Monday November 20th – Open Thread

Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be thy Name. Thy kingdom come. THY WILL BE DONE, on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread. And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but DELIVER US FROM EVIL.

For Thine is the kingdom and the power and the glory, forever and ever. Amen †

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239 Responses to Monday November 20th – Open Thread

  1. Mike says:

    Hello Treepers

    You’ve created a kind and thoughtful community here in the “open thread” portion at CTH. I think I’ll disrupt and jar this delicate ecosystem with some Hillbilly Metal.

    Metal Monday

    Liked by 4 people

  2. Missing Andrew says:

    Liked by 3 people

  3. txjohn says:

    Just out of sheer mad curiosity…Any word on solving the mysteried behind the LV shooting?
    I won’t hold my breath…somebody’s pulled the blankets up so deeply this story’s dead. And the MSM is where on this?

    Liked by 3 people

  4. BigMamaTEA says:

    h/t Earl of Taint

    Liked by 1 person

  5. BigMamaTEA says:

    h/t Ear of Taint

    Liked by 1 person

  6. Dora says:

    Liked by 1 person

  7. BigMamaTEA says:

    Think letter/email writing doesn’t work???? IT DOES!

    This “grant” was about to go into force, and we stopped it. WINNING! (Sometimes you have to think out side the box)

    The Black Panthers org had managed to finagle a “grant” from the US Park Department to work on some kind of memorial in the Berkley area. (It was going to turn into another one of many automatic payouts, US taxpayers are funding. It’s a little-fish; but eventually they all add up!)

    God Bless the National Fraternal Order of Police. This letter got this potential grant stopped!

    Liked by 4 people

    • Nikki/Chico says:


      My husband has a musket! Bought from Britannic Arms, and it was used at the Bi-Cenntinnial celebration battle at Yorktown and the surrender of Lord Cornwallis.

      (our side lost, 😕😒🙁☹️, but we looked real nice out on the battle field 🙂)


      Liked by 2 people

  8. BigMamaTEA says:

    “If­”, By Rudyard Kipling

    If you can keep your head when all about you
    Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,
    If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
    But make allowance for their doubting too;
    If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
    Or being lied about, don’t deal in lies,
    Or being hated, don’t give way to hating,
    And yet don’t look too good, nor talk too wise:

    If you can dream ­and not make dreams your master;
    If you can think­ and not make thoughts your aim;
    If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
    And treat those two impostors just the same;
    If you can bear to hear the truth you’ve spoken
    Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
    Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken,
    And stoop and build ’em up with worn-out tools:

    If you can make one heap of all your winnings
    And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
    And lose, and start again at your beginnings
    And never breathe a word about your loss;
    If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
    To serve your turn long after they are gone,
    And so hold on when there is nothing in you
    Except the Will which says to them: ‘Hold on!’

    If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
    Or walk with Kings ­nor lose the common touch,
    If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
    If all men count with you, but none too much;
    If you can fill the unforgiving minute
    With sixty seconds’ worth of distance run,
    Yours is the Earth and everything that’s in it,
    And­ which is more ­you’ll be a Man, my son!

    Liked by 5 people

  9. Dora says:

    RIP Della

    Liked by 1 person

  10. BigMamaTEA says:

    Gateway Pundit is reporting…….

    “#NeverTrumper Jeff Flake Was Foreign Lobbyist Working For Uranium Firm With Ties to Iran”

    ……”Since announcing he will not seek re-election in 2018, Senator Jeff Flake (R-AZ) is on a warpath against President Trump. While Flake is lamenting President Trump’s rhetoric and nationalist, populist policies, it’s important to remember the Arizona lawmaker has a checkered past as a foreign lobbyist who worked for a uranium mining firm with ties to Iran.”………

    Liked by 3 people

  11. Lucille says:

    Those on the left always lie. Even the seemingly nice little old lady down the street if she is dedicated to the leftist philosophy lies to herself, votes for lies and liars, and is unaffected by truth or examples of horrors brought about by her basic beliefs. Harsh? No.

    The International and Domestic Left has a purpose which forever comes first in their minds–the suppression of all dissent in favor of ONE viewpoint–theirs and theirs only. They say that’s what others (namely us) do. However, they project their lies onto freedom-loving, Constitutional-supporting, morality-practicing, life-affirming citizens…as though WE are the ones who hate and wish to quash legitimate thought.

    Bottom line…history has shown that the left supports and gives excuses for suppression of freedom, practices character assassination, works to put others in chains, and lies to get into and remain in positions of power over the rest of us…ALWAYS!

    Stefan Molyneux lets it all go in this excellent “food for thought” episode; so just in case you need a language warning…

    Liked by 3 people

  12. Lucille says:

    Don’t Put Clarence Thomas In with the Bad Boys
    By Jack Cashill – November 20, 2017

    Liked by 1 person

  13. Katherine McCoun says:

    Over the months of the campaign and now the first year of the Trump Administration (I still just LOVE typing that! For so long we just didn’t know if it would actually happen and So much was riding on it!) I have been trying to understand the Never Trumpers, the Neo Cons, the recent history of the Republicans, which leads me to the Bush “dynasty”, the CIA, the Deep State, our foreign policy, etc. Reading post after post by Sundance, seeing how things have played out has helped but there is one particular point that leaves me confused Every time I try to figure it out.

    I need help understanding William Kristol, Neo Con movement and esp. his father, the so called “god father of the neo con movement”, Irving Kristol. His wikipedia page clearly states that in college, in the late 30s (graduating in ’40), Irving Kristol was an “outspoken” member of an Trotskyist anti-Soviet group. Trotskyist were Marxists. So, during his college years of ’36 – ’40 he was an outspoken Marxist. This not the late 20th Century or now when one could be a Marxist and supposedly not be anti American. This was clearly Anti American, Anti Free Enterprise, Anti Free Market, pro Marxism as espoused by Lenin, etc.

    After serving in WWII, Kristol became involved with the Congress for Cultural Freedom until the late ’60s when the organization shown to have been funded by (and probably developed by) the CIA with the purpose of being an anti communist voice aimed at intellectuals, particularly on the left. Did he know the purpose or was he one of the post war liberals, Marxist and communists that the CIA was trying to cultivate away from the USSR during the Cold War?

    He then co founded “Encounter” magazine with a known member of the Communist party in England during late ’30s who then became disillusioned with communism in the 40s, Stephen Spencer. This magazine was also funded by, and seems to have been directed to be founded by, the CIA with the encouragement of M16, although Spencer denied knowing the true source of the funding.

    Kristol published articles in “The Commentary”, a magazine known to “provide a strong voice for the anti-Stalinist left” (according to wikipedia) and, after WWII, was strongly anti Communist, with Kristol even somewhat defending McCarthy as being anti communist/pro American. This magazine, its leaders and writers seem to have parted ways with the left when the Democrats took a hard left turn away from post WWII liberalism to anti capitalism, anti Israel, anti post WWII Dem programs, etc., in the ’60s. From the position of anti communism Democrats they moved to
    Republicans – the Neo Con version.

    Was this magazine also funded by the CIA to support Deep State policies? It seems that the CIA was supporting anti communist but pro Dem/liberal organizations in the 40s-60s and then moved to working through the Neo Con organizations, taking over the Republican Party after the Democrats took a hard left turn. Was Kristol with the CIA officially or coincidentally? So many of his magazines, so much of his politics seems to have been very closely affiliated with the CIA organizations, preferences and policies. Was he a CIA operative from college days forward? From his service in WWII forward? Were the ideas he expressed his own or a reflection of the the CIA/Deep State’s?

    I find it interesting that all of the magazines for which he worked, wrote or published/lead were all aimed at thought leaders. “The Public Interest”, was aimed at “journalists, scholars and policy makers”. “The National Interest” was focused on foreign policy – again, whose foreign policy did it promote? Was it publishing independent analysis and opinion or was a it a conduit to promote official views as were Kristol’s first two magazines? Were these magazine, like the first too, funded by the CIA?

    How does Kristol go from being an anti USSR Marxist to an anti communist Democrat/liberal to a Neo Con Republican? Yes, I know that he, like many thought a little socialism (like FDR programs in their infancy, to soften capitalism) was good but LBJ’s programs went to far and that many ’40s Dems thought that the ’60s Dems went to far and had left them. The ’30s and ’40s young people were now adults, youthful liberals who had been mugged by reality, etc. Those are the personal stories but what about official policy?

    How do policies, beliefs and political philosophies of the Republican party possibly line up with a ’40s-’60s Democrat? They only line up if you change the Republican party drastically from the party it was in the ’30-’50s to line up with the Dems, moving it far to the left. So, are Neo Cons actually Republican at all or were they moderate Dems who no longer felt at home in the harder left Dem party? How does their foreign policy reflect Republican foreign policy?

    It would seem to me that Neo Cons are the ones who hijacked the Republican party and are their own animal, their own political philosophy and not who Republicans were before the Neo Cons, not who they thought they were with the Neo Cons and not who we are now.

    I have been reading and learning a lot but am left confused by the “god father” of neo conservatism, his Marxist origin and his apparent CIA affiliation and where that leaves the Republican party of today. Or does it explain the Republican party of Bush 1 that was nurtured in the nursery of the CIA, bided its time while continuing to grow its tentacles during the Reagan administration and then flourished during the ’90s-’16?

    Liked by 3 people

    • decisiontime16 says:

      True, Katherine M……
      “It would seem to me that Neo Cons are the ones who hijacked the Republican party and are their own animal, their own political philosophy and not who Republicans were before the Neo Cons, not who they thought they were with the Neo Cons and not who we are now.”

      Look up “paleoconservative”.


    • georgiafl says:

      Seems like the NeoCons are really NeoComs (as in communist).

      Liked by 1 person

    • pyromancer76 says:

      Thanks, Katherine. Good history. Used to read the NYRevBooks and articles by Irving. Never could understand why so many Jewish marxists — of course, Marx himself, his followers, so many American Jews — all going toward their own demise. What is this about? There is so much intelligence; where is the creativity and interest in free enterprise. Always some authority to demand obedience.

      There is nothing conservatives about neo-conservatives — globalist-one-worlders all.

      Liked by 1 person

    • It first must be said that Irving Kristol was leagues ahead of his son Bill in the brains and charm department. In the early 90s I went to a symposium at Harvard Kennedy School of Government, the subject was “Neo-conservatism”. There was an excellent group of participants: William Phillips, a founding editor of the legendary quarterly magazine Partisan Review, Nathan Glazer, co-founder of the Public Interest, Norman Podhoretz, then editor of Commentary, Daniel Bell, renowned sociologist and Irving Kristol. All were considered neo-cons or fellow travelers of the neo cons. Phillips and Bell were the fellow travelers, and I believe Bell still considered himself a democratic socialist. I found Irving Kristol very sympathetic on a personal level. He was crusty, argumentative, street smart,. He came off as a wiseacre New York Jewish guy of humble beginnings. As to his political philosophy, his early Trotskyist background is not unusual coming from where and when he did. His entire world in the 30s was Jewish and socialist. As the son of East European Jewish immigrants, there was only socialism and/or the Talmud. The entire group of NY Jewish intellectuals came from socialist and Marxist environments. To his credit Kristol threw off socialism very quickly. He did educate himself in economics and totally rejected Marxism and embraced modified market economics. He was also culturally and religiously of a conservative bent. Though he rejected orthodox Judaism in his youth, he developed an interest in theology and was respectful of traditional religion. He was excellent on matters like public morality, pornography, the erosion of manners and humane customs. My difficulty with his Neo-conservatism is it’s elitism. There is a distrust of the American people. In Irving Kristol and other Jewish intellectuals I believe it arises out of fear of persecution. Unfortunately there is a tendency to believe that if the American people assert themselves there will be anti-Semitic pogroms. I believe this is totally irrational but unfortunately many Jews believe it fervently. The neo-cons want to restrict the voice of the American people. This is the basis for the open borders mentality. Also, their belief in American empire derives from the dangerous idea that abstract notions of universal equality can be imposed on the world. To me, Irving Kristol presented his worldview, which I largely reject, with integrity. His son Bill, I believe, has none of that integrity. There is also his mother, Gertrude Himmelfarb, who is a renowned historian of Victorian Britain. In contrast, Bill Kristol is a complete lightweight.

      Liked by 1 person

    • P. S. Irving Kristol denies any knowledge of the CIA funding of the Congress of Cultural Freedom and their funding of Encounter magazine in London. The funding for Encounter was passed through a front, an American millionaire. The editor, the British poet, Steven Spender, was a complete political naif, and hadn’t a clue. Kristol was a world wise operator, I find it hard to believe he was completely in the dark. It’s interesting to note that the moving force behind the CIA’s support of the Congress for Cultural Freedom, and it’s earlier European incarnation was a former high level Trotskyist, who went on to become a founder of the postwar American conservative movement and an original editor of National Review, James Burnham. Burnham was definitely not a neo-con and is today acclaimed by the paleo-conservatives and Trump supporters around the American Greatness blog.


  14. BigMamaTEA says:

    I’m trying to keep my postings this week light, and not too heavy into politics until after the Holiday; but, I found this very humerous!!!!!!……

    “Remember When Civil Rights Groups Wanted Police Bodycams?”

    …..”But now, a group called The Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights avers that bodycams pose a “threat to civil rights.” They released a report titled, “The Illusion of Accuracy: How Body-Worn Camera Footage Can Distort Evidence,” in which they decry bodycams because the officers can view the footage before they write incident reports.”……….

    ……”In the report, Vanita Gupta, the leader of the Leadership Conference, who is a former ACLU director and former acting assistant attorney general of the civil rights division under former President Obama, writes, “The vast majority of the nation’s leading police departments with body-worn camera programs allow unrestricted footage review – meaning, officers are permitted to review footage from body-worn cameras whenever they’d like, including before writing their incident reports or making statements.”………..

    Liked by 3 people

  15. auscitizenmom says:

    lilbirdee12’s prayer:

    Our Heavenly Father, Your children come to you tonight to ask for healing and peace throughout our country so that we may return to being One Nation Under God. Guide us to be leaders in Your Kingdom, spreading Your Love and Salvation to all. Forgive us our sins and deliver us from evil.

    Lord, we ask for a blanket of protection over all our troops and law enforcement who serve to defend and protect us. Bless our representatives with the strength and wisdom they need to achieve the path You have chosen for us.

    Please place Your Guardian Angels of Protection around Donald Trump and Mike Pence and their families as they seek to lead America back to You.

    Grant us patience, Lord, as the evil ones try to anger us and cause us to fall.
    Spread blessings over Israel and Netanyahu.

    We humbly ask that You please comfort those who are grieving and in pain.
    Thank you Father, for Your Love and the gift of Life.

    And, Lord, we pray for all the people who have been affected by the earthquakes and hurricanes.

    In Jesus name, we pray. Amen.

    Liked by 4 people

  16. Cassandra says:

    Amen. Thanks for posting!


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