Donald Trump Falls In Iowa – Ben Carson Takes Massive Lead…

Fox News will immediately dispatch their legions to begin proclaiming the end of Donald Trump’s campaign.  This poll (pdf below) seems rather odd considering Ben Carson has not been gathering big crowds in Iowa, meanwhile Trump sells out every venue.  Odd.

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481 Responses to Donald Trump Falls In Iowa – Ben Carson Takes Massive Lead…

    • JRD says:

      Rabid John Podhoretz and Bill Kristol, neocons backing Marco Jebio the puppet who despise conservatives?

      These drama queens are not even credible. The neocons are so threatened, good.

      Nobody wants the neocons stupid wars that none of THEIR children fight in, get killed or maimed!

      Both these drones are on Braman’s speed dial.

      Liked by 6 people

    • snaggletooths says:

      Saw the tweet and found it a bit funny as am not a monsanto supporter Paul Ryan saying he will now run for speaker is a bad day for all of us the Re-tweet from trumps account is not a big deal in the realm of things.

      Liked by 3 people

      • michellc says:

        I didn’t see it but I still think it’s funny, but then I don’t like monsanto either and I’m not a fan of corn subsidies. I like Iowans but they get a little crazy when you try to talk to them about subsidies to not grow food.

        Liked by 1 person

    • timmypaddy says:

      If you call the 712 area code as much as you call the 515 and 319 you will get the result of Carson being stronger than he is. I live in Iowa and formally Omaha and the Western third of the state is very religious. There are 3 or 4 counties in the northwest corner of the state that are almost all Dutch Reformist. Relax! Trump is still killing it with Republicans in West Des Moines, and as West Des Moines goes, so goes Iowa.

      Liked by 13 people

    • SharonKinDC says:

      This isn’t even half an antiacid worth. It’s less than a sound only dogs can hear. Gone before it ever started. Even the Iowa poll, coming out today, isn’t the lede anywhere. He’s up so far everywhere else, it’s just not a big deal.

      Like

      • phil fan says:

        Trump let Carson co-opt the ‘Anti-sharia issue = no sharia compliant POTUS in WH’ IN IOWA? Trump needs to push his agreement to avoid a replay. He’s been focused on other things. WRONG! Cost him in IOWA with women and evangelicals. Rush makes the point that this poll was conducted while Carson was in spotlight making his “Sharia is unconstitutional; No Sharia Muslim can be POTUS” comments. OF COURSE this is going to be popular with women and especially Christian Evangelicals. Believe this is a big factor in this poll no one is mentioning here:

        http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3351883/posts
        http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2015/10/22/ben_carson_and_trump_continue_to_roll

        Why is Donald letting Carson have this issue to himself? Carson surged after he nailed this non-PC issue just as Donald surged after his “Build the Wall, Expell them” comments. AIR leaders)? Three days of DT talking calmly and with courage on THIS issue and he will surge past Carson in Iowa. I simply do not understand why this message is not going out. I

        Like

        • jello333 says:

          Of course anyone who practices all aspects of Sharia Law shouldn’t be president, or in any other political position. Well actually, such a person should be in JAIL… I mean if they actually PRACTICE what that “law” demands. But I think if Trump is gonna say something like that, he needs to broaden it a bit, so it attaches to ALL religions. Something like “No religious rule any person might believe in gives that person the right to violate any state or federal law.” That would stop any accusations of “anti-Muslim bias” dead in their tracks.

          Liked by 1 person

          • b rb says:

            . “No religious rule any person might believe in gives that person the right to violate any state or federal law.” Which of these Biblical laws would you drop in your new state, federal law gambit? Seems to me politicians are violating all kinds of laws right now. No law can fix this. Only heart changes.

            Liked by 1 person

        • Doodahdaze says:

          Maybe a Trump/Carson 2016 ticket. These Carcassgoer polls are “Iowa Outliars” set up for MSM anti-Trump talking points of the day.

          Liked by 1 person

        • SharonKinDC says:

          Disagree, phil fan. One of the great things about Trump is not only is he right on the issues, but he doesn’t get bogged down in issues not central to his campaign. He’s said enough about ‘the problem’. He didn’t get bogged down like Carson.

          Carson, w/ his Hitler, Muslim, and now invoking need for speech investigations on campuses, is creating an ‘extremist’ brand. IMO, even if he could pull off a primary win (virtually impossible) in a general he’d be slaughtered. YMMV

          Liked by 1 person

          • phil fan says:

            Yes Sharon I see now that Donalds handling of the sharia ? is more nuanced than I appreciated originally = As you say he doesn’t want to get caught up in the dramatics of tweaking their noses for no good reason. But he understands the perils of Islam.

            Regarding Iowa it must be his NY style = brash, which they don’t get? Also I know the fix is in with the “polls by trolls” = agenda polls not accurate of actual sentiment re: Donald. I overemphasized the sharia issue!

            Liked by 1 person

            • SharonKinDC says:

              If those Iowa polls called likely primary voters, they missed at least 25% minimum of Trump’s base. (Maybe closer to 50%) He’s got new people registering, others who rarely caucus… so they’d not be on a call list. Know the crap Nat’l poll was LPV’s, not sure about Iowa, but I rather wonder…

              Liked by 1 person

      • Teddi says:

        Doesn’t pass the smell test [ i.e., just like that IBD/TIPP national poll a while back that had Carson up 24% to 17% ]. If you look at other polls before and after – its an obvious outlier for an agenda…

        Liked by 1 person

  1. Nanny G says:

    I’m not sure about why women in that poll picked others over Trump, but I noticed younger voters (who have been promised a free ride on their college loans by many candidates) are not exited about Trump’s promise of jobs.
    Think about it.
    Jobs have not been available for years now.
    So, younger people have become enamored of sitting around doing nothing and getting by anyway.
    What is more appealing?
    Jobs, as promised by Trump.
    Or, a bigger, better safety net as promised by everybody else?

    Liked by 7 people

    • amjean says:

      You might be right. And if you are, what a shame for this country.
      Also the media overall has been very positive for Ben Carson.
      He hasn’t been attacked yet for most of his positions. The media
      tried to fry him for his comment that a muslim who put shia law
      before the constitution should be president, however, that whole
      question/answer was lame. I don’t think Trump helps himself
      when he keeps saying Carson is a nice guy. Trump is being
      raked over the coals and he says Carson is a nice guy. Not
      comparing the two, however, didn’t McCain state that Obama
      was a nice guy? Trump should say nothing about Carson; nothing
      derogatory, nothing nice either.

      There are a lot of negatives about Carson; when people find
      out (how, I don’t know) his poll numbers will drop.

      Liked by 1 person

    • wondering999 says:

      Nanny G, there have always been people who are lazy — and often they are just incompetent and conflicted. I go to classes and see a lot of very industrious young people.

      We DO have to have a safety net of some kind, but it also has to be a “safety net” that works. This is why we need Trump. What they have been doing is weird, random and only minimally useful for many people.

      I just got a notice from my insurance company that next year, my monthly premiums will go up to about half of what I earn in an average month. It is nuts. And I don’t use much medical care, although I do need a “safety net” if I have a major problem.

      Liked by 2 people

      • nimrodman says:

        “… next year, my monthly premiums will go up to about half of what I earn in an average month …”

        That’s “white privilege”.

        You’re privileged to pay for everybody else in addition to yourself.

        Liked by 1 person

        • wondering999 says:

          What’s weird is that the premiums were much lower the first year (because of a “tax credit”), then they jump up and up. Kind of like cable bills (I dumped cable, too).

          I can think of lots of things that would lower medical bills, and I’ve used Minute Clinics which are great, open 7 days a week for things like TB testing, vaccinations etc. I suspect that Trump & Co. could cobble something together that would not only work, but it would lower prices too.

          Liked by 1 person

          • TheLastDemocrat says:

            well, that is one aspect of the entire mistake.

            they could have required citizens to have at least some “catastrophic coverage,” with some kind of heavily tax-encouraged medical savings account for out-of-pocket and deductible.

            but, instead, they went and engineered a minimal plan that REQUIRES too much – all preventive services noted by US Preventive Services Task Force – a specific mandate of preventive services: ALL the things that make Planned Parenthood money.

            Plus abortion coverage, etc.

            Liked by 1 person

            • ZurichMike says:

              This is the Swiss model: Every citizen is required to carry basic coverage, and all insurance companies must provide this coverage. You buy up (better coverage) if you like (and Swiss like to be insured), and so there is huge competition and decent rates. And its 100% private — there is no massive equivalent to Medicare or Medicaid. And it works.

              Liked by 2 people

              • goodoldboy66 says:

                How is the Swish poverty level % these days? Don’t see too too many refugees setting up camp on the foothills of Zermat. Here it will soon be 100% government vs private.

                Like

                • ZurichMike says:

                  Switzerland does have its poor — with a higher proportion in the French-speaking side. However, the infrastructure is so good, that being poor in Switzerland, while sobering, is hardly like being poor in India.

                  Refugees are spread out, like in all countries, and this issue is what made the country move even more to the right in the elections last weekend. Here, refugees are required to go to language and integration classes, where they also learn to recylce, use the facilities properly, live in the West, and appreciate that that infrastructure and high quality of life is because of what we do and not what they demand. I have seen work crews of refugees doing larger, one-off community projects: picking up trash, sweeping streets, cleaning parks. It saves the cantons and communities a lot of money that they are otherwise providing for the upkeep of these refugees.

                  Liked by 1 person

        • squid2112 says:

          I have found out that for my employee compensated medical benefits, I will now have to pay full taxes on everything that they contribute, in addition, since I have a pretty good healthcare plan, I am going to be additionally charged the “Cadillac Tax”, and if that weren’t enough, the portion that I have to pay for my healthcare plan is going up 42% and my deductible is going up $1000. So, I got my raise for the year (a meager 3.2%) and yet my bi-weekly paycheck is now going DOWN by about $300-$350. Great raise huh?

          Liked by 3 people

          • squid2112 says:

            Oh, and did I mention that my raise is only 10 months late?

            Like

          • lorac says:

            Yes, for everyone, everything our employer contributes to our health plan is going to be counted as “income” on our taxes starting with next spring’s taxes. It’s going to hit people hard because at most companies, the employer pays a lot more, while the employee (let’s say a single person) pays maybe $50 out of every two-week paycheck. So now we not only have to pay for other people’s insurance in our own health care premiums and deductibles, now we have to pay tax on it and our employer’s share. The administration planned for the “goodies” of Obamacare to roll out first, and the worst parts to roll out later.

            Even though health cooperatives are going out of business and others may soon, too (as the feds have recently gone back on the promise to bail out the poorer performing cooperatives), only around 7 million out of the reported 20+ million uninsured people have gotten insured. So, whoopee, costs are bound to go up more as we move forward….

            Liked by 1 person

  2. dizzymissl says:

    20 Reasons Why It Should Be Donald Trump in 2016

    http://bit.ly/1kxeaHy via @BreitbartNews

    Liked by 2 people

    • SharonKinDC says:

      This is BRILLIANT. Worthy of sharing everywhere! The list hits all of my points, but better!

      Liked by 3 people

    • Can I please add #21.
      Trump understand economics. His proposed Tariff on imports is dead on correct, even though most folks (like Bill O’Reilly) dont understand it.

      Currently, all major Central Banks are waging currency wars (including U.S.) to add their manufacturing sector. Here in the U.S. liberal policies such as EPA, DOT, Dept of Labor, etc have devastated the manufacturing sector, wiping out jobs. Liberals answer is to lower interest rates (which also helps National Debt) but primarily lowers the U.S. Dollar, permitting easier exports, and slightly higher jobs in the U.S. Downside to this is that savers/investors (innocent third party) are forced in casino style stockmarket or no returns at all on investment. Enter Donald Trump. He addresses the problem forthright – just place a tariff on imports, leaving the third party savers/investors unmolested. With a tariff program, interest rates can return to their normal levels. Without the Trump plan, left on our present course, we will have another crash at least as large as 2008.

      Nobody but Trump has any shot of making a dent in the Washington disaster. And frankly, If Carson really loves this country, he needs to drop out. He has no qualifications to effect any change as a POTUS. He’s just confusing people.

      Trump in 2008!

      Like

    • R-C says:

      I got into a dust-up on that website over his article. The guy in full-on Trump denial.

      No matter what you said, this guy remained adamant: “Trump is a democrat. Trump is with Hillary.” Sheesh.

      I asked another “conservative”: If Trump is not the guy, then which “pure conservative” is going to rise up? Which is going to carry the election? (He came back with an insult against me, so I said, “Yes, thought so. You have nobody.”) This guy was bent on the “Trump is an entertainer” theme as though all Trump has ever done is to host a game show, or whatever. The guy described Trump’s campaign energy, and how he’s reaching out to young voters and using modern media–like all of this was a BAD thing. I went on to describe Trump’s preparation for this job he seeks–it of course fell on deaf ears. The guy said I’m in “full fan mode”, or whatever.

      Oh, well. I will keep trying to get through the hard heads out there.

      Like

  3. Melania for 1st Lady says:

    Let’s not ignore the elephant in the room: race.

    There are a significant number of people who claim to be on the Right yet they have fallen prey to the cultural Marxism of the Left. They are supporting Carson because he’s black, plain and simple, end of story. They want to prove how “tolerant” they are, how much they love diversity and the whole multi-culti agenda.

    “Hey, look at me, I’m a Republican but I’m not one of those evil racist whites! I’m a goodwhite! I love blacks! Open borders? Sounds great! More diversity! Our diversity is our strength! I’m a Republican but I’m a goodwhite – my only disagreement with the Left is that I want low taxes and the Left wants high taxes. That Carson fellow sure is a nice, smart, clean black man. I’m going to support him to show what a goodwhite I am. White liberals have been having all the fun proving that they’re not racists for years and now I want a piece of that action. I can be just as good as all the goodwhite liberals.”

    This is the stupidity of many who say they are on the Right. Actually, they would never say they are “right-wing” because the right-wing, as everyone knows, is a bunch of racist badwhites. They do however claim to be republican and/or conservative, which is a safe way of saying “I’m on the right – sort of – but I’m not one of those racist right-wing badwhites. I’m a goodwhite – if there’s two things I love it’s low taxes and more Mexicans/Somalis/Syrians/insert-non-white-ethnicity-here coming into my terrible, all-too-white, nation. After all, diversity is a strength – America must have been a terribly weak country pre-1965 immigration act when we were 90% white. What a terrible country we were. Not to worry though – we’ll atone for those sins!”

    There is a similar line of thought among Fiorina supporters. They have caved to cultural Marxism and believe it would be sexist of them not to support her (Did you know that Fiorina is a woman?). They also think that “she’s the only one who can take on Hillary because she’s a woman too!” Anyone who buys into this line of thinking is already a lost cause who has basically accepted the leftist, feminist rules and agreed to play by them.

    These republicans who are desperate to prove to the media and to leftists that they are “goodwhites” who are not racist/sexist/homophobic/xenophobic are really just leftists themselves (but, but, but……but we’re for low taxes!)

    To all of you who, like me, are not ashamed to be on the Right, I say this: Stop trying to get the Left to love you. Stop apologizing. Stop groveling. Stop looking for your own “magic negro” to vote for to prove what a goodwhite you are. Stand up for something besides low taxes. I like low taxes too. But how are you going to keep taxes low if you import millions of third-worlders who will go on the dole? All McCain and Romney wanted to talk about, and all Jeb currently wants to talk about, was low taxes/”the economy”. The McCain/Romney/Jeb crowd never wants to talk about social/cultural/demographic issues. They have already surrendered those issues to the left. How are we going to keep our gun rights when we import millions of third-worlders who vote for the anti-gun democrats? How are we going to stop abortion when we import millions of third-worlders who vote for the pro-abort democrats? (“but, but, but…..but the hispanics are Catholics! They don’t like abortion! They’ll vote republican, I just know it!” Sorry, goodwhite – they may or may not like abortion but they ain’t voting to cut off their own welfare checks)

    Securing the border and stopping the invasion (and turning back the invasion) are the only issues that matter. If we lose on those issues then we will lose on every other issue from now until the end of time (or at least the end – one way or another – of America). Donald Trump has made this the signature issue of his campaign. Don’t vote for the magic negro. Vote for The Donald and make America great again.

    Liked by 15 people

    • Piper says:

      Melaniaforfirstlady- I posted before reading yours- you are 100% correct!

      Liked by 1 person

    • William says:

      Me too. Stop the grovelling! You gain no respect that way.

      Like

    • phil fan says:

      Vet Carson. Who is this man We don’t want Barry 2

      Liked by 4 people

    • bleep21k says:

      @Melania…- LMAO! The “magic negro”! Sounds like a good name for a band from the 60s…

      I told some of the young black students at work today (a university) that “Trump is ma boyee! Look em up!” They were suprised lol, but they trust my truth.

      Mr. Carson is too quiet for me, even though I do appreciate his stance on Islam in particular…

      Liked by 10 people

      • Melania for 1st Lady says:

        Haha! I wish I could take credit for the term “magic negro” but I stole it from Rush Limbaugh. And he got it – strangely enough – from a goodwhite liberal who wrote about our humble president Barry Obama back around 2008.

        I too appreciate his stance on Islam. I concede to his supporters that he does seem “nice”. And, being a brain surgeon I’m sure he’s intelligent. I do think that the intelligence needed to perform brain surgery is different from the intelligence needed to run a country. A chess master would be better than a brain doctor. Or a man who has run a yuge empire of a company, making deals with foreign governments, overseeing thousands of employees, etc.

        If we were living in “normal” times (remind me, when were those, exactly?) I might be more inclined to consider Dr. Ben. I’m sure he’s a nice guy. But times are tough, and, as Donald says, “We don’t need NICE!” We need tough, we need sharp, we need cunning SOBs who will fight back against China and Mexico and all the others who are taking us to the cleaners. “Nice” people got us into the mess we’re in today.

        Liked by 3 people

      • wondering999 says:

        I have listened to Carson speak, and I like him. Also I am grateful that he is willing to serve in politics, since that area seems like a nightmare job to me.

        But for the particular set of problems a president faces, I think Trump is better prepared to address the issues and the opposition.

        Liked by 5 people

      • phil fan says:

        Trump let Carson beat him in IOWA among women and evangelicals b/c Carson spoke up about evils of Sharia and ‘no Sharia compliant POTUS, it’s not constitutional’. Poll was taken while spotlight was on Carson per above as Rush says:

        http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2015/10/22/ben_carson_and_trump_continue_to_roll

        It’s more than race, it’s this foreign religious invasion equally. Why does Donald not calmly and with courage point out this specific issue esp. IN IOWA? 3 days of this and he will recover ground lost to clever Carson with women and evangelicals.

        Also see below on this thread:

        ThankYou,Treepers says:
        October 22, 2015 at 6:57 pm

        Liked by 1 person

    • JoeS says:

      People are generally nice, and while they may not come out and say they like Trump because they don’t want to face being “associated with a racist, bigot, etc., etc., etc.,” names like Trump has been called, that does not mean they are not supporting him. When someone calls on the phone, I believe that because Trump has been brow beaten in the media by pundits both democrat and republican and by nearly all analysts, people shy away from being honest. I believe it is highly plausible that Trump is polling lower than his actual support for the reasons above, especially in telephone polls when there is a “live person” on the line. When Trump, and UNIQUELY TRUMP, is polled in online polls, he does much better. Take a look at this:
      https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2015/10/14/why-donald-trump-loves-online-polls/

      Regarding race, there may be a double effect here with Carson and the online poll phenomena. Take a look at the recent online polling results here on the Treehouse site. Trump does much better in the online polls and Carson does MUCH WORSE! The “Wilder Effect” could, potentially account for this. The Wilder effect is the tendency for people to favor black candidates in polling more than white people because they do not want to be perceived as racist. Here is an article that describes the “Wilder Effect”:
      http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/003/391lpcdh.asp

      At any rate, the Des Moines Register is likely to release new data on the republican race that occurs after the “Quinni Poll” (17th-20th) really soon and we will see if 2 polls achieve a similar result.

      Liked by 1 person

      • sandraopines says:

        Re: Nice vs Bada$$

        I am a take no prisoners bada$$ girl with a similar attitude to Trump. By no means am I as skilled. ehem I am told by those who have worked with and for me that it takes time to get to know me and then they love me. At any rate, I believe this to be true with some of the softer people. They are slower to warm up to those of us who go after problems with a sledge hammer, of course some never do.

        I think as Trump continues to connect with people the appreciation for his work will grow into Love. Also, people don’t like to see others treated unfairly. Media and GOPe is very unfair. I hope and pray people see with their peepers.

        Liked by 1 person

  4. ctmom says:

    Two words. Rick Santorum.

    Liked by 3 people

  5. kinthenorthwest says:

    I think something stinks really really bad in the FOX poll, worse than a few dozen skunks with their tails in the air.

    Liked by 6 people

  6. Libertas says:

    Does any believe all the poll shopping Quinnipiac and Fox are undergoing to get the results they want.

    Liked by 11 people

  7. Piper says:

    WHY WHY WHY would any one vote for Carson?! Look he’s a nice man and all (I guess, I mean what do we really know about him?) but he has never created jobs, held political office, dealt with politicians in any meaningful way, had any military experience, done anything that would lead me to believe that he can run an entire country, (especially one with the amount of problems odumbo and his minions have created), he is for amnesty and forced vaccinations, what the h@ll!
    My opinion is that people who feel guilty for being white and not liking Obama are trying to make some kind of amends by voting for someone based strictly on their skin color. Sad. I understand wanting to vote for a staunch Christian, but those voters should be in Cruz’s camp. Hillary will wipe the floor with Ben, that’s a debate that makes me want to hide under a table somewhere, just thinking about it!

    Liked by 8 people

    • joanfoster says:

      Yes, Ben Van Winkle would literally fall asleep in a debate with Hillary. I don’t believe this poll for a second. Maybe Trump invokes Carl Ichan’s name one too many times or was profane in one of his speeches. I would like to see the breakout before being too disheartened.

      Liked by 2 people

    • czarowniczy says:

      Rep[lace ‘Carson’ with ‘Obama’ and peddle back to 2008.

      Liked by 4 people

      • jello333 says:

        Hope you saw my other comment on that very point… started with “I’m gonna go all politically incorrect now…” or something. 😉

        Liked by 1 person

      • michellc says:

        There are resemblances such as not many knew who he was before he gave a speech and we still don’t really know much about him.
        He was in Tulsa today signing his book, I guess I could have went and asked him questions, but I needed to go get feed bought and get it home and unloaded before the rains hit. Plus, I hate Tulsa and try to avoid it at all costs and would never go there unarmed, so if he has secret service protection now they might have frowned upon me if they sensed I was armed.

        Like

        • czarowniczy says:

          I just wonder if Carson isn’t a Republican overreaction to Obama. Might be better if all candidates from both parties campaigned totally wrapped in a burlap sack so that the only thing we could concentrate on was the shade of the lies they told. For some candidates (I’ll leave that to the imagination) the sack would be a total improvement.

          Like

          • michellc says:

            I personally think he is and think it’s an emotional thing, for one he’s a successful black man who gave it to Obama and two some really have a problem with being called racists and go out of their way to prove they aren’t.
            The reality of that is they are going to continue calling you a racist.

            Like

    • justfactsplz says:

      Carson is also too wishy washy when it comes to the second amendment. I agree Hilary would make mincemeat out of him at a debate. Trump 2016.

      Liked by 3 people

  8. Sandra says:

    Peter Brown of Quinnipiac, who is frequently quoted in the poll summaries, very obviously wants Trump to go away. Earlier this month Quinnipiac showed Trump ahead in FL, OH, and PA. Peter Brown wrote “Those who were waiting for Donald Trump’s campaign to collapse will need to wait
    longer – at least in the three key states of Ohio, Florida and Pennsylvania,” Who would write that about the poll leader?? His comments in other polls are equally disturbing. Is he in a position to fudge results, driven by some irrational hatred of Trump?

    Liked by 6 people

  9. Bill Quick says:

    I think what may be going on is that Jeb just finished dumping a crap ton of money into anti-
    Trump ads in Iowa, ostensibly with the purpose of boosting himself against the leader. That failed miserably – Bush is now polling lower than previously – but it still might have hurt Trump vis Carson. Note the totals of the two remain similar – at this point, as Carson gains, Trump drops. I suspect the opposite will be true as well.

    Liked by 3 people

  10. ThankYou,Treepers says:

    Sometimes we can see dynamics over and over again for decades in one discipline but never comprehend the implications of those dynamics in other disciplines.

    Example: I’ve never been to Iowa and often go for months without ever hearing, let alone thinking, of the place. But then there are is a certain time of year when year after year I hear of Iowa almost daily. That time of year is college basketball season. The major colleges in Iowa have made themselves well known nationally in college basketball over the last half century. The locals seem to be rabid fans who support those teams to the extreme.

    The sense one gets is Iowa, though not teeming with local high school players who are recruited nationally or ultimately reach the pro level to any disproportionate degree, is a college basketball hotbed because the zeal of the local fans attacks out of state recruits who make the teams strong.

    Explicitly, Iowans are a lily-white population crazy about the non-native black players who come to their schools for the adulation. It’s been starkly obvious year after year since the 1960s.

    Anybody who has been paying attention to that blatant dynamic knew Obama was going to win the Iowa primary/caucus/whatever in 2008 just for being able to claim African American heritage in brown skin.

    That’s what’s going on here with the Carson surge in Iowa and nothing else. As stated in the post, he’s on leave at the moment, but to Iowans he’s still black.

    I have made it clear here I see Trump as dangerously naïve on islam, which is the greatest threat to our nation and culture even though islam will untimately be vanquished because it’s of the devil and thus attempts to denies the Godliness of the Divine Redeemer Jesus, the Son of God.

    Plus giving credit where due, Carson has separated himself above every Presidential candidate of the post 9/11 era by raising the truth about sharia (Islamic supremacy law) and taqiya (relentless deception by muslims in furtherance of their cult as islam encourages) while all other candidates since 9/11 have been practically islamophilic (Bosh Fawstin’s insightful term).

    Since Trump loves and has thrived in American competitiveness, I hope Carson’s courageous insights on islam spur Trump to become sophisticated about the critical topic via the competitive process of the campaign.

    But this blip is just a bunch of white people who are in the habit of loving to love blacks from a distance showing how noble they are by cheering for the black competitor in the arena.

    Liked by 3 people

    • phil fan says:

      Trump gets it about the dangers of Sharia. He condemns it. Carson is a stealth candidate much like BO. He will be vetted and exposed count on it.

      Liked by 4 people

    • Josie says:

      That’s quite a steroetype about Iowans. I suggest you plan a visit so you can get some clarity. They like good basketball players regardless of skin color. They love basketball. Sheesh.

      Like

      • ThankYou,Treepers says:

        In my opinion Steve King, (R), Iowa, US House, is in a class by himself as America’s top elected official in the post 9/11 era and I’ve expressed that opinion repeatedly. One needn’t visit Iowa to have known Iowans. One of my favorites proudly displayed his Golden Ear.

        Last week I defended a statement of my beliefs on here after a few female commentators ridiculed same and the result was a multi-day suspension and still-ongoing moderation delay of all my postings. And that was for quoting Jesus on this site which starts each day with “The Lord’s Prayer”, and then standing firm in the face of efforts to dilute the clarity of His commands.

        So at the risk of more of the same, suffice it to say my opinion on Iowan negrophilia is not for lack of initiation on the topic. Actually, it’s well recognized in some very sophisticated quarters.

        Like

  11. PatriotKate says:

    This may be wildly speculative, but it’s been rolling around in my head the last couple of weeks. Has it ever occurred to others that Trump and Carson may be working together to take down the entire Republican field? Everyone speculated that Trump and Cruz were working together. I don’t buy that. I think Cruz was trolling Trump.

    I really do not believe that Carson wants to be President. He does not appear to have that fire in his belly. However, running for President opens lots of other doors for him and gains him tremendous recognition. There is money to be made just by running.

    Now, here’s why I speculate. Trump NEVER says anything even remotely negative about Carson and even excused him when he got close choosing not to counter punch him as he says he usually does. He said something to the effect that he knew that Carson did not mean what he said when asked about it. I read somewhere that Herman Cain is behind the primary Super Pac that supports Carson and remember they don’t have to reveal who the donors are (could Trump be a silent donor to this PAC?). A couple of weeks ago when Trump was in Atlanta, Herman Cain was front and center in the audience, because Trump gave a shout-out to him. Recall that it is the Establishment that took down Cain and it was awful the way all that happened. AND, why are all those black pastors who were in Atlanta for Trump not backing Carson? Odd.

    Is it possible the two are working together to clear the field? Remember, there’s a large group of Carson supporters who will shift to Trump.

    Wild speculation or not?

    Liked by 1 person

  12. charliewalksonwater says:

    iowa doesnt have the influence it once had. They voted for Santorum in 2012, 2008 Huckabee, So their track record is not great. i see where it got them. But, Trump winning Iowa would be great.

    Liked by 4 people

    • I will guess as per recent trends that Carson will win Iowa and that it won’t matter.

      Liked by 1 person

      • phil fan says:

        As long as he wins NH all is good

        Liked by 2 people

      • Catmom says:

        Agree. These silly “traditions” are outdated. Who cares about a state so addicted to federal subsidies that they cannot think straight. I live in New Mexico. No one in this country should care about what voters in NM think. We are a taker addict state in serious need of rehab and a wake up call. If I lived in another state I would argue that NM should go back to Mexico. We contribute nothing other than military, national labs, welfare and a gateway for illegal immigration.

        Liked by 2 people

        • Desert Transplant says:

          Aw yes..the third world “Land of Entitlement.” I don’t think much anyone actually does care about the state. The poverty ridden state will now be resettling Muslim refugees and mayor of Santa Fe is one of 18 in the country that wants more and more of these miscreants. My glorious US Rep Michelle Grisham. last week, along with Senators and other Reps, penned a letter to Prez O asking him to hurry and get those “refugees” to USA, even skipping the “vetting process” which is a sham in and of itself. I see no hope that NM will ever be anything but an underbelly.

          Liked by 1 person

          • Melania for 1st Lady says:

            New Mexico was once a rather conservative state. However, according the 2010 US Census, it is now 47.3% hispanic (and I’m sure that has grown since 2010).

            Democrats couldn’t convince Americans to vote for them so they imported third-world ringers from Mexico.

            Thanks Teddy Kennedy and 1965 Immigration Act!

            Liked by 2 people

      • Bill Quick says:

        It’s a problem for Trump, because a big part of his campaign strategy is built on him being a winner. Bad juju, then, to start out in the first real election, no matter how minor, by losing it. Cracks the image.

        I’m not terribly worried, even if the poll is accurate. Trump has been treating Carson with kid gloves. I’m sure he has a strategy for taking him down. But Bush (and to a lesser extent, Rubio – as the Donor Class Bobbsey Twins) remain job number one.

        There’s plenty of time to get around to Carson, once the GOP Donor Class cracks and exits toward Hillary.

        Liked by 2 people

        • Big Picture says:

          I think he is “killing him with kindness.” He says that Carson is nice, and then explains why being tough is better than being nice.

          Like

    • Josie says:

      They kept voting for anyone other than Mitt. They keep trying to break the GOPe influence. They voted against McCain. They voted against Mitt. Then, New Hampshire comes along and does the GOPe bidding.

      Like

  13. Ivehadit says:

    Not the least bit worried. Keep marching, Donald…straight to the White House!!

    Liked by 3 people

  14. angryduc says:

    I don’t trust that poll. Trump is going to get smeared everyday a hundred times over and if you are going to support him you have to see through the fog.

    Liked by 5 people

  15. We’ll see. I have little faith in single polls, but multiple ones show Carson ahead than I’d think that Carson is ahead.

    One one hand it makes sense. Iowa is Trump’s weakest place in the early states and I would expect him to come second in some of the polls (he has before). He can afford to lose Iowa as long as he takes the others by large enough margins.

    On the other hand it is a little disconcerting. It is the second poll with a decent sample size (although the other was a partisan poll) that shows him significantly behind this month [1]. All the other polls in Iowa that show him ahead are from last month.

    [1] http://elections.huffingtonpost.com/pollster/2016-iowa-presidential-republican-primary

    Like

    • Iowa: the pastor’s platform in a presidential race. makes sense Carson would be ahead.
      do not be discouraged! the way i see Iowa for Repubs is that it is the state they vote for PASTOR or the candidate that is most like their pastor. sad but true.

      it’s only October 22nd and Trump is still doing quite well there and it is a momentum state with a caucus, no one selected is bound to his or her candidate at the convention.

      “Meanwhile, there are 17 states that use a caucus and convention to choose delegates. Iowa is such a state. Even though it’s the first caucus, the convention is held months later — and no one selected in the caucus is bound to his or her candidate. Four years ago, former Pennsylvania Senator Rick Santorum won the Iowa caucus. He got no delegates. Instead, former Representative Ron Paul (R-Texas) won the convention and most of the delegates.”

      SOURCE: http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2015/08/16/yes-donald-trump-can-win-but-heres-what-it-will-take/

      Liked by 2 people

  16. Donald Trump Falls In Iowa – Ben Carson Takes Massive Lead…

    Those were tough words to read, and a bitter pill to swallow. But, no matter what this poll reports, my support for Donald Trump hasn’t changed one iota.

    I didn’t decide to vote for him because I thought others would.

    I decided to vote for Donald Trump because I believed he is the best candidate for the job of POTUS. And nothing has happened to make me believe any differently.

    TRUMP 2016

    heck, why stop there?

    Re-Elect him 2020, too!

    Liked by 8 people

    • R-C says:

      We have this ONE poll, against which we stack the huge crowds Trump is drawing in Iowa–where Ben isn’t drawing huge crowds.

      I’ll go with the huge crowds and suspect this poll is an anomaly.

      Liked by 3 people

      • wondering999 says:

        I think some schemer was annoyed because Trump brings up his leadership in the polls, often. And they’d probably like to find a way to reduce the crowds, if not by photography, then by violence. No matter what they do, I support Trump for the job.

        Like

      • lorac says:

        Yes, I agree, it’s one poll.

        Iowa may be mostly white, but blacks are not exotic there or something, as someone above implied. Iowa has a lot of farm country, but it also has lots of cities in which plenty of blacks live. And hispanics are there, as everywhere else. I have lived in Iowa, and for many, many years.

        If Iowa were voting for Carson like he’s some exotic creature, why did Carson not lead all the other Iowa polls? This is just one poll. I think some people are letting the media alarm them, just as the media planned…

        Like

    • justfactsplz says:

      I will not be shaken. Trump all the way. We must stay strong in our support. Worse days and attacks are ahead for Trump but he will rise above it all. What we can do is educate others and try to help get out the vote. This is the most important election of our lifetimes. They think if they berate Trump enough that we will give up on him. NO! Cold Anger.

      Liked by 2 people

  17. Paco Loco says:

    One simple question…who do you want negotiating with Vladimir Putin? Donald Trump,Ben Carson or Hillary Clinton?

    Liked by 5 people

  18. czarowniczy says:

    Wondering if Trump drop is due to RAT campaign crews testing out anti-Trump strategies, testing for the seemingly inevitable match-up between supporters Fostering a Killery campaign and the fast depleting stock of native Bitter Clinger voters? Iowa’s a great battleground to test in and the results don’t really mean that much until the brokers at each party’s convention serve up the main course.
    The next summer/fall will be a miserable time as the professional thought-shapers hit us Left and Right, and the various manipulative techniques will have been tested and ficus grouped ad nauseum. I’m looking at laying in that LDS-inspired extended food supply and a politically-inspired extended booze supply. Thought of staying potted from about July 4th through through early November’s seeming to feel better and better.

    Liked by 1 person

  19. TheTorch says:

    Trumps impact on caucus turnout could be yuuuuge!
    http://theiowarepublican.com/2015/trumps-impact-on-caucus-turnout-could-be-yuuuuge/

    I doubt the poll is taking this into consideration…

    Liked by 4 people

    • LIKE! O Torch yes you are correct! i hadn’t even taken the caucus TURNOUT into consideration in my long diatribes on the subject of Iowa being the “let’s vote for the candidate most like our pastor.”
      this could very well land Trump in the winner’s seat. Iowa has nasty weather in February and turnout is very crucial. and i also didn’t take into consideration (silly me!) how Trump is aware of all of this and knows turnout is the most important.

      Like

    • Notmeagain says:

      The reasoning in the article is good, turnout is a big goal to pursue. Worked for Obama. The comments are very mixed. If they are all from Iowans (and who knows, int this internet age), there is definitely a large % that are not sold on Trump although that doesn’t mean they are sold on Carson either.

      Like

  20. i have long thought that Trump possibly could lose win Iowa to Carson. three candidates come to mind: Rick Santorum, Huckabee, Bachman is right. one word: EVANGELICALS who like it “soft” what i call the polite evangelicals, those who look to a candidate that they consider “more like them” religiously, rather than the candidate that could win a general election. campaigning on “the pastor platform.” where the US is like the church and the president is like the pastor. i know them well because i used to be one of them, however, after seeing one evangelical after the other fail to even get the nomination after Iowa, i now see that is not enough. but the biggest revelation for me was being out of the country for several years i noticed the evangelical political leaders are completely blind as to what is really going on outside of the mainstream media, especially regarding foreign policy and rather war mongers always hopped up on war war war. at least in my view exposed them as not being competent leaders.

    at this present time we need a leader like Trump, a non interventionist (not a war monger), with experience on the world stage, seeing the big picture, who can work through the isle well, a manager and a winner and a businessman who loves America, has proven vision and leadership in those areas who will create an atmosphere in which we even will be able to work on the social issues. not the other way around. that deciding issue is THE ECONOMY and being a good steward of money. and who can win a general election.

    Trump does have a good share of us but if this poll is accurate and at this time, Carson has more of them. of course it is still early and Trump is not done campaigning there so best to wait. but from my visits to those “polite” evangelical sites Carson is being touted more than Trump: think David Brody. but also we should remember this is nothing new for Iowa. Cruz yes, he is an evangelical but he’s being seen as someone who rocks boats, again not a “polite evangelical” like THEM. and waving a bible to them perhaps even seen as an insult in their minds. they want their president leading prayer groups and bible studies and taking all his decisions to the prayer closet. nothing wrong with that, however i notice that the ones that do really in fact all buy into Washington’s narrative and strapped in bondage to their 301-C’s. hardly what i would expect if they were truly seeking God’s wisdom.

    i remember Huckabee from 2008. Iowa is not the deciding state, although would be good for momentum seems to me to be the Santorum evangelical loudest statement of the race. after that more moderate voices carry. Leading in most of the other states with a New Hampshire win is more telling of who will get a nomination, rather than who is ahead in Iowa.

    so this is my narrative LOL! and how i view things. i don’t expect others to see it this way, just thought i’d share what i see having been one of them for many years prior. don’t get me wrong i am still an evangelical and a big prayer room warrior, but i prefer rocking the boat when wickedness presents itself. and i see what capitulating has done to this country: his name is OBAMA!

    Liked by 5 people

    • PremAmerica says:

      Here is a simple fact that will make you sit up……

      In Des Moines county 4 years ago Santorum won with 388 votes out of 1350 caucus goers….. Yesterday, Trump had over 3000 people at his rally!!

      Do you think the “likely voter” model in this poll could possibly account for this phenomenon?

      Trump’s is a “movement” candidacy. Likely voter models based on historical turnout patterns can’t come close to capturing his true support.

      Liked by 7 people

      • YAY PremAmerica! WoW! thanks! so it is the turnout and not the polls! i’ve been focusing on the wrong thing: the polls!
        this could be tiger style politics eh? STEALTH! everyone thinking Santorum and Carson and suddenly that Trump tiger comes of the bush and pounces and takes Iowa!! grrrrrrrrr Trump!

        Like

      • Ono says:

        Still early in Iowa! Dial back to Trumps rally a few weeks back and he brought an undecided Dan Gable on Stage. Should Dan Gable go Trump, then bet the farm Iowa will as well. Gable did not endorse Trump at the rally, saying that he wanted to hear what he had to say first. He did however take a Trump “Make America Great Again” hat and put it on.

        Iowa is Dan Gable…Dan Gable is Iowa

        Liked by 1 person

    • sandraopines says:

      My views tend to be very near yours Monique on almost every subject.

      Liked by 1 person

  21. rsmith1776 says:

    I’m sorry I am not going to dignify my attention a poll in which Jindahl and Fiorina are within MOE of each other.

    Not your fault Sundance. I don’t think I am going to take seriously the whole Iowa caucuses theater either.

    Liked by 4 people

  22. flyanddive says:

    If you say the Earth is 6000 years old, you are going to win Iowa, but lose every other state.

    Liked by 1 person

  23. IW84NO1 says:

    On Ben Carson….spread this far and wide…
    BEN CARSON TEAMS UP WITH AL SHARPTON http://www.newswithviews.com/Nelson/kelleigh251.htm Also note his connection in the article with Farrakhan!!!

    Liked by 2 people

  24. fred says:

    Time to really get serious with eyes wide open. If the establishment can turn the Freedom caucus to support the devil himself in their eyes then the power is strong. The force is working overtime and one of the pawns is getting settled in as speaker. Tea party people claim they were blind sided and I’ll have to go with that but the degree is amazing. They got Paul Ryan the very worst installed through payoffs or threats. The same will be used against Trump and it’s coming soon.

    Like

    • chili palmer says:

      Today, 10/22, Rush Limbaugh said the Freedom Caucus isn’t what a lot of conservatives think it is. He said they wanted Boehner out not because of ideas or ideology but because of the way he ran the place, punishments, etc. They’re not the ideological hardliners they’re portrayed to be.

      Liked by 3 people

      • kallibella says:

        I heard Rush say that today and I felt so let down about it. It is as if conservatives are encountering obstacles at almost every turn from people from within and from the outside. No wonder the so-called Freedom Caucus believed Paul Ryan and now he is actively seeking the Speaker position.

        Like

  25. TheTorch says:

    People concerned about this IOWA poll, should take a few things into consideration:

    This is the only poll that shows this at the moment (we have not seen any other polls yet), so this could be an outlier or a trend we simply do not know. I suspect this is an outlier, due to the swing.

    This poll will not take into consideration the huge rally and Trumps local media exposure he had the other day in IOWA and postive coverage as a result of that, as the poll was taken before that. Also I don’t think he has even visited the part of IOWA he went to before, since he announced.

    This will not factor in some other positive media coverage recently, i.e Fox News Sunday (1.6 mil audience) and the aftermath of the 911 comments and Bush (foot in mouth) etc.

    We really need to see a poll that takes the above into consideration, if the next IOWA poll from Quinnipiac or another polling outlet shows Carson with a lead, then it is reasonable to assume a trend and not an outlier. But in this scenario and because it is would be happening so early, it is correctable, just requires more hard work to be done in the state and a few additional rallies and local events added to the schedule than planned.

    Ordinarily IOWA is not that important, I mean it voted for Rick Santorum. BUT because of the GOPe plans it would help them to create a narrative pretty early on, if it looks like Carson is the likely winner of IOWA. This may be a case, where actually an early AD spend, might make sense, to dent not only any attack ads, but also to level the playing field so to speak. The advantage of Trump winning IOWA is that it adds to his Conservative credentials very early in the process and helps to build momentum, it also will have the added benefit of putting the GOPe in a further state of panic, because they won’t be able to control the narrative early, they will of lost it.

    IOWA is also the only state that Carson will be likely to win, so if he fails to nab this one, then I doubt he will get any. If that happens, then he will likely end his campaign after IOWA, and that is when Trump can consider a VP option or something else for Carson’s support, which could then lead to a potential nightmare scenario for the GOPe, because if part of Carson’s support switches to Trump, then it is game over for the GOPe and pretty early on.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Sandra says:

      I’m not concerned until I see a definite trend. One single poll means little, like that weird IBD poll that had Trump 24 Carson 23 nationwide. The subsequent polls were back to numbers we are used to seeing.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Thank you Torch and PremAmerica! So it is not a stealth tiger who will take Iowa, but a streak of tigers!! AMBUSH! OMG! This puts a great visualization for the imagination and thus for prayers! Trump will win with sheer numbers and not a stealth one man tiger!

      Trump supporters to Iowa caucus even through the snow!

      REF: “What is a group of tigers called?”
      A group of tigers is called a ‘streak’ or an ‘ambush’. In the wild tiger is known for not staying in groups and are solitary animals. However, man-made environment may force them into unnatural social groups. A tigress and her cubs may also be referred to as a streak or an ambush.

      Liked by 2 people

  26. SoldierI says:

    12 point drop, sound like the same poll that said Trump drop in the polls after debate, but end up as lie.

    Liked by 1 person

  27. wullfe says:

    . Terrible day. Wisconsin: Carson 20%. Trump 18%. Long lines at Carson’s book signing.

    Like

    • amjean says:

      Where in Wisconsin and what demographic?

      Like

      • wullfe says:

        It’s on Carson’s Twitter page. @realbencarson. They’re doing quite a bit of celebrating there.

        I’m not going to sleep tonight!

        Like

          • Sandra says:

            Big margin of error on that one, +/- 6.4% The entire sample was 603 people and 40% were asked to choose the Republican candidate. With that big margin of error Trump could have 24 and Carson 14. 🙂

            Like

            • Sandra says:

              By the way, 10% of the participants stated that they were going to vote in both primaries. Is that possible in Wisconsin???

              Like

            • wullfe says:

              Yes, something isn’t right. Trump’s been to Iowa, what, about 5 times, getting huge crowds? See this write up today, Oct 22, in The Iowa Republican. Here’s an excerpt.

              “When you look at Trump’s crowds across the state, it’s not inconceivable that he could turn out 60,000 people to caucus for him, which would be twice as much as Santorum got in 2012, and 20,000 more votes than Huckabee received in 2008. Many in the media have tried to predict the demise of Trump’s campaign, but it may be time to start estimating how much support he can turn out in a state like Iowa.”

              http://theiowarepublican.com/2015/trumps-impact-on-caucus-turnout-could-be-yuuuuge/

              Anyone catch Sean Hannity and New Gingrich? Very fair and good discussion about Trump’s very high poll numbers in other states and GOP’s poll, asking what happened in Iowa. Newt suggested it could be evangelicals. Said Trump needs to do more rallies.

              Like

              • jello333 says:

                “Newt suggested it could be evangelicals. Said Trump needs to do more rallies.”

                Maybe it’s time for Brother Don’s Travelling Salvation Show!

                Liked by 3 people

                • phil fan says:

                  Absolutely, and sincerely done. Just humbly from his heart = “I want our land to be free, free to worship our God and His Son”. Talk a little about his early religious church exposure to Norman Vincent Peale. Low key, from the heart.

                  Like

      • phil fan says:

        A poll of ‘public radio’ listeners = NPR. Just a survey of their listeners, timed for release w/ the IOWA poll which itself was held back (timing). Pure liberal bunk

        Like

    • sundance says:

      There is never a single poll from Wisconsin that is trustworthy. None.

      It’s a weird state that way. Go back to Scott Walker ’10, ’12 and all the judge elections – recall elections – etc. Not a single poll even close to accurate and there were dozens.

      When it comes to polling and Wisconsin, I don’t even consider them nor give them any time. It’s a weird state that way. FWIW

      Liked by 8 people

      • and Wisconsin is after New Hampshire and South Carolina where Trump will win and momentum will be high! Carson probably won’t even win Iowa either. By the time Wisconsin comes around he will be back where he belongs: with the rest of the pack!

        Like

    • Sandra says:

      Who exactly needs the illegal labor? Family farms or corporate farms? I hope someone can explain this to me.

      Like

      • Melania for 1st Lady says:

        I think you’re a pretty sharp cookie and your questions were rhetorical, but I’ll answer.

        Obviously it’s the agri-business corporations that need illegals. I live near an Amish community. Rather than import third-world children to work for slave wages, the Amish have this funny, old-fashioned strategy to produce the labour needed to help out on their family farms and in their family businesses: they have children!

        I consider myself to be very right-wing. I support small farms, family farms. Many of these farms are organic and I support that too, despite the fact that I can’t stand many of the left-wing idiots who talk about organic this and gluten free that. There is nothing “conservative” or “right-wing” about spraying poisons on food and using harmful farming practices that destroy the long-term health and fertility of the land – God’s Creation.

        I think there is a myth/brainwashing campaign that “people on the right support agri-business” and “people on the left support family farms”. Kind of like the myth that people on the right were opposed to taxing hedge-fund guys. Everyone thought this was gospel until Trump said “I’m going to tax hedge-fund guys” and all of us right-wingers said “sounds good!” The media likes to say that this “isn’t conservative”. People like Glenn Beck say that Trump is leading us down a dangerous road. No he isn’t. We’ve always been on this road but nobody – until Trump – gave us a voice. Nobody is really against taxing hedge-fund guys other than a few of their bought-and-paid-for Rino congressmen/senators. Nobody really likes big agribusiness other than the Rinos who’ve accepted agri-business lobbyist bribes.

        I think some folks on the right are reflexivly against small organic family farms simply because they associate the whole thing with hippies. This is a mistake. The Right (by Right I don’t necessarily mean Republican…..but it would be nice if Repubs would represent us) would be wise to embrace small farms and, to some degree, environmentalism. I consider myself an environmentalist. I would hate to see the place where I hunt squirrels turned into a Wal-Mart. We don’t have to become PETA members or start worshipping Mother Earth. But there is nothing conservative about the outright abuse of animals that goes on in many feedlots and factory-farm chicken houses. We can still mine coal. I’m all in favor of that. But the mountaintop-removal methods being practiced, especially in West Virginia, are destroying God’s Creation. It’s also causing job loss – miners are no longer needed if you just blow the mountain up instead of mining it. An embrace of common-sense environmentalism would help us with young people as well as women – young mothers concerned about pesticides on their kids’ food – people who want to take care of the land but aren’t totally on-board with the lunatic left fringe environmentalists. We (the Right) need to give these folks a common-sense alternative to left-wing lunacy. Simply opposing the Left doesn’t count as an alternative.

        And stop bitching about the price of a tomato going up if we deport the illegals and pay Americans to pick crops. THAT’S what you’re willing to sell your country up the river for? Cheap tomatoes? Really?

        Sorry. Rant over.

        Liked by 4 people

        • michellc says:

          Since I’m a family farm, although you don’t make a living by being a family farm these days, so it’s truly more about feeding ourselves, I support family farms. With that said though I can’t agree with you about organic farming. Just because something is “natural” doesn’t make it safe and there are times when chemicals are necessary and used correctly are not harmful.
          In addition if you raise animals on a certified organic farm you can never give an animal an antibiotic and keep it on the farm. It must be documented and then removed and too many then you’ll lose your certification. I have seen animals suffer and die because they withhold antibiotics, over easily cured things such as uterine infections, pneumonia, etc. It is stupid and imho cruel.
          For me it’s not because I’m on the right, it’s because it’s my life experience and people have went stupid when it comes to “organic.” No chemicals whatsoever, whether it’s de-worming and vaccinations. I do believe you can still be certified organic and de-worm and vaccinate, but I could be wrong about that, but many of these organic farms, some of which are newcomers to farming and ranching won’t even de-worm or vaccinate their animals and now we’re seeing diseases that haven’t been around in 50 years making a comeback.

          Myself, I buy nothing organic and I wouldn’t eat it if you paid me to.

          There is such a thing as common sense and there is a middle ground where you don’t feed animals growth hormones or steroids or Ractopamine but you do give antibiotics when needed when an animal has an infection or to prevent coccidia and animals need to be de-wormed and they need vaccinations. It’s a waste to use “natural” products when they aren’t working and you watch your crop being destroyed by pests and although we use manure in our gardens in the offseason as fertilizer, raw sewage is another matter and sometimes plants do need more fertilizer than the manure provided.

          There is also a place for big ag because there are not enough and will not be enough of us family farmers to ever provide the amount of food needed to feed everyone who doesn’t raise their own food. In order to do that animals will have to continue being raised in commercial barns and feed lots. Not all of big ag are bad or cruel to animals just as not all family farmers treat their animals well. A lot of times what people consider is cruel is not cruel at all such as chickens in cages, when my kids showed chickens they lived in cages and they were just as healthy and fed just as well, actually better, as the chickens who ran free. Plus, if I was going to buy store bought eggs I would buy eggs from a caged hen over a cage free egg because there is a lot less danger of the egg being contaminated. Chickens crap all over eggs laid on the ground or in a nest. Farrowing crates for pigs, not all sows are careful sows and I would imagine being a 5lb pig crushed by a sow that weighs hundreds of pounds is not a pleasant way to die. Plus some sows are mean when in labor and especially after given birth and I’m going to choose the well being of a human any day over an animal. As for feedlots, I’ve been to many feedlots and those cows have hay at all times along with are fed grain. Yes, they’re not out in a pasture, but many of them came from a pasture. When we’re raising a cow/steer to butcher, we always pen it up the last 60 days and we feed it hay and grain and go heavy on the corn because after a lifetime of raising our own beef and trying it different ways, a cow fed corn those last 60 days makes the meat taste better and makes it have better marbling. For those who disagree, that’s fine with me I could care less if they want to eat only grass fed beef or not, but when it’s my money and my cow I want what I prefer to eat.
          There are some things I don’t like about factory farming and things I don’t agree with and growth hormones and ractopamine are two of them. I wouldn’t raise my animals on concrete either, but I also know it’s a fact of life and raising many in confined areas is going to continue because a lot of people depend on their food coming from grocery stores.

          I could go on all day, because I have a lot of pet peeves when it comes to a lot I hear about farming, but I will stop boring everyone to tears and just finish with the only way to ever stop the need for factory farming is for a lot more people to start raising their own food and I don’t see that happening as long as there are grocery stores.

          Liked by 3 people

          • Garrison Hall says:

            . . . but I will stop boring everyone to tears . . .

            Your comments are eloquent. Although people sometimes don’t want to hear it, the truth is never boring.

            Liked by 2 people

            • michellc says:

              Thank you, although I know I bore folks to tears. I also make many of them think I’m cold hearted or support animal cruelty.
              It honestly sometimes makes me laugh because when it comes to my animals for the most part they’re all on pasture or dirt(pigs) but because we use farrowing crates or we face reality that factory farming is necessary we don’t care about animals.
              Not all the time, but often this comes from folks who would never go out into an ice storm or thunderstorm in the middle of the night to pull a calf or a kid goat or help deliver a litter of pigs. They wouldn’t bring an animal into the house and put it in front of the fire to warm it up. They wouldn’t do everything in their power to get a newborn animal to live, including giving them your own breath, but will freak out when you know it’s a lost cause and you stop trying.

              I guess I don’t like being lectured about what is cruel and what is not by folks who buy from family farms so they know what is right and wrong. My response to that is always, “well good for you, try raising them yourself, then we’ll talk.”

              Like

          • Melania for 1st Lady says:

            You bring up some good points, some of which I agree with.

            You say that a family farm can’t make a living these days. True enough. But why is that? We had millions of family farms quite recently in our history that made money. The problem is that the factory farms cheat – they hire third-world labor off the books. Donald often says that rather than “free trade” we need “fair trade”. To compare this to farming, Rino Republicans think of agribusiness factory farming as “free farming” but what we need is fair farming. How can the little guy compete when the corporate farms have lobbyists that can get them slave labor and subsidies and whatever else they want? This is one reason I support Donald – he is not beholden to lobbyists.

            I often hear that we need factory-farm methods to “feed the world”. Excuse me? Let the world feed itself. Family farms fed America before and they can do it again. Not just farms – I would like to see a revival of the “victory gardens” of WWII. City dwellers and suburbanites can and should take some responsibility for feeding themselves whether by raising chickens or raising vegetables. American kids need some connection to the food chain. Growing food is patriotic and all Americans should be urged to do so. Yes, in my ideal world food prices would be higher. But this would be offset by people growing some of their own. Don’t want to grow your own? Fine, but you will in effect pay a laziness tax as a result of purchasing all your food.

            Your assertion that cage-raised chickens are just as good as chickens who have access to earth and sky is troubling to me. I’m not sure what size of cages you’re referencing but all the factory farm cages I’ve seen are too small for the birds to even turn around. That is, in my view and most people’s view, animal abuse. I’m no tree-hugger but confining an animal in a space where it can never walk or turn around is simple cruelty. Chickens can be raised in larger cages and they can be raised outside in fresh air. Why is this not done? It would be more expensive. In a nation where more than half are overweight and a third are obese we are worried about McNuggets being too expensive. This is ludicrous. Chicken should be more expensive and anyone who has a problem with it and doesn’t want to pay the costs of what it takes to humanely and safely get a chicken from farm to dinner plate should either raise their own or do without. You may think that raising chickens in cages and packing 100,000 cattle into a feedlot that is no more than a couple acres is not cruel – or maybe you just don’t care whether it’s cruel or not. That attitude however, will turn off young people, especially young women, in huge numbers.

            I don’t know why you say you would not eat organic “even if someone paid you” to. I buy organic things from my Amish friends all the time. These are good Christian people. They pay taxes but because of their religion they take absolutely no govt. money – no welfare, no foodstamps, no social security or medicare, no farm subsidies. They have the crazy idea that, rather than depend on the govt. to take care of them with soc. security when they are old they will instead have children and the children will eventually take care of the parents. This is what a normal, healthy society does. Even if your organic food doesn’t come from a nice Amish farm, it most likely comes from a smaller farm, probably a family owned farm. It’s harder to have a huge organic farm because you can’t use all the chemical pesticides and herbicides and fertilizers so most organic farms are on a more human scale. On the other hand, when you buy non-organic food that came from a giant factory farm, you are almost certainly supporting illegal invaders and scumbag special-interest lobbyists.

            Again, I really think the reason a lot of folks on the Right turn up their noses at organic farming and organic food is because they associate it with hippies. Like a reflex they say “If the hippies are for it then I’m against it”. I hate hippies too which is why I won’t let them claim small farms, organic farms, or family farms as “their thing”. Lots of young people are interested in farming these days. This is fertile ground where the Right can make gains but unfortunately “our” party – the Republicans – is completely beholden to special interests. The Republicans will take whatever position their corporate lobbyists tell them to with regards to agriculture. Maybe The Donald will start to change that.

            Liked by 1 person

            • michellc says:

              I will agree with you about illegals.
              However, it is fantasy that there can be enough of us to feed everyone. There isn’t enough land in most states anymore to make that possible. Farm land has been turned into gated communities.
              I’m a born and raised okie, however I also spent a lot of my raising time in Arkansas and have been in many chicken barns in my life. Although I wouldn’t raise chickens inside under a light, clip their beaks and burn them out by 2 years old, it’s been done for generations now. I don’t believe in allowing emotions to control my way of thinking. Chickens are stupid, nasty animals and pretty much all chickens care about is eating. I’m sorry that I put humans above chickens and I can tell you when you’re mass producing eggs to provide eggs for all the people who don’t produce their own eggs, hens in cages laying eggs that aren’t being pooped on and are having as little human contact as possible are safer for humans to eat than eggs that are pooped on and have more human contact. Now they aren’t eggs I would eat because store bought eggs are tasteless after you’ve lived on farm fresh eggs.
              It’s my experience though that more often than not the same people complaining about the “poor” chickens are the same people who either are vegans or don’t raise their own chickens and buy their eggs from local farmers. Now, I’m not saying you shouldn’t buy your eggs from local farmers, but if every person wanted to do that there wouldn’t be enough eggs to go around and if you aren’t feeding yourself then you really shouldn’t be complaining about the “poor” chickens. Now you may or may not fall into that category, I’m just speaking of most I’ve dealt with. And you say chickens should cost more, just exactly how much do you think a chicken should cost? The last time I looked at prices of chickens in the store, $8 to $10 for a chicken seemed pretty expensive to me. Although, still in reality when you calculate in the cost now it’s still fairly cheap, there is a lot of feed that goes into a chicken, then you have to incubate the eggs, which takes electricity to run the incubators, then the expensive chick starter to raise that chick up on, plus electricity to run the heat lamp to keep it warm, then more feed before it’s butchering age. When we’re incubating, hatching and brooding chicks our electric bill goes up about $20/month. Then you add in the feed and we probably have at least $10 in every chicken, maybe more and that’s not including our time and then we spend more time processing it.

              We sell the majority of our weaned calves at auctions and they are more often than not bought by meat buyers. We sell a few off the farm and keep back some replacements and keep back one a year for us to eat and the rest go to market. Land is valuable and we don’t have enough of it to raise all of them until butchering age and at that point as anyone in cattle can tell you your profit level goes way down as does the price per pound you can get. The feed lots finish them out. Once again God ain’t making anymore land and to produce the tons of meat needed a year feed lots are the only way to do that.
              I can take you to feed lots and show you that they aren’t standing in their own feces and always have access to fresh hay and water and are grained every day. Yes, they aren’t out on green pasture, but again I argue if you’re not raising your own beef then you don’t have a lot of room to complain. If you don’t want to eat feed lot meat then that is your right and we will always sell a weaned calf at market price to anyone who wants to finish one off. There are some farmers who do finish them out and will sell you the meat and cut out the middle man. We did it for awhile but then we found people were stunned that we were charging them $3.50/lb hanging weight and they pay for processing. Then you get those who don’t understand you can’t get all steaks, a cow only makes so many steaks.
              We’ve done it with pigs as well and then we’ve gotten those people who don’t understand why they can’t just get all bacon.

              As for kids being interested, I see kids every day leaving the farms, not interested in continuing farming, because it’s not an easy life. That’s why the average age of farmers is going up not down. Again, I believe in reality, not what I want reality to be.
              I also live in an Amish and Mennonite community and often buy apple butter and some jellies and bread from them because I can buy it from them for less than I can make it. Something else we buy from them is chemical fertilizer and insecticides. Because we don’t need tons of it and they do buy it in bulk, we can go buy what we need from them less than we can at the store. So maybe some Amish never use chemicals, but not all Amish. Even the Amish are branching out to make a living by opening stores to sell their goods.
              Also, again to say all Amish are kind to their animals is not reality.

              I honestly also don’t understand exactly how much you want people to pay for food? Food costs are already high.
              I care about animals and I care about what I eat, besides the fact we enjoy what we do even with all the hard work and heartbreaks, we want to know what is in our food and first and foremost we do it to feed our family.
              Spending the majority of our lives in a rural community, we also know what being poor is. We also know not everyone in even rural communities can afford to raise all of their own food and if them being able to afford to buy meat and eggs means a chicken must be kept in a cage or a pig must be raised in a concrete floor barn or a cow raised in a feed lot, I’m going to choose the living person every time over the animal. Again, I live in reality not what I want reality to be and the reality is it’s the only way it’s possible to provide food for everyone.
              To say it’s because we think organic folks are hippies is nonsense. We use natural methods when they work, when they don’t then we have common sense and use what does. We also use common sense and don’t watch our animals die when we can give them antibiotics to cure them and neither do we allow our animals to die from preventable diseases by giving them vaccinations and we don’t watch them die from worms when we can get rid of them.

              So no, I won’t buy organic, many of these organic farmers use raw sewage as fertilizer and it’s going to make you sick long before an insecticide will. Many organic farms use so called natural products for de-worming that farmers learned a long time ago only work part of the time, if at all. Many organic farmers don’t vaccinate their animals from preventable diseases, some that were eradicated before the organic craze and are now coming back. They also do not give them antibiotics when it could save the animal’s life. Guess where much of this meat goes? I don’t want to eat diseased, wormy meat.

              The funny thing is probably 90% of the time our veggies would be deemed organic because we only use chemicals when necessary. However, we have some common sense and have been doing this for a long time and know when chemicals are needed to not lose our harvest. We’re not going to feel all good about ourselves for not using chemicals when we have no produce to eat.
              Our chickens or our eggs I guess would never be considered organic because we never raise chicks without coccidia prevention, because we learned from a lifetime of experience that prevention is a lot easier than treating it, with a lot less lives lost.
              Most of the time our pigs, goats and cows would be considered organic if you exclude chemical de-wormers and vaccinations, but again we have common sense and are not going to feel all good about ourselves for not using an antibiotic while we watch our animal die.

              I guess the moral of my story is when you live this life and have lived this life since you were born, you learn that you better not let emotions guide your way.
              Emotions is where much of this stuff comes from, people with emotions who are brand new to farming or people who have never farmed in their life. They see a picture and get all weepy even if that picture really isn’t representative of reality. They hear we have antibiotic resistance because they’re putting antibiotics into our food. Yet, here I am who has been raised on food that had antibiotics in it, my father used antibiotics more than we do and used them as a preventative in all of our animals and I don’t have a resistance to antibiotics. Then again, I’ve never been one to run to the doctor every time I had a sniffle and only took antibiotics when I had a bacterial infection.

              Liked by 1 person

              • Melania for 1st Lady says:

                Wow. didn’t know I was putting chickens above humans when I said a chicken ought to have enough room to turn around at some point in its life. Guess that makes me a limp-wristed vegan.

                What it boils down to is this: we could do things the right way but that’s too expensive so let’s do it nasty. This ideology that values cheapness over quality has gotten us into this mess. Fact: most things can be made cheaper in foreign countries – whether food or cars – because of slave labor (though we import some of that), horrible environmental practices etc. Donald wants to charge foreigners who sell in the US a tax – he talks about the Ford plant all the time, saying that if they want to build in Mexico they will have to pay a 25% tax to bring those foreign-made cars into the US. Some people whine “but that’ll make the cars more expensive!” Of course it will. Unless Americans are willing to lower their wages to third-world slave wages and lower our quality of life to third world standards then we have to do it. Gotta do it.

                I don’t pray to the God of cheap crap. Maybe you do. Too many people think like that and that is why store shelves are full of made in China crap and unemployed Americans who used to work at the factories we no longer have can’t even afford that.

                Like

                • michellc says:

                  It is nasty and cruel in your opinion.

                  Let me give you an example of why folks opinions and emotions shouldn’t be what guides us. First though, I want to say whatever is the safest for humans should be the first thing we’re concerned with and whether you want to believe it or not there is less chance of contamination of eggs from caged chickens. I will also tell you something else about chickens, a stressed hen will not lay eggs, a sick hen will not lay eggs. I have not went into every laying house in the country but those I’ve been into the hen could stand up and she could turn around. No, they can’t stretch their wings or scratch in the dirt or sun themselves, but if they were in dire straits as it’s made out they are they wouldn’t be laying eggs.

                  Now on to my story, in the same day I had two people call who were interested in buying a feeder piglet. Both people asked some of the same questions, the same questions were:
                  1. Do you clip your pigs needle teeth?
                  2. Do you dock your pigs tails?
                  3. Do you notch your pigs ears?
                  4. Do you farrow in crates, pens or pasture?

                  My answers were the same to both.
                  1. Yes we clip their teeth.
                  2.No, we don’t dock their tails.
                  3. Yes, we notch their ears.
                  4. Depends on the pig, some farrow in a pen, some farrow in a crate and we’ve always done it both ways.

                  One person wanted their teeth clipped, ears notched, and their tails docked. He wanted to know why we didn’t dock their tails and didn’t like my answer that in all the years we’ve raised pigs, we’ve never had a piglet chew on or bite off another piglets tail. We also use the tail as a physical way to tell if a pig is healthy. A curled tail means a healthy happy pig. A straight tail is a sign the pig may be getting sick or is not getting enough nutrition. He thought we were crazy and had no clue to what we were doing. He also thought we were begging for trouble by not always using a crate. I guess he had never learned to watch his pigs and know which ones are careful enough to allow to farrow in a pen, because our gilts have always went into a crate and how they did determined if future litters would be farrowed in a crate or pen. If careful sows who didn’t try to eat us the next time we felt comfortable with them in a pen. If not careful or if they try to eat us then they go in a crate.

                  The second person was appalled that we would be so cruel to mutilate the poor piglets. And how could we force a pig into a crate where they can’t turn around, that was just beyond cruel. This person was also against castration and against pigs being in pens and thought that all pigs should be pastured raised and it was abuse to castrate and not allow them to run on pasture.

                  The moral of my story is what one person considers cruelty is not what another considers cruelty. How one person thinks it should be done is not always necessary and sometimes is harmful to not only the humans involved but the piglets. Now when one of these people get another group of people who scream the loudest they start dictating how it should be done by everyone and then they run to the government and demand laws dictating their opinion even if they don’t know what they’re talking about and no matter how many people who have the experience say it’s going to cause harm the way they want it done.

                  Now, this first person did what people should do in a free market, he said he wouldn’t be buying a pig from us because he thought he needed a pig with a docked tail. That is his right and the way it is supposed to work. He didn’t go on a rant of how somebody or some law should force us to dock tails.

                  The second person did what an emotional, I scream the loudest and I know the best way does. She went on a rant about how there should be laws against abusing animals. I’m sure she had lots more to say that I didn’t hear after that because I did what I have the right to do and hung up on her rant.

                  Sometimes, it’s best to quit trying to argue with a person who wants to see only what they want to see.

                  Which, is why I’m going to stop arguing with you. You can only see what you want to see that factory farming is cruel and by damn you don’t care and won’t listen to the fact that we live in a world where the majority depend on buying their food from others and that us farmers who may or may not do it the way you think it should be done can’t provide enough food for everyone.

                  Me, I’m on the side of I don’t like some of what goes on on factory farms and it’s not how we do it and it’s not how we would ever do it. However, the amount of food we provide for those who depend on buying their food is a drop in the bucket compared to the food factory farms provide. I’ve never been a factory farmer, so it’s not for me to tell them how to do it right. However, since my main concern is Ractopamine, I do what you do in a free market and I don’t buy meat from the grocery store. We raise our own and if we’re running low on bacon or hamburger before our next animal is processed, we buy our meat from a local butcher who raises his own animals to butcher that are not fed Ractopamine.
                  Now, I think once more people become aware of ractopamine that the factory farmers and regular farmers will stop using it, because that again is how a free market works. But, I’m not going to advocate for the end of factory farming or advocate for the government to dictate how many animals they should keep in a certain area. Because the truth is they know a lot more about it than I do and they’re doing some things right because you never see a shortage of meat in the grocery store and once again, sick animals or stressed animals or animals not being fed enough don’t grow well.

                  If though you’re truly conservative and believe in the constitution and conservative values then you wouldn’t want these people dictated to and over regulated. You’d do what the first guy in my story did and stop buying any food from the grocery store. Then if enough feel the same way you do, factory farms would try to change doing things to a way that would satisfy more people. Dictation, over regulation leads to fewer factory farms, but then it trickles down to family farms and before long you won’t have anyone raising food.

                  Like

              • michellc says:

                Also, I am not anti-organic, just like I am not anti-pastured raised pigs or grass fed beef. I’m more of a person who believes in it’s your property, do what you want. If you want to raise organic food and eat organic food, more power to you and I won’t say a thing unless you start telling me I shouldn’t be raising my food non-organic or your animals start contracting diseases that endanger mine before mine have been vaccinated. I also think there is room for all of us, those who want organic and those of us who don’t want to raise or eat organic food. However, I also believe you should give that same respect to others. Don’t call those of us who don’t believe in your methods cruel animal abusers who are destroying the environment.

                Also I don’t believe in living in a fantasy world and although there is much done on a factory farm that I personally wouldn’t do, don’t pretend that everyone is just itching to start farming or that there is even enough land for them to do it. Within five miles of me was a 3 generation farm and ranch. A mile section, half devoted to crops the other half to pasture for cattle. The final family member who wanted to keep it going passed away and his kids broke it up into chunks and sold it off. Now it’s residential land, several housing additions, 3 of which are gated communities and the rest small 1 to 10 acre lots with people living on the lots who don’t raise any food. They’re also the same people who complain about the farm that this is still hanging on by their fingernails across the road from them when they dump truck loads of manure on the ground to fertilize the ground and at least some of them are the same folks I see at the farmers’ market asking if the tomatoes were grown organically. That is happening across the country, which means fewer farmers, not more.
                Also the honest truth is if you’re not raising your own food, you are contributing to why we must have factory farms and why factory farms will remain a necessity. I also live in the reality it is not possible for everyone to raise their own food, never has been and never will be. Another reality is without factory farming and the constant pushing to destroy them and destroy any farmer who doesn’t raise their animals in the way you picture in your mind they should be raised is going to not only push out the factory farms, but the family farmer as well. Then what little food is available is going to be so expensive only billionaires will be able to afford to buy it.

                Like

        • liberty2828 says:

          I am right with you. I have a family farm with help from my children and my Ranch foreman, who is here legally and has been with me for 20 years. I provide housing for his family and helped pay for his family to renew their legal status.
          I also hire local independent contractors to do things for me. We are totally organic, my son is a bee keeper, take pride in taking care of our land, grow some of our own food, buy at farmers markets and are self sustaining in case of emergency. We strongly support the 2nd amendment and bridge a broad range of views that don’t fit neatly into other people’s categories.
          Trump covers so many bases for many people like us, which is why he is drawing from a broad base of support. I put my Trump sticker on my truck today and feel so excited for the future of our country for the first time in years.

          Liked by 2 people

  28. Piper says:

    I would just like to say THANK YOU to all you treepers- I felt like someone popped my balloon this morning after I read that poll and went around all day kicking rocks! It wasn’t until this afternoon, reading you all’s responses that the fog in my head cleared. Thanks to everyone for being so “vocal”, this is the only site I can go to daily (heck, almost hourly) and get my Trump boost. It’s going to be a L O N G political fight and I’m so thankful to have found you all! Trump 2016 Keep Stump’n!

    Liked by 5 people

    • JRD says:

      Geez, the corrupt establishment hasn’t even started their attack yet.

      Trump’s a street fighter. Do you believe in him or not? He’s not going to roll over and play dead.

      Liked by 8 people

      • Piper says:

        JRD-I totally believe Trump, his ego is too big to give up easily (that’s NOT a criticism, I love that about him), I’m just beat down since Bush’s second term, then the horror show of these last 7 years! I just want a win, I want the inmates who have been running this asylum locked back up. We’ve taken so, SO many hits these last years-obama hussein’s election, obamacare, gay marriage, we lost Iraq, etc., etc. and the hits just keep coming. Then we’ve had crap candidates McCain and Romney that sucked- I feel that Trump is too good to be true, and then I worry TPTB will kill him or hurt his family- so many things- I just need to pray harder and focus. I’ve offered to volunteer for him, got the bumper sticker, pinterest board, take every opportunity to change hearts and minds- I’m ready for a win! I’ve been a scrapper all my life and you’re right, what the crap is wrong with me, I’ve become a little apathetic, thanks for your post- it was what I needed to hear!!

        Liked by 1 person

    • It’s okay, what’s important is you came to the water hole for a drink! I think the rocks were trying to tell you something! Next time don’t kick them just remember what a rock is: strength! and a bunch of them even better!

      Liked by 2 people

    • kallibella says:

      Piper, today has been a difficult day in many ways in our national life. Starting with having to put up with Hillary and her lies and her above-the-law attitude and the MSM covering for her and saying “move along. Nothing to see here,” is very hard for our patriot’s heart to take and take and take. We have been taking and taking for the last couple of decades at least.

      Then the Iowa poll, the Wisconsin poll and the intern Twitter comment make for a difficult day. Plus, the Ryan and Freedom Caucus don’t make things easier either. But let’s keep everything in the right perspective. Trump is a fighter. He is so competitive. He is not going to sit back and just take it without adequately responding, and when he responds he does to so to really derail the opponent for a few days at least.

      Even today, Jeb!ito was on Megyn Kelly’s and he is still talking about 9/11 !!! Wow! I thought to myself “he’s still harping on it,” while Trump moved on and in the interim went to Burlington, Iowa filled the town’s largest arena,and went back and may be up to his next event tomorrow or whatever, and JEB!ito is still talking about 9/11 !!! LOL Jeb!ito is discombobulated, that’s all. LOL

      Trump is a fighter! He will fight for America. He knows everybody is gunning for him. In many ways I think he loves it and thrives on that kind of challenge. You don’t get to be as massively successful as he is if one is timid and takes the attacks without answering back.
      Trump is well prepared to take them on and come out ahead, to our delight and great relieve!

      Liked by 2 people

      • jello333 says:

        “the intern Twitter comment”

        Just keep in mind that it was a REtweet. In other words, the intern herself didn’t make the comment… she just re-posted (retweeted) something a random person had posted earlier. And if what Donald says is true, about it being “accidental”, that probably means the intern was just quickly grabbing and retweeting all kinds of supporters’ comments, without bothering to read them closely first. Yes, even THAT shows some level of incompetence on her part, but nothing more.

        Liked by 1 person

      • TheTorch says:

        Jebby is lost, his balloon has been popped, by the mighty Trump.

        It is very sad really, he knows its over, but he can’t accept it. The waterboy has overtaken him which adds insult to injury.

        Someone should send him a new balloon, so Trump can pop it again.

        Liked by 2 people

      • Piper says:

        Kallibella-I’m not a typist, so my comments never have the depth I’m trying to get across, You said it all for me, thank you! I watched the hearing, as much as I could stomach at a time, and yes all of those things… you linked everything together beautifully. I was at home all day and watching every story unfold, drip, drip, drip -truly Chinese water torture stuff! I have a love hate relationship with days off work, too much time to devote to the news is not a good thing nowadays!

        Liked by 2 people

        • kallibella says:

          “Trust in the LORD and do good.” Psalm 37: 3. And, “The wicked plots against the righteous and gnashes his teeth at him, but the LORD laughs at the wicked, for He sees that his day is coming,” verse 12.
          Very comforting in all cases, especially in the case of the Hillary hearings.

          Like

      • sam says:

        I agree it’s a retweet but so many news outlet picked up on it and start their negative spin. Twitter in general is bunch of negatives and positives stuff and Trump like to retweet positive opinions. I also agree it’s one of his intern or worker cause he doesnt have time to always sit there and retweet.

        Check Jeb bush twitter he got a bunch of negatives bashing him

        Like

      • sam says:

        Also, even though paul ryan is probably going to the speaker of the house but he did not get the freedom caucus endorsement which means his terms itsnt met and they can still call a vacate to the speaker chair.

        Like

  29. General P. Malaise says:

    Carson won’t go far. he hasn’t got leadership abilities that Trump has.

    Liked by 2 people

  30. bob e says:

    we need another black politician like we need an outbreak of influenza.
    black politicians don’t represent the people.. they represent the black people
    carson should not even be considered for the presidency ..

    Liked by 2 people

  31. RINOKiller says:

    The crowds in Iowa and this “poll” doesn’t make sense.

    I was doing some research and this polling company is either not as good,or, in the middle of the pack with the rest of the unreliable polling companies.

    Like

    • Doodahdaze says:

      It is the sample they used. Also neither poll released their methodology. This is a tell. They are push polls for media lying programs.

      Like

  32. ZurichMike says:

    Since 1976, the only candidates to have (1) won Iowa and (2) gone on to become president were:

    Bush in 2000
    Obama in 2008

    Let’s not put too much into one state known for quirky caucus rules, late-night caucuses in the dead of winter, the urban / rural divide as well as impact of evangelicals and corn-subsidy thinking.

    We’re also looking at the “old model” of polling — those who likely attended a caucus in the past — this does not take into account the tsunami of support for Trump and potential caucus-goers — could be a real “raucous caucus” in a few months.

    Keep the faith!

    Liked by 1 person

  33. goodoldboy66 says:

    Peter Brown’s pole is firmly implanted in Ben.

    Like

  34. 22227z says:

    I have to say I was not happy w/Trump when he said that Ryan would be a Speaker that would be a uniter. Bad, bad, bad. Ryan is a horrible choice, and Trump should not support him.

    I do not understand why Carson is so popular. I can understand why people don’t like Donald, but I cannot begin to understand the love for Carson.

    Like

    • ZurichMike says:

      Ethanol subsidies — a big theme in Iowa. Carson supports this; Trump does not.
      Evangelicals — a big theme in Iowa, although Iowans haven’t figured out that Carson is 7th Day Adventist, not evangelical.
      More “white guilt” — this time from Republicans.

      Liked by 1 person

  35. wullfe says:

    The WND/Clout poll by Clout Research, a national opinion research company in Columbus, Ohio: Telephone survey Oct 15-19.

    Trump 33%, Carson 24%.

    http://www.wnd.com/2015/10/gop-ready-for-a-revolution-survey-reveals/#S1syGg9KtBOjMWIq.99

    Like

  36. ssupsky says:

    This poll, is it good or is it bad? Mayhap it shall encourage Mr. Trump to fight harder in Iowa. Do not forget also that he made a huge impression at the Iowa State Fair by giving rides to kids in his helicopter. The people at the fair, they are the ones that shall go out and vote for Mr. Trump. He laid the groundwork in the state already.

    Like

    • Doodahdaze says:

      This poll seems fishy to me. I can’t find the actual demographic by number of men and women. But….
      Carson gets 33% of women and 25% of men.
      Trump gets 24% of men and only 13% of women.
      Carson lead comes from women, but the poll does nat say how many women and how many men were sampled. At least I can not find it. If too many women were sampled it would skew the poll to Carson.

      Liked by 1 person

  37. sam says:

    Ben Carson is just drafting behind trump, any opponent he know out seem like carson suck up more votes than trump

    Like

  38. It’s official CARSON is the New King In Iowa!

    Second Poll confirms his front runner status!

    Des Moines Register/BLoomberg Poll: CARSON 28%, TRUMP 19%

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2015/10/23/gop-iowa-poll-ben-carson-donald-trump/74446364/?

    Like

    • mpmp2015 says:

      Yes, it is official (unfortunately), Carson is leading with Iowa Republicans. This could be the result of two factors. (1) Negative Club from Growth ads that knocked Trump on his non-conservative past. I think there was a delayed reaction to the ads and they are having some effect. (2) Carson’s positions on Muslims really resonates with Evangelical voters. Trump was more tepid in his Muslim positions because he still does have a lot of business partners in the Middle East and investments in that region, he can’t really go full postal on the Muslim question as Carson was able to do the last several weeks. This allowed Carson the opportunity to seize and issue that resonates with a significant block of religious Republican voters. The Muslim issue for Carson is the illegal immigration issue for Trump. Both are important issues appealing to different wings of the Republican conservative base. Trump had the Muslim issue in the bag for a few days after the NH plant that questioned Obama’s faith, but within days Carson doubled down on the Muslim issue and going much further right than Trump and fully seized that issue from Trump.

      Trump can respond either doing more events in Iowa or seize back the Muslim issue from Carson. Or just simply start running ads in Iowa. But how those ads play is tricky. Trump can’t afford to knock Carson and alienate his voters, so he could only really run a positive ad campaign about himself or a negative campaign knocking the GOPe and political class.

      This might be the beginning of the GOPe strategy playing out. They take out Trump with Carson, then destroy Carson the way they did Herman Cain. GOPe just needs to get Trump down to 3rd or 4th place and their own candidate in second place against a weaker opponent in Carson. It ends up with either Bush or Rubio waiting the wings to sneak into the nomination.

      Like

      • liberty2828 says:

        I have been wondering why Trump has not mentioned his plan to “send them all back” speaking about the Muslim migrants Obama wants to bring in with the help of the re-settlement organizations? Last several speeches he has not mentioned it.

        Like

  39. Sandra says:

    I’m still not buying that in two weeks Trump could go from +5 to -8, especially after Carson has made some really inflammatory remarks, way more inflammatory than anything Trump has said.

    Bloomberg had a teaser a short while ago, they declared Carson the “front runner” without mentioning that it’s limited to Iowa. The media is shameless.

    I notice in the DMR/Bloomberg poll that only 15% of Carson supporters are certain they’re sticking with him. Am I weird? I’ve made up my mind already.

    Liked by 1 person

    • mpmp2015 says:

      Those inflammatory remarks are made about Muslims, so they play extremely well with certain conservative voters in Iowa. Carson was smart to seize this issue and when called out on it, he didn’t apologize or backtrack, he doubled down, that was seen by many as a sign of strength and he is being rewarded in the polls.

      Like

  40. Sandra says:

    At the next debate, Trump is going to need to go on the offensive and tear apart Carson’s policies, especially Carson’s desire to end Medicare. Trump need not worry about any of the other candidates right now, just Carson. The media never presses Carson for details and they treat him like he’s some kind of endangered species, so the public is largely unaware of just how radical Carson is. It’s up to Trump to educate the public.

    Like

    • mpmp2015 says:

      The press “supports” Carson(as a means to an end) in order to take down Trump. Once Trump is in 3rd place and a GOPe candidate is at secured at second place, the media is going to attack Carson and push for a GOPe candidate; either Bush or Rubio.

      Once that happens, Trump’s in trouble, depending on how badly he wants to be president, he’ll have to spend a lot money to salvage the nomination or….break his pledge and run as a third party.

      Like

    • joanfoster says:

      The press treats every black candidate like an endangered species. I have a friend in Ohio who regularly post inspiration comments on her Facebook page. From time to time a picture of Sleepy Ben shows up with the comment “wisdom from a man of God”. There are some evangelicals who stop listening at that point. All they care about is the faith angle and not anything else. I frankly could care less whether a candidate talks about his/her faith or not, just let me talk about mine and don’t attack people of faith.

      Like

    • liberty2828 says:

      Trump can nicely bring up their differences not in attack mode. There are lots of them.
      http://www.newswithviews.com/Nelson/kelleigh251.htm

      Like

  41. JoeS says:

    I think Trump just has to spend some time in Iowa. He is going there Tuesday. He should just stay on message and possibly plan some retail politics like a bus trip or something where he creates surprise and just shows up in places unexpectedly. I think Carson support is softer, and Trump’s core are DUG IN.

    As far as the evangelical vote, Trump should try to win it, but not attack Carson. Trump does have some SERIOUS evangelical support (me for one). He should leverage it. Take a look at this from Rick Joyner (worth watching the WHOLE THING):

    https://www.morningstartv.com/prophetic-perspective-current-events/trajectory-donald-trump

    Like

  42. sam says:

    Don’t be discourage fellow trump supporters. Trump is still leading in everywhere other states. Just hope that trump don’t panic and the media don’t toot too much about this is the end of trump.

    Liked by 2 people

    • mpmp2015 says:

      Though since the first bad Iowa poll came out yesterday, the only news from Trump was a retweet that was done by mistake. After that, pretty much radio silence for yesterday aside from a few more retweets. Then the second bad poll from DMR/Bloomberg came out this morning and then more radio silence from Trump. Not sure what’s going on, Trump likes to be on top of the news cycle and he’s pretty much been absent since yesterday’s bad poll. Maybe he is meeting with his strategists on how handle this delicate situation.

      Obviously, the media wants his reaction to these two bad polls in Iowa and he is unavailable to do any interviews yesterday and today, which is uncharacteristic of Trump to avoid the media. Not sure what’s happening in camp Trump now…. His first official statements addressing the bad Iowa polls will be big news and I think he and his advisers are probably mulling it over.

      Like

  43. R-C says:

    This, on Drudge today–AFTER that latest “Trump is DOOMED in Iowa!” poll:

    http://www.politico.com/story/2015/10/insiders-trump-nomination-looking-more-likely-215087#ixzz3pNgfNdEW

    Liked by 2 people

  44. manickernel says:

    I just realized I am going to miss the little Bobbie Jindal head when he is finally gone from the squares.

    Liked by 2 people

    • liberty2828 says:

      I kind of liked the red circle slash better than empty boxes.

      Liked by 1 person

      • mpmp2015 says:

        I originally thought the same, because it was a good way to visually see which candidates dropped up (bec there are too many to remember), but then I realized it was it was probably a bit too much “gloating.” Now, I’ve gotten use to the empty boxes. I think SD struck a good balance between conveying serious info and having a little levity.

        Like

  45. Doodahdaze says:

    The pond scum at FOX is reporting on their FOX radio newz the Iowa likely carcass goer poll as if it is a national poll of all voters. What liars. FOX LIES!

    Like

  46. Doodahdaze says:

    Jebito is reducing staff. Something is up.

    Liked by 1 person

    • mpmp2015 says:

      I think Jebito is toast. He’s far too low in the polls to over take Trump, Carson and Rubio. Only the financial size of his Super PACs keeps him relevant in the race. The large negative ad campaign will hurt Trump’s poll numbers, but it doesn’t necessarily translate into higher numbers for himself.

      Rubio appears to be the GOPe’s last hope. Carly is the quasi-GOPe last hope as well. However, Carly’s polls numbers are essentially the same as if the second GOP debate did not happen. I guess once the voters dug a little deeper, it was pretty obvious her business track record was atrocious.

      If it continues to go this way for Jeb in the next few weeks, he’ll have to pass on the GOPe “mantle” to Rubio and see if he can give it a go at Trump and Carson. Head to head, Rubio has done okay for himself against Trump. With less than 100 days to the first voting in Iowa, it’s becoming harder and harder for Bush to keep saying to his supporters that there is “still enough time” for him to make a comeback.

      Like

  47. Concerned says:

    For those of you who have a bit of the sads like I do that there are now two polls that put Carson in the lead in Iowa, just keep in mind that this year in Iowa the delegates are bound and are allocated proportionately. The threshold is 3.33%. Let’s say the caucus results are just like the latest DMR/Bloomberg poll with Carson 28%, Trump 19%, Cruz 10%, Rubio 9%, Paul 5%, Fiorina 4%, and the rest below the threshold. Then with 30 total delegates the allocation would be something like Carson 11, Trump 8, Cruz 4, Rubio 4. Paul 2, and Fiorina 2. (That adds up to 31, but it’s close enough. 🙂 ) So Trump would not walk away empty handed. If he can win most of the winner-take-all states and do well in the proportional states, he might be able to win the nomination outright.

    Like

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