Senator Tom Cotton Discusses Latest on Coronavirus: “Situation is Very Grave”…

Senator Tom Cotton appears on Fox News to discuss the latest on the troubling issues with the Coronavirus.  China has approximately 70 million people in quarantine during their effort to contain the spread of the virus.

Senator Cotton has been a leading voice in the U.S. warning about the potential risks from Coronavirus spread.  Interestingly Mr. Cotton explains the origination of the virus did not come from the food market initially blamed. However there is a level-4 bio-lab within a few miles of the Wuhan market. Occam’s razor? Interesting information.

This entry was posted in Big Government, Big Stupid Government, CDC, China, Hong Kong, Infectious Disease, Japan, media bias, N Korea, propaganda, Uncategorized. Bookmark the permalink.

260 Responses to Senator Tom Cotton Discusses Latest on Coronavirus: “Situation is Very Grave”…

  1. Deplorable_Infidel says:

    “Senator Tom Cotton appears on Fox News to discuss the latest on the troubling issues with the Coronavirus.”

    The only thing that troubles me about this is the title “Senator” before the person’s name.

    ….just because all 100 of them will not let PDJT do recess appointments.

    Trust has to be earned.

    Liked by 18 people

    • babrightlight says:

      Let’s blame Trump for the spread of the virus and send Democratic members of Congress to Wuhan to investigate.

      Liked by 15 people

      • Beau Geste says:

        Your second suggestion of a “factfinding mission” for all of the senatecritters who lie that the Senate is always in session, even when it isn’t, is an excellent idea. They frequently take taxpayer-funded “factfinding missions” to paris, london,italy, greece, lots of places.
        Rather than criticize PDJT, they should all go to wuhan to all get the facts themselves.

        Liked by 10 people

      • dottygal says:

        That’s the best idea I’ve heard all day. I say send some Democratic Congress people too: Nadler, Schiff, Pelosi…

        Liked by 1 person

    • wlbeattie says:

      Don’t start me on that …  

      Liked by 9 people

    • sysconfig says:

      Tomm looking for a scapegoat to ride on Trumps coat tail. WH knows..At this point it’s irrelevant whether virus is lab created or not..because everyone of the super powers has them, and it could happen to us. What he should be worried about can this thing mutate in the next few months. I read a research gate paper where analysis said yes and its worse than Sars. If Sars epidemic hit everyone, particularly China bad, this is the badboy of corona viruses now just because of one enzyme.
      The present study for the first time reported a very important mutation in the Spike (S) proteins of BB coronavirus. By this mutation, 2019-nCoV acquired a cleavage site for furin enzyme, which is not present in the S proteins of all other BB coronavirus (e.g. SARS coronavirus) except the Mouse Hepatitis coronavirus (MHV). This mutation may increase the efficiency of virus infection into cells, making 2019-nCoV has significantly stronger transmissibility than SARS coronavirus. Because of this mutation, the packing mechanism of the 2019-nCoV may be changed to being more similar to those of MHV, HIV, Ebola virus (EBoV) and some avian influenza viruses, other than those of all other BB coronavirus (e.g. SARS coronavirus) except the Mouse Hepatitis coronavirus (MHV). In addition, we unexpectedly found that some avian influenza viruses acquired a cleavage site for furin enzyme by mutation as 2019-nCoV. Further studies of this mutation will help to reveal the stronger transmissibility of 2019-nCoV and lay foundations for vaccine development and drug design of, but not limited to 2019-nCoV.
      So Tom, keep your arse home for everyones good

      Liked by 4 people

      • Doc Joe says:

        It DOES matter if it is lab created or not. You stand corrected. Not irrelevant. No description of the virus below can undo this statement.

        Liked by 3 people

      • zekness says:

        the likelihood if that morph is JUST AS LIKELY as the virus will morph to several different strains that are far less contagious than the existing outbreak…meaning virus mutation can and often does mutate toward features that do not climb some magical ladder of upward and increasing danger. It just does NOT work like that.

        It is just as often that these viruses (any really) have a completely unknown direction in which they will mutate. This is counter-intuitive in scientific observation to evolutionary “fitness” …academically, this is a pretty good way to get it completely wrong because observation topples that apple cart…routinely.

        . As we see in nature, there are some pretty nonsensical impractical features located in ALL of life that warrants a pretty good inspection on the notion that some “fitness” path is the only means by which critters on planet earth evolve. It seems to be rather random, in the sense that we just don’t know what pressures (or lack if them) that cause these unexplained changes fully. with virus, we can observe it on time scales that allow this to be witnessed rapidly. IF you examine several other C-virus (common flu for instance), the reasons for the different vaccination requirement is due to a mutation that takes place….just a slight change in character. But we also know there are HOT seasons and those that are very minor…with seemingly no extraordinary changes in the main sequence. so there is some else we just don’t know…or we getting “amplification and feedback” errors in the research.

        anyway….there is not going to be a vaccine for this c-virus, for exactly the same reasons there could not be one made for SARS or MERS. (this is not to fearmonger, but to illustrate the larger problem dealing with this family of virus and the changes that take place over time…._)

        I would hope that everyone here is aware that the reason why SARS and MERS were not eliminated by vaccine? It mutated into an entirely different class of c-virus rather rapidly…and it’s contagious features, mortality rates, r-naught, became comparable to the standard seasonal virus flu…THAT is the reason you don’t hear of anyone getting hurt by SARS and MERS…it just went nothing burger “naturally”….there every reason to believe the same thing will occur with COVID-19….it is nearly identical in sequence as both…

        it may take some time….but your first clue will be a higher survivability…followed by a lower contagious factor. (the virus loses its main feature)

        this same covid-19 will likely perform the same path….like so many (but certainly not all) of do!

        Liked by 3 people

      • Pale rider says:

        We are talking about a communist nation and killing off part of the population would not be out of the question. If too many mouths need to be fed I would not be surprised if viruses are made for this specific reason. Just saying.
        Mark Stein was commenting that there are satellite detections of burning bodies in China to a large enough degree it is detected from space.
        We all fantasize about ‘what if’ communism comes here and how people would be killed who are dissidents. It’s what they do to control populations. Either for the economy or rebel uprising.
        It’s just my opinion but the factors are numerous to the regimes benefit. They also may consider this in negotiations with the United States as leverage. A way to hold it’s own people hostage for relief from sanctions. We saw some of that with Obama the POS who was crowned twice as an illegitimate puppet.

        Like

    • vikingmom says:

      Still not sure why Rand Paul hasn’t put a stop to this!! It would only take ONE Senator and he has been the President’s best defender from what I have seen…

      Liked by 3 people

      • powderdayrules says:

        I agree vikingmom, this is the question on everyone’s minds. What is the threat that holds all the repubs in line? I would think this would be easy for a retiring senator to do. Maybe Sundance you could elucidate us on this.

        Liked by 2 people

        • abdiesus says:

          The RNC doesn’t allow anyone to run for office unless they know that person is already compromised, or at least compromisable – preferably the former. We may not know what form that compromise has taken in each and every case, but rest assured, it is there. Money is the simplest form of compromise, as no one (except Trump) totally funds their own campaign, and no one (except Trump) gets into politics unless they want to make money. Sometimes the leverage could be concerning loved ones. Sometimes it could be a combination of factors – the cartels have a saying “either the silver or the lead – if you cooperate you get the silver, if you don’t you get the lead”.

          Once each candidate has been compromised in some way, they are “safe” because they will never step out of line for fear of scandal and the loss of $ which that would represent, or, depending upon the moral framework of those holding the leverage, perhaps personal harm or harm to loved ones. But rest assured, the Club vets it’s candidates carefully, just as the Senate vets Trump’s appointments, and in both cases, they only allow a candidate/appointment to go forward if they are overwhelmingly satisfied that there is no risk to the Club in doing so.

          As Sundance so often says, there are trillions of potential American tax $ that hang in the balance, and they can’t afford to allow anyone to unnecessarily interrupt, damage, limit or uncover that corrupt income-stream potential.

          Like

  2. Roni says:

    With the exceptions of CTH, WarRoom, very limited coverage of how the coronavirus could affect the supply chain for pharma med supplies, including drugs, vaccines. Wilbur Mills is sounding the alarm about relying on one source for critical needs.

    Liked by 18 people

  3. James Carpenter says:

    _IF_ the current spread in China (complete with false reporting) and the spotty but multinational infection reports are any indication, Americans will be sharing this before long. We might dodge the bullet but…
    Epidemiologists are busy modeling both morbidity and mortality, trying to inform and prepare responders. And those models will become increasingly predictive as more data is gathered.
    Typically, a virus is either very contagious or very dangerous (a killer). But not both at the same time. Bioweapons research notwithstanding.
    It is not too early to think about personal health, working on boosting immune systems, filling prescriptions, keeping stocks of helpful OTC medicines. Like with any natural disaster that Americans weather every year, those who prepare for eventualities are in better shape than those who don’t.

    Liked by 14 people

    • Rachelle says:

      “James Carpenter said: A virus is either very contagious or very dangerous. But not both at the same time.”

      Spanish Flu — contagious and a killer

      Smallpox– contagious and a killer.

      Liked by 3 people

    • AvengerDave says:

      Please remember, stockpiling anti-bacterial “everything” will not protect against a virus. However, having regular stocks of these items could prevent spread of more routine illnesses that might normally send people for urgent or emergency care. This care may become a risk for further communication if care is available at all.

      Liked by 1 person

      • A2 says:

        Bleach and medical alcohol will only kill the virus. Anti-bacterials as I said before, like dettol etc. does not eliminate them.

        Fomites as I discussed last week is a case in point. now PRC is sanitising banknotes.

        This has been known since the 19th century.

        Ugh.

        Like

    • wlbeattie says:

      Common sense always finds a ready audience!
      Thank you!

      Liked by 1 person

    • zekness says:

      there was nothing ordinary about SARS or MERS….r naught was as high as 8 for both and averaged to about 1.7-2.2

      COVID-19 has striking similarities to both, in the sequence and the spread and killing departments.

      it’s also worth pointing out, we don’t have a complete data set from China (color me surprised….they have a serious financial interest to protect so there is a serious level of narration going on about it….the first clue was disinviting CDC early in January to help out….and a embargo on releasing raw data to anyone including WHO)…so we really have no idea what r naught and the spreading and killing values are..the general rule of thumb is that for every confirmed set on these kinds of outbreaks, one can assume to at least double that…across the board. There is every reason to believe this disease made the transition from animal to human somewhere in the Oct-Nov timeline…maybe earlier. There are quite a few animals that eat and forage in the same spaces as bats. Which is likely the animal host. In eastern china/mongolia these same animals are eaten routinely by the indigenous people…and not often cooked well or handled carefully at all. It would be interesting to see someone do a little nucleic testing of the baseline in wuhon and a sample of blood from some mongolian tribal centers. I have this intuition this is where we should be looking…the longer incubation period suggests this virus managed a survival feature (as virus often perform) to adapt to a larger host population…mongol tribes are sparce, remote, and have the immune system anyone would envy..the “perfect” environmental conditions that would achieve a really serious bug over time. I’m willing to bet, should that research complete, we will find very remote areas where this bug is common and yet does not have the dangerous symptomatic features…due only for the high resistance to disease these people likely have. No make that virus transit to societies that have lessor defenses….bang! and chaos ensues.

      the open market places were unlikely to be the actual source, but more of less an highly trafficked area of human beings ….like train stations…aircraft…cruise ships…concerts…casino…shopping malls…it’s all about the number of people in close proximity over a durable period of repeated contact…

      it also didn’t hurt that china was observing one of the highest travel seasons, honoring some moon event….so you have a local outbreak in a highly populated area, and at the same time, a massive traffic of tourists and travelers criss crossing every single congested avenue for this virus to transmit.

      isolation is the key here. We can’t put the cat back in the bag..but we can keep the cat contained from off the leach…

      24 days should be the standard now…not 14….there is enough evidence 14 is not adequate.

      Like

  4. mac says:

    Can anyone explain why the Senate won’t allow Trump recess appointments? They seem to cooperate with him on other things.

    Liked by 1 person

    • bullnuke says:

      The turtle has complete control.

      Liked by 3 people

      • Jus wundrin says:

        Who pulls his strings?

        Like

        • CountryDoc says:

          His wife? China? US Chamber of Commerce. Globalists? GOPe? the Fed? Blackmailers? It shouldn’t be hard to figure out, and most likely is already known.

          Liked by 6 people

          • A2 says:

            Sorry I disagree with the attack on Secretary Chao. A cheap shot and unwarranted

            Like

            • GB Bari says:

              A2, why do you charge that any suspicion that McConnell’s in-laws’ significant shipping business between China and the U.S. has been influencing McConnell’s obstruction of the President on most MAGA policies (especially illegal immigration and tariffs) other than judicial appointments is a “cheap shot”?

              IMHO it is a perfectly valid concern, as are all of the other incestuous connections between PDJT’s congressional obstructors and so many businesses (via lobbyists) that are dependent upon the Globalist models that have been destroying America’s middle and blue collar class economy since the 1990’s.

              Liked by 1 person

            • alonzo1956 says:

              A2
              Chow’s family has gotten rich from involvement with the Chinese. I view it as a problem and so do many others. Secret Empres by Schweitzer has more information on the subject.

              Liked by 1 person

            • abdiesus says:

              Sorry I disagree with your defense of Chao. see my comment below – Chao got where she got because of serving under Bush – the globalist par excellance. Her background and connection to China is well known and not disputed. There’s a strategic element in McConnell being Senate Majority leader and married to Chinese wealth and influence, whose business is over 70% shipping Chinese goods. To put it bluntly, China owns most of our congress, either directly or indirectly, and McConnell is case in point numero uno.

              Like

            • CountryDoc says:

              A2, I grant you, it was a knee jerk, cheap shot (relative to my usual comments), but not totally without merit, as evidenced by others who have so kindly supported my general suspicions, which are based on the inaction in areas that SHOULD have resulted in strong reaction from McConnell. He has been suspiciously silent and useless while Yuge principles of our constittutional republic are violated.

              There have been many articles here about the GOPe, Republicons, and conflicts of interest.

              That said, please list your list of actions by Secretary Chao that indicate she is a patriot, a defender of the life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness of U.S. citizens. Show me evidence of her support of MAGA policies. Show me evidence of her support to return manufacturing back to the U.S. so that the middle class, rather than globalists, may prosper.

              Show me a list of her effective representation of the average U.S. citizen, and I’ll overlook the blatant conflict of interest, blatant lack of inactivity (that framed the question I responded to).

              Like

        • Snellvillebob says:

          The people who give him the most money of course. He then uses most of that to distribute for re-election campaigns. In return, the GOP Senators pledge to represent McConnell rather than their voters. I don’t think Romeny will get much his next election.

          Like

        • abdiesus says:

          McConnell is *literally* married to China. What westerners don’t take into consideration is that in Communist China, NO ONE gets rich without the Communist Party. Or to put it more correctly, EVERY business is State controlled. So for McConnell to be married to an heiress to a shipping company The Foremost Group, which, according to wikipedia “has extensive ties to the Chinese state and Chinese elites….[and] has obtained hundreds of millions of dollars worth of loans from a bank owned by the Chinese state, has substantial interests tied to a major Chinese shipyard funded by the Chinese state, and long-term contracts with a Chinese state-owned steel producer….[and] In what The New York Times described as “a rarity for foreigners”, Angela and James Chao have served on the boards of a Chinese state-owned shipbuilder, and Angela has been on the board of the Bank of China, as well as the China Council for the Promotion of International Trade (which was created by the government of China). From January 2018 to April 2019, 72% of the total tonnage shipped by Foremost was shipped to and from China.”
          So lets just say that McConnell is on the opposite side of the China issue from Trump. Interesting that Trump would make Elaine Chao a member of his cabinet – most likely a strategic move – keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

          Like

    • Beau Geste says:

      I’ll try an answer:
      Because they are evil, corrupt, power-hungry criminals who do not want honest investigators appointed who will look into their kickbacks from foreign aid or other appropriations they vote for, or their lobbyist bribes-for-votes, and they do not want PDJT to be successful so another crony-club president can be elected?

      Liked by 7 people

      • GB Bari says:

        Sundance has repeated this “warning” in many of his articles that address the Globalists’ lining up with the Deep State to undermine the President since before he was elected.

        “There are trillions at stake.”

        To that, I will add the old rule (about explaining corruption in government) that was established many decades ago “Follow the money.”

        Liked by 1 person

    • wlbeattie says:

      If someone has a sensible answer, please let me know on twitter @wlbeattie

      Like

    • Dutchman says:

      mac,
      Sorry, your post seems,…naive, IMHO.
      Actually, you have it EXACTLY right;
      “They SEEM to to cooperate with him on other things.”
      They focus on appearance, form ovrr substance.

      They are swamp, led by McConnell, who rules with an iron fist.
      They fight him every step of the way, but largely thru INaction. And you can’t believe a word they say.

      PDJT is an INTRINSIC and EXISTENTIAL threat to ALL of them, most definetly including Republican leadership in the,Senate.

      Go back and listen to his Oct (I THINK 16th?) Speech, and then his,Inaugerual speech.

      He is not JUST aiming his comments,at Democrats, he is aiming it at the power elites in DC, and that means,Republican leadership, as well.

      He is saying he is going tovreturn that power to the people; you think lidsey graham or McConnell like the idea of THAT?

      Republican leadership in Congress are just as bad as Democrats, worse because at least Democrats are honest.

      Republicons, despite what they say are for national health care, abortion on demand, open borders and ultimate a globalist agenda, just like the Dems.

      They are simply playing a role, like Dem party did for years, until finally coming out of the closet.

      Liked by 16 people

      • meow4me2 says:

        In general agree, but disagree that Democrats are “honest”. They are nowhere near honest and lie without remorse to achieve their objectives.

        Liked by 3 people

        • Dutchman says:

          For a given value of ‘honest’; for years, they were in stealth mode,,posing as the ‘loyal opposition, sincerely interested in the best interests of the country, patriotic and God fearing, just disagreeing on policy.
          It was a,POSE, but millions,were fooled by it.

          Now, they are,’out of the closet, and all their candidates, are openly advocating conmunism.
          The only ‘moderate democrats’ are,Republicons, cause they are still in the closet, pretending to support the Constitution, 2A, anti-abortion, etc. but lieing.

          They actually want the same globalist government as the,Dems, they just lie about it.

          Liked by 6 people

          • Judith says:

            Yep. The best answer is to primary all the republiCONS and get em out. Unless we want to go the full-blown Revolution route.

            And wouldn’t Globalists just love that- giving them the chance to fuel anarchy and declare martial law. #UNiparty #New/One World Order.

            Like

            • Dutchman says:

              Yes, but we mustn’t keep doing the same thing, over and over, and expect different results.
              Instead, learn from what WORKS.

              Organise quietly, online. Announce, or file papers at last possible minute, so as to give them as little time as possible to set up their smear campaign “op-research” b.s.

              Do not attempt a big, National campaign, like Tea party and Bannon did. GRASS roots organising.
              Money isn’t the answer, and trying to compete on that basis,,is like taking on the redcoats, by marching out in formation onto the field; you get slaughtered, every time.

              Authentic candidates, populist nationalist policies, grass roots organising CAN beat inauthentic party hacks with massive funding.

              Like

              • zekness says:

                if we’ve learned anything from history and from the rise of trump’s real power..

                being noisy, very loud and directly attacking corruption is the most effective means for any meaningful impact.

                I understand your comments….I agree with all of them they can all be accomplished (if we all have the will to defend our nation from these corruptors)….but we have to make the biggest recorded noise in the history of mankind…the stakes demand it.

                when you make noise the media is forced to respond..this is how you leverage the weakness of your enemies….it’s essential to not just being heard, but of being recognized as a serious threat.

                our threat is real…our demands must be met or there will be consequences …

                doing any of that silently or quietly indirectly enables the corruptors because they never respond to the tree that falls in the forest …they respond when there is a raging fire that is climbing up the back porch.

                Like

                • Dutchman says:

                  Making noise is fine, got no problem with that.
                  I was only talking about tactics and strategy of PRIMARYING Rinos in Congress.
                  There reaction to any attempt to primary them, shows the recognise its a vulnerability.

                  We just have to figure out how to do it, EFFECTIVELY, and doing it the way we have tried in the past, hasn’t worked.

                  Like

              • CountryDoc says:

                Dutch, how do I find these groups locally? I’m in a conservative area, and I have a hard time telling friend from foe, even among repubs. How do I direct my friends and relatives to find the true patriots locally to organize and ensure that we get republican candidates that are truly conservative.

                Like

                • Dutchman says:

                  I suggest contact the Trump campaign, and ask. They have Women, Hispanics, Blacks, etc. For Trump groups. Probably a group for everyone.

                  These groups are, I suspect doing “grass roots organising”, and would be a good first place to look.

                  Then you can consider contacting the local GOP, and going to monthly meetings, to check out the ‘lay of the land’, but keep your cards ‘close to the vest’, see where things lay.

                  Hope this helps, and there is always the option of starting a group.

                  Like

      • tacocat43 says:

        Swamp creatures are like weeds- you can eliminate them but if there is a space, it will be filled. Gonna take 30 years to clean the Swamp.

        Like

        • Dutchman says:

          Given that modern progressivism/conmunism started infusing our givernment and society around 1915, I’d say your being optimistic.
          But, where are we going to be if we DON’T spend the next 30 years, expunging it?

          Liked by 1 person

  5. Mike Lee DelMarcelle says:

    These Chinese food markets i’m sure all over the place in China with similar things in other counties. Why did this virus just happen now and what are the odds it would originate in a market near the only level 4 bio-lab in the country? Sounds like the video game resident evil.

    Liked by 2 people

    • bullnuke says:

      Wuhan is Chinese for Raccoon City.

      Liked by 1 person

      • TreeClimber says:

        The T-virus was manufactured to kill off most the world’s population…

        Liked by 1 person

        • wlbeattie says:

          @ TreeClimber <= If true then
          IMHO I'll thank God that #Trump is POTUS.

          Liked by 2 people

        • GB Bari says:

          Please cite your source for that declarative statement.

          Like

          • TreeClimber says:

            The last Resident Evil movie. I wasn’t making anything more than an allusion in regards to the Coronavirus, I was speaking of the fictional T-virus.

            I do ascribe to the theory that the Coronavirus was a bioweapon but I certainly don’t pretend to know whether it was released intentionally or what it was intended for.

            Liked by 1 person

      • A2 says:

        You know better than that. Poor joke. Wuhan is a central city in China along with its sister cities, Hanyang, Hankou and wuchang, on the Han river. Been trading ports for at least a few thousand years. The three cities were central to defending the capital, and facilitating inter Asian trade and consolidated as one city in 1926 under the Guomindang, not the communists.

        What is happening is a travesty. The focus should be on what the PRC does, as to covering up, what they will do now, and screw the propaganda. We need facts, not cheap shots

        Senator Cotten gave a clear assessment, yet I see posters here belittling him directly, or indirectly. The US is not naive as to the challenges. is taking measured steps, evacuating US persons caught in the epidemic, the medical care in the US will be far superior to what the beleaguered PRC can do.

        Liked by 4 people

    • A2 says:

      Answer me this. The wild food markets are very big in other parts of China, like Guilin, Yunnan and so on. I’ve been there , seen it. Why are they not an epicentre.

      The PLA level four lab might not be the source but the South China University of Technology lab where a report on this has been published. cYA, deflection, who knows at this point.

      The PRC propaganda machine is in full alert. Xi-nobyl is a hero, has taken control and Bob’s your uncle.

      Liked by 2 people

      • Linda says:

        I don’t trust any of this. The people in Wuhan had been protesting the toxic air over the city. Here comes the virus no more protests. I have read that pneumonia has been very high in Wuhan, and now chest ex rays show an infection, bang! you have the coronavirus. Just having normal flu can now be called corona! And just like that big pharma has unlimited test subjects. If you die they just say it was the corona virus not the test drugs. How many times have they told us this in the past??? CDC, WHO the last ones I would ever trust.

        Liked by 3 people

      • GB Bari says:

        A2 the timing of this virus suddenly appearing into the mainstream of China is just too coincidental with the rapid deterioration of the Chinese economy, if I am correctly remembering your reports from late last year.

        I would not put it past the CCP to release this deadly pathogen into the populace to draw attention away from the economic troubles and instead be able to blame their sinking economy on the virus. Given their brutal history, the CCP could be expected to look upon a few hundred thousand or million deaths as collateral damage.

        Like

  6. Jus wundrin says:

    Inovio pharmaceuticals have stated they have designed a vaccine. Tests coming early summer. It took them just 3 hours to find the sequence. American ingenuity.

    Liked by 1 person

    • zekness says:

      I’m very skeptical.

      This sample virus they collected may be quite significantly different than the virus actually becomes by the time they go to production and the first vaccinations takes place.

      The cruel joke with SARS and MERS class c-virus is that it rapidly modified. This was observed in SARS and then in MERS. This is the reason no effective vaccine was EVER developed for those two. Covid-19 is nearly identical to both. The probability a vaccine will be effective is truly a timing issue. And that train has left the station. It would be expected by now that there are likely as many as one dozen variants of covid-19 in the wild.

      With any luck the main sequence characteristics of covid-19 follows the trajectory of SARS and MERS…we will know in another month or two. If the incubation period is 14-24 days or asymptomatic hosts can be be contagious… we’ll likely have a serious pandemic..

      But like impactors from space and lightning strikes and winning lottery tickets…we have the benefit of probabilities this will end as SARS and MERS… sputter out in about a year or less.

      Not saying research for a vaccine isn’t worthwhile, it could certainly lead to sone6 breakthroughs. I’m all for that. I am rather skeptical though.

      We are dealing with a zoonological disease that is highly contagious and presents like two known c-virus befoe..determining sequence isn’t especially difficult … the real magic is figuring out how to make proteins fold in a very specific way and to know which if these proteins are the Achilles heel. We are smart but this is life we are attacking. It has the ultimate mission to survive. We aren’t gods even if we pretend some times.

      I remain skeptical.

      Like

  7. AnotherView says:

    Of course China has been lying about the timeline, the number of deaths, and where it all originated. All signs point to a lab manufactured virus. How can fish have a virus with genomes that suggest HIV insertions! I think the slow incubation period, the ease of transmission combined with presentation of ordinary flu symptoms mast the true long-term deadliness of this virus. We also have no idea how the virus effects ages & races since no stats have been released. It’s going to be far worse than the flu that killed so many 1917-18. And I have no faith whatsoever in our government being honest with us about it since they lie so much about everything else. Major cities are still sending the CDC samples from patients to get virus confirmation, then waiting nearly 48 hours for the result. Why don’t they have test kits in every hospital??? WHO & Google have been suppressing information about the virus on the net. Bottom line: It’s a bioweapon. Anyway, that’s my take.
    .

    Liked by 2 people

    • keeler says:

      It’s not fish, it’s mainly a bat genome.

      I’ve seen the reports about HIV type sequencing and successful treatment with HIV medication. The problem with jumping to the conclusion that HIV-type sequences are proof of engineering is that these sequences can occur in other viruses. For example, the Bubonic Plague and HIV share identical white blood cell suppression traits, and there are a few people who are actually immune to HIV today because they inherited a genetic mutation of people who were immune to the Plague 700 years ago.

      That doesn’t mean it’s not a bio-weapon, or a cross between an escaped bio-weapon sample and a natural reservoir (ie. a bat colony). It could very well be this is a bio-weapon with HIV insertions, but there is insufficient evidence at this point to know.

      Liked by 5 people

      • AnotherView says:

        You’re obviously more versed in biology–my weakest subject! However, I do appreciate the information you shared–I find it keenly interesting. I did read several initial reports on the virus breakdown before veering off to focus on symptoms and where the latest outbreaks are occurring. I’ve been doing genealogy for years so naturally I read hundreds and hundreds of deaths certificates looking for patterns. In any case, I do seem remember there was talk of bat guano being connected to Ebola but I haven’t followed up it since I read the Hot Zone. The 80s will always stick in my mind as the decade of HIV/AIDs and the near-disaster of America with the Reston monkey house–both of which the government failed us on. I will say the Chinese are known for ingesting anything that walks, crawls,slithers, or flies. Therefore, it’s quite hard to believe that suddenly they’re dropping on the streets and bats are blamed as the culprits. Especially when a Level 4 lab is in the vicinity.

        Liked by 1 person

        • keeler says:

          New viruses can emerge quite suddenly. All it takes is a mutation, something viruses are very good at, for a perfectly harmless bat, bird, or camel virus (as is the case with MERS) to become deadly to humans and then jump to a human population. Closer and more frequent contact between animals and people increase these risks. Therefore, this scenario might be more believable than it first appears.

          It is important though to note that there is some reporting which claims there were not, and there have never been, bats at the Wuhan market, but there were one if not multiple research labs within 10 miles of the market… and that a Chinese citizen was busted for smuggling a corona virus out of Canada last year…. but all these points would only be possibly relevant if the market was the point of origin.

          Liked by 2 people

          • David A says:

            Keeler says, The problem with jumping to the conclusion that HIV-type sequences are proof of engineering is that these sequences can occur in other viruses. ”

            That us only part of the evidence that China was working on a virus very similar to the new COV virus.

            Besides the four suspicious short sequences, one of which was a specific sequence found in bats from that area, there was found to be a short insertion sequence, used for RNA splicing. ( Not from nature)

            Additionally the Wuhan lab learned specifically ( ten years ago) that such a virus as this could develope in nature and likely would happen in China.

            So they, to the concern of the international community, began to develope their fear, in the hope of also developing a vaccine, working on the transmission to human capability, which they ” demonstrated” ( including the infection means of attaching to ACE2 proteins.

            Now we know that the bat sequence in question which also I’d a close match to a HIV sequence was not being sold in the Seafood market and that bat is in fact in hibernation at this time of year. ( Indeed no bats were being sold in the Seamarket at this time) Either in hibernation or migrated 600 miles away. However we know the Wuhan lab had that specific bat virus in the lab and they were working with it for years.

            We know the Wuton lab, 8.5 miles, not 20 miles from the sea food market, was working on just such a virus for defensive purposes.
            We know the new COV virus contains a well known short splicing tool sequence. We know there is another lab, about 300 meters from the market, that may have been working with the Class 4 lab 8.5 miles away.

            IMV, this was an accidental release from one of the two labs of a developed virus that was developed
            for defensive reasons. ( Hubris is a human condition) China has a history of at least four previous accidental releases, and their industrial accident rate is about 100 percent greater then the US rate.

            Wuhan, a city of 11 million plus, a central travel hub for all of China, much like Chicago for the US, is really a crazy place to locate a class 4 lab.

            Links. https://chiefio.wordpress.com/2020/02/16/16-feb-2019-ncov-sars-cov-2-covid-19-corona-virus-outbreak/

            https://harvardtothebighouse.com/2020/01/31/logistical-and-technical-analysis-of-the-origins-of-the-wuhan-coronavirus-2019-ncov/

            Had to go to the way back machine for this one, photos in article not carried through

            https://web.archive.org/web/20200203110836/https://medium.com/@realAdrianBond/coronavirus-exposed-part-1-communist-coverup-or-pandemic-bioweapon-of-mass-destruction-229ad482c0d3

            Liked by 3 people

          • botchedcasuality says:

            That Chinese citizen was a high level research immunologist pathologist and she made I believe nine trips to the Wuhan lab the first year it opened. I read this several weeks ago when the virus was just hitting the news, I bookmarked the link but nothing there today and I can’t post a link to the articles. Zero hedge published something very similar and got quarantined. Turns the light bulbs on, we’ve been softened up to accept social media quarantine for any wrong think-speak-read.
            John Rappaport was permanently thrown off word press after fifteen years for no stated reason.
            So now the information channels are very narrow and can be flipped off in a Nano second.

            Like

            • jmilamdeal says:

              Social media has been censoring any information that does not conform to regular medical information being peddled, like things being wrong with vaccines, for some time now. I have been following natural health information for years and do not trust the pharmaceutical companies any farther than I could throw them, they are akin to rascal Democrats, wanting only money and power! As a matter of fact, when you do the research you find that big pharma supports the medical schools, as long as their teaching supports giving the drugs they recommend! After studying the subject, I no longer trust most doctors other than for maybe an emergency, just as I do not trust many of the vaccines and drugs being pushed on people these days. If I am not mistaken, Rockefeller started supporting medical schools shortly after 1900, and wanted them to prescribe drugs instead of anything natural, like the herbs that had been used for hundreds of years. The newly formed medical establishment began to poo poo anything natural like chiropractic, homeopathy, and anything that did not involve drugs. That is when the pharmaceutical companies began to blossom and herbal remedies began to disappear. Did you know that you cannot sue a drug company for a death or big health problem caused by a drug? Our government has paid billions to people harmed by drugs and our FDA and government officials are a big problem because they are paid to support drugs and big pharma. Chemo for cancer is a big money maker for drug companies and doctors, but did you know that an oil made from marijuana can cure cancer and many other health issues? That is one of the main reasons it was outlawed and taken out of use, it could not be patented by drug companies!

              Like

      • glissmeister says:

        Virus physiology doesn’t require human tampering to develop the traits being demonstrated by this strain of corona virus. The phenomenon of recombination is ever churning and continuously influencing what the next emerging viral threat will be.

        Liked by 1 person

    • jeans2nd says:

      Why no test kits in every hospital?

      Could the answer be that we’ve few test kits available, due to the fact that the bio-chemicals needed for test kits have been off-shored to China ?

      Not to mention the bio-chemicals needed to manufacture nearly all our pharmaceuticals have been off-shored to China.
      Scary, is it not?

      Liked by 8 people

      • Beau Geste says:

        Even more so, because the chinese could suddenly put whatever the want in meds.

        Liked by 3 people

      • AnotherView says:

        That’s what caught my attention during a presser last week about a virus case in TX. They said they sent the patient sample to the CDC and had to wait for confirmation. Scary, isn’t it? Why isn’t the CDC sending hospitals test kits, or letting them do their own testing?

        Liked by 1 person

      • meow4me2 says:

        The test kits have several components. There is huge pressure to produce more of those components so more kits will be available. Undoubtedly, some of those components will be sourced from China. If the manufacturer is shut down due to the virus, then an alternate sourced must be found.

        Simply put, there’s a lot of scrambling around now in supply chains. I’m dealing with a number of suppliers with significant delays because of the virus. Our receipts from suppliers are 20% of the norm, which says to me even our vendors in Europe and elsewhere are likely sourcing through China.

        Like

      • zekness says:

        The nucleic test kits (field method) are notoriously inaccurate for c-virus.

        For example:. SARS and MERS will give be a false positive on these covid-19 specific tests. These class c-virus are so closely matched even in pristine lab environments false positives will happen quite often. Nucleic tests are not designed to be a “perfect” test. Some even argue, nucleic tests for c-virus in this class are probably more risky to depend on at all. This is what the CDC was basically announcing last week when they advised kits are not a reliable screening method.

        To compound the issue is that the c-virus class will change sequence is ways that the nucleic screening methods do not, can not detect at all.

        Now you begin to understand the complexity and Dynamics involved in attempting to create an effective vaccine. This reality highlights why.we cannot use the same seasonal flu vaccines year over year.

        Things change. The game is about playing catch-up where time is the enemy. Sometimes the virus remains stable within be a narrow range. Some times it does not.

        I think this bug will follow the track if SARS and MERS. About a year now or less the virus adapts to the natural pressures of change. Losing its “power” so to speak. But that is just me making a wild guess with the understanding nobody knows what will happen … could go very badly.. that’s a possibility. Doe5 now, isolation remains the best way to keep in the bug away from a much larger sample size to continue the trial and error path finding. We can’t control time. But we can do mitigate against risks by removing as much as possible the hosts it can populate. We shall see

        Like

    • CountryDoc says:

      What are the motives of WHO and Google to supress information on the virus. Who’s money is being protected, or who’s agenda in WHO, Google, and CDC is being protected or furthered?

      Like

  8. keeler says:

    It’s going to take a long time to sort this out, if it’s ever possible.

    The PRC government is clearly not being straightforward with anything around covid-19, including their daily reporting numbers. Its behavior is certainly not matching with its official statements.

    Now there are rumors that the Wuhan Univeristy of Naval Engineering, one of the Chinese military’s major educational centers, went into lock down on January 2nd, 2020- nearly three weeks before Wuhan went into general lock down. (This is separate from the reports that Chinese officials arrested doctors for spreading “rumors” about a new infectious disease in early December.) Recent images on social media show PRC officials wearing special face masks with a much higher level of protection than the front-line medical staff during visits. The impression is left that the Chinese government seems very, very scared of this virus, regardless of its origins, and has been protecting party members at a high level for some time.

    It’s hard to tell right now where the truth lies between the disinformation coming from Beijing, the emerging (but early) data coming out of non-Chinese studies of the disease, and the compelling but fragmented stories leaking out on social media. But whatever the truth is, the outlook does not look good.

    My sense is that health officials are preparing for a global pandemic, and their efforts are directed at stalling spread long enough to develop effective treatment, and to develop necessary medical planning and infrastructure if it does explode in other countries.

    I strongly encourage those who haven’t been giving this much attention to start researching. Media is under reporting on this, and that alone raises questions….

    From what I have read, key indicator nations are Singapore, which heavily redeveloped its health care system as a result of the SARs virus, and Japan. Based on current modeling, impact on the US should be clearer by mid-March/early April.

    Liked by 5 people

    • All Too Much says:

      The declared incubation period of fourteen days does not hold up against some reports.
      Longer periods have been reported.
      Something just ain’t right.

      Liked by 1 person

      • keeler says:

        I’ve seen reports of around as long as 20 days.

        I’ve seen reports of r-values from 2 to 6.

        I’ve seen reports of secondary infections and heart attacks.

        I’ve seen reports of male infertility.

        From an reporting standpoint, it’s impossible to know what is accurate right now. Anything from China itself is essentially useless. The WHO is compromised by China. It’s unclear where the emerging studies have pulled their data from, who has performed the studies, and most importantly whether the media organizations reporting on them are doing so with the technical knowledge necessary to present the information in an accurate and contextualized manner.

        Something is definitively not right, but between Chinese propaganda, the telephone effect, and the low quality of journalism it is extremely hard to know both the quality and quantity of what “not right” is.

        Liked by 2 people

        • glissmeister says:

          Some will develop no symptoms but still spread infection. This outbreak will do what it will do, and frankly, what will ultimately happen is already established by the dynamics of the initial outbreak. It will rampage until it plateaus and begins to fizzle out and become just another damn virus. But the threat remains great, for this and other reasons.

          The greatest public health threat of all: government behaving stupidly. Stress will profoundly suppress individual immune health and function. Shutting down communities, overworking the medical infrastructure, driving employers into crises and economic collapse, communities into bankruptcy and chaos, such will only amplify the degree of virulence and morbidity of preexisting illnesses that become worse with the onset of the new viral insult; become worse and therefore invite the viral trauma.

          This virus will cull the population; the infirm, the very young and the very old will typically pay the price, and we will mutually learn such as the virus progresses along its evolutionary path to ordinariness. It’s a bitter biology lesson.

          So easy to dig the pit deeper. The only thing worse than people behaving stupidly is people in government behaving stupidly.

          Ironically, the Chinese government may end up killing more of its people than the virus did, and resulting in higher death tolls among non-Chinese outside of China. The economic calamity the misadministration has set in motion is far more dangerous to the world than the virus itself.

          Like

          • David A says:

            Yes the Chinese government may do that. ( Especially grouping people by the thousands who have only maybe been exposed to known carrier) That sounds insane to me.

            Yet China’s reaction, a quarantine of almost 10 percent of the GLOBAL population, is clear evidence of a much higher RO ( within China at least.) And a much higher death rate. If so, and this is very likely, as China is not destroying their economy for show, then without strong measures national panic and far greater destruction would have occurred.

            Liked by 1 person

  9. montanamel says:

    Remember Colloidal Silver…. you only need 5 ppm or 10 ppm solution…. take for 3 days, layoff for 3 days, repeat… Teaspoon per day for protection, Tablespoon, 2 or 3 times per day, if you get the nasty bug…it works. Must be made with minimum of 99.9% pure silver…no coins!… Maple Leafs are 99.99% pure….wire form is better, sometimes called dental silver.

    The “single supplier” issue is very important…one ship load has already been “recalled” to China – instead of sailing for the USA as paid for… This bug can “reinfect” and it attacks the heart then…due to damage done by some of the drugs being tried. There seems to be a point that is not being addressed; the bug really seems to focus on “young males in good health”… The very young and very old seem to get a pass, or at least a lighter version….There seems to be an immune system “over-speed” response that takes down the strongest. Their own bodies end up being their worst enemy. This response should be kept in mind when self medicating, ie: loads of anti-inflammatories may not be the smart move… YMMV.

    The inability of the China leaders to tell the truth and open up to CDC and WHO trained doc’s is a very big issue too.

    Liked by 1 person

  10. Mike Lee DelMarcelle says:

    I was a trainer in NBC (nuclear, biological & chemical) from my time in the service. If the Chinese were trying to develop a bio weapon to either sicken or kill in the event of a war this has several things that would be desirable for that purpose….
    1. Contagious and can survive on surfaces
    2. Long incubation period of 14 days (possibly more) would allow it to spread in large numbers before being detected.
    3. This also can show symptoms similar to flu (making it hard to diagnose) but attacks the respiratory system. Many chem & bio weapons that countries develop are designed to attack the lungs and or the ability of blood cells the carry oxygen in the body. If these were used in conjunction with each other they could be devastating.

    This was no boating accident!!!!!

    Liked by 3 people

    • lcsteel says:

      I completely disagree with your assumption.

      Like

    • mike says:

      There are a number of possible scenarios there, PRC, US, UK, India, Israel, Swiss pharms etc.

      My person view of the most likely scenario:
      Whether there is a western connection on a modified virus or not, my view is that PRC steals a lot of stuff (e.g. BSL4) and cuts a lot of corners in science and industry. Hubris, slop and reckless ambition are a dangerous combination that we see a lot from PRC.

      Maybe cooked bat and burnt fingers go together…

      Like

    • lolli says:

      👍Mike Lee,
      Been following this closely.
      I agree.

      Like

  11. Johnny Boost says:

    The Chinese have known about this virus since early January or late December or so, but outside of China we’ve seen roughly 800 cases or so and three or four deaths. Nothing of interested reported in New York City or Southern California, both major travel hubs with a good number of Chinese and Asian residents. No outbreaks at any colleges who have foreign exchange students. For something supposedly this dangerous there is little going on outside of China.

    I’m getting the feeling that a lot of this “quarantine” is basically martial law in order to suppress and kill off political opposition and undesirables in general. You can’t quarantine a city for more than a few days. They need to ship in all of their food and basic supplies constantly and they never have more than a few days supplies on hand at any given time.

    In recent months China has had sharply rising food prices, unrest in Hong Kong and a rickety banking system. Is there a bad flu outbreak in China? Probably. It is flu season, and China has bad air pollution and sanitation practices that are likely exacerbating it. But this might be more of a political crisis than a health crisis.

    Liked by 2 people

    • jeans2nd says:

      Chinese Ophthalmologist Dr Li Whatsits notified China of this virus Oct 2019.
      Dr Li was arrested and made to sign confession of spreading malicious rumors.
      Dr Li recently died, from coronavirus.

      President-For-Life Communist Chinese Dictator Xi knew Oct 2019.
      And did nothing.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Johnny Boost says:

        Did Li die from cornoavirus or did Li die because Xi wanted him dead? A disease outbreak is perfect cover for the Chinese regime to kill off its enemies and China has a history of brutal repression. The Hong Kong protests sure have quieted down in the past couple of months.

        If this disease is as dangerous as they say it is, there’d be more than a couple of deaths outside of China by now, considering all of the shipping and international travel from there.

        Liked by 1 person

        • Dwayne Diesel says:

          I agree. Look at the Japanese cruise ship that has been isolated for several weeks now. No deaths from the main cruise ship. Or the other mentioned (at least not found from my quick google search).

          The NYTs article following the cruise ship is misleading. It says live update, breaking news (30 mins ago): https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/17/world/asia/china-coronavirus.html

          The update has nothing by do with the virus or the cruise ship. It has to do with the PRC postponing a government function. With saying that this article points to declining numbers.

          I have the following thoughts:

          1. The PRC knows where this started and how- they are involved somehow. Not saying purposely but the PRC is involved. It could be purposeful but no definitive proof.

          2. The PRC is allowing this to be worse than needed because they need to CYA. They are not sharing vital info (or at least not early on) because it will expose them. I think they have a vaccine or antidote (or a partial) especially if they were working on this in their lab. Sharing this exposes them.

          3. The media is causing more hysteria than needed. I’m an Engineer so data is very important to my decision making process. The death rate in China (approx 70, 000 declared cases or shared cases divided by the approx.1800 shared or declared deaths) is approx. 2.6%. Whereas in in the U.S this flu season alone has lead to 10,000+ deaths (as of Feb 3rd). Context is important. The death rate from flu is on average 5-10% world wide with it rising to >25% during pandemic years (3rd world countries bring biggest contributors). Apples to oranges maybe but it provides some perspective.

          What is the point? I think this CV is import to track but is not as deadly as its being portrayed but because of China’s overpopulation and lack of medical attention available to many it has the ability to spread and cause problems. Especially since China tried hiding it. I think a few months from now this will be another bird or swine flu similar to SARS.

          The Chinese just have some ‘splaining to do.

          I think this is a very contagious disease that hides and spreads fast. It’s dangerous when not treated- like ALL virus related diseases. But when treated early is a nuisance but not deadly. Which is why no deaths being reported from cruise ship.

          The pieces being shared don’t fit. I wouldn’t expect different with anything originating from China.

          Liked by 2 people

          • David A says:

            ‘”The death rate in China (approx 70, 000 declared cases or shared cases divided by the approx.1800 shared or declared deaths) is approx. 2.6%.”

            That is completely incorrect! In Wuhan, using China’s understated numbers, there are as many people in critical care as there are dead, and about 3 times as many in IC, many of those going downhill.
            So let us assume 0 new infections.
            How many of those in IC and critical care will die, how many in the early stages of the infection will progress to critical and death. In Wuhan, with overwhelmed hospitals, we can expect a death rate of closer to 10 percent plus. ( China is grossly underinflating their numbers in my view. ).

            As to the flu, the flu death rate is about .01 percent. You are off by two magnitudes!!

            Like

            • Dwayne Diesel says:

              It is not incorrect. State your source and back your information. There are enough people buying into the hysteria.

              Here’s this years CDC info on the flu: flu and Pneumonia is approx. 6.8 %. Most do no die from the “flu virus” they die from complications from the flu such as Pneumonia or other respiratory illnesses. Here are two links that back my assertions- the first is general information the 2nd provides cases and deaths:

              1. https://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/index.htm

              2. https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/preliminary-in-season-estimates.htm

              The CV virus is starting to be similar. People are not dying from the “virus” per se but rather respiratory complications or other organ failures brought on by a weakened immune system. It’s why I said apples and oranges but some perspective is needed.

              Until you can provide a source more reputable than the CDC and proof of how much China is underreporting you are speaking out of your butt. I don’t mean to be offensive but I hate speculation. There’s enough of that regarding this going around.

              Like

              • David A says:

                No need to be rude and wrong.
                Your own link says 6.8 percent of the deaths that do occur are penimonia, not 6.8 percent of
                total flu victims die!
                Let’s say 35 million x .001
                means 35000 annual deaths ( about an avetage US flu season verses your 35 million x .065 or 2,275,000 dead. ( Nonsense )

                As to my numbers from Wuhan and mainland China, they are based not on the CDC, but the lowball numbers China places every day. There is no other source and China lists the number of infected, the number in serious cond, and the number in critical condition. It is not controversial except we know those are likely lowballed. But what I quoted was from those lowballed numbers.

                Like

    • David A says:

      The leaks past the Chinese gatekeepers, ( thousands) all show how bad this is in China. It is insane to destroy their economy like this for the reasons you suggest.

      The virus develops slowly. January 21 was a bit over three weeks ago. US cases 1 – 2 – 4 – 8 – 15. Almost four doublings in under 4 weeks. ( Granted different sources)

      The point is that from infection to asymptomatic yet contagious, to serious symptoms, is about 16 days.
      (12 to 24 plus days)

      RO is variable for many reasons. Look at the cruise ship.

      Like

      • Dwayne Diesel says:

        Just brought cruise ship up too. No deaths. Spreads fast. People recovering. But the complication being the variable hibernation period. Hard to know who’s good and who’s sick.

        Like

        • David A says:

          The 40 in the cruise ship is through the roof. The concern is how many will need hospital care and from there, with a high RO, how long will it take to overwhelm the hospitals. Thus ain’t no flu.

          Like

          • Dwayne Diesel says:

            Stop your fear mongering. See my recent reply. You provide no data just your speculation based on irrational fears not backed by anything.

            Like

            • David A says:

              I conflated two things.
              In China the RO and the death rate is way above the flu, and the hospitals got overwhelmed.
              On the cruise ship about 30 percent of those tested were positive. The RO is very high on that ship.
              Regarding death rate the time sequence is critical. There is a decent chance the non smoking have a much lower death rate. 6 day average from infection to first symptoms, about 10 additional days to serious complications for about 20 percent of the infected. ( Wuhan numbers, very high percentage of smoking males)
              While the RO looks like maybe similar, hopefully the severe cases will be much reduced. We should know in the next two weeks.

              Like

          • lolli says:

            Here is the latest on cruise ship numbers. This is from international society for infectious diseases. From the report 2-16-20
            https://promedmail.org/

            “As the passengers prepared to leave the country, Japanese health officials said the number of confirmed coronavirus cases found on the ship, the Diamond Princess, had grown by 70, to 355.”

            Like

    • meow4me2 says:

      From a Chinese coworker in contact with people in quarantine areas. Only one person in the household is allowed to go out and get food. Only specific times of the day allowed. No public transport allowed. You walk, bike or use a vehicle if lucky enough to have one. People have been throwing open their windows to talk to neighbors. That is being cracked down upon.

      I agree we won’t get reliable numbers from the Chinese. We never have about anything. We will only know when we see how deadly or contagious this is outside of China. That said, our medical care system is much more robust and able to handle more, supplies from China notwithstanding. It is likely to be more deadly in a less advanced medical system. Witness Ebola in Africa vs US. More deaths in China may simply mean less access to high quality medical care, or a completely swamped medical system.

      Like

    • TonyE says:

      The Chinese community in SoCal is freaking out. Just sayin’. I got a lot of Chinese American friends and ex coworkers, they are wearing masks whenever they walk out of the house. Have been doing so for almost a month now.

      Like

  12. All Too Much says:

    This cannot be good.

    “Health officials said Saturday that they’ve found a coronavirus case among the hundreds of passengers who disembarked a cruise ship in Cambodia, The New York Times reported.”
    […]
    “Now, more than 1,000 passengers from the ship have proceeded to destinations around the world, and health officials are struggling to determine how to handle the situation.”

    https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-case-found-on-westerdam-cruise-after-hundreds-disembark-2020-2

    Like

  13. The Devilbat says:

    Johns Hopkins University has a fantastic online world map showing the numbers of infected people and the number of deaths by country. It is updated at least every few hours. See it here:

    https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

    Liked by 2 people

    • All Too Much says:

      Have you noticed on the map there are no reported cases in South America and, until a few days ago, none in Africa, Something isn’r right. There is extensive air travel between China and Africa these days.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Johnny Boost says:

        The fact that very little has happened outside of China, with all of their international travel and shipping, is what people should be thinking about.

        I wouldn’t be surprised if the Chinese government suddenly collapses, much like the Soviets did.

        Like

        • Raptors2020 says:

          Globalism, we hardly knew ye..

          Someday, we may tell our grandkids about the good old days when people travelled around the world for pleasure or adventure. But now, children, only government officials on important diplomatic business get to cross borders. Oh well.

          The Left mocked Otto Warmbier for visiting North Korea. And tell me again, why any tourist needs to visit North Korea or Iran or any other authoritarian state?

          Global warming believers may seize on this epidemic to further their quest for major restrictions on travel. Ocasio-Cortez has already called for government permits to travel.

          Permanence is the illusion of every age. Somehow, without the floating hotels we call cruise ships, we’d get by.

          Like

      • The Devilbat says:

        It does seem strange. The Chinese are not the only liars in the world, it’s possible that a number of countries are not reporting the virus. Think about what will happen if it gets a hold in Venezuela. The people there are already weak from hunger and they will die like flies. The Chinese are heavily involved in the country so there will have been a lot of them visiting the on business.

        Like

      • Vince says:

        I am not an expert, but I have heard hat the virus does not survive well at higher temperatures. The plan right now is to slow down the transmission and hope that summer will kill it off. South America and Africa are hot climates, and the Southern Hemisphere is having its summer now. If they don’t have any cases, that’s a hopeful sign that higher temperature may stop it.

        Like

      • AnotherView says:

        I watch this global incident map.Quite appalling: http://outbreaks.globalincidentmap.com

        Like

      • A2 says:

        I already commented on that.

        Like

    • keeler says:

      BNO also has a good breakdown on reported raw data . JHU is a little better, but for those who like multiple sources:

      https://bnonews.com/index.php/2020/02/the-latest-coronavirus-cases/

      Liked by 1 person

  14. Rynn69 says:

    I am not a tin foil hat conspiracy theorist, but it does seem rather coincidental that this “coronavirus” happens as the U.S. is attempting to decouple from China and is utilizing tariffs and other measures to do so.

    Liked by 3 people

    • David A says:

      The economic damage from this will far outweigh any damage from a new trade deal with the US.
      The reports getting past the Chinese government gatekeepers are very real.

      Like

  15. MaineCoon says:

    FTA: Health officials believe there is still opportunity to prevent widespread transmission of the coronavirus in the United States, the director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said Wednesday, even as he warned that more human-to-human transmission here is likely.

    “We’re still going to see new cases. We’re probably going to see human-to-human transmission within the United States,” Dr. Robert Redfield said in an interview with STAT.

    He added that “at some point in time it is highly probable that we’ll have to transition to mitigation” as a public health strategy, using “social distancing measures” — for example, closure of certain public facilities — and other techniques to try to limit the number of people who become infected.

    https://www.statnews.com/2020/02/12/cdc-director-more-person-to-person-coronavirus-infections-in-u-s-likely-but-containment-still-possible/?utm_content=buffer80e53&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=twitter_organic

    Like

  16. lcsteel says:

    I expect it will be all over in 3 months…Reminds me of the SARS scare.

    Like

  17. patti says:

    This is very disturbing…

    Top 15 #Coronavirus Pics You Won’t See in Legacy Media

    http://directorblue.blogspot.com/2020/02/top-15-coronavirus-photos-you-wont-see.html

    Liked by 1 person

    • keeler says:

      For anyone who has paid attention, the PRC’s handling of this outbreak has really exposed how much of a Third World Nation China remains.

      I could get into a lot but I’ll stick with the “temporary hospitals.” Bars on the windows. No isolation… giant wards with sick people lying head to head exposed to cross-infection. No running water, including toilets. Flooded hallways. No sanitation. Passed out patients and dead bodies lying in the reception areas. And there are videos of patients being led in Communist Party pledges.

      They’re not hospitals. They’re concentration camps where little, if any, effort is being made to treat the sick. To some degree the conditions and behavior can be rationalized given the scale of the outbreak has overwhelmed the system, but the system was inadequate to begin with and the vast majority of the resources are going to treat those leading the pledges at real medical facilities.

      China, despite all of its economic growth in the last 25 years, remains a nation where life is cheap, infrastructure is poor, and the environment is filthy. The pristine streets of Beijing are the 21st century equivalent of Mussolini’s trains, which were only on time for the headlines.

      Liked by 1 person

      • mike says:

        … and your nearest helpful Christian is likely to be on the organ donor list.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Dutchman says:

        keeler,
        So in other words, a typical CONmunist country. USSR put men in space, but was still very much as you describe “3rd world”; its not the people, race or heritage; its CONmunism, and what you describe is a hallmark of Conmunism.

        Incompetence, innefficiency and corruption suck all of the vitality out of a society.

        Liked by 3 people

        • 55praises says:

          People need motivation to do a job well. If there is no reward (such as monetary), if one’s action or inaction is forced/contrived, or if one sees/experiences obvious corruption, productivity declines. All of these things occur in a Communistic system.

          Like

      • David A says:

        No isolation… giant wards with sick people lying head to head exposed to cross-infection.””

        That is the one that gets me. Many of these forced location group quarantine locations are for exposed but not known to be sick people.
        I do not think it hyperbole to call this murder.

        Like

        • TonyE says:

          It’s a “quarantine” in the fullest sense of the word.

          Quarantine the sick away from the healthy and the sick will either die or get healthy. Meanwhile the healthy are kept away from the sick.

          The quarantine is not meant to cure the sick, only to keep them out of the way until their disease has taken its course. That’s why people want to escape from quarantine and why the cops shoot.

          Like

          • David A says:

            In China they are considered exposed, they are not tested. Put all the exposed 24 7 in the same room, some are guaranteed contagious but asymptomatic, insane, really not hyperbole to say murder.
            You will get an R0 that is through the roof, worse then the cruise ship by far.

            Like

            • David A says:

              True quarrantine, among the civilized at least, means isolation, especially in the likely exposed but not known.

              The RO on the Princess cruise ship us very high, and at least they have seperate rooms

              Like

      • Rudolph says:

        Think about how many hospital beds are available in your area? It wouldn’t be enough for a pandemic either.

        Like

    • Peoria Jones says:

      These videos are HORRIFIC!

      Like

  18. patti says:

    Expert: China Has ‘Global Chokehold’ on Medicine, Can Shut Down Our Pharmacies, Hospitals in Months
    https://www.breitbart.com/radio/2020/02/14/expert-china-has-global-chokehold-on-medicine-can-shut-down-our-pharmacies-hospitals-in-months/

    Like

    • deplorable says:

      Wow, sounds like big pharma owns Congress. From the article:


      Gibson replied, “There was country-of-origin legislation introduced in Congress around 2008 that would require companies to state on their packages where their product is made, and it was killed immediately. So I asked someone in the industry, someone who worked there for more than 30 years, ‘So, what’s going on here?’ and this person said, ‘Well, the industry thought it probably wouldn’t be good for business if their customers knew where their medicines were coming from.’”

      But big pharma does NOT own President Trump. Mr. President, please bring this up on the campaign trail. Americans WANT country-of-origin labeling on the medicines they put in their bodies.

      Liked by 2 people

  19. mike says:

    Sunshine, better sanitation, cleaner air, higher temps, and better warning/response will hopefully slow things down in the US. Maybe genetics help too.

    I don’t want a quickie vaccine or military trial like the swine flu vaccine that killed more people than the swine flu itself in 1976.

    Plan B
    Injectable Vitamin C is a key anti-viral treatment FR Klenner first described in JAMA for viral pneumonia in 1948. First fills in the deficits, neutralizes toxic crap, and then has a metal catalyzed reaction around pathogens’ iron and copper sites. If a virus has iron or copper in its protein coat, it is doomed by Fenton reaction after high concentration vitamin C.

    We stay in a tropical jungle area with all kinds of nasty stuff – mossies with arboviruses, venomous insects, carrier bats, etc. IV vitamin C is handy for us. One virus I got into was like a sci fi movie, but IV C knocked it out with a series of 100,000+ mg infusions, the first infusion visibly the most impressive in ca 6-8 hours. Most people will do 50,000 mg – 75,000 mg C infusions for cost/convenience in 1-2 hours.

    Early infusions need to be about 8 hours apart the first day e.g. t = 0, 8hr, 16 hr, 24 hr. Smaller dose injectable vitamin C series for 2 hr, 4hr or 6 hr spacing were done in the early years for viral pneumonias and polio. Klenner’s heaviest infusion doses were on the order of 700-1100 mg C /kg body weight in the 1970s, lower doses earlier in the 1940s and 50s. After day 1, a tapered schedule usually works. Klenner felt he could kill any acute viral disease in 4 days or less, with big enough doses frequently enough with some trade off between dose and frequency but he usually finished with only 3 – 7 infusions and oral loads.

    Various vitamin advocates will suggest up to 3-7 days of vitamin D3 at 50,000 iu when under siege by influenza. Adequate magnesium and vitamin K2 are needed with long term high doses of D3.
    Likewise zinc is on the list for some viruses. After that, Elderberry and olive leaf extract have interesting properties in natural medicine.

    China has listed an IV vitamin C trial at 1 gram C per hour x 7 days but that is far short of Klenner’s peak vitamin C levels and infusion rates for reliability. https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04264533

    see these books or sites
    1. Curing the Incurable: Vitamin C, Infectious Diseases, and Toxins, by Thomas E Levy MD
    2. Injectable Vitamin C and the Treatments of Viral and Other Diseases
    by Robert McCracken, PhD is $1 online at Barnes &Noble, $3 on Amazon.
    3. The Healing Factor, by Irwin Stone is available for free, see Chapters 12-13.
    original copy https://archive.org/details/TheHealingFactorVitaminCAgainstDiStoneIrwin/page/n53/mode/2up
    retyped (with some typos) https://visionearth.org/downloads/THE-HEALING-FACTOR-v20150318-001.pdf
    4. https://riordanclinic.org/2014/02/high-dose-intravenous-vitamin-c-as-a-successful-treatment-of-viral-infections/
    5. This 1980 paper by Robert Cathcart MD, is the major paper on maximum oral dosing of vitamin C, to bowel tolerance: “How to Determine Vitamin C Dosage” Oral C is still far short of going all out to injectable vitamin C but easier to buy. http://www.doctoryourself.com/titration.html

    We’ve got vitamin D3 powder, 10,000 iu and 50,000 iu vit D3 caps, 1000 mg vit C tablets and powder, high strength beta glucans, olive leaf extract, zinc (50 mg) and selenium caps to modify viral attacks and help prevent getting an initial illness.

    Liked by 3 people

  20. A2 says:

    A report in the Daily Mail, still trying to track down the original source, has said that PRC researchers have published an account that identifies a PRC university Laboratory close to the Wuhan market as the source of infection.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8009669/Did-coronavirus-originate-Chinese-government-laboratory.html

    Unless I see the report in Chinese, I will wait to comment. It may be true, or just a cya report.

    Senator Cotton, has outlined correctly what has happened, despite his mispronunciations. And I have posted much of it here.

    Now I see folks attacking him, not just the PRC. What’s that all about?

    Liked by 2 people

    • Dutchman says:

      Attack the messenger?

      Like

    • David A says:

      You may find these other reports informative as well.
      https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2020/02/16/senator-tom-cotton-discusses-latest-on-coronavirus-situation-is-very-grave/comment-page-1/#comment-7860626

      Regarding the daily mail article, IMV it has some chops just because it breaches the MSM firewall with some MSM reporters and it dies appear well sourced.

      Like

      • A2 says:

        Thank you, very nice, but as I live in China i have more updated reports..

        Maybe a curse, but I try to alert folks here. I am selective. Don’t want to scare the numpties.

        Liked by 1 person

        • Dwayne Diesel says:

          I’m surprised you can comment on here living in China. On my visits for business this site, as well as a few others: Bongino, bonginoreport, dailycaller, newsbusters, etc. load but my ability to comment is really restricted (usually the comment add on doesn’t load- i.e disqus).

          It frustrates me when I travel there….plus I was taken to an underground military photo place the last time I flew out of Shanghai. Taxi went through police check points (black unis with police written on them) taking me to an underground area where the taxis could only go on direction with girders on both sides so you can’t open doors. Military members were there (green unis, guns,etc.) coming up to our cars taking our pictures. U.S. citizens who have never been to China I feel struggle to understand just how much the government is watching you.

          Like

        • David A says:

          My link was to scientific analysis of the virus and reasons to think it was possibly an accidental lab release. ( Not really cogent to weather the information came from China or not.) Although would love to hear about your experiences and word on the street of how bad this is in China.

          Like

    • lolli says:

      A2,
      Weird this thread immediately went to bashing Cotten instead of researching this virus.
      I seriously do not understand why people are pretending this is just a flu. SMH.

      When 30% of health workers are contracting this disease, you pay attention.

      Like

  21. Bone Fish says:

    People, especially in the Western orbit, just don’t get it yet. COVID-19 (Chicom Flu) is the world changer, the reset of civilization. This bad little piece of manufactured bug is in the process of wiping out the whole Chinese economy. Because China is the start of 70-90% of the world’s supply chain, most countries’ economies and supplies are going to evaporate.

    Ask yourself this:

    1) What do I use every day/week/month that I cannot live without and has any part of its supply chain anchored in China?

    Well, that ****’s going away. And, not for just a week, or even a few months. It’s going away for in all likelihood a couple of years at least.

    2) What do I buy/eat if the local grocery stores are all closed? How long can I go without being able to shop at one?

    A chain, they say, is only as strong as its weakest link. The supply chain that puts food in your local grocery store is built on so many supply chains that it would boggle your mind. Truck parts, refrigeration pumps, packaging machines, plastic wrap, the list goes on and on. All of it is going away.

    3) How cheaply are you willing to work?

    Figure out what you think your “price” is and then ask yourself why any manufacturer would produce anything from gasoline to chick pot pies? Because the moment they can no longer produce at a profit, they will shut down.

    4) When you believe, rightly or wrong, that in leaving your home to work/shop for food could be a death sentence to not only you but to those you live with, and any of those people’s departure from the home could mean the same, what would you leave your house for?

    This is the thought process that will paralyze all society. Once people realize that this beastie has a window of being asymptomatically infectious, (super spreaders), for up to 24 days, and that if you happen to get it and beat it, you have just as good a chance to catch it again, and that the second time it has much better odds of killing you than it did the first time. What are you leaving the house for again?

    The folks just do not understand it yet. But they will soon.

    Like

    • David A says:

      IMV to alarmist. We will see in about 3 months. In the mean time please understand that, due to automation and ever growing efficiency improvements, labor is an ever smaller percentage of costs. Also shipping costs are real. Also, while China’s mercantilism has achieved dominance in numerous fields, resources are global. For instance rare earth metals are not so rare.

      It is a very good think we have Donald Trump as POTUS, even if it is not as bad as you project.

      Like

    • mike says:

      The Chinese should recover from this coronavirus. They will get better at public hygiene and medicine. Either better health practices and treatments will diminish the threat or recovered patients, acquired resistance at great cost, and vaccines will come to fore.

      We had worse in the 19th century.

      Liked by 1 person

  22. spoogels says:

    Is CDC hiding #coronavirus cases in New York? This voicemail message was left for Dr. Paul Cottrell and later posted on his YouTube channel.

    Like

  23. spoogels says:

    For anybody who hasn’t read the article on the Epoch Times, IT IS A MUST READ!!!

    https://www.theepochtimes.com/did-chinas-plan-to-destroy-the-united-states-backfire_3223117.html

    From the article:
    “We are not as foolish as to want to perish together with America by using nuclear weapons,” said the general. “Only by using non-destructive weapons that can kill many people will we be able to reserve America for ourselves.” The answer is found in biological weapons. “Of course,” he added, “we have not been idle, in the past years we have seized the opportunity to master weapons of this kind

    I am leaning to this way of thinking. I would not put it past the Chinese government to plan to control their population and destroy our economy if they see their economy going down! But hey you Dem idiots, keep yelling Russia, Russia, Russia, while the Chinese are taking over the damn world!!!

    Liked by 3 people

  24. A2 says:

    I give up. Full stop.

    Carry on

    Numpties.

    Liked by 1 person

  25. MfM says:

    The U.S. evacuation of the Diamond Princess saw over 300 Americans headed home yesterday.

    Surprise… 14 of them who didn’t have symptoms have the virus. Testing was done several days before they left.

    Liked by 1 person

    • JustScott says:

      Beat me to it. Article says the ” individuals were moved [] to a specialized containment area on the evacuation aircraft to isolate them”

      http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/276084

      Like

    • Peoria Jones says:

      Let’s pray for three things:

      1.) Keep those poor souls the hell away from the rest of us.

      2.) Give them the very best medical care the USA can provide.

      3.) Make them as comfortable as possible while they’re away from their homes and loved ones.

      God Bless them. I pray that they – and we – all get through this without serious harm.

      Like

      • lolli says:

        Ya. Some from the ship flown in here to Texas early this morning, adding to the ones already here.
        It is so encouraging for me to know they are at a base a few miles away, and one positive is at our Methodist hospital where babies are born.
        No worries, they are being super duper careful.
        Also, 4 families Here are just self quarantining. And the family members who live in their home but did not travel to China, do not have to quarantine. Ya. We are screwed.

        Like

    • lolli says:

      The tests have been proven to give false negatives quite often.

      Like

  26. citizen817 says:

    Liked by 1 person

    • A2 says:

      Yeah and I posted that already before.

      Like

    • A2 says:

      I already posted that on the Open Presidential thread yesterday.

      I am giving up here.

      Just chaff, countermeasures, and screwy medical theories. A cornucopia of disinformation from the twitter twats.

      Go for it. I live in China, read, write, speak the lingo, but I’m just another poster so what I report is just, nonsense.

      Ok la. Nevermind.

      Liked by 2 people

      • David A says:

        Don’t give up. My brother works with a couple if wealthy Chinese business men. He says they report, like much of the leaked media, that it is a very grave situation, worse then the official numbers, and they have been traveling just to stay ahead of growing quarantines.

        Please share your personal experiences and word on the street perspective.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Ausonius says:

        Please stay with us!

        Can you answer this? When this first started, there was a report that “guest scientists” from China, who were working in a Canadian lab, stole certain viruses to weaponize them at Wuhan. This report was from”ZeroHedge,” which is not the most reliable source, or a reliable source at all.

        But now it seems there might be something to it.

        As others have said, it might not make much difference now, whether it was “weaponized” or not. The virus is out. However, knowing that it was created via man-made tinkering could provide clues on how to counter it.

        Liked by 1 person

        • Yvain says:

          The name of the guest scientist is Xiangguo Qiu, who is a virologist most notable for her work on ebola and being involved in Zmapp, an experimental anti ebola drug. I’ve linked her papers below and believe (based on some quick verification via online googling) that she is a Canadian citizen.

          https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4214273/
          https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3842534/

          In 2019, her security clearance was revoked by the Canadian government. Details are sparse, and the best source of information is from the CBC. If you read the link below and the assorted stories, this is what’s readily available.

          https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/chinese-researcher-escorted-from-infectious-disease-lab-amid-rcmp-investigation-1.5211567

          So, my take on this personally is that I do not personally think that this is necessarily connected. The motives don’t match up. It’d be far easier to use a non-Chinese national. Their Chinese social media presence is too recent to be “organic”, and so on.

          However, if I were to play devil’s advocate and go with the proposal that this is connected to Wuhan, my money would be on her husband, Cheng Keding. I am surprised that Zerohedge, for all their self-professed journalistic integrity, name dropped him but failed to note that Cheng’s expertise involving SARS or his work on the ACE2 receptor, which IS known to be used by coronaviruses. The other thing that seems awfully suspicious to me is that if you read Chinese media, his name – unlike his wife’s – goes virtually unmentioned and there is virtually nothing on him.

          My take on these things is that I think it’s important for all of us to see what information is out there, and conclude for ourselves based on what’s there. Apologies if this neither debunks nor “confirms” your suspicions, but until we can get more information somehow, this is the best I can do.

          Like

      • Dwayne Diesel says:

        I agree A2. I think the media and others are way over the top with their doomsday analysis. The death rate in China (at least reported) is only approx. 2.6%. Lower than the flu. Doesn’t mean don’t take precaution but for me this says that this CV is not as deadly as being presented if treated or addressed early (see the cruise ship).

        I also said from the beginning this has the appearance of a bio-weapon attack (don’t know if on purpose or by accident) thus it tells me the Chinese know how to address the situation. But, the Chinese also are a communist regime who don’t care if people die.

        Keep doing what you are doing.

        Liked by 3 people

        • David A says:

          You are still very wrong on the death rate for the flu, and the Cov virus death rate is higher, as your method is flawed.

          You do not divide deaths into total cases. That badly skewers the numbers in a logrythmically growing time line. Instead figure out the average time from exposure to death, and figure out total cases at that time, or about 18 days before the current days total death. Alternatively look at deaths vs recovered.
          ( This is simplified to illustrate why you do not divide total death by current total case load.)

          I took A2 to be frustrated with the bio-weapons China did it to itself on purpose claims, not that he objected to the gravity of the situation in China, or wrongly thought that thus was milder then the coming flu.

          Like

      • kleen says:

        Last time I checked only 2 deaths outside of China. (I don’t know today what that number is)
        Yes 2 lives lost is too many, but as far panic, 2 deaths is not a reason to panic considering one was a 80 something year old. We all know pneumonia in elderly people is dangerous.

        I think we will get more accurate information once this virus is dealt with outside of China.

        Liked by 2 people

      • lolli says:

        A2,
        Ya, I don’t get it.
        You are our on the ground reporter.
        I look for your reports on the virus, just as I did on the HK protestors.
        I don’t blame you for getting ticked off, but you can ignore them and speak to us who are interested.

        Liked by 3 people

      • walt39 says:

        A2, this ALWAYS happens. I’m in the same spot you’re in in a couple of other fields. When anything important goes hot you get lots of ignorant people show up, some of them post their speculations as fact, a few spend their time attacking others … That’s just how it is.

        The first rule is never respond to the stupid or personal attacks. Only if a legitimate question is raised, then you answer that and move one.

        The way I deal with it is I am posting for the people who want to learn and can figure out that I know something. Most of them aren’t — never will! — posting. They’re just reading and nodding.

        Yes, the same basic facts have to be posted repeatedly — not uncommonly 50 times or more on the same thread because most people won’t read more than a few screens before they quit.

        It IS frustrating, sure it is, and especially because you mostly can’t see that you’re doing any good. But — this IS the game.

        Thanks for whatever you have time to do.

        Like

      • mark says:

        If you really care A2 you won’t give up.

        I remember answering you to be safe. Nuf said

        Like

  27. MfM says:

    To me the most important things right now is to find out how it is transmitted and how long it is viable outside the human body.

    For a virus that has caused so many deaths little is known. Then again we are dealing with China.

    Other than political culture there are practices in China that have helped the spread. Sanitation i.e. lack of proper hand washing, sharing eating utensils and eating from common containers are problem areas.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Super Elite says:

      Try Leviticus 11. The Chinese eat unclean food as a delicacy. Did you notice the map in the Senator Cotton video? In which there are no coronavirus cases in the Middle East where they practice eating only halala foods (meaning clean foods as outlined in the book of Leviticus). In fact it has gotten to the point it isn’t safe to eat ‘clean’ foods because the Globalizers abuse the animals in order to make one more dollar.

      Like

  28. JustScott says:

    Been following Dr. Campbell for weeks. Last minute of tonight’s short video was disturbing, as was his strange mouth movements.

    I would like to believe this will be a nothing-burger for US, but info is trending other direction ATM.

    Like

  29. Mike in a Truck says:

    I’ll say it again.When a bio weapon is created the antidote is cooked up right alongside it. For no other reason at least to give it to your own troops.Notice none of the “elites” in China are catching Capt. Trips.

    Liked by 1 person

  30. JasonF says:

    In the video, Senator Cotton claims that the virus definitely did not originate in the Wuhan marketplace. To support his claim, he cites a study published in The Lancet. That study is online, and free, at
    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30154-9/fulltext

    The study tells about some people (from Shenzhen) who went to Wuhan on December 29th. Those people got coronavirus, and they did not visit the Wuhan marketplace. They seem to have gotten coronavirus from visiting a hospital in Wuhan.

    Coronavirus is known to have been in Wuhan before December though. Hence the study says nothing about how corona virus originated.

    Thus, the study does not support Cotton’s claim. Cotton presumably misunderstood the study. He should have been more careful in his work.

    Perhaps the coronavirus did not originate in the Wuhan marketplace. But Cotton has not presented any evidence to support that.

    Like

  31. Ausonius says:

    I just asked A 2 above, our Chinese correspondent, whether the ZeroHedge report from January might have some truth in it.

    https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/did-china-steal-coronavirus-canada-and-weaponize-it

    It was almost instantly attacked as conspiracy theory and unfounded, especially by the Canadians. I agree that ZeroHedge is not a good source, but perhaps “Auch ein blindes Huhn findet mal ein Korn” (Even a blind chicken sometimes finds a kernel of corn.)

    Liked by 1 person

  32. Broc Smith says:

    I’ve lived in China 20 years. My family and I got to America prior to the quarantines. This article focuses on “how bad China is”, stirring up fear and resentment. There are many terrified people in China right now. Many families and innocents affected. I am not saying we should turn a blind eye, but wouldn’t it be better to feature news feeds that offer solutions, sympathy and prayer?

    Like

    • wondering999 says:

      Yes. Have been praying for A2 and A2’s community since I first heard about this. Coming

      Also praying for the rest of us. China is now under military lockdown? No more of those inspiring, incredibly courageous Hong Kong rallies? Where medical staff were among the brave protestors?

      and for us, eventually restrictions on Trump or Bernie rallies? (Not quite comparable to Hong Kong, but also uprisings against the criminals)

      Pray for us all. .

      Like

  33. NoFixedAddress says:

    2019 and prior – The Trump Team work toward a trading accommodation with the CCP to restore equity for America;
    2019 – Avowed CCP investor and supporter, Bloomfield, joins the 2020 Democrat Presidential farce (Nov 19, 2019);
    2020 – CCP signs Phase 1 trading agreement with the Trump Team;
    2020 – 2019-nCoV is announced;
    2020 – CCP shuts down Chinese manufacturing and export including Pharmaceutical;
    2020 – American Retired Military voices are finally being quoted of their long standing warnings about the CCP’s intentions toward America and the West in general.

    Like

    • NoFixedAddress says:

      Forgot to mention,
      January 2020 – Major CCP ‘businesses’ already revoking acceptance of overseas supplied raw materials via ‘force majeure’.

      Like

  34. Kokanee says:

    Last month Zero Hedge had this article about where the virus came from.
    https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/did-china-steal-coronavirus-canada-and-weaponize-it

    Like

  35. tsmifjones says:

    Cotton’s is a dumb ass. He’s a swamp rat piece along with organ stealing murder covering up ahole asa hutchinson and they are giving away Arkansas to the virus infected chinese.

    Like

  36. Blind no Longer says:

    Frankly I am glad Senator is sounding the alarm. Maria has had him on her show for the past few weeks. She is angry about the Chinese going to the White House and Davos knowing about this deadly virus, but trying to hide it.

    IMO, this is a biological weapon that got loose, purposefully, or not, all bets are off it this virus was weaponized. I get very angry at people who just shove this off as the flu and spout the usual mantra, the “regular flu” infects and kills more people here every year.

    I have made this point on other threads, we do not shut down air travel, check people’s temps, quarantine people on military bases and have the CDC following and contacting people who have had contact with someone who had the “regular” flu. People are not dropping dead on our streets with walking pneumonia.

    People who dismiss this as something that will not take hold here, are kidding themselves and are complicit in helping it to spread. It’s just the flu.

    I believe Maria is scared. She was in Davos and came back very ill. A few Sundays ago she had to leave in the middle of her show saying she was ill and could not finish.

    We don’t know enough about this virus to take it lightly. The incubation period where people have no symptoms and suddenly become very ill….all the while they are shedding the virus like crazy and possibly infecting others at work, school, grocery stores etc.

    This virus has many characteristics like Sars. We should prepare accordingly. No different than a hurricane….have your supplies ready just in case.

    Liked by 2 people

  37. kleen says:

    The problem with ignoring coronavirus fake news, is undermining public panic. Once the population panics, then it’s too late to prepare.

    We see it before hurricanes hits the shore. Empty shelves, gas stations out of gas, booked hotels, cancelled flights etc.

    The storm itself may not be a problem but panic is.

    So, it’s always good to be prepared for emergencies as best as you can, even if what we are seeing is all fake news and this is just another Flu. Regardless of what this really is, keep paying attention to the panicky crowd and how it affects your area.

    Spring is coming Tornadoes are a real threat here in Texas, that, I should prepare for. Coronavirus? Not right now.

    Like

  38. JohnCasper says:

    Predictions are very hard to make. Especially about the future.
    – Yogi Berra

    Like

  39. lolli says:

    I have been reading up on this daily.
    I have never before been alarmed by a virus (sars, etc) Before now.

    For official reports check (international society for disease or some such) but actually reports from research and CDC.

    https://promedmail.org/

    Latest information I ran across, states the incubation period can be longer than 14 days.
    Also, you can be reinfected, and if you are, you might very possibly die of a heart attack.

    https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3876197

    Like

  40. Zippy says:

    As much as 3 times as transmissible as the common flu, 10 times as deadly within advanced developed nation medical systems, 40 times as deadly within OVERLOADED advanced developed nation medical systems, transmission without symptoms, transmissions via feces, 80% of those infected have mild cold symptoms and not knowing they have it spread it everywhere.

    Bioweapons expert Steven Hatfill says if community outbreaks of a virus with these characteristics aren’t nipped in the bud while still at very low numbers, control is hopeless without doing what China is doing in quarantining entire cities larger than NYC. Imagine trying to do that here and what it would do to our economy and what it IS doing to China’s economy.

    We’d better pray it doesn’t get a foothold here.

    China’s Hubei province in full lockdown – 17 Feb 2020

    Coronavirus: 99 more cases confirmed on cruise ship Diamond Princess
    17 Feb 2020

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2020/feb/17/coronavirus-live-updates-us-citizens-japan-diamond-princess-cruise-ship-china-wuhan-hubei-cases-death-toll-latest-news

    So far, a total of 454 infected found on ship.

    Like

    • Zippy says:

      Oh, and by the way, even though our OWNED politicians have LONG been warned about the danger when 87% of our antibiotics are made in China as well as 80% of generics (we don’t even make aspirin any more) and essentially all of medical personal protective gear (masks, gowns, gloves, googles, etc.) they have, of course, done nothing.

      Like

  41. Kenney says:

    Many countries have these labs to study virus’s. I don’t think they were making weapons but were just sloppy in handling virus’s. Cutting safety corners and improper methods. It just takes one person to go out in public with a virus and off it goes. The first 41 cases had 5 not related to the market so the lab is a good possibility. It is probably impossible but there needed to be tracing of the earliest infected people. This problem was caused by the early mishandling of the crisis. The main thing now is to get it under control. It could get worse before it gets better. Serious stuff.

    Like

    • Zippy says:

      That’s increasingly what is thought even from studies from WITHIN China and official talk from high levels about stopping leaks from labs (how’s that for a hint?) – it was probably a leak from one of the several Wuhan facilities which work study such viruses for preventative human health work and not even necessarily from the Level 4 containment facility. China has previously had three or four ACCIDENTAL leaks of the SARS virus that was being studied, so they don’t have a good reputation.

      Bioweapons expert Steven Hatfill said from his analysis of the genetic literature thus far on SARS-CoV-2 (the new official name for what was called the 2019-nCoV virus) that it doesn’t have bioweapon characteristics.

      Like

      • Kenney says:

        I thought this was the only site within China but I could be wrong. The interesting thing is that the bats that produce this virus were 600 km away so the lab is the likely source. The research is for medical purposes trying to get cures and patents. They were sloppy as one worker admitted to getting blood and bat urine on his person. That alone tells a story of carelessness as this shouldn’t even be possible. As a weapon the reason it is not useful is, well we can see the reason.

        Like

    • Yvain says:

      The high level comment was made recently by Wu Yuanshan, a minister from the Ministry of Science and Technology on the 15th. He’s speaking to Chinese research groups and pharmaceutical companies and emphasizing the importance of biosafety protocols during the course of development, as seen here in a report from the Beijing Daily (this is “more” CCP direct control versus less).

      http://www.bjd.com.cn/a/202002/15/WS5e47b91de4b0094948680efe.html

      I’m not saying that a leak is impossible, but the current (latest) social media outbreak buzz in China pertaining to this theory is a graduate student working in the virology institute is patient zero during the coronavirus outbreak, about half a day after the report above went public. The claim is basically her poor practices caused the virus to leak out, and so far the aforementioned media in my post below are the ones that managed to pick it up.

      This “leak” is complicated by a few factors. First, someone claiming to be the student in question have came out on social media and said she graduated in 2015 and therefore wasn’t anywhere around Wuhan during the outbreak, and Chinese netizens dug around the supposed virology institute’s graduate student list and found no such person.

      My inclination is that it is possible that it was a leak as a result of poor practices, but I think given the degree of narrative manipulation that is on-going across the entire world, it’s not likely that we’ll ever find out. China stands to lose the most internationally and domestically if it was indeed from a lab or a bioweapon as some people think.

      Like

      • Zippy says:

        His comment has very interesting timing don’t you think? And with China’s past reputation with SARS leaks, I’m not giving them even the slightest benefit of the doubt.

        Also, the Chinese allegedly destroyed the wet market where the outbreak was claimed to have originated without doing proper analysis of its animals or so at least as far as -WE- know because they haven’t shared the data. I read a microbiologist’s complaint about that and the fact that that and the fact that the Chinese aren’t sharing their level 4 lab data will prevent anyone (other than perhaps the Chinese) from ever proving the original source of the virus.

        And all of that really doesn’t matter anyway. We just need to make sure it doesn’t gain a foothold here.

        Like

        • Yvain says:

          Indeed. From anecdotal observations, many Chinese-Americans (I hate hyphen-American, but I think it’s important to realize that ethnic enclaves are a thing) and Chinese nationals living in the US are very fearful of the developing situation. If anything they believe we (the US) aren’t doing enough to protect America. That, since I’m not directly involved as a healthcare professional, I can’t really gauge.

          On the scientific front, however, I am more than satisfied with how fast researchers are making progress on the simple basis of the speed to which we’re solving this matter relative to other diseases.

          BSL 4 labs frequently deal with matters specifically pertaining to national security, so I’m not surprised that the Chinese aren’t sharing that data. Entertainingly, I think from our perspective as scientists (at least in my own social circle), we view the situation in reverse. That’s to say, a lot of shoddy data is being shared because everyone wants to publish first in academia, and the Chinese are being “too” transparent. 😛 Between that Indian HIV paper, that German study that “misspoke”, the Harvard anti-Trump professor jumping at conclusions (sidenote: at the time where he deleted his tweets, he was obviously wrong, but as time go on, eh, maybe he’s more right than wrong), or people now intentionally distorting scientific publications to meet their own ends on our social media…

          I think for us, the issue isn’t whether or not it gains a foothold here. It’s already here, and the only thing left to see is how we handle this matter. The US is one of the first to impose strict travel limitations and advisories, and the CDC had explicitly mentioned that its strategy was “better safe than sorry” during those early days. Contrast the Trump administration’s response relative to say, Trudeau’s up north or Japan (which is where I’d actually worry if I was in charge of the WHO at this point), and I’m hoping that we’re doing enough.

          Or, in other words, if this does end up being a globe-shaking event that destroys the modern world, I wouldn’t fault our President – our “experts,” after all, were testifying in the House a couple of weeks ago not only telling us to keep our borders open, but China should also not quarantine its population and await for international assistance 😛

          But, if the situation here isn’t dire and is kept under control in the US, then I do hope we’re prepared to deal with what comes next. I’ve seen, rather alarmingly, social media platforms removing content deemed to be “unscientific.” Considering how liberal a lot of my colleagues are, I don’t think I need to say more.

          Like

          • Zippy says:

            “Between that Indian HIV paper”

            Yeah, Steven Hatfill blew that up immediately saying a number of viruses have HIV-like characteristics referred to in that paper.

            “It’s already here, and the only thing left to see is how we handle this matter.”

            If it is to any substantial extent and is spreading in a “silent epidemic” as Steven Hatfill called it, being spread by people who think they have a mild cold or the common flu, things could get extremely bad here. Considering that China is the source of most of what we need to fight it, what happens when its us or them getting those supplies?

            Like

  42. Zippy says:

    14 Americans evacuated from cruise ship in Japan test positive for novel coronavirus
    17 Feb 2020

    https://abcnews.go.com/International/14-americans-evacuated-cruise-ship-japan-test-positive/story?id=69026322

    LONDON — More than 300 Americans who were passengers aboard a cruise ship quarantined at sea in Japan over coronavirus infections have evacuated the country on two flights chartered by the U.S. government, officials said.

    ***After*** disembarking from the Diamond Princess cruise ship, 14 of the passengers were found to be infected with the novel coronavirus, known officially as COVID-19, prior to boarding the charter planes at Tokyo International Airport on Monday. The passengers, who had been tested a couple days earlier, “were moved in the most expeditious and safe manner to a specialized containment area on the evacuation aircraft to isolate them in accordance with standard protocols,” according to a joint statement from the U.S. Department of State and the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (HHS).

    “After consultation with HHS officials, including experts from the HHS Office of the Assistant Secretary for Preparedness and Response, the State Department made the decision to allow the 14 individuals, who were in isolation, separated from other passengers, and continued to be asymptomatic, to remain on the aircraft to complete the evacuation process,” the joint statement read, noting that the individuals would continue to be isolated from the other passengers during the flights. [as isolated as you can be in big aluminum tube with recirculated air – Z] “All passengers are being closely monitored by medical professionals throughout the flight, and any who become symptomatic will be moved to the specialized containment area, where they will be treated.”

    Like

    • Zippy says:

      “the novel coronavirus, known officially as COVID-19”

      NO, the DISEASE is called COVID-19. The virus now has the official name SARS-CoV-2 because of it similarities to SARS, formerly 2019-nCoV.

      Like

  43. Yvain says:

    I’ve been reading the Treehouse for a long time, but whenever I try to comment, my comments for some reason won’t come through. I’d like to try again because I genuinely find the perspectives valuable, and as the lone conservative in a collegeful of liberals, you guys are a rare spot of sanity keeping me sane these days.

    This coronavirus thing is very complicated because it’s important to note that nobody (including the Chinese) knows what’s going on. In my experience, western sources (am fluent in mandarin and knows where to look) tend to only pick up either the “official” PRC ran sources, or the alternatives coming out of obviously anti-PRC groups. Both have explicit narratives that want to push. Both are also rather far from what actually goes around in popular Chinese social media platforms such as WeChat or Zhihu, and this is with explicit observation of PRC censors at work.

    For instance, I’ve noticed that a lot of people here are linking to stuff like the Epoch Times or New Tang Dynasty. Ignoring the fact that they’re founded by Falun Gong adherents which obviously have a bone to pick with the PRC, a lot of what they push in their Chinese language media publications (emphasis mine) looks straight out of CNN with the same brand of identity politics, SJW-ery, and entertainingly enough, “globalist” perspectives. The only difference is that they also happen to be anti-PRC. I am not saying that the information they provide isn’t valuable. Just that, these biases exist, and people should be aware of them.

    I don’t think Sen. Cotton is wrong to tell everyone we should treat the coronavirus seriously, nor do I think it’s fearmongering (a casual glance at social media), but if you look at CDC’s response so far, we’ve been “taking it seriously” since China first shared the information with us. We’ve so far managed to isolate and grow this virus in cell culture, and people like me (my PhD is actually in genetics, so “close enough” :P) can look at it for ourselves.

    Finally, the media is under-reporting this because it can’t hurt Trump (yet). The US is one of the first to limit travel, and if you look at how we’re mobilizing resources (CDC posting daily updates, major research centers and hospitals coordinating, military getting notified to prepare in case something happens), there’s not much meat there. I guarantee you if this becomes widespread in the US they’ll be running this in the hopes of unseating him come November.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Ad rem says:

      Welcome to the Treehouse Yvain! 😀

      Like

    • lolli says:

      Awesome post Yvain. 👍
      I agree.

      Look at the preparation occurring.
      Word has it FEMA is preparing, also.

      It is here, common sense tells us that.
      (1k illegal Chinese a month pass through El Paso, foreign exchange students had already returned, holiday travel was going on during the outbreak)

      No one, at this time is being tested for it unless you have been to China recently. Even if you have the symptoms.
      I don’t see how we miss.

      Also in regards to your posts not showing up;
      Make sure you have successfully refreshed your page before thinking a post did not go through. Not sure if that is your situation, but that’s what I have noticed.

      Like

      • Zippy says:

        “I don’t see how we miss.”

        I agree.

        It may infect asymptotically (thought to be confirmed in a German study which was found to be faulty), but the fact that 80% will think they just have a mild common cold leads to easy spread and is why it is shown in that video I posted above that Chinese authorities require the personal data on people buying cold and cough meds at the point of purchase. That’s so they can pay them a visit.

        Fecal transmission is confirmed and toilet venting in an HK apartment is suspected for one infection transfer. Massive post-recovery (or postmortem, like Ebola) viral load has been found, but they don’t know yet if it remains infectious. That’s probably behind the Chinese health authorities ordering ASAP cremation of bodies.

        Also, in a study of 138 cases in a Chinese hospital it was found that 41%(!) of those found to be infected contracted it -IN- the hospital. So, you have the COMMON flu or some other medical problem, you go to your GP or a hospital and get COVID-19 from someone else there who actually has it.

        Like

    • Zippy says:

      “western sources (am fluent in mandarin and knows where to look) tend to only pick up either the “official” PRC ran sources, or the alternatives coming out of obviously anti-PRC groups.”

      I read English translations of Chinese medical studies as released. I also read western-sourced medical studies. PERIOD.

      Like

      • Yvain says:

        Thanks guys. The refresh thing seems to do the trick.

        Zippy, I’m posting because I thought your posts were (and are) remarkably clear and helpful, but I thought maybe the CTH can use another perspective that can get to the source material – especially the stuff that blurs the lines between scientific information and news. So if my comment up there you viewed as some kind of an attack, I apologize as it definitely wasn’t my intention.

        Like

  44. Brian says:

    Coronavirus bombshell: ‘REAL cause’ of outbreak claim – Chinese scientists break cover
    =====================================================================
    https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1242801/coronavirus-lab-leak-chinese-pathogen-laboratory-scientists-wuhan-wet-market-bioweapon

    Like

  45. richq11 says:

    The “gravest” part of this is that the medicine needed to combat this comes from China!

    Like

  46. stenwin77 says:

    Our Communist enemy making our drugs. What could go wrong ?

    Like

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