Iran Shoots Down $123 Million U.S. Unmanned Aircraft – President Trump: “Iran Made A Very Big Mistake”…

Iran didn’t just shoot down a simple ‘drone’, Iran used a surface-to-air missile to shot down one of the most technologically advance U.S. aircraft costing $123 million; more than the price of an F-35 stealth fighter jet.

The targeted aircraft was a US Navy Broad Area Maritime Surveillance (BAMS-D); a RQ-4A Global Hawk high-altitude long endurance (HALE) drone, flying in international airspace over the Gulf of Oman.

“The RQ-4 flies at upwards of 65,000 feet,” Tyler Rogoway, the editor of The War Zone, wrote. “So this would have been a sophisticated radar-guided surface-to-air missile that shot the aircraft down, not a shoulder-fired, heat-seeking missile.”

(Business Insider)The US military called the incident “an unprovoked attack on a US surveillance asset in international airspace” over the Strait of Hormuz, the entrance to the Persian Gulf. The Iranians have accused the US drone of entering Iranian airspace, an allegation Central Command characterized as completely false.

President Trump responds below:

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428 Responses to Iran Shoots Down $123 Million U.S. Unmanned Aircraft – President Trump: “Iran Made A Very Big Mistake”…

  1. ristvan says:

    Just checked. The War Powers Act of 1973, 50USC1541-1548 enables PDJT to respond with military force if US or its armed forces are attacked. The Navy was attacked. Congress must be notified with 48 hours, and the action can last no longer than 60 days unless congress passes an ongoing ‘authority to use military force’ or AUMF. Congress is being briefed this afternoon.

    It is likely there will be a limited military response. PDJT as much as said so. It is unacceptable to have two tankers attacked by Iran in international waters last week, and then shoot down a Navy surveillance drone (on watch to prevent a repeat) this week. Some proportionate military response to IRNG needs to be made to have them stop. Bully needs its nose bloodied, but not more.

    Liked by 28 people

    • Great comment, but the U.S. response does need to be about five times stronger than the initial acts of Iranian terrorism. Somewhere between a bloody nose and a full-scale hospitalization. I am thinking more like a seriously busted knee cap.

      Liked by 12 people

      • jeff montanye says:

        because iran wants to make it easier for the u.s. to attack them, they made tiny attacks on little oil tankers. that’s just common sense.

        Liked by 2 people

    • The Demon Slick says:

      Hit the oil! My gold is already up $50 an ounce today. My bitcoin is 9400 per up $200 per unit. Even my silver is up 50 cents an ounce. Stocks are BOOM as well. I made a lot of money today while I was sleeping. I don’t want war but the media hysteria is good for business.

      Like

    • Bonitabaycane says:

      This situation is not a simple analogy of a bully.

      Iran is a terrorist, maniacal regime that seemingly wants to draw us into war in the Middle East.

      I have total faith in our VSGPDJT that he is strong enough to defend this country, but not foolish to take anyone’s “bait” to draw us unnecessarily into war.

      Liked by 6 people

      • swissik says:

        I wish I had your faith but as long as Bolton, Graham and others whisper in the President’s ear…..who knows what. That group is itching for war and so are those powers that be who make lots of money off the war machine. It is enough to make a skunk vomit.

        Like

      • Lamont Cranston says:

        Xenophon’s “Anabasis” chronicles the relentless assaults against Greece by the “barbarians” (Persians). That was many centuries ago and the “barbarians” will never stop until all civilization is destroyed. They are playing a very long game.
        (BTW: We studied Xenophon in original classical Greek language for 2 full semesters during my sophomore year of prep school)

        Like

    • Sofa King says:

      EVERYONE:
      Why was Japan meeting with Iran when tankers were attacked??? Being intermediary for Trump?
      I smell a rat! Either:
      1. Iran’s leadership doesn’t have control over their Revolutionary Guard, who doesn’t want a new deal, or;
      2. OUR military/”intelligence” bueracracy doesn’t want peace, and just happened to be filming the Iranians recovering their mines.
      REMEMBER: If we go to war, it will NOT be limited to Iran, it will NOT be quick, “clean” and easy, and all efforts at justice here in America for the Spygate conspirators will fade away, barely a slap on the wrist administered. Mark my words.

      Someone is trying to stir up trouble as the counter-investigation closes in….

      Liked by 14 people

      • >”Someone is trying to stir up trouble as the counter-investigation closes in….”<

        Makes sense to me.

        Liked by 12 people

      • Petrel says:

        Sofa King — Probably option 2. Iran was busily wooing the Europeans to support Obama’s nuclear agreement and had invited Japanese Prime Minister Abe as a go-between to open talks with President Trump.

        By the time Abe arrived, the Japanese and Norwegian tankers were mysteriously shot and — absent real proof — Bolton was pointing the finger at Iran, even as the ship owners disputed with us about what really happened.

        In Middle Eastern culture dis-respect to a guest is a no-no. The idea that Iran’s spiritual leader, the Ayatollah, would countenance an attack a Japanese ship while Abe came to visit is a non-starter.

        Liked by 3 people

        • sysconfig says:

          I believe Trump did it right rather than be suckered into an action that would make Iran his baby as Libya was Hillarys and Iraq was Bushs. When he said it was a general or staff that made a bad call and not intentionally…that is sign of a level head. Bolton and pompeo should be the ones to inherit these fiascos..because there is another hand pushing for this conflict..Iran has nothing to gain..I hope Trump fires them at some time..

          Liked by 2 people

          • David L Kohler says:

            Well said.

            Like

          • Mariainohio says:

            I think the same. It seems like everyone is trying to goad him into war. As long as he plays the “Aw shucks, someone just made a mistake” strategy, he will drive the war mongers nuts. I honestly believe that he will continue this until Iran commits such a hostile act that it cannot be ignored as an act of war or the cast of characters pushing for war and advising Iran ( Hillary, Kerry, Obama, congress) goes insane. He’s just toying with them. He knows what they’ve all been up to.

            Liked by 1 person

        • DaveK says:

          Don’t forget that Russia massively benefits if oil prices spike. Putin would love for a shooting war to start in the gulf, and even more so if the US becomes directly involved.

          Like

        • dallasdan says:

          “The idea that Iran’s spiritual leader, the Ayatollah, would countenance an attack a Japanese ship while Abe came to visit is a non-starter.”

          This is consistent with the President’s feeling that a rogue element in Iran did the work, and it was not ordered by the Ayatollah.

          Like

        • Murray Smith says:

          ?

          Like

      • Heika says:

        Try this on and you start to get the idea. I am not an Iran Fan, but still… there are 2-3 countries in the area that gain massively if USA goes to war with Iran. However, this is a glimpse into how it is being shoved along. Bolton is one of the egotistical pieces of trash in the world, and Trump is starting to see it. Trouble is, the vested interests are no where near the death and carnage that will result. Trouble is being ‘invented’, and its not by Iran. They are not idiots. Here Trump has seen through Bolton on the Venez business.
        https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-06-20/frustrated-trump-sours-venezuela-regime-change-after-bolton-got-played

        This recent interview is well worth watching. Wallace with Iran’s foreign minister. Its always interesting to see what the ‘other side’ says in a rational context – whether you believe it or not. Stay educated, not blind with rage. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scuBPjcjufU

        Liked by 2 people

        • Sofa King says:

          I’m so glad I found the Treehouse.
          Zerohedge doom-porn never panned out and made a liar of me for years.

          Liked by 2 people

          • GB Bari says:

            I, too, learned to ignore ZH’s “doom porn” (great description, BTW). Waste of internet space.

            Liked by 3 people

          • yucki says:

            If you follow the links to some of ZH’s articles, you’ll find yourself in a Russian info op.
            “Strategic Culture”, “Voltaire”, Pepe Escobar.
            “Mint Press”, “CounterPunch”. “Unz” and “The Saker” [Putin-flavored Russian Orthodox].
            Kooks and has-beens, antique fixtures of the red professoriate, like Noam Chomsky and Stephen Cohen.

            notthattheresanythingwrongwiththat
            …necessarily.
            Anti-EU, pro-Brexit, anti-Nato.

            +++ DEFEATIST propaganda, brought to you by the world’s best, ever. Da, Tovarish.
            Relentless pessimism, any day, every day. Crafty blend of fact and fiction that manages to trend consistently bitter, bleak, down.

            Get a hit of “libertarian”-flavored enemy: globalist-banksters-neocons, we’re-being-had by you-know-who. Let’s disarm, curl up in the fetal position.

            Breathe deeply…. pretend you didn’t miss the historic bull market because you ingested this enemy bull shi’ite.

            Breathe deeply…. float on these toxic fumes, you may not feel a thing….

            Liked by 2 people

      • Ben D says:

        I call False Flag…aka Crisis Initiation… https://youtu.be/Y6LKmhDRWFc

        Like

    • KnowSERENoFear says:

      War Powers Act unconstitutionally transfers powers from the Legislature to the Executive. Therefore the Act is unconstitutional…and therefore unlawful. “Limited military response” is arbitrary…arbitrary has no place in war…arbitrary got us Vietnam, war on drugs, Iraq, 18+ years in Afghanistan with no end in sight.

      Agree that Iran attacked US. So let Congress do it’s job and declare war. I, for one am tired of POTUS doing the work of Congress…and then if there is positive public opinion, Congress supports….if not, they dissent. A bunch of bull. We the People decide war though our Representatives – realtime.

      We may “like” that the current POTUS can respond militarily…but we won’t “like” it when Biden can do it. See the problem? How will we like it when Congress passes the “We Are A Socialist Country Act of 2019?” Would we expect President Trump to dutifully follow such a law?

      Our Founders often said (based on considerable prior experience) that taxes, war, and debt always lead to the corruption and death of a country. IMHO – they were very wise.

      Liked by 3 people

      • ristvan says:

        Lurking Lawyer here.
        Nope. You may think so, but as a long settled matter of constitutional law it doesn’t. In fact, if you read its legislative history the War Powers Act was intended to LIMIT Presidential A2s2.1 Commander in Chief powers otherwise inferable. Just checked. Wiki has a decent nontechnical explanation.

        And as a general comment for all Treepers: Administrative (federal) law is a full year 3L HLS course. It deals with the many complexities of Congress using its A1s8 powers to delegate details to the A2s1.1 Executive power of the President. When that is proper, when it isn’t, and if proper what legislative oversight means. I took it and got an A.

        The notion that Congress cannot delegate A1s8 at all leads to utter legislative gridlock. This was recognized during the time of George Washington as President, Jefferson as his SoS, and first Chief Justice John Jay. Since they all helped write the Constitution, one can safely assume their interpretation then was and remains correct.

        Liked by 9 people

        • KnowSERENoFear says:

          Nope not buying it. From a lawyers perspective – an institution that has endeavored to pervert our Constitution since 1789 – I’m sure your correct. No way did our Framers intend the POTUS to have the authority to arbitrarily commit to war for 60 days. George Washington, in particular, would have been absolutely against it. Many letters written between Founders and dialogue in both the Federalist and anti-Federalist papers specifically say that power and authority of the federal was specifically enumerated in the constitution – in fact, they said that it was RIDICULOUS to assume that the feds power extended beyond what was written in the Constitution….otherwise, why list them at all.

          Our Constitution begins with We the People…NOT we the lawyers….nor WE the Legislature…nor I the President. WE hold the power. Administrative law was abhorred by our Founders. So Congress can pass a law and deem us a socialist country and lawyers will defer to legal positivism and the incorporation doctrine? NO WAY! The States created, via ratification, the Constitution…the Constitution created the Federal government with LIMITED powers…and included the Ten Amendment SPECIFICALLY to stifle a strong central government. The federal government is the CREATURE of the several sovereign States AND WE the People. And NO law can change that.

          I’m sure that lawyers must take a “Constitutional law” class. And I have no doubt that you received and “A.” Your Constitutional law class taught you that Federal law is supreme. That is FALSE. If the States created the Federal government to act in a LIMITED capacity on their behalf in matters of foreign relations, then how can that government become supreme over it’s creators? Did your class delve into the 800 years of tyranny by the English ruling class over their subjects? Did it discuss how the British ruling class consistently used the “law and courts” to subjugate the peasants? Did it explore the birth of Magna Carta and how the English ruling class ignored it’s tenants “for the security of the people?”

          Congress can NOT transfer power from one branch to another. PERIOD. What – shall the Executive make laws now? ….shall the Judicial decide healthcare? …shall the Legislature put citizens on trial? OH WAIT…they do!…And what a mess they’ve made of it.

          “Utter legislative gridlock”….EXACTLY…Our Founders NEVER intended for their to be 12,000+ laws passed by Congress. They wanted law to be very difficult to create at the federal level. Laws were to be left to LOCAL governments….States, Counties, and cities…if one didn’t like them, then one could move. Instead, we are left at the mercy of a corrupt, intrusive, central government that is no different than the government of our Founders before 1776.

          To say they wrote the Constitution means our Founders interpretations were correct? What does that even mean? Their interpretations of the Constitution are found in the ratification debates, the Federalist papers, Anti Federalist papers, and letters to each other….and from those, you will find NOTHING that would indicate that any of the Founders wanted a strong central government, with arbitrary authority to just transfer power from one branch to another, with a President that could make war on a whim.

          Like I stated earlier, I am NOT saying that Iran should be left unchecked….quite the contrary….they should suffer consequences for their actions. BUT if those consequences include war or sanctions, then we must follow the Constitution and follow the enumerated process. Congress MUST be held to do their job – “regulate commerce with foreign governments” and “declare war.” The POTUS has enough on his plate. Congress, once again, is simply setting up President Trump to take the fall in order to discredit his 2020 campaign.

          Liked by 3 people

    • Esther says:

      Trump needs to get the technology back or completely destroy it and all who have had contact with it. A surgeon’s knife in part, and a public trouncing. There are people trained for this, but the Israeli’s do it best.

      John Bolton WHERE ARE YOU? You’ve been gunning for war and failing badly, like with Venezuela. Who is in this plot with you? We’re going to be watching all of you traitors very closely. We will scrutinize everything you say and all your body language. And NONE OF THIS WILL STOP THE DECLASS.

      Liked by 3 people

    • Adam says:

      Iran is short of cash, so we want to go in and break the expensive stuff, the stuff which will cost billions to rebuild. Ultimately, the goal is to get them to abandon their regional (and global) ambitions.

      Like

  2. keeler says:

    Pay attention to any changes in shipping traffic, especially the oil tankers… when nations begin recalling their merchant marines, something big is in the works.

    A significant draw-down in, or detouring of commercial traffic away from, the Hormuz routes would be a strong indicator of the severity of any potential responses.

    Also bear in mind that such a draw-down or detour may take several weeks.

    Liked by 1 person

    • bertdilbert says:

      We can block Iranian oil and let Saudi make some money so they can buy more US military equipment and create US jobs.

      Liked by 2 people

      • McGuffin says:

        JustScott – I’ve never seen such a map as this marinetraffic map that you posted. Wow!

        The CTH posters are by far the most intelligent that I’ve run across in all of the “internets”! I learn something every single day from you other birds in the tree.

        Liked by 8 people

      • VegGOP says:

        Fascinating live map. I could not find a key that explains the meaning of the colors.

        Like

      • keeler says:

        Yep.

        As I said, it would be probably take some time to implement any drawdown in traffic. We’re talking about a massive, slow-moving, globe-spanning supply chain that would need to be redirected without any significant disruption of that supply chain. Such a move might not be possible, but if it is it will take some time to adjust operations.

        Any noticeable changes in traffic volume would suggest possible American actions will either surpass the intensity and scale of tactical strikes (such as those on Syrian airfields) or are expected to elicit an Iranian response of a similar level.

        Conversely, a lack of volume change would suggest an anticipated status quo.

        Like

      • yucki says:

        This map fiend loves it!

        Like

  3. bessie2003 says:

    As it would be in the interests of all the nations in that region, since it is their oil that is being shipped out, is it possible that members of the Gulf Cooperative Council (the GCC), in coordination with support, perhaps logistics, from the United States mount an appropriate response to what the Iranians are now proudly boasting they (and not some rogue military person within the Iranian military as President Trump generously offered them to use as an out) were responsible for, thus limiting our own nation’s involvement (removing an easy propaganda target for the Iranian regime, us being the devil and all) while simultaneously working to strengthen the ability of this GCC to make their mark for defense of their region?

    Liked by 6 people

    • jeff montanye says:

      wonder how long a chinese or russian drone in the “international waters” half way between cuba and the u.s. would last. yeah. let’s go to war. it’s worked so well the last half dozen times. wait dozen times.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Orygun says:

      My thoughts exactly! There was good reason to start off his Presidency with a visit to the GCC. He was letting them know this bad actor is on their turf and is their problem. I would expect a joint operation with the GCC.
      This makes the arms sale even more necessary and might have something to do with the Iranian behavior.

      Liked by 2 people

  4. joeknuckles says:

    IMHO, Iran could be trying to provoke a conflict in order to turn public opinion against the current administration and help get their preferred party, the Democrats, back in the White House so they can have their way with them.

    Liked by 6 people

  5. SHV says:

    I’m old enough to remember Gulf of Tonkin and much later hearing C-Span play the WH tapes Oval Office discussion during the “event’, so I have a jaded perspective. However, despite some comments that I have read, the US is not Petroleum independent; IIRC, we now produce about 1/2 of our needs and import about 10 million barrels of oil per DAY, so I don’t think PDJT can let the straits be closed and let other countries deal with the problem.

    Like

    • The Demon Slick says:

      We have enough capacity to be completely energy independent. Many thousands of wells are capped and idle right now because they are not profitable right now. If the price of oil goes up, they become profitable, and can be tapped very quickly. It’s all there for us, just waiting.

      Liked by 1 person

      • mike says:

        Uncompleted wells that deplete pretty fast. WAG, we might average 1-2 million bopd extra for 6 months.

        Like

        • SHV says:

          Read that the bottle neck of pipe line capacity out of the Permian Basin is going to improve over the next few months/year and as you say may increase production by 1-2 million bpd. Perhaps the biggest payoff is to get the damn pipe line infra-structure from Western Canada built. We now get 99% of Canada’s petroleum exports ~3.4 million bpd. We are the only market for that tar sand stuff and I suspect that Canada would be happy to produce all that we want. It’s just transporting and refining it.

          Liked by 2 people

      • GeoNC says:

        This is just plain nonsense from someone who knows nothing about the oil business. No company shuts in a well capable of generating positive cash flow. In a low price scenario that would only be an old stripper well capable of less than 10 BOPD. Each state has its own regulatory agency and they all require a permit to shut in a well for longer than a year and then you are ordered to plug or produce. A few thousand wells at a handful of barrels per day each isn’t even decimal dust with the country approaching 10 million a day.

        Liked by 1 person

  6. Jeff C-C says:

    The best picture of what Iran wants is in the movie, “The Life of Brian.” One of the revolutionaries is thrown into the colosseum with a huge, heavily armored gladiator. He’s got no chance, just this skinny, unprotected guy. So he starts running. The heavily armored gladiator runs after him. They run and run until the gladiator has a heart attack. Our scrawny hero takes the gladiator’s sword and kills him. He starts jumping around with the sword, “I won, I won!”

    Osama bin Laden had the same idea. Attack the US and provoke a massively expensive response, then let us bleed ourselves dry.

    Liked by 2 people

    • TarsTarkas says:

      I don’t think things turned out exactly the way Osama expected. Nor is POTUS silly putty in the hands of any ‘neocons’. There won’t be a land war, anyone who’s been in the Zagros or the high plateaus knows that they’re a guerrilla soldier’s dream. Like Afghanistan only lower. IMO expect considerable erosion of the Iranian navy, including destruction of the infrastructure needed to keep it supplied and afloat. Also total financial warfare including hacking, malware, also a total boycott of any institution still foolish enough to help out the mullahs. It won’t be fire off a few missiles and declare victory.

      Liked by 7 people

  7. rustybritches says:

    If you just watch Iran and see what they are doing they run from being in denial to We are ready for War and We are sending a message to the US Well what is the message from them, They shot down a Drone and it was a very expensive on and they managed to put big holes in two tankers and so far all I see is OBAMA’S FINGERS ALL OVER THIS MESS WITH IRAN AND
    Obama and Karry needs to be arrested and put in Gitmo until this mess is all over
    Biden and the dems can say that all the Dems are ahead of Our President and that’s ok
    they said the same thing in 2016 and in the end we won and we will win again
    President Trump is number ONE and none of these other people can hold a candle to him
    I just pray that they don’t get away with cheating again.. please lord blow all the dems away with a gentle breeze and send them all where they belong

    Liked by 10 people

  8. TazioNuvolari says:

    It’s crazy how so many are judging President Trump as if he is GW Bush. Have faith in the man. He is not going to get us into some protracted war.

    Liked by 14 people

    • Luke of the D says:

      I am with you. The war hawks, here on the Treehouse and elsewhere, seem to be forgetting who we are dealing with. President Trump is not GlobalWar Bush or the Bombin’ Obamin’. President Trump is a strategic businessman, not a war hawk. He has proven that time and time again. And everyone should keep focused: Iran shot down a drone… and expensive drone, but a drone. There will absolutely be a response, but will it be a crushing military engagement with Iran? Why would you expect that from President Trump when he has never once acted in that manner? Bluff, sanction, punish, threaton… yes absolutely! But bombs away? Hardly.

      Liked by 2 people

      • TazioNuvolari says:

        We have to keep in mind there are those inside the government, and also in these comments, who are determined to take President Trump down. They are out to separate him from his base. I’m with him no matter what decision he makes.

        Those who are here to sow seeds of dissension and cause President Trump’s supporters to turn on him can go tell their handlers it is not going to work. We are not going to vote for one of those batshit crazy Democrats no matter what.

        Liked by 8 people

      • Esther says:

        The warhawks on CTH are not who they pretend to be. They have come to CTH as one of the last remaining really conservative sites after working their thing on others, getting them shut down etc. Hopefully the monitors here are keeping an eye on the trend. There is a pattern to how they infiltrate and they are ramping up to sow dissent and distractions.

        Liked by 2 people

      • One of the main reasons I supported Trump is he is not a war hawk.

        Liked by 2 people

  9. Luke of the D says:

    Question: Why would Iran take down a US drone in international airspace? What is their goal? To be annihilated? Assuming this was Iran who shot the drone down, there are only two goals I can think of: 1) They want to prove to the world that the USA is not invincible by provoking us and defeating us in war or 2) They want to die.

    Per point 1, they really don’t need to prove we are invincible (we are not… see 9/11), so why bother?
    Per point 2, I get that the Islamic Republic of Iran is suicidal to a large degree, but that cannot be the goal can it?

    I am no expert on strategic military action, but what am I missing? Why would Iran take down our drone in international airspace?

    Liked by 6 people

    • Best comment so far IMO.

      Liked by 1 person

    • benifranlkin says:

      That’s why PTrump said it must have been a mistake. Only an idiot would have done it.

      Liked by 4 people

    • TarsTarkas says:

      IMO they’re trying to rally the people around the flag. A la Gaultieri with the Falklands. And if Michael Foote had been PM it might have worked. Unfortunately for the Argentinian generals it wasn’t. Within the year they were out, and Thatcher, who had seemed destined for a single term in office, would go on to be one of the longest-serving PM’s in British history.

      Like

    • Zorro says:

      You forgot the quest for 72 virgins option.

      Liked by 1 person

    • freespeechfanatic says:

      They believe, I suspect, that Trump might be politically vulnerable due to his rescission of the Iran Deal, that this event will lead to political pressure to reconsider sanctions. They have also been probably been hearing from Obama’s people, who may think that they can provoke Trump into some flat-footed response that will hurt him. Gross misreadings of Trump, but that should not be surprising.

      Liked by 3 people

      • There is certainly no “political vulnerability” concerning that stupid “deal,” and as Iran’s stupid and reckless comments about this subject continue to mount, perhaps the naive Europeans will finally realize what DT knew implicitly: that this was “appeasement” all along.

        If you simply want “a peaceful civilian nuclear power generation program,” you can buy ready-to-use nuclear fuel for whatever reactor system you have installed. You have no reason whatsoever to want “centrifuges” and to refine the metal yourself. With every passing day, Iran makes it more and more clear that this “deal” was an obvious feint.

        As the country becomes more and more belligerent – “and now this!” – it’s not entirely obvious (to me) what is the best thing to do next. Perverse as it may seem, Iran might want something military to happen, if only to take attention off the crushing economic sanctions. It’s obvious that they are attempting to be provocateurs. So the question becomes what to give them – how to respond.

        Like

        • Rhoda R says:

          Overt reaction by the US might take the wind out of the sails of Irani citizens who want to oust the Ayatollahs and return to a more stable form of government.

          Like

        • MaIneCoon says:

          Oddly it just brought to mind that rocket man kept launching rockets untilhe got what he wanted — a meeting with U.S. President – Trump. IIRC O ignored him and wouldn’t give him the time of day. But, what does Komeni want? Said last week he wouldn’t meet with POTUS. Must want what POTUS took away? They hate us. Rocketman didn’t seem to hate us.

          Like

    • JT says:

      Its just a drone.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Robert Smith says:

      2) they do have a death cult running the place

      Like

    • Sentient says:

      Maybe it wasn’t in international air space. Maybe it was in Iranian air space – sent there by US war hawks who wanted and expected it to be shot down, and maybe they’re telling the world – and the president – that it was in international air space.

      Liked by 1 person

  10. MVW says:

    Trump has shown the ability to get his point across economically. No doubt he has more and very significant sanctions that can be initiated unless Iran makes reparations, either official or unofficial.

    Iran’s rhetoric also needs to be changed. As Trump said, we will see…

    Liked by 2 people

    • MVW says:

      The mistake Iran made is that these aggressive actions will enable Trump to do more extreme sanctions that Europe fought against. This is the same ‘quick sand’ strategy. The more these idiots fight and struggle, the more they get sucked down. We are about to see Iran’s nose go under the water line.

      Liked by 8 people

    • bertdilbert says:

      Perfect Timing. When Trump meets with Xi, he can tell him “I just blocked Iranian oil.” It will be just like the last time when he announced at dinner we were attacking Syria. Except this time, China is the biggest buyer of Iranian oil…. tic tic tic

      Liked by 1 person

      • SHV says:

        “China is the biggest buyer of Iranian oil…. tic tic tic”
        ****
        Perhaps not the leverage is once was, PDJT has already squeezed Iranian oil exports down to 500-700,000 bpd, mostly to India and China; China’s share is a drop in the bucket compared to their needs.

        Like

  11. pochas94 says:

    If we’re not up for a fight, then our time on this earth as a sovereign nation is written. But if Trump thinks Iran can be made to behave, then I can go along.

    Like

  12. Marc says:

    Right now, I don’t know who to believe. That’s how weak the word of our intel community and top brass is these days. Has Japan confirmed yet that it was Iran that attacked their ship?

    Liked by 2 people

  13. Texian says:

    The point of no return has commenced.. The wheels of the U.S. Government Military Machine have begun to turn. EAM sent to U.S. Forces worldwide.. (Where’s my helmet..! )

    Meanwhile, back at the slot machine..
    Gold is up $30, Silver is up .30..

    Like

  14. WES says:

    It is in Europe that Iran can be hurt further.

    Iran is acting tough because of increased confidence derived from China and Russia.

    Liked by 1 person

  15. sunnyflower5 says:

    Dems- “Iran is being provocative because President Trump ended Obama’s deal”…….Didn’t a group of our sailors get taken before the “ Death to America” Regime made a deal with Obama? Who were the Dems blaming back then?

    Liked by 3 people

  16. frank field says:

    A “mistake” they will pay for.

    Guaranteed.

    Trump for Rushmore

    Liked by 1 person

  17. Mark McQueen says:

    I predict Iran is about to lose at least one SAM site and probably a radar installation or 2.

    Liked by 2 people

  18. Jim S. says:

    People should consider that if we attack Iran, they *could* shower our military bases in Qatar, Kuwait, Iraq and Afghanistan (not to mention Israel) with Surface-to-surface missiles (Scud-types plus IRBMs which use Russian/N. Korean tech) and potentially kill thousands of US military personnel.

    I’m not advocating for or against an attack, although I have an opinion. Just be aware that this could happen whether we like it or not.

    Iranian proxy attacks from Yemen onto Saudi Arabia, which uses our SAM systems, do get through air defenses.

    Another point, is that this could escalate very quickly.

    I don’t know if all of this has been pointed out below. I did read most of the comments.

    One fact about this drone. It’s basically meant to be a U-2 replacement. It flies along the border of nations and uses a side looking SAR radar to map terrain and locate targets. Also, SAM systems radars light up to track it and that gives valuable info on where those radars are and how to avoid them. This drone is not that difficult to shoot down with the Russian S-300 SAM, which I’m pretty sure Iran possesses.

    The naval version is capable of patrolling and mapping very large areas of the ocean. This is not an attack drone.

    Like

    • Rhoda R says:

      But shooting it down does tell the US military what kind of successful or effective tracking/missile systems Iran is using.

      Liked by 3 people

    • dallasdan says:

      Yes, the potential, immediate and negative consequences are severe. However, if Iran chooses to test the President, I am confident he will crush them in ways I don’t presently understand with any certainty. It will have to be done to both maintain his credibility and to administer a clear and harsh lesson to other bad actors in the world.

      Liked by 1 person

  19. MaineCoon says:

    Kerry goes to Iran stirring up trouble for PT, same as O all over the globe. Then Iran acts aggressively last week and today. DIms would love for PT to go to war. That would be the bonanza election campaign card.

    POTUS won’t take the bait anymore than he took the Mueller-Weissman obstruction bait.

    We’re not going to war, but Iran will be brought to it’s knees. POTUS hasn’t forgotten what Iran & O did to our Marines. Revenge is coming.

    Liked by 8 people

  20. FL_GUY says:

    You know, I TRUST President Trump to do what is right for the USA, no matter what it is, I back him 100%. He knows more about what is really going on than we do.

    Liked by 12 people

    • Lack is not all says:

      Ditto. I do trust my Presidente. Never did before other Presidents. Just the opposite. Now I know we are in good hands. It was a terrible feeling during the 8 years of Obama, knowing that he hated us and our country. Now I feel that the patriot President will do the best to protect me and my family.

      Liked by 2 people

  21. JohnCarlson says:

    All those who seek to destroy Donald Trump’s reelection chances (now rather good) ought to know, and likely do, that yet another war in the Middle East is likely the surest and the shortest means to accomplish it.

    Like

  22. JAS says:

    1) The hawks are on the war path. Trump wont take the bait.
    2) It’s just a drone, no American lives lost – that is why we use them. Important point!
    3) Iran vs the USA today is proportionally in time about as powerful as Iraq vs the USA then. No contest there.
    4) Time to arm drones with extended range AGM-88 HARMs (High-speed Anti-radiation Missile). Or better yet have stealth Wild Weasels lurking close by. Take a few of their SAM sites out and it’s End of Story.
    5) In the meantime the sanctions are bleeding them dry.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Pammipoo says:

      Perhaps in addition to some SAM sites, we could take out a few key radars that overlook the route from Israel to Iran’s nuclear reactor. Not that we would actually encourage a strike like that, mind you, just happened to be there.

      Like

  23. MaineCoon says:

    “Bumble”? An “elistist” who thiks we’re stupid.

    Schumer: I told the president that these conflicts have a way of escalating. The president may not intend to go to war here, but we are worried that he and the administration may bumble into a war.— Chad Pergram (@ChadPergram) June 20, 2019

    https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js

    Liked by 3 people

  24. MrACC says:

    The vice is tightening on the deep state. What better way to take the media (as lame as they are) attention off of what’s about to go down than a “look a squirrel” war with Iran.
    President Trump knows their EVERY move. I trust him 2nd only to the Lord Jesus Christ, my savior.

    Liked by 2 people

  25. ooicu812 says:

    We have Bolton and Bolton has his useful idiots inside Iran. Who knows what the truth of this really is. Just seems really odd to me that there are so many Americans like John Kerry, Bolton, Obama. Mueller, Rockefellers DuPont who have been involved in setting up Iran to spin their Uranium. All connected to a 50 year HUGE on going business deal involving 20,000 cold war Russian missile, centrifuge’s and Uranium one. Stealing America’s resources for their personal gain. Trump needs to know a whole lot more before he acts. $123 million dollar tax paid unmanned vehicle will be worth it to these people to get Trump to screw up and out of office.

    Liked by 1 person

  26. MaineCoon says:

    McCarthy/Nunes/Thornberry/McCaul after Iran briefing: There must be a measured response to these actions. President Trump and his national security team remain clear-eyed on the situation and what must be done in response to increased Iranian aggression.— Chad Pergram (@ChadPergram) June 20, 2019

    https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js

    Liked by 3 people

  27. MaineCoon says:

    NEW: U.S. military releases map showing flight path of U.S. drone before it was shot down over the Strait of Hormuz (illustration as released by the Pentagon) pic.twitter.com/vjyVJZKZrx— BNO News (@BNONews) June 20, 2019

    https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js

    Liked by 1 person

    • MaineCoon says:

      This is a new photo reflecting a map of the strait and the path of our drone.

      Liked by 1 person

      • WSB says:

        MC, after you post your link, remove the ‘mobile.’ Right up to the // when you post…no space in between, The tweet and graphics should come through. This rectifies the difference between desktop and mobile devices on these forums. Remember to remove the dot as well. I am trying it now…

        Liked by 1 person

  28. mtk says:

    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/situation-room-briefing-on-iran-crisis-concludes-as-mcconnell-says-measured-response-coming

    How is for a measured responce.
    1. The President announces he is sending a Peace Team, comprised of Rep. Pelosi and Sen. Schumer.

    2. The message to be delivered is as follows, “Harm one hair on their heads, and I am really, really going to get upset.
    3. Iran, don’t let them come back until $122 million is deposited to the US Treasury.

    While this drags out…
    The US Navy will be shuting down the Straight as a good will gesture to Iran’s objectives. Nothing passes, except anything not destined to or from Iran. Any provocative actions, will be met with increased bemoanings from Mrs. Pelosi and Mr. Schumer’s rather inept juggling skills.

    See problem solved.

    Liked by 3 people

  29. czarowniczy says:

    I’m betting Trump’s statements are an effort to de-escalate the situation.

    A drone isn’t something to go to war over, especially as we’re not sure how the drone was configured: was spying on Iranian military sites? Spy planes (and ships) full of military have been shot/forced down while being spying from international waters/airspace for decades. Even when the crews are killed/not returned we don’t go to war over it. Have we forgotten Iranian Air flight 655 in 1988, shot down in international waters by a US Navy ship? Iran was understandably pissed but didn’t go to war with us.

    Iran was being pissy and popped a SAM at a drone, again nothing to start a war over. Iran could have fired one of its hoard of anti-ship missiles, some being very effective, if it really wanted to start a s**t storm but instead it zaps an unmanned drone. Iran knows where that Reaganesque line in the sand (to differentiate from the swishy Obama line in the sand) and isn’t about to cross it, and I’m betting there’s a Russian factor here to as Russia, the US and Israel are getting ready to meet in Jerusalem to discuss Syria’s political fate come the end of the war there. So far #1 on the agenda is getting Iran and its proxies out of Syria. Israel wants Iran out, the US wants Iran out, I’ll bet my car that Syria wants Iran out and even Russia’s making noises like it wants Iran out – I’m curious as to if this is part of the reason Iran’s acting up? It must want to reaffirm what it sees as its power position in the Gulf. It’s been stooped over the decades from its trying to consolidate its hold on the Levant. It’s pretty well failed in Lebanon and now is looking at getting kicked out of Syria, why not poke the Great Satan with a stick and regain some face? It already has Russia talking smack about what might happen were the US to start a war with Iran, why not ratchet things up but keep it on the green side of the line?.

    Liked by 3 people

  30. Grassleysgirl/Breitbartista says:

    This has one wondering
    just what Secretariat Kerry 🐎 was up to during his meetings with mullahs.

    Liked by 2 people

  31. Skeeball says:

    I suspect Tehran John is behind this. He’s been secretly meeting with the mullahs for years.

    Liked by 2 people

  32. MfM says:

    What about Pelosi? She met last month with Iran’s Foreign Minister Zarif.

    She’s one I’d be watching also.

    Liked by 4 people

  33. WSB says:

    Geraldo is on Hannity just now. He must be pro-Iranian because he is siding with their take on the drone being nine miles from shore. And he believes we should NOW renegotiate the failed Nuke Deal.

    if there are Twitter warriors out there, have at him.

    Like

    • I yelled at that bas tard the entire time he was on. Nothing he says is of any value. Hannity spent entirely too much time engaging this clown. Besides, I was more interested in what the CIA guy had to say, but had very little time.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Esther says:

      There is a story about a chameleon. In an experiment to test how it changes its color, they put it on yellow, it turned yellow. Then they put it on red, it turned red, they put it on blue then it turned blue. They continued and put the lizard on blue and red it turned half blue and half red, same with green and yellow. Then they decided to put it on all four colors at once, and the reptile exploded. Geraldo is just like that chameleon, switching his mouth however the wind blows. I’ve never had any respect for him either as a journalist an opinion head nor for his legal skills and womanizing. Geraldo Rivera has no loyalty to anything but money, is it a wonder he has been divorced so many times? Just wish somehow he could be forced onto blue, red, yellow and green at the same time with the spectacle of him exploding. The man who cannot pick a side and stick with his choice is a person who lacks character. Geralda is not only lacking in any redeeming quality of character, he is spineless. Fox should send him on assignment to Iran and hopefully they adopt him. What a duplicitous turd!!

      Liked by 1 person

      • WSB says:

        Esther, I spilled everything, crying and laughing at your amazing post!!!!

        I DID save the wine glass.

        Please excuse the pun, but you are spot on! I will never look at the Sherwin Williams paint commercials the same way ever again.

        Great points, and when we meet again next time, the host loves to have spaces between paragraphs so more eyes will easily read your points (I know, rules are rules, and Sundance has them up top of the blog….took me awhile to adapt).

        In the meantime…Brava!

        Like

      • WSB says:

        Esther, I just read this to my taller half, and I have not heard such a chuckle in awhille!!!!! Still have a tissue to the eyes!

        LOLOL!

        Like

      • WSB says:

        Chameleon Color Boarding!

        OM!

        Like

  34. Muthaucker says:

    Many of us have a bone to pick with Iran. Hopefully, PDJT unleashes hell on Iran, because they have it coming. Bush II should have done it when he was in charge…then it was all about keeping the oil flowing…now? Not so much. Get some!

    Like

  35. Esther says:

    WHY IS IRAN SO CAVALIER ABOUT HAVING DONE SOMETHING SO DANGEROUS TO THE USA?
    It makes no logical sense other than, Iran knows something we don’t know and is indeed ready to start a war. in fact they have taken the first major shot and are publicly boasting about it. We know they are not that stupid. India just recently deployed several warships to the Gulf as did the United Kingdom all ostensibly to protect their shipping passing through the Straight of Hormuz. Iran is being bottled-necked by major and bigger military forces than it could ever fight. So what is Iran’s strategy?

    The only reason a country so puny in terms of its ability to fight the USA, UK and others, is because Iran fights differently, it conducts strategic terrorism. Two reasons it would be acting so idiotically is because they think they have a weapon(s) most Americans are ignorant of them having. Electronic weaponry in the hands of terrorist like Cluba who used some sort of sound to damage the brain and neurological system of our people at the embassy there comes to mind. At this point it looks like Obummer has all his muslim and MS-13 army in position, and all his weaponry on our soil has been placed. Trump’s wall is not up as yet and that porous border is a HUGE disadvantage to our Country in circumstances like this. The strong possibility is that Iran is indeed ready to wage war against the USA, but on its own turf. The other reason could be that Obummer and his co-conspirators realize that the clock has run out on their freedom and the prison walls are closing in so they made this desperate move.

    However before drawing any conclusion, Once again I urge Treepers to research PROJECT PELICAN and how the Kenyan-imposter handed over a most strategic port to his muslim friends, Port Canaveral in 2014. These people running the port in the secret deal make their living out of dealing in all types of arms. Also Check out all the American ports, at least 85% that Americans gave away to dangerous foreigners to bring in and take out cargo unsupervised for over a decade. Feinstein gave Long Beach Port to the Chinese. This all started with Bush. Looking at it, the Dems opened up not just our land borders, but our maritime borders to the enemies of this Country. Trump’s move with tariffing Mexico was to try to hasten getting a grip on this problem knowing what Kerry and the Kenyan-Devil have been plotting. For certain Trump has a strategy in place, but the situation is still very dangerous. Sure hope I am wrong.

    At this point after what happened today, Trump should send a swat team of trusted marines to storm Kerry’s and Obama’s homes ( every one of them) as it is now quite clear they have been openly giving aid and comfort to America’s enemy. But our VSG must have a counterfoil to whatever is going on.

    It may help with understanding why opening our maritime border to un-inspected shipping and our land borders to undocumented persons who slip past our are assisted by Border Patrol rogues was and is so dangerous . Now for SURE its certain the USA has much better equipment than any of them. Terrorism however, Its a different kind of fighting, when the enemies bring this kind of thing on our own soil in surprise attacks against us there can be some real damage. Those Billions Trump asked for to fund the military for certainty must really have us prepared to swiftly counter,any attack, except if there is an element of surprise, or a combination of strategic coordinated terror attacks. The weapons below are puny compared to small backpack nuclear type attacks. Russia had planned this many decades ago, just imagine what they and the Chinese may have put in the hands of Iran under the auspices and direction of the Kenyan-Demon.

    Check out these weapons which are now several years old and most likely better perfected in today’s world.

    And this one just because of size – yet the Dems want citizens to give up their semi-automatics and carry pistols.

    Liked by 2 people

  36. Justin Green says:

    Trump’s statement today was a bigger check on the warmongering folks in DC than it was on Iran.
    He gave them a clear out. Another chance.

    Woe be to Iran if they really did all this and pursue it further, though. Trump will royally hit them back. But it’s a sign of Trump’s modesty that he gave them an out today, which is exactly what he did.

    Liked by 1 person

  37. WSB says:

    Does anyone know if there is a cap on air space ceilings or if there would have been a way to track the coordinates? May be a silly question but 65K feet is high even if somewhere near a coast line.

    Like

  38. VinceWhirlwind says:

    A possible response? “Turn the other cheek”

    This strategy tends to piss EVERYone off. Tally up the options. Tell the pissants to stop it,or else…. Then do nothing.

    My opinion, I don’t think it was Iran.

    Liked by 2 people

  39. Kent says:

    …jimmuh CAHtuh did us SO many fayvuhs…..thanks so much mistuh jimmuh….

    YOU made it so barack and crew could give us what we have today…

    Stand by for a fundamental transformation.val.barry.kerry.rice.power…..creative writer….house counsel….

    Watch what you have wrought unfold…….

    Like

  40. Petrel says:

    Regarding Iran, President Trump was asked a question, by Steve Hilton, on May 19, 2019. His answer was very measured: what he did not like about the Obama deal was that it gave Iran permission to develop nuclear weapons after a lull of some years.

    The President startled Hilton by stating his bottom line — he does not want Iran to have permission to build nuclear bombs ever. In effect, President Trump has the same objective for Iran as for North Korea.

    Then Hilton began asking about military action in Iran. President Trump shrugged the matter off with a meme about the “Military Industrial Complex” loving perpetual wars. The President cited Syria. During the last 2 years, America has wiped out ISIS — there is no more Syrian Caliphate. True, there are some very bad people in Syria, but no more land controlled by ISIS. So he proposed to lower our military presence in Syria and Washington went crazy.

    We can comfortably believe that the Iranian leadership know all about neo-con Bolton & Pompeo and will have followed that May 19, 2019 Hilton interview closely. When the President said today that the drone shoot-down was inexplicable, an underling mistake, he was signaling some sort of a deal was in the works and suspects there are various factions, on our side and theirs, that are not happy with a peaceful resolution.

    PS That map of US bases (above) should send chills down everyone’s back. Should the US bomb some military installation in Iran, expect to see the demolition of our bases and the death of our finest soldiers / sailors / airman by return volley. Iran has plenty more missiles that can climb to 60,000 feet across the Strait of Hormuz.

    Like

  41. MaineCoon says:

    Pressure from all sides.

    Iranian activists attending a U.S. House of Representatives hearing on Wednesday, promoting #FreeIran & "Regime Change by Iranians."A major rally is scheduled for Friday outside the U.S. State Dept.#IStandWithMaryamRajavi#March4RegimeChangeByIranians pic.twitter.com/XezZzw52eq— Heshmat Alavi (@HeshmatAlavi) June 20, 2019

    https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js

    Like

    • Kent says:

      …regime change is the solution….get rid of the mullahs, the islamic republican guard and install decent people installed by the voters of Iran…..

      The Iranian people are not our enemies…the mullahs and the IRG are….

      So take them out………

      Like

  42. MaineCoon says:

    #UPDATE on #Iran-Iranian National Security Council chief: Iran does not take Trump nor his statements seriously.-Iranian IRGC chief taking credit for shooting down U.S. military drone, emphasizing it sends a clear message to America.pic.twitter.com/8MExVG9ujG— Heshmat Alavi (@HeshmatAlavi) June 20, 2019

    https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js

    Like

  43. JustScott says:

    “The US Federal Aviation Administration on Thursday issued an emergency order prohibiting US operators from flying in an overwater area of Tehran-controlled airspace over the Strait of Hormuz and Gulf of Oman”

    “There were numerous civil aviation aircraft operating in the area at the time of the intercept,”

    https://www.smh.com.au/world/middle-east/faa-prohibits-operators-from-flying-over-some-iran-controlled-airspace-20190621-p5200b.html

    Like

  44. cheering4america says:

    Have read all the comments, and found the map posted above particularly interesting and sobering.

    Two things come to mind while thinking about this outrageous shootdown of a US vessel in international airspace:

    1. If you remember early in President Trump’s Administration there were a lot of Iranian people protests and pushing back against their leaders; PDJT kept saying “We support the Iranian people.”

    2. Recently I have been reading that the Iranians are within 6-10 months away from having full nuclear capability. President Trump insists that they must not reach that point (I agree).

    How, if at all, do these two items fit with this act by Iran?

    Like

    • Kent says:

      The mullahs and the Islamic Republican Guard are not the people of Iran….Jimmy Carter dassisted Ayatollah Khomeini in the overthrow of the Shah of Iran leading into the 80’s….and they have terrorized around the world ever since….

      As for nuclear capability….they’ve got it….they’re not bluffing when they say Death to America…..this is in their Friday prayers….and China via North Korea has handed them the means to deliver it via missile and computing technology delivered to them during the clinton administrations……and the missile technology to shoot down our surveillance drone came from Russia…..

      Barack Obama and his weaponized CIA prevented an overthrow of the mullahs by the people of Iran……John Brennan did that………

      Like

    • keeler says:

      I first heard Iran was “six to ten months away” from developing nuclear weapons in 2005.

      I’ve no doubt the Iranian government has an active nuclear weapons program, and that- if allowed- it will be successful. However, I don’t put too much faith in a defined window of time. Nor do I think domestic unrest is driving Iran’s recent actions.

      I think something else does: China.

      Go back and look at the behavior patterns of North Korea and Iran since Trump became President. When North Korea is acting up, Iran is quiet. When North Korea signals possible progress towards peace, Iran and its proxies in Gaza and Lebanon begin to act up.

      What just happened this last news cycle? Iran attacks tankers… North Korea and China send out peace signals… Iran shoots down a US drone.

      Much is made of Russia-Iran ties. However, Iran’s top oil customer is China. China has invested heavily in Iranian energy and infrastructure, including a railway which is key to the “One Belt” program. China is Iran’s second-largest trade partner. China sells Iran arms and weapons systems. In short, China and Iran have substantial economic ties.

      I suspect China deploys Iran and North Korea as complimentary attack dogs. China may not be calling the shots in Tehran as it does in Pyongyang, but it does have the power and motive to offer incentive and support for Iranian provocation when it is desirable to do so.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Petrel says:

        keeler — Your idea of China using agents in North Korea and Iran as “complimentary attack dogs” makes so much sense. Again, your intuition that China may not have as much control over Iran as it does in North Korea is brilliant.

        There was something about attacking the Japanese and Norwegian oil tankers that made little sense if the attacker was Iran — given that country’s current charm campaign to keep the Europeans backing Obama’s treaty despite the US pullout. Why that particular attack as Japanese Prime Minister Abe was visiting the Iranian Ayatollah with messages from President Trump?

        The attack on the American drone seems equally puzzling if the trigger hand were Iranian. However, were the trigger hand Chinese double-agents, with an objective to tell President Trump to back off trade tariffs — now that would make a lot of sense.

        News that President Trump has just called off a retaliatory attack suggests that our leader is aware of possible double-agency. He may have been reached by Iranian high-command — or is using that high native intelligence he clearly possesses.

        Like

  45. JustScott says:

    Like

  46. The Devilbat says:

    War with Iran is inevitable as it has been long since planned. The Rothschild’s control the banking in every country in the world except for North Korea, Cuba and Iran. They started the Gulf war and they planned the so called Arab Spring in order to take over the banking which they did. Iran is next on their list. North Korea and Cuba are insignificant and can easily be taken care of later on. Iran is the big prize.

    Like

  47. JustScott says:

    POTUS called off strike at last minute: (NYT ack’d by VOA)

    Like

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