bother to retry BUT you can bet Corey/BDLR will pursue this case with all the monies the State has at their disposal if there is a hung jury.

        I have always thought a hung jury was possible IF not an acquittal. I remain concerned about voir dire, though there are going to be 500 to consider, I remain skeptical, I don’t know how much background information can be honestly vetted from a questionnaire.

        • John Galt says:

          Try for a white male jury, I don’t think they would convict. Seminole county only 12% black? 6 x .12 = .72 = less than 1 black juror, although white people with jobs may try to get out of serving on a 3-week jury trial.



          • boricuafudd says:

            JG, no jury that is constituted without a single AA will acceptable to the BGI, even if it turns out that way, that in itself WILL be problematic.

            • John Galt says:

              “no jury that is constituted without a single AA will acceptable to the BGI, even if it turns out that way, that in itself WILL be problematic.”

              Scott should call out the National Guard to handle such problems.

              • boricuafudd says:

                It may come to that, but that does not change what I said.

              • JB from SoCal says:

                Exactly, JG. This one of the reasons why we have a National Guard in the first place:

                “When National Guard units are not under federal control, the GOVERNOR is the commander-in-chief of the units of his or her respective state…”
                “This is the authority under which GOVERNORS activate and deploy National Guard forces in response to natural disasters. It is also the authority under which GOVERNORS deploy National Guard forces in response to MAN-MADE EMERGENCIES such as RIOTS AND CIVIL UNREST, or terrorist attacks.”

                [my emphasis]

          • diwataman says:

            July 16, 2012
            “Voters are essentially split about whether George Zimmerman — who faces second-degree murder charges for shooting the 17-year-old Trayvon on Feb. 26 — was acting in self-defense when he pulled the trigger. Forty-four percent believe he was and 40 percent say he wasn’t, while 16 percent are not sure. Major differences emerge when voters are separated by geography and race.”

            “The real divide on this is racial, which I think isn’t terribly surprising given the racial tone that this [case] has taken,” said Brad Coker of Mason-Dixon Polling & Research, a nonpartisan, Jacksonville-based company that conducted the poll. The telephone survey of 800 registered Florida voters — all likely to vote in the November general election — was conducted July 9-11 and has a margin of error of 3.5 percentage points.”

            “Only 6 percent of black voters believe Zimmerman was acting in self-defense, while 82 percent said he was not, the poll found. Hispanics were the most likely to agree with Zimmerman’s self-defense claim, with 52 percent saying he was justified, compared to 50 percent of whites. Hispanics were also the most likely to say they were not sure, with 25 percent undecided about the case. Trayvon is black; Zimmerman is Hispanic.”

            Believes it was self defense:
            Black 8%
            White 50%
            Hispanic 52%

            Believes it was not self defense:
            Black 82%
            White ?
            Hispanic 23%

            Black 10%
            White ?
            Hispanic 25%

            White 66.3% 3.978
            Hispanic 17.1% 1.026
            Black 10.5% 0.630
            Other 6.1% 0.366

            • diwataman says:

              Whoopsy, I made a little error there, it should be;

              Believes it was self defense:
              Black 6%

              Black 12%

              • doodahdaze says:

                So if the jury is 2 white, 2 black and 2 Hispanic it will be a brawl in the jury room. Call the bailiff! The jury might hang each other if not supervised. I hope the white guys are big.

            • art tart says:

              D-Man – great information, I have wondered where the opinions and %’s. Encouraging.

              • jello333 says:

                And that was from last summer, way before a lot of the exculpatory stuff had come out. And a lot is still YET to come out. Take another poll a month from now, and it’ll look lots better.

        • Cherpa1 says:

          I think it is entirely possible to have a hung jury. For 6 to agree on the events of that night, let alone 12 looks mighty hard . Tray people have convinced themselves it is a clear and obvious case against Zimmerman. How in the world did this encounter escalate so quickly to a gun being discharged and a death? I hope Mary and Selma will be called to testify for sheer comic relief while the 13 year old Austin testimony hopefully will shed light on the tragedy,

  13. JC says:

    Anybody think it’s coincidental that De La Rionda and Miss Piggy are both Hispanics picked to “get” (semi-hispanic) Zimmerman in a politically motivated travesty – to preempt civil rights violation claims by GZ?

    The Gov is scared shitless that Shapton would be having busloads of black demonstrators at the Disney world gates so he decided to throw GZ to the wolves, overcharge and then hope GZ runs out of money and has to make a plea.

    (What if there are no phone records to support Deedee’s purported conversations with Tray prior to the shooting and she brazenly testifies that she knew she had the conversations with Tray and can’t explain why they didn’t show on the phone records. Would a jury be scared enough to convict on something this preposterous? I’m sure the FL legal system would be too gutless to prosecute deedee or Crump for perjury (Crump doesn’t want to testify (except on TV))

    • maggiemoowho says:

      Angela Corey isn’t Hispanic , she is Syrian. I was shocked to read that she was of Arabic descent.

    • JB from SoCal says:

      Ms. Corey is an Arab, a Syrian (yes, THAT Syria). It is my belief that her family name was changed from Khoury, but that is only from personal experience having lived in small-town Pennsylvania within various ethnic neighborhoods — Syrian, Lebanese, Irish, Italian, Polish, Slovak, African American, Hungarian . . . you name it. I just don’t think that “Corey” is a Syrian name, IMHO.

      Does the fact that she is Arab explain her volatile tirade against a Jewish Professor, Alan Dershowitz ? Not necessarily so, as she appears to be hostile toward anyone who dares question her authority. She should have new opportunities to shoot off her large, hate-spewing, ugly mouth when this news spreads:


      Notice that the only two beneficiaries of her — or I should say, the Florida taxpayers’ — largesse (in the amount of $235,000) are:
      1) Angela Corey
      2) Bernard de la Rionda

      • maggiemoowho says:

        Become boss and upgrade your pension with tax money. Must be nice. Are they planning on retiring soon or maybe being forced into retirement soon.

      • art tart says:

        OMG! What a total screw to the taxpayer’s in Fla., outrageous! Maybe Alan Derchowitz needs to call Shrek and tell her that wasn’t her money, it belonged to the taxpayer’s. Because there was no oversight and she could roll the money into her & BDLR’s retirement, it wasn’t the right thing to do with so many looking for jobs, homeless, etc.

        imo, she and BDLR should have been able to upgrade “or buy in” their pensions with their OWN MONEY, not off the backs of the hard working taxpayer’s in Fla. I guess she thought this wouldn’t come to light, who can she call and threaten over the article, the facts?

      • John Galt says:

        Is this the same compensation as received by other Florida SAs? Or is this Corey’s reward for doing a little favor for Bondi?

      • waltherppk says:

        Crooks with big mouths begging somebody to shut it for them often get their wish

    • boricuafudd says:

      I believe BDLR is of Italian descent, which would make of Latin descent not Hispanic.

  14. brutalhonesty says:

    I have for 5 years studied and documented troll tactics. from the get go on 1070 I found I was debating profiles named for dogs using dog pics, or daffney duck, or nacho man, or gato negro. then I found they automatically call anyone who disagrees “fake” and posts links and asks everyone of their buddies to report. then they make a group to organize their reporting attacks. they once were getting profiles removed from facebook within 2 minutes of the first pro1070 post. Then I found many of the root profiles had all the others as their friends. because doing so enables private messaging to organize what thread location to go to and what person to report and what argument to attack. then facebook introduced pages and the trolling was taken to a whole new level. 1 person using 5 profiles at once using multifox could totally spam up any thread and create a perception of “wide public acceptance” of whatever cause they were promoting.

    I think it would be beneficial if there was a thread devoted to this aspect where we could basically diagram the entire network, from the pr firm down to the paid posters…. similar to the way on all those crime shows they have pictures all over a bulletin board with lines drawn to the other ones they are connected to…..so they can figure out who the mafia boss or terrorist ringleader or whomever is.

      • recoverydotgod says:

        I’m curious if the each of the family members listed in the motion you linked were present during Ben Crump’s witness 8 interview [parents were per Ben Crump affadavit and certain other family members per Ben Crump affidavit. Who were "certain other family members" Stephen???? Jahvaris????] [The state and presumably the defense knows who was there per footnote 2 on page 8]]

        Just interesting to me that Trayvon’s dad would not have checked online phone call records before March 18th if the Esquire article is accurate about the phone call[s] Trayvon [phone] received at the football game on February 25th.

        Here is a link to a Esquire article with a few interesting paragraphs at the bottom of the first page of the article about the football game Saturday night Feb 25th 2012 Trayvon’s dad, Trayvon and Boobie were at.

        This article was published after the Courts Order on October 19 that Ben Crump disclose who was present with him during the interview.

        November 13, 2012, 12:00 AM

        “At one point, he walked away and sat in the bleachers with his headphones on and Trayvon’s dad said, Look at this man over there. He over there on the phone, talkin’ to a little girl…”

        Read more: Trayvon Martin Family Interview – Trayvon Martin Aftermath – Esquire http://www.esquire.com/features/americans-2012/trayvon-martin-1212#ixzz2LTCJMBQb

        • maggiemoowho says:

          Considering that Jahvaris and Ronquavis spoke to her at the wake. I find it very hard to believe that it took a few weeks after the wake for Tracy to come across her in the phone records. Are we supposed to believe that she knew TM was shot, went to his wake and couldn’t put two and two together. The whole story is bogus IMO.

          • tara says:

            Right. She was at the funeral (not the wake) and met Ronquavis and other family members but did not tell them that she’d been on the phone with Trademark. Totally believable. (eye roll)

            I think what happened was that she DID tell them about the phone calls, but it took stupid Team Skittles a few weeks to figure out how to get the paper evidence to back up their story. But I suspect that the original DeeDee freaked when parts of her interview were played by Crump at his press conference and by ABC’s Matt Gutless Wonder on the evening news, and when the pressure was on for this “star witness” to be interviewed by BDLR so that they could use it for Corey’s My Very First Affidavit they had to find a ringer.

            Question: DeeDee #2 apparently signed an affidavit stating her age and name. Would it include her address as well? And does anyone else think that the reason why DeeDee 2 was interviewed at Sybrina’s house and not her own is because they wanted as little documentation as possible containing her address? I wonder if her phone account has her address.

            • maggiemoowho says:

              Tara, I almost went back to check what I wrote last time and didn’t, but I had to laugh when I read funeral not wake. I’ll get it right one of these times. Thanks for correcting that again. :)

            • jello333 says:

              MOM and West should not just ask for her “address”. They should ask what her address is NOW, what it was at the time of both the Crump and Bernie interviews, and what it was on Feb 26th. That could be important.

    • John Galt says:

      Very well done.

    • diwataman says:

      I don’t see the ownage. She already ruled in part on this, she’s not going to change he mind and suddenly be all nice to the defense; denied.

      • selfdefenseadvocate says:

        Grounds for appeal?

      • raiikun says:

        And if she denies it, that can be appealed.

      • brutalhonesty says:

        He suggests the witnesses credibility is in question, he asserts a denial is a violation of his constitutional rights, and he goes after the states claim the witness is “afraid”…a blanket statement devoid of fact, and ultimately an underhanded accusation that the defense and specifically george had threatened or intimidated her…..and he points out nelson ruled based on “lesters order” when “lesters order” contains no provision addressing the addresses outside of that they will be redacted from the media and public…not that they will be denied to the defense team.

        basically we have west saying “denying this violates his rights”..so for her to deny it she will need to lay out how it does not violate his rights very succinctly, and it will be another bulletpoint on the appeals evidence list. West is also saying nelson hasnt even read lesters orders when she uses them to affirm her denials.

        the above alone to me is ownage, combined with it is dated the 19th(and i would assume/hope filed and the end of the business day and not before lunch) and court is on the 22nd…giving the state little time to respond without breaking nelson’s 48 hour rule….which also begs the question: will she again violate her own rule to the detriment of george?

        • diwataman says:

          I hear ya but they already whined about that stuff directly to the judges face and look what they get for it.

          When are all these appeals people keep talking about supposed to happen? After conviction?

          • John Galt says:

            “When are all these appeals people keep talking about supposed to happen? After conviction?”

            Or perhaps after a hung jury in connection with an appeal of denial of immunity. Generally speaking though, you are correct. Many discovery orders are not appealable until after conviction. The basis is that the appeals court avoids lots of work, an errant discovery order is not irreparable injury as it can be appealed after conviction, and even then the appeals court can often avoid setting aside a conviction on the basis of “harmless error” — the defendant would have been convicted anyway.

            • diwataman says:

              Okay then, so they’re doing all this whiny stuff in case George gets convicted and they’ll be prepared for the appeal with all of these motions that contain the complaints. So in other words O’Mara had George convicted long ago in his mind and has been playing the whole game for an appeal. Great, it’s worse than I thought.

              • justfactsplz says:

                It is worse than we thought. They are denying George his constitutional rights and the right to a fair trial. The defense should not be having all of this trouble getting all of the discovery from the state. And the judge isn’t helping one bit.

              • MJW says:

                So in other words O’Mara had George convicted long ago in his mind and has been playing the whole game for an appeal.

                Any defense attorney worth his salt preserves issues for appeal. Only a complete incompetent thinks, “Why bother? We’ve got this in the bag!”

                • diwataman says:

                  Right but my point is O’Mara’s primary mindset this entire time seems to me was to play a long game based on appeal after conviction, that is, everything else is secondary, not too reassuring if you ask me.

                  • jello333 says:

                    I think you’re wrong in your assumption, though. See my other comment below (about a Richardson hearing). I still think MOM and West are gonna go over Nelson’s head if need be. I still think they’re gonna make sure they have all the discovery, and have finished all the depos BEFORE this goes forward (to hearing/trial). I may be wrong, but that’s what I believe. YES, I agree that what they’re doing now is partly to have everything on-record in case of an appeal…. but only partly. In other words, no, I don’t believe they’re just looking past the hearing/trial and focusing on appeals. No, I don’t believe that. But I won’t make you risk any more cakes just yet.

                  • diwataman says:

                    My assumption is based off of what others are saying that there will be appeals. I see you all bringing it up but I don’t see it happening in reality. As you can see, others are saying that when people are talking “appeal” they are talking about after trial.

                    So that is what my assumption is based on.

                    If you think there will be some sort of appeal before an immunity hearing and/or trial then you’re arguing with the wrong person.

          • jello333 says:

            NO. It’s supposed to happen BEFORE an immunity hearing or trial. This triggers a Richardson hearing BEFORE anything moves forward. It’s not optional. Last night some of us were talking about a case that someone (LetJusticePrevail, I think) found. It is VERY relevant to this case. Both on discovery violations, incl. “feet dragging”, and a judge’s refusal to grant a continuance. This is the case…. and yeah, I already sent it to MOM and West (though they probably already know about it):

            Cuminotto v. State, (Fla. 4th DCA 2012)


            • diwataman says:

              Why are you arguing with me on this? Take it up with the others who apparently disagree.

              • jello333 says:

                Hey now! ;) ;) You should be PROUD that it’s you I’m picking on right now. Check my record, and you’ll see that it’s only the most knowledgable people here that I have the deep back-and-forths with.

                Seriously, though, I didn’t mean that to be an argument. I just didn’t remember if you were here last night when that was being talked about. And I wanted to make sure you were aware of it, since you’re one of the guys who I look to the most when it comes to all-around knowledge of this case. I’m as in awe of your work as anyone is… don’t let my joking with you create any doubt about that.

      • jello333 says:

        We need new rules regarding judges, since some of them don’t seem to care if they get overturned on appeal or not. They really couldn’t care less. Fine. Then let’s have a new rule that’s sorta like a report card. If you’re overturned less than 1% of the time, you get an ‘A’. 3% of the time, ‘B’, and so on. If you’re overturned more than 10% of the time, you FAIL and…. bye bye, look for another career.

      • jello333 says:

        There are laws and rules that explicitly control what a trial judge, including Lazy Nelson, can legally do. Precedent, controlling caselaw…. she can NOT simply ignore that. Oh, she CAN, I suppose… there’s no one gonna handcuff her right there on the bench and haul her away. But she WILL be overturned. And as I said in another comment, when a judge has that kind of CONTEMPT for the rules/laws, she should be PUNISHED for it. (Notice I said “should”, not “will”)

    • Angel says:

      The stuff going on in this case with a defendant having to beg to know the true identify of a witness to be able to confront them as his right per 6th amendment makes a John Grisham novel seem boring by comparison and I love me some John Grisham. If any of you want a good read by him, “An Innocent Man” which was based on a true story details what prosecutors are capable of in order to win.

      • doodahdaze says:

        Floriduh as some strange laws. Such as the law about drug possession. Where even if the possessor has no idea it is drugs they can get 25 years. Like a Granny with a bad Grandson who stashes Cocaine in her flour can. I kid you not. They can put Granny in Prison.

        • ftsk420 says:

          Florida has a lot of those strange laws.

          Women may be fined for falling asleep under a hair dryer, as can the salon owner.

          When having sex, only the missionary position is legal.

          You are not allowed to break more than three dishes per day, or chip the edges of more than four cups and/or saucers.

          Oral sex is illegal.

          Just to name a few.

    • jello333 says:

      There ya go. Setting up a Richardson hearing, and maybe a DCA appeal of Nelson’s idiotic Nazi scheduling.

  15. Nettles18 says:

    News from the defense team. They are going to address the voice recordings they are looking for and Mr. Crump’s deposition on Friday, Feb. 22nd. In addition, Mr. West has filed a motion to get the addresses of witness from the Category A list including the family of Trayvon, W7, @W10, W24, W25 and W8.


    • HughStone says:

      I bet Crump just pooped his pants.

      • John Galt says:

        The fact that Nelson ruled against SCOTUS precedent on such a clear cut issue indicates that she is ill suited to be a judge on the Florida Supreme Court. Hopefully somebody will bring up her performance in this case when she next requests consideration for that position.

        • doodahdaze says:

          The main thing for her is 5th DCA. She is kinda bound by some of the cites West has in the new motions. Other circuits don’t bind her in Floriduh.

          • MJW says:

            Somewhat surprisingly, that’s not true. Florida doesn’t work like the hierarchical federal system. In Florida, all trial courts are bound by any DCA decision unless there’s a conflicting decision in another district. If there are conflicting DCA decisions, and the DCA of the trial court’s district has issued an opinion on the matter, the court is bound by that decision. All courts are, of course, bound by a state supreme court decision.

            • jello333 says:

              GOOD! As I said in other comments, this case (from 4th, not 5th) is perfectly on-point with what’s going on: Cuminotto v. State (Fla. 4th DCA 2012)

          • MJW says:

            Forgot the cite.

            Pardo v. State, 596 So. 2d 665 (Fla. 1992):

            The District Courts of Appeal are required to follow Supreme Court decisions. As an adjunct to this rule it is logical and necessary in order to preserve stability and predictability in the law that, likewise, trial courts be required to follow the holdings of higher courts — District Courts of Appeal. The proper hierarchy of decisional holdings would demand that in the event the only case on point on a district level is from a district other than the one in which the trial court is located, the trial court be required to follow that decision. Alternatively, if the district court of the district in which the trial court is located has decided the issue, the trial court is bound to follow it. Contrarily, as between District Courts of Appeal, a sister district’s opinion is merely persuasive.

        • jello333 says:

          She is. She’s really, really bad. The only question is WHY. Is she totally biased and in the pocket of the BGI or someone else? Or is she just lacking the basic knowledge any 2nd-year law school student should have? Or maybe it’s just pure LAZINESS, as I often accuse her of? Regardless, this woman should NOT be a judge at ANY level.

      • John Galt says:

        They may have a problem with W8’s address not matching historical location data for her alleged phone, which motivated the State to violate the law by refusing to disclose her address. Of course Crump may have found a more suitable ping log matching residence for her by now.

      • myopiafree says:

        Yes, Include DeeDee? You want that TOO?

    • Nettles18 says:

      In reading the motion for addresses, it is learned the depositions are set to happen in mid-March in South Florida.

    • sundance says:

      Ask yourself this question. Why was this, these constitutional and cited arguments, NOT presented in the October hearing for witness address?

      That has always baffled me.

      I said at the time both O’Mara, and unfortunately West, were insufferably short-sighted in not visibly challenging the judge to justify her position – it just did not make sense.

      Denial of witness identity is a BIG EFFEN DEAL. Not only was Nelso ridiculously wrong, but O’Mara and West just did the potted plant routine in the face of it.

      No-One has been able to reconcile why West/O’Mara just let that *sit* unchallenged.

  16. mung says:

    Wow the Trayvonites really took over the Click Orlando thread on Shellie. They seem to hate her worse than George. It is amazing that they can’t see that they look awful with the comments they make about the family and friends of George. Not a single one of them would care about her if she was married to someone else.

    • justfactsplz says:

      Yes, they have slowly taken over the site. The pure hatred is awful.

      • art tart says:

        I am appalled that Click Orlando and the Orlando Sentinel allow some of the hate monger’s to personally attack blogger’s, people they don’t even know. It seems that neither site cares their readers are bullied, I think it says a lot about both outlets. Why provide a blog for hate, you can’t have a decent discussion for the off topic name calling.

        • selfdefenseadvocate says:

          Not to worry- Potential jurors are not likely to read those trash talking posts. Potential jurors are probably at work or doing other productive things. I am a potential juror and I stay away from those sites- none of my neighbors or friends even follow the case.

        • justfactsplz says:

          Click Orland was the first place I blogged about this case. It was the first I blogged period. I saw the misconceptions and jumped in to defend George. Over time more and more people there supported George. Lately it has been bombarded with lies and hate. Click Orlando rarely features a pro GZ blogger. They have even kicked off some they thought were racial but allow these people to threaten and call names. That is why I don’t blog there as much anymore. They wish all kinds of terrible things to happen to George, his family, his friends, and his supporters.

      • maggiemoowho says:

        Not sure how they think that being that hateful is in any way honoring TM, if that’s what they want to do. It is very immature and only brings dishonor to him. Hatefulness, name calling and shallowness turn people off and most people will avoid those situations.

        • brutalhonesty says:

          it seems tray would approve…his own postings on his own fb and twitter are similar in nature. Constantly talking sexual and putting down women. they are living up to his name and his legacy of hate for women and whites. he set the bar, and they are reaching to attain it. they are just waiting for an excuse to “put the bangers” to a “cracker” when this case doesnt go their way. they see total justifications for his actions and seek to emulate his behavior. and they dont want to pay the same price he did for those actions.

        • justfactsplz says:

          Most people do avoid it. I am glad for the brave ones that do try to shed the light on their lies.

    • rumpole2 says:

      That is the subject of my daily Daft Post from Justarse Quest tomorrow. They at least gave George a day off.. every post was about Shellie… and mostly just hate and person al attacks.

    • GZ Supporter says:

      There is one mentally unstable TM supporter who has been caught using umpteen fake profiles to smear GZ, SZ and RZjr on another blog. She has created so many different fake profiles in a desperate attempt to make it look like TM has overwhelming support. When a GZ supporter comments she goes absolutely berserk and uses these different fake profiles to attack, harass and bombard the commenter. She even used the real GZ and SZ’s name and pictures to make highly inflammatory statements. This tells me she knows how pathetically weak the state’s case is and she can’t rely on their “evidence” to support her convictions. The fact that she needs to resort to stooping to this level speaks volumes.

  17. brutalhonesty says:

    rjzr tweeted this link, says they are trying to slander his reputation
    Robert Zimmerman Jr. doesn’t know what he’s talking about.
    “Stand Your Ground is not a factor in this defense,” said the brother of George Zimmerman, killer of Trayvon Martin, on Friday on HBO’s “Real Time with Bill Maher.” That should come as a surprise to Zimmerman’s lawyer Mark O’Mara, who was in a Sanford, Fla., courtroom the day before unsuccessfully seeking a delay in the April start of a “Stand Your Ground” (SYG) hearing. But the older Zimmerman brother’s inaccurate assertions about SYG didn’t end there. The more he talked, the more he drifted away from the truth of that insane law. It’s not called a “license to kill” for nothing — and it might be his brother’s get-out-of-jail-free card.
    Zimmerman said this on “Real Time.”
    “Stand your ground” is not a factor in this defense. “Stand your ground” did a couple different, I don’t want to get overly legal, but it kind of prevented people from being dragged through civil court when they are found criminally innocent of a crime. Now, what happened there and why it’s not a factor is because stand your ground removes the duty to retreat, a presumed duty to retreat sometimes, if someone comes in here with a gun why are we not just running out the door? Why would someone take out a gun and shoot him? And then you get into the slippery slope of is it homicide or not? You’re not presumed able to be in a retreatable position when someone is sitting on top of you, slamming your head into the concrete repeatedly after they’ve broken your nose. There is no ability or capacity one has….
    To understand how wrong Zimmerman is you need to know what Florida’s statute actually says.
    Florida statute 776.013(3) says: (a) person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.
    Florida statute 776.032(1) says: A person who uses force as permitted in…s. 776.013…is justified in using such force and is immune from criminal prosecution and civil action for the use of such force, unless the person against whom force was used is a law enforcement officer….As used in this subsection, the term “criminal prosecution” includes arresting, detaining in custody, and charging or prosecuting the defendant.
    SYG greatly expands the Castle Doctrine. That’s the longstanding legal right to defend yourself in your home or place of work without a duty to retreat before using deadly force. In 2005, Florida expanded that zone of protection to wherever you have a legal right to be. It also granted immunity from prosecution.
    The law does not just prevent “people from being dragged through civil court when they are found criminally innocent of a crime,” as Zimmerman asserted. It can also keep someone who uses deadly force from being further prosecuted. And, according to Kendall Coffey, a former U.S. attorney for the Southern District of Florida, its practical effect is to prevent arrest in the first place. This, plus Sanford police believing they didn’t have enough evidence to charge him, was perhaps the primary reason why George Zimmerman was allowed to leave the Sanford Police Department hours after killing Trayvon. And it very well may be what allows him to avoid his second-degree murder trial.

    Last June, I outlined how, despite the risks, Zimmerman could walk thanks to SYG. As the law makes clear someone can “meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself.” The key being “reasonably believes.” Zimmerman’s words and injuries will carry great weight in a he-said-he-said where one of the individuals is dead.
    Now, here’s how you know Robert Zimmerman is clueless about the SYG law. Section 776.041 might hold the key to his brother’s freedom.
    Florida statute 776.041(2) says: Use of force by aggressor.—The justification described in the preceding sections of this chapter is not available to a person who:
    (2) Initially provokes the use of force against himself or herself, unless:
    (a)  Such force is so great that the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant,….
    Detective Chris Serino’s March 13 request to arrest Zimmerman for manslaughter noted that “[t]he encounter between George Zimmerman and Trayvon Martin was ultimately avoidable by Zimmerman if Zimmerman had remained in his vehicle and awaited the arrival of law enforcement, or conversely if he had identified himself to Martin as a concerned citizen and initiated dialog (sic) in an effort to dispel each party’s concern.” This would make Zimmerman the one who “initially provokes the use of force against himself.” Thus, not covered by SYG.

    George Zimmerman (Reuters)

    But, remember, Zimmerman says Trayvon cold-cocked him with a punch in the face. He also said the unarmed 17-year-old “grabbed my head and slammed it into the concrete sidewalk several times.” He added in his written statement hours after killing Trayvon, “My head felt like it was going to explode,” “the suspect covered my mouth and nose and stopped my breathing” and “I felt the suspect reach for my non-exposed firearm and say, ‘Your [sic] gonna die tonight m———–.’”
    Under this insane law, if he is found credible by the judge, Zimmerman’s “reasonable belief” that his life was in danger might be enough to allow him to escape prosecution. This determination would be made by Judge Debra Nelson, who took the case after Judge Kenneth Lester was removed from the case last August. Zimmerman attorney O’Mara went judge shopping after Lester’s scathing July 5 order revoking Zimmerman’s bond and increasing restrictions on his movement. Lester was concerned Zimmerman was preparing to flee the country after discovering that the defendant and his wife were hiding money derived from donations from supporters and a second passport.
    In his motion to disqualify Lester, O’Mara said he believed “the Court has created a reasonable fear in Mr. Zimmerman that this court is biased against him and because of this prejudice he cannot receive a fair and impartial trial or hearing by this Court.” And O’Mara was most concerned about Lester’s impact on an impending SYG hearing.
    After all, this Court would preside over and is the trier of fact in any immunity proceeding under Florida statute 776.032. In that proceeding, the Defendant has the burden to convince the Court by preponderance of the evidence that he is entitled to the protections of the statute. . . . Those protections are significant. If the Defendant prevails at that hearing, he is immune from criminal prosecution and civil action. Mr. Zimmerman fears that the Court has already decided that he is not worthy of belief regardless of the type of proceeding or the corroborative evidence that would support his testimony.
    For Robert Zimmerman to say SYG is not a factor in his brother’s case against the second-degree murder charge shows how little he knows about the law and his brother’s defense.
    Follow Jonathan Capehart on Twitter.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      Shorter Jonathan Capehart: the statutory meaning of initial aggressor eludes me.

      Psst, hey Johnnie: under Florida statute and precedent case law, “initial aggressor” means, specifically, initial physical aggressor.

      “Getting out of the car” does not meet that threshold. Thanks for playing.

      • John Galt says:

        “The law does not just prevent “people from being dragged through civil court when they are found criminally innocent of a crime,” as Zimmerman asserted.”

        Seems like Jonathan overlooked some of the provisions of 776.032.


        (1) A person who uses force as permitted in s. 776.012, s. 776.013, or s. 776.031 is justified in using such force and is immune from criminal prosecution *** and civil action *** for the use of such force


        (3) The court shall award reasonable attorney’s fees, court costs, compensation for loss of income, and all expenses incurred by the defendant in defense of any civil action brought by a plaintiff if the court finds that the defendant is immune from prosecution as provided in subsection (1).

    • boricuafudd says:

      As the saying goes, ” you can take a horse to the water, but can’t make him drink.” The same applies for columnist they can read and quote the law, they just can’t understand it or apply properly.

    • cassandra says:

      Hard to understand how the WP allows Capehart’s to continue to print misinformation and promote his racist agenda. Last spring I had an email exchange with him, he came across as unreasonable and resentful, a man of privilege misusing his position.

      • Chip Bennett says:

        Hard to understand how the WP allows Capehart’s to continue to print misinformation and promote his racist agenda.

        Consider the source. WaPo clearly do not have a high standard for their political “bloggers”; after all, just last week or so, another WaPo blogger got snookered by a satirical article that Sarah Palin had been hired as a correspondent by Al Jazeera, and printed it as fact.

    • John Galt says:

      “This, plus Sanford police believing they didn’t have enough evidence to charge him, was perhaps the primary reason why George Zimmerman was allowed to leave the Sanford Police Department hours after killing Trayvon.”

      Johnathan’s shocking discovery: cops can’t make arrests without probable cause. They even have a name for that: False Arrest.

      • boricuafudd says:

        Is there not a group of people who always complain that they get arrested without probable cause? I think, I have seen them march and protest this from time to time regarding this.

      • boutis says:

        To wit Monsier Crump made some up with the assistance of a varied and storied crew. However documenting said evidence is a bit of a problem which he does not wish to discuss.

    • jello333 says:

      God, Capehart, you are such a FOOL. 95% of what you talked about there was SIMPLE SELF-DEFENSE. And THAT is was RZ Jr was talking about. George doesn’t NEED stand-your-ground to prevail. So that “insane law” really IS, as Bobby says, irrelevant to this case. So maybe you also wanna call traditional self-defense statutes “insane”? Is that where’s you’re going with this, Capehart? Sheesshhh… what exact qualifications ARE needed to get a job like yours, huh?

    • ejarra says:

      I found this and thought it fit here:

  18. diwataman says:

    I see on the list they have the illusive W24. That is the only person listed which I couldn’t even find which investigator interviewed that person.

    Considering now who W24 is grouped with I’m going to guess it’s Alicia Martin.

  19. mung says:

    You can’t fix stupid. From a post from a rabid Trayvonite on Click Orlando:

    As GZ states he aimed the gun making SURE he did not shoot his left hand and FIRED. Evincing a depraved mind for disregard of human life AFTER the shot when he claimed he was taking such a beating that TM HAD to have something in his hands so he mounted him with his FULL weight knowing the gravity of the situation and was seen pressing on the neck area of TM

    • brutalhonesty says:

      interesting I have seen that very post word for word over and over from multiple “individuals”. more proof of a written script from the pr firm going to the paid trolls for dissemination

  20. Where the popcorn at?

    • Chip Bennett says:

      Crump fights Zimmerman’s attempt to depose him. Files p-work today asking judge to forbid it.

      Don’t worry; I’m sure Nelson will see nothing insurmountable here.

    • boricuafudd says:

      Well, that did not take long, and it abides by the 48 hour rule, too.

    • John Galt says:

      Protip for Rene: os.com is not the same site as http://www.orlandosentinel.com

    • recoverydotgod says:

      How will this play with Blackwell’s argument in court on Feb 5th, 2013 of Ben Crump acting in this case [the interview of Witness 8] as a “private attorney general”?

      • boutis says:

        Did she just figure this out? Should someone draw a diagram for her?

      • Chip Bennett says:

        Crump’s atty: Crump was hired by #Trayvon’s parents to pursue “civil claims” against #GeorgeZimmerman. Translation GZ likely to be sued.

        Salient issue: Trayvon Martin’s parents are not parties to the State of Florida v. George Zimmerman prosecution. Trayvon Martin’s parents are not parties of either the prosecution nor of the defense. Therefore, Benjamin Crump is not in any way involved in the the case, and is not a “general attorney”, public, private, or otherwise.

        Wikipedia, roll tape:

        Private attorney general is an informal term usually used today in the United States to refer to a private party who brings a lawsuit considered to be in the public interest, i.e., benefiting the general public and not just the plaintiff. The person considered “private attorney general” is entitled to recover attorney’s fees if he or she prevails. The rationale behind this principle is to provide extra incentive to private citizens to pursue suits that may be of benefit to society at large.

        Crump does not represent anyone who has brought suit against Zimmerman. Other than the criminal prosecution, no suits have been brought against Zimmerman. Thus, Crump’s claim of being a “private attorney general” is moot. And even if it weren’t, any civil suits brought by Crump’s clients against Zimmerman have absolutely nothing to do with the State’s criminal prosecution of Zimmerman.

        • recoverydotgod says:

          Makes sense. Wonder why Attorney Blackwell brought that up when speaking to the court? Just for TV?

          • John Galt says:

            I think Blackwell intended to bamboozle Nelson with the “private attorney general” nonsense. There is a substantial body of case law that generally shields prosecutors from being deposed. Blackwell knew that Nelson, a former prosecutor, would know about the prosecutor shield law, so he extrapolated it a little bit into “private attorney general” in order to resonate with Nelson’s memory banks.

            • recoverydotgod says:

              I think Blackwell’s written “borrowed wits of his parents attorney” and his Feb 5th spoken “private attorney general” are going to clash in the memory banks of Judge Nelson.

              • woohoowee says:

                “private attorney general”.

                Considering Chip’s Wikipedia definition, was Blackwell attempting to assert “social justice attorney general”? All in the public’s interest, ya know (heavy sarcasm).

                March 20, 2012

                “Former mayor of Baltimore and the current dean of Howard Law Kurt Schmoke sent a letter to the Martins’ lawyer offering assistance.

                “I didn’t think the family had resources to hire some big law firm so Howard Law, with its history of social justice involvement, seemed to be the right place to provide that support,” Schmoke said.

                The Martin family attorney has some powerful evidence. A 16-year-old girl claims she was on the phone with Trayvon moments before the shooting and he said he feared he was being followed.”


            • jello333 says:

              Ah, but Judge Debra Nelson is completely unbamboozleable!!!

        • rabbit says:

          The term private attorney general was used by Crump’s attorney to describe Crump’s position before GZ was charged and while the SPD was saying there was no reason for him to be charged. It was Crump, as a private ag, who found DeeDee and interviewed her. He was also preparing to sue GZ in the public interest. I don’t believe there is a claim that Crump is still working as a private ag but there may still be a civil suit against GZ, whether he is found guilty or not guilty. Recall that even though OJ was found not guilty in criminal court, he was found guilty in civil court.

          • MJW says:

            It was Crump, as a private ag, who found DeeDee and interviewed her.

            As Chip Bennett already pointed out, Crump wasn’t acting as a “private attorney general” within the accepted meaning of the term. He was acting as a private attorney who probably interfered with the investigation by instructing Tracy Martin to withhold the T-Mobile account password so that Crump could get to W8 before the police could.

            Even if he were acting as a private attorney general, it would have no affect on whether he can be deposed.

        • doodahdaze says:

          Maybe that is how he will get the payola. He sure could not get a settlement.

      • JC says:

        I’d describe the Crumpster as being a private prosecutor or leading a posse.

        He will go to extreme lengths to avoid being deposed.

        Did I read correctly that Crump was at BDLR deposition of Deedee? That seems odd. reinforce the message that she was to stick to script with the story Crumpster taught her (which is no mean feat)

        • John Galt says:

          Yes, BDLR mentioned during the recorded W8 interview that Crump had been there earlier. Another good topic for a Crump deposition: how he helped BDLR and W8 “prepare” for her interview.

      • disgustedwithjulison says:

        The counterclaims in civil court that could be filed against the Martin/Julison/Fulton/Crump party would make this quite the court battle. George definitely has damages due to their lies perpetrated. I can’t see how Crump will pursue suing GZ as he will get named as a party in the counterclaims. Crump may go after insurance companies, HOA, or gun companies…but he has poisoned the pool re GZ and will find himself writing the check to GZ at the conclusion of any civil trial.

    • SANFORD – An attorney for Benjamin Crump, the high-profile Tallahassee lawyer for Trayvon Martin’s family, today filed paperwork, suggesting that Trayvon’s parents intend to sue George Zimmerman.

      It’s been clear for months that the family is seeking damages from the homeowners association of the Sanford subdivision where Trayvon was shot, the Retreat at Twin Lakes………


      • disgustedwithjulison says:

        Oh this is way to funny….Crump doesn’t want to be deposed…so he is saying that they can’t depose him because he plans on filing a civil lawsuit against GZ if this goes to court! Squirm Benjamin…..squirm! Too precious.

        With that said – the system is corrupt. I have said before, all of the actors will play this out, but in the end, Crump will never be deposed. The system protects each other….especially in Florida.

        • doodahdaze says:

          Now. He should go in to the bait business. Nightcrawlers are fetching a pretty penny. Good grief. It gets better by the day now. Don’t depose me Bro!

      • doodahdaze says:

        I want to sue the guy selling paper’s on the corner in the road. I want 15% of everything he reported to the IRS next year.

    • doodahdaze says:

      Tune in next week. Amos will take the deposition of Kingfish. Calhoun will object on the grounds of Holy Mackerel’s are endangered species.

    • myopiafree says:

      This will indeed be a “make or break” moment in this trial. If Nelson denies it, then you can be certain she will deny the DeeDee deposition. This will fully define whose “side” Nelson in on. A critical Friday for this case. I think DeeDee is lying, because the Heart Cell phone had a dead battery. When do we get that full data dump??

      • jello333 says:

        What Nelson says and does on Friday is very important. But far more important — if Nelson rules against them — is what MOM and West do and say in response. I mean what they say in court, as well as what paperwork they might file in the days immediately following.

      • doodahdaze says:

        Tune in next month after she can’t figger it out.

      • MJW says:

        If Nelson denies it, then you can be certain she will deny the DeeDee deposition.

        I won’t be surprised if Nelson doesn’t allow Crump to be deposed (even though there’s no good legal justification); I’ll be shocked if she doesn’t allow DeeDee to be deposed.

        • jello333 says:

          I still believe what I’ve been saying for months now: Neither Crump nor Dee Dee will be deposed, unless it’s nothing more than “I plead the 5th”. In which case, I see this not only ending before trial, but even before an immunity hearing. I just don’t see how this goes forward if the defense is not allowed to get to the bottom of the Dee Dee Saga…. and I can’t see the State ALLOWING the defense to get to the bottom of it. As I think most people here agree, exposing everything surrounding Dee Dee could be the death knell for the BGI.

  21. art tart says:

    I have wondered why MOM/West/Beasley Firm said “they didn’t have a problem w/Judge N presiding over the NBC case.” Why is that? It seems they could have gotten another Judge due to conflict of interest, I never understood why they thought allowing her to remain helped them, but then again, maybe the alternative was worse, IDK.

    • John Galt says:

      There is no indication that they served the NBC complaint. No return of service, no answer. As of yet, there is really nothing for Nelson to provide over in the NBC case.

  22. rumpole2 says:

    Crump’s response is “brilliant”… apparently :D

    It never ceases to amaze me that a legal professional (albeit a bad one) associates herself with anonymous dopes like LIMPapa?

  23. boricuafudd says:

    Let me guess, I am the attorney for the Family, and we are suing GZ so anything that I done is covered under attorney work product, and cannot be discussed.

  24. art tart says:

    From OS article:

    It would be wrong, Blackwell wrote, for Trayvon’s killer “to prepare his defense on the borrowed wits of his parents’ attorney.”

    What bullchit. WHY did Crump NEED Blackwell filing paperwork stating Crump represented Trayvon’s parent’s in the Civil Suits they plan to file, why didn’t Crump file that paperwork since Crump HAD ALREADY filed on behalf of Sybrina for $ 75,000.00?

    For Blackwell to try to deflect the needed answers to questions the Defense needs such as how DD was vetted, who contacted her, yadayadayada, is disingenuous and insulting. What wit does Crump possess, trying to locate the “t” in the name Martin?

    WHAT are they afraid of and more importantly, are Tracy and Sybrina afraid their parenting of Trayvon is going to have to be answered for in the depositions, who TM was living with, why was TM left unsupervised the weekend of the tragedy, why did Tracy call JUVY first when looking for TM? Tracy/Sybrina can just get over it., they have promoted themselves and their proposed values in the media since the event, now they can legally go on record. TM’s family needs to pretend it is just another INTERVIEW except they have to tell the truth and aren’t getting paid this time. I too hope MOM/West ASK Tracy/Sybrina how much $$$$$ they have made thus far from interviews, for “licensing fees” which encompasses pictures, videos,air fare, hotel accommodations, etc.

    • John Galt says:

      The actual legal precedent is set forth in West’s motion. Attorney-client privilege and attorney work product doctrine objections should be evaluated on a question by question basis. Sweeping mumbo jumbo like “It would be wrong, Blackwell wrote, for Trayvon’s killer “to prepare his defense on the borrowed wits of his parents’ attorney.” should not carry much weight.

      West and MOM are probably getting a good laugh out of the concept of borrowing Crump’s wits.

      IMHO, decision of this motion is a defining moment for Nelson.

    • jello333 says:

      Oh, I love this! ;)

      “TM’s family needs to pretend it is just another INTERVIEW except they have to tell the truth and aren’t getting paid this time.”

  25. eastern2western says:

    my question is what exactly are the martins going to get out of zimmerman? the man is in debt and has no way of making money. what ever he has left will not even cover one cocktail party for the crumpster. then what is the point of the law suit?

    • boricuafudd says:

      A lawsuit by Crump will legally hide his machinations in the case. Is not about any assets GZ currently has but any future assets and legal cover.

      • art tart says:

        GZ may eventually have assets if the NBC case settled BEFORE the Civil Suit Crump is planning against GZ/ Twin Lakes is litigated. I assume GZ will have legal fees owed to MOM/West for representation in anticipation NBC will pay. Perhaps MOM/West are first in line to any monies GZ gets from the Civil Suit.. KC is filing bankruptcy to try to get out of Judgements, of course the defendants are protesting but legal analyst say in Fla., Judgements can be dismissed in bankruptcy UNLESS they are federal. (student loans are federal also and aren’t dismissed in bankruptcy.)

        It seems Crump is going to have to PROVE GZ was acting as “captain” that night as opposed to running errands as GZ has claimed. IF GZ wasn’t acting as “captain” of neighborhood watch, nor did he identify himself to anyone as Captain of neighborhood watch, Crump will have to prove it. Twin Oaks may appear to have deep pockets but attorneys representing them will fight Crump in his assertion UNLESS they offered to settle for a smaller amount. Only time will tell.

      • doodahdaze says:

        He may have to recover from the Salvation Army Soup Kitchen. He can get the Sunday meal for the next three years. Or even the worn out batteries from Zimmerman’s ankle bracelet to recycle.

      • doodahdaze says:

        If Crump gets his way and GZ is imprisoned for 30 years he can only garnish his prison wages making Car Tags. 5 cents an hour. That will deplete his commissary fund.

    • maggiemoowho says:

      They won’t get a dime from George if he is aquitted under Self Defense. He is free from all Civil Liability. They can’t sue him. George will also be entitled to back wages and other reimbursements from the state.

      • jello333 says:

        We need to quit even entertaining the idea of any of these freaks suing George. Ain’t gonna happen… ever. But vice-versa?… oh yeah.

    • skeptiktank says:

      George could come into a lot of money even if found guilty. NBC is just a test case. The first domino if you will. What the big deep pockets networks did is libelous whether he is guilty or not. I would think they all understand this. Also, there could be a book deal, a movie…whatever.

  26. ed greene says:

    Your honor
    Mr Crump and his associates have given at least 3 different stories how witness 8 was found.
    Here are the tapes.
    Mr Crump had them issue a picture of a 12 year boy.
    When Sybrina Fulton said on NBC Today it was an accident(Play Tape) Mr Crump said she made a mistake. Does Mr Crump expect your honor to believe he didnt know whom he was talking to.in his Witness 8 interview.
    No ID given to him . He just didnt graduate law school. He said W8 was a minor.
    Listen to tape it stops more times than it goes.
    He has told many untruths in order to get my client charged.
    He might have also advised some other people to lie.(Sybrina and Tracy, Austins momma)
    What is he afraid of in a deposition the TRUTH.
    Who found witness 8 why did witness 8 not call police, look for trayvon, call Trayvons parents.
    Who dont even know if it is same person in Crump witness 8 interview and in the BDLR witness 8 interview.. The state charges were brought about because Witness was found. Not by the State or Police but some how by the Crump organization. Tracy stated to 2 witness that it was not Trayvon screaming for help on tape with he later changed after talking to Crump.
    Mr Dershowitz.,one of leading attorneys in country, said that the arrest affadavit for murder 2 was ridiculious, without witness 8 and the two parents identifing the screaming as Trayvon it would be more than ridiculious.

    If you guys can print those tapes here.All MOM or Mr West have to do is follow this script.
    I am not a lawyer or play one on TV

  27. diwataman says:

    “It would be wrong, Blackwell wrote, for Trayvon’s killer “to prepare his defense on the borrowed wits of his parents’ attorney.”


  28. ottawa925 says:

    Attention: Here is the Response filed by Blackwell re: Crump

    click on the link

    • I can’t wait to hear the discussion of this.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      I couldn’t get past the first paragraph:

      Without attempting to make any sort of threshold showing designed to overcome the formidable presumption and public policy concerns against deposing opposing counsel or discovering work product, Defendant seeks to depose Attorney Crump…

      “deposing opposing counsel”?

      O’Mara and West are Defendant’s counsel, and their opponents are the State of Florida.

      Has Crump now been retained by the State of Florida, such that he would have standing as “opposing counsel”? Or have Crump’s clients filed some heretofore unknown suit against Zimmerman, for which Zimmerman has retained O’Mara and West as counsel, that they should oppose Crump?

      • sundance says:

        ***** INSERT BIG FLASHY LIGHT HERE ******

        LOOK AT FOOTNOTE #7 ON PAGE #4 :

        ……”Defendant does not contend in his Motion that there are any material contradictions or inconsistences between Witness 8’s prior March 19, 2012 interview with Attorney Crump and her April 2, 2012 statement to the State.”…..

        Crumps attorney is asserting that West/O’Mara are not challenging material from the recording (ABC) and the April 2nd sworn affidavit to BDLR to show inconsistencies. Disengenuouly ommitting the inconsistencies stem from CRUMP not W8 per se.

        • John Galt says:

          Yeah, that seemed a little weird to me also. First of all, there are indeed material inconsistencies between W8’s statements on Crump’s recordings and those made during the BDLR interview (e.g. “get off, get off”). Second of all, there is no reason for the defense to reference any such inconsistencies in the motion to depose Crump, because they are irrelevant to deciding the motion. The applicable rule merely requires that Crump “may have information relevant to the offense charged.”

          So, to me, it is like if you ask your kid “Why didn’t you cut the grass?” and he responds with “I didn’t steal the cookies.”

      • John Galt says:

        Since when did “without leave of court” require a threshold showing? IMHO, this is really a simple issue which Blackwell attempts to cloud with an enormous smoke screen. As pointed out by West, Crump’s own affidavit shows that he “may have information relevant to the offense charged.”

        3.220(h)(1)(A) in pertinent part:

        After receipt by the defendant of the Discovery Exhibit, the defendant may, without leave of court, take the deposition of any unlisted witness who may have information relevant to the offense charged.

        • John Galt says:

          OK, the guts of Blackwell’s response to West’s motion appears in FN 19 on page 16.

          Basically he wants Nelson to ignore the controlling Florida case law legal authority cited in West’s motion.

          “To the extent the four cases relied upon by Defendant could be construed to suggest otherwise, they are distinguishable, devoid of ratio decidendi or otherwise inapposite in the circumstances of this proceeding.”

          Note that Blackwell fails to explain why they are distinguishable, devoid of reason, or inapposite. Basically Blackwell is saying that controlling Florida case law does not support my position, so I don’t want to talk about that.

          “ratio decidendi” is legal mumbo jumbo which means “reason” or “rationale”.


          • boricuafudd says:

            Reading between the lines, there are issues with DD, which I overlooked in order to get GZ arrested and establish liability, which is why the family hired me for. I [p0 ye1`q

            • recoverydotgod says:

              …and besides that…the parents and certain family members and some media wanted to be at the my interview of the witness .. .which was ok with the witness and her parents

              • Nettles18 says:

                Not only did W8 go from being 16 to 18 from March 19th to April 2nd. She seems to have lost her father by April 2nd.

                • ottawa925 says:

                  hmmmm (re: lost father). Well, I was just over reading at Rumpole site and courtesy of Jordan2222’s timeline over there … my gosh … Tracy has had 4 kids with 4 different women. Yep, he’s big time Father of the Year. He probably gets a new woman (one with a job) to keep up with all the child support payments, otherwise, where is all this money coming from to pay child support. MOM/West need to look into that. If they keep chopping up your paycheck how do you live? He probably was selling drugs and that’s how Trayvon learned … from his Father. Hello !!!!

            • jello333 says:

              ” I [p0 ye1`q ”

              I assume that’s some obscure dialect of Crumpese?

          • doodahdaze says:

            But then again there is still the 6th amendment, and the 14th to deal with. In addition to the two cited 5th DCA cases. And the 5th cases count. In Floriduh. The wrangling is wild. In this case the 5th DCA and FSC are binding. The court is not bound by other districts.

            • MJW says:

              As I mentioned previously, unless there’s a district split, all DCA decisions are binding on all trial courts. DCA’s in Florida are not, in most instances, courts of intermediate appeal. Except in limited circumstances, they are considered courts of final appeal.

              • MJW says:

                Ansin v. Thurston, 101 So. 2d 808 (Fla. 1958):

                It was never intended that the district courts of appeal should be intermediate courts. The revision and modernization of the Florida judicial system at the appellate level was prompted by the great volume of cases reaching the Supreme Court and the consequent delay in the administration of justice. The new article embodies throughout its terms the idea of a Supreme Court which functions as a supervisory body in the judicial system for the State, exercising appellate power in certain specified areas essential to the settlement of issues of public importance and the preservation of uniformity of principle and practice, with review by the district courts in most instances being final and absolute.

          • doodahdaze says:


      • brutalhonesty says:

        they want to have their cake and eat it too. “hes an officer of the court, an atty general, opposing counsel, but he isnt a surrogate of the state and he has nothing to do with this case.”

    • eastern2western says:

      it will take a corrupt judge to not see something wrong with an attorney hiring another attorney just to prevent his deposition. From the previous hearing, Nelson is the corrupt judge. It will be an up hill battle for the defense from this point on. basically, every martin family member will be writing an affidavit just to avoid deposition.

      • brutalhonesty says:

        the benefit of writing an affidavit is the defense has no chance to slip them up to where they say something dumb like “you want that too” or “i feel guilt”…its the best way to make sure they all match…..after all, crump would be the one writing each one of theirs, as their lawyer. this is blatant in your face obstruction of justice flat out.

    • debfrmhell says:

      So if he is claiming some sort of Private Prosecutor role, can MOM demand Discovery from him? Not a legal standing in the world, I would imagine, but I think it would be a kick in the arse to watch.

    • HughStone says:

      Did she change that tweet? I could swear that it said “The motion was legally sound”
      Like she was trying to convince herself.

  29. mung says:

    Trayvonites have a great knack for cherry picking data then spinning it to fit their argument. Until today George’s father was a high powered judge that kept George from getting arrested on several occasions and has used his power to cover up what really happened with Trayvon. Today that has all changed. After the post that Mr. Zimmerman put on this page saying “I have presided over approximately 20,000 probable cause hearings”, the Leatherheads started foaming at the mouth and saying that a magistrate does not have the power to preside over probable cause hearings.

    So which is it? Is he some high powered judge with influence all of the way to the highest levels of government or is he just a glorified desk clerk? Pick a story Trayvonites and stick to it.

    What they fail to comprehend is that every one of their “what if” stories is yet another reasonable doubt in this case.

  30. ottawa925 says:

    ^ LOL … yeah sitting on their fat arses in front of a computer … but yeah … they have his back. I think they want to do him !!!! geesh

    • rumpole2 says:

      Funny you should say “fat arses”… I am beginning to think that my “Daily Daft” for tomorrow has been leaked lol

    • rumpole2 says:

      Must be soooooo reassuring to know that potty-mouthed, hate filled, uninformed, unintelligent, fat old cretins have “got your back” Especially since they post with identities hidden behind aliases that they can, and do, change when things go pear-shaped.

    • jello333 says:

      It’s also hilarious how they all, and this includes NatJack, call him “Attorney Crump”. I’ve found that anyone who feels the need to be addressed in some formal way is WAY lacking in self-confidence as to what that title is intended to convey. Look how we all here refer to MOM and West…. well, yeah, you just saw it. And if not that, it’s O’Mara, or Mark, or Don, or whatever. Have we EVER called either of them “Attorney” O’Mara or “Attorney” West?

  31. JB from SoCal says:

    Dream headlines coming soon to a newspaper near you::



    • doodahdaze says:

      Martin attorney appointed special attorney general by presentdet. Given super powers to over see unfair rules.

    • Nettles18 says:

      This headline is real! Chicago’s top cop thinks Trayvon Martin should have been allowed to beat up George Zimmerman without being stopped! http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/02/18/chicago-top-cop-likens-gun-lobby-influence-to/

      He wouldn’t mind if we had a trial first and presumed George Zimmerman innocent would he? I guess he would.

      • boricuafudd says:

        When your city’s top cop feels it is ok to beat on someone because you believe he is following you, explains a lot about that city’s Crime Problem.

      • diwataman says:

        “If there was a special interest influencing police work, I believe that would be called corruption,” McCarthy said.

        Hmmm, interesting…


      • ottawa925 says:

        Chicago top cop … <<< if that was so pathetic it would be funny. Corrupt police dept. talking about corruption. I guess they would know …huh?

      • diwataman says:

        “… just simply putting guns in people’s hands is going to lead to more tragedy.”

        It sure will so what’s your point? Increasing the speed limit will lead to more tragedy as well, perhaps we ought to reduce all speed limits to 5 mph, oh no, that’s right, how silly of me, we value faster speed limits at the cost of potential tragedy just like we value self defense with the understanding that it also comes at the cost of potential tragedy as well ay? Gee willikers, whowouldathunkit.

      • tara says:

        McCarthy doesn’t have time to research the facts of this case. He’s busy trying to deal with all of the shootings here in Chicago, a few of which have become high profile because of their connections to Obama. All McCarthy knows about Trademark is what he read or heard in the first few weeks when Crump and Julison pumped out their fairytale and the media willingly passed it on to the public without bothering to fact check.

  32. RockyMtnMama says:

    Question for the attorneys: Much of Blackwell’s response seems to rely on the interview with DeeDee being confidential “work product”. How can he claim this, however, when others were present for the interview, Chump has played parts of the interview for the press, and even allowed a member of the press to record it?

    • boricuafudd says:

      IMO, it extends further, he wants to shield any discussions him and the family had with, not just the discovery or interview, but any other aspect that deals with DD. He also may not want to answer questions, does the family agree that the voice screaming is TM?, etc.

    • John Galt says:

      West covered the pertinent law in 4 pages. Blackwell burned 18 pages creating a smoke screen.

      90.507 Waiver of privilege by voluntary disclosure.—A person who has a privilege against the disclosure of a confidential matter or communication waives the privilege if the person, or the person’s predecessor while holder of the privilege, voluntarily discloses or makes the communication when he or she does not have a reasonable expectation of privacy, or consents to disclosure of, any significant part of the matter or communication. This section is not applicable when the disclosure is itself a privileged communication.

      • boricuafudd says:

        Being that some of the communications may have happened in front of a reporter, can the family assert that privilege was not waived, as these communications were between them, their lawyer and the reporter and not to be disclosed without their consent.

        • John Galt says:

          No. The reporter is not lawyer, not client and not a third person within (c):

          90.502 Lawyer-client privilege.—
          (1) For purposes of this section:
          (a) A “lawyer” is a person authorized, or reasonably believed by the client to be authorized, to practice law in any state or nation.
          (b) A “client” is any person, public officer, corporation, association, or other organization or entity, either public or private, who consults a lawyer with the purpose of obtaining legal services or who is rendered legal services by a lawyer.
          (c) A communication between lawyer and client is “confidential” if it is not intended to be disclosed to third persons other than:
          1. Those to whom disclosure is in furtherance of the rendition of legal services to the client.
          2. Those reasonably necessary for the transmission of the communication.

          • boricuafudd says:

            I did not think so, reason I asked is because I was curious is Crump and Family would claim they were confidential informants of Crumps and expected confidentiality in theire communications.

  33. Nettles18 says:

    Trayvon through his parents eyes and a hope to build a prosperous foundation.

    • brutalhonesty says:

      they commented
      EyeUrbanTV 5 days ago
      It has come to our attention that there are individuals or should we say “Trolls” that stalk the internet for stories of Trayvon and mock, deride, and ridicule him and his family anonymously. Out of respect for the family, we kindly ask that you respect the matter at hand and think twice before you post a comment to this Video. We will remove and block any user who refuses to comply with this request. -EYEURBANTV
      Reply ·

      • boricuafudd says:

        I understand that parents have to work, so time is limited but really the only bonding time Sybrina had for TM in during the 10-15 min drive to school, beyond words to describe how pathetic that is.

        On a different note, I wonder how people will react when they found out, their own attorney has admitted to being hired not for any justice as was claimed but to file lawsuits and enrich themselves of their dead son.

    • Nettles18 says:

      This poor kid is destined to have died at 14 years old. They are consistent in not remembering his last 3 years on earth.

      How do you think 17 year old Trayvon would feel about that?

      • jello333 says:

        I think when I first started saying this shortly after I got here, people thought I was a bit goofy. But you’re right… Trayvon would be disgusted by what’s going on, and I have NO doubt he’d have more respect for us here than for his so-called “supporters” out there.

    • diwataman says:

      They’re talking about the 14 year old Trayvon. That Trayvon was long gone by the time he confronted George. And when did Sybrina ever take him to school? When Tracy and Alicia were fighting for the week? Nice to hear they think of their son as the lawnboy and bagboy, did they tip him a nickle?

    • eastern2western says:

      prosperous foundation of doing exactly what? at first they wanted to change all syg laws of 22 states. Is that even part of their goal now?

    • debfrmhell says:

      Serious cropping for that picture. Look at her avie on Twitter. Same picture, Jahvaris is the featured son. In the small avie, TM is barely in the picture.

      • boricuafudd says:

        Shh, you are not supposed to make negative comments about the staged, choreograph, scripted video. There are several times when you can see they had to re-shoot. The cut man did not do a good job.

    • John Galt says:

      cure cancer, paralysis and hunger ? I didn’t know they did that in the aviation field.

      • justfactsplz says:

        Parents of a criminal thug now want to help other children to have a good and Godly life. Pass that trash can of theirs, I need to throw up.

    • libby says:

      These criminally negligent parents forgot a lot of what trayvon needed to be taught (like how to keep your hands to yourself)

    • ejarra says:

      Sad… Just sad…

      That they didn’t know their very angry son. A son they helped mold into the one who received 3 suspensions in a year. A son who was abandoned to watch the son of his father’s mistress while his father partied the weekend. At least Tracy gave him about $100 as a punishment. Sybrina, when she heard the news of her youngest child’s death, did she go immediately to Sanford? Hell NO! She had better things to do. Those parents are the parents that are idolized by the black community.

      They say what their son may have become in some fantasy dream world. They neglected to say what he PROBABLY would have had a better chance of becoming. Like a man, who like his father, would father multiple children with multiple women, and an adulterer, He could have easily grew up to be a thief, a drug addict, a rapist and, like he almost became that night, a murderer.

      And what is sadder… there are people that fall for their crap.

  34. ottawa925 says:

    This reminds me a little of neighbors I use to have that lived behind me. They were a picture perfect family, or so it seemed. House kept immaculate, kids were like 7, 9, 10 when they first moved here. Well, as the years went by, the father and mother divorced. Mother left and the kids stayed with the father in the house behind me. After that … OMG … the kids were wild, no supervision, the father totally neglected his property … just a complete 180. They moved away about 6 years ago and not a moment too soon. I never saw a family disintegrate so quickly as with this family. They were like different people. I guess breakups cause that sometimes.

    Tracy has a track record of being a player. No doubt he was teaching Trayvon the ropes.

    I mean what kind of great father has four kids by four different women? I feel sorry for the current gal he’s gotten pregnant. Now she’ll be tied to him forever. He’ll dump her … that’s his track record. Find her … get her pregnant .. stay with her for awhile … then move on to the next. Poor woman. Don’t women ask questions anymore these days? If I asked and a man told me he already had 4 kids by 4 different women … I WOULDN’T WANT HIM !!!!! What’s wrong with these women? Are they that desperate? I’d rather it be just me and my son then settle for someone who has this kind of past history. Terrible. No self esteem whatsoever. Can’t be !! I would shove my foot up his arse, not make a baby with him. Get the H …. I kick you in yo whittle nuts and then hit you over the head with a fryin pan.

  35. JC says:

    Cell questions
    Has Deedees cellphone been taken by the state and forensically examined? If not why not.

    Are cell phone messages recorded on the phone or at the carrier (“Your mailbox is full”), I think they are recorded at the carrier. Can erased voice & text messages be recovered? I know all kinds of computer stuff can be retrieved.

    Deedee whoever she may be is a mouth breathing dolt and if she truly had anything like those conversations with Tray and his phone suddenly went daid wouldn’t she at least leave a message when she couldn’t reach him. What was the gist of her messages? “Tray, you be OK” or “Tray, you give that cracker a goodbeatin about the haid?”

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