02-27 George Zimmerman Case – Open Discussion Thread

Use this thread as an open thread just for Zimmerman Case stuff. A place to just dump, collect, or discuss general information about the Trayvon Martin VS George Zimmerman Case.

“The sensationalized, fact-deficient coverage of this case has achieved the
desired results. The networks got their ratings. The politicians got their
talking points. And if it means innocent people get caught in the middle of the
racial enmity they’ve fomented, obviously it’s considered acceptable collateral
damage.
Congratulations, geniuses. Job well done. Jim Treacher, The DC Trawler

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318 Responses to 02-27 George Zimmerman Case – Open Discussion Thread

  1. rumpole2 says:

    Daily Daft Posts From Justarse Quest.

    I would like to continue to…. “Spread the Daft around”

    Though since posts are mostly not strictly on topic as far as the case goes, I’m going to put them in a Members Only area… so we can have a good laugh at them and the dopes who write them.

    I will post them in the public GZ case thread only if they actually contain points about the case worth debating.

    Random Topics

    http://randomtopics.org/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=584&start=920#p22870

    ……………………………. photo cockatoo_zpse3f8d231.gif……………….. photo cockatoo_zpse3f8d231.gif……………………………….
    If only Trayvon had kept his hands in his pockets, none of this would have happened.

    Like

  2. waltherppk says:

    Yesterday there was an interesting post which is worth keeping indexed, bookmarked for future reference because it is an important forensic “intelligence analysis” about this case.

    John Mclachlan posted a cogent analysis connecting the dots which have been in part described before and said what I have been saying and others have been saying in many separate posts, condensed into one summation. Here’s a link to John Mclachlan’s post

    John Mclachlan says:
    February 26, 2013 at 8:24 am

    http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2013/02/26/02-26-george-zimmerman-case-open-discussion-thread/#comment-330428

    D-Man you definitely want to keep the whole thread section there including this post in a special noted “dossier” of material of further interest.

    Like

    • justfactsplz says:

      John Mclachlan is spot on. The police knew, Wolfinger knew.

      Like

      • waltherppk says:

        I agree. I think he hit the nail squarely on the head, and it exposes the conspiracy which we have suspected.

        Like

        • justfactsplz says:

          It does. The police went to work on that phone right away to try to indentify Trayvon or someone he might have called. Norm Wolfinger new the results and wanted to supeona Dee Dee and put it before the Grand Jury and end that little farce right then and there. Crump knew this and called on Bondi. The rest is history. You reap what you sow and the Scheme Team is going to find that out.

          Like

          • waltherppk says:

            Yeah since fraud is a crime of secrecy and deception only slight evidence is sufficient to evince belief of its occurrence, and there is a lot more than slight evidence apparent here for this case that fraud has occurred.

            Like

            • justfactsplz says:

              Yes, phone records, missing data, The differences in Dee Dee’s two interviews, her age difference, etc., it all adds up to a heaping pile of rubbish that stinks to high heaven. I think they also have proof that DeeDee was some place during that time where she could not use the phone. I believe she actually tweeted to a friend that she would be unavailable for a few hours.

              Like

    • jordan2222 says:

      That was an outstanding post he made.

      Like

    • waltherppk says:

      When O’Mara used the phrase “Something is afoot here” ……the depth of that is understood better in light of what Mr. Mclachlan says. This post by Mr. Mclachlan is EXACTLY what I would expect to hear from a consulting professional forensics expert.

      Like

    • diwataman says:

      Should I be aware of this Mclachlan person? He doesn’t seem familiar with the case and other stuff. That first paragraph is something I haven’t heard of; phone companies just handing over cell info upon request? That takes a subpoena as far as I know. It would take me a while to respond to the rest, from skimming it I find most of it lacking. :(
      ————————–
      D-man, trust your instincts here. There may be more to this than we have been able to discern. Not trying to be mysterious–just sayin’. Admin/Sharon

      Like

      • waltherppk says:

        Look more closely. Consider the heart phone “dead battery” story. The police have a lot more sophisticated electronics than I do, but I have a 1 X AA LED flashlight that has a universal jumper patch cord that will power up any model dead cell phone for at least 10 minutes of emergency use. That is plenty of time to call 911 and get the caller ID and the 911 call from a phone found on a homicide victim is a lawful access by law enforcement to the service providers logs for that phone within 15 minutes of request.
        It is unreasonable to believe it took police days to deal with a cell phone with a dead battery. I don’t buy that story, not for one minute do I buy any of it.

        Like

        • diwataman says:

          Look more closely at what specifically? If it’s unreasonable to think that’s what happened then you’ll have to look into Officer Santiago as he was the one who handled the first investigation into the phone from what I can tell from the report. You’ll also have to look into Agent Shor from the CCIB, Sgt. Ciesla, the Seminole County Sheriff’s Office, CST Smith, SA Carter and Inv. Singleton as all these people were also involved. You don’t have to buy any of it but that’s all we have.

          O’Mara must have gotten the complete SPD file as he’s not asking for it anymore so he’ll know a lot more then we do about the initial investigation from the SPD. All we have is a two page summary from Santiago.

          I know what sophisticated electronics they used. The report mentions they used a cellebrite device but it didn’t say which model.

          http://www.cellebrite.com/

          Agent Shor from the CCIB said he couldn’t download the information on scene, which would be correct for the reasons he gave because cellebrite says you want the phone charged before doing it, I would even suggest having it fully charged and plugged in.

          The phone was checked into evidence and checked out on the 28th. Why it sat there for a day I don’t know. Maybe they wanted to be sure it was not wet before attempting to do anything. The rest is in the report, I’m not going to post it all here right now.

          Like

        • brutalhonesty says:

          just a thought: in the local case of the missing (and now known to be dead in the trunk) ebony jackson, when they found her car they needed a subpoena to search it, upon which they found her body…….and before that they told the family to contact the car dealer for the gps data so they could find her…for whatever reason the police couldnt or didnt contact the car company and say “its a missing person we need to know where this car is”

          Like

      • waltherppk says:

        Serino was former DOD of unspecified job description and a homicide detective. He was not a dull knife.

        Like

        • jello333 says:

          Right. I don’t trust the guy, but he doesn’t seem stupid to me, either. I think he messed up in more ways than one here, but for reasons other than shear stupidity.

          Like

          • waltherppk says:

            It seems clear there were 2 conflicting investigations proceeding at the same time, the police investigation and the private investigation of Crump in concert with Tracy Martin who was obstructing access to the phone found at the scene. Actually what Tracy Martin was doing was obstructing a homicide investigation into the death of his own son ……WHY ??? Clearly if there was any “break” in the case it was wanted to be done or “arranged?” by Crump and not the “untrustworthy” SPD or the SA but would only be gotten through the vigilant efforts of Crump. It was desired for the “Litigation” that the police be made to look bad so any “big break” in the case would be announced by Crump …which is exactly what was engineered to occur.

            Like

          • waltherppk says:

            Really I think we had this thing analyzed correctly a long time ago with the “obstruction of a homicide investigation” allegation squarely against Crump and Tracy Martin, who were not just seeking answers or justice, but were seeking to advance “The Narrative” which supports “The Litigation” which is the greed agenda of the entire Scheme Team. Crump and Tracy Martin wanted to “scoop” the case with at the right time announcing the “new witness” DeeDee with the inference being that the police did not do their jobs, never of course placing any emphasis on the reason the police were being obstructed was due to the efforts of Tracy Martin being advised by Crump every step of the way. Obstruction charges should have been formally brought against both Tracy Martin and Crump, but that would not be helpful with the politics involved where once again the “police acted stupidly” until some fine upstanding black citizens put things right.

            Like

            • boricuafudd says:

              I not convinced the obstruction was based on knowledge of DD, IMO they were concerned that the phone would contain incriminating evidence. As it just happens it also contained the DD information. On the other hand and I did mentioned this back in March, that Crump announced the discovery of DD, just a day or two before the SPD who had subpoena the records were obtained from T-Mobile.

              Like

      • sundance says:

        I thought the same thing. Who is this Mclachlan person? Have they been here before?

        While the substance of the consideration is eloquent in nature it does make some assumptions and contradicts some known facts about the phone.

        1. In order for the comment thesis to be of significant value it is predicated on the police taking action with the phone that is not in currently disclosed discovery. Could be, but that’s a jump. Only O’Mara/West would actually know that; and that would only be if they have that discovery. If so, then that leads to another entire series of questions about why not used to dispatch the entire narrative before now. Meaning why go through all this DeeDee w8 stuff if they had specific knowledge that such a phone call never existed? You would think if the SPD knew the call was not possible, by now the defense would know the same?

        2. It is factually in current discovery disclosures that the technical guy at SPD asked Tracy martin for a passcode of some sort for the phone, or account data. Consequently, John Mclachalan’s thesis disputes this and asserts the SPD would have no need for such a request to be made. Yet we know with specific certainty that such a request was made.

        As DiwataMan states, and I concur, only through a suponea could law enforcement gain account specifics for phone data – though perhaps we are mistaken. Again, a drive by comment without historical reference might be valuable, or not.

        More information is needed.

        Like

        • diwataman says:

          I can’t even begin to deconstruct it all, it would take me a while. T-Mobile sounded at first like they would have given the SPD some account info but that seems contingent upon cooperation from the account holder and we see how that went.

          Not only that but I would think if they went about it that way they would make a very detailed and thorough report, unlike the one we see from Santiago, for an official record. I have no idea what they could do outside of subpoenas and warrants regarding this sort of thing but why would they even go that route as it doesn’t have that officiality to it that would be taken advantaged of later in the courtroom, yikes.

          Like

        • waltherppk says:

          The poster Mclachlan is new to me. The phone being waterlogged could be the reason for delay but there is nothing noted in the reports about that. A friend actually dropped his cell phone in a swimming pool and it dried out overnight by itself and was okay. Anyway it just seems there could be two stories going on here, the story that is on the record, and another story entirely not on the record. This would need to be researched to confirm, but I think no subpoena is needed for a law enforcement request for recent or last call history to the phone of a homicide victim which qualifies as an “emergency” request by law enforcement. To get the previous months history yeah a subpoena would likely be needed ….but there may be an exception there for a John Doe victim situation as was the case here.

          Like

          • justfactsplz says:

            I have seen this poster before either here or elsewhere but not a lot of posts. Omara has had information concerning the phones for a long time. I don’t know why he hasn’t used it or why that discovery has not been released by the state.

            Like

          • diwataman says:

            Agent Shor gave the reason of the phone being wet in the report.

            There’s nothing wrong with speculating but it should be done with everything else that’s actually known about this case to see if it all starts to fit together.

            We, I feel, unfortunately, are not going to be getting any more discovery. We’ve hardly had any for months as it is. So it’s going to have to come down to FOIA requests or just wait for the trial for it all to come out and even then we won’t have all of the questions we’ve had over the months answered, some things will just never be known.

            Like

            • waltherppk says:

              Yeah page 16 of 183 I see that now (either/or) low battery or wet phone condition making use of the celabrite device unsuccessful. What still may have been possible is to simply jump power the phone and dial 911, if the problem was only a low battery. That is the point of departure “from events of record” where the scenario could be different.

              It would be an important question for Discovery to make of the phone service provider if any non-subpoena requests were made by any law enforcement by emergency requests to provide any account user or call history information prior to March 2, 2012.

              The issue here is I think it is difficult for people to believe that it was nearly four days after the shooting before police were able to learn the phone number for the phone of a person dead as a result of a homicide, because of a low battery or moisture problem.
              It just seems well unbelievable that it would be four days later. All I can conclude is that the investigation slowed because the deceased was not a John Doe for very long but was identified about 12 hours after the shooting, and that the circumstances were such that the police were of the impression there wasn’t any longer any urgency to investigation of what appeared to be a self defense shooting. This occurring on the night shift on a Sunday evening would probably also help explain delay that may not otherwise occur for processing a phone for a John Doe homicide. After the deceased was identified the “emergency” aspect which may have earlier given access “by request” to law enforcement working with a John Doe homicide no longer existed, so after that 12 hour window it could be that then a subpoena would be needed for the service provider records.

              Like

              • wrongonred says:

                I think I have said this before, No way it took 4 days. If wet, even if submerged in a pool, usually, you can place in a jar of rice, which will absorb all of the moisture in the electronics. No longer than 24 hours, and you are good as new. The Huawei uses a micro-USB plug, so even if the issue is solely the battery, say it is shot, the phone could be booted without it. I have about 20 Micro USB cables and chargers all over my house, SPD likely even has them in their cars as well for their personal phones.

                The only thing that could have occurred would be if someone made an attempt to turn the phone on while wet, which is when they are damaged, as they they will short out (in which case, even a Cellebrite device could not access unless and until the mother board were repaired), otherwise, the physical memory would need to be removed and soldered to a new board, which there is no indication occurred.

                I do not know McLachlan, or have any special insight aside from some experience rooting and modding Android phones as a hobby, but I find his statement entirely plausible, and the statements that they could not get into the phone for 4 days entirely implausible. Why? Because even if the SIM Lock is enabled, you can still call 911, same for Facelock (which was not supposed opn his outdated OS, PIN Lock, Pattern Lock, or password lock. The Ideos U8150 only had Android 2.2 (Froyo) on it, so it did not support Internal Memory or Sim encryption. The best Trayvon could have done is encrypted the data within his apps (assuming he was rooted) with Titanium Backup, however, if that was done, even Cellebrite or the computing power of the NSA could break 1024-bit encryption. Long story short, the power issue and the moisture issue would both been resolved within 24 hours……even if locked by any sort of passcode on the device, the police would have been instantly able, upon powering up the device, to call 911 to get the number. (This assumes that they are completely unable to access the Launcher, in which case Menu->Settings->About Phone-> Status will not only give you the registered number of the phone, but also the IMEI number which is the cross network identifier for a particular handset. This is how the Towers recognize the phone, as you can switch SIM Cards (changing phone numbers), but the IMEI is tied to the device itself.

                BTW, I use T-Mobile if anyone would like to see verification that 911 can still be accessed even if there is a Sim Lock in place on the device.

                Like

          • boricuafudd says:

            As far as I remember, I know that LEO’s could request the cell phone pinged to get identifying information only. Any call history would fall under Federal Privacy Laws. The phone was dead, so they would have to wait until the phone was dried and charged. The police would not need this information at the beginning since TM was identified hours later. Afterwards as the investigation was expanded would be when the information would ascertained. If the belief was that the phone was indeed TM’s asking the father for access would be a shorter route to get calling history and any phone information stored in the phone.
            I am curious could I could not find it if anyone asked Tracy to verify that the phone was indeed TM’s. Also there was an earlier story that TM’s phone was given to Tracy the next day.

            Like

            • waltherppk says:

              You are right, I also think what slowed down the forensics interest in the phone was the identification of the deceased within hours through different means such as the missing person description. If the deceased had remained a John Doe then the investigation of the phone would have been a more expedited business which would have definitely led police to “DeeDee”. The change of circumstances when the John Doe was identified took focus off the phone and it became more generic as an ordinary personal effect of the deceased.

              Like

              • boricuafudd says:

                There was no reason to suspect any evidence would come from the phone. I am curious about something, somehow the SPD decided that the phone definitely belonged to TM, since they conducted no forensic test to check for fingerprints or Swap the speaker for DNA. What convinced them the of the phones owner, I could see no mention, but there was a stop on fingerprinting of the phone. What convince the police of the phones provenance is never explained.

                Like

          • John Galt says:

            “This would need to be researched to confirm, but I think no subpoena is needed for a law enforcement request for recent or last call history to the phone of a homicide victim which qualifies as an “emergency” request by law enforcement.”

            18 USC 2702 (c) (4)

            to a governmental entity, if the provider, in good faith, believes that an emergency involving danger of death or serious physical injury to any person requires disclosure without delay of information relating to the emergency;

            Dead victim with sole shooter detained / interviewed / released would not appear to qualify as “danger of death or serious physical injury”.

            Like

        • arkansasmimi says:

          Looking around, this was interesting, tho dont know if it pertains to what yall are talking about.
          Florida appeals court rules that police can search cell phones without warrant
          6:13 PM, Jun 20, 2012 |

          http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/article/260922/472/Florida-appeals-court-rules-that-police-can-search-cell-phones-without-warrant

          Like

          • arkansasmimi says:

            Another interesting article.
            Chenda Ngak /
            CBS News/ March 1, 2012, 5:47 PM
            Police can now search cell phones without a warrant

            http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-501465_162-57388970-501465/police-can-now-search-cell-phones-without-a-warrant/

            Like

          • diwataman says:

            page 16

            http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/sections/news/Zimmerman_Discovery.pdf

            “On February 28, 2012 I spoke with SA Carter who told me we did not need a search warrant.”

            Search warrants and subpoenas are different things.

            Like

            • waltherppk says:

              For there to be a “hidden” conspiracy possible as we have considered, then the T-Mobile logs would have to have been scrubbed of any entry for the 911 call which would be made before March 2, 2012 ….so I am thinking this scenario of the police already being aware of DeeDee before she was “discovered, groomed, and coached” by the Scheme Team is unlikely.

              Like

              • wrongonred says:

                What I am not sure of, is that if you use the Emergency Call function while the SIM is locked, I am not sure if it will register on your T-Mobile account. The SIM contains the T-MO specific information, however, if the SIM is locked, it may just transmit the IMEI information and the location information as all providers are required to, no differently than the fact that if you no longer have cellular service on a phone, you are still able to dial 911……..so in such a case, there would be no one to invoice. I do not think pre-SIM registered calls (SIMs which are still in a SIM Lock state) appear on phone logs is my point, thus no need to scrub anything.

                Like

                • waltherppk says:

                  Evidently the phone was not SIM locked because the 911 call made by police on March 2, 2012 nearly four days after the shooting appears on the T-mobile phone bill. Is the IMEI information which you mention is the equivalent of the MAC address for a network modem.?

                  Like

                  • wrongonred says:

                    Yes, exactly. It is a unique Identifier hard coded to the chipset of the device. Mobile phones with WiFi, also have MACs, but IMEI is the same principle for cellular networks.

                    Like

                  • waltherppk says:

                    Thanks for clarifying the IMEI then is the correct term for the unique manufacturers hardware ID code hardwired in the phone itself. I have been calling it the MAC address all along, but did understand the ping logs associate with the unique identifier in the phone first, so anybody swapping SIM cards to a different phone would show up on the ping logs which are phone specific for each actual phone’s unique IMEI.
                    Can you find out from T-Mobile about the billing status for a SIM locked phone to see if it possibly does show up on the billing anyway ? Because if a 911 call on a SIM locked phone would not show up on the bill, then the March 2, 2012 call to 911 shown on the billing statement indicates the phone was not SIM locked. This would be at odds with what is being reported about the “locked” phone …correct?

                    Like

                  • wrongonred says:

                    Not necessarily. My understanding is, and perhaps I am in error, that the password that was needed was not a SIM Lock, but rather was the password to the T-Mobile account itself for some reason. I am still not sure that has been clarified. There are 3 types of passwords on a standard T-Mobile Account/Android Phone:

                    1. SIM Lock, this is an optional security setting, which will prevent ones phone from being used on the network under the account in which the SIM is registered. Typically, depending on the phone, this can be bypassed, but if so, the phone will not be usable on the network with the installed SIM Card.

                    2. PIN, Password, Pattern Lock- Also optional, The phone connects and is recognized by the network, however, user access to the Launcher is blocked. If the phone is rooted, this can easily be bypassed by going into recovery and backdooring it.

                    3. Account Password/Pin- This is what T-Mobile asks you for when you call to validate your account. It was this that was my understanding as to what it was. That because they did not have a subpoena, that they could not force the information from T-Mobile, so they asked Tracy what it was, and he declined to tell them, and said he had to ask his attorney. I may be in error, but I believe this was the supposed password boondoggle. Why? Because the phone was clearly identified as a T-Mobile Handset, and even if it could not be turned on for whatever reason (for the sake of discussion), worst case scenario, you take the battery out, and there are a). The SIM card which has a number printed on it and b) a panel which has both the IMEI and the Serial number for the device. Even if the phone did not work in any way, from just that, T-Mobile could identify both the hardware individually, as well as the account to which the SIM was registered, all without powering the phone on. The SIM would be linked to a phone number, so it would not even be necessary to call 911 in the first place. This whole reported series of events makes little sense. Smart Phones are the new treasure troves of information for Law Enforcement. Surely, if I know these things, someone at SPD, who undoubtedly has sat through classes on these things would know as well. I am not sure why they called 911 four days after the fact as there is no information of which I am aware that they would have gained, which they would not already have been aware. As I have said, T-Mobile could have told them, or if they could get into the phone, Settings-Status-About Phone gives you the phone number, IMEI, Uptime, Network Status, MAC Address, Bluetooth Address, Battery level, IP Address etc……

                    So, all of that said, the version of Android the phone was on (2.2 Froyo unless rooted), does not Support SD Card Encryption, so you could just remove the SD card and copy to a computer. If there were any videos on the phone, they would have been stored there by default, as the phone has 3 memories (ROM/RAM, Internal and SD Card) the ROM, unless the bootloader is unlocked, cannot be written to, RAM is used for processing functions, and the internal storage memory is very small, and mainly only used for System Apps storage The SD Card with where ALL of the media storage files are written, this is pretty much all audio and video, as the internal memory is very limited 200MB on this model, with 512MB of ROM and 256 RAM) The SD Card goes up to 32GB on this model.

                    The problem is, the SD Card is the easiest to manipulate as well, as it could just be removed and tampered with, whether or not the phone was locked/unlocked/functional.

                    Like

                  • waltherppk says:

                    @wrongonred There is no reply for your post below with the 1,2,3 on the phone scenario (link)

                    http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2013/02/27/02-27-george-zimmerman-case-open-discussion-thread/#comment-332173

                    This thread is strung out thin, but what you are saying confirms it is entirely possible there is information available to the police while the investigation was in the early hours and was still a John Doe homicide. So it definitely is possible there is an earlier “off the record” access of information by police, which is not reflected by the later reports of record. Isn’t that very interesting ? It would seem on second thought that John Mclachlan was on target with what is technically feasible and the police reports which we have examined may be misleading and not tell the whole story. Serino would be the one to know what is the story about this. The police narrative about the phones has always seemed suspect because of the delay.

                    Like

                  • Ad rem says:

                    Oops “wrong”….. spam hellz got ya. :-(

                    Like

        • Xballer52 says:

          In my experience, anytime that I have needed phone records for investigative purposes, I have had the State make the request via subpoena. I have never just picked up the phone and called them asking for phone records. I have my doubts that phone companies would be so compliant. I would imagine that the inability to verify the identity of the person requesting records via telephone would be of concern to phone companies, and legitimately so.

          Like

        • John Mclachlan says:

          I sent my contact details and a small response by direct contact to the tree house.
          It was in my sent folder.
          I do not know if you received it.

          Like

    • hooson1st says:

      Mclachlan’s comments are interesting.

      I would just throw a little bit caution in here.

      In this case, you had a fatality, and you had already identified the shooter. So, the matter of the cellphone would have less priority than it might if the shooter was still on the loose.

      The cell phone receives a higher level of interest as Crump/Julison efforts swung into gear.

      Like

      • waltherppk says:

        It definitely caused a second look to be taken at the initial police response involving the phone so this is not a worthless exercise given the implications. But I think the bill of particulars about the facts allows making sense of the events of record showing the record is probably trustworthy about the phone. Of course this second look at the scenario involving the phone does not change the pertinence of the ping logs and call history as has value otherwise as subpoenaed evidence having potential value for our analysis of events. The scenario Mclachlan’s post detailed is an interesting “what if” the police knew a lot more than was reported very early while it was still a John Doe homicide, however I think while it is good to consider that possibility ….it is debunked as an unlikely scenario based on our deeper look into that possibility. Mclachlan’s hypothesis would have more legs to walk if circumstances were slightly different particularly if the John Doe had remained unidentified for a longer time and there were no witnesses to the circumstances of the shooting, but given the circumstances as the police encountered and described on the record, it looks like Mclachlan’s scenario is a
        dog that won’t hunt. It was an interesting hypothesis however and worth a look.

        Like

  3. diwataman says:

    Just wanted to get this on here again.

    The Gutman tapes will be argued at the next hearing, March 5, 2013, unless of course Matt conveniently goes on holiday or the fat white lawyer shows up again.

    http://www.flcourts18.org/PDF/Press_Releases/Notice%20of%20Hearing%20Feb%2013%202013.pdf

    I do not know what that other motion is in there. The last one I can find with that heading is this one about the bio’s but I thought she already denied that.

    http://184.172.211.159/~gzdocs/documents/0113/defendants_motion_for_discovery_fdle.pdf

    Also, another friendly reminder. If you’re interested in watching the hearings, as manybuddies is no longer posting, then there are free screen recorder’s available. If you are technically challenged in this way I would suggest experimenting with the software now before the hearing. The trial is not too far off either and there will be hours of video every day so it might be a good idea to figure that one out as well. I will NOT be able to do it all and I often miss the hearings myself but I will try.

    Like

  4. Sharon says:

    We don’t know where they went, but we are aware that the list of “recent campfire conversation” that usually appears on the right hand column is not there. The right boxes are checked and the switches are all properly thrown–but it’s just not there. If anybody sees it laying behind some tree, bring it to the campfire, please.

    We’ll keep working on it. Sorry–that is rather dis-orienting. :(

    Like

  5. justfactsplz says:

    Our late local news said this evening that the new Sanford police chief if meeting with local pastors, the D.O.J. and the C.R.S. but they did not tell why. Interesting.

    Like

    • sundance says:

      The “local pastors” make up the biggest part of the CRS at the local level. It is through church and civic groups the DOJ-CRS approaches the community.

      Like

      • justfactsplz says:

        That explains the early involvement of these pastors and all of the town hall meetings in their churches that also included Corrine Brown in attendance.

        Like

        • diwataman says:

          Bishop James Dixon, Chairman of Religious Affairs of the Texas NAACP, was on the scene the day of the Jonathan Ables shooting.

          http://diwataman.wordpress.com/2012/09/18/black-woman-stands-her-ground-kills-white-man/

          “Bishop James Dixon travels to Sanford, Florida to join other social justice advocates including Rev. Al Sharpton of National Action Network, Marc Morial of the National Urban League and NAACP leaders.

          On Thursday, March 22, 2012, Bishop James Dixon will be traveling to Sanford, Florida to join other social justice advocates…

          Bishop James Dixon was recently appointed Chairman of Religious Affairs of the Texas NAACP

          Bishop Dixon recently introduced a new campaign to area leaders, Be Your Brother’s Keeper, Not Your Brother’s Killer. The purpose is to promote the concept of brotherhood within and across lines of race, and to discourage violence by promoting the sanctity of human life.”

          http://www.prweb.com/releases/2012/3/prweb9318779.htm

          The shooter has been indited for murder and Bishop James Dixon is back in the media, listen closely to what he has to say in the video, look at the hypocrisy and familiar narrative:

          “Unfortunately the actions of an enraged man led to his untimely death,”

          “Had this been a black male, a white female, most people are doubtful we’d be having this kind of press conference,” said Dixon when a reporter asked specifically about the race issue and whether he thought a white female would face a murder charge under similar circumstances.”

          “How is it that you get a murder charge when you’re the one under attack,” Dixon asked.”

          http://www.khou.com/news/crime/Pastor-questions-grand-jury-indictment-in-road-rage-death–192138941.html

          Like

      • jello333 says:

        One thing I don’t get. If one of the alleged purposes of the CRS is the ease tensions, WHY don’t they admit that George WAS involved in trying to help Sherman Ware? But as it is, it seems like black church leaders are going out of their way to lie about that. If they still wanted to push for a conviction, they could do that… but seems like getting some of the “racism” aspects out of the way would help “ease tensions”. (Of course this is more of a rhetorical question than anything, since I realize the whole “easing tensions” thing is probably a smoke screen.)

        Like

      • recoverydotgod says:

        Interesting. That makes a lot of sense. I’ve prayed that a local pastor or group of local pastors would step up to the plate and speak out the truth in love.

        Like

  6. diwataman says:

    Good lord I’m in moderation hell like with every comment! No biggie, just letting it out, lol : o

    Like

  7. arkansasmimi says:

    Wow thats odd. I was replying to Dman comment to say THANKS. But it shows Anonymous in Blue Letters. Okay. THANKS DMAN!

    Like

  8. sundance says:

    God Bless this Admin Team who wade through the filth and hate on a daily basis and keep the Treehouse clean. Accidentially I clicked on the wrong file in the backroom and ended up in the trashcan with them….. bleeelch. But I noted this bit of one comment I though I’d dig out and share:

    This is one of the non-vulgar bits – where we are all just racist n stuff:

    I find this all so funny. Are you guys memeber of the KKK? by the way your information is incorrect and highly misleading. Martin had Ice Tea not Watermelon (a racist remake). If you looked at the label of the Robitussin it is 18% alcohol, none of these item are illegal, anyone can purchase them over the counter. So what crime is being commited?

    Ya, see, this is how the other side looks at this case. They buy the media story hook, line and sinker. If I had a dollar for every time someone said we were racists for pointing out a simple fact like it was NOT iced tea.

     photo ArizonaWatermelon-1.jpg

    If you share the Truth – you’re automatically a racist. (((headdesk)))

     photo Juices-Arizona-Watermelon-Tea-1.gif

    Like

    • Chip Bennett says:

      I think “Letters to Sundance” would be a fascinating publication.

      Like

    • ejarra says:

      And even if they were sent that picture as proof, we all know what they would say in a reply.

      IT WAS PHOTOSHOPPED!

      Like

    • jello333 says:

      I’m actually kinda glad they throw around rayyysiiiisss! accusations like they do, because it helps me break the ice with my friends about this case. What I mean is this: Some of my non-Treeper friends know very, very little about this case. So I might start talking to one of them, and at first they’ll just repeat some stuff they may have heard on the news early-on. So I then start to correct them. But before I go into any details, one of the first things I do is let them know that *I* am now being called a racist by TM supporters simply for the fact that I challenge the original story line. And since most of my friends know me very well, and have themselves been victims of similar tactics (mainly because of their speaking out against Obama, which of course is another thing that proves you’re a racist), they kinda go, “Ohh… hmm…” And then it seems that they’re more open and willing to listen to the facts of the case, from the point of view that there just MIGHT be some ulterior motives on the part of the GZ haters.

      Like

  9. Pingback: Okay, you got me, I’m racist |

  10. brutalhonesty says:

    http://globalgrind.com/news/trayvon-martin-candlelight-vigils-nationwide-1-year-photos-videos

    Last night, thousands of people around the nation put their hoodies up, held a candle, and said a prayer for slain teen Trayvon Martin, in a celebration of life that marked a year since his fatal shooting in Florida.

    VIDEO: Hoodies Up! Trayvon Martin & His Impact On Hip-Hop

    In New York City, Trayvon’s parents Sybrina Fulton and Tracy Martin, alongside actor Jamie Foxx, spoke to a hooded crowd about the death of their youngest son and the work that has to be done to make sure that our children remain safe from gun violence and racial prejudice.

    “This day, until the day I die, will always be Hoods Up Day for me,” Tracy Martin said.

    Both Martin and Fulton donned hoods as well, holding strong as the crowd chanted, “Who are we? Trayvon Martin!” Picket signs with Trayvon’s face and words denouncing racial profiling and gun violence stood high above the crowd.

    “I’m the mother of two boys,” Fulton said. “I have one son on earth and one son in heaven.”

    Foxx, who also attended the Peace Walk for Trayvon in Florida last week, told the crowd how he felt after meeting Trayvon’s parents.

    “I just started to think: What would I feel like if she wasn’t there with me?” he said.

    At 7:17, candles were lit and a moment of silence followed, marking the time when the first police officer arrived to the scene of the crime to find George Zimmerman standing near Trayvon’s lifeless body. Foxx then serenaded the crowd with an emotional song and Michael Eric Dyson was also on hand to lend his thoughts and prayers.

    LIST: What’s Going On? 12 Developments You Missed In The Trayvon Martin Case

    Almost a thousand miles down the Atlantic shore, another crowd gathered in Sanford, Fl. to remember the life that was stolen a year earlier.

    Despite the rainy weather, people stood outside of Sanford’s Goldsboro Welcome Center and the Historical Museum to show their respect.

    Groups of teenagers and parents also gathered near Yale University, in Los Angeles, and in Washington D.C. to remember Trayvon’s life and to reflect on the work that must be done to break down the social constructs of race that led to his death.

    Trayvon, you are missed.

    Read more: http://globalgrind.com/news/trayvon-martin-candlelight-vigils-nationwide-1-year-photos-videos#ixzz2M7ABW5rn

    Like

  11. Teinoh says:

    Dershowitz takes new shots at prosecutor in Trayvon Martin Case

    http://www.newsmax.com/US/dershowitz-zimmerman-martin-defense/2013/02/26/id/492168

    Like

    • diwataman says:

      Notice what he says at @7:56 of the video and how it differs from the reasoning O’Mara has given to the press. You won’t hear O’Mara say what Dershowitz did there.

      Like

    • Sha says:

      Dershowitz: Sounds like a honest and fair man …… Big hug to both of them for doing the interview , that took guts on the part of both of them. I wish there where alot more people who could just be fair no ones asking for special treatment just a fair shot with a dose of the truth.

      Like

    • boutis says:

      Dershowitz shows sneering contempt for Corey. She was picked as special prosecutor precisely because she is so infamous for overcharging and wearing the accused down until they give up or are bankrupt. She was supposed to be the ticket to a plea for something (anything) criminal so Crump could then get his “go away” money and the state would not have to deal with him until the next time. I hope the voters of Jacksonville are proud of their votes.

      Like

    • Love that quote from Sybrina: “kids have a right to walk in peace.”

      No, George Zimmerman had a right to walk with his piece!

      Like

    • Dangles says:

      I like the Dersh’s idea that O’Mara & West should move to get the NEN tape tossed from evidence during the trial. You can tell Dersh hasn’t been following the case all that closely (an neither has the interviewer) from some of the things he said. And he’s just plain wrong about Martin being any kind of “victim.”

      Like

  12. eastern2western says:

    agree with allan completely. despite his hate for gun owners, he has already stated the martin getting on top of zimmerman and started pounding his head to the ground is sufficient enough for a self defense claim. what ever happened before has no relavance in this case. If the defense gets the nen excluded, it will be a major blow to the prosecution because the recording seems to be the only evidence for proving zimmerman actually followed trayvon.

    Like

    • John Galt says:

      As far as I can tell, Dershowitz spoke in precise alignment with Florida law regarding traditional self-defense. Jenkins v. State, 942 So.2d 910 (2006).

      Like

    • indiethink says:

      I do not agree with Dershowitz on the moral question. The only immoral actions were those of Trayvon Martin that night.

      Like

      • Sha says:

        indiethink: I didn’t agree with that either ……. but at least I felt he was being fair.

        Like

      • justfactsplz says:

        I had a problem with that statement also.

        Like

      • Ricky Jimenez says:

        I have heard “not legally responsible but morally responsible” a few times previously as a description of Zimmerman’s fault in the death of Trayvon Martin. It probably is a reference to Zimmerman’s provoking of Martin by noticeably following the latter while in his vehicle but not identifying his purpose to Martin, to defuse the situation, when he had the chance. Some people might find lack of intelligence rather than morality as the operative concept here.

        Like

        • indiethink says:

          Please… are you calling me stupid or immoral? I have followed suspects in my ‘hood more than once, both in my car and on foot. And because of our neighborhood watch diligence in tracking/reporting problem people we have rid the area of open air drug markets.

          TM demonstrated his resentment towards GZ prior to GZ exiting his car. TM considered payback at the point when he first approached GZ to check him out. George might have misread the situation when TM ran off, and did not consider that TM would ambush him.

          Like

          • Ricky Jimenez says:

            I pray that you are never involved in a Zimmerman/Martin type incident indiethink. On previous occasions, George refused to make his observing obvious to suspects, despite queries from the dispatcher. Once he was about to try to check closer on one but Shellie was also there and stopped him. On another, he didn’t get close enough to a car to get a license number so just described model and color. Earlier on Feb 2, 2012, while walking his dog, he kept his distance from somebody lurking near Taafe’s house and walked a distance away to call police. In none of the previous occasions did the police find the suspects when they arrived so I guess he decided to be more aggressive in his last try, unfortunately.

            Like

            • jello333 says:

              What are you talking about? George made NO attempt to get close to Travyon, at ANY time. Quite the opposite. It was Trayvon who tried to get close to George… first when he circled the truck, and of course later when he came back to attack George.

              Like

            • indiethink says:

              I have been in Zimmerman’s situation as I noted here before. Sucker punched, knocked to the ground and stomped in the head. Unlike GZ I was assisted by a family driving down the street who stopped, they attackers ran. I was 53 year old. These teens have no shame, they are completely out of control, they kill over alleged incidents of disrespect.

              Like

              • I have always disliked the phrase “he disrespected me” because it seemed to mean that the person was expecting a deference that he didn’t really earn or deserve. I am glad you survived this attack.

                Like

              • I lived in the ghetto briefly, I was buying from trayvons brothers. same age. 17. while waiting for the one to come back, the other clothes lined my face and split my lip bad..and proceeded to go through my pockets. I was stunned and just sat there. and the kid had just put out the blunt we, WE, were smoking. A few weeks later these same kids had a massive fight and a gun was pulled and the cops came. this dude “D” sent 15 year old “deeda” to go get a “dub” and he came back with “a dime” and so “D” fought off the dealers 10 guys (they all claimed a gang name) one on one.. each one going one one one in a row. they got mad “d” won all the matches, they came back with more people and a gun.

                it is typical.

                Like

              • Sha says:

                I’m sorry that happened to you indiethink………… :(

                Like

                • indiethink says:

                  thank you,
                  This happened to me 2009, my kids were victims in our neighborhood park in 2000. So while I was being kicked in the head, covering up my eyes, nose and ears, I was thinking about how my kids felt some years earlier. We took care of each other, and we took community action which did make some progress in dealing with these crimes.

                  Being a victim of black- on- white violence changes everything. I continue to speak out publicly, and while I am described by many as a racist, I always win the argument since the crime data proves the problem is all too real.

                  Like

                  • ytz4mee says:

                    we took community action

                    Classic prog-speak.
                    Puke.

                    Like

                  • jordan2222 says:

                    ?

                    Like

                  • ytz4mee says:

                    I never forget.
                    Never.

                    Like

                  • indiethink says:

                    what the heck, we demanded specific law enforcement changes, security changes at the high school, coordination between transit cops and both police dept along the border area where the uptick in these assault occurred.

                    Essentially, we formed a network of neighborhood leaders who with the assistance of the DA confronted failure public policy.

                    Enough of your hostile pigeon holing of me, I get stuff done.

                    Like

                  • indiethink says:

                    ytz4mee

                    and what exactly do you think GZ did when he organized the NW, that is community action.

                    I get it, you have me all figured out, and think it just fine to attack my character.
                    You are wrong, just plain wrong. I too never forgot, I just don’t condemn.

                    Like

                  • ytz4mee says:

                    Nice attempt at deflection, but FAIL

                    Like

                  • indiethink says:

                    You are just bullying me, it is more than unkind, it is nasty. what exactly are you trying to do? I hope you cleaned up your own puke and did not leave it for someone else fo fix.

                    Like

                  • ytz4mee says:

                    Target, freeze, marginalize, attempt to ridicule.
                    You are too predictable, and you can’t hide who you really are for very long, can you??
                    Your crap won’t work here.
                    You thrive on being combative and adversarial.
                    Sorry, I won’t stand for it.

                    Like

      • jello333 says:

        I really don’t think he knows nearly as much about this case as we do. I have a feeling that if he did (and hopefully he yet will), he’d no longer have the “moral responsibility” opinion.

        Like

    • waltherppk says:

      Dispatchers have said that in a situation such as was George that the person calling does act as the “eyes and ears” for the police who are not there, and there is nothing about the behavior of George that is really out of line in that context. There is nothing at all that was improperly out of bounds or unlawful about George taking a walk to try to accomplish a visual on the subject being previously observed and described to the dispatcher, and earlier the dispatcher had requested to be kept apprised by the “let us know if he does anything else” instruction. The later instruction “we don’t need you to do that” was not explicitly telling George to disregard the previous “observe and report” type of instruction ….but could reasonably have been interpreted as nuanced in meaning, like we don’t need you to do that (but you can still take a look if you want), or it could infer to George to “be cautious about approaching subject too closely, try to keep your distance” type of meaning. The dispatcher clearly understood that George was a bit nervous about the behavior of the subject he was observing and therefore was seeking not to endanger George by encouraging any sort of “pursuit into the darkness” where George could be met by the subject lurking around a corner. In a way that is something to the effect of what George reports ultimately did happen.

      Like

      • ftsk420 says:

        “or it could infer to George to “be cautious about approaching subject too closely, try to keep your distance” type of meaning”

        That’s exactly what I believe the NEN operator meant.

        Like

        • eastern2western says:

          keeping travyon within eye sight is not same as following. it could be dark that night which meant zimmerman was simply looking for him, but there is no freaking way the prosecution to prove zimmerman as the initial aggresor because dale already tole o’mara that he does not know. unless dd could see through a telephone from millions of miles away, her testimony is worthless junk. even dale stated on record that he has nothing to dispute zimmerman’s story.

          Like

        • waltherppk says:

          There has been so much effort at “mind reading speculation” about George done by the Scheme Team which accuses George of in effect being the “hunter” and characterizing Martin as being the prey being “the hunted”. Yet in the NEN call there is a description of a response by Martin closely approaching the vehicle of George “coming to check me out” which could indicate that Martin was annoyed by the unwelcome attention of George when Martin became aware of being observed. This could reasonably indicate that while George was nervous about the behavior of Martin, that the awareness of “being watched” was regarded as a provocation and that Martin became pissed off.
          So if that is the case, it would do much to explain how events then followed where behavior can be explained by the state of mind of the tow persons, George being nervous but “looking around” to attempt a visual on somebody who was pissed off in the way of that old cliche that has started many bar room brawls that begin with the WTF are you looking at ? ….followed by a sucker punch from the person gazed upon even if they were just imagining that anybody had been “looking at them”. Indeed many fights have occurred over the “eye contact” kind of body language which the animal nature would interpret as a “challenge” …..and then the fight is on.

          Like

          • ftsk420 says:

            Honestly if it was me and Trayvon that night instead of him and George I would have done the same thing George did. Once Trayvon put his hands in his waistband like he did to George I would have taken that as a threat and acted on it. Growing up in a bad neighborhood Trayvon knows when you do something like that it’s on but I think he felt he was dealing with a white guy who couldn’t defend himself. If Trayvon approached a cop with his hands in his waistband cops at the very least would have hit him with the taser.

            Like

        • jello333 says:

          Yep, that’s what it was. It most definitely was NOT, “You leave that little boy alone!”

          Like

      • Sha says:

        Have you noticed that no one brings up the prompting from the dispatcher…..let us know if he does anything else which is why he even got out of the car to keep an eye on him.

        Like

        • waltherppk says:

          Yeah that part always gets omitted from the propagandized account of the NEN call. A lot of folks have noticed the “selective editing” of what is inconvenient truth from the analysis of that NEN call. It is the same thing as is done with the deceptive and prejudicial audio editing that is the reason for the lawsuit against NBC.

          Like

        • jordan2222 says:

          Sean (the dispatcher) will testify FOR the defense. He’ll say that he in effect ASKED George to get out of the truck… albeit inadvertently.

          “Just let us know if this guy does anything else.” (TWICE)

          “He’s running? Which way is he running?”

          Like

      • ejarra says:

        There is some else that I thought of when I read your post that has NEVER been said or analyzed here. At one point George was describing where his truck was parked, correct?

        If George was not supposed to leave his truck as the State says, why didn’t Sean tell him to go back in it? NOT ONCE, was that suggestion made. I think that if BLDR brings that up, MOM/WEST should bring up the idea that once the truck was mentioned and that Sean knew at that point that George was no longer in the safety of it, why didn’t he tell him to go back in it?

        If all those Trayvonistawho keep harping on George being out of his truck and the suggestion, “You don’t need to do that.” as an order. By Sean knowing that once George mentions his truck and it is reasoned that he is NOT in it. And by Sean NOT telling him to go back and get back in it, it is inferred that it is ok to NOT be in it.

        Am I making any sense?

        Like

  13. art tart says:

    Since the FBI has said:
    FBI to George Zimmerman: We don’t have to give you our file

    http://www.orlandosentinel.com/

    What’s next? It seems since the FBI is paid by the taxpayer’s, taxpayer’s have a right to see their personal file the FBI has in a case in which the taxpayer is charged in a crime.

    Baez had endless motions trying to get information from the FBI in KC’s case, he usually filed the motions against the State to produce the FBI reports, but he lost every time with the State stating, “the defense needs to contact the FBI themselves, not us,” Judge Perry ruled in favor of the State at every attempt. I don’t remember if he was ever successful in his attempts t get the information, there was so much discovery/tens of thousands of pages, he may not have been successful, ever.

    Like

    • John Galt says:

      @ 5:20 to 9:10

      Nelson and MOM appear to think that Nelson is the boss of the FBI. Bernie seems to know in advance that MOM is going to bounce off the FBI. West said that the FBI told him to get the docs from the State. This looks like a stonewalling setup to me.

      Like

  14. art tart says:

    Expert: Zimmerman jury may be all white
    With only six spots on the voting jury, WDBO legal analyst Bill Sheaffer said seating even one black juror could be difficult.

    “From a statistical perspective it is more probable that you may end up with an all-white jury,” Sheaffer said.

    http://www.wdbo.com/news/news/local/expert-zimmerman-jury-may-be-all-white/nWbJ7/#sthash.VFKG6MQd.dpuf

    The makeup of the OJ Simpson murder trial was 9 blacks, 1 Hispanic, 2 whites.

    Like

    • rumpole2 says:

      I have been thinking that the likely outcome if there is a trial is a hung jury… split along racial lines.
      Good news if it’s an all white jury.. no point pandering to the BGI and political correctness when an innocent man’s life and liberty are at stake.

      Like

      • art tart says:

        rumpole2, I too have thought a lot about the potential jury, I think it is very possible there could be a hung jury. In OJ’s trial, Christopher Darden’s book was a good read, the black assistant prosecutor to Marcia Clark who stated he “was brought in because he was black.” He too stated, “I knew we had lost the case when a couple of juror’s made a fist to show black power.” There were no riots about OJ walking on the murder of two, unlike this case in which the race card is played daily.

        Like

      • John Galt says:

        They don’t have to be black to hang the jury. A non-analytical white guilt infected Obama voter will do nicely. Imagine somebody like Mary Cutcher.

        Like

        • rumpole2 says:

          I agree… there is possibility of a hung jury whatever the racial mix.

          I just fear that the BGI and their servants have already injected RACE such that it’s likely to impose ADDED pressure on any black jurors.

          Like

          • art tart says:

            rumpole2 – you make a point about the “added pressure,” I hadn’t thought about that. Too, even though I thought KC was a murderer and walked, the juror’s in her case in interviews didn’t understand circumstantial evidence and connecting the dots, they took a tremendous beat down with the public across America with endless verbal attacks etc. Some claimed their lives were threatened and they had to move or some claimed to have lost their jobs. I hope this wouldn’t prevent a jury from doing the right thing, having fear of repercussions as KC’s jury did.

            imo, I don’t see the public across America, except in the media, agreeing as to the circumstances in reading the comments in the blogs, they are pretty divided, except at OS. A LOT of American’s have read the evidence and speak up for the injustice to GZ in this case. In KC’s case, hardly anyone thought KC was innocent except the Defense, at least in GZ’s case a lot of American’s question the beat down GZ got at the hand’s of TM and his right to protecting himself. That at least is encouraging.

            Like

            • rumpole2 says:

              Without labouring the point…. 90% (or some large percentage) of Black voters, vote for Obama…. beyond normal percentages one expects from “Democrats”.
              I am trying real hard to NOT be racist.. but there is already an element of this case being a race issue.. such that black jurors go into it MORE likely to decide guilty.
              Of course I would hope that a juror regardless of color would NOT let prejudices sway their decision… but reality is as it is.

              Like

            • stobberdobber says:

              I have a problem with your “circumstantial evidence and connecting the dots”. That does not represent proof beyond a reasonable doubt. I did not follow the KA case and have not had the interest to really look further into it, but I must make this observation about it, It seems to have created the same amount of prejudicial hysteria before the trial as this case has. What kind of circumstantial evidence do you think will come out in this case to convict George? I do know that many people in the U.S. are convicted on circumstantial evidence alone and I do not believe that is morally correct to do. Circumstantial evidence still leaves reasonable doubt, and doesn’t make the prosecution correct. As those of us here can see they are stopping at nothing to convict and obstruct the defense here so such a statement should be clarified in my opinion.

              Like

    • No. Its too embedded. They all think it could be them or their brother or their child. It was the sermon in all their churches. Some even placed false Idols of the messiahs(obama) son on Christ’s altar . The black president invoked his name and basically said it was a racial killing (remember michelle said of barry “he could get shot going to the gas station just for being black)…then all the Naacp/100black men/nbpp/princehallmasons.

      there is no way there are any uninfluenced blacks. unless you pick from the elderly back pool maybe..wise with age…know what racism really is…stuff like that..

      Like

      • I disagree. I think there are black people who want justice and truth. They just have to be careful about what they say or do. There is much pressure in the black community to conform. I remember the Oprah shows where they talked about the black kids who made good grades and were bullied for it. There have been some black people who have spoken up recently about voting for Obama just because he is black and said it was a mistake. I think the real problem is that the black culture right now thinks that it is all right to attack a white person for any reason. They see Tracy’s lifestyle as normal and Trayvon’s aggressiveness as normal.

        Like

    • I guess I am going to have to toughen up. This story brought tears to my eyes and bile to my throat. The inhumanity just is so awful. And, this piece of garbage that did thias is going to be back out on the street in no time to do something else cowardly and criminal.

      Like

      • mung says:

        Yep. Just in the news today there have been so many stories about scum bags that need to be off the street. Some idiot stole money from girl scouts selling cookies in front of a Block Buster, someone stole a woman’s bank deposit while she was at the drive up teller, and some idiot was shoplifting from a Walmart and started shooting at people trying to stop him.

        The good guys need more rights not less. That is part of what bothers me about the way George is being railroaded. If this happens here how safe are we when we protect ourselves or others? And I know “better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6″ but that shouldn’t even be the choice. Better to exercise your right to defend yourself without question.

        Like

    • 5 foot 7. 145 pounds. This was just a child who was turning his life around.

      Like

    • stobberdobber says:

      Total Bond : $7000

      Like

  15. mung says:

    People with Random Topics access please check out my post at the following link and see where you can help me gather questions to ask.

    http://randomtopics.org/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=801#p22910

    Like

  16. Teinoh says:

    Am I reading this right? They knew that TM had died that night and not the next morning? From April 2012.
    ‘The night it happened I had some missed calls,’ explained Fulton, who had to compose himself to tell the story.
    ‘One was my mother, So I called her back, I could tell something wasn’t right and she told me that Tray passed away.
    ‘And I just paused because I couldn’t believe it and I didn’t understand it.’

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2129812/Trayvon-Martins-brother-speaks-say-did-attack-George-Zimmerman.html

    Like

    • arkansasmimi says:

      Wow, thats what he says. ALSO says :’He was smart, he was in honours classes, he wanted to go off to college like I did,’ explained Fulton.’ And miss so many days?

      Like

      • Alexandra M. says:

        LOLZ Sir Sizzurp-Scholar was expelled from 11th grade. His next options would have perhaps included an “alternative” school (unofficial Juvie Hall), a mandated boot camp, being a “declared dropout” altogether or GED program in “big boy” jail. There is NO WAY Tray would have obtained a HS Diploma with his class.

        Like

        • libby says:

          They have thug finishing schools locally and nationally.
          The thug finishing school in Sanford was known as the “GOONS” (their attire was hooides in winter, btw)

          Like

  17. maggiemoowho says:

    Dog shoots owner in leg, no charges expected to be filed against the pooch.

    http://www.wtsp.com/news/article/300912/8/Dog-shoots-Florida-man-Gregory-Dale-Lanier-in-the-leg-with-a-9mm-handgun

    Like

  18. arkansasmimi says:

    This is one IGNORANT. PROFILING. EX-ATTNY. Which if wasnt so serious, would feel sorry for his poor followers. So Leatherhead plainly states:

    I” said long ago and I will repeat it today:
    Anyone who believes the defendant is innocent is a racist and anyone who contributes money to his defense is a stupid racist.” http://frederickleatherman.com/2013/02/27/cnn-article-promotes-racist-description-of-trayvon-martin-case/#comments

    Like

    • mung says:

      Can I sue him for slander?

      Like

      • maggiemoowho says:

        He doesn’t know what a racist is, none of those people do. They are hateful people who know GZ is innocent, but their hate and severely damaged egos won’t allow them to accept or admit it.

        Like

      • thehoff71 says:

        Don’t you love how he repeats his “Anyone who believes George is a racist blah blah blah” over and over but blows a freaking gasket and screams LOLDefamation whenever he sees his name posted on a pro-George page?

        Like

        • libby says:

          He says ‘racist’ like it is a bad thing.
          (the way for blacks to show whites and the rest of us how bad racism is is for them to address racism in their own community so we will all know this is bad).
          Blacks refuse to address racism in their own communities; they pretend only whites are racist.

          Like

    • thehoff71 says:

      Wow, go check out his post today..he’s not even hiding his hatred along side his true intentions anymore:

      So, O’Mara and his client are a “couple” and poor George is wearing bulletproof vests and disguises while he steadily eats himself to death because he doesn’t get to vote on the outcome of his trial.

      Excuse me, while I cry me a river of tears.

      If you like this post and the quality of this site, please consider making a secure donation via Paypal by clicking the yellow donation button in the upper right corner just below the search box.

      Like

    • Alexandra M. says:

      Dumbarse Leatherman knows he’d best not step foot in my state anymore (WA.). We chucked him out like raw sewage awhile ago. Despite his tall tales, he was NEVER seated at the “Grownups Table”. :)

      Like

  19. Hello

    I have been searching for the breakdown of George’s $100 000 living expenses that I saw here recently. I remember there being a substantial amount of it as a security deposit. Does anyone have the link? I have been searching but to no avail. Thanks to anyone.

    Like

    • art tart says:

      casparweinburger – I have never seen a breakdown on the expenses but I had read at one time that GZ/SZ had to pay for breaking their lease, relocation cost, then the deposits, etc. for a new place. I too read that their credit card debt was paid in full, I don’t know that as fact as a link wasn’t provided. I too am curious.

      Like

      • casparweinburger says:

        Thanks. Do you have any link about paying for a security deposit? I read somewhere it was a huge amount.

        Like

        • art tart says:

          I did find this article on where the money has gone, it does list the living expenses t be $ 61,747.54 for a year.

          From the article: 5 things to know about the George Zimmerman-Trayvon Martin saga!

          What’s the money been used for? The biggest single expense remains the $95,000 bond to secure his release from jail. The fund has also paid $61,747.54 in living expenses for Zimmerman and his wife, who are now living in an undisclosed rental home, at a price his legal team describes as “reasonable,” in Seminole County, Florida. Other expenses include $56,100 for security, a little more than $76,000 in expenses for the law firm and the case, and $3,201 in miscellaneous expenses. Those include Zimmerman’s GPS monitoring fees, office supplies and the occasional pizza for interns on the case, who work for free, according to the web site.

          http://www.cnn.com/2013/02/25/justice/florida-zimmerman-5-things/index.html

          Like

          • casparweinburger says:

            Great. That is what I was looking for. I am trying to defend GZ against the absurdity of this host, who says that GZ put on weight in order to bolster his sympathy with the jury. I have never heard something so ridiculous:

            Like

            • its all they got. its all a script. they have no case. so they are focused on any reason to keep the hate going.
              oh, and “he went through”…..can shelly work? are they BOTH living on it,…..2 people on 125k…….
              and the sickos….WE ARE WATCHING! “someone has to talk about it” lmfao how is it they have the right talking points if no one is watching for THEM????
              and calling gz the perpetrator omfg….the problem is the crime was martins…they cant seem to understand this.
              and yes, stress. I know a girl, she is kinda big. shes an emotional eater. she was skinny when i met her, now shes….yeah.

              Like

    • strat4evr says:

      I never recall seeing that figure commented here concerning living expenses and would certainly like to see it if it was in fact posted so please do re-post if it exists.

      Like

      • art tart says:

        MOM broke it down on the web site as to where the money has gone:

        Household/Living Expenses — $61,747.54

        http://www.gzdefensefund.com/donate/index.php/how-has-money-been-spent

        Like

        • jordan2222 says:

          Notice the date. He has never kept his word about that fund. I suspicious.

          Like

          • art tart says:

            jordan2222 – GZ donations are from the public and a detailed list of cost hasn’t been released NOR challenged by those making donations for living expenses.. The $ 2,500.00 spent on getting a phone hooked up to a mobile home while GZ/SZ lived out of State was a bad investment since SZ/GZ had to abandon that arrangement and move back in State, I assume their credit card debt was paid off as it is a living expense. If the figure is accurate, the cost is approximately $ 5,000.00 per month for living expenses excluding security and the law firms needs. I assume for rent, food, car notes, car insurance, phone, cell phones, etc.

            Like

            • recoverydotgod says:

              The defense team needs to give an accounting, nevertheless. It is only wise.

              In fact, if they said…we need to raise $X for an expert for phone forensic expert, etc……be specific…they would raise money for specific items quick.

              Like

              • art tart says:

                recoverydotgod – I agree, I want to donate to the defense fund, but I am not so interested in donating to the living expenses unless I know where they are going. GZ has to have a defense no matter what, experts have to be paid, but the nebulous cost of living expenses and the amount that has been spent on living expenses is the highest amount of expenditures with the exception of bail. This is only my opinion, I respect other’s that feel differently but a lot of money has been spent thus far and the amount seems high.

                My son lost his job and he and his wife have moved in with me until he can find another job and get back on his feet. This is a less than ideal situation but this happens all the time with families in the spiraling down of our economy, people are becoming more resourceful because they have to. The costs have not been made public because they may not be popular with some that have donated but those donating, have a right to know where the monies are spent.

                Like

                • jordan2222 says:

                  I recall when MOM promised a regular and detailed accounting of the money. I think that failure has hurt the money coming in plus there was a lot of discussion about its legal structure and how the Bar viewed it.

                  Sorry, but I simply do not trust O’Mara. George was doing fine on his own and that abruptly changed. His part in the perjury scandal also did not help. He lied and people become wary and distrustful. I would like to see the legal terms and structure of the trust and how MOM is tied to it. I had thought we would see that but I have not. Have you?

                  I think SD was researching this at one time but do not what he found out. There is also something fishy about the second bond terms. Why is that not available like the first bond?

                  Lastly, why has MOM never asked for indigent status? I know what he has said recently but would all of that been different long ago? IDK..,.. just questions.

                  Like

                  • jordan2222 says:

                    I meant to say that MOM lied, not George and we all know that.

                    Like

                  • art tart says:

                    jordan2222 – all good points and I agree. The thing is, as much as I want an accounting, it probably the damn if you do and damn if you don’t thing as far as a breakdown of expenses. It may bring unwanted criticism and that’s something the defense doesn’t need, they need money. MOM shouldn’t have said there would be an accounting, its the dance attorney’s do, MOM would probably claim he did give an accounting, but it’s the nebulous expenses behind the broad amount MOM has listed as expenses as to where the money has been spent that raises questions.

                    Like

                  • jordan2222 says:

                    IDK but the bottom line now is that I have serious doubts that individuals can fund the defense. No way can they raise a half million and they might need more.

                    IMO, this is going to require Beasley and/or some other heavy hitters to come up with the money.

                    Like

                  • jello333 says:

                    Beasley has a lot more potential targets than just NBC. And if he’s successful with all of them, his share of awards/settlements is gonna be HUGE. And whether or not he IS successful is gonna be closely tied to how George’s criminal case goes. Soooo…. can you imagine Beasley just sitting by twiddling his thumbs while things fall apart in the criminal case? I can’t.

                    Like

                  • jordan2222 says:

                    IDK. I really don’t what they will do. MOM is not doing too well.

                    Like

                  • jello333 says:

                    After you see the motions that are gonna be filed tomorrow, THEN let me know what you think. ;)

                    (And no, I have no idea if something is gonna be filed… it’s just a feeling.)

                    Like

                  • jordan2222 says:

                    I always hope you are correct with your optimism.

                    Like

                  • arkansasmimi says:

                    Jello, I was thinking today was Thursday, and thinking tomm they would file something due to hearing next week. But yes I have feeling something being filed tomm or Friday. Would Friday still be within GZ 48 hr window. As only he has to abide. MAYBE some new docs released?

                    Like

            • justfactsplz says:

              My husband and I are on a fixed income and don’t even make that much a month. I believe the cars were paid off with the initial paypayl money. I totally understand the cost of security but living expenses not so much.

              Like

              • jordan2222 says:

                When George had control of the money, I am almost sure I read that he had paid off ALL of his debt plus he prepaid well in advance many other things like cell phones.

                He was preparing for something bad happening and did not want to leave Shellie penniless. It was an issue because I recall that there was an argument made that he would not do that if he was preparing to flee the country.

                Like

                • arkansasmimi says:

                  In those papers where they revolked his bond, I think there shows bank statements that show where stuff was paid for. I believe thats were that stuff is.

                  Like

                  • justfactsplz says:

                    Yes I am sure they paid those things off and I don’t blame them. They had no idea where there living was going to come from. Pretty scarey stuff. I know Omara bought property next to his office to expand. Maybe I have been on a budget so long I am out of touch. As long as George is taken care of that is my main concern. They have to be safe.

                    Like

                  • jello333 says:

                    Whatever wrong he may have done early-on, there’s no way I’d believe that MOM is now doing anything wasteful or unnecessary with the money they have coming in now. And like you say, however they need to use that money to help George and family, either for the case or for living expenses or for security or whatever, is fine with me.

                    Like

                  • justfactsplz says:

                    I hope they have enough to hire good experts.

                    Like

  20. brutalhonesty says:

    breaking: “miller” shuts down justice for trayvon comment section, WINNING. all their hate was too much, and they couldnt silence the truth, so they closed comments.

    Like

  21. ottawa925 says:

    From the Esquire Interview/Article of 11/13/2012, page 2 of the Article:

    “He was a cool kid. He didn’t start no trouble.

    He was a good linebacker. Like, if you hit against him—

    —Your helmet comin’ off.

    I remember the first time he hit me. I started cryin’ like, “I ain’t playin’ with him no more.”

    Trayvon said, Toughen up.

    He blitzed me. I didn’t want him to blitz no more.

    F’real.

    I stay out of his way. I try to trip him, but it ain’t working.

    Horton sends them off with a laugh: A’ight, knuckleheads, get going.”

    http://www.esquire.com/features/americans-2012/trayvon-martin-1212-2

    Read more: Trayvon Martin Family Interview – Trayvon Martin Is an American of the Year – Esquire http://www.esquire.com/features/americans-2012/trayvon-martin-1212-2#ixzz2M90ixvPf

    Like

    • jello333 says:

      I have NO DOUBT Trayvon was a tough guy. And remember, that talk about football is stuff that happened like 3 or 4 years earlier… so just imagine how much stronger and tougher he was by the time George ran into him.

      Like

      • rooferx says:

        And after his “MMA” training with his cousin. Look at the muscles on his shoulders in the pics at Sybrina’s Bday. That isn’t from studying in school and it’s not hereditary. He was working out…fighting style.

        Like

    • I have always thrown this stuff at them. Hes so weak? He played football. I remember those kids. they practiced every day before school. they want to know about some 45 feet they claim gz lied about….maybe trayvon tackled him after the punch.

      Like

  22. arkansasmimi says:

    Ok, read this story about the vigil in Sanford. Very interesting that most people mentioned or interviewed within this whole freaking MESS has a police record. Check out the young mother, who has brought her 6 yr old son to each event.
    Snip>
    With a pair of red candles left over from the holiday season, Shameka Baker brought her son Jonte Liggons, 6, to the vigil. Baker, of Sanford, has attended almost every Trayvon rally since last year.
    “I just don’t want to give up now,” said Baker.
    As a mother, Baker said she’s concerned about her son and how he’ll be treated as an adult. If he goes to the store, Baker said she wants him to “make it back safely.”
    But it’s not only about her son, she said.
    “It’s about making sure proper justice is being served,” she said. “Not just here but everywhere.”
    Story http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-trayvon-martin-vigil-20130226,0,2526081.story

    Like

  23. recoverydotgod says:

    Approach? “Mark?” “…disingenuous?”

    George Zimmerman’s attorney: We’re not trying to ‘demonize’ Trayvon Martin
    by Joy-Ann Reid | February 27, 2013 at 1:38 PM

    http://thegrio.com/2013/02/27/what-trayvon-martin-looked-like/2/#s:trayvon-martin-compilation-16×9

    -snip-

    Sanford native Natalie Jackson, an attorney for the Martin family, agrees that O’Mara must do everything he can to advocate for his client. But she and the rest of the Martin family legal team take issue with his approach.

    “Who Zimmerman saw [on the night of the shooting] was a figment of his imagination,” Jackson says. “And that’s where Mark is being disingenuous,….

    -snip-

    Like

    • GnataLIE is irrelevant. She said there were two shots. She has no credibility. She is in it for herself. She gets off on the dogpound tweeters. Shes like the wicked witch and her flying monkeys….oh wait now im going to be called racist. :)

      Like

      • Trayvon that they sold is the figment of Sybrina’s imagination. Her denial of who he was is telling. She wants to hold on to 14 year old baby tray for some reason, and I think its deeper rooted than his death, something along the lines that a son gets his moms name tatted on his wrist…maybe she had not even seen him since he was 14. Everything she says is true, as long as you think about him back then. Honors, football, Cheerful. I really think she never let go of that image, and to do so now would put her on the brink of insanity. Just look at her blink rate when asked about who he was.

        Like

        • diwataman says:

          Yep, they take everything and reverse it. The obvious figment of imagination here is the character of Trayvon they created to enrage the black masses and white sympathisers.

          Like

          • jordan2222 says:

            Wasn’t there a story she told about the two of them sleeping together for a long time?

            Like

            • dmoseylou says:

              Ewwwwwwww! You are so right. I needed a barf bag after I pulled the article for ya. ;)

              http://globalgrind.com/news/sybrina-fulton-trayvon-martin-mother-ricki-lake-show-details

              Like

              • jordan2222 says:

                Sick

                Like

                • dmoseylou says:

                  “You know, he was just a regular teenager. … ”

                  Very. Sick. That one paragraph is so reprehensible. My sons NEVER slept in my bed when they were 17, and they were “regular” teenagers (and I was a single mom.) And refer to me with a nickname like “cupcake?” No way, nada, zip, zilch.

                  That always reminds me of Alicia stating that Tray-non-dad had “CAT” tatted on his neck b/c that was TM’s nickname for her. Riiiiiiight….pre-Alicia pics of him would put that dog right to sleep. I knew exactly what that tat was the second I first saw it…and had an “Aw, sh%t! George is so scr*wed” moment. I worked Level 1 Trauma at a major medical center for decades. Everyone dreaded their week-ends on, b/c it was always He//. (Think present-day Chicago.) Crips and Bloods, Bloods and Crips. Every Friday, Saturday, and Sunday was lock-down. The smokers could not go outside on breaks…they had to go to the roof-top heli-port. Shift-change was mandatory armed police escort ONLY!—Not security guards; as a state-run facility, security was provided by city LEO.

                  The NBPP with their bounty for GZ was laughable. Really. Whimp-o-Dites. The very REAL threat to George and his family that continues to this day is from “CAT.”

                  Like

  24. wrongonred says:

    So, reading the argument proffered by the FBI, if accurate, is there anything to prevent the persecution using the FBI as a shield and saying, “Yes, we were aware of X,Y,Z exculpatory evidence, but it was generated by the FBI, and as such, under Brady, we were under the belief that they had the responsibility to hand it over to the defense, they just gave us, the persecution, a copy as professional courtesy……” Opps, what?!?! The FBI is legally barred from giving it to you? Oh man, sorry about that………..sucks we aren’t responsible……” Is that a possible, if not plausible, scenario? It also allows the FBI to shield the the persecution as they can say, “Yes, we had this exculpatory information, however, we were barred by law from providing it to the defense……however, we can give whatever inculpatory evidence we please to the persecution…..” I fear this could be the train crash we are heading towards………………..

    Like

  25. We had to go on and do the work of the court and we did.
    Ruth Bader Ginsburg

    So that’s the dissenter’s hope: that they are writing not for today but for tomorrow.
    Ruth Bader Ginsburg

    When police or prosecutors conceal significant exculpatory or impeaching material, we hold, it is ordinarily incumbent on the state to set the record straight.
    Ruth Bader Ginsburg

    “It had to register somehow with the Florida courts that that statute was there and that it might be in the state’s best interest not to go around changing the law after the election.”
    Ruth Bader Ginsburg

    “Arizona presents no specific reason for excepting capital defendants from the constitutional protections extended to defendants generally, and none is readily apparent.”
    Ruth Bader Ginsburg

    “What is subtle about what is described here?”
    Ruth Bader Ginsburg quote

    “are not warranted by the state interests — administrative efficiency, fraud detection, informing voters — alleged to justify those restrictions.”
    Ruth Bader Ginsburg quote

    Like

  26. diwataman says:

    Who is Stonewalling? – O’Mara is stonewalling himself: The FBI Issue

    http://diwataman.wordpress.com/2013/02/28/who-is-stonewalling/

    Like

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