01-08 George Zimmerman Case – Open Discussion Thread

Use this thread as an open thread just for Zimmerman Case stuff. A place to just dump, collect, or discuss general information about the Trayvon Martin VS George Zimmerman Case.

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304 Responses to 01-08 George Zimmerman Case – Open Discussion Thread

  1. dmoseylou says:

    George and Shellie: LAUGH! Out loud and on purpose: LAUGH! C’mon, Laugh! Force it if you have to! But LAUGH! Laughter increases serotonin “feel good” levels.

    Best Animals Fail & Wins Compilation Ever !! Funny Hahahah !!

  2. nomatter_nevermind says:

    I’m just beginning to get up to speed on purple drank. One of the first questions to pop into my head relates to Zimmerman’s statement on the police call that Martin appeared to be ‘on drugs’.

    Serino asked Zimmerman about this in the last SPD interview, on 2/29.

    2/29-3, 1:32-41

    Serino: On drugs, why?

    Zimmerman: Oh, because he just kept looking around, looking behind him, looking, just kept shifting where he was looking.

    Is the behavior Zimmerman described commonly associated with purple drank intoxication?

    • libby says:

      I think the more appropriate question would be, IS the behavior Zimmerman described commonly associated with burglars using purple drank intoxication?
      It is important to note that the job of a good prosecutor is to find inconsistencies in a defendant’s testimony (the existence of inconsistencies by itself is not proof of guilt since few of us would stand up to the scrutiny of a good interrogator without a lawyer under any circumstances, much less after defending one’s life from a brutal attack).
      SMALL inconsistencies would be expected of anyone who has been questioned for days after such a horrific event (and those were the kinds of inconsistencies they found with GZ, SMALL ONES).
      The parents of Trayvon Martin have provided inconsistencies so large you could drive a truck through them and they have NOT been questioned yet (their parental neglect has largely been ignored despite its being a potential felony).
      And by the way, seeing as the preliminary tox reports show Trayvon was on drugs (and they are still withholding the complete toxicology reports) AND that Trayvon had both brain damage AND liver damage from excessive drug use at a very young age, I would sugest that George may not have bene able to descroibe well how he knew trayvon was on some powerful AND dangerous drugs, he just knew it in his heart, in his gut. It was his instincts that told him Trayvon was on drugs (and his behavior that toild him trayvon was casing the neighborhod for a burglary). And his schol records indicate this would not have been the first time Trayvon was caught with stolen jewelery AND a burglary tool.
      The biggest confusion with these cough syrup concoctions (even here at the treehouse) is the type of drug that these concoctions represent. Your drank mixture contains the drugs you put in it. if you use a codeine or opiate based cough syrup, you get an opiate high and when you take the cough syrup that has an active ingredient that gives off a pcp like high, then that is what you get. The active ingredient in most over the counter cough syrups is DXM and this stuff not only gives a pcp like high, it also gives false positives for pcp use amongst its users (and it messes up your brain and liver big time if you take copious amounts of it).
      It should also be noted that almost every rap musician who has written songs glorifying drank or lean use has died from overdose or gun violence, but i bet they will be eager to pin that on GZ, also.

  3. rumpole2 says:

    Daily Daft Post From Justarse Quest

    It seems RZ has said something on Twitter about possible civil law suits?
    Whatever it is has given at least some of the JQ posters pause to think about the libellous stuff they post.

    It’s mostly paranoia I think, but the discussion on this subject highlights a few interesting points.

    Traybots are not so much worried about the HATE that they post… just worried about RZ (and others) seeing it. (Of course the creation of the secret Trayvon Zone Sewer came from that line of thinking)

    I doubt they get it, but it shows that on some level the KNOW that what they post is hate and that it may well cause harm.

    The solution offered by some alpha cretins is to simply put “IMO” or “JMO” in a post… then you can post anything you like, true or not, because “IMO” means it’s an “opinion” and you cant be held accountable for those!! (What do they smoke over there??)

    Seems NONE of them have thought of the most obvious solution… POST THE TRUTH.

    You can not be sued for libel if what you write is the truth… those worried should perhaps just stop posting lies and unsubstantiated supposition… that would work… move along… no law suit here, we only post the truth!

    Some examples at Random Topics

    • rumpole2 says:

      If they could only grasp the simple concept of posting the TRUTH when it comes to identified persons, they would not have to hide this and other discussion forums away in a secret sewer.
      It is daft to imagine that a “Members Only” area is in real terms not public anyway.
      ANYBODY can register as a member of of JQ, and clearly there are no real checks or standards as to who is accepted as a member. It is obvious from the posting that there are people who are “psychologically damaged”, and in a few cases, people who clearly have psychiatric problems and illnesses. It is known that criminal types (paedophiles and the like) are drawn to “True Crime” sites, and just in terms of statistical probability there are likely some very dubious types who are members of JQ.
      So…. members only area…….. not so elite as they pretend.

      • maggiemoowho says:

        Many are Pathological Liars and are incapable to see reason. They are unable to differentiate between fact and fiction. They should all donate their brains to science, maybe a cure could be found.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      “JMO”: the Bless his heart of the sewer occupants.

      Bless their hearts!

  4. rumpole2 says:

    A song for Trolls

  5. jim brown says:

    Several witnesses said they heard arguing outside, so loud it was, they were curious enough to look outside
    But Zimmerman told police there was no arguing and he also said he did not say anything. All this is on the Police tapes

    A fatal Zimmerman lie. I can’t wait for this trial to start because I know 100% TheRealGeorgeZimmerman will not testify.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      Several witnesses said they heard arguing outside, so loud it was, they were curious enough to look outside
      But Zimmerman told police there was no arguing and he also said he did not say anything. All this is on the Police tapes

      Again: exact quotes, please. What exactly did the witnesses say, and what did Zimmerman say?

      A fatal Zimmerman lie.

      Right; so even if found to be a bona fide lie, said lie disproves the physical injuries Zimmerman sustained at the hands of Martin, the multiple eye-witnesses who saw Martin on top of Zimmerman, beating him, the audio of a clearly distressed Zimmerman screaming in anguished pleas for help for almost a full minute… oh, and the complete lack of any physical injury to Martin indicative of being involved in a fight.

      Good luck with that.

      • jim brown says:

        silly the injuries are moot. so what there was a fight. big deal. why does your logic assume injuries mean the other guy started the fight? seriously? look I’m sorry you zimmerman fans have AVERAGE intelligence but the 2 are mutually exclusive.

        Mutuallly exclusive!

        the evidence released by the state is all over the internet. they have posted all the tapes. many witnesses heard arguing, most said it was too dark to see, or they were afraid. the liitle child witness walked around to the other side of the house because o the noise. zimmerman’s last interview on the 27th. he was asked 2x about arguing. he said “no arguing”.

        you zimmemran fans anser to all that is they’re all lying.

        • rumpole2 says:

          Have you been drinking?
          Your typing is slurred.
          Typing and drinking are not “mutually exclusive… but they usually do not mix well.

          Your dichotomy between what GZ said, and what witnesses reported is false. Witness testimony confirms what GZ stated. He did describe a verbal exchange with TM. Witnesses clearly confirm that when they say “arguing”

          • jim brown says:

            lie. you lost. it’s documented. George said he only said “I don’t have a problem”

            to you that qualifies as an argument. 5 words. witness said it went on for a while.

            you insult, I listen to the tapes.

            • raiikun says:

              One of the witnesses closest to the start of the altercation described what she thought were 3 exchanges of words (like one said something, then the other, then the first). Then the scuffling, grunting, which turned into yells. That matches George’s claim exactly.

              Some heard loud noises as if arguing, but couldn’t make anything out. For all you know, what they thought was arguing was the procession of the fight and grunting/yelling.

              You’re making assumptions about what they heard that there is no merit to making.

              • jello333 says:

                “Some heard loud noises as if arguing, but couldn’t make anything out. For all you know, what they thought was arguing was the procession of the fight and grunting/yelling.”

                Exactly. The one witness who seemed to hear things the best, described it as you noted. And so under the assumption that she was fairly accurate, it matched almost exactly with what George said. And so no reason to believe the other witnesses (who heard things LESS clearly than the first witness) actually heard a long drawn-out “arguing”, as opposed to a combination of the verbal confrontation AND the beginning of the physical conflict.

        • AghastInFL says:

          What did DD say?
          She mentions three exchanges, W-11 mentions three exchanges and GZ mentions three exchanges.
          Now consider this possibility, what the others heard was the muffled yelling for help coming from GZ; none of the arguing heard by say W-18 is clearly defined as words… And remember she times that argument exchange BEFORE George connected with the SPD.

        • Chip Bennett says:

          silly the injuries are moot. so what there was a fight. big deal.

          What’s the big deal? Why don’t you try reading the Florida self-defense statutes, and get back to us on that one?

          why does your logic assume injuries mean the other guy started the fight? seriously? look I’m sorry you zimmerman fans have AVERAGE intelligence…

          Oh, shucks; another ad hominem.

          …but the 2 are mutually exclusive.

          Mutuallly exclusive!

          I’ll type extra slowly for you this time, because I’m about to get into some seriously deep logic:

          In order for Zimmerman to have started a fight, he would have to have been engaged in a fight. If Zimmerman was never engaged in a fight, then it is impossible for him to have started a fight.

          A fight requires two participants. Two participants would result in physical injuries sustained by both parties.

          Martin exhibited no physical injuries, commensurate with a fight, whatsoever. Zimmerman, on the other hand, exhibited considerable physical injuries. Zimmerman’s physical injuries were caused by Martin.

          If Zimmerman wasn’t engaged in a fight, then the injuries he sustained were caused in a one-sided physical altercation, otherwise known legally as an assault.

          There was no fight; there was only an assault.

          Zimmerman’s injuries (especially the broken nose), and the description by multiple eye-witnesses of how Martin caused those injuries (a sustained, relentless assault while Zimmerman was screaming for help), prove that Martin committed a felony aggravated battery against Zimmerman.

          Under Florida statute, use of lethal force in self defense is justified in order to prevent the commission of a felony.

          In order to prove that Zimmerman does not have immunity on the basis of self-defense, the State will, at a minimum, have to prove, with a preponderance of the evidence, that Zimmerman was the physical aggressor.

          So, please present evidence that Zimmerman was the physical aggressor in this altercation.

          But going even farther than that: in order to prove that Zimmerman does not have the right to claim self-defense even if he was the aggressor, the State would have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Zimmerman did not attempt to remove himself from the altercation, and that he did not reasonable fear imminent risk to his life or significant bodily harm.

          Zimmerman repeatedly tried to get up from underneath Martin, but Martin knocked him down each time. Zimmerman screamed for help, and for Martin to stop, for at least the 40 seconds captured in the 911 recording. Zimmerman had already sustained a broken nose, and was having his head repeatedly knocked into the ground. Zimmerman had a taller, stronger, more physically fit person straddling him, pinning him to the ground, beating him in the head and face.

          Where is the evidence that Zimmerman did not attempt to remove himself from the altercation?

          Where is the evidence that a person would not reasonably fear imminent risk to life or significant bodily harm in that scenario?

          the evidence released by the state is all over the internet. they have posted all the tapes. many witnesses heard arguing, most said it was too dark to see, or they were afraid.

          I recommend that you go back and re-read the witness statements. Pay careful attention to the witness sketches, as well as the description of relative orientation of the “person in red” versus the “person in white/gray”.

          the liitle child witness walked around to the other side of the house because o the noise. zimmerman’s last interview on the 27th. he was asked 2x about arguing. he said “no arguing”.

          Rumpole has this one covered.

          you zimmemran fans anser to all that is they’re all lying.

          Oh look: another straw man.

          The only person even remotely suspected/accused of lying is Mary Cutcher, who self-servingly recanted/changed her testimony.

    • libby says:

      You might want to go watch a movie called “my cousin vinny”.
      It is not exactly like reading a law book, but it will give you some insight into:
      The FACT that not all witness testimony is treated as gospel.
      Some witnesses are more reliable than others.
      The more a witness’s testimony changes, the less reliable that testimony is percieved in most cases.
      And by the way,
      trayvon’s supposed girlfriend Deedee said it was trayvon who started the verbal altercation you describe.
      George Zimmerman wont need to testify. He already gave statement for three days WITHOUT the benefit of a lawyer even though that was his right as well as taking multiple lie detector tests.
      Among the realities you prolly never considered, but that I find mighty ironic is:
      Though George had the guts to be interviewed without a lawyer for days,
      the main cop who interveiwed George, when he was to be interviewed oin how he conducted himself in this case, he was so afraid, he couldnt do the interview WITHOUT an attorney present as GZ had (GZ has brass balls bigger than the persecutor bdlr AND the lead investigator serino).
      I bet you are blind to how it hurts the case that not is the lead investigator discredited, but also that most fo the cops that worked the scene that night will be witnesses for the defense.
      trayvon’s parents spent so much time attacking the cops that know the cops must let the world know that they did a good job at the scene, they recognized right away who was the thug and who was the victim. trayvon martin was only a victim of parental neglect while GZ was and is a victim of unbridled African American racism.
      The Sanford PD is comprised of one third whites, one third blacks and one third hispanics (the news media told you the dept was compruised of entirely whites). of course, the news media has done nothing but lie about this case from the start

      • jim brown says:

        GZ is stupid and a child murderer. He was soooooo confident he would get praise from the cops at racist Sanford PD. Until Trayvon’s parents insisted their kid is not that type kid.

        watch any cop show, they tell you what you say can be used against you.
        no it’s he didn’t have a lawyer.

        The Sanford PD and DA were already on the radar screen for racist police work. just months before zimmerman they were featured on ABC national news

        ask the security firm if GZ is a skunk?

        • libby says:

          I dont see any link you provided to the abc national news story you mention. Is that cuz you lie as much as the martin/fulton clan?

        • Knuckledraggingwino says:

          Why would Sanford Police be prejudiced to accept GZ’s word for what happened?

          Could it be that they remeber that the last Sanford PD cop to be shot in the line of duty was shot by a 16 year old Black male who was prowling an apartment complex in circumstances early similar to what GZ faced?

          Could it be that Sanford PD cops are smart enough to be aware of FBI homicide data that confirms that adult males are quite capable of killing with an unrelenting assault using “personal weapons” and that such an assaultnbecomes even more lethal if they are using a can of water Mellon colpcktail and a concrete sidewalk as bludgeons?

          • libby says:

            Trayvonites act like they are oblivious to karate, kung fu, silat, arnis, tae kwon do, etc.
            What does KARATE mean in japanese?
            EMPTY HAND!
            There are many many empty handed styles of martial arts (most of them are empoty handed), but I suspect you are well aware of this (thanks for sharing)

    • canadacan says:

      Count your blessings that you’re allowed to post here,

    • John Galt says:

      “But Zimmerman told police there was no arguing and he also said he did not say anything. All this is on the Police tapes”


  6. jim brown says:

    Zimmerman can cry about his bloody face all he wants. It means there was a fight,
    The instigator of a fight is mutually exclusive of who started the fight.

    The Child Trayvon was running away from Zimmerman , that’s what Zimmerman told 911. The Child is not the aggressor. End of Story. and we know zimmerman has a history of “chasing” after people from a wal-mart incident.

    Zimmerman’s word is not trustworthy. He’s got a problem of trust with the security firm, He’s got a problem of trust with the Judge, He’s got a problem of trust with his cousin, He’s got a problem of trust with his ex-Girl Friend, He’s got a problem of trust with his former school, He’s got a problem of trust at his former workplaces, He’s got a problem of trust with his creditors, He’s got a problem of trust in his previous police arrests.

    Hos story always conflicts in every issue. Now his story differs form the security firm. He lied to the judge. When he was arrested for assaulting the cop, his story is different than the cops.
    He told Police he had no problem with his former GF, Like a restraining order is NO BIG DEAL.

    He instigated a fight against a Child, the Child kicked his behind, Zimmerman only prior experience in fights was slapping, and punching women. His 2 year old butt found an 11th grader too much too handle.

    Zimmerman fits the profile of a loser looking to be somebody. Soon he will be a convicted murderer of a child. move aside Adam Lanza

    • jim brown says:

      Zimmerman can cry about his bloody face all he wants. It means there was a fight,
      The instigator of a fight is mutually exclusive of who started the fight.

      I meant the victor/loser of a fight is mutually exclusive of who started the fight.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      My goodness, but these trolls just get more and more stupid and insufferable with every reincarnation.

      Zimmerman can cry about his bloody face all he wants. It means there was a fight…

      A fight requires two participants. A fight would result in physical injuries to both parties, commensurate with mutual physical interaction.

      Martin had no such injuries.

      This wasn’t a fight; it was a one-sided beatdown.

      The instigator of a fight is mutually exclusive of who started the fight.

      I don’t think you understand the meaning of either instigator or mutually exclusive.

      Martin instigated the verbal confrontation (verified by State’s star witness, Dee Dee). Martin broke Zimmerman’s nose. No evidence whatsoever exists that Zimmerman ever swung on, much less ever touched, Martin.

      The Child…

      You mean, the 17-year-old, over six-feet-tall, fight-club refereeing…

      …Trayvon was running away from Zimmerman , that’s what Zimmerman told 911.

      Yes, as corroborated by State’s star witness, Dee Dee, Martin successfully eluded Zimmerman, and ended up all the way back near Brandi Green’s house.

      So how, pray tell, did a verbal confrontation and physical altercation between the two then later take place at the sidewalk “T” some 70 yards north of Brandi Green’s house – the same sidewalk “T” that falls right along the east-west route that Zimmerman claims to have taken?

      The Child…

      You mean, the 17-year-old, over six-feet-tall, fight-club refereeing…

      …is not the aggressor. End of Story.

      So, we have:

      – Dee Dee and Zimmerman both stating that Martin had eluded visual contact by Zimmerman
      – Dee Dee stating that Martin had reached the vicinity of Brandi Green’s house
      – Dee Dee stating that Martin refused run
      – Dee Dee and Zimmerman both stating that Martin started the verbal confrontation
      – The location of Martin’s body, and the various personal effects of both Martin and Zimmerman – not least importantly of which are Zimmerman’s keys and flashlight – was not near Brandi Green’s house, but rather at the sidewalk “T”
      – Zimmerman exhibited a broken nose, lacerations to his head, bruising to his face, swelling of his head, and copious amounts of blood
      – Martin exhibited scrapes on his knuckles, and the fatal gunshot wound, but not a single physical defensive injury
      – Multiple eye-witnesses stated that Martin was on top of Zimmerman
      – Not one single eye-witness stated that Zimmerman was ever in a position other than beneath Martin
      – At least one eye-witness stated that Zimmerman made several attempts to extricate himself from his pinned-down position, and that each time, Martin knocked Zimmerman back to the ground, so that he could continue beating Zimmerman.

      If Martin wasn’t the aggressor, how did the altercation take place at the sidewalk “T”, after Martin had successfully eluded Zimmerman, and had reached the vicinity of Brandi Green’s house?

      If Martin wasn’t the aggressor, why did Martin have no physical defensive injuries?

      If Martin wasn’t the aggressor, why did he pin ZImmerman to the ground, and repeatedly prevent him from getting up and escaping, while sustaining his “MMA-style” beatdown?

      and we know zimmerman has a history of “chasing” after people from a wal-mart incident.

      Zimmerman’s word is not trustworthy. He’s got a problem of trust with the security firm, He’s got a problem of trust with the Judge, He’s got a problem of trust with his cousin, He’s got a problem of trust with his ex-Girl Friend, He’s got a problem of trust with his former school, He’s got a problem of trust at his former workplaces, He’s got a problem of trust with his creditors, He’s got a problem of trust in his previous police arrests.

      Hos story always conflicts in every issue. Now his story differs form the security firm. He lied to the judge. When he was arrested for assaulting the cop, his story is different than the cops.
      He told Police he had no problem with his former GF, Like a restraining order is NO BIG DEAL.

      Most of this is specious, demonstrably refutable drivel. All of it is utterly irrelevant.

      He instigated a fight against a Child…

      You mean, a 17-year-old, over six-feet-tall, fight-club refereeing…

      …the Child…

      You mean, the 17-year-old, over six-feet-tall, fight-club refereeing…

      …kicked his behind, Zimmerman only prior experience in fights was slapping, and punching women.

      Untrue, and irrelevant even if it were true.

      His 2 year old…


      …butt found an 11th grader too much too handle.

      So you admit that Martin had established sufficient disparity of force to cause Zimmerman not to want to be involved in the physical altercation?

      That might be the most prescient thing you’ve said here, ever.

      Zimmerman fits the profile of a loser looking to be somebody.

      Are you really sure you want to play the fits the profile of… game with respect to the parties involved in this altercation?

      Soon he will be a convicted murderer of a child…

      You mean, a 17-year-old, over six-feet-tall, fight-club refereeing…

      …move aside Adam Lanza

      Wow, so you would compare Trayvon Martin to two classrooms full of six year olds?

      You stay classy, troll.

      • WeeWeed says:

        Before I head out the door to go to work, y’all want this clown locked up??

      • libby says:

        Thanks Chip,
        I should avoid the trolls (and avoid feeding them)

      • jim brown says:

        previous lying and criminal activity is not relevant?

        you under 18 you are considered a child, a minor, you cannot carry a concealed weapon, you cannot drink, cannot vote. He’s an 11th grader, he’s not Al Capone as that fool Zimmerman labeled , He’s not an azzhole as Zimmerman called him, He’s not a focking coon or punk as Zimmerman called him. He’s just a UNARMED kid walking home with candy from a 7-11. He should have been left alone and that dummy Zimmerman will pay
        On your opinion, you’re on the losing side of history. Reading your logic you probably swore Obama would lose. LOL!

        You can’t handle the truth you support a child murderer, woman beater, sex crime sick person.

        • WeeWeed says:

          Enough. You’ve become repetitive and boorish.

          • texan59 says:

            This just confirms my decision to stay off this page. :roll:

            • dmoseylou says:

              I just scroll right past all of it. Boring, waste of time, no good discourse / debate. Ignored Trolls will not stay where they can not cause a ruckus and divert all good conversation.
              I often hope no newbies decide to check out this page when post after post after post is nothing but Troll Talk.

            • dmoseylou says:

              I just scroll right past all of it. Boring, waste of time, no good discourse / debate. Ignored Trolls will not stay where they can not cause a ruckus and divert good conversation. I often hope newbies to this site do not visit this page when post after post after post is nothing but Troll Talk.

          • howie says:

            In order to be re-educated would he have to first be educated? Send him to the mines.

        • dexter says:

          Get real. Look at the time stamps. DD claimed he rain home from the 7=11, and than spent two minutes under the mail thing. George first phoned the dispatcher 40 minutes after Trayvon left the store. How long does it take to run half a mile? Trayvon wasn’t just returning home with candy and tea. He had something else in mind.

        • ftsk420 says:

          Funny thing is you really have no idea who Trayvon was you only know what you have been told. Bet my last dollar Trayvon would beat you like he did Zimmerman if given the chance.

          • howie says:

            Was T-con facing criminal charges?

            Vandalism and Juvenile Crimes in Miami, Florida

            In many cases, criminal mischief involves juvenile offenders. If your child is currently facing criminal charges for graffiti or vandalism, involving an experienced juvenile defense attorney as soon as possible is crucial. Although the juvenile justice system is geared toward rehabilitation rather than punishment alone, you will need a lawyer to protect your child’s rights and ensure they are given the opportunity to handle the underlying situation that caused the arrest or offense, rather than facing excessively harsh penalties.

        • tara says:

          I love how Team Skittles idiots always assume that GZ knew everything about Trademark, that he was in high school, that he was unarmed, that he majored in cheerful, etc.

      • Jim Brown is the product of “No Child Left Behind.” Really sad statement. More taxes!!!

    • profejb says:

      This “Jim Brown” troglodyte, “He’s got a problem . . . ” with credibility. Seems to love wasting his time by posting here and being shown for the embarrassingly pathetic ignoramus that he is. I too would like to YAWWWNNN when I see his name show up among posters, but, believe it or not, I actually feel pity for this poor unfortunate creature.

      Three (3) pertinent acronyms for you, Jim Brown, and please, write them down:

      1. GED ~ Get yourself to an Adult School somewhere, wear dark glasses to hide your age/ identity, change your name if you have to, then read and study so you can finally, finally get yours
      2. Meanwhile, until classes start, show us your proof/ evidence/ source, anything besides the silly wet-dream fantasies that you proffer here . .. . or . . . STFU
      3. Most important though, GTFOOH and don’t ever come back

      ***** “Jim Brown” ~ the person they had in mind when the “Scroll Down” function was created. *****

    • Justice4All says:


      Love it when these trolls come here and think that they are hurting George when all they are doing is opening opportunities for those with supportive evidence to dismantle all of the conspiracy theories that team skittles conjures up.

      This is honestly helpful for any lurkers we have here who are unfamiliar with the case. Most people see someone who resorts to name calling and claims that can not be supported with links to evidence and immediately focus their attention on the poster who can support their argument and is clearly more educated.

      If only Jim’s crew from across the street would join us in debate more often.

      • libby says:

        They dont have the intestinal fortitude God gave mice. They are happiest in a mob setting when their vigilante impulses need not be controlled in any way

    • ftsk420 says:

      Proof he instigated the fight? that’s right you have none. Child was running? more like Trayvon was looking to hide so he could ambush Zimmerman. Blood on George does prove a fight and it proves it was one sided the screams also prove Zimmerman was giving up add that to the fact that Trayvon was on top of him leaving him no way to escape which is why Trayvon was shot.

      • libby says:

        Trayvon did have a right of Stand your ground, btw., but stand your ground as I think you know has the responsibility to retreat if possible. The one on top doing the major beat down is the one with the greatest ability to retreat and thus the greatest legal responsibility to retreat. of course, in the minds of most of the trayvonites, trayvon had all the rights and none of the responsibilities and GZ had all the responsibilities and none of the rights

    • jello333 says:

      Stop with the “child” garbage, already! You’re just embarrassing yourself. And far worse than that, you are libeling Trayvon himself. If he’s watching you, if he’s watching what MOST of your type are doing and saying about him, he is DISGUSTED! You calling him a “child” and claiming he was “scared” and “just trying to get home with his candy” is insulting beyond belief. Trayvon would HATE what you’re doing.

  7. MuayTyson says:

    So Mr. Brown admits there was a fight and that GZ was injured.

    Hmmmm, well Mr. Brown you have over played your hand none of this matters. You see in the law of Self Defense as I know it there is a line and that line is where a reasonable person believes that his/her life is in danger. Trayvon sat mounted on GZ slamming his head into the ground this would leave any rational person to believe that death could result from such activity.
    I read the Florida Statute on Self Defense and I will provide the link(http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.013.html) There is nothing here about mutual combat.
    So let’s say for the sake of argument that Trayvon had Stood His Ground fair enough but where he went from defending himself to Aggravated Assault was the moment he continued to strike GZ as GZ was incapacitated or on his back under Trayvon. So no matter what happend up until Trayvon had the upper hand really matters because at some point he had defeated George yet choose to continue to injure him when he could have easily held him down until police arrived.

    Even in your version of the story(which I do not believe) George was justified in shooting and killing Trayvon Martin.

    • TandCrumpettes says:

      I don’t know about you, but I think that just being mounted by a complete stranger is enough to reasonably believe your life is in danger.

  8. jim brown says:

    I can not wait until they lock up this mental midget Zimmerman

    This guy is soooooo stupid , he flunked community college classes. WTF? you Zimmernan fans back this idiot up?

    oh yeah, let’s hide the money using my secret code, I can outsmart em. He’s a dope!

    and you women, you support men with restraining orders against them? do you silly girls realize that 50% of men who’ve had restraining orders go on to future crimes? you silly chicks need a court ordered stay-away boyfriend. suffer. the only chick he could pull was a desperate fat chick, the violent SOB.

    did any of you listen to the 4 police tapes? My God, get rid of this stupid child murdering fool now!

  9. MuayTyson says:

    Well Jim not going to answer to my reply?

  10. Has the hearing today been cancelled?

  11. TandCrumpettes says:

    So let me get this straight….these “new” rules apparently state that assault is A-OK as long as two parties engaged in an argument.

    I want to be clear on this for future reference. Usually when my hubs asks me where all the Oreos went, I blame the cat. He calls my bluff, and we tend to engage in an argument (albeit friendly) about the price of Oreos, the gas and time involved in buying more.

    Its good to know I can not only eat my husband’s Oreos, but break his nose and pound his head into concrete just because he dared call me a liar when I blamed the cat.

    Am I also allowed to commit attempted murder when he originally purchases said Oreos, and jokingly says to the cat, “Stay away from these?” I can’t have anyone “dissing” my furry homey, nomesane?

    • Sha says:

      Tand : Yep ! to here them say ……. That just about clears it all up for all of us . :D

    • eastern2western says:

      actually, the new rule should say all people should stay in their car when they see young black men walking around.

      • TandCrumpettes says:

        But wait! You are not allowed to see them waking around! “Looking at them” is a crime, punishable by death!

        As we all know, TM lost GZ. From his POV, all GZ had done was look at him. Look at him and talk on the phone.

        I believe GZ when he claims TM circled the vehicle. It makes sense. TM heard the conversation, realized the cops were getting involved, and ran. It also explains why he was so P.O.’d about everything that had happened thus far.

        Now, if GZ is lying about that, it makes TM look even worse. Now there’s NO excuse for being angry. He was just P.O.’d that someone had dared to “look at him.”

    • libby says:

      Whenever my wife accuses me of cleaning the house, I also blame the cat.
      They get blamed for plenty of stuff they didnt do, so they might as well get some credit for washing the dishes or cleaning the kitchen.

  12. Ron Callaway says:

    Obama told his loyal followers “If they bring a knife we bring a gun”
    Does that have anything to do with the violence by blacks on whites?
    If blacks and whites were reversed in population, the whites would
    be no more.

  13. Ricky Jimenez says:

    Jeralyn has an article, in reference to the Holmes Aurora shootings where she goes into the kind of preliminary hearings they have in Colorado to determine if there is probable cause to hold somebody for a felony (1st, 2nd or 3rd degree) charge. http://www.talkleft.com/story/2013/1/7/1012/98989 There is no doubt in my mind, that the Murder2 case against Zimmerman, outlined in the notorious Affidavit of Probable Cause, would not have survived such a hearing.

  14. eastern2western says:

    Jim Brown seems to be a high school kid who slept through basic political science classes. If he is losing a fight, he uses personal attacks to divert the attention or ignores the topic and jumps all around like a head less chicken. trying to have a legal argument with him seems to be a complete waste of time.

    • mung says:

      You really think it made it to high school?

    • Eric says:

      I love how he brings up that GZ failed community colleges. Really? What evidence is that? If you want to throw that one in there then that might be the motive behind Trayvon attempting to kill GZ. See how stupid you sound?

      Run along little kid. The thug deserved what he got.

  15. mung says:

    The real Jim Brown is probably rolling in his grave knowing that someone is using his name and making such comments.

  16. maggiemoowho says:

    Isn’t it illegal to provide misleading information on a website that asks for donations. The website for Change for TM is providing (In my opinion) misleading info in reference to statistics and the SYG law. They claim 30,000 mothers and fathers lost children to gun violence but do not specify facts. The site is all about SYG. So they are leading people to believe that, that many people have been killed due to the SYG law. (just like those rediculous PSA’s SF and BigTM made)

    • mung says:

      Every one of the people who shot someone over drugs was standing their ground to keep their drugs and the other people’s money. Don’t you get it?

    • libby says:

      This case is not just to make the martins/fultons rich, they want to make sure syg is eliminated where it exists and to make sure it is not enacted in the states where it doesnt yet exist (hell yeah, they will lie, cheat, steal, break any law they can think of to make sure thug’s partents get rich when their thug dies attempting to murder innocents like GZ).

  17. jordan2222 says:

    I have been virtually out of commission for the last few days but looks like all I missed is a couple of folks looking for arguments. Any important news lately?

  18. hoffstyle71 says:

    Flushed Down, oh I mean Blushed Brown or Jim Brown is yet another troglodyte who wandered off of the Leatherman drum circle campfire. Repetitive vomit from the know nothings is all he is. Just ip ban him and be done with it..

  19. eastern2western says:

    I do not know where jim brown is from, but I advise all people to stay away from it. In one of his comments, he stated people around his neighborhood believe zimmerman over reacted to an event that happens normally around there. According to his signed testimony, zimmerman shot martin because he got his nose broken, head banged against the concrete and also a death threart, but that is consider so normal around jim’s neighborhood that people are practically immune to it? wow, you guys should stay away from that place. No wonder it usually takes a day or two for him to answer some of our comments and his information seem so oudated because the new paper boy probably needs to carry an ak47 just to deliver news papers every morning. You guys should nice to him because man is from the place where corpses are used as stepping tiles.

    • mung says:

      That’s funny because people like him are afraid to come into my neighborhood because people defend themselves in my neighborhood. Probably doesn’t hurt that my neighbor is a PL2 trained security guard and has a stockpile. I am probably the least armed in the neighborhood with the exception of the vacant house.

    • WeeWeed says:

      I have to come tell ya’s this – that thing is in the spam bucket, callin’ us all kinds of raaaaayycciiiiiiiiis’, nazis and facists, and other words that he can’t spell – but he thinks YOU did it, east!!! After I TOLD him I was gonna do it. **sigh** Stoopid….. Carry on. I shall continue to spread hate and discontent on another thread….. :D

    • ftsk420 says:

      I’ll walk through his hood like I own it.

    • libby says:

      Normally, in his neighborhood, when a percieved white guy is walking around, he gets attacked viciously (often by feral teens) and nobody in Jim’s neighborhod thinks anything is wrong with beating the crap out of a white guy for no reason.
      Thanks to our esteemed moderators

  20. Eric says:


  21. eastern2western says:

    Look, I live in one of the most, if not the most, conservative cities in the South (at least we think we are…election results pretty much prove its true), YET, the general consensus of people here is that Zimmerman over-reacted to a relatively everyday situation, perhaps out of boredom, maybe out of a need to feel important ,and therefore has brought his own woes on himself.

    This is the original quote from brown and you guys need to stay away from his neighborhood. I have never heard of a place where a brutal beating is so normal that it happens everyday and people have practically imune to it. His streets must be fill with people whose faces are 45 percent covered in blood and they just walk around without any stiches, bandaide or even or even medicine. god, that place sounds like hell.

    • LetJusticePrevail says:

      That sounds like a scene from a “zombie apocalypse” movie…

    • maggiemoowho says:

      Just read the tweets from students in the Miami Dade school system. Fights, crime and death are all common. It’s hard to relate to the number of violent and criminal acts that come out of that school system. Where I grew up if a student got into a fist fight it made the evening news, crime was very low and shootings non exsistant(unless you lived in the city). TM was not the only friend of some to die that night, some of TM’s friends tweeted about another friend who “accidently” shot himself in the head on the same night. All boils down to the parents, where are the parents.

      • sundance says:

        Straight up. The PD in the area are really curious about what happens with this whole Trayvon thing. Apparently they all know the secret “PC” giddy up we talked about and outlined several weeks ago. In back chanels they are cautiously optimistic that all the stuff they face will come to the surface when the “true” story of Trayvon Martin the gang banger comes out.

        Lots of backroom convo amid the Miami-Dade School Police Dept about it.


  22. brutalhonesty says:

    fresh discovery on gz legal…crump handed over the tape finally

  23. brutalhonesty says:

    am i understanding this one correctly? they still didnt hand over the whole tape from beginning to end (so we can hear if they coach her or instruct her first)?
    and that they edited it out, again, knowing thats what west and omara are doing?>

  24. diwataman says:

    This is just absolutely nuts. Yes the audio is better but it’s still difficult to hear what she says. If what O’Mara got, again from the State, are the digital files off the recorder then someone did something I’m still trying to figure out. It sounds like someone is sitting at a computer with a microphone while pressing play on a digital recorder. I’m still thinking what happened was Gutman recorded the entire event from the time he got there to when he left. After that, Crump pulled out his recorder and Gutman played his while Crump recorded it to his recorder, I think. Then it appears some recorded the clips from Crumps recorder through a microphone onto a computer and back to a digital device and that is what Crump gave. He did not give his original recording.

    • howie says:

      I think the state was allowed to redact portions it did not deem relevant prior to giving it to Omara. The state has the whole tape.

      • rumpole2 says:

        My comment in the “sin bin” I’ll try re-wording it.

        Why doesn’t O’Meara subpoena Matt Guttman’s tape of this and subsequent interviews he boasts of having with a DD.

        • dmoseylou says:

          Why did the State not subpoena Gutman’s tape? Still no phone records / ping logs; and NO full tox report. This discovery circus is beyond ridiculous.

        • howie says:

          They may be awaiting the outcome of Shellies motion quo warranto for Corey to prove jurisdiction. I doubt she can. She and Lester had no biz collaborating in the charging of Shellie. Her case is local but was charged by John Guy, one of Corey’s assistants. Also Corey is up for re-appointment by Scott soon. They ain’t got us yet.

          • MJW says:

            I noticed that in both George’s and Shellie’s detailed case files there’s a new filing for the governor’s executive order 12-279. It was issued at the end of 2012. I haven’t been able to find it, but I’m guessing it extends the special prosecutor’s authority to crimes related or arsing from George’s case, in an attempt to cure the quo warranto problem.

            I’d think that even if it’s what I think it might be, the special prosecutor might have to start Shellie’s case over again, because at the time the case was initiated, the special prosecutor may not yet have had the authority. Perhaps the executive order attempts to make the authority retroactive, or just “clarifies” executive order 12-79 to say they had the authority all along. Of course, I’m just speculating about all this.

        • diwataman says:

          He will I’m sure, when he gets around to it. I think he’s just trying to get past the Crump thing first. Which reminds me. Do you know what time it is? Well in Florida the courts have closed and it appears nothing has been filed.

          17 days left to file.

      • diwataman says:

        It’s difficult to say if the State actually edited any of the interview from the time it started to the time it finished. The language is too vague to be sure but as it stands now it sounds like Crump had other recordings on there that were of who knows what, could be a grocery shopping list or some crap, that they did not include as part of what they gave to O’Mara. It still leaves the questions of what occurred here unexplained. O’Mara is going to have to subpoena the ABC recordings. I’m sure Matt will be very cooperative.

        This whole thing is truly just pathetic and is yet another demonstration of the weakness in the beliefs of Crump et al. in Georges guilt. If they were confident in their beliefs there would be a very clear line to information like this recording but all we see is obfuscation, stonewalling and deception. Nothing is simple with these people because they are so full of S***. Matt will play the same game. He could if he wanted to simply release the audio he has to the public, he never will, he is dedicated to “the cause”, he will obfuscate, stonewall and deceive just like the rest of em.

        • howie says:

          If the state had any evidence it would be delivered FED_EX in giant piles to his office. They would smother him with it. It would not be like pulling teeth.

        • Ricky Jimenez says:

          Have you ever written to Guttman asking for information or the release of his tapes? How do you he will be uncooperative?

          • diwataman says:

            Are you kidding me? He could, if he wanted, release what he has to the public but he restricts it to extremely short clips for media consumption to sell a very particular story. Nothing is stopping him in all of these months from posting what he has, he certainly doesn’t need me to ask him. If he so desired to be helpful he could also give what he has to the state yet that is not in the discovery now is it. He could send it on over to O’Mara, yeah right, good luck with that, not without a court order and even then he will more than likely put up a fight.

            • david says:

              I wouldn’t be at all suprised if Omara holds on to almost all reciprocal discovery until the deadline and then drops it all on Baldy at once to give the scheme team the least amount of time possible to spin it before the immunity hearing.

              • diwataman says:

                That would be about the worst thing he could do.

                • david says:


                  • diwataman says:

                    Because he’s supposed to give the state his discovery just like they are supposed to with him and this judge will not be playing games like that. West’s complaint last time to the judge was that he did not have time to respond to the State but she quickly turned that around on him by reminding him she gives plenty enough time in between hearings for any communications and to get things done. This is exactly the reason why I have kept a countdown on the lack of activity on O’Maras end to when the next hearing day comes. 17 days is not a lot considering everything. She is not going to screw around when it comes to this.

            • jello333 says:

              Gutman knows he’s very much in the firing line when it comes time for George’s team to file civil suits. But I think he’s got one very nice bit of leverage to avoid that: The tape. So I can easily imagine him agreeing to help MOM/West in that regard, in return for them agreeing to grant him immunity where any lawsuits are concerned.

        • jordan2222 says:

          So there is no transcript?

    • rumpole2 says:

      Why doesn’t MoM just subpoena Guttman’s tape? *Sigh*

      • howie says:

        He had to get the Crump tape first. It makes the Guttman tape accessible without a doubt. “to clarify”

        • rumpole2 says:

          I hope you are correct… and Guttman is added to witness list and deposed.

        • John Galt says:

          Bingo. The newly released Crump recording demonstrates that the information can not be obtained from alternative sources.

          “The shield law provides a qualified privilege, which means that a court may force you to reveal information in some circumstances, even if you are covered by the statute (above). In order to compel disclosure of the identity of an anonymous source or unpublished information, a court or other legal body must find that three conditions are met: (1) the information is relevant and material to unresolved issues in the case; (2) the information cannot be obtained from alternative sources; and (3) a compelling interest exists for requiring disclosure of the information. The results of this kind of balancing test would be different depending on the facts of the particular case.”


        • arkansasmimi says:

          I agree Howie.

    • jello333 says:

      Yep. And I think what’s gonna be most important about Crump’s tape is how it compares to Gutman’s tape. It’ll be a BIG part of showing what a conspiracy this all was. Without Gutman’s tape, Crump’s tape doesn’t change much. But once they compare the two… watch out.

    • John Galt says:

      IIRC, I think the info you posted on Crump’s recorder indicated that it recorded in mp3 format. gzlegal says that the State provided wma files, which seems to prove that somebody has been tampering with evidence, as the original file would have been in mp3 format.

    • justfactsplz says:

      He sure didn’t. More talking like marbles in their mouths. All the people talking in the background. The starting and stopping. How stupid do they think people are?

  25. mung says:

    File 5 at 33 seconds. Is it me or did she said that he was going into the NBA and stuff?

  26. mung says:

    So the first recording was edited. That is why they have both versions there. Nice.

  27. mung says:

    The dog pound and the leatherheads have swarmed over to Click Orlando like it is the end of the world or something. I guess the release didn’t hold anything good for them huh?

  28. eastern2western says:

    here is my question about this whole audio witness. she claims that she heard trayvon was being push because the head set felt. How is that even be possible? only an eye witness can see who pushed whom, but she was able to hear trayvon was the pushee? kid has better hearing than me?

    • LetJusticePrevail says:

      No, she made the headset claim to add a little “detail” to her story, just like she added “heard the grass” . Insignificant little details are the stock-in-trade of liars, because they are trying to divert attention from the actual lie, itself. The funny thing is, the details are what usually trap them.

      • eastern2western says:

        she also added she heard trayvon was yelling get off after the head set was dropped. which was never even existed in her first interview. I am getting this feeling that she is getting to be little to helpful in her testimony.

  29. hooson1st says:

    The snippets suggest that Crump talked to DeeDee prior to this recording, likely shortly before, and that he did not meet her in person.

    It sure doesn’t sound like this was a professional operation going on.

  30. MJW says:

    At about 4:18 (4:11 in the original version, released months ago), Crump says something that sounds to me like “Lily, Lily!” In the new version, the sound drop out, like a redaction, just before he says that, which is strange, because I hear nothing at that point in the original recording that needs redaction, though if “Liliy” is DeeDee’s name, that obviously should have been redacted.

    • diwataman says:

      Sounds like he says “let me, let me” As in “let me call you back…”

    • eastern2western says:

      while being much more digital, but it is just pure digital trash because that girl sounded like she was talking while eating. the defense should just depose her already without playing all of these hoka poka. I truly hope the next hearing is about impeachment of dd because of her questionable origin.

      • rumpole2 says:

        What she said back then… and what people said to her… is important in its own right.

        As well as what she now says in a deposition.

        • jello333 says:

          Yes, we should always keep in mind that the whole point of all this digging into everything about Dee Dee is NOT primarily to have her testimony deemed inadmissible. That of course will be part of it, but it’s even bigger than that. The main thing is to show that everything about her, her interviews and statements, and how they came to be… EVERYTHING is a major component of the conspiracy against George. So what MOM/West are doing is NOT simply trying to undercut Dee Dee’s testimony. It’s to help prove a CONSPIRACY.

  31. david says:

    The Tray Trolls fail again! In Florida it does not matter who the first agressor is, it matters who refuses to stop. Read 2 A) and B) 776.041 Use of force by aggressor.—The justification described in the preceding sections of this chapter is not available to a person who:
    (1) Is attempting to commit, committing, or escaping after the commission of, a forcible felony; or
    (2) Initially provokes the use of force against himself or herself, unless:
    (a) Such force is so great that the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant; or
    (b) In good faith, the person withdraws from physical contact with the assailant and indicates clearly to the assailant that he or she desires to withdraw and terminate the use of force, but the assailant continues or resumes the use of force.

    • howie says:

      The state knows they have no way to meet the bar of a murder 2 charge. They overcharged in order to try for a plea. A normal proceedure.

    • eastern2western says:

      that is the main point the whole media have missed since the beginning of the case. the usage of deadly force will always be the last option. if there were chances to escape, it is much better to escape. Even if zimm were the initial attacker, but martin should had stopped when he was winning the fight. However, he continued on and turned from a victim to an aggressor. this was explained by dershowitz, but every media associate seem to ignored expert opinion from him and just barry their head in their ass and listen to sharpton.

    • John Galt says:

      “In Florida it does not matter who the first agressor is, it matters who refuses to stop. Read 2 A) and B) 776.041 Use of force by aggressor.”

      Scheme Team’s point is that 776.041 can not be the basis for civil immunity. See 776.032, which omits listing 776.041 in the enumerated statutory grounds for immunity:


  32. david says:

    The Tray trolls also consistently overlook Gilbreath’s statement at the first bond hearing that there is no evidence at all to suggest who started the altercation.

  33. rumpole2 says:

    Girls talk
    There are some things you can’t cover up
    With lipstick and powder
    Thought I heard you mention my name
    Can’t you talk any louder……

  34. david says:

    Traybots love to say “trayvons body was 45 feet away from where George claims he was attacked” but when I respond that Trayvon’s body is 70 YARDS away from where the states star witness claims he was, they suddenly have nothing to say

  35. rumpole2 says:

    What was Crump thinking anyway.
    Officer of the Court?

    This amateur phone “interview” over the phone in a “Mickey Mouse” fashion with a potentially key witness in a murder case?
    At that stage, for all he knew, a Capital Murder case.

    • diwataman says:

      He doesn’t think, he acts. He acts on pure emotion that is cast in a civil rights mould. Trayvon Martin is just a stepping stone for him on his path to achieve black leadership status. If you haven’t noticed ever since the Martin case he has been running all around the country in search of very particular cases that will help him achieve that goal.

  36. eastern2western says:

    it is either angela corey was smoking mushrooms or she ws listening to a version that was much more clarified because I this digital clean up version was as the same as the one before. It is very hard for me to believe angela corey hangs her whole case on an audio witness as weak as her. basically, dd does not prove whole initiated the fight, who was winning the fight and also can not even id the white man was zimmerman. great, she gave it murder two becase election was coming and her numbers in the aa community was down due to the prosecution of a 13 year old black kid and a 30 year old black woman.

  37. MuayTyson says:

    The case really only hinges on one little fact. Was Trayvon on top of George? If he was and continued to assault George then George was justified in shooting him. George was for all purposes subdued and could not realisticly retreat or escape. This is a pure Self Defense case not a SYG case or another type of case. What happend before the physical action really has no berring the Traybots want to inject a lot of different motives and particulars to this case but even they agree that Trayvon was on top of George.
    If MoM can’t get this case thrown out then he needs to go work at Wendy’s.

    • eastern2western says:

      may be he is playing along to catch all of the little fishes.

    • jello333 says:

      “If MoM can’t get this case thrown out then he needs to go work at Wendy’s.”

      Agreed. But I don’t think he (or Don, or George, or anyone else on the team) WANT this thrown out just yet. Right now they’re probably collecting incriminating evidence (against the conspirators) like crazy. But once the criminal part of this case ends, that’ll be much harder to do.

  38. diwataman says:

    In this new audio we hear DeeDee say Trayvon wasn’t doing anything, he was just going to the store to get his littler brother some Skittles and Arizona Iced Tea. Wouldn’t she say something like “watermelon drink” if he in fact told her what he was going to get from the store? I would think so.


    • lovemygirl says:

      In another interview she said snacks, nothing specific.

    • lovemygirl says:

      Of course it isn’t his little brother either :)

    • eastern2western says:

      but the the police report states arizona ice tea which was all the information that was available when they invented dd.

      • jello333 says:

        Ding ding ding ding!!!

      • John McLachlan says:

        The police report described George Zimmerman as being white.
        Dee Dee claimed that trayvon Martin described George Zimmerman as being white, sitting in a car, not a pickup truck.
        Would Trayvon Martin have described George Zimmerman as being white, or Hispanic?
        Would Trayvon Martin have used the term car or pickup truck?

    • maggiemoowho says:

      Who is the voice in,the background. You can hear a male talking in the background.

      • rumpole2 says:

        If you listen very, very, very carefully you can hear quite distinctly the tune “Besame Mucho ” I have an ear for music and I recognise it is in fact “Los Paraguayos” who must have been in Crump’s office at the time.
        I can distinctly hear not one, but two, cockatoos singing along……… in harmony!

      • ejarra says:

        That was Tracy. I recognized his voice. In fact, Crump mentions his name.

        • justfactsplz says:

          Did I hear on that tape something about Crump not wanting to use a land line?

          • LetJusticePrevail says:

            Yes, you did. It sounded like Matt Gutman suggesting that they call back DeeDee on HER landline, but Crump cut that short, for some reason, saying something to the effect that he was having enough problems already. I thought THAT was rather odd. Why would he WANT her on a cell phone, with the poorer audio quality? Did he WANT a crappy recording, or was there some OTHER reason he did not want to use a landline on HER end? Maybe in case HIS phone records were ever checked?

          • ejarra says:

            Not just that, but Crump also wanted to have DD1 talk on speakerphone on HER side so that EVERYONE on CRUMP’S side could hear her. I know that’s NOT how it works and that she should NOT have had speakerphone turned on. I’ll bet that Crump told her to do that and that she was SO STUPID she believed that THAT was how it worked. Why else would SHE be on speakerphone. If she wasn’t, she would have been MUCH EASIER to understand. This was definitely a set-up. “little brother”, “ice tea” “big white man”.

            I’d know like to hear/read the Aug 2nd FDLE Jacksonville interview next.

    • rumpole2 says:

      Thanks for the YT upload, Dman.

    • ejarra says:

      I heard her say, “little brother”. I refuse to believe that Trayvon would call a kid he just met 4 days earlier his “little brother”.

    • John Galt says:

      From listening to the new release at gz legal:

      Part 2: there is an obvious redaction at about :40

      Part 2 at 1:25: Trayvon was waiting (presumably under the mail thing) for the rain to go down. It seems to me that this is fundamentally inconsistent with GZ’s version where Trayvon is walking or running at all times when observed by GZ. I don’t think GZ ever stated that he observed Trayvon sheltering under the mail shed. DD states that Trayvon also put his hoodie on, which was already on as shown by the 7-11 video. There is an obvious edit at 1:48 and 1:50. At 2:40, Crump curiously calls for God to bless Sybrina and Tracy for getting DD on the phone, as if it took a lot of effort. This is not apparent from the FDLE interview reports for Sybrina and Tracy.

      It seems to me that the beginning of the narrative was edited out of Part 3 as it seems to begin midstream. @ 1:35, Crump clarifies that the last thing that DD heard was “what are you doing around here”. There is no mention of “get off get off”.

      Part 3 @ 2:20 – DD says that Trayvon described GZ as “a big white dude” GZ at the time of the shooting, was neither big nor white. It seems to me that “big white dude” might have been concocted based on errant media reports of GZ as being white and 250 lbs. The “big white dude” transformed into a crazy creepy old white man at the BDLR interview. The common concept is that they are attempting to posture Trayvon as being scared. In the Crump interview, Trayvon is scared because a “big white dude” is following him. By the time of the BDLR interview, it is apparent that GZ is not the 250 lb. “big dude” mentioned by the media, so to keep him scary, he becomes crazy and creepy.

      Part 7 @ :28 DD mentions Arizona ice tea, which is, of course, false and derived from errant media reports. The significant thing here is that it is not obviously fed to her by a leading question, as in the BDLR interview.

      Also, I didn’t notice any reference to rushing for half time of the basketball game in the Crump interview. Was that concocted later?

  39. jordan2222 says:

    I cannot remember but does anyone recall exactly what evidence exists that proves that this girl was on the phone with Martin during the minutes prior to his death. Surely, there is more than the copy and paste job supplied by Crump.

    I am even more anxious now to know what O’Mara’s investigation of the phone reveals. I am guessing that he already knows and releasing this tape is only part of a strategy to show how absurd this is.

    • eastern2western says:

      that phone bill they turned in was just pure fugly pos. the letters were out of alighment and fonts are in different sizes. I am sure crump has not purchased any new office equipment for at least thirty years.

    • myopiafree says:

      Hi Jordan, I hope O’mara knows. Early on, the police should have ordered the phone company to publish those records as part of “discovery”. But they never where. TMs phone was DEAD – as far as we know, during that last 5 minutes. Where are the PING LOGS, that COULD show it was working?? Where is the “heart” phone data dump – that would PROVE these issues, one way or the other. All we have is Crump’s “cut and paste” “phone bill”, and a coached “bombshell” DeeDee. I hope she looks good, because she is no bombshell in her warped statements about TM.

    • justfactsplz says:

      There is no evidence that proves this person was on the phone with Martin minutes before his death. Crump’s crumped up phone record is not legit.

      • diwataman says:

        There is no evidence that we have seen does not mean it does not exist. The state has cell phone records of both Trayvon and W8, we just have not seen them.

        Also, I printed up my wife’s T-Mobile bill in the same format as the Crump upload and it is the same. There is also the fact that the phone number of W8′s appears on those records and the 911 call with two call backs from the SPD at the same time-frame they checked the pone out of the evidence room and put it back in.

      • tara says:

        I believe that Trademark was talking to DD. And it’s fine, it doesn’t change the facts of the case. She doesn’t help the prosecution one bit.

      • eastern2western says:

        even if their call did existed, dd may even further incriminate trayvon. according to her, trayvon first lost zimmerman and then he just magically saw him again? she is very weak as a witness because she is still can not prove who started the fight, winning the fight and the cause of the shot. remember that it is always the prosecution must prove its case beyond reasonable doubt.

        • justfactsplz says:

          IF and that is a big IF she really exists the defense will easily rip apart her testimony. She would be of no use to the prosecution.

      • dmoseylou says:

        Agreed. The Crumped up record is as fake as DD. Neither one exists. After the release of the slightly better taped interview of DD today, I pulled up the BDLR / DD interview and listened sentence-by-sentence to the 2 interviews, comparing the voices. The Crump DD is NOT the BDLR DD. MOM / West surely have had the 2 voices analyzed to authenticate if they are in fact one or two persons.

        • justfactsplz says:

          It amazes me how BDLR, the Martins, and Crump seemed to have gotten away with coaching these interviews. The fact that parents of a victim and their money grubbing attorney can produce this crap, and the state bites it, hook, line, and sinker. If this was on the up and up this witness would have been interviewed by the state in the presence of a court reporter, not going to the victim’s parents home to interview her. Abd what about the interviews of her in Jacksonville? Where is the documentation about these interviews and their contents?

          • jordan2222 says:

            IMO, this puts all of them in dangerous territory. One way or the other, the truth will finally come out. If they really believe that this video supports their case, then I must have been drinking every day since I started watching this mess. There is no way that this can be believed. Maybe is is a sign of final desperation but MoM had planned to use to discredit the whole thing .

            The next logical discovery will be times lines .

            • justfactsplz says:

              When on earth is the defense ever going to receive all of the state’s discover, the week before the immunity hearing?

          • jello333 says:

            “have gotten away with coaching these interviews”

            Here, just add these couple words and you’ll feel better: “SO FAR”

    • jello333 says:

      Oh yeah, I think MOM and West already know the answers to pretty much every question they’ve been asking. What they’re doing now is laying some traps.

  40. eastern2western says:

    To me, it is still very odd that the prosecution still does not have any recorded testimony of sabrina fulton. robert zimmerman was the first one who went to the police station and putted his words on tape that he was sure those screams are from george zimmerman. However, the prosecution still has not turned in any documented testimony of sabrina despite putting her as a pivotal witness in the identification of the the screams.

    • justfactsplz says:

      On the other hand the defense has Tracy Martin stating the voice was not his son’s, in the presence of two officers.

  41. dmoseylou says:

    Did anyone catch Robert Z on Hannity tonight? Anyone have it on video?

  42. dalec911 says:

    If Dee Dee… the real Dee Dee (if there is one) the 16 or 18 year old witness really shows up in court, well I’ll just eat my shorts!! But I really did like reading the rants from the Jim Brown earlier this morning. I laughed my ass off!. And that’s all I got to say bout that! back to lurking… and drinking!

    • justfactsplz says:

      No one will be more shocked than me if the one and only Dee Dee shows up in court. If she is real, why the need for more than one Dee Dee? Was SPD and Omara led down the rabbit hole to the wrong Dee Dee leading them to believe ……?

  43. diwataman says:

    Just checked my DVR of Hannity and there was no Robert.

  44. jordan2222 says:

    Considering everything we have seen so far, who thinks George will testify if this case gets as far as a SD hearing?

    • LetJusticePrevail says:

      I thought that it would be a “given” that George would testify at an immunity hearing. Is that not the “norm” for that type of proceeding?

    • libby says:

      me thinks not.
      he already testified for days upon questioning by the cops (and passed the lie detector tests)

    • John Galt says:

      I think Z will testify at an immunity hearing. Z has the burden of proving at the immunity hearing that he was not the initial aggressor and acted in self-defense. IMHO, his recorded police statements don’t come in, if offered by the defense, because of the hearsay rule. Defense might argue the past recollection recorded exception, but that requires Z to testify that he does not currently recall his previously recorded recollection. I don’t think they will go there. IMHO, Z will testify and BDLR will flap his wings, cackle, act outraged, and attempt to impeach with prior inconsistent statements.

  45. LittleLaughter says:

    I do not know the “norm”, but I do not believe he will. I believe his lawyers will present the evidence; refute the state’s *ebidence*, and present their side w/o GZ tesitfying. After all, He stands by his statement to LE; what more does he himself need to say?

  46. tara says:

    I love how Crump keeps trying to elicit some emotion from this girl by repeatedly telling her that she was the last person who spoke to Trademark, “just minutes before he was killed”, and she is COMPLETELY emotionless. The last time Crump appeals to her emotions she responds with “yah”. ROFL! The same thing happened when BDLR interviewed DD2.

    By the way, in part 8 DD1 claims that she spent the night in the hospital. I think at 1:02 she says her mother took her to the hospital at “two something”. Not sure how to rectify her statement with the massive number of tweets from that day. To those of you who haven’t seen this, take a look. Trademark’s funeral was Mar 3. http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2012/04/21/update-10-part-2-the-trayvon-martin-shooting-deedee-reveals-the-false-truths/#more-37932

  47. Knuckledraggingwino says:

    With my hearing, I have nothing to offer on interpreting the Crumpntapes. I am hoping fora transcript with notes on edits.

    I will point out that it is very possible that MoM and West have the Guttman tapes of the Double Dee Dee #1 interview. With Beasley backing them, they may have persuded the network to hand over the tapes in return for limitations on liability.

    If the defense has the Guttman tapes, then the only purpose of obtaining the tapes from Crump is to prove prosecutorial misconduct.

    • eastern2western says:

      it is not very likely because the defense must turn it over to the prosecution. remember that both sides have recipical discover. what ever the defense has, the prosecution must have a copy and also the public too because of the sunshine law.

      • howie says:

        I don’t think the state has got the goods. The charge does not meet the facts. The state keeps on the course that Zimmerman was not out of his car when the NEN told him the “did not need him to do that,” this was after he exited. The state insists it was before. As far as I can tell it was after. It is nonsense. All the state evidence shows he was returning to his vehicle and was approached and attacked. If that is true then the logical conclusion is that Zimmerman’s suspicion of the T-con was correct. He was acting strange and was on drugs.

  48. You all have to understand how lawyers work in small firms. Most are horribly backward in terms of technology. Even with computers, many lawyers are still using Windows 98 and XP Service Pack 1.

    Most do NOT have the capability to capture and preserve evidence when they have staff or themselves conduct “investigations.” Most buy a cheap digital camera and keep it in a drawer, to use on those rare occasions where they need to take a pic.

    With recordings it is even worse. Most lawyers do NOT have equipment suitable for recording phone calls or taking recorded statements. Heck, most lawyers do NOT know the law on surreptitiously recording conversations. (Some states are single consent, others mutual. Single consent means that one party only has to approve the recording or “eavesdropping.” Since the recorder constitutes a party to the recording, surreptitious recordings are allowed. Here in California it is mutual consent, so both sides have to consent to recording. That is why you hear when calling a service department “for quality control your call may be recorded.”)

    Anyway, I don’t know the law in Florida, but if it is mutual consent, did Crump get ON THE RECORDING consent from DeeDee to record her statement? If not, the recording may be kept out on that basis, especially if Crump made the recording with the intent of turning it over to law enforcement. According to case law he may have been acting as an agent of the police so he would be bound by the laws that limit police wiretaps and recordings. Just an aside, thinking out loud.

    Back to Crump. The reason the recording is so crappy is because either he did NOT have a recorder and bought one at Walgreens, or he had this el cheapo recorder to keep in a drawer or use for occasional notes to file.

    This was not a professional device, obviously, so you have to think of how this was done. I doubt the recorder an an external mic port, so any recording would have been done by Crump holding the device up to the speaker when the land line was on speakerphone mode, or he held it up to the phone earpiece.

    Either way, the recording quality is going to be horrible. For one thing, the mic on these el cheapo devices are not meant to record sounds emitting from other electronic devices, such as phones. Second, they don’t have the capability to drown out (cancel) background noise. End result, a recording like that Crump produced that day, and that he played ON THE DEVICE during his presser (see my YouTube video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86QQnKMuUmk )

    Also, remember to follow the money, follow the motive. At the time he made this recording Crump was desperate to get Zimmerman arrested and charged. This recording was included in Crump’s fabrication, destruction, and hiding of evidence. (E.g., Ask Crump at depo if he took pics of Trayvon Martin’s hands while the body was at Kurtz’s funeral home. Crump has pics of Trayvon Martin’s cuts on his knuckles.)

    Very few law offices are equipped to make professional audio quality recordings. All it takes is getting a recorder with an external mic jack and one of those suction cup phone recording devices ($3 at Radio Shack). And then the lawyer has to know where to put it on the phone handset (it goes in the middle, so the device can record BOTH the person recording and the person called).

    Given Crump’s low IQ (he really is dumb as a rock) I suspect he had a hell of a time figuring out how he was going to record the call, so that everyone in the room could hear it. He knew that he could record it with a free Android app (call recording software) but then he would not be able to let Gutman in on the action. That’s why I assume this recording was simply Crump putting the device next to another phone, that was on speaker phone mode. End result, the crap we hear today, unprofessional, the same as Crump.

    • jello333 says:

      Hey Mike*, where ya been? And that’s some very interesting points about the tape, but what really caught my attention is this: “Ask Crump at depo if he took pics of Trayvon Martin’s hands while the body was at Kurtz’s funeral home. Crump has pics of Trayvon Martin’s cuts on his knuckles.” Sounds like you’re not just speculating about this. Hmm….

      (* Michael… of course I meant Michael! ;) )

    • MJW says:

      Some states are single consent, others mutual.

      I believe Florida requires all parties to consent:

      934.03(3)(d): It is lawful under ss. 934.03-934.09 for a person to intercept a wire, oral, or electronic communication when all of the parties to the communication have given prior consent to such interception.

      If not, the recording may be kept out on that basis, especially if Crump made the recording with the intent of turning it over to law enforcement.

      I don’t see how it comes into evidence, no matter what. I can’t think of a Florida hearsay exception that would apply. The only likely use I can see is for impeachment as prior inconsistent statements, and obviously the defense would like it to be available for that purpose. Even if there were a hearsay exception, if the state tried to use the recording in place of DeeDee’s testimony, I think it would be excluded by the 6th Amendment. I’m not aware of any cases that considered whether interviews not done by the state can be testimonial hearsay, but under the circumstances, I don’t see any other conclusion.

    • dmoseylou says:

      “Crump has pics of Trayvon Martin’s cuts on his knuckles.”
      I have questioned the autopsy report from Day 1. As a practicing medical professional for years, that autopsy screams “WTH!” to me: Numerous omissions, breach of protocol, and misinformation. As with chain of custody records, a record from door-to-door (The minute TM’s body was signed into the ME offices until the minute he was signed out) should have been included in the report. It was not.

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