9/18 George Zimmerman Case – Open Discussion Thread

Use this thread as an open thread just for Zimmerman Case stuff. A place to just dump, collect, or discuss general information about the Trayvon Martin VS George Zimmerman Case.

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509 Responses to 9/18 George Zimmerman Case – Open Discussion Thread

  1. La Raza has gone on the record that George Zimmerman is more white than Hispanic. In deference to Obama and their wise Latina on the Supreme Court, Sonia Sotomayor, they will not speak up on Zimmerman’s behalf.

    This song is dedicated to George Zimmerman, who has changed the English dictionary. White Hispanics Unite!

  2. Hugh Stone says:

    Not directly about GZ, but it relates. Check this out.
    Black woman stands her ground against white devil.

    • waltherppk says:

      There should be an arrest. The bullet hole through the window is too far forward towards the front of the car, indicating the man was standing not in a location to attempt entry of the vehicle but was probably simply walking up from the front or walking by towards the front. The door handle and area where the bullet hole would correspond to a shooting of someone attempting entry of the vehicle would be two feet or more astern of where that bullet hole is located….so the evidence does not square with the shooters story and an arrest should have been made. I am betting there is a probability the woman was at fault in the accident and was reckless with the vehicle as well as moments later reckless with the gun. Based on what I see there there is no gray area and it really makes me wonder what the passenger reported seeing. I would bet the woman ends up being charged.

      • Chip Bennett says:

        I agree with your assessment of the placement of the bullet hole; additionally, there is eye-witness evidence that directly contradicts the shooter’s testimony.

        Perhaps the most important point: the police have already stated that they’re leaving the determination in the hands of a grand jury: which is exactly what Angela Corey should have done in the Zimmerman-Martin case.

        • waltherppk says:

          It looks like the bullet actually ricocheted off the door frame so that would tend to indicate the woman was definitely freaking out about something. And it looks like the collision was rear impact by the fellow who was killed, who then got out of his vehicle and went to the womans vehicle which is definitely not good. He should have been standing beside his vehicle or halfway bewteeen vehicles with his insurance card and drivers license in hand waiting in an unthreatening manner for the police to arrive. Closely approaching the other driver was a hugely dumb thing to do. So I would amend my earlier opinion and say this shooting will probably not be charged to the woman. It would not be the womans insurance coverage that was the issue in such a crash anyway, but the insurance issue would reside with the operator of the vehicle having the front end damage. So basically after such a crash all the man should have done is stand there peacefully looking stupid and apologetic with his insurance card and drivers license in hand ….because then it was the womans move in that incident where the man was already evidently at fault.
          From what I understand it is smartest to stay with your own vehicle calmly waiting for the police to arrive. Approaching too closely a vehicle of a stranger in a stressful situation or an isolated location either one is unwise and is a good way to get shot which is exactly what appears to be the case here. But still the bullet hole is in a very odd location as would indicate a weird situation. I doubt the man was really trying to enter the car. I don’t doubt that the woman was seriously freaked out because she shot her own car door frame and killed the man with a ricochet shot. Write this one off to youth and inexperience making a reckless driving incident escalated into a reckless walkup that never should have happened, ostenisbly to “take care of business” that should have been left to the cops. Fatal error you betcha, but the error was likely by the man and the woman will not be charged if this checks out the way it is looking now.

    • maggiemoowho says:

      She stayed in her car so nobody should have been shot, nobody should have been killed. Isn’t that what Camp TM keeps saying about GZ. He should have stayed in his car.

    • knuckledragingwino says:

      I presume you people are joking?

      If someone had been engaging in hostile, aggressive behavior while following the woman before she arrived at the service station, then exited his vehicle to approach her vehicle in a hostle manner, she had every reason to be fearful. If he then escalated by pounding on her vehicle and broke her window (see the photo), then she had every reason to believe that he would soon gain entry. Once he entered her vehicle or removed her from her vehicle, her prospects for survival would be grim.

      Assuming that these are the facts of the case, then good for her.

      Those of us in the Treehouse should be just bas eager to support this woman’s right to self defense as we are GZ’s.

      • msfaye123 says:

        In this case the woman was still in her car and could have very well driven off.
        A press of a buttom would have locked all doors and a press of the accelerator would have given her a chance to drive away. In George’s case according to John even when George was pulling Trayvon up and it appeared that George was trying to get Trayvon off of him George was unable to do so.

        • Chip Bennett says:

          Or lay on the car horn. Or set off the car’s panic alarm.

          • myopiafree says:

            Locking the door – was all she had to do. Futher, like GZ/TM – this should go to a Grand Jury – that is the only way.

            • maggiemoowho says:

              I won’t make a judgement unless we see all the facts because we all know how the media spins things. If the media wants to defend this lady they will say the victim had a machine gun pointed at her while pounding on her window and if they want to prosecute this lady they will say the victim had a baby in his arms while tapping on her window.

        • ftsk420 says:

          Friend of mine had something happen to him the other day which almost ended someone’s life. He was driving his truck at about 7am in the morning when he slowed down to go over a speed bump a black male ran to his driver side door my friends window was open. To the black males surprise my friend packs a .44 mag with a 7″barrel. Once the black male was done shitting him self he said all he wanted was a cigarette. My friends response was BS and even if true you almost died for a cigarette. Anybody who knows the streets knows the black male thought he had an easy target and was gonna rob him.

          • Sha says:

            ftsk420: Your friend may have saved a few lives including the guy who ran up on his truck. The guy will think twice before he runs up on someone else hopefully and in return if he was up to no good save maybe his life as well as others.

      • waltherppk says:

        Listen to the man who was fifteen feet away and you have a witness and evidence that both show difficulties with the womans story. Chip is correct however that if there is more to the story a grand jury should decide the matter of what to do. If the woman really was being the recipient of a road rage kind of incident then no she should not be charged.
        Of course she had a right of self defense….but that bullet hole is nearer the front frame of the door beside the windshield and you don’t open a door using the side view mirror as a door handle.

        • msfaye123 says:

          ….but that bullet hole is nearer the front frame of the door beside the windshield and you don’t open a door using the side view mirror as a door handle.


      • Knuckledraggingwino says:

        At this point we have very little information, so we are all speculating. Here is what we think we know so far:
        It appears that this was an ongoing road rage prior to the two vehicles reaching the gas station.
        It appears that the shootee rear ended the shooters car.
        We do not know if this rear ending collision was intentional or unintentional. If the rear ending was intentional, then it was an assault with a deadly weapon. If you don’t believe me, check out the FBI stats or Vital Statistics of the US stats on weapons used in homicides.
        It appears that the shooter had the opportunity to fleeing her vehicle. However; if there had been an ongoing pursuit by the shootee prior to the rear ending then she had already made a good faith effort to retreat. Furthermore; the continued pursuit might have demonstrated that the shootee’s superior horsepower and skill made retreat impractical. It is also possible that the shooter’s car had stalled on impact or she turned it off. (auto trans or manual. If manual, did she stall it trying to leave?)
        Yea, the woman is in her car. BFD! It isn’t an armored car. Do any of you people have any idea how easy it isto brak into a car? I have putty fist through a car window on multiple occassions. Once to free someone from a car and a few times because I was angry. (my own car, LOL ). The car was only a temporary barrier to protect her from an assault.

        The exact position of the shootee relative to the car door latch is irrellavant. If the door is locked, an assailant is not going to continue entry by opening the door. An assailant will then attempt entry by breaking a window. Standing slightly ahead of the window frame perfectly positions an assailant to break the window. It is also a dynamic situation, so an assailant will be moving around.
        The trajectory of the magic bullet does not concern me. We do not know how many rounds were fired. The shooter honestly does not know. That will be determined. However; given the geometry, it is probable that the shootee was shot in the kneck. An over penetration is almost inevitable even with a defelection from the spine.
        The witness is lying about how close he was. Look at Diawataman’s photos. He also wasn’t in a position where the bullet that hit the truck would “whiz by him”. If he was further away then stated, then he didn’t hear much before the shooting. He knows nothing about what happened prior to the shooter and shootee’s arrival at the gas station.
        As I said, I don’t know what happened, but the basic facts known so far favor the woman.

    • diwataman says:

      Oh I see how it is. The laws are okay for blacks but not for non blacks, ahhh, I get it now.

    • Sounds as though this incident arose from a rear-end traffic incident that escalated into tragedy. Assuming the witness was in that parking lot; The vehicles would’ve had to be traveling from right to left in order for the bullet to pass through the vehicle window, rapidly expanding prior to fatally injuring the deceased. The bullet is supposed to then travel (visual estimate) another 100-150 feet whizzing past the witnesses head. Therefore: #1) I’m wondering the position of the deceased prior to the shot/s being fired. where was the entry wound, where was the exit wound (if applicable)? I question whether she fired only a single shot, if that’s a fact, did she have some of those magic bullets from the JFK assassination? Unless her weapon was a magnum, firing ammunition at around 1,600/fps, her explanation is unlikely correct. Even a full metal jacket cartridge AKA ball ammo would require enough energy to propel the bullet through the vehicle glass which creates rapid expansion & sheds a good amount of energy, then enter the victim’s body inflicting a fatal injury without striking anything solid such as bone, exit the body while retaining the energy required to travel past the witness with a sustained velocity that he heard the bullet whiz past his face. Unless the fatal wound was to the neck area, it’s likely that either the shooter had magic magnum ammo or the witness in embellishing his statement for whatever reason. The deceased guy could’ve angrily approached her vehicle & banged on the window if she failed to acknowledge him. The gas station witness couldn’t be expected to hear such an incident if there was a constant flow of traffic. Though she’s probably not required to, assuming she were in fear, why didn’t she lock the vehicle doors, called 911 & wait for the authorities to arrive? Just my opinion; Information is missing or somebody is lying/embellishing the facts.

  3. good morning treepers
    with all the information thats out there I find it baffling how most bloggers and fb commentors are still declaring falsehoods as facts in this case. I am a firm believer that GZ maliciously and repeatedly slammed his face against TM’s fists!

    • waltherppk says:

      The Trayvonites probably think George grabbed the poor innocent skinny lad by the ears and fell backwards pulling him down atop him and at gunpoint ordered the terrified child to scream loudly for nearly a minute so as to attract the attention of the entire neighborhood along with the police who would be arriving any minute just so they could witness an incident where their own eyes could not be believed due to the clever ruse and masterful deception of a man only pretending to be the victim of a brutal assault escalating to an attempted murder. It was fortunate that George remembered his firearm when he did or the police may have arrived minutes later to find both men naked with the black child chewing on a mouthful of white hispanic face meat and still screaming……cupcake …cupcake…..after I finish my cannibal zombie attack for dessert I want a cupcake.

  4. cecelia says:

    Nope not a bit of intelligent life on this thread… just the zimbots spewing the same wore out lies of their idol mr zimmurderman.

    • mung says:

      Better than the lies that Team Trayvon is spewing. Not one fact has come out of anyone’s mouth on the side of Team Trayvon.

    • waltherppk says:

      It will be interesting what the full tox results show and if there is any parallel with the flesh eating zombie incident that occurred. Oh wait there already is a parallel isn’t there….another stoner whose forcible felony aggravated battery was interrupted by a bullet. Was being unarmed any issue there ….no. So where is the outrage over the shooting of a poor unarmed cannibal ? Guess a cannibal wouldn’t be as easily airbrushed to be a black victim poster child especially with the cannibal image problem thing and all. Maybe there are some things beyond even Crump and Julison in the way of a challenge of manufacturing graven images to deceive people. Trayvonites airbrushed babyfaced child “victim” is a graven image and it isn’t the image of the thug that George Zimmerman shot. All the Trayvonites are trying to do is gang up and finish the job on George Zimmerman that Trayvon tried and failed to accomplish. The scam did not work in the Duke lacrosse case and it won’t work here either.

  5. cecelia says:

    Name one! oh wait you can’t! zimmurderman is on trial NOT TM! and the FACTS are looking like he’ll be convicted of 2nd degree for those of us smart enough to actually LOOK at all the incriminating stuff against the hopped up on adderal murdering POS that can’t keep his stories (PLURAL) straight..

    • sandy says:

      If you have ADHD Adderal does not “hop” a person up. It has the opposite affect – it calms a person down so they can better concentrate. Get your facts straight before you spout garbage.

      • mung says:

        Yes I am getting tired of the BS about the meds. In fact George has a recognized disability and these people have no problems with calling him names for it.

      • flaladybug says:

        Agreed Sandy! I am a 41 married mother of four son’s and was diagnosed with ADHD 2 years ago. I was prescribed Adderrall and the difference in my life has been a lifesaver!! Not only am I more focused and calm, but my reactions to stressful situations has improved dramatically. And for the claim that George was “hopped up” or abusing his meds, I can assure anyone that if that WERE the case, he would not be physically or mentally capable of sitting through the hours of taped statements he made to SPD!! Overuse of these meds would have made him agitated, unable to focus, caused him to sweat profusely, etc. Anyone who has viewed the tapes would know this WAS NOT the case with George!! Btw….the 2 stress tests he PASSED would have detected an extremely rapid pulse ……this did not happen.

    • mung says:

      What incriminating stuff, what facts? You want to keep this on only relevant facts OK. There is photo evidence that shows George was beaten. There are witnesses that said Trayvon was on top of George beating him. George shot Trayvon in self defense.

      Those are the only facts that matter.

    • You’re funny. Those that believe in Zimmerman’s innocence aren’t the ones having to desperately look for “inconsistencies” or get theories from dumpster divers like Leatherman.

    • maggiemoowho says:

      Please tell us some of those facts that you claim will convict George and don’t forget to give actual proof of those facts. You and your friends come here and make all these accusations and never back them up with factual proven evidence. As for GZ’s medications, he was prescribed those meds, unlike TM who was taking illegal drugs. That has been proven by the coroner and by the school.
      One more thing, we are all adults. You might want to address us as such, your name calling and rants are very juvenile.

        • mung says:

          You spelled troll wrong.

        • maggiemoowho says:

          They don’t have any factual evidence. Juvenile name calling and rants is the only way they know how to deal with their anger and frustration. Somehow they think these rants make GZ look guilty, when in fact it makes them look desperate and ridiculous.

          • mung says:

            You couldn’t be more on target there. There are a few things going on with these people. One of the big issues is that they were fed this story and got very emotionally involved with it. When the facts started coming out they couldn’t deal with the fact that they had been duped and that what they thought was true was not. So in an effort to try to reconcile what is in their mind with the facts they spew lies and slander. They see us as the enemy because we know the facts and those facts are in conflict with what they have in their heads.

            What would be interesting is how many of these people would actually invite the real Trayvon into their house? I bet very few would.

            • breemcphee says:

              @mung – your explanation about the obsessos is spot on!

            • Excellent analysis. The hatred they put out there is astounding. GZ is just a regular guy that was trying to protect his neighborhood. Don’t they get that? I think deep down they do get it, but can’t admit that they were misled by all the propaganda.

            • John Galt says:

              “What would be interesting is how many of these people would actually invite the real Trayvon into their house? I bet very few would.”

              If anybody wanted him in their house, he would have been carrying a house key.

              • mung says:

                What I mean is do you think any of these people who support little baby Trayvon would have ever invited him into their house for dinner? I doubt it. They would clutch their purses or wallets if they saw him walking down the street. It’s their own fear that they are trying to run away from.

    • the adderall angle is silly. millions of people are prescribed adderall in this country. what I can’t seem to understand are the injuries to both parties.. on the one hand we have a broken nose, black eyes, cuts to the back of the head, and blood. On the other hand we have scraped knuckles and a GSW.. Who was the aggressor again? the guy with the broken head or the guy with the scuffed up knuckles? I think a jury would know.

    • Show me one murder case, involving no white people, that angered you this much and when/where you commented on it.

      • Chip Bennett says:

        The Zimmerman-Martin case involves no white people, regardless of the novel “White Hispanic” label the NYTimes applied to George Zimmerman.

        • Well there was Chief Bill Lee, he was white and clearly in cahoots with GZ.. (kidding) :P

        • mung says:

          Sorry Chip you are wrong on this one. The Zimmerman-Martin case involves thousands of white people……who believe that they are being a good citizen by calling anyone who doesn’t buy into the media hype a racist. Those white people don’t seem to realize that the black people they think they are siding with, hate them for trying to pretend like they understand their plight.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      …and the FACTS are looking like he’ll be convicted of 2nd degree for those of us smart enough to actually LOOK at all the incriminating stuff…

      Would you be so kind as to list the facts and incriminating stuff that will lead to Zimmerman’s conviction?

    • msfaye123 says:

      “can’t keep his stories (PLURAL) straight”.
      1. Martins stated that Trayvon came to Sanford on Wednesday and on Tuesday and Serino stated that Trayvon had been in Sanford 7 days prior to the incident.
      When did Trayvon come to Sanford?
      2. Brandi saw Trayvon on Sunday morning when all of the boys were sleep, Tracy hadn’t seen his some since Saturday night around 8:30PM. When were the last time that Tracy Martin actually saw his son?
      4. Tracy told the 911 call taker that his son had on shorts and flip-flops, he had to be corrected by those in the background. Tracy didn’t know what his son had on.
      3. Chad stated that he and Trayvon WAS WATCHING the all-star game when Trayvon decided to go to the store. Trayvon was in 7-11 around 6:30pm the all star game hadn’s started yet.

      Did Tracy Martin come home that Sunday night around 10:30PM or did Tracy Martin come home in the weewee hours of Monday morning just prior to calling his son in as a missing person?

      If Tracy Martin came home at 10:30PM that Sunday night and his son wasn’t home did Tracy Martin react like a loving concerned parent?

      According to Tracy Martin his son didn’t know anyone in Sanford, ok so where in the heck did Mr. Martin think his son was?
      Lets see how concern Tracy Martin was about the whereabouts and the safety of his son.
      1. Did he look out on the patio to see if Trayvon was sitting out listening to music or chatting on the phone? NO
      2. Did he get in his car and drive around the neighborhood to see if may be he was hanging and chatting with some newly found friends? NO
      3. Did he drive to the store to see if the could spot his son walking or laying on the side of the street dead? NO
      4. Did he call Trayvon’s mother and asked if she had heard from Trayvon recently? NO
      5. Did he drive to the cousin’s house to see if Trayvon was there? NO
      6. Did he call the local hospitals to see if Trayvon was in the ER? NO
      7. Did he call the local police station to see if there had been any encounter with a person meeting Trayvon description? NO
      8. Did he continue to call his son’s phone throughout the night in hope that he would answer the phone. According to Tracy his son’s phone was going straight to voicemail, did Tracy bother to lead a message that said you need to call me asap? NO

      Tracy Martin did none of the things that a concerned loving parent would have done, what Tracy Martin did was he turned HIS phone off making it impossible for his own son to reach him in case of an emergency. Not only did he disconnect the line of communication between him and his son, Tracy Martin went to see and didn’t get up until 7:00AM the next morning. Tracy Martin slept all night not knowing where his son was, his son who was in an area where he knew no one, his son who had left walking to a store on minutes away hours earlier on a raining dark night. His son who he couldn’t get in touch with yet Tracy Martin slept all night.

      • Sha says:

        msfaye123: I replied to you on yesterdays thread but for some reason it kicked it to the bottom of the page. It was about these same issues.

    • myopiafree says:

      We are still waiting for proof that the “Heart” cell phone was actually working, and further, the Tower “Ping Longs”. It also seems that the State’s start witness was lying when she said that TM was going back for “Half-time” – when the game had not even started. This is the LaCross/Nifong case – all over again.

    • I’m not familiar with the evidence of which you reference. Could you PLEASE post it here in order that I may review such evidence? Of course I’ll (probably other Treepers too) retort your evidential claims but don’t let that stop you from proceeding. PLEASE: Go ahead, make an honest effort in presenting your version of the facts. BTW: I completely understand if no such evidence exists & you’re merely swinging by to disrupt the conversation here. This site is a magnet for Mountain Trolls!

    • jello333 says:

      When this case is dismissed at the immunity hearing, have you decided where you’re gonna riot? Is it gonna be somewhere specific, or are you just gonna be spontaneous, and do it wherever you happen to be when you hear the news?

  6. cecelia says:

    Pretty soon the only disability anyone will recognize is the FACT that this LOSER (who may have been abusing his meds, we’ll never know since the good ‘ol boys club’ didn’t test him) shot and killed TM because he’s got anger issues and will be spending time in prison. he’s a big pansy who can’t deal with RL on his own was he drinking with his meds? more than likely since he was hanging out with the violent and drunken taaffee who lies as much as zimmurderman

    • So genius, why did Zimmerman let Trayvon scream for over 40 seconds? I guess he wanted people to see him grabbing Trayvon’s hoodie to prevent him from getting away (according to Leatherman’s theory) right before he shot Trayvon?

    • mung says:

      Nothing in your post is fact. Did you eat a lot of paint chips when you were a kid?

    • sandy says:

      You aren’t worth my time. You have nothing but hateful opinions or guesswork, neither of which will get you far in a court of law. When you have facts and are willing to be polite, come back to visit. Until then, you try to have a nice day.

    • maggiemoowho says:

      That is your opinion and your entitled to it. Such strong accusations against someone you don’t know, you talk as though you have a personal experience with these things.

    • LOSER.. abusing meds.. good ‘ol boys club.. anger issues.. spending time in prison.. big pansy.. can’t deal with RL.. drinking with meds.. violent and drunken taafee.. zimmurderman..

      Just listing all the catchphrases :)

    • Chip Bennett says:

      Do you have any evidence or facts to discuss?

      Trust us: you don’t want to get into comparative character assassination between Zimmerman and Martin.

      And honestly, since none of that has any direct bearing on countering the known evidence of the case – namely that the State’s star witness Dee Dee indicated that Martin willingly chose not to go inside the house to which he had returned, and that Martin willingly chose to return to Zimmerman to verbally accost him; that multiple witnesses identified Martin as being on top of Zimmerman, beating him; that Zimmerman had injuries consistent with being assaulted; and that Martin evinced nothing to indicate that Zimmerman ever even touched him – I really don’t care to waste our time on irrelevant character assassinations, either.

      • What does it say for Trayvon that the people who support him dont know what he looked like during the day he was shot, don’t know who he was and don’t want to.

        What does it say for Trayvon that the people who support him don’t care to take the time to research the facts and make it about themselves (race, let’s be honest) and not him.

        The whole time we hear about how it is wrong to profile. Tracy didn’t trust the police, Ben didn’t trust them and neither did the family or the rest of the all black law firm. They instantly judged George, got a ton of facts wrong and refused to acknowledge their sloppiness in this process:

        1.) The funeral directory – the NAACP hero Richard Kurtz

        He claimed there was no fight. This is because the lawyers didn’t care about Trayvon they cared about a lawsuit. You can’t sue without being on the offensive. They brought him on board to give answers to the press that focused on George “Proof he wasn’t in a fight. Proof he is lying”. It wasn’t about what Trayvon suffered from his ‘assault’.

        That was proven false

        2.) Trayvon Was Going To 711 During All Star Game Halftime

        He died before that all star game half time took place. Great research. That should be an offense worthy of a serious investigation but, alas, it won’t be. That’s because we are racist and he’s a victim. Or something.

        3.) Trayvon Wanted A Snack

        Chad, the age shifting brother, who is 14, then 12, then 8, told Tray to get him skittles. So a hungry 17 year old goes out in the rain, for no reason, .8 miles, and forgets HIS snack. Sure. Ok. That’s how 17 year olds are when they want a snack. Nice try. What gets a 17 year old to walk .8 miles in the rain? The 3 men who walk into the 711 after he does can give you that answer. There’s a reason the white kid, who has the money, is banging on the counter. He’s in a rush to give Tray what he paid for. Unless Tray stood out for 5 minutes, coincidentally, for no reason. Sure. Why not believe that? Just like Trayvon forgot his snack but only remembered Chad’s snack. Just like any other 17 year old boy would. Right.

        The video I keep posting shows that the cousin knew on Feb 28, early AM, Trayvon whooped George. He said so. The friends of Trayvon talk about a fight on 2/27. The girl we think is Deedee, when her twitter was open, said she received bad news and had to go. She then posts the RIP message for Tray. It was 2/27. But the reason I didn’t think she was deedee is because she’s not the girl in the photo with Tray and his G.F but, even if it’s not deedee, how do friends know about it the day after – while the story changes immediately after Crump comes on board? And which ‘brother’ spilled the beans on it being a fight? Nobody wants to talk about that.

        4.) Jasmin Rand

        The one white person hired by the non racist law firm told people his body was in a morgue for days IIRC. Sad reality is Tracy calls for his missing son on 2/27 and finds out later that day, as do Trayvon’s friends, that he’s dead. So how did they find out, family and friends that is, if his body is hiding in a kkk morgue for 3 days as the klansman high five each other and twirl their evil mustaches?

        Time to grow up. Seriously. View the video to see the tweets. pay attention to the dates and move on.

        So the day after he is shot they know it’s a fight. 3 weeks later he’s a 12 year old boy being chased. He’s scared for his life. But here’s the rub.

        Trayvon NEVER GAVE PERMISSION TO BE SEEN AS A SCARED BOY. That was what he wanted to never be seen as. It was decided by him – mostly by people who profiled who he was and changed it for public consumption – or by those who ‘care’ about his skin color – not him – and chose to believe what benefits them.

        Stay classy. No more bs, please.

      • Whats funny about this whole character traits comparison is that GZ was ACTUALLY A CHOIR BOY! and TM well.. I’m not sure, maybe we can glean something from his school records? :)

    • scubachick75 says:

      Abusing his meds?? If you knew anything about Adderall you’d know that it’s so tightly controlled in Florida that you have to see the doctor every month just to get the next months supply. There are no refills allowed. George’s Adderall was time released also. George didn’t sound angry when he called 911….he sounded afraid and as it turns out, he should have been afraid. Afterall he was dealing with an out of control thug who had “no limit”.

    • eastern2western says:

      hi, may I inform you that most psych meds do not turn a person homicidal. Actually, psych meds are design to calm a person or give them a feeling of euphoria. However, a lot of patients who stopped taking psych meds will tend to get very suicidal. If you are claiming zimm killed martin because of this meds, then zimm could probably claim temporary insanity to get him self aquited. my advice for you is stay with the script from the martin lawyers or you may end up aquitting zimmerman.

    • jello333 says:

      I don’t mean this as an insult, just an observation. But you and some of the others at the “I hate GZ” sites are not very smart, are you? You never base any of your arguments on facts or evidence. You’re just not very good at dealing with this case in a logical way. Have you even considered stopping for a second and asking yourself, “Self, am I making a fool of you?”

  7. John says:

    Fact Zimmerman saw Trayvon.
    Fact Zimmerman says Trayvon is up to know good, on something, checking him out.
    Fact Zimmerman followed Trayvon.
    Fact Trayvon was doing nothing except walking home getting rained on talking on phone getting followed by Zimmerman.
    Fact Trayvon indicates fear of person following him which is factually Zimmerman.
    Fact according to nZimmerman Trayvon “skipped away” , yes that is right all gang banging big badazz street thugs “skip” away right? Or din he using one of his football drio.ll techniques?
    Fact Zimmerman was in vehicle with loaded gun safe and sound.
    Fact Zimmerman got out of his car and admittedly followed the “skipping” MENACE ofu Trayvon.

    • mung says:

      What’s your point? None of that is against the law.

    • To be fair TM was not really a menace….
      Until he sucker punched GZ and beat his head against a concrete sidewalk that is..
      details details.. who need em?

    • eastern2western says:

      lets skip the part about trayvon hitting zimmerman. lets skip the part about the emts cleaning up zimmerman. lets skip all of the crime scene photos that were taking after the incident that show zimmerman with bruises and broken nose. lets pretend every photo is cgi, then the prosecution will have a great chance of winning.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      Good story, bro.

      Now, can you add the evidence that refutes Zimmerman’s claim of use of lethal force in self-defense?

      • “Fact Trayvon indicates fear of person following him which is factually Zimmerman.”

        No, it’s not a fact. It’s a witness by a girl whose story wasn’t consistent with Ben Crump. One of them said he had a hoody to hide from the rain and the other said it was to hide from George. But the cousin in my video never mentioned any hiding and he knew tray better than anybody. Pay attention. You can’t take a witness and claim ‘fact’ and then ignore the fact that:

        A.) Trayvon could have ran home

        B.) The witnesses all supported George before the pressure was put on them to change. The black teen would be killed if he went against ‘his people’ and that’s why Black Talk Media grabbed him for that awkward video to have him change his story and why his mother, who is pitching fitness tips or something like that, went on with Al Sharpton. She said the police ‘pressured him to give that story’

        The same police that brought in George days later to re-enact the story and come back days after *that* –> all after a 1+ hour lie detector test. Because they were so desperate to cover it up. Good grief.

        There is a fine line between being naive and disingenuous. The latter speaks volumes about one’s character. “Oh, poor Trayvon. Oh, wait, what did he look like? Oh that doesn’t matter. It’s wrong to judge people. The police and tea party and george are racist. Don’t judge people” – enough. Time to be an adult.

      • If I remember correctly, during the initial bond hearing the officer who signed off on the affidavit stated that they have ****no evidence**** on the records to refute the statements made by GZ.

    • raiikun says:

      Fact: George got out of the vehicle in direct response to being asked where Trayvon was running.
      Fact: When the dispatcher realized this, he advised George not to follow, and George said “Okay.”
      Fact: Evidence strongly indicates that George did not continue to follow, as the confrontation occurred where George already was before being advised not to follow.
      Fact: There is no evidence that George provoked the fight, or had any intention beyond wanting to assist police.
      Fact: George was on the ground, taking injury for the better part of a minute, with a witness seeing George trying and unable to get up, before George finally used the weapon as a last resort.
      Fact: There is zero chance of a conviction sticking. Especially in Florida. The evidence against him is too weak, and the legal precedent in his favor is too strong.

  8. Tuduri says:

    So La Raza decides ones race or ethnicity? Here’s the dirty little secret about them: They are a racist organization. They disdain Cubans, for instance, because most are conservative and anti-communist. They proclaim themselves a ” Super Race” and have contempt for others. One’s acceptability by La Raza depends on either their political affiliation or whether your circumstances, like GZ’s, are in line with their agenda. Since Tm has been adopted by President Obama as his would-be son, GZ cannot be one of them and does not merit their support.

    Cecilia wears no clothes, er, has no facts to support her arguments. Cecilia, while you may be saddened by Trayvon’s death, facts show that he attacked GZ and was shot in self-defense by GZ. He was no little kid as Crump and the media have tried to portray him. He was a street wise, bully, and drug abuser who thought he could beat up someone who dared to stare at him. I see these guys in my work every day. Staring at them in the wrong way is to disrespect them. Trayvon thought he could get away with beating or even kiling GZ with impunity. But you can’t deny GZ’s real injuries and the fact that Trayvon had no injuries other than a single close contact gunshot wound. You can’t deny the witnesses who saw Trayvon on top beating GZ or the fact that GZ was yelling for help for a prolonged period of time.

  9. “You can’t deny the witnesses who saw Trayvon on top beating GZ or the fact that GZ was yelling for help for a prolonged period of time.” You really can’t. Also the injuries.. those are undeniable as well.. and when the school records and PUBLIC SOCIAL NETWORK information comes out I think it will paint a clearer picture of what TM was or was not capable of.. Future MMA, Astronaut, Pharmicist, Jeweler, Handyman, Boxing referee, womens rights advocate, handyman, candy loving, aerospace engineer with a doctorate in cheerfulness?

  10. did I meantion handyman? :)

  11. eastern2western says:

    kind of ironic that la raza declares zimmerman as being too white when most of latino community is a mixture of either native american, european or african american. zimmerman’s mixture of white, african and native american is a norm in latin america which proves that he is a normal latino. The truth is there is truly very few percentage of indigenous population in latin america and the population is getting smaller and smaller. However, la raza is stupid enough to claim zimmerman as being too white. Then, those morons should check their family tree because most of them have european blood in them.

    • deadassassin says:

      You misunderstand. He isnt too WHITE,he is TOO white…..like on fresh prince of bel air when will makes fun of carlton and calls him white, for speaking correctly and caring about school and dressing respectfully. George is too white because he doesnt say the border crossed him, he isnt a citizen of the world, he isnt a people with no borders, he doesnt speak spanish as his primary language, he doesnt work the fields, he isnt a racist, he is friends with the gringo…see where Im going here?

      And yeah thats great for gz to be disowned by the racist hate group that promotes aztlan, reconquista, the overthrow of the us government.
      (see tucson school district “ethnic studies” story, especially this video)

  12. John says:

    Undisputable Fact Zimmerman Shot and Killed Trayvon!

    Let me ask a question what would you do if you were being followed by someone?
    Innately you have two choices Fight or Flight!
    that’s it
    when i come for one of you, What are you going to do?
    Trayvon already tried Flight
    Zimmerman made the other choice for him when he exited his vehicle.
    And no calling 911 is not an option
    so my guess yous will run but if i by chance corner you you are going to fight and I have every right to end your life
    so it looks as though you have only one choice now
    what is it ?

    • I was once approached by a mugger while walking through a city park. I’m turned the opposite way and walked quicky (not run) but walked, keeping a min distance between myself and the mugger. If he got closer I would walk faster and always in the direction of a public crowd. There is not excuse for throwing punches provoked or unprovoked, unless you are struck first.. A police officer will tell you the same thing, if two people get into a bar brawl the guy without injuries is going to jail.

    • boricuafudd says:

      John, there lies your whole fallacy, if your are paranoid or hopped on drugs, “fight or flight”, may be your only options. In fact TM had many options, keep walking to his house, knock on someone door, simply ignore the person watching him. Those are just 3 simple options that TM could have utilized, yet the one he picked was supposedly approach someone who as you say he was afraid of, and confront them. Non sequitur.

      You guys want to portray TM as not having any choices, as if he was trapped in a locked room or something to that effect, where the “fight or flight” instinct would kick in, but he wasn’t, he was never cornered and according Dee Dee, he approached and confronted GZ.

      • boriqua, its a lot simpler than that. If TM really felt threatened all he had to do was walk the other way.. Or since he already had a cellphone in his ear call 911. people are making this so much more complicated than it is.. (J4TM) :/

      • msfaye123 says:

        It is not unusual for a person to park on the side of a street and make or take a phone call, so what made Trayvon think that whatever George was doing that it had something to do with him. Just walk by the man in the car smile and go about your merry way, the unprovoked running why?

        • boricuafudd says:

          Exactly, but that is a point missed by the Trayvonites. GZ could have had finished his call and could have been on his way home, no need for a confrontation. Except, that to TM his actions were interpreted in a negative (criminal) way. We know now that GZ was not going home, and was in fact trying to keep TM in sight, but TM could not, he just assume it to be so.

        • Rachael says:

          Soo now it is not ok to run (or skip) ? Gz was no cop!!! Sure, never run from a cop, but who the hel does he think he is if someone runs he should go after him. He is not the most hated man in the word, but he sure is the stupidest!

    • JW says:

      It would be stupid to attack someone following me if I had the chance to get away and didn’t.

      • John says:

        Exactly that is my point, why attack GZ when he could get away!
        GZ’s injuries were not life threatning as he indicated and the Dee Dee phone call does indicate fear on Trayvon’s part!
        GZ also states while on the phone with dispatch that he did not want to give out his address in case Trayvon could hear him.
        So why would Trayvon lead GZ to his own home?
        And you take GZ’s version of events as truth.
        GZ is not a credible witness and if he was of a different tone you would discount his story as you do Dee Dee’s.
        Admit your truth’s and you will see the light

        • JW says:

          Same ol’ nonsense from Trayvonites…..Trayvon could have gotten away but he returned to confront George. It is plain and simple as that. You are talking myths and fairy tales.

        • boricuafudd says:

          John, I appreciate you calling racist, though in a sneaky way, but it is you who can’t see. When GZ said he did not want to give his address in case TM could hear him, he said something else, he I don’t know where this is at, then he talked about the address. Now follow me here, that means that GZ lost sight of TM. If he could not see TM, then how would he be leading him home? Even, if let’s say GZ was in hot pursuit of TM, what difference would it make if GZ saw where TM was staying, unless he had something to hide there?

          You see it is you who if you were of a different tone would see, how illogical your thinking is. This is why you guys get hanged up on the weirdest theories, but always end saying GZ is lier, lier and he’s guilty.

          • Rachael says:

            What? You want some crazy lunaticwho is chasing you to know where you are staying? Yeah he had eomething to hide – where he lived. Believe me, if you were a chick you would understand. Really if you were a reasonable person with minimal critical thinking skils you might too but well…

            • howie says:

              This might be true if another drug deal was going down at Brandy’s house. You do realize her sister was a large scale dealer. Tm might have been sent out to keep the Police away from the scam. Of course that might be considered a Hate Fact to you.

            • Chip Bennett says:

              Again with the ad hominem. That might play over at JQ, but it doesn’t play here.

              What? You want some crazy lunaticwho is chasing you to know where you are staying? Yeah he had eomething to hide – where he lived.

              According to star witness Dee Dee, Martin refused to run because he was right by his father’s house. He had lost Zimmerman. All he had to do was go inside, and he would have seen the tip-off of the all-important NBA All-Star game.

              But Martin chose not to do so. Instead, Martin chose to return to Zimmerman, so that he could verbally accost and physically assault Zimmerman.

            • boricuafudd says:

              Rachael, what chase? It seems like you guys have no concept of time and distances. Please look at your own videos, the location of GZ when TM first came up to GZ’s truck and where GZ parked to go to the T.

              There was never any CHASE!

              Even some of guys out there have realized this, that is why some have said that GZ had passed TM, while TM was at the mailboxes. Stop with this fantasy, look at the evidence the distances, the timing, you will see that there was no chase, that GZ had lost TM, so he did not have to be concerned with being watched going home.

              I’m am sorry that you as a chick are in constant fear of being chased, that sounds like a personable problem, I can’t help you with your paranoia. As for critical thinking, I will say this, the key word is Thinking, not fantasizing, critically.

            • ftsk420 says:

              I would rather call them women not chicks. So TM didn’t go home because of the crazy white guy? Zimmerman didn’t give out his address because he didn’t know where the thug went. Either way you wanna spin it TM attacked GZ then continued to escalate the attack by pounding him into the concrete. Doesn’t matter how it started there is no evidence GZ broke any laws. I will stand up and say there really is no evidence TM did either until he attacked GZ.

        • Chip Bennett says:

          Exactly that is my point, why attack GZ when he could get away!

          According to the testimony of both Dee Dee and Zimmerman, Martin did “get away” from Zimmerman. Zimmerman states that he “lost” Martin. Dee Dee claims that Martin indicated that he was right by his father’s house, and that he was not going to run.

          GZ’s injuries were not life threatning as he indicated…

          Irrelevant. The legal standard for justifiable use of lethal force is (at least) two-fold:

          1) to prevent the commission of a felony (Martin was committing felony aggravated battery against Zimmerman)
          2) reasonable fear of imminent death or bodily injury (repeatedly banging your victim’s head into the ground constitutes such reasonable fear; a minimum of 40 seconds of sustained screaming for help constitutes such reasonable fear)

          …and the Dee Dee phone call does indicate fear on Trayvon’s part!

          Dee Dee’s testimony here is contradictory. She claims that Martin said he was afraid, but she also claims that Martin said that he would not run. Also, Dee Dee testifies that Martin verbally accosted Zimmerman, which further refutes the claim that Martin was afraid.

          GZ also states while on the phone with dispatch that he did not want to give out his address in case Trayvon could hear him.

          Zimmerman also states that he holds that fear because he has lost visual contact with Martin, and doesn’t know where he might be. Such a statement is consistent with Zimmerman’s own fear of Martin, who had previously approached and circled Zimmerman’s truck menacingly, before taking off.

          So why would Trayvon lead GZ to his own home?

          Martin had already reached his own home. All he had to do was go in the door.

          And you take GZ’s version of events as truth.

          Zimmerman is afforded the presumption of innocence. And absent any materially contradictory evidence, Zimmerman’s testimony is valid.

          GZ is not a credible witness…

          You keep asserting that, but you have not proven it.

          …and if he was of a different tone you would discount his story as you do Dee Dee’s.

          …when all else fails, play the race card?

          Admit your truth’s and you will see the light

          Physician, heal thyself.

          • Also.. The severity of GZ’s injuries is not the issue, but whether in fact he had them and if they were inflicted by TM. There is no threshold of damage to your body before the law of self defense kicks in.

        • ftsk420 says:

          Wake up and smell the coffee. TM is the one who attacked Zimmerman TM initiated the confrontation Dee Dee even confirms. TM was no where to be found for 2 minutes but never made it home. Now if your following me and I turn around and knock you out I just committed assault. You go down I jump on top and pound away now I committing attempted murder.

        • myopiafree says:

          There is no indication that DeDe is telling the truth.

        • msfaye123 says:

          “the Dee Dee phone call does indicate fear on Trayvon’s part!” Are you speaking of the little piece of $#% t that claimed that she listened to Trayvon who feared for his life, who ran and ran until he was out of breathe, and finally she heard someone pushed Trayvon, and then she turns her lights off, takes her butt to bed and says absolutely nothing to anyone about anything that she was an earwitness to who refused to cooperate with the police until Crump offers a new car for her coached narrative.

          Please don’t speak of DeeDee as if she has any credibility because she has none. As a mother and grandmother I can’t imagine my child/grandchild having a friend like DeeDee. With a friend like DeeDee who would needs an enemy.

      • wasnotme says:

        Not really any more stupid than getting out of your car and pursuing someone who looked like they were on drugs, checking you out with their hand in their waistband.

        Oh wait, I know you guys don’t like that p-word.

        Not really any more stupid than exiting your vehicle when there is someone out there, looking suspicious, looking like they are on drugs, checking you out with their hand in their waistband.

        • Chip Bennett says:

          Not really any more stupid than getting out of your car and pursuing someone who looked like they were on drugs, checking you out with their hand in their waistband.

          Let’s assume, for the sake of argument, that Zimmerman exhibited stupidity in his actions that night.

          Stupidity isn’t illegal, and does not deny Zimmerman his right to claim justifiable use of lethal force in self-defense.

          • Rachael says:

            Stupidity is illegal when it results in the death of another human being. *IF* Trayvon did anything to GZ (which you sure can’t see from his supposed injuries), it was because HE was the one defending himself from a lunatic who had already made it clear these azzles always get away and he was going to make sure this one didn’t.

            • howie says:

              Shooting the little monster was prudent and reasonable under the circumstance.

            • Chip Bennett says:

              Stupidity is illegal when it results in the death of another human being.

              That statement cannot be supported by relevant Florida statutes, and is inherently asinine. A young woman walking alone at night wearing skimpy clothing might be acting stupidly, but it doesn’t make her legally responsible if she shoots and kills a would-be rapist in self-defense.

              Nevertheless, where is your evidence that Zimmerman’s alleged stupidity “result[ed] in the death of another human being.”

              *IF* Trayvon did anything to GZ (which you sure can’t see from his supposed injuries)…

              One more time: the severity of injury is utterly irrelevant with respect to Florida statutes defining justifiable use of lethal force in self-defense. Also, your interpretation of sustained injuries is either woefully ignorant, or willfully obstinate. Zimmerman sustained a broken nose, as well as lacerations to the back of his head, and swelling, bleeding, and bruising to the face and head.

              …it was because HE was the one defending himself from a lunatic who had already made it clear these azzles always get away and he was going to make sure this one didn’t.

              Where is your evidence that Zimmerman initiated any verbal or physical contact with Martin? Where is your evidence that Zimmerman did anything contrary to what he testified? (PROTIP: the State, on record in court, has testified under oath that it has no such evidence. You might want to tread lightly here, lest you play the fool.)

            • Sha says:

              Rachael: Stupidity is illegal when TM of his own free will decided to commit felony aggravated battery on GZ. Stupidity is when a young man would rather beat the crap out of someone instead of go to were he was staying. Stupidity is jumping on someone with a gun. Stupidity is leaving a troubled young man unsupervised. Stupidity is not getting off of someone you are beating when there is someone telling you they are calling the police .etc. etc. etc. I don’t take away from the fact a young man lost his life that is always a tragedy no matter what the circumstances are. But it’s time that someone took responsibility for TM’s part in this tragedy.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      Undisputable Fact Zimmerman Shot and Killed Trayvon!

      Yes. All agree that a homicide was committed that night. The question remaining to be proven in court is whether that homicide was legally justified.

      Let me ask a question what would you do if you were being followed by someone?
      …Trayvon already tried Flight

      According to the testimony of both Zimmerman and Dee Dee, Martin was successful in that flight. Zimmerman, as per his NEN call, lost contact with Martin. Martin, as per Dee Dee’s testimony, reached the proximity of his father’s house.

      All Martin had to do was go in the door.

      It was Martin who willfully chose to return to, and to confront, Zimmerman. (Note: at this point, Martin loses any claim of acting in self-defense. Thus, his assault and battery of Zimmerman was both fully illegal, and fully justified Zimmerman’s use of lethal force in self-defense against that assault and battery.)

      Zimmerman made the other choice for him when he exited his vehicle.

      This assertion is not factually correct. Zimmerman exited his vehicle to attempt to maintain visual contact with Martin, but after leaving his vehicle, (a) Zimmerman complies with the NEN operator’s statement that “we don’t need you to [follow him]” (Zimmerman replied, “okay” and ceased attempting to follow), and (b) Zimmerman lost visual contact with Martin.

      so my guess yous will run but if i by chance corner you you are going to fight and I have every right to end your life

      Please present evidence that Zimmerman “cornered” Martin.

      Further, mere “cornering” does not statutorily justify the felony aggravated battery that Martin committed against Zimmerman.

      Bottom line: the evidence of the case stop at Zimmerman following Martin as far as the area of the sidewalk that formed the “T”, and at Martin running back to his father’s house, and losing Zimmerman.

      The State has yet to present any evidence that Zimmerman:

      a) followed or attempted to follow Martin either beyond the location of the “T” sidewalk, or against the admonition of the NEN operator
      b) demonstrated any aggression, including brandishing his weapon
      c) verbally confronted Martin
      d) physically assaulted Martin
      e) in any way instigated the confrontation, much less did so in a way that legally justified the felony aggravated battery Martin committed against Zimmerman

      This is the hurdle that the State and the Martin supporters must overcome. Otherwise, the preponderance of all empirical evidence and witness testimony demonstrate that Zimmerman’s use of lethal force was legally justified as an act of self-defense.

      • You forgot one thing.. According to DD, she said “Run”, TM’s response was “NO”

        • John says:

          Exactly !
          Where was he going to run to?
          Zimmerman was hot on his trail on foot

          • Chip Bennett says:

            Zimmerman was hot on his trail on foot

            The State has evidence to support such an assertion, especially when such an assertion contradicts the testimony of both Zimmerman AND the State’s star witness, Dee Dee?

          • ftsk420 says:

            He could have ran home he was right there. Zimmerman clearly says he doesn’t know where he is. 2:26 into the NEN call TM runs 3:40 into that same call Zimmerman says he doesn’t know where he is which is why he doesn’t want to give his address. That amount of time TM could have been home drinking his watermelon and eating his skittles but no he chose to act like a thug and wait for Zimmerman then commit assault.

          • myopiafree says:

            Hi John, Sport Expert TM has already made it to Brandi’s – if he was scared shitless. He was WAY AHEAD of GZ, who was at the top of the “T” – checking addresses. Even DeDe confirmed that all TM had to do was to open the door AND WALK IN – and then shut the door. End of story.

          • msfaye123 says:

            Trayvon was seem running south toward Brandi Green’s house, running there would have suffice. But let’s count the number of places that Trayvon could have ran and used his phone in order to call for help since he was in such fear.
            From the top of th T toward the back of the community there were exactly four unpaved cut throughs were Trayvon could have hid that had bushes where he could have concealed himself from the sight of George.
            From the top of the T Trayvon could have ran south to the back entrance, Trayvon could have ran west toward the pool and clubhouse and out the front gate. Trayvon could have ran East toward Retreat Circle and jumped the fence. There are so many hiding possiblities in that community Trayvon could have hid and they would still be looking for him today.

            There was never a reason for Trayvon to run, all he had to do was walk down the sidewalk toward Brandi Green’s townhouse, George following once reaching the door go inside close it it and prepare to watch the All-Star game. That’s all folks!

          • jello333 says:

            My God. You haven’t even listened to the NEN call, have you? You haven’t bothered to look at the map of the neighborhood, have you? Mmm mmm mmm….

    • scubachick75 says:

      Why is calling 911 not an option? Trayvon had the option. Is it because Trayvon didn’t feel threatened by George so he calls his “girlfriend” instead….the girlfriend who can barely put a coherent sentence together and who doesn’t even bother to tell anyone that she hasn’t heard from him since he told her he was being profiled and pursued from some crazy white guy? Even after she “heard” him hit the grass!! Don’t play stupid, Trayvon had several choices. He just chose the wrong one.

      • “the girlfriend who can barely put a coherent sentence together ” I feel like this speaks VOLUMES about the credibility of DD.. or maybe I’m taking crazy pills?

      • ftsk420 says:

        Easy it wouldn’t be gangsta if TM called 911 no way he goes back to his hood labeled a pussy. Funny part is he had no ID on him no way to prove he belonged in that part of town cops were coming to get him and if they showed up while he was alive TM would have got a free ride in a cop car or possibly shot by police. They were coming to check out a suspicious black male with something in his waist band

    • msfaye123 says:

      “Trayvon already tried Flight”. Trayvon was seen running toward the back entrance @ 7:11:42 in other words he was at the T and turned right ran down the sidewalk that lead to Brandi Green’s house right?
      Based on this fact what explanation would there be for Trayvon to be on that sidewalk that ran beside witness 11 house the one that is called the top of the T at the time she first heard sounds of the argument if in fact Trayvon had already tried Flight? You are right based on what George and DeeDee said and the evidence shows Trayvon did flight only to prepare himself for fight.

    • strat4evr says:

      “Trayvon already tried flight” Flight that could have ended with his entering home but TRAYVON made the choice to return and confront. Instead of safety of home he confronted and paid the ultimate price. His own stupidity ended his life. Self Defense.

  13. John says:

    how did you know he was a mugger?
    Dressed like one?
    and my guess he was not white
    predictable response
    you people don’t know the street

    • eastern2western says:

      please john, can you please how did a 205 lb, 28 year old short zimmerman managed to run up to martin captured him and still did not cause any injuries? since you know so many facts of the case, can you please enlighten us about how did zimmerman managed to hunt down martin at his weight, shape and still was able to talk on the phone? please john explain this key part of this case.

      • John says:

        that can Not be explained as GZ’s timeline does not match up with his story line

        • forget the timeline.. Look at the INJURIES.

          • John says:

            the only injury GZ had was to his pride of “those aholes always get away”
            not this time with Gun packing Zimmerman on the case

            • eastern2western says:

              if you can not even explain about how did zimmerman managed to capture martin, then you have no case buddy. the whole case depends on zimmerman having the physical ability to out run martin. However, you do not even know how did zimmerman managed to even keep up a running pace with martin, then why are you even so sure that zimmerman was even the initial aggressor?

            • um, no.. GZ had two black eyes a broken nose and cuts on the back of the head.. perhaps you may not have seen the photos but for the sake of non participants reading the site I will respond If i can

              • raiikun says:

                And George’s head was swollen so badly that Singleton actually asked him if that was the normal shape of his head, then pointed out how much the swelling had gone down the following day.

            • Chip Bennett says:

              the only injury GZ had was to his pride…

              The EMTs sure had to clean up a lot of blood from Zimmerman’s “pride”. Also, Zimmerman’s pride sure endured a lot of swelling, bruising, and lacerations. (I didn’t know that injured pride presented as a broken nose, either.)

              • I never knew injured pride could produce so much blood!

              • bamabelle says:

                Please re-read the EMT report. It states minor bleeding. Also, it seems that even O’Mara accepts that George’s head injury may not have occured how George said it did because he is now only putting emphasis on his nose injury. And, the medical report from the family clinic said stitches were not required because of no jagged edges. Now, tell me how a head bashing on concrete results in no jagged edges?

                • Chip Bennett says:

                  Please re-read the EMT report. It states minor bleeding.

                  Again: I didn’t know one’s pride was capable of bleeding at all. Nevertheless: the injury did bleed, and Florida self-defense statutes do not depend on the severity of an injury, but rather either the commission of a felony or else the reasonable belief in imminent death or bodily harm. Repeated pounding of the head into anything meets both standards.

                  Also, it seems that even O’Mara accepts that George’s head injury may not have occured how George said it did because he is now only putting emphasis on his nose injury.

                  Or, an alternate theory: the broken nose is prima facie evidence of felony aggravated battery, which alone justifies Zimmerman’s use of lethal force in self-defense.

                  And, the medical report from the family clinic said stitches were not required because of no jagged edges.

                  Where is that medical report? I don’t have a copy, and would like to read it for myself. From what I understand, the clinic declined to suture because that would have needed to be done much sooner. Also, since when do sutures require “jagged edges”? In fact, generally speaking, smooth edges are preferred for sutures. (Note: link also confirms the practice of not suturing wounds that are older than 6-14 hours, which would apply in Zimmerman’s case.)

                  Now, tell me how a head bashing on concrete results in no jagged edges?

                  Why would blunt-force trauma, such as a head being pounded against concrete, result in jagged versus smooth edges to a wound? Further: why is the type of wound relevant?

                  • jello333 says:

                    Hey Chip, if you haven’t seen it yet, please check out my reply to that same comment and tell me what you think.

                  • Chip Bennett says:

                    Jello: I already read and replied. Well-stated!

                    Our friends keep conveniently forgetting, or disregarding, that as per Florida statute, the severity of sustained injuries isn’t germane, but rather the response of a reasonable person to the circumstances that resulted in those injuries.

                    That is a hurdle that the State simply has absolutely no evidence to overcome.

                  • jello333 says:

                    Thanks Chip. Yeah, eventually they’ll come to realize that even if the injuries WEREN’T severe (which I won’t concede to) that George still has a solid defense. And at that point they’ll have to come up with something else. Speaking of which… I’m not sure I should help them out, but I’m feeling generous tonight. So if any JQ people are still here, I think this is probably what really happened that night:

                    Trayvon saw how tired and thirsty George was from all the chasing, and so he met him at the “T”, with the intent to offer him a drink of his watermelon juice. But when he went to pull it from his pocket, the bag it was still in snagged on the zipper of his jacket, then suddenly tore loose, causing the can to sorta fly out like from a sling-shot. Got poor George right in the nose! Then, as we’ve described, George staggered around awhile before falling. He hit the back of his head on the sidewalk, and became delusional, thrashing around violently. So Trayvon, realizing George was gonna seriously hurt himself if he didn’t stop, got on top of him trying to prevent further injury. George kept trying to sit up, but not knowing whether he had injured his neck or not, Trayvon correctly tried to convince him to stay down. Sadly, despite all the good Trayvon was trying to do, in George’s confused state he didn’t understand, and finally pulled out his gun, and…. well…

                • jello333 says:

                  Ok, let’s try a scenario that fits more closely with “the injuries weren’t that bad” theme most GZ-haters ascribe to:

                  After surprising and verbally confronting George in the dark, Trayvon suddenly punches him in the nose. George’s vision goes black for a few seconds, followed by “seeing stars”. Dizzy and disoriented, he stumbles along as he tries to get away from Trayvon. But eventually he falls or is pushed down, and Trayvon gets on top of him. George’s head is on the edge of the sidewalk, and every time he tries to sit up, Trayvon pushes him back down. NOT “slamming his head into the sidewalk” for the sake of doing that, but rather in an attempt to push George back down so he can continue the assault. Even when he is simply trying to hold his hand over George’s nose (probably to shut him up rather than “suffocate” him), those actions AGAIN have the effect of pushing George’s head into the sidewalk… maybe from only an inch or so above, but hitting it nonetheless. Eventually George gets his head off the sidewalk, and maybe there are a few more pushes of the head into the ground (no longer the sidewalk).

                  Alright, so if it happened that way, chances are there wouldn’t be MASSIVE damage; maybe more like what we actually see with George’s injuries…. ok? But why would George lie, and say he was bashed harder, and more than appears to be the case? He wouldn’t. He’s not lying. What MAY be going on is because of the bashing he DID sustain, it SEEMED to him it was much more severe. After the initial hit to the nose and hit to the back of the head, any relatively minor bump probably felt like a massive hit, and any additional hit COULD HAVE been massive for all he knew… COULD have been fatal.

                  So let’s say, for the sake of argument, that you’re right: George’s injuries were relatively minor, and the head slams weren’t as numerous as he thought. And part of the time Trayvon was just trying to push him back down, NOT necessarily to bash his head. And the attempts at “suffocating” were really just Trayvon trying to muffle the screams. Do you like this scenario better? Fine… you know what? IT DOES NOT CHANGE ONE THING! What is important is what George BELIEVED and FELT was happening to him, or was about to happen. If what was going on in his mind at the time was REASONABLE, then that’s it…. it’s over… clear-cut case of self-defense. And remember, I’ve given you the benefit of the doubt re. the injuries and Trayvon’s intent… the truth is likely much harsher.

            • John,

              You do realize that the prosecution can not try someone based on so called inconsistencies. The prosecution is going to have to put together an airtight timeline of how it went down, including GZ starting the physical confrontation. I’ll give you a hint – they are not going to be able to do it.

              You can’t convict someone of getting out of their car, you can’t convict someone of observing a stranger in their neighborhood, and you cant convict someone of murder, when it is clear they are being assulted.

              If GZ was being assulted, its case closed.

        • Chip Bennett says:

          And where is the State’s evidence of an alternate timeline?

    • Because as he approached me he kept repeating “Aye yo, gimme yo shit”, the guy was stumbling drunk and his clothes were tattered.. didn’t really give me the impression of an investment banker. :/

      • John says:

        so you were inherently afraid of a stumbling drunk repeating himself

        • Who was demanding that I give him “my shit.” TBH I was nervous the guy had a knife or something.. Why would I let someone like that approach me? The mans intent was clearly to rob me.. Or maybe striking up a conversation with a menacing drunk demanding that I turn over “my shit” is something you engage in frequently? I dunno, different strokes for different folks I guess..

          • John says:

            so you moved away
            what would you have done had he kept following you
            you are already fearful

            • Once I crossed the street and was out of the park and on the crowded sidewalk the guy turned and disappeared into the darkness. Mission accomplished.

              • John says:

                right he let you get away
                but GZ was on a mission to NOT let this Ahole get away!
                not this time
                hero Georgie to the neighborhood rescue

                • mung says:

                  He must have been a super hero to catch up with Trayvon who had a huge lead on him. But you don’t want to address that part of your theory do you?

                  • ftsk420 says:

                    Nobody does nobody wants to talk about the fact that there is no way in hell Zimmerman would have caught him. If they had a foot race all my money would be on TM.

                • msfaye123 says:

                  I think that this Ahole had gotten away until this Ahole decided to go back and confront.
                  Could you please give a logical explanation of why Trayvon was on the sidewalk that lead from Twin Trees to Retreat Circle when he was seen running south of that location almost 4 minutes earlier?

                  According to DeeDee Trayvon was right by his dad’s house but he is killed right by George’s Truck.

            • John: don’t get me wrong I’m not threatening anybody. In the same situation as “factsobserver”; I’d have stopped, turned to face the aggressor while scanning for accomplices & determine if he had a weapon in either hand. I can take care of myself but if he had accomplices & a weapon, then he’d better have good health insurance. Due to the additional clothing perps usually wear this time of year, I switch from 9mm, to carrying .40 S&W ballistic tip ammo. AKA Zombie Max ammo

              • ftsk420 says:

                I don’t carry a gun although I do have one in my house. A gun is no guarantee that I can tell you. If I can get close enough to you I can and will disarm you and probably shoot you with your own gun or beat you with it. If I did carry it would be at least a .40cal 9mm don’t always have the stopping power you need.

                • Statistically speaking; Once an attacker closes to within 21′ of their intended victim, the odds are in the attackers favor. Sorry but if an aggressive perp is yelling at me “yo give me your stuff” or displaying a weapon, I’m going to fire before he’s close enough to incapacitate me with that weapon. On a side note; Federal 9mm HST, 147g JHP @ 1,150/fps will drop a perp in his tracks just as quickly as my favorite 10mm 165g JHP. Shot placement is critical to any caliber bullet effectively delivering it’s energy to vital organs or the central nervous system. Just remember to always aim center mass heart lungs & hope your bullet also shatters the spine or lodges against it. Just for fun, check out Lance Thomas on Justice Files.

            • jello333 says:

              We’ve already admitted that George was hunting down Trayvon in order to get those delicious Skittles. What more do you want from us?

        • ftsk420 says:

          So the way you see it anyone following you it’s ok for you to attack. If it happens to be a cop and you attack your gonna get shot. You claim to know the streets but it’s obvious you don’t.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      Do you have anything other than the race card to play here?

    • ftsk420 says:

      What people don’t know the street? I suggest you re think that post. Trust me I know the streets very well but I don’t think you do.

    • myopiafree says:

      Hi John, What you mean, ‘You People:”??

    • James F says:

      “you people don’t know the street”
      Well maybe we should try to find the name of the street then…no, wait…that is justifiable grounds for some street thug to commit a violent assault on us were we are precluded from defending ourself…right?

  14. Who let the Trayvon supporters on here? They are so slow..

    • I think its a good thing.. Many many people are unclear on the FACTS (thank crump and parks for that) Most of their arguments are easily countered, hopefully by coming here they can become better informed on the realities surrounding this.

    • myopiafree says:

      Hi “Only Want Truth” – This is indeed an ‘Open Forum”. Their attempts to smear George Zimmerman simply proves that they are not the sharpest knife in the drawer. We are still waiting for proof that the Heart Cell was “working” – and hitting the Tower “Ping Logs”.

  15. John says:

    that is all the game yous have here insults and disparagement

    • boricuafudd says:

      John, that is your other problem, your are thinking like a criminal, which is why TM instead of exercising his other choices, confronted GZ, punched him and would have continued, but for GZ having a weapon.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      that is all the game yous have here insults and disparagement

      *glances up at all of cecelia’s posts in this comments thread*



    • um, No. You just described 90% of the J4TM people

    • JW says:

      Cry foul because you are losing a debate? tsk,tsk,tsk….

    • Whoa John! Very few insults have been cast in your direction. Looks as though several questions have been asked of you but you side-step the issues & deflect the questions with additional questions & insults of your own. I was sincere when I invited you to present the facts of which you suggest prove George Zimmerman is guilty of second degree murder. I wasn’t baiting you in hope of belittling you but rather offering to examine your perception of the facts & engage in a rational debate. Seriously; This is one of the better informed online communities where all are welcomed provided they play nicely. Though several have challenged your opinions, very few have returned your insults, this community is primarily comprised of adults willing to engage supporters as well as opposition in rational, logical conversation. Come on take a chance, present your case using facts & let’s leave the insults at the door.

  16. John says:

    i’m like Charlie Sheen baby “Winning”

  17. John says:

    right on brother he was a spectacle
    but gave you insight into a world you will never know
    just like you will never know Trayvon’s world
    just because a kid smokes weed does not make him a drug abuser
    and guess what
    weed does not make you aggressive so find a new angle
    now change the drug of choice to crack and i will give you the possibility of attack and violence.

    • Consider this John.. A 17 year old young man, from an unstable family, with problems at school, with substance issues, on the eve of his most stringent disciplinary action at schoo; (10 day suspension-drug related), being ratted on by an unfamiliar adult.. Is it possible a young man under these conditions could lash out?

    • partyof0 says:

      If you havn’t had it and you are use to it…you’re probably quite a bit more edgy

    • boricuafudd says:

      Wrong again, first off the instinct of fight or flight only apply in situations of high stress and the are no choices, TM’s situation was never that, since he had many options and as you have said he was not scared, so their is no fight of flight situation.

      Weed does not usually make you aggressive, but it can and has, remember the Miami cannibal, that everyone thought was on salts, it turns out, all he had done is smoke weed.
      What people don’t know is that chemicals are added by drug dealers, to heightened the high, because of the low level of THC.

    • eastern2western says:

      This is so typical of the martin camp. They love to give out a lot of facts that prove nothing, but they run when ever they are confronted with a technical question. Hey juanito, how did zimmerman managed to out run and capture martin without causing any injuries on his body when martin was the one who clearly had the one minute start? This question is not some thing that could be avoided in a trial because the affidaivit assures everyone that zimmerman was the one who managed to pursue and confronted martin. If there is no pursue from zimmerman, then we can assume that the confrontation was not even stared by him, but was actually from martin.

      • *raises hand* GZ didn’t outrun TM.. TM sucker punched GZ, straddled him and delivered MMA style blows.. (corroborated by documented witness statements..ie: its on paper) :)

        • eastern2western says:

          if the prosecution can not even prove the “pursue” part of the accusation, how are they going to even prove george was the initial aggressor?

        • wasnotme says:

          What physical evidence though corroborates MMA-style blows – what was it, 14-25 GZ said? And there are other witness reports that say wrestling, hearing nothing that sounded like blows to the face, etc. But look at his face man. Do you really think your face would look like that after undergoing such a pummelling?

          • Chip Bennett says:

            What physical evidence though corroborates MMA-style blows…?

            The lacerations, bleeding, swelling, and contusions on Zimmerman’s face are consistent with an assault, independent of the method of assault used.

            Eye-witness accounts indicate that Martin was beating Zimmerman “MMA-style”.

          • ftsk420 says:

            Yeah it would guess you never been in a fight have you. Either way TM had the chance to flee the moment he broke Zimmerman nose but he chose to mount him and pound away. Like it or not it’s a crime TM had blind rage and it cost him.

          • MMA style blows were the exact words used by a documented (that means its on paper) eye (not ear) witness .. pesky details sure get in the way of a good story :)

          • eastern2western says:

            dude, it is mma style which means it is not exactly mma. sure, the witness said martin was on top swinging in a mma style, but the injuries do not match a mma style beating. However, the truth is a beating did happened because there were emts, eyewitnesses, cops and medical personnesl all saw zimmerman’s injuries afterwards. His injuries may not be life threatening, but that does not take away his right of self defense. even the martin camp admitted trayvon was on top of zimmerman hitting him for self defense, but these wacky chair detectives are coming up with different scenarios that are based on video games and pillows. wake the f up man, a prosecution can not convict zimmerman completely based on his inconsistencies. It is possible that zimmerman will go to trial, but a reasonable jury will not convict him (paraphrased from allen dershowitz).

          • Nettles18 says:

            W6 gave a statement to Lead Detective Serino 90 minutes after the shooting. At approx. 9:05pm and he’ll have a time with the jurist to explain how he watered his statement down upon hearing the media furor. (Page 38). http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/sections/news/Zimmerman_Discovery.pdf

    • Chip Bennett says:

      I don’t care about the mitigating circumstances of the lives of either Zimmerman or Martin. What I care about is the known empirical evidence and eye-witness testimony of Martin committing a felony aggravated battery against Zimmerman that fully justified Zimmerman’s use of lethal force in self-defense, and the lack of any evidence thus-far presented by the State that would counter that self-defense claim.

      Zimmerman getting out of his car does not deny him a right to self-defense.
      Zimmerman carrying a concealed firearm does not deny him a right to self-defense.
      Zimmerman merely following Martin does not deny him a right to self-defense.

      Even if the State could prove that it was Zimmerman who verbally accosted Martin, such verbal accost would not deny Zimmerman a right to self-defense.

      In short, the State cannot prove any action on Zimmerman’s part that would justify the felony aggravated battery that Martin committed against Zimmerman; thus, the State cannot prove that Zimmerman did not have the right to use lethal force in self-defense.

      • “the known empirical evidence and eye-witness testimony of Martin committing a felony aggravated battery against Zimmerman that fully justified Zimmerman’s use of lethal force in self-defense” I think this alone would lead a jury to acquit GZ.

    • partyof0 says:

      Once again…if you havn’t had weed in awhile and you are use to the pleasant relaxed feeling it gives you…you get paranoid…that’s what happened to TM…and GZ was his result…there is your new angle…give me more.

      • Not to mention GZ was ratting on TM. No one likes a tattle tale :)

        • wasnotme says:

          Was he ratting on TM? TM knew that? All he knew is some crazyassed old guy was watching him, calling on his phone about him, then got out of his car and started walking in the same direction as him. I don’t smoke pot and I would find that to be a weird and aggressive move. Would scare the crapolla out of me.

          • ftsk420 says:

            TM knew he was on the phone which is why I think TM ran in the first place. Stay out of my hood because if I see a suspicious person looking into houses I’m gonna see what he’s up to.

          • I propose a new civil rights movement and amendments to the constitution that prohibit citizens from engaging in “crazyassed-old-guy’ness” as well as walking in the direction of other citizens. check change.org for updates and please donate accordingly. :P

          • jello333 says:

            “old guy” Huh? Who are we talking about here? George is 28, and he looks even younger…. but of course you know that. Oh well…

            “got out of his car and started walking…” And Trayvon knew that as it happened? That he had gotten out of the car? Not if he had already turned right at the top of the “T”. And even Dee Dee knew better than to claim what you claim. When asked about it, she could only say, “You want that too?”

    • ftsk420 says:

      So your claiming to know how the streets work? your claiming to know TM world? hoa about the synthetic marijuana would you agree that can make you violent and possibly make you attack someone. I will agree with you about the weed but your so wet behind the ears about the streets it’s fucking funny.

    • scubachick75 says:

      And George taking Adderall (prescribed medication not an illegal drug) does not make him a violent person or a drug addict. Not to mention, George was treating a real medical condition. Trayvon was using weed and purple drank/lean to get high.

      • wasnotme says:

        The largest incidence of drug use is prescribed medications.

        Adderall has a very high incidence of abuse. It is dextroamphetamine and amphetamine, i.e., speed, regardless of legal or not. I totally agree that when used properly to treat the situation it is prescribed for it is fine. It is a godsend for many. But then, so is OxyContin. Was George taking his medication as prescribed? Even if he was, when was the last time his medication was adjusted? Maybe it was no longer working. Sometimes when it is no longer working, people self-medicate. Anyway, it is a moot point since there was no tox report done on him, so we do not even know if he had taken any (which could also be problematic for someone who should be taking it). And benzos (benzodiazapines – Restoril) are also drugs with a very high potential for abuse.

        Travon had used weed (what 17-year-old hasn’t at some point), but from the tox report, not recently and purple drank/lean is just speculation and certainly not in evidence with this incident.

        So we know there were no drug factors for Trayvon contributing. We have no idea if there are or not with GZ.

        All of it is speculation and with no evidence for either, rather meaningless.

        • Chip Bennett says:

          I find it highly ironic – nay, hypocritical – that the Scheme Team (and their supporters), who fights tooth-and-nail to keep under wraps any information that would run counter to the narrative they have created about Martin, have absolutely no problem with floating utterly specious allegations and insinuations about Zimmerman.

          All of it is speculation and with no evidence for either, rather meaningless.

          In terms of the trial, absolutely. Insinuated drug use of either Martin or Zimmerman has no direct bearing on the felony aggravated battery Martin was committing against Zimmerman immediately before Zimmerman shot Martin.

        • James F says:


        • ftsk420 says:

          So are you saying there is no evidence TM used lean I know he liked it more then weed.

        • What exactly did Zimmerman do that would suggest to you that he was abusing his medication? No evidence he hunted Trayvon down as Crump would have people believe. No evidence he confronted Trayvon. No evidence he started the physical confrontation. What did Zimmerman do? And no, shooting someone in self-defense doesn’t count. Besides, he sounded pretty damn calm and rational to me and if he was “high” on something I’m pretty sure the witnesses, cops and EMTs would have noticed. The cops spent hours with him and no mention of any suspicion of drugs or intoxication. Give it a rest.

          • bamabelle says:

            True, George was calm as a cucumber. His pulse rate even showed how calm he was. Pretty strange for a guy who thought he was going to die, don’t you think?

            • Chip Bennett says:

              How does Zimmerman’s pulse rate impact Dee Dee’s statement that Martin, after reaching the safety of his father’s house, opted instead of going inside the house, to return to Zimmerman, and then verbally accosted Zimmerman; the empirical evidence that Martin broke Zimmerman’s nose; and the eye-witness testimony that Martin was on top of Zimmerman, beating him “MMA-style” while Zimmerman screamed for help for at least 40 seconds?

            • landaumurphyfan says:

              bamabelle says:
              September 19, 2012 at 12:27 am

              True, George was calm as a cucumber. His pulse rate even showed how calm he was. Pretty strange for a guy who thought he was going to die, don’t you think?
              No one took GZ’s pulse at the time he thought he was going to die, bamabelle. Naturally his pulse rate was relatively calm later. Once the imminent threat to life has been removed, the body naturally begins to return to its normal status, although the speed at which it does so will vary from person to person and from situation to situation.

              A true hater can always find a reason to hate, though. Pulse rate of X? Too high – clear evidence that he’s stressed because he’s lying. Pulse rate of Y? Too low – clear evidence that he wasn’t all that frightened earlier or his pulse would still be racing.


        • This whole Zimmerman was on medication thing was created by Crump and friends as an attempt to counter the fact Trayvon was a drug user/abuser. They knew it would come up ever since they found out that a toxicology was done on Trayvon. That’s why they protested it so much. They knew.

        • scubachick75 says:

          Maybe you missed the part when I said any person on Adderall has to see their doctor every month. Every month I have to meet with my doctor where he weighs me (because I’m thin already and Adderall is known to cause weight loss) and he checks my blood pressure, pulse, listens to my breathing, and he asks if I have any new side effects or symptoms. They watch for signs of abuse such as asking for dose increases too often, running out early, lost scripts etc. Adderall just doesn’t stop working one day. It’s a gradual thing. Again…you meet monthly to discuss these things.

          Where on the tox report do you get that the weed was not taken recently? They haven’t released the full tox report so we don’t know what is on it. The purple drank isn’t speculation when Trayvon himself admits to using it.

          • ftsk420 says:

            I have read the tox reports I would like to see all of it but the numbers reflect someone who smoked but not recently. Like I said yesterday may have been a few hours before or night before but not right before.

      • “Trayvon was using weed and purple drank/lean to get high.” Thats called substance abuse… by a minor.

    • What about Lean AKA sizzup? I grabbed this from Go Ask Alice. Sizzurp, or purple drank, is a dangerous recreational drug, usually derived from mixing prescription-strength cough syrups (though sometimes over-the counter varieties) with soda and candy. Sizzurp users run the risk of developing dependency and overdosing on the main ingredients, codeine and promethazine. These drugs, partucilarly when combined with alcohol or other drugs, can lead to fainting, difficulty breathing, coma, and even death.

      Also called lean, drank, barre, or purple jelly, sizzurp first became popularized in the hip-hop community, but is now thought to have crossed ethnic and cultural boundaries in its growing popularity. Because its main ingredient is a legal substance — cough syrup — sizzurp has made inroads into younger populations who have access to pharmaceutical substances. Sizzurp is used along with alcohol as syrup for cocktails or with marijuana by soaking a blunt in syrup before smoking. Older, more seasoned drug users tend to drink it straight up, sans mixers. Crack cocaine users may also use sizzurp to help mitigate the chest congestion and coughing that come with smoking crack. Both of these uses, which result in higher concentrations of codeine and promethazine, increase the likelihood of developing an addiction.

  18. Fact: George’s mother is not white and he’s ‘white’
    Fact: Obama’s mother is white and he’s black

    Fact: It’s all bs. Time to flush down the trolls and move forward. Let’s find out if Crump has any debts and what time Tracy made his call and find out what Chad was really doing.

  19. John says:

    The laws you refer to gives Trayvon everyright to “stand his Ground”
    and no marks will come from drawing a gun
    and grabbing someone by the shirt – hoodie to restrain them
    GZ’s injuries were not that of being repeatedly puunch and having his head smashed against the cement

    • boricuafudd says:

      What crime was GZ committing that TM needed to stand his ground? So far, you have not mentioned any crime by GZ.

    • eastern2western says:

      please, john, lets give me an answer about the pursue part of the affidavit. without it, nothing really matters. even dd said zimmerman was out of breath before he had a chance to speak to martin. If zimmerman was out of breath by the time he was even close enough to speak to martin, then how are you going to even prove zimmerman had enough energy to start a fight with martin? I could be a little old because running just makes all of my muscles weak and sore.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      The laws you refer to gives Trayvon everyright to “stand his Ground”

      Actually, no. The right to self-defense requires that the person claiming self-defense not be engaged in any unlawful activity. Martin was committing a felony aggravated battery against Zimmerman and no evidence exists that Zimmerman in any way initiated the physical assault.

      Also, the right to claim SYG requires that the person claiming to be standing his ground either not have initiated the physical assault, or else, after initiating the assault, makes an effort to disengage from the situation.

      (By the way: Zimmerman’s 40 seconds of screams for help clearly indicate a desire to disengage from the situation, regardless of who started the assault.)

      and no marks will come from drawing a gun
      and grabbing someone by the shirt – hoodie to restrain them

      Please present the State’s evidence that Zimmerman grabbed Martin’s hoodie to restrain him.

      GZ’s injuries were not that of being repeatedly puunch and having his head smashed against the cement

      Demonstrably false. Lacerations on the back of the head are entirely consistent with blunt trauma. Broken nose, swelling, bruising, and lacerations on the face are entirely consistent with sustained battery. Blood cleaned off of Zimmerman by EMTs at the crime scene prove that the injuries were sustained during the altercation.

    • ftsk420 says:

      Cool lets stay with that angle Captain Ignorant. TM had every right to punch Zimmerman because he was scared but had absolutely no legal right to continue to attack. Once he had the chance to run he should have and didn’t and that’s why he died. Case closed buddy.
      Namecalling edited by Admin. Namecalling tends to create escalation in language all around.

    • Hugh Stone says:

      TM Was standing his ground against a man calling the cops on him. ;)

      • boricuafudd says:

        I guess that deserves a beating in the “streets” but is not illegal. Right John? Or do you think we should beat up anybody because of that?

        • ftsk420 says:

          Seems ok with TM supporters just to attack anyone who may or may not be following them. What they seem to miss is the fact that once you have the chance to flee you are supposed to do just that. Even if TM had every right to clean Zimmerman clock when Zimm went down TM legally should have ran which we all know he didn’t and that’s why he died. At least all the TM supporters are agreeing that TM punch Zimm first.

          • “Seems ok with TM supporters just to attack anyone who may or may not be following them.” This is the most frightening aspect about this ENTIRE case I feel.

            • bamabelle says:

              And George supporters believe that it is okay to shoot someone because they do not like the way they look or dress or even because they do not recognize them.
              Now that’s scary!

              • Chip Bennett says:

                And George supporters believe that it is okay to shoot someone because they do not like the way they look or dress or even because they do not recognize them.
                Now that’s scary!

                Do you have reading comprehension issues, or are you just willfully obstinate?

                We contend no such thing. To the contrary: we contend that Martin verbally accosted, then physically assaulted Zimmerman; that Martin committed felony aggravated battery by sucker-punching Zimmerman and breaking his nose, then pinning him to the ground, pounding his head into the ground repeatedly, and then beating him for at least 40 seconds, during which time Zimmerman was screaming for help.

                Thus, Zimmerman’s use of lethal force was justified as self-defense, both to end the commission of a felony, and due to reasonable fear of imminent death or bodily injury.

              • James F says:

                Show evidence of your ridiculous claim that those who believe everyone deserves justice, including Zimmerman, stated anybody should be shot because of how they dress, including Trayvon.
                Trayvon was killed because he brutally assaulted someone. No other reason.

              • jello333 says:

                God, what is wrong with you guys?! George thought that Trayvon might be casing houses, either for a break-in right then, or preparing for one later. THAT is what George suspected. WAS that what Trayvon was actually up to? Not as far as we know. But by the same token, we don’t know that he WASN’T up to something like that. Do we? Ok, so George thinks Tryavon might be contemplating a break-in, and so he calls the cops. What exactly is so crazy, so extreme, so malicious about that… especially considering the recent history of the neighborhood? And everything that follows is about George trying to give the dispatcher info about this suspicious person, and Trayvon apparently planning how HE is gonna confront George… NOT the other way around.

                Oh, and you know this, but I’ll repeat it anyway: The only reason George shot Trayvon is because he was, at a minimum, committing aggravated battery on George, or possibly even trying to kill him. Are you claiming that is not likely?… or lemme re-word that, are you claiming that is not at least POSSIBLE?

              • ftsk420 says:

                It had nothing to do with looks in the beginning Zimmerman was giving a description to police but all that stopped the moment TM attacked whether out of fear or whatever was wrong with him. Keep trying to turn it into something about race but it’s not. Answer me this TM put his hoodie on cause some strange white dude was looking at him thus making him even more suspicious then he ran are you honestly telling me that’s the right thing to do.

              • Sha says:

                bamabella: I can’t speak for GZ or anyone else but I can speak for myself. I believe that if someone attacks me for what ever the reason I’m going to get them off one way or another even if I have to kill them. I am not going to give anyone the chance to give me life threating injuries and the hell with what people think my life is just as important than anyone elses.

        • FACT if you are a snitch you are basically demanding a beat down MMA style.. ;)

    • Again, the severity of GZ’s injuries is not the issue, rather, whether he sustained injuries or not, and whether TM inflicted those injuries or not.

    • deadassassin says:

      Grabbing the shirt of someone trying to get away will very much leave marks….specifically by the neck. Ive been in several hockey fights and this happens. even in regular clothing it happens-ive done it to my brother when we got into it and i tie him up so he cant hit me.

    • John,

      Question for you. What would have happened if the police arrived just before GZ had to pull his gun? Would TM have been arrested for assault? Or would the cops have looked at GZ injuries and TM injuries (or lack thereof) and said well nothing happened here?

      No, TM would have been charged for assault. I dont care if he is black, white or purple, an assault is an assault, and every citizen of the USA has a right to defend against being assaulted.

  20. Chip Bennett says:

    One more for John, after which I will assume that he has no desire to engage in any actual discourse:

    Let’s assume, for the sake of argument, that we completely disregard all of Zimmerman’s testimony. What are we left with?

    1) Auditory witness, Dee Dee, who indicates that Martin, having the opportunity to go inside his home because he was “right by” it, chose not to; and further, that Martin, having eschewed the opportunity to go inside his home, returned to and verbally accosted Zimmerman
    2) Multiple eye-witnesses that place Martin on top of Zimmerman, beating Zimmerman
    3) Injuries sustained by Zimmerman consistent with that eye-witnessed beating
    4) No injuries sustained by Martin, other than the gunshot wound, that were inflicted by Zimmerman
    5) 9/11 calls that clearly indicate Zimmerman screaming for help, for at least 40 seconds, which logic indicates to have been coming from the 20-something Hispanic man under assault, rather than from the deep-voiced 17 year-old committing the assault. (With at least two Martin family members asserting that the screams were NOT that of Trayvon.)

    Am I missing any empirical evidence? (Not assertions, theories, or allegations; actual evidence?)

    If so, what does the preponderance of that evidence indicate?

  21. breemcphee says:

    Anyone up for a laugh? Below is a copy of a sig line that illustrates the typical robo-poster-Trayvonite thinking. To appreciate it fully, you must see it in its original form, written in LARGE PURPLE FONT. It is ironically prefaced with the poster’s IMNSHO (in my not so humble opinion) and then the rest is written in aggressive, authoritative (desperately trying to sound factual) bullying prose. Hey, Trayvonite, news flash – it is yet another OPINION, WRONG opinion – NOT fact, as much as you would like it to be.

    (another Trayvonite obsesso curiosity: they all award “Post of the Day” to anyone who writes lonnnnnnng, boring posts! Hmmm, so if it’s lonnnnnnng, it must be intelligent? Bwahahaha!)

    Read it and LAUGH: (how I wish we had that little ROFL smilie here!!!!)

    Everything I assert is IMNSHO.

    Under the law, if you provoked the situation, you can’t claim self-defense EVEN IF YOU REASONABLY FEAR FOR YOUR LIFE, UNLESS, you exhausted EVERY means of escape.

    Contemporaneous is not synonymous with simultaneous, Zimmerman had NUMEROUS opportunities to escape, that were contemporaneous (same period of time) to the danger that night. He CHOSE not to do so. Therefore it was NOT self-defense.

    • the big purple font adds legitimacy.. LOL

    • howie says:

      Under the law insane nut jobs can be Baker Acted. He is a prime candidate.

    • maggiemoowho says:

      He/she must be reading the Camp TM law book, sounds like something they would tweet.

      • breemcphee says:

        @maggiemoo – not an original thought amongst them!

        • maggiemoowho says:

          They all seem to take whatever Leatheryman, llmpap and a few others say as proven fact. None of them seem to research anything. Maybe they don’t know how to research or maybe they are afraid to research anything for fear they will find out the truth.

          • breemcphee says:

            @maggiemoowho – it’s day in and day out of the same vicious projections. Leatheryman, llmpapsmear and crapapi on the computer 24/7 is enough to know they have no job and no life. Who would listen to people like that? Obsesso Trayfans, that’s who.

    • raiikun says:

      And that guy with that sig doesn’t even understand what contemporaneous means, and why the following on the NEN call is not contemporaneous with the encounter and therefore has no legal relevance to making George the aggressor.

      • ftsk420 says:

        I have said this a million times and will continue to say it. Even if TM had every right to defend himself that was over the moment Zimmerman went down when TM climbed on top of him he became the aggressor. If you have the chance to flee that’s what you are supposed to do. TM supporters want to have it both ways but it won’t work.

      • breemcphee says:

        @raiikun – another reason everytime I read that sig line nonsense it sends me into fits of laughter is because it amazes me that Noah thinks she actually knows what she’s talking about!

  22. cecelia says:

    Do you think the state will use the Hannity interview where zimmurderman claims “i was NEVER afraid of TM”? YES they will do you think all the inconsistencies will come in? YES do you think the state will be able to prove the way the holes line up in the shirt that GZ grabbed ahold of TM sweatshirts and “moved his other hand out of the way so he didn’t shoot it” will come in? YES
    TM is NOT on trial so all your yammering about his parents didn’t do this they didn’t look for him blahblahblah ad nauseam won’t keep the lowlife from prison.
    but hey this IS FloriDUH we’re talking about so maybe he and skanky anthony can hook up IF he gets acquitted. BIG IF

    • I think the injuries will speak loudly. As to the question of whether or not TM was capable of creating those injuries we will have to look to indications of the CHARACTER of TM.. Was this young man capable of inflicting such injuries? 3 things can clarify this.. the school records, and the public social network data (Twitter and FB) and I feel, maybe I’m going out on a limb here, that those records will reflect poorly.

      • scubachick75 says:

        Yes! His Facebook, Twitter posts and pictures are screaming Trayvon’s character. Ma Cupcake said she wanted a legacy to live on forever in Trayvon’s name….. Well there you go. Someone should make her a scrapbook of his twitter comments and pics.

        If his school records, social media and full tox report reflected positive things, you know Chump or Corey would have have released them a long time ago. They keep those things in the same box they keep Dee Dee.

      • wasnotme says:

        “I think the injuries will speak loudly” LOL – sorry for laughing, but as a nurse with previous ER experience, they don’t even whisper.

        However, a gsw to the heart screams!

        • Chip Bennett says:

          LOL – sorry for laughing, but as a nurse with previous ER experience, they don’t even whisper.

          Once again: the severity of the injuries is utterly irrelevant to a claim of justified use of lethal force in self-defense. The only criteria are:

          1) Who inflicted those injuries, and
          2) Would a reasonable person fear imminent death or bodily injury while sustaining the attack that inflicted those injuries

          Further, even if that standard isn’t met, Martin’s attack against Zimmerman clearly meets the standard for felony aggravated battery; therefore, statutorily Zimmerman was justified in using lethal force in self-defense against the commission of a felony.

        • the severity of the injuries is not the issue, rather whether or not GZ had injuries and whether or not TM was capable of inflicting those injuries.

          As a nurse with previous ER experience can you tell me which part of the head is the most vulnerable to fatal trauma?

        • ftsk420 says:

          So basically you have to be a doctor and diagnose yourself and make sure the wounds are life threatening before you can defend yourself.

        • msfaye123 says:

          The law doesn’t require that George lay there and allow Trayvon to punch his lights out while praying dear GOD let this fool be gentle with my head. Come on read the statute.

        • scubachick75 says:

          Doesn’t mean that the one that ended up dead is victim.

    • partyof0 says:

      As “John” put it….”What the F*&% does that mena??”

    • boricuafudd says:

      Cecilia, don’t you guys understand that all you have is a story, where is the beef? Small inconsistencies are not evidence of malice. Which is what you have to prove, because you believe does not make it so. Evidence, Evidence, Evidence.

    • breemcphee says:

      Besides the fact that the parents have made themselves huge targets for ridicule, do you really not understand that the unstable home life and his father’s serial-adultery-fiancee-hunting-child-procreating doesn’t have anything to do with demonstrating that Trayvon came from enough ugly circumstances to lash out?

      Do you really not understand that Martin’s school suspensions for vandalism, drugs and truancy don’t show that he could be up to no good, just like Zimmerman thought that night?

      You really don’t know that there are other circumstances to back up the facts that Martin was up to no good?

      • Thats the thing about frauds like the Martin/Fulton’s.. they don’t have the foresight to think about long term.. they don’t stop to think, “hey, I may not be able to keep up this charade indefintely..” No, they think only about the right now and their 15 minutes of fame which means PAYOLA. It so transparent its not even funny.. well maybe it is a little funny :P

    • breemcphee says:

      @cecelia – you sound like one angry lady. Maybe you should focus, instead, on your own personal problem – you know, the one that is causing you to project this way.

      The Martins don’t give a good rip about you unless you plan to place a donation into their trash cans.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      Are you even capable of restraining from ad hominem when you comment? Even once?

      Do you think the state will use the Hannity interview where zimmurderman claims “i was NEVER afraid of TM”?

      I just re-read the entire transcript. Zimmerman never makes that statement.

      …do you think all the inconsistencies will come in?

      What are the material inconsistencies that supersede the preponderance of evidence that Martin was assaulting Zimmerman, and that Zimmerman was justified in his use of lethal force in self-defense?

      do you think the state will be able to prove the way the holes line up in the shirt that GZ grabbed ahold of TM sweatshirts and “moved his other hand out of the way so he didn’t shoot it” will come in?

      Holes lining up between shirt and sweatshirt? Seriously? You think that’s going to be admissible and credible? (Because the only possible way for shirt and sweatshirt to be aligned in any specific manner must be due to Zimmerman grabbing the sweatshirt and pulling his hand out of the way… riiiiiight.)

    • ftsk420 says:

      TM is on trial like it or not. If Zimmerman didn’t have a gun that night and TM killed him what do you think the out come would be. No law in the world would say he was justified and I would bet my last dollar TM wouldn’t have stuck around for the cops to show up.

      • wasnotme says:

        If Zimmerman didn’t have a gun that night, he would have been too chickencrap to get out of his vehicle and Trayvon would be alive and Zimmerman would be living his “normal” life.

        • Chip Bennett says:

          If Zimmerman didn’t have a gun that night, he would have been too chickencrap to get out of his vehicle and Trayvon would be alive and Zimmerman would be living his “normal” life.

          Zimmerman getting out of his vehicle was not an illegal act, and does not deny him the right to use justified lethal force in self-defense against the felony aggravated battery Martin was committing against Zimmerman.

        • John Galt says:

          Good thing Zimmerman did have a gun that night. No telling how many people Trayvon would have assaulted and killed by now.

        • James F says:

          More pure speculation with no evidence to back it up. Your ignorance of the law is sad yet amusing.

    • maggiemoowho says:

      You really need to do your own research and stop believing everything you read on the Leatherman Blog. Do you know or even care how ridiculous you sound repeating his claims. No sane investigator will bring any of your borrowed Leatheryman opinions into court. Your lying to yourself if you think otherwise.

    • howie says:

      Here you go. Several inconsistent statements.
      1. I am innocent.
      2. I am not guilty.
      3. I did not do it.
      Now. Which inconsistency proves guilt?
      You Fool.

    • spectator1 says:

      cecelia says:”do you think the state will be able to prove the way the holes line up in the shirt that GZ grabbed ahold of TM sweatshirts and “moved his other hand out of the way so he didn’t shoot it” will come in? YES”

      They’re going to prove GZ has 3 hands?

    • bamabelle says:

      And the prosecutors will use the part in the interview where George claims to know nothing about the SYG law. Sorry, George, but Osterman just said in an interview that SYG was covered in your concealed weapon course. Ooops, George lied again. Why does an innocent man lie? Can any of his supporters tell me?

      • Chip Bennett says:

        SYG does not apply to this case. Zimmerman had no opportunity to try to escape the situation; therefore, he had no means to stand his ground. This case is a simple, straight-forward self-defense matter.


        1) You do realize that not all CCW classes are the same, right? Florida CCW statutes require nothing more than a basic NRA firearms safety course. So, how do you know that Zimmerman and Osterman completed the same CCW-eligible course?
        2) Even if Zimmerman’s CCW-eligible course covered SYG, Florida CCW statutes don’t actually require that he retain that information. So his lack of retention of SYG information, even if provided in his CCW-eligible course, does not invalidate his right to concealed carry, nor his right to invoke SYG when applicable.
        3) Even if Zimmerman is lying, and had received SYG information in his CCW-eligible course, such lying does not deny him his right to justifiable use of lethal force in self-defense. The burden of proof still lies with the State to prove that Zimmerman’s use of lethal force was not justifiable.

      • Chip Bennett says:

        Why does an innocent man lie? Can any of his supporters tell me?

        Why did Martin place his phone earbuds in his pocket between running and returning to accost Zimmerman? Why did Martin likewise remove his photo button and put it in his pocket? Why did Martin, upon reaching the safety of proximity to his father’s house, instead of simply going inside, choose to return to Zimmerman, to verbally accost Zimmerman, and to sucker-punch Zimmerman, breaking his nose? Why did Martin then pin Zimmerman to the ground, and proceed to pound Zimmerman’s head into the ground, and beat him for at least 40 seconds while Zimmerman screamed for help?

        Can any of his supporters tell me?

      • jello333 says:

        Hey, guess what? George doesn’t NEED stand-your-ground to prevail in this case. One of the main parts of SYG is that you don’t have to retreat. But as I’m sure you know by now, George was TRYING to escape, but he COULDN’T. So why would he claim he has a SYG defense, when he couldn’t even use the “no need to retreat” clause? George doesn’t need it, he’s got centuries-old, near universally-recognized, traditional SELF-DEFENSE on his side. Surely you’re not gonna bash traditional self-defense now, are you?

      • landaumurphyfan says:

        bamabelle says:
        Why does an innocent man lie? Can any of his supporters tell me?
        So anyone who fails to tell the strict, absolute truth at all times must be guilty of something? What, then, are we to make of the Scheme Team?

        Why does TrayDad lie about what time he last saw his son?
        Why does he lie about where he was when his son was shot?

        Why does Jahvaris lie about what time TM left the house?
        Why does he lie about why TM went to the 7-11?

        Why does TrayMom lie about driving TM to school every day?
        If she’s telling the truth, why did TM miss so many classes?

        Why does the whole Scheme Team lie about TM’s school record?
        Why does Crump lie every time he opens his mouth?

        GZ is being treated for ADHD, a condition that can make memory problematic. I don’t find it difficult to believe that he could forget an element of a course he had taken. He probably forgets quite a few things. I forget a lot of stuff myself – I have been known to forget my own birthday! – and I don’t even have ADHD.

        But even if GZ is the biggest liar on the face of the planet, there is still no EVIDENCE that he is the perpetrator rather than the victim. And EVIDENCE is what the legal system is meant to rely on.

  23. breemcphee says:

    Those JQ posters are pure entertainment!

    • James F says:

      A bunch got bannned from JusticeQueef yesterday for some reason. They need to get their fix somewhere so it looks like they came here.

      • breemcphee says:

        @JamesF – You’re kidding. I missed it! It had to be anyone trying to bring facts over there or engaging in mature, logical discussion, because it most certainly wouldn’t have been any of the obsessos!

        • James F says:

          I’m no sure what happened but even trayvonites were given ‘infractions’. The mods deleted it all but there is still this statement in post 236 in thread 140.

          “Holy Moly!!!! Yes – and it was over 40 posts. What the heck happened to most of you? I cannot believe so many of you attacked that one poster instead of just responding and pointing out what you believe to be the truth or just skipping and scrolling. This was uncalled for and totally unnecessary. Members are entitled to their opinions even if the bulk of you do not agree with them. Those involved will be receiving infractions.”

          • breemcphee says:

            @JamesF – Thanks for posting it, I never would have found it! They had to be piling on this amazing poster by the nic of “truthiness.” They cannot handle the slightest truth and cannot just LEARN from someone with more intelligence than them. Well, we know it couldn’t have been the crass, vulgar, bakerprune who wrote that post. It had to be someone with a little more respect and sense of fairness. Finally. Seems the low-rent owner has been MIA for a bit. Hopefully, she will gain a smidgen of couth.

            • raiikun says:

              It wasn’t me being piled on this time lol, it was some other new guy who had only made a few posts. I saw the early onset of the dog-pile but missed the point where it got ugly enough for bannings to occur.

              I tell ya though, it takes severe patience to debate on that website, when every post gets attacked by multiple people and even after you refute them, half an hour later, someone else jumps in to attack with something you’ve already refuted. And people like Noah can get proven wrong over and over and over and just pretend it never happened. (Like his severe ignorance of how “contemporaneous” works).

              • CCG says:

                I’m amazed that there was banning of their own. It must have been pretty bad for that to happen. They engage in gang warfare against any poster who is not part of the lynch mob and have been given the go ahead from the mods, using ending in the GZ supporter being banned.

                • breemcphee says:

                  @CCG – you’ve summed it up nicely! What a group of thugs. No wonder they support the Martins.

                • breemcphee says:

                  @CCG – I’m amazed, too. It had to be because the vulgar owner, baker, was gone. I’m sure she’ll “rectify” the situation once BigBoil complains to her and readily humiliate the good Mod who did the bannings/infractions.

                  Or maybe, the other 2 owners finally realized baker is lowering them and their site into the low-rent image she projects.

                  • rumpole2 says:

                    She did…. The two people that I saw “off the Island” (for 3 days) were reinstated within hours… once Ma Baker came on deck.
                    I don’t think the other two owners saw sense.. lol They are just as bad.
                    The “problem” arose because Athena deleted posts and handed out “infractions” for each one. The discipline system there AUTOMATICALLY issues a 3 day Time Out after a certain number of infractions… of course it was never meant to apply to The Rabid Travonite types… so Baker fixed it.
                    It is all a matter of who you know and which side you are on.
                    None of this is surprising
                    HYPOCRITICAL BULLIES

                  • breemcphee says:

                    @rumpole2 – Wow, and many thanks for your update – I admit I was dying of curiosity! Yeah, I knew it had to be Athena who posted the message. She’s really the only one who acts with a modicum of decency.

                • bamabelle says:

                  Are you kidding? Sundancecracker has deleted my posts on more than one occasion and I was being respectful…just stating opinions & facts You shouldn’t criticize other sites for doing what this one does..

                  • ftsk420 says:

                    I’ll tell you it takes a lot for any Admin on here to delete a post. The admins put up with so much bs and yet they still filter everything as to not offend anyone. I feel they do an outstanding job. I have been warned and placed in moderation and may have had a post or 2 removed but I know it had to be something I said that made that happen. Nobody is forcing anyone to come here and post out of all the websites involving this case this one is about the fairest there is. Don’t like it you can leave anytime you wish.

              • breemcphee says:

                @raiikun – I bow to you, your posts and your knowledge over there on JQ! I’m a big fan of the way you explain and the respect and patience you employ with people who deserve none of the class with which you post! Kudos to you!

                (everytime I see that sig line by Noah, it sends me into fits of laughter!)

                • rumpole2 says:

                  Updates not a problem. I read there for entertainment. I was part of the place for 3 and half years (now banned) so I KNOW how the place and the people operate :)
                  I do think the owners have toned there own nasty posting down a little? No doubt because they have read some of what is written here…. but it’s a sham… they still favour and encourage posters who are ill-informed about the case. Extreme nasty hate spewed out about GZ and anybody associated with him, while any mention of facts about TM are labelled as “bashing the victim” and punished.
                  The owners do not get it……that the whole point of discussing a case is to try and work out WHO is the victim. You can not decree it from the outset. And even if you do have an opinion.. if you are “Questing for Justice” you need to look at ALL the facts.

                  • breemcphee says:

                    @rumpole2 – You make an excellent point regarding the importance of civil discussion when questing for justice. I’ll never forget when Bakerprune came on that Trayvon Martin thread like gangbusters, proclaiming Zimmerman’s guilt with the juvenile explanation that “my daddy lives in Florida, he has a weapons permit and HE SAYS ZImmerman is guilty, etc……..”

                    Oh, now that certainly explains it – baker’s daddy says it, so it MUST be true?? I mean how OLD is that prune? That is something 3rd graders say! I had never seen such classless behavior by owners on a site, so I suppose it’s good thing the owners have read and modified (at least a bit) their ugly behavior.

                • ftsk420 says:

                  I believe I was banned over at JQ withing in 20 mins and was never allowed back.

              • jello333 says:

                I wonder if I’m still allowed to post over there. I haven’t gone back since my first time, a few days ago. For a couple hours it was just me against the whole gang. A little later Truthiness came in and held down the fort for awhile, as he often does. I don’t think I could do that every day… it was all I could do to spend a couple hours there. ;)

                • Just remember to wear tinfoil under your helmet, that should allow you to explore their environment without H.E. particles melting your brain & don’t forget to attach an auxiliary tether cable just in case the Treehouse needs to launch a rescue/recovery mission.

  24. ftsk420 says:

    I’m waiting for John to school me on how the streets work but he seems to have ran away. Will this be a verbal lesson John or are we gonna take it to the streets.

  25. Sentenza says:

    They can’t actually point out anything that GZ did which is illegal without completely distorting the facts.

    It’s not illegal to get out of your car.
    It’s not illegal to follow someone.
    It’s not illegal to assume someone is up to no good because they’re wandering around looking in houses. If I recall correctly, Zimmerman stating that TM was walking around looking into random houses.

  26. Mikado Cat says:

    First time I looked over this case many months ago it was clear, TM decided to beat up GZ, decided GZ was an easy target, out of shape and whimpy looking, decided GZ had no fighting skills and posed no risk to TM. If GZ had looked dangerous, had looked like he knew how to fight and might have been able to hurt TM, TM would have walked straight home.

  27. ftsk420 says:

    Guess John isn’t coming back. Is he stuck in moderation perhaps? I was waiting for my streets lesson from the 000 but I guess it’s not gonna happen.

  28. eastern2western says:

    how stupid are these trayvon supporters?, if zimm’s injuries are self inflicted, then he needs to punch him self in the face multiple times and then fall back ward to cause the cuts on his face while waiting for the cops to come. Do these people forget the fact that zimmerman had nearly milliseconds after the the gun shot and before the first witness came to check out the incident. Are they even suggesting that zimmerman could had injured himself, planned a perfect murder scene and caused his own bleeding during those milliseconds. wow, zimmerman has the speed of superman because he did all of it without anyone ever witnessing his actions.

  29. itsallboutmeash says:

    George points right at the tree when he says he fell down. Nobody wants to believe him though.

    • howie says:

      Fool! I already told you Zimmerman was up in the tree.

    • Chip Bennett says:

      What on earth does this have to do with the known, material evidence in this case? To wit:

      1) Auditory witness, Dee Dee, who indicates that Martin, having the opportunity to go inside his home because he was “right by” it, chose not to; and further, that Martin, having eschewed the opportunity to go inside his home, returned to and verbally accosted Zimmerman
      2) Multiple eye-witnesses that place Martin on top of Zimmerman, beating Zimmerman
      3) Injuries sustained by Zimmerman consistent with that eye-witnessed beating
      4) No injuries sustained by Martin, other than the gunshot wound, that were inflicted by Zimmerman
      5) 9/11 calls that clearly indicate Zimmerman screaming for help, for at least 40 seconds, which logic indicates to have been coming from the 20-something Hispanic man under assault, rather than from the deep-voiced 17 year-old committing the assault. (With at least two Martin family members asserting that the screams were NOT that of Trayvon.)

      Note: this empirical evidence and eye-witness testimony is completely independent of any of Zimmerman’s testimony.

      So how on earth does Zimmerman pointing at a tree in any way materially impact such evidence and testimony?

  30. partyof0 says:

    Looks like Parks and Crump need to go down to Houston and make sure that guy that was shot and killed at a gas station after an accident is charged with “getting out of his car”.


  31. strat4evr says:

    I would just like to say. I see the toll this is taking on all the family members of George and Shellie. The family members are in a position that they can’t speak out yet they have to listen to all the media BS and hateful comments of TM supporters. I know all the family follows this site and believe me when I tell you that in this new age of social media SD has gathered a fine group. I sometimes am amazed. I just want to bring to the forefront that in the midst of all the debates and searches for truth, their is a family whose lives are totally upside down. And they can’t come here and defend themselves. Thank you all treepers for being who you are.

    • myopiafree says:

      Hi Strat – I think that is why most of us post here – because GZ and SZ – ARE ALMOST DEFENSELESS!! They are a target for the Black Panther Party, a very distorted, and arrogant “Prosecutor’s office”, that totally IGNORES the massive amount of exculpatory evidence, the office that promotes a certain DeDe, who tells some obvious lies, in order to charge the innocent GZ with a excessive 2n degree, and hope he will “fold” for a plea bargin. Yes, we on TreeHouse are called all kinds of names – because we stand up for the “little guy”. Peace!

      • strat4evr says:

        Thank you for the response myopiafree. You guys are awesome. I wish I could say everything I know.

      • Myopia: The line ” because we stand up for the “little guy” sounds like an argument that Ryan Julison allegedly stated to S.D. months ago, just prior? to the Zimmerman update with DeeDee’s Twitter account activity. I remember thinking what a lame excuse that Mutha F was using to justify his reckless portrayal of both Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman in his quest to satisfy both his greed & his inflated ego. Your usage of the phrase is an honest & accurate assessment of why some of us remain here. Keep on fighting the good fight!!

    • waltherppk says:

      Let me know if Dr. Antal was helpful and if not I’ll find another similar asset.

  32. ftsk420 says:

    Seems me and John are from different streets. Seems John has watched to many movies and thought coming here and playing Billy bad ass was a good idea. Guess you thought wrong.

  33. Justice4All says:

    GZ supporters say TM started the fight & jumped on GZ. I’m curious what your thoughts are of GZ jumping on TM after he shot him? If you watch GZ reenactment he says he did just that towards the end, 10 or 11 minutes into it. No rumor, these are GZ own words.

    • James F says:

      Another JusticeQueef refuge? GZ explains himself. He was just the victim of nearly fatal assault and wanted to make sure his attacker could not finish what he started.

      • Justice4All says:

        No, I’m not a refuge & don’t post or belong to JQ. I just wanted to ask a question, not be labeled. I didn’t ask for GZ explanation, I asked for your thoughts & clearly you gave them. TY for your time.

        • James F says:

          A simple search confirms a traybot named Justice4All (spelled the exact same way) is, or should I say was, a regular at JQ.

          • Justice4All says:

            Could be, IDK, I don’t even read there. I’m sure someone can check my email addy to confirm I’ve never been a member there & have never used the name before now.

        • msfaye123 says:

          I’m curious what your thoughts are of GZ jumping on TM after he shot him? I don’t view him any differently than I would if he had not gotten jumped him after shooting him. I think that his reactions were those of any reasonable person not knowing whether your attacker is going to jump up and continue his assault.
          Actually some people may have jumped up and shot again making sure that Trayvon wasn’t going to get up and continue the assault.

          • Justice4All says:

            Actually it cleared up why some witnesses described TM on top & some described GZ. Probably all true, depending when each looked outside.
            Just to be fair, my husband said exactly what you did about making sure, but me? I’d run like hell after realizing what just happened & try to get to someone’s house or porch. LOL

            • Chip Bennett says:

              All eye-witnesses on the night of the incident described Zimmerman (“red jacket”) on the bottom.

              There is no evidence that Zimmerman was ever on top of Martin during the assault.

            • Justice4All: I don’t care where else you comment, that’s your business & no concern of mine. You asked the question ” I’m curious what your thoughts are of GZ jumping on TM after he shot him?” I’d respond that it was actually Selma Lamilla who visually witnessed George Zimmerman kneeling upon the back of Trayvon Martin. Mary Cutcher was relaying information from Selma to the 911 operator but from the safety of inside her home. Cutcher stated to the 911 operator that she feared to look out the door or windows & kept urging Selma to “get back inside here”. Mary Cutcher’s a false witness without credibility due to her 3 different statements, none of which are consistent with the audio recording of her 911 call. The SPD then knew Mary Cutcher’s a fruitcake or an attention whore. Back to your question; George Zimmerman stated that he wasn’t sure if the shot he fired had hit or missed Trayvon Martin because immediately following the shot fired, Martin sat straight up while saying something like “okay okay you got it, you got it”. Zimmerman stated that he thought Martin was conceding that Zimm had possession of the weapon & was surrendering. Zimmerman crawled out from under Martin & then held him down with his knee upon Martin’s back while awaiting the authorities to arrive. Sometime while George Zimmerman was kneeling upon Trayvon Martin’s back, he became aware that the bullet fired had indeed wounded Trayvon Martin. I believe you can watch the description on the SPD video of Zimm’s re-enactment of the events. Also note: At the time of Zimm’s re-enactment he had no idea the statement Mary Cutcher would make although in actuality it was Selma that saw Zimm kneeling over Martin while holding Trayvon Martin’s arms down. Hope this is helpful but there’s more if you’re still unclear why Zimm kneeled upon, rather than jumped upon Trayvon Martin’s back.

              • Justice4All says:

                I’m talking about hearing this from George, not a witness. In the video above, at about 10-11 minutes, when George describes not knowing if he shot TM, he says he then got on top of him, after TM rolled off or GZ pushed him off. IDT he actually remembered how TM fell over. My only reaction to that is I never knew GZ had said that. I must have watched other video & not that one until today. And yes, I think the witnesses were the two you mentioned. I was just surprised hearing GZ say he did that, making sure TM had no weapon. In this video GZ says he got on top of TM after he somehow got TM off him. IDK if anyone else watched this one.

      • breemcphee says:

        Have you read the JQ dramatics about Zimmerman jumping on Martin after he shot him to PURPOSEFULLY “bleed him out?” Those drama queens are beyond the pale!

    • ftsk420 says:

      So what he also said he didn’t know he shot him and if you believe that not to be true I will gladly post a video of a man being shot point blank in the head twice first shot he continued to try and run second shot dropped him.

    • James F says:

      Why did so many of you traybots get banned from JQ yesterday?

    • treewig says:

      My thoughts would be that it fits exactly with what witnesses saw. I’d say his explanation makes sense, being that he didn’t realize initially he had hit TM with his shot and that once TM got off him, he got up and on top of him to make he wasn’t armed.

      One thing that always intrigued me about this is that GZ only shot once. IF he was out to get TM, I imagine he would have unloaded the entire clip into him to make sure he killed him. Instead, it was just one shot which seems to me to be the actions of someone trying to defend themselves, not someone trying to kill.

      • Justice4All says:

        It will be interesting to see if there are any witnesses that actually saw this fight start. IDT I’ve heard any statements yet from anyone that actually saw GZ’s head being slammed in the ground, but some statements haven’t been released yet. The ones I have listened to, seem to feel the fight started somewhere else, down the street, but not the location it ended. No matter what side you’re on, I think we’ll be surprised when all the evidence comes out. Still too many gaps & hope tomorrow’s dump fills some of that in.

        • Chip Bennett says:

          IDT I’ve heard any statements yet from anyone that actually saw GZ’s head being slammed in the ground…

          The lacerations and blood aren’t sufficient evidence of some degree of blunt trauma to the back of Zimmerman’s head?

          The ones I have listened to, seem to feel the fight started somewhere else, down the street, but not the location it ended.

          Look at the location of all the things dropped by Zimmerman and Martin. All of it is within the vicinity of the sidewalk “T”.

          • eastern2western says:

            reality does not exist in the pro-martin clubs. only rumors and suggestion. I also heard big-foot was the person zimmerman first saw because it would explain the whole sweat pants report.

          • Justice4All says:

            Couldn’t GZ have cut his head when he tried to slide back on the grass? I’m not saying it didn’t happen, just that no one seemed to see it & some said the voices got louder as they got closer & ended up on the grass. Yes, same area, but was there ever any blood found on the concrete? Just asking, I may not have seen everything that’s out there. I thought GZ said TM was slamming his head on concrete when he pulled his gun out & shot & neighbors say they were on the grass..maybe rain washed blood away? Trying to sort through & make sense of it all from all accounts I listened to.

            • Chip Bennett says:

              Couldn’t GZ have cut his head when he tried to slide back on the grass?

              Multiple lacerations, and all that blood, from attempting to slide from the sidewalk to the grass?

              Yes, same area, but was there ever any blood found on the concrete?

              That’s a legitimate question. I’m still re-reading the discovery, looking for anything in the police reports that indicates that anyone even looked for blood on the sidewalk. I haven’t seen anything thus far. It was raining during and after the altercation, but one would think that such rain wouldn’t wash away all traces of blood.

              One thing that I’m noticing is that Serino’s summaries of the witness statements appears possibly to bias the actual written statements in such a way to help support his conclusion that Zimmerman be arrested for manslaughter.

              • Justice4All says:

                I never heard they looked either but I know GZ told them right away about his head. I’ll keep looking, hopefully someone will find info on that. You’d think that would be done ASAP before leaving the scene.

            • scubachick75 says:

              Wouldn’t that leave more of scrape type of wound?

            • howie says:

              He said he pulled gun and shot when the little monster tried to get it. Not when the little monster was bashing his head in. Get your facts straight.

            • AghastInFL says:

              Chris Serino indicated in one of the interviews (2/29) the injuries came from the cover… he said “the cement thing”. Was the cover taken into evidence?

        • maggiemoowho says:

          Justice4all, go back and read the transcript of the first bond hearing. The states own lead investigator confirmed that they state has no evidence of who started the fight. The lead investigator also confirms that they have no evidence that confirms GZ continued to follow TM after the dispatcher told him they didn’t need him to do that. There are witnesses who confirm TM was on top of GZ beating him. Not sure what witnesses you are talking about, but most if not all confirm GZ account.

          • Justice4All says:

            Not witnesses, GZ himself said after he shot TM, he got on top of him because he thought he may have had a weapon. One lady described a red shirt/jacket on top & that would explain it. Most said the dark hoodie, yes, but I was trying to figure out why they all didn’t see the same. Could be some looked after the shot which would explain it. First bond hearing? TY, I’ll go read that, maybe it will clear this up for me.

            • howie says:

              The lead detective for the state testified that the state has no evidence. No evidence to contradict Zimmerman’s account that he was returning to his truck when he was attacked. The lead SPD detective in his investigation wanted to charge Zimmerman with unnecessary killing while trying to prevent a felony. The felony was Tm’s felonious attack on Zimmerman. The two lead investigators will be defense witnesses. That brings us to Wolfinger. He did not see evidence to charge even manslaughter. The local State Attorney will be defense witnesses. Then there is the FBI and FDLE. No racism and forensics back Zimmerman. They will be defense witnesses. That is Zimmerman’s corner. Now in Corey’s corner we have the famous DD. Star witness extraordinaire who can even hear the grass, and the Crumpster’s. I predict a knockout in the first round by Zimmerman.

            • maggiemoowho says:

              I’m sorry, I was talking about the witnesses who saw TM on top of GZ before the shot was fired. On some of the crime scene photos you can see spots that looks to be blood, it was raining so I don’t know if there would be that much. I would think it would be documented on some of the police forms, but again who knows if they have all been released. I’m sure there are alot of crime scene photos that we have not seen yet and then there will be Omara’s discovery also.

        • Your best bet would be Austin Brown except that his mother was pressured to coerce Austin to retract his original statement. It’s probable that Austin saw what happened immediately following Trayvon Martin’s (alleged) initial attempt to verbally intimidate George Zimmerman. I speculated months ago that the dog Austin was walking escaped from the leash as a result of being frightened by the nearby gunshot & that’s what caused Austin to run after the fleeing dog. I remember a video of Austin’s mother complaining that she & Austin were being pressured by authorities to retract or revise Austin’s statement. I’ve looked all over the Internet for that video but it appears as though it was very thoroughly eliminated. A particular Treehouse motto is “The Truth Has No Agenda” but the same can’t be said of the Scheme Team. Their motto appears to be “Show Me The Money”, their battlecry was “we just want an arrest, nothing more, nothing less” then it was switched to “he should’ve stayed in the car” & now it appears to have become “justice for Trayvon”. Nothing more than Race-Baiters & greedy lawyers parading the inept/indifferent parents of a teen gone bad, in their bid to force the scared Florida Political Machine into providing the Scheme Team with a record payday. Thankfully George Zimmerman hasn’t caved & the Florida insurance companies appear to be awaiting the outcome of an Immunity Protection Hearing before they consider giving into Crump’s strongarm scheme. The Scheme Team’s going to be unhappy with the outcome!

          • Justice4All says:

            Is this the video?

            • howie says:

              Notice the Scheme Teamer on the right.

            • Chip Bennett says:

              What I notice from this video is the damning testimony from Cheryl Brown that the SPD Lead Investigator Chris Serino was going fishing for evidence to prove that the shooting was not in self-defense, due to personal bias, rather than merely trying to ascertain the facts of the altercation:

              “This was absolutely not a case of self-defense, and we’ve got to prove it. Read between the lines. There was some stereotyping going on here.”


              As-quoted by Cheryl Brown, it certainly doesn’t sound like Serino was attempting to remain objective during the investigation; coincidentally, such reading-between-the-lines perfectly describes his summary of witness testimony that concludes with a recommendation to prosecute for manslaughter.

              Never mind the witnesses who stated unambiguously that it was Zimmerman who was screaming, or the officers who told other witnesses, “If it makes you feel any better, the one who was screaming isn’t the one who was shot.”

              Serino was on a witch hunt to prove Zimmerman guilty of manslaughter, and wasn’t going to let trifles such as empirical evidence or eye-witness testimony stand in his way.

            • No that’s not the video. The video which I referenced was from a day or two after the tragedy occurred. The scheme team & the Race Baiters such as Rev Al weren’t even aware of Trayvon Martin at that time. Cheryl Brown was standing on a sidewalk & the camera angle was pointing toward the scene behind her, I had assumed that the people in the background were police detectives. Cheryl was speaking to the person filming her in what I interpreted as an upset nearly angered tone. I thought she was pissed, indicating that the authorities (Serino?) were pressuring her to coerce Austin to retract his original statement. I’ve searched all over, typed many searches including Cheryl Brown, Austin Brown, Chris Serino, Brown retracts original statement etc, etc. That video has vanished from my grasp but maybe a computer expert would know how to recover it from Cyberspace.

          • howie says:

            Bondi and the state may pay them off with Taxpayer funds after the election. Like the Anderson case. They now need a trial and conviction in order to get private loot I think.

  34. eastern2western says:

    I found it man. this tape proves zimmerman was running around with a gun and got into a mma style fight with martin. It was caught by the cctv from the gated community. check it out man, case closed. zimm is goin away for years.

  35. thefirstab says:

    Hi all, just dropped in for a minute, I see some interesting debate with “John” and “Cecilia”. As usual, their facts are questionable. May I add another tidbit that they might be able to understand?
    The reason this case grew legs, and became such a rallying cry for “Justice” – it’s not even about trayvon, it’s really a story about A Personal Liability Specializing in Civil Rights Violations Law Firm (Parks and crump) with a little help from their Friends (Nat Jackson, Sharpton/Jackson and Julison the PR guy) who saw an opportunity for a multi-million dollar lawsuit. Repeat — they don’t give a rat’s patootie about Justice, the martin family, certainly not the zimmermans. They jus’ want an arrest — to open the Pearly Gates to a massive revenue stream, of multiple wrongful death lawsuits. So what if “their people” are suckered out of some chump change? Part of the gig. All part of supporting THEIR high-end lifestyles. Praise the Lord and pass those trash cans!

    • Sha says:

      thefirstab: You said that very well and in terms that even they can understand. I’ve been sreaming that from the roof top of my house, all they care about is money. When this well runs dry they will move on.

    • howie says:

      On the money. I don’t think the recent influx of ???? whatever they are, is aware of our prior investigation in this area. All they do is babble on about irellevant and fanciful minor details, about the the events leading up to Tm’s felonious attack on Zimmerman.

  36. ftsk420 says:

    I have a question for John and the rest of the TM supporters. What is your view on the NBPP do you condone their behavior. Do you condone the fact that they burn the American flag and step on it. Do you condone the fact that their purpose is to have a nation of their own and their purpose is to over throw the government. Do you condone the fact that they put a bounty on the head of an American who has the right to a fair trial.

  37. Springstreet says:

    Could we talk less about trolls and more about TM’s missing (7/11 to cut-through) half an hour … and his alleged change from tan pants and shoes to stone washed blue jeans and red sneakers?
    TM’s cousin said they had previously bought blunts at the 7/11 so TM went there to have the 3 Amigos test his marijuana. The Amigos told him how much they wanted and TM immediately went back to Brandi’s … but got so wet that he changed his pants and shoes. Then, TM went back and waited at the cut-through so he could not be seen by the entry gate security camera, BUT could see the approach of the 3 Amigos when their car approached from up the MAIN street.
    Very unfortunately, TM was first spotted by GZ (calling the police) and had to go back to Brandi’s to dump his stash … before he confronted that cracka GZ. Chad saw TM leave the porch and (now complicit) had to join in the ridiculous DeeDee/Crump story line. Thoughts?

    • My thoughts are the school records Twitter and Facebook profiles will reveal a lot. How did Crump think these could be suppressed?

    • If Chad was filming the beatdown, he would be up for 2nd degree murder just like Patty Hearst. It’s no wonder why he stayed inside and played video games while dozens of police cars were out in front investigating the murder. One of Chad’s football player friends saw the whole thing go down while walking a dog. You can even hear the dog barking on the 911 tapes, so with the blood gang and black panther situation, he is a reluctant witness. When a reporter asked Chad what he has learned from all of this, he smiled and said “not to be a racist.” The State’s whole case rests on the testimony of girlfriend DD, but it is hard to see how Tracey Martin saw the call on his phone bill for the cheap pre-paid stolen drone phone. It will be interesting to see what the “ping logs” show for the phone memory sticks on all of the phones in question.

    • maggiemoowho says:

      Just look at a close up of the body photos from the scene, you can see the bottom of TM’s pant leg and tennis shoe. The pant leg is tan.

    • kathyca says:

      I’ve always thought that Trayvon didn’t go home because he was waiting for something and that he took George on because whatever he was waiting for was something he didn’t want spectators to.

      Also, is there any possibility that the person George saw first and the person who wound up dead are the same person. I know that was briefly discussed here, but I don’t know if I’m missing something that links the two people other than dd’s alleged phone call. Is there CCTV of the guy George first saw. If not, is there any possibility that it wasn’t Trayvon he saw when he first called NEN. Would be consistent with Trayvon planning to meet up with someone and having to go back to Brandi’s for whatever. It would also explain the big difference in the clothes description.

    • Imaginative. It’s difficult to imagine him not sharing in such a sampling yet the THC level was too low.

    • Isn’t this change of clothes theory because one cop put on his report Travyon was wearing jeans at the scene? The same person that said Trayvon had his hands beneath his body?

      • maggiemoowho says:

        Yes, but I really believe that was a honest mistake on the cops part. In his report it he states when he arrived on scene he made contact with Officer Smith and he also saw GZ, then he went and did CPR on TM. GZ was in jeans and that might be why he said TM had jeans on. CPR is hard on anyone who performs it and I’m sure what TM was wearing was last on his mind. I do think he should be asked about it though just to clear up the confusion. Just my opinion though.

        • msfaye123 says:

          If the clothes that are in evidence don’t match what Trayvon had on in the 7:11 video we will know that he changed clothes after leaving the store and before George spotted him.

    • wasnotme says:


  38. Hey Treepers, here is an interesting turn of events. The State is moving to revoke SZ’s CCW permitbased on her perjury charge. If the charge is upheld that SZ could lose the CCW permit permanently. This one should get the J4TM group hopping up and down :P


    • breemcphee says:

      And the witch hunt by the State continues. They are out of control.

      Doesn’t take very much for the J4TM group to get excited!

    • James F says:

      Tomorrow morning is the docket sounding for Shellie Zimmerman’s case. It is the last chance for the state to try and make her cop a plea, if not it goes to trial.

    • After the cases of George & Shellie Zimmerman have played out neither of them will require their CCW permit because they will hopefully be laying on a Peruvian Beach while their attorney’s pursue the multiple lawsuits for malicious character assassination, libel, slander, false arrest, false imprisonment & anything else their attorney’s can sue for. Neither of them would ever be safe working a job in the USA, their going to need all the money lawsuits can rightfully provide them if their going to survive long enough for all this crap to be forgotten

  39. sybiljx1 says:

    Has this issue of Dr. Phil paying guests been discussed?


    Dina Was Paid $50k For Train Wreck Dr. Phil Interview Says Michael Lohan

    • maggiemoowho says:

      Considering Dr. Phil made a $600,000 donation to the Anthony’s organization, I bet he made a hefty donation to TM’s organization. He even volunteered to help camp TM,with their organization.

    • froggielegs says:

      Of course he pays his guests but, I wouldn’t believe a word that came out of Michael Lohan’s mouth. Seriously think about it, which drug addict/alcoholic is telling the truth?LOL. No one in that family can speak the truth. It’s no wonder their daughter is as screwed up as she is.

      From your link above…

      “Michael Lohan made an appearance on screen at one point, and claims that although he was not paid a cent, his ex-wife pulled in thousands for her time.”

      Sounds like someone whining because he didn’t get paid which actually makes you wonder, was Dina really paid or is Michael just saying she was cause he is pissed that they would not pay him. Also think about this, how would he know if she got paid? They don’t even talk to each other!

      Obviously we are not the only ones wondering how much Traydmarks got paid…


  40. strat4evr says:

    Dr. Phil has been given factual information that shows his approach is wrong and his producers have responded with comments that says ” Dr. Phil will answer your questions which no one else on TV right now can do. No one else can do that.” The letter goes on to say that he cares about how this is affecting the family and his desire is to help the family through these hard times. This is after he had already taped the Martin Fulton interview. To whom this letter was sent I can assure you Phil. Your refusal to do your homework and state facts and pandering to the Martin and Fulton fake will one day bite you in the ass. I for one will not forget your crap when this all plays out and shows what an ass you are. Your letter stated you are not a journalist. I hope you treepers wont get mad at me for my attitude. I have seen the tears and it breaks my heart.

    • Sha says:

      strat4evr: I have no respect for Dr. Phil . Any decent person no matter what side they were on should have presented the facts and let people make up there own mind. He had a opportunity to bring up alot of horrible things that have happened since this case and to try to defuse the hate but he choose to add gasoline on the fire. Once again someone willing to sacrifice a whole family for ratings. GZ has a mom and dad just like TM who love there child and are trying to protect him. Show me anywhere were one life is worth more than another.

  41. Hugh Stone says:

    Let’s play a game and concede that GZ had his gun out. I think it would be for Austins’ pit bull that was running loose that night. Was that the same pitbull that GZ got the gun for?

    See, I can make stuff up too.

    • rumpole2 says:

      Yeah, right….

      So GZ shots at the dog… slips over and misses, and hits poor Trayvon…. who was trying to help save George… Trayvon is such a nice little boy.
      But the dog attacks George and causes all the head wounds….
      It’s a theory… worth a thread at Justice Queef. lol

      • rumpole2 says:

        The dog attacks… and George slips over and the dog starts savaging his head… Trayvon gets on top of George and wrestles the dog with his bare hands. (That explains what witnesses saw with TM on top).
        GZ is a wuss ….. so he cries out while Trayvon valiantly tries to pull the dog off. Just as Trayvon manages to get the dog off… GZ shoots in a panic and hits Trayvon.

        THAT is actually a better theory than any I have seen at The Trayvon Zone. :)

        Still… probably not Murder 2 in that case? But worth a crack?

    • ftsk420 says:

      I believe Chad owned a boxer not a pitbull. Something off about Chad and that dog.

  42. eastern2western says:

    the state has no case because the police report is a fabrication. according to crump, the police report is all fake and the prosecution can not build a case on fabrications. crump is right because police report is a fabrication and we should all throw out anything that is found in the police report.

  43. arkansasmimi says:

    Rene Stutzman‏@renestutzman 3 hrs ago
    Shellie Zimmerman to skip routine perjury court hearing in the morning. Her atty will ask for continuance, he says: http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-09-18/news/os-shellie-zimmerman-hearing-20120918_1_shellie-zimmerman-george-zimmerman-trayvon-martin

  44. rumpole2 says:

    I know that often “The devil is in the detail” of cases.. but in this case the overall picture is blatantly obvious that I find it frustrating to be arguing piffling details.. about how many feet the body was from the “T”…
    I followed the Anthony case for 3 years… every detail.. for example, cell phone pings stretching over 31 days pinpointing KC minute by minute…. too much detail to ever be presented to a jury.. and in the end even a summary was too much for them.
    This case is so clear-cut it is travesty that George and his family and friends are being put to all the effort (and expense).. also the tax payers of Florida… this is going to cost millions.

    • froggielegs says:

      No in the end the prosecution screwed up, over charged and had no concrete evidence to prove that Casey actually killed her daughter. If I were on her jury, I would of also found her not guilty.

      Sad part about it is, George is paying for Casey being found not guilty. Most of the people screaming for his head are only doing so because they feel it will give them some justice for Casey walking. It’s part of their mob mentality. Read some of the comments on InSession FB page. Most of the people commenting there even say things like Casey walked but this time George won’t or we’re not going to let Florida let another killer walk. They don’t want to really look at evidence they just want justice for a crime George didn’t even commit which is the killing of Caylee Anthony. Then add the race baiters to the mix and you have all the people convicting George with out a trial.

      • rumpole2 says:

        I do not agree with you on KC case itself… but it would be way off topic to debate that here.
        I agree with your comments on the cross over to this case though.
        I agree that many of the same “mob” that bayed for blood in the KC case are baying for GZ’s blood now. I was part of the KC mob, if you like… but in BOTH cases my conclusions were/are based on evidence.

      • howie says:

        I heard Corey has again charged a 10 tear old with Murder in Jax. as an adult. Wonder how the Tconista’s feel about that? This one is Hispanic I think. The Anthony case was also a travesty. I watched. I would also have gone NG. Even knowing that something did happen. The state failed. Sometimes a guilty must go free to prevent innocents from wrongful conviction.That is the blessing and the curse of the system.

        • rumpole2 says:

          I’d have gone guilty AND DP.
          The prosecution did a good job IMO

          • howie says:

            I understand. On an emotional basis so would I. I thought the state failed legally to meet the burden. I did not believe the theory of either side.

            • rumpole2 says:

              We have to agree to disagree…off topic already :)
              The State’s case was extremely strong. It is often said that a “Circumstantial” case can be stronger than say, relying solely on eyewitnesses who could all give a different version of the same event. In the KC case the circumstantial case was overwhelming in itself.. and in addition to that the forensics were there as well.
              The Jury could have at least asked to review some evidence? Seems they preferred to review the desert menu while planning the bus trip home.

        • froggielegs says:

          Oh The Trashcan brigade won’t care about some little Hispanic kid. He’s not the right color.

          Re: CA, There was more evidence to prove Caylee drowned in the pool than there was her dying of chloroform. The state failed big time. Course when you have a prosecution who claims 84 searches on a computer for chloroform when in fact it was just 1 search, what do you expect? (you can read about that here, this is the first site that came up in Google there are others if you search)


          Look how fast Jeff Ashton wrote a book as soon as the trial was over and immediately ran for office of State Attorney and won! Someone who willfully hid evidence in a trial and used the death of a child to further his own career! Personally, I would LOVE to see Casey sue the state and win for them with holding evidence. Not because I think she is completely innocent but because I would love to see the state pay for trying to screw someone out of a FAIR trial. Just like I hope George ends up suing them along with the Scheme Team and Trashcan Brigade for the lies and judicial misconduct they have done!

          • howie says:

            Another problem they had. it was the defense who had to call the FBI as witness. That really smelled. The case stank to high heaven. It is the reason we have jury trials. They knew she did something but not what. The state never answered that question. That is how I saw it. Corey will face a similar problem in her witnesses. FBI favors Zimmerman.

  45. arkansasmimi says:

    Rene Stutzman‏@renestutzman Sept 18 2012 8 pm
    Shellie Zimmerman to skip routine perjury court hearing in the morning. Her atty will ask for continuance, he says: http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-09-18/news/os-shellie-zimmerman-hearing-20120918_1_shellie-zimmerman-george-zimmerman-trayvon-martin

  46. Pingback: Black woman stands her ground, kills white man «

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